00:00:11:14 - 00:00:31:08 Unknown Hi, I'm Catherine and I'm Gail, and welcome to women over 70. Aging reimagined, our award winning weekly podcast. Visit women over 70.com and learn how you may become engaged with our communities through Aging Reimagined circle. We hope to see you at our next online monthly program. 00:00:31:08 - 00:00:40:20 Unknown And today we're excited to be talking with Laurel bear. She's 86. Laurel is director of strategic initiatives for the Village Chicago. 00:00:40:22 - 00:01:12:14 Unknown It's a community of people who choose to share interests, experience and friendship as we age. Laurel has worked in various aspects of media communication for over 50 years. She's also is founder and former president of Bottomless Closet, the first of its kind not for profit organization that provides clothing and support to women seeking employment. She writes for the village's monthly newsletter about aging and ageism, which has been informative about her own aging process. 00:01:12:16 - 00:01:38:06 Unknown And for the past 20 years, Laurel has been the caregiver caretaker for her husband. And she served with us. I quote, I consider myself in many ways a solar solo ager because I am primary caretaker for my husband and I'm making all decisions and doing all tasks by myself. So solo aging, while not living alone, is the focus of our conversation today with Laurel. 00:01:38:06 - 00:02:02:12 Unknown And we want to thank you so much for being here to to share your experiences and insights. We also want to thank our former guest, Jill Stewart, for connecting you with us. So welcome, Laurel. Thank you. Yes. Well, let's let's dive in and have you give us some context for your long term role as the caregiver for your husband. 00:02:02:14 - 00:02:30:10 Unknown Okay. My husband's name is Andy, and we married late in life. We got married. We were both in our late 50s. It's interesting because our lives had crossed many times in the past. We actually went to the same high school, although I was. I'm a year older than him, so we didn't know it when he is that we didn't know each other then, and we met professionally and the advertising business. 00:02:30:12 - 00:02:56:02 Unknown And then very late in life, we reconnected. And, the other thing that's really funny is our social Security numbers are only 82 digits apart. I don't know how that could have happened, but kind of weird. Anyhow, we got married in the late 50s, and five years later if he was diagnosed, with some cognitive issues. And that was a long time ago. 00:02:56:04 - 00:03:28:17 Unknown And as, of course, as we've both age and age, other, what they like to call comorbid comorbidities have developed. So there are lots of things to take care of. And I must say that, I am very fortunate in having this wonderful man to take care of because, he doesn't exhibit any of the frustrating and, difficult behavior that many people do. 00:03:28:19 - 00:03:53:06 Unknown It's cognitive issues. He's very easy to take care of. He doesn't wander around. He's happy. I he's grateful. And and that I am so blessed because, 20 years of something else, would have been an entirely different story. And the other thing I'm fortunate abounds that I do have work that I love to do. 00:03:53:07 - 00:04:16:20 Unknown So, my entire life isn't isn't given over to caregiving. So that's that's kind of what happened. So can you tell us a little bit about your mind? Tell us a little bit. If he doesn't, doesn't exhibit some of the typical, conditions that people might have, but what what is it that he what do you need to do as a caregiver? 00:04:16:22 - 00:04:51:03 Unknown Well, for him, it's it's mostly, reminding and just, you know, making sure he has his medications, making sure he has diabetes, making sure he has his shots, making his doctor appointments, taking him to them from them. Just his overall well-being, plus all the rest of life. And as a performance man. Yeah. Are you able to enjoy social life together? 00:04:51:05 - 00:05:17:05 Unknown Yes. We are. We we go to family gatherings. People come over. And, you know, he he he he can engage. It's best not to ask questions. You know, it's. People should know that when you're dealing with someone is memory loss. Don't ask them how long you lived in this kind of life. Okay. But he's, 00:05:17:07 - 00:05:38:04 Unknown He likes to have company. The village has, off again on again play reading group. And, I used to host it here in our house, and we just loved it. You know, we sit around a living room and read the play and he loved having the people here and listening to the play and all that. And he's still the smartest person I've ever known. 00:05:38:07 - 00:05:50:14 Unknown I mean, he's really smart. You can tell by his sense of humor comes out. And as I said, I'm very fortunate to be, giving care to someone that's relatively easy to care for. 00:05:50:17 - 00:06:27:17 Unknown I was a little bit more than about. You know, I you're identifying yourself as a solo solo ager. Yeah. It's interesting. When we first, thought about having a program for solo agers at the village, we were thinking, well, this is people who live alone. And then, when the group started going and also at that same time, I wrote, I write our monthly newsletter, the Navigator, and I wrote an issue about solo aging and discovered it is a way more nuanced but concept than people think. 00:06:27:19 - 00:06:58:22 Unknown First of all, there are lots of people who, chose to be solo agers. They like being independent. They they like being on their own. And yet they still have to do the kinds of planning and putting things in place. That are necessary when when you're on your own. We also discovered that, that there's, there's a practical aspect to it. 00:06:58:24 - 00:07:25:06 Unknown You know, dealing with making decisions and planning and and that kind of thing. But there's also an emotional component to it. There's one particular person I know who is got her plans in place. She's got a great social life. She's got everything, you know, surrounding her that she needs, but she cannot get over the fact that she doesn't have family. 00:07:25:08 - 00:07:45:20 Unknown You know that she is in close to her family. It just it just, you know, the holidays are hard for her. And, you know, it's there are lots of aspects to it. And it's interesting also, when we put out that the newsletter it was it got the most response, than we ever have from one of those things. 00:07:45:20 - 00:08:10:12 Unknown And I think it's because, we were able to gather some quotes of comments from people. Was the worst thing about it. And, and then what do you like about it? I mean, even people who are struggling, you know, or like one individual who had to put, the spouse into a, you know, into a care facility. 00:08:10:14 - 00:08:36:21 Unknown I mean, he's a solo ager. And as I said, I consider myself one, too, because, you know, I have to do everything, you know, change the furnace filters. Yeah. You talk about village. What? Which village are you? Are you in? So. Yes. Is the village Chicago? Which is, primarily solely around the north side of Chicago. 00:08:36:23 - 00:09:09:05 Unknown Some, members downtown up as far as Evanston. We have about 150 members at the moment. And how does that help you or what? What is there about the village, Chicago, that that is important to you as a solo ranger? As a solo agent? Oh, well, as a solo major. First of all, as a as a caregiver, it's providing me with a social and intellectual life. 00:09:09:06 - 00:09:35:18 Unknown Even if I am weren't working there, I would be able to participate in, you know, all kinds of programs. They have the social programs. We can have lots of presentations on zoom that that people can attend. And, and also, as a member, which I am also. There are resources like. But for a month I've been saying this place needs a deep clean. 00:09:35:19 - 00:09:58:22 Unknown It's driving me crazy. I keep looking around and seeing things that, you know, need to be clean. So I, I called up the other day and I said, I need a this and of that. And then the other thing and I've, I've got all kinds of resources to, to get to, to help me. Go ahead. Oh, you're you're working. 00:09:58:24 - 00:10:21:19 Unknown As, director of strategic, what is it? Strategic plan or strategic issue? Mitigation. So are you able to do that from home or how do you manage your work? I do work from home. I work from home. I go on to the office. You know, occasionally I go to meetings. Occasionally I do have help in the house here. 00:10:21:21 - 00:10:53:02 Unknown Monday through Friday, just in the mornings, 9 to 1. So my big social hours and lunch, I go out to lunch late at 1130 to 1 is my magic hour. Keep that in mind. And, yeah, I'm able to do it. If it's my classes in a different room for where my husband is, sometimes I'll bring the computer in there and work in there so I can keep his eyes on me. 00:10:53:04 - 00:11:23:05 Unknown But, you know, it's been wonderful to be able to work that way. You talk about the emotional load of being the primary caregiver. What do you what do you want to expand on that? What do you mean by that? Yeah. I think the two primary things are well, one is guilt. I don't think a day goes by that I don't say to myself, what should I be doing? 00:11:23:05 - 00:11:53:08 Unknown I should be doing more, I should be. Making him move around more than he does and shouldn't, you know being having people come over more often. I should be playing. We see with some I shouldn't be you know. And that's just you know you can drag yourself crazy with that you know. But you have to look at the upside of that is because when I do that, it reminds me of how much I have done and I am doing to make his life good and happy and safe. 00:11:53:10 - 00:12:34:07 Unknown And the other thing is, of course, the loss of freedom. It's, you know, I'm pretty housebound, fortunately. I'm a homebody. I think I'm the only person in America who didn't really notice when there was a pandemic going on, because I didn't feel it different to me. But it's still, you know, I'd like to go out and toss down a margarita with friends from time to time, and I just, you know, it cost me money to do that, and I can do it, but, you know, and I believe that, the upside of that is, yes, you've lost some freedom. 00:12:34:07 - 00:13:00:16 Unknown But look at the look at the sense of purpose that you have in your life. Look at what good what you're doing for this individual and his family. You know, they on you have to worry about him. And, you know, and despite everything, I would say we have a great marriage, you know, it's, it's interesting how a person can change so much, so much. 00:13:00:18 - 00:13:03:15 Unknown And you still love them. You know, it's, 00:13:03:15 - 00:13:28:14 Unknown that's a wonderful thing. Look, it sounds like he's he's he's able to reciprocate that love, too. Oh, absolutely. I get, thank you for taking such good care of me. And, every, every time we're in the car going to somewhere that's 99% of the times for him. You know, you'll tell me thank you about six times because he forgot that he told me the first time because. 00:13:28:14 - 00:13:46:02 Unknown But, hey, you know, I mean, I am totally asleep. It I think it's, I always feel guilty about it, that being that it's brings so easy to to care for him when it could have been so very difficult. 00:13:46:02 - 00:14:03:23 Unknown you write about aging and ageism for the, the newsletter, the column. So what has what have you what's what have you learned about aging and ageism that really stands out for you? Where do I start with the the. I am so hard on this. I'm so hard on this topic. 00:14:03:23 - 00:14:32:13 Unknown It's just fascinating to me. It all started I think about it's almost 15 years now that the fact is that the Frameworks Institute started working and the, Reframing Aging Project, and they did all that research and came up with all these wonderful, ways to reframe aging. And and that was the beginning of it. And but since then, I guess I found some heroes in it. 00:14:32:15 - 00:15:01:22 Unknown The first one being Ashton Applewhite, of course, who everybody knows. And I think one of the first things I learned from from Ashton's writing is how do I identify ageism, the stuff that slips past us? Gosh, you look so good for your age now. Like, that means you look younger than you are. Yay for you. You know, that's younger isn't better than older. 00:15:01:22 - 00:15:27:21 Unknown It's just different. So it's it's learning to identify it. And then it's it's learning to respond to it. I, a couple days ago I, I posted on Facebook, I was watching some, rehabbing, you know, redecorating, rehabbing things, which I love to watch. And they keep talking about this granny wallpaper and granny, they have wrecks the back. 00:15:27:23 - 00:16:00:14 Unknown I said, I am so sick and tired of these rehabs calling wallpaper. They don't like randy paper. You know there's a difference between old and old fashioned. So I do like to step back if possible. So that's that's an important thing I learned. And then, the whole issue of internalized ageism, when the village actually, had a, an award that we gave out annually called a Trailblazer Award. 00:16:00:14 - 00:16:29:10 Unknown And one year we gave it to back a lady doctor back a lady who wrote Breaking the Code. And that book was just like a revelation to me. The whole idea that, negative attitudes about aging could impact everything. Your health, and this whole concept of internalized ageism, where you adopt the attitudes of the culture and you apply them to yourself, you know, everybody does it. 00:16:29:10 - 00:16:57:17 Unknown I do it myself. Am I too old to wear jeans? The least I can know that I'm being healthy. I'm doing something that, you know, doesn't make any sense. But that was that's where this whole notion of, negative attitudes about aging can, reduce your life expectancy by an average of seven and a half years. It's just become a meme now, like aging is bad or loneliness is bad for you is smoking. 00:16:57:19 - 00:17:20:03 Unknown I see it everywhere. I believe that when you believe that, I know, I know back, we know back alley these work and what she's do. Does that sound true to you? Absolutely. I mean, if you average out, I mean, all the the studies that have been done where they, you know, they take people and they, you know, they follow them for decades. 00:17:20:03 - 00:17:46:17 Unknown And, the way you can influence how people work is down in the laboratory by, giving people images of, of, week old people and having them do worse on memory tests, and their handwriting gets worse and they're their posture gets worse. I mean, the mind is so, subjected to those to those, suggestions. 00:17:46:18 - 00:18:24:22 Unknown Yeah. I do believe it. And the word that most people leave out when they say is average, on average, seven and a half years. And then then my niece, hero is Tracy Gendron, who wrote Ageism Unmasked. And that's where I learned about the history of ageism and how it's a socially constructed concept, that, it's, how it came to be, how 65 came to be this, this number where you became out of date. 00:18:24:24 - 00:18:56:16 Unknown The whole concept of retirement became a life stage. It's, she points out that it's a negative mindset. It's who you used to be and what you used to do. You know, it's, it's, healthy. She, I have a thing here that she says, which I love, which is aging, is a slow and steady process of change that ultimately leads to our becoming our unique individual cells. 00:18:56:18 - 00:19:24:23 Unknown And so, sorry, I get these terrible phone calls all day long. And I really I really have experienced that. I mean, I feel more myself than I ever had in my whole life, you know, and and you don't see it until you get there. You don't see it coming. You don't feel it. Is that your experience to you is it's happening. 00:19:24:23 - 00:19:52:09 Unknown But you you don't realize it until you get there. So, yeah, I certainly think so. You know that I'm fascinated too, with with studies that suggest that as we get older, especially into our 80s, we become happier before happier. It's true. I mean, absolutely, I but me, I mean, in the world we're living in right now, is there too much to be happy about? 00:19:52:09 - 00:19:56:20 Unknown And yet you find it. You know, you find it. You know what it is 00:19:56:20 - 00:20:25:12 Unknown like for yourself. Yeah. Like with coming into yourself, the older you get, the more you come into yourself, which makes you happy because you're not repressing anything. You're allowing it all to come out. That's right. And you know, you stop caring about that stuff that you used to care about, you know, I mean, I used to put, they go up and down stuff, you know, I don't care, people. 00:20:25:12 - 00:20:34:18 Unknown It's not going to change what people think of me. You know, they're not going to like me because I have early skin. They're not like, because I don't 00:20:34:18 - 00:20:53:22 Unknown are you working on another, other, topics for your newsletter? Oh, yes. I just I'm thinking about there's one, one of our, one of my colleagues at the village wrote it, and, it's, the subject of, adult children of aging parents. 00:20:53:22 - 00:21:24:00 Unknown And, you know what? All the issues that come up for them, she had a really scary experience with her own father. So, we got into that, so. But I'm going to be next, and I, I'm thinking about trying to find some interesting and new ways to talk about community. You know, we fling that word around, Olaf and, there so many components to it. 00:21:24:00 - 00:21:50:03 Unknown You know, this idea of, loose ties and, you know, kind of tangent, the things that you build community with, they just aren't, your neighbors and, you know, your next of kin, there's there's a lot of ways to build community. We were doing a, a presentation on, advanced care planning and talking about the subject of, planning ahead. 00:21:50:03 - 00:22:14:10 Unknown And you know what? You have to get in place all that stuff. And, one of our staff members talked about the fact that there's a crossing guard and that she passes every morning on her way to the elf, and that person has become a part of her support network. If if she doesn't show up for a few days, you know, that person would know. 00:22:14:12 - 00:22:52:16 Unknown It's I love all those little ways you can, show up to your life and, extend your sense of community. Yeah, especially finding different ways for those who do not have family, as you were talking about earlier. Yeah. New our solo or solo agers who don't have others that they live with. And so I think the finding community as you're discussing is a major way of feeling more comfortable in the world as well. 00:22:52:18 - 00:23:15:21 Unknown It's kind of essential. The, you just need to think of something. Oh, the term solo aging has got a little bit of sadness attached to it. You know, I wish there was there was another way to talk about it. Except nobody would know what you were talking about. I know there was somebody at some point who tried to promote this term. 00:23:15:23 - 00:23:48:00 Unknown Elder orphans. Can you imagine? They always make everything that happens to old people so sad. It's it's that makes you say, yes, I, I caught on to that, that term also on I was like, oh no, it's, it's although I've heard people refer to themselves as an elder orphan, so but I think that has come to mean that it's that these are people who had no really no connections with it, family or close friends. 00:23:48:02 - 00:24:18:12 Unknown So yeah, let's it's a sad one. Let's let's use different language. Exactly. Yes. And and as you get older, of course, you lose so many people. Who were your support network necessarily? And that can make a big difference, too. And and create this idea of elder orphan. Yeah. I had this idea of calling it, just referring to it as heads of household, but that's that's a little too academic. 00:24:18:12 - 00:24:53:00 Unknown And demographic, but it basically is what it is. I mean, the head of household has to take care of, you know, making sure whoever is in that household is safe and. Yeah, right. So so what can you offer other women who will be in your shoes or only? Yeah, I, I feel a little uncomfortable answering this question because as I've told you, I've had an easy time of it. 00:24:53:02 - 00:25:24:09 Unknown However. I can say that when this first happened 20 years ago, I did wander around for a time saying, this lady, I've been married five years. You know, this isn't what I signed up for. I can't do this. What's happening? All that kind of stuff. And then suddenly, somehow, I got to the point of, I have been training my whole life to be able to do. 00:25:24:11 - 00:25:51:03 Unknown I'm organized. I know how to get things done. I know how to plan. I'm empathetic. And I think what that process is, is there's just something inside of you that you just. You just have to let go. You have to stop fighting it. It's it's there. It's not going to go away, and it's not going to get better. 00:25:51:05 - 00:26:22:24 Unknown It's only going to get worse. And you have to stop fighting it. And, it's interesting. And, you know, I've been going along all these years. And last year I, I thought I found myself in the emergency room. I was flying, but there I was by myself, of course, catastrophizing I have cancer. And I went, yeah, I'm going to die and I'm going to leave him all I was sobbing because I'm thinking I'm going to die and leave him all alone. 00:26:22:24 - 00:26:49:07 Unknown I just couldn't stand the whole thought of it and somehow I was there for a week. They fixed me up and I went home. But through that process, I realized that I was still, after all these years, had some level of resentment in me. And for some reason, that experience dissolved it. And when I came home from there, I had a different attitude. 00:26:49:09 - 00:27:15:14 Unknown I was I felt more like I was, a caregiver, a nurse, not a nurses, but a caregiver, period. That, you know, if something to happen to you, it wasn't my fault. I was doing all the right things. There were things that were happening that I couldn't prevent. I didn't have that, you know, that tension all the time. 00:27:15:14 - 00:27:37:12 Unknown And that was just that was just, you know, less than a year ago. But I it's been much easier even since then. As easy as before. It's been much easier. I don't feel the, you know, that life and death sword hanging over my head on the day, and I can't tell you how to get there. It's just it's an internal journey. 00:27:37:18 - 00:27:43:23 Unknown But I think, as I said, the idea of letting go, it helps. 00:27:43:23 - 00:28:01:08 Unknown Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much for sharing this with us. I know, I know some many of our listeners will resonate with your, your experience and appreciate your insights. And thank you for talking about everything so openly. We really appreciate it. Thank you all. 00:28:01:08 - 00:28:02:06 Unknown So pleasure. 00:28:02:06 - 00:28:29:12 Unknown And listeners, we'd like to see more of you in our monthly online programs. Make Your Voice Heard as together we change the conversation about women aging. Visit Aging Reimagined Circle at Women over 70.com, and we want to thank our sponsor, Plymouth Place in Lagrange Park, Illinois, where senior living is redefined with options and opportunities to fit individual needs and preferences. 00:28:29:14 - 00:28:59:20 Unknown And if you're interested in another wonderful podcast, we recommend Beverly Glaser. Are you ready to ignite your next chapter? Aging with Purpose and Passion is the weekly podcast, inspiring women over 50 to embrace bold life shifts and unlock the potential their potential through captivating stories from trailblazing senior women, aging with purpose and passion that. Com. Thank you for listening.