1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,560 Hey. What's really going on? It's Boots Riley. 2 00:00:02,560 --> 00:00:04,240 I'm the writer and director of Sorry to 3 00:00:04,240 --> 00:00:07,379 Bother You. You are now listening to 4 00:00:07,759 --> 00:00:10,099 two dope teachers and a microphone. 5 00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:13,324 Keep it locked right here. No texting. 6 00:00:33,030 --> 00:00:35,750 Good afternoon, two Dope Nation. How y'all doing? 7 00:00:35,750 --> 00:00:38,149 Doing good. So, I'm Gerard Munoz. My boy, 8 00:00:38,149 --> 00:00:40,229 Kevin Adams. And we are two Dope Teachers 9 00:00:40,229 --> 00:00:41,049 and a Mic. 10 00:00:41,414 --> 00:00:44,295 We have this incredible opportunity right now. Do 11 00:00:44,295 --> 00:00:45,655 you wanna talk about our guests that we 12 00:00:45,655 --> 00:00:48,134 have up here? We we, again, are at 13 00:00:48,134 --> 00:00:49,274 the, conference 14 00:00:49,734 --> 00:00:52,215 on racial and social justice, the NEA conference, 15 00:00:52,215 --> 00:00:53,994 and we have the pleasure 16 00:00:54,695 --> 00:00:55,434 of having, 17 00:00:56,289 --> 00:00:58,690 I think, our number one greatest guest that 18 00:00:58,690 --> 00:01:00,390 we've ever had on the podcast. 19 00:01:01,409 --> 00:01:02,390 This is a man 20 00:01:03,010 --> 00:01:05,989 who has influenced me through his lyrics. 21 00:01:06,370 --> 00:01:08,290 I influenced both of us. Yep. We quote 22 00:01:08,290 --> 00:01:11,010 his lines routinely on this podcast. That's right. 23 00:01:11,010 --> 00:01:11,750 That's right. 24 00:01:12,165 --> 00:01:12,665 He 25 00:01:13,125 --> 00:01:14,185 is a auteur. 26 00:01:14,564 --> 00:01:16,105 He is a force, 27 00:01:16,484 --> 00:01:18,185 and, we just wanna welcome 28 00:01:18,645 --> 00:01:21,284 Boots Riley to the pilot podcast. Thanks for 29 00:01:21,284 --> 00:01:23,125 having me. Thanks for being with us. Thank 30 00:01:23,125 --> 00:01:25,465 you. So we just had this incredible experience. 31 00:01:25,605 --> 00:01:27,545 I think a lot of folks are familiar 32 00:01:27,629 --> 00:01:29,310 with the music that you make with the 33 00:01:29,310 --> 00:01:30,030 coup and with, 34 00:01:30,670 --> 00:01:32,829 and and through that sort of vein of 35 00:01:32,829 --> 00:01:34,349 hip hop. I think a lot of people 36 00:01:34,349 --> 00:01:35,869 in the room just learned about your social 37 00:01:35,869 --> 00:01:37,789 justice roots. Can you talk a little bit 38 00:01:37,789 --> 00:01:40,369 about what brought you into the forefront of 39 00:01:40,745 --> 00:01:41,484 this justice 40 00:01:41,784 --> 00:01:44,185 work and engaging and amplifying the work that 41 00:01:44,185 --> 00:01:46,905 are that's happening in communities? Well, what brought 42 00:01:46,905 --> 00:01:49,305 me into the work, not necessarily in the 43 00:01:49,305 --> 00:01:49,805 forefront, 44 00:01:50,585 --> 00:01:51,305 but I, 45 00:01:51,944 --> 00:01:52,444 I 46 00:01:53,030 --> 00:01:53,849 I started, 47 00:01:54,469 --> 00:01:54,969 helping, 48 00:01:55,750 --> 00:01:58,090 farm workers in Central California Valley. 49 00:01:58,549 --> 00:02:01,670 Started, helping them organize. So they had a 50 00:02:01,670 --> 00:02:02,489 summer project 51 00:02:02,950 --> 00:02:04,170 where I 52 00:02:04,469 --> 00:02:07,275 went and helped run off flyers, and, 53 00:02:07,695 --> 00:02:09,395 they were creating something called 54 00:02:09,775 --> 00:02:12,254 the Antiracist Farm Workers Union, which was off 55 00:02:12,415 --> 00:02:15,215 which which was some folks that split off 56 00:02:15,215 --> 00:02:15,955 from the, 57 00:02:16,735 --> 00:02:19,474 from from the United Farm Workers because because 58 00:02:19,534 --> 00:02:21,314 at the time, United Farm Workers 59 00:02:21,770 --> 00:02:22,590 were helping 60 00:02:23,129 --> 00:02:24,349 immigration to 61 00:02:24,729 --> 00:02:27,050 deport people. Yes. Yes. Right. And so these 62 00:02:27,050 --> 00:02:29,129 were more radical folks that were like, we're 63 00:02:29,129 --> 00:02:31,709 gonna create the anti racist farm workers union. 64 00:02:32,090 --> 00:02:32,590 And, 65 00:02:32,969 --> 00:02:34,875 I went and they, you know, and and 66 00:02:34,875 --> 00:02:36,955 it was like just it it was boot 67 00:02:36,955 --> 00:02:39,194 camp basically because they'd be going to work 68 00:02:39,194 --> 00:02:41,034 in the fields, you know, leaving at three 69 00:02:41,034 --> 00:02:42,875 in the morning. They'd be like, okay. It's 70 00:02:42,875 --> 00:02:44,655 your job to, 71 00:02:45,275 --> 00:02:47,034 to to make the caravan for the day, 72 00:02:47,034 --> 00:02:48,955 to organize it. Here's the phone list of 73 00:02:48,955 --> 00:02:51,550 phone numbers. Here's the things. Get get the 74 00:02:51,550 --> 00:02:53,230 signs made. Yeah. Figure out what the router 75 00:02:53,389 --> 00:02:55,310 and you're like, I'm only 15. You know? 76 00:02:55,310 --> 00:02:57,069 I'm just you know? Yeah. And you're just 77 00:02:57,069 --> 00:02:58,670 getting it right in there with people. Yeah. 78 00:02:58,670 --> 00:03:00,030 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right in there, like, just 79 00:03:00,030 --> 00:03:02,030 seeing what they're doing. And so through that, 80 00:03:02,030 --> 00:03:04,129 I got a good school about 81 00:03:05,305 --> 00:03:08,025 how power actually works. Yeah. No doubt. That's 82 00:03:08,025 --> 00:03:10,025 incredible. So 15 years old, you're out there 83 00:03:10,185 --> 00:03:12,745 Yeah. Doing the work and and supporting these 84 00:03:12,745 --> 00:03:14,364 movements that that have happened. 85 00:03:15,704 --> 00:03:16,924 What is it about 86 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:20,199 educational justice in schools that resonates with you? 87 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:22,280 You said some incredible words up there. Yeah. 88 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:22,840 Yeah. Yeah. 89 00:03:23,319 --> 00:03:25,319 And I think Kevin and I, we're sitting 90 00:03:25,319 --> 00:03:26,599 there. We just keep looking at each other 91 00:03:26,599 --> 00:03:29,319 like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's it. That's 92 00:03:29,319 --> 00:03:31,080 it. So what is it that got you 93 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:31,580 interested 94 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:32,685 in this, 95 00:03:33,164 --> 00:03:34,705 in this movement around school? 96 00:03:35,164 --> 00:03:37,884 Well, you know, well, one, having gone through 97 00:03:37,884 --> 00:03:38,944 school and having 98 00:03:40,125 --> 00:03:42,125 it being a major part of what what 99 00:03:42,125 --> 00:03:45,245 formed me and knowing that that's for most 100 00:03:45,245 --> 00:03:45,745 humans, 101 00:03:46,125 --> 00:03:47,340 a major part of that. 102 00:03:47,900 --> 00:03:48,459 You know, 103 00:03:49,900 --> 00:03:51,599 also understanding that, 104 00:03:53,019 --> 00:03:55,039 teachers teach not only in the classroom, 105 00:03:55,340 --> 00:03:58,379 but then but but what what the students 106 00:03:58,379 --> 00:03:59,900 go through, what they see in their life, 107 00:03:59,900 --> 00:04:01,900 that teaches them Yeah. A lot. And so 108 00:04:01,900 --> 00:04:03,425 I think it's really important, 109 00:04:04,125 --> 00:04:06,525 that people see teachers fighting for the things 110 00:04:06,525 --> 00:04:09,585 that they need. And also to understand that, 111 00:04:11,085 --> 00:04:13,564 a lot of the times teachers understand their 112 00:04:13,564 --> 00:04:15,405 power and the power they have. So a 113 00:04:15,405 --> 00:04:18,180 lot that that that understanding that the teachers 114 00:04:18,180 --> 00:04:19,319 aren't only fighting 115 00:04:20,339 --> 00:04:21,319 for their well-being, 116 00:04:22,100 --> 00:04:24,580 and and not only is their well-being attached 117 00:04:24,580 --> 00:04:25,720 to, you know, 118 00:04:26,100 --> 00:04:26,759 how well, 119 00:04:27,139 --> 00:04:27,639 education, 120 00:04:29,855 --> 00:04:32,014 is going. Mhmm. But it's also that they're 121 00:04:32,014 --> 00:04:34,014 fighting for other things that have to do 122 00:04:34,014 --> 00:04:35,535 with the students Right. And have to do 123 00:04:35,535 --> 00:04:36,754 with the larger community. 124 00:04:37,134 --> 00:04:37,634 So, 125 00:04:38,095 --> 00:04:39,935 you know, a a lot of people don't 126 00:04:39,935 --> 00:04:42,730 understand that about those fights. That's right. That 127 00:04:43,029 --> 00:04:43,529 that 128 00:04:44,149 --> 00:04:44,730 that teachers 129 00:04:45,430 --> 00:04:46,250 became teachers 130 00:04:46,949 --> 00:04:49,990 often because it would because they wanted to 131 00:04:49,990 --> 00:04:51,910 see Yeah. You know, they want to see 132 00:04:51,910 --> 00:04:53,830 people learn. They want to see education, and 133 00:04:53,830 --> 00:04:55,335 then they get in there, they under they 134 00:04:55,335 --> 00:04:57,254 learn that they're gonna have to be the 135 00:04:57,254 --> 00:05:00,375 ones to reshape education, you know, through and 136 00:05:00,375 --> 00:05:01,975 and the, you know, the way they have 137 00:05:01,975 --> 00:05:04,235 power in that is not just through, 138 00:05:04,935 --> 00:05:06,855 electing people who are going to appoint the 139 00:05:06,855 --> 00:05:07,595 right people. 140 00:05:07,895 --> 00:05:11,050 It's through, you know, being able to shut 141 00:05:11,050 --> 00:05:12,649 it down, being able to use that threat 142 00:05:12,810 --> 00:05:15,050 Yeah. Of withholding labor to say, this is 143 00:05:15,050 --> 00:05:17,149 what we want. These are our demands. 144 00:05:17,930 --> 00:05:19,289 You know? Yeah. And we'll shut it all 145 00:05:19,289 --> 00:05:21,769 down. Yeah. Yeah. It down. Yeah. And I, 146 00:05:21,769 --> 00:05:23,289 you know, I was struck by your words 147 00:05:23,289 --> 00:05:24,910 when we, you were speaking, 148 00:05:26,514 --> 00:05:27,334 at the keynote, 149 00:05:27,875 --> 00:05:29,714 because I I think about our own experience 150 00:05:29,714 --> 00:05:31,415 in Denver and our teacher strike. 151 00:05:31,795 --> 00:05:34,615 And, you know, how many teachers were unwilling 152 00:05:35,475 --> 00:05:37,490 to really carry it and push it further 153 00:05:37,490 --> 00:05:39,250 because the they made the first offer, and 154 00:05:39,250 --> 00:05:41,170 we accepted right off the bat. You know? 155 00:05:41,170 --> 00:05:42,230 And I and we accepted 156 00:05:42,610 --> 00:05:45,090 in the middle of the night. Like, if 157 00:05:45,090 --> 00:05:46,529 teachers woke up, they're like, do I go 158 00:05:46,529 --> 00:05:48,370 back to work today? Do I stay? Yeah. 159 00:05:48,529 --> 00:05:50,545 Are we still on the line, Pickety, and 160 00:05:50,545 --> 00:05:51,824 I think it's really important. And I think 161 00:05:51,824 --> 00:05:53,185 another thing that came up for us I 162 00:05:53,185 --> 00:05:54,704 think with things like that, because I don't 163 00:05:54,704 --> 00:05:57,024 know about the Yeah. Denver strike. But in 164 00:05:57,024 --> 00:05:59,125 other ones that I've seen, sometimes 165 00:05:59,824 --> 00:06:00,305 the, 166 00:06:01,264 --> 00:06:02,564 the the local leadership, 167 00:06:04,410 --> 00:06:07,449 doesn't have a gauge of how how much 168 00:06:07,449 --> 00:06:10,090 the teachers are actually willing to fight. Yeah. 169 00:06:10,090 --> 00:06:12,730 And they and they accept things Yep. Based 170 00:06:12,730 --> 00:06:13,230 on, 171 00:06:13,610 --> 00:06:15,230 you know, this this misconception 172 00:06:15,610 --> 00:06:17,654 Yep. That that people you know, if you 173 00:06:17,654 --> 00:06:19,514 got people out there fighting, often, 174 00:06:20,295 --> 00:06:22,455 they they wanna win the thing that they 175 00:06:22,455 --> 00:06:25,115 came for. Yep. Yep. Right? Yep. And so 176 00:06:25,254 --> 00:06:26,935 we've we've seen that. It doesn't just happen 177 00:06:26,935 --> 00:06:28,455 with teachers. It happens in a lot of 178 00:06:28,455 --> 00:06:30,939 struggles. Yeah. And, you know, people of the 179 00:06:30,939 --> 00:06:34,620 leadership being more being less radical than than 180 00:06:34,620 --> 00:06:37,180 the the than the base. Yep. Yep. And, 181 00:06:37,420 --> 00:06:39,180 and I think some of that has to 182 00:06:39,180 --> 00:06:42,399 do with having, you know, having there be 183 00:06:43,615 --> 00:06:45,154 better channels of communication, 184 00:06:45,615 --> 00:06:47,935 better ways to gauge where folks are. Yeah. 185 00:06:47,935 --> 00:06:48,595 And, also, 186 00:06:49,454 --> 00:06:50,194 you know, 187 00:06:50,574 --> 00:06:51,954 one thing that organizers 188 00:06:52,415 --> 00:06:54,915 and, quote, unquote, leaders are supposed to do 189 00:06:54,975 --> 00:06:56,995 is is help push people 190 00:06:57,529 --> 00:06:59,850 towards the direction. Yeah. Yeah. Help influence them. 191 00:06:59,850 --> 00:07:02,490 Yeah. No doubt. To make the choices that 192 00:07:02,490 --> 00:07:04,410 that that that are that are good. You 193 00:07:04,410 --> 00:07:06,410 know? I mean, you think about, you know, 194 00:07:06,410 --> 00:07:07,930 even when we talk about things that are 195 00:07:07,930 --> 00:07:10,029 non labor struggles like, you know, 196 00:07:10,604 --> 00:07:11,824 civil rights movement, 197 00:07:12,365 --> 00:07:14,944 certain aspects of it. Mhmm. All those orations 198 00:07:15,004 --> 00:07:15,745 we hear 199 00:07:17,004 --> 00:07:17,985 are organizers 200 00:07:18,685 --> 00:07:20,444 trying to get people to move to the 201 00:07:20,444 --> 00:07:22,764 left. Yep. Yep. You know? Yeah. They're not 202 00:07:22,764 --> 00:07:24,764 just saying Yeah. You know? That's the whole 203 00:07:24,764 --> 00:07:26,529 point. If you're, you know and And and 204 00:07:26,529 --> 00:07:28,629 so I think sometimes it's not 205 00:07:29,009 --> 00:07:29,509 where 206 00:07:29,970 --> 00:07:32,050 where the teachers are. Yep. Yep. Yep. It's 207 00:07:32,050 --> 00:07:34,389 it's it's how how, 208 00:07:35,410 --> 00:07:37,730 sometimes some of us as organizers have been 209 00:07:37,730 --> 00:07:38,230 taught, 210 00:07:38,770 --> 00:07:41,295 in this sort of to to to try 211 00:07:41,295 --> 00:07:43,375 to be cert you have to be responsible 212 00:07:43,455 --> 00:07:45,214 Yep. Yep. To folks. But I think there 213 00:07:45,214 --> 00:07:46,915 has to be a way to 214 00:07:47,295 --> 00:07:50,915 communicate and also to agitate, to get people 215 00:07:51,055 --> 00:07:53,055 to understand Yeah. No doubt. When the fight 216 00:07:53,055 --> 00:07:54,910 needs to happen Yeah. No. Or longer. And 217 00:07:54,910 --> 00:07:57,389 and you referenced the the strike in LA 218 00:07:57,389 --> 00:07:59,629 and and the shutdown of the entire city 219 00:07:59,629 --> 00:08:00,129 around, 220 00:08:00,509 --> 00:08:01,730 around a school strike. 221 00:08:02,509 --> 00:08:04,269 Something that you said just keeps on ringing 222 00:08:04,269 --> 00:08:05,949 in my mind, and and this is the 223 00:08:05,949 --> 00:08:09,310 idea of disrupting and dismantling capitalist systems. Right? 224 00:08:09,310 --> 00:08:11,754 This idea that, you know, Kevin mentioned We've 225 00:08:11,754 --> 00:08:13,914 had this going back. Yeah. Our first our 226 00:08:13,914 --> 00:08:15,514 first offer we get, we're like, okay. Cool. 227 00:08:15,514 --> 00:08:17,435 We'll get it. Because in a way, like, 228 00:08:17,435 --> 00:08:19,754 we kinda wanna make a statement, but we're 229 00:08:19,754 --> 00:08:22,714 not necessarily willing to push it to its 230 00:08:22,714 --> 00:08:23,774 logical conclusion. 231 00:08:25,604 --> 00:08:26,104 The 232 00:08:26,810 --> 00:08:27,949 the end of capitalism 233 00:08:28,329 --> 00:08:30,990 in schools, what what would that bring 234 00:08:31,290 --> 00:08:33,710 if we are able to put aside 235 00:08:34,490 --> 00:08:36,649 the the notion that our schools need to 236 00:08:36,649 --> 00:08:37,610 be feeding this, 237 00:08:38,009 --> 00:08:41,605 educational industrial complex? Yeah. How do like, what 238 00:08:41,605 --> 00:08:43,045 would that look like if we're able to 239 00:08:43,045 --> 00:08:45,764 do that? You you'd have education that's closer 240 00:08:45,764 --> 00:08:48,165 to the truth. Right? Because so much of 241 00:08:48,165 --> 00:08:49,144 what we're taught 242 00:08:49,764 --> 00:08:51,225 is, you know, 243 00:08:51,605 --> 00:08:54,350 in a nonthreatening way to the establishment. So 244 00:08:54,389 --> 00:08:56,549 Yeah. In service of the establishment. Even even 245 00:08:56,549 --> 00:08:58,070 when you like Yeah. If you just were 246 00:08:58,070 --> 00:08:59,589 to look at history and the things that 247 00:08:59,589 --> 00:09:01,830 are left out That's right. Of history and 248 00:09:01,830 --> 00:09:03,990 how they're taught. Yep. And and and even 249 00:09:03,990 --> 00:09:06,309 in in, you know, through textbooks that aren't 250 00:09:06,309 --> 00:09:07,450 necessarily considered, 251 00:09:08,384 --> 00:09:11,024 conservative or whatever. Right. You know, they're leaving 252 00:09:11,024 --> 00:09:13,665 out the the they're leaving out the impetus 253 00:09:13,665 --> 00:09:15,504 of it, which is community involvement. And so 254 00:09:15,585 --> 00:09:18,625 because even after capitalism, there's going to that 255 00:09:18,625 --> 00:09:20,820 the only way to keep that Yep. Is 256 00:09:20,879 --> 00:09:22,639 for peep for the community to be engaged 257 00:09:22,639 --> 00:09:24,079 and for people to be in struggle. No 258 00:09:24,079 --> 00:09:26,659 doubt. So you'll have a a, you know, 259 00:09:26,959 --> 00:09:28,659 something that that is closer 260 00:09:29,039 --> 00:09:31,120 to truth. And then you'll also have, you 261 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,679 know, we we talk about this idea when 262 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:36,134 we say education is the key. That should 263 00:09:36,134 --> 00:09:38,774 be like education is the key to feeling 264 00:09:38,774 --> 00:09:40,855 enlightened about the world and all the what 265 00:09:40,855 --> 00:09:42,774 they mean is education is key for you 266 00:09:42,774 --> 00:09:44,038 to get a job that you can pay 267 00:09:44,038 --> 00:09:45,274 for work. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 268 00:09:45,654 --> 00:09:47,355 And and and actually, you know, 269 00:09:48,029 --> 00:09:49,230 it doesn't. You know what I'm saying? That's 270 00:09:49,230 --> 00:09:49,730 right. 271 00:09:50,190 --> 00:09:51,629 My office doesn't. So 272 00:09:52,190 --> 00:09:54,669 but what about an education system that that 273 00:09:54,669 --> 00:09:57,230 taught us just more about the the the 274 00:09:57,230 --> 00:09:59,230 world, you know, things that weren't based on 275 00:09:59,389 --> 00:10:02,029 A system that is community. Right? Only like, 276 00:10:02,029 --> 00:10:03,554 okay. You're gonna be able to get a 277 00:10:03,554 --> 00:10:05,475 job Yeah. Does this and does that. So 278 00:10:05,475 --> 00:10:07,154 these are the the only things you need 279 00:10:07,154 --> 00:10:08,835 to know. Yeah. And and and maybe it 280 00:10:08,835 --> 00:10:11,315 would be an education system that kept going 281 00:10:11,554 --> 00:10:13,394 Yeah. Even as you got a job Yep. 282 00:10:13,394 --> 00:10:15,475 Yep. Yep. That that went throughout your whole 283 00:10:15,475 --> 00:10:18,160 life. A culture of learners. Yeah. Yeah. So 284 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:18,639 when, 285 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:21,279 what do you see as the connection between 286 00:10:21,279 --> 00:10:22,420 art and activism? 287 00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:24,240 Well, I think, 288 00:10:25,279 --> 00:10:28,720 art is is communication. That's, you know, it's 289 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:29,220 it's 290 00:10:29,855 --> 00:10:32,575 someone putting forward their putting forward an idea. 291 00:10:32,575 --> 00:10:34,754 Mhmm. No matter what that idea is, 292 00:10:35,055 --> 00:10:37,795 you know, it's someone putting forward that idea. 293 00:10:38,095 --> 00:10:39,634 And, and so 294 00:10:40,014 --> 00:10:40,915 human beings, 295 00:10:41,615 --> 00:10:44,195 it's it's the duty of all human beings 296 00:10:44,860 --> 00:10:46,480 to change the world for the better. 297 00:10:47,179 --> 00:10:49,200 And so, I I think that that, 298 00:10:50,300 --> 00:10:52,139 you know, if we're thinking about that, even 299 00:10:52,139 --> 00:10:53,580 if you're not trying to make art that 300 00:10:53,580 --> 00:10:55,820 says, this is exactly how I think the 301 00:10:55,820 --> 00:10:57,820 world should change. If you're come if if 302 00:10:57,820 --> 00:11:00,204 that's who you are as a person, it 303 00:11:00,204 --> 00:11:01,884 will come out in your art even if 304 00:11:01,884 --> 00:11:04,125 you're just making a love story. Yeah. You 305 00:11:04,125 --> 00:11:05,584 know? Yeah. Or 306 00:11:05,884 --> 00:11:07,644 even if you're just telling the tale of 307 00:11:07,644 --> 00:11:09,804 this thing that happened on one day. Yeah. 308 00:11:09,804 --> 00:11:11,985 That'll come out in your in your world 309 00:11:12,379 --> 00:11:15,100 view. And so I I think, you know, 310 00:11:15,100 --> 00:11:16,860 if we're trying to get trying to get 311 00:11:16,860 --> 00:11:17,840 people to, 312 00:11:19,500 --> 00:11:20,240 take power 313 00:11:20,620 --> 00:11:23,500 in their daily lives, get involved in in 314 00:11:23,500 --> 00:11:24,960 things, I think 315 00:11:25,375 --> 00:11:27,615 it's important to speak the language that people 316 00:11:27,615 --> 00:11:30,495 are speaking. Yeah. Absolutely. Right? So and and 317 00:11:30,495 --> 00:11:32,595 that language that we're consuming, 318 00:11:33,134 --> 00:11:34,194 that we're speaking, 319 00:11:34,975 --> 00:11:36,894 all a lot of that falls under art, 320 00:11:36,894 --> 00:11:39,694 falls under music, falls under film, falls under 321 00:11:39,694 --> 00:11:40,194 television. 322 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:44,580 All of these things are and paintings, whatever. 323 00:11:45,279 --> 00:11:47,519 We gotta speak all the languages that that 324 00:11:47,519 --> 00:11:50,480 that that, people are being spoken to in. 325 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:52,480 Yeah. That that I mean, that's absolutely powerful. 326 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:54,945 Right? Because when we start seeing the role 327 00:11:54,945 --> 00:11:56,464 that the creative arts has done, and we 328 00:11:56,544 --> 00:11:58,485 over here, we have this incredible booth of 329 00:11:59,024 --> 00:12:01,745 of, of silk screened, like, protest posters, and 330 00:12:01,745 --> 00:12:03,424 and we start looking at the role that 331 00:12:03,424 --> 00:12:05,904 that the arts have done to get people 332 00:12:05,904 --> 00:12:08,420 to imagine liberation and imagine what freedom looks 333 00:12:08,420 --> 00:12:10,180 like and feels like and tastes like and 334 00:12:10,180 --> 00:12:11,080 sounds like. 335 00:12:11,540 --> 00:12:13,220 I I think that's why I think that's 336 00:12:13,220 --> 00:12:14,500 why it's so easy to cut the arts 337 00:12:14,500 --> 00:12:16,259 in schools. Right? Because that's the kind of 338 00:12:16,259 --> 00:12:18,740 thing that's gonna get kids thinking beyond, you 339 00:12:18,740 --> 00:12:20,899 know, the material gains that an education will 340 00:12:20,899 --> 00:12:21,585 get you. 341 00:12:22,065 --> 00:12:24,065 And and here's the thing. And and the 342 00:12:24,384 --> 00:12:26,465 you know, which reminds me, there's a certain 343 00:12:26,465 --> 00:12:28,865 trend to try to get art funded where 344 00:12:28,865 --> 00:12:29,524 they're like, 345 00:12:30,304 --> 00:12:33,585 let's teach music because it teaches kids math. 346 00:12:33,585 --> 00:12:36,529 Let's get rap because it teaches literacy. I 347 00:12:36,529 --> 00:12:39,009 mean, no. Let's teach music because music allows 348 00:12:39,009 --> 00:12:41,090 people to express themselves. That's right. That's right. 349 00:12:41,090 --> 00:12:42,929 Same way teaching them to write an essay 350 00:12:42,929 --> 00:12:45,410 does. That's right. Yeah. Let's teach, you know, 351 00:12:45,410 --> 00:12:47,429 painting because we need 352 00:12:48,050 --> 00:12:51,144 people to express themselves and and it is 353 00:12:51,144 --> 00:12:53,625 a value in and of itself. Like, hip 354 00:12:53,625 --> 00:12:55,945 hop shouldn't be taught because it teaches math. 355 00:12:55,945 --> 00:12:58,345 Hip hop should be taught because it is 356 00:12:58,345 --> 00:12:59,404 the most influential 357 00:12:59,784 --> 00:13:00,284 literary 358 00:13:00,985 --> 00:13:03,304 movement Right. In the his in the last 359 00:13:03,304 --> 00:13:04,764 couple hundred years. Absolutely. 360 00:13:05,199 --> 00:13:05,699 Absolutely. 361 00:13:06,079 --> 00:13:08,019 And and for people to be 362 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:11,699 encouraged to to create through that that medium 363 00:13:12,159 --> 00:13:12,659 is 364 00:13:13,199 --> 00:13:14,339 is literacy 365 00:13:15,199 --> 00:13:17,120 in and of itself. Yeah. You you've got 366 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:18,959 me thinking about all the conversations I had 367 00:13:18,959 --> 00:13:20,625 with my parents about, why are you gonna 368 00:13:20,625 --> 00:13:22,144 major in that? Why do you wanna study 369 00:13:22,144 --> 00:13:24,384 that? That's right. And, like, now now you've 370 00:13:24,384 --> 00:13:26,865 got me thinking about well, because it's it's 371 00:13:26,865 --> 00:13:28,304 a way to be me. Right? And it's 372 00:13:28,304 --> 00:13:30,225 a way to try to put something positive 373 00:13:30,225 --> 00:13:32,304 in the world and and do and just 374 00:13:32,304 --> 00:13:33,825 do that work, which is And here's the 375 00:13:33,825 --> 00:13:35,800 thing, a lot of that okay. A lot 376 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:37,800 of that is is, 377 00:13:38,519 --> 00:13:41,580 you know, our family wants us to survive. 378 00:13:41,639 --> 00:13:43,560 Like, our family knows that it's crabs in 379 00:13:43,560 --> 00:13:45,559 a barrel. Yep. That's right. Right. To be 380 00:13:45,559 --> 00:13:47,559 the crab that gets out. Yep. And but 381 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:49,340 but Yep. If we're as a community, 382 00:13:49,824 --> 00:13:52,164 we can't and and so therefore, they're like, 383 00:13:52,225 --> 00:13:54,865 get this Get yours. This particular thing that 384 00:13:54,865 --> 00:13:56,464 will get you that job. Yeah. On the 385 00:13:56,625 --> 00:13:57,284 on on 386 00:13:58,225 --> 00:14:00,544 and as a community though, we can't think 387 00:14:00,544 --> 00:14:02,304 that way because we know that only lets 388 00:14:02,304 --> 00:14:04,065 a couple people out. Yep. And then we 389 00:14:04,065 --> 00:14:06,090 also know that you can get that thing 390 00:14:06,090 --> 00:14:08,090 and you're most people don't have a job 391 00:14:08,090 --> 00:14:09,049 in the in the, 392 00:14:09,529 --> 00:14:11,450 degree that they got it that Yep. Yep. 393 00:14:11,450 --> 00:14:12,490 Yep. Yep. Yep. They got a degree. You 394 00:14:12,490 --> 00:14:13,690 got a degree and you got a job 395 00:14:13,690 --> 00:14:16,269 that you needed. And and so, you know, 396 00:14:16,330 --> 00:14:18,090 the the thing is is that we have 397 00:14:18,090 --> 00:14:19,070 to look at education 398 00:14:19,865 --> 00:14:21,704 in a different way. You know, we've shaped 399 00:14:21,704 --> 00:14:23,865 it to try to meet industry. Yeah. And 400 00:14:23,865 --> 00:14:25,865 those folks that run the industry, they don't 401 00:14:26,105 --> 00:14:26,924 you know, like, 402 00:14:27,384 --> 00:14:29,144 you know, we've got an industry of people 403 00:14:29,144 --> 00:14:31,544 learning coding, for instance. And that's they don't 404 00:14:31,544 --> 00:14:33,704 know anything else but how to do these 405 00:14:33,704 --> 00:14:35,889 things. And therefore, they only know how to 406 00:14:36,049 --> 00:14:38,289 I mean, you know, I don't know. Like, 407 00:14:38,289 --> 00:14:40,289 they they're spending so much time doing this 408 00:14:40,289 --> 00:14:42,450 stuff that they don't know about much else. 409 00:14:42,450 --> 00:14:44,370 Yeah. Yep. Yeah. And so, you know, comparing 410 00:14:44,370 --> 00:14:46,289 how quickly things have changed. So even some 411 00:14:46,289 --> 00:14:47,985 of the folks that end up, like, let's 412 00:14:47,985 --> 00:14:49,985 take some of those folks that learn coding 413 00:14:49,985 --> 00:14:52,065 and stuff, they end up being hackers for 414 00:14:52,065 --> 00:14:53,904 a second like anonymous. Yeah. And then but 415 00:14:53,904 --> 00:14:55,504 then it's so easy if you just look 416 00:14:55,504 --> 00:14:57,424 at the news to turn them into FBI. 417 00:14:57,424 --> 00:14:59,585 That's right. That's right. Because they haven't learned. 418 00:14:59,585 --> 00:15:00,565 That's right. They haven't 419 00:15:00,945 --> 00:15:03,309 they're not connected to anything else. And so 420 00:15:03,309 --> 00:15:04,529 we've had we have this 421 00:15:04,909 --> 00:15:05,409 education 422 00:15:05,789 --> 00:15:07,089 system that's that's 423 00:15:07,549 --> 00:15:08,049 supposedly 424 00:15:08,669 --> 00:15:10,509 helping a couple people be the crabs, get 425 00:15:10,509 --> 00:15:12,289 out of the barrel. Yeah. But for everybody, 426 00:15:12,509 --> 00:15:14,509 it's not helping them to to to learn 427 00:15:14,669 --> 00:15:17,884 Right. Success versus liberation. Right? Liberation is big 428 00:15:17,884 --> 00:15:21,084 picture. Liberation is community oriented. Is turning is 429 00:15:21,084 --> 00:15:21,825 is is 430 00:15:22,684 --> 00:15:24,205 is turn is That's right. Do it. Is 431 00:15:24,205 --> 00:15:26,605 turning the buckets over so that all the 432 00:15:26,605 --> 00:15:28,290 crabs That's right. Get out. That's right. You 433 00:15:28,290 --> 00:15:29,570 get lots of snaps up there. I don't 434 00:15:29,570 --> 00:15:31,170 know if you're gonna say that. Lots of 435 00:15:31,170 --> 00:15:33,809 snaps coming from the audience. As teachers, like, 436 00:15:33,809 --> 00:15:35,730 what I'm always thinking about is is what 437 00:15:35,730 --> 00:15:37,250 can I do to make sure my students 438 00:15:37,250 --> 00:15:39,430 have the best experience and be and become 439 00:15:39,714 --> 00:15:42,274 who they wanna be? So and we and 440 00:15:42,274 --> 00:15:44,274 we are always delving into our own educational 441 00:15:44,274 --> 00:15:46,434 experiences. But when you think about your own 442 00:15:46,434 --> 00:15:48,434 educational experience, are there things that teachers did 443 00:15:48,434 --> 00:15:49,654 that significantly 444 00:15:49,955 --> 00:15:52,355 impacted you positively or negatively? For better or 445 00:15:52,355 --> 00:15:54,115 for worse. Because we know not every teacher 446 00:15:54,115 --> 00:15:55,870 out there is impacting students positively. 447 00:15:56,170 --> 00:15:57,389 Oh, I mean, definitely. 448 00:15:57,769 --> 00:15:59,690 And a lot of the the teachers that 449 00:15:59,690 --> 00:16:00,490 impacted like, 450 00:16:01,450 --> 00:16:02,110 you know, 451 00:16:02,809 --> 00:16:05,610 I I had this teacher, miss Satterfield. She 452 00:16:05,610 --> 00:16:07,769 died later of of cancer. Yes. 453 00:16:08,570 --> 00:16:10,190 And she was at Oakland High. 454 00:16:11,184 --> 00:16:13,985 And she, you know, my writing, she really 455 00:16:13,985 --> 00:16:16,085 encouraged me and she was talking to me 456 00:16:16,384 --> 00:16:18,304 all the time about how beautiful it was 457 00:16:18,304 --> 00:16:19,904 and how great it was. Nice. I remember 458 00:16:19,904 --> 00:16:21,904 I came back, like, I I hadn't been 459 00:16:21,904 --> 00:16:23,504 back to school since I graduated. And I 460 00:16:23,504 --> 00:16:26,139 came back, like, eight years later, and I 461 00:16:26,139 --> 00:16:28,139 saw her and and, I was like, hey. 462 00:16:28,139 --> 00:16:30,320 It's me, Raymond. And she's like, who? 463 00:16:31,500 --> 00:16:32,320 She she 464 00:16:33,339 --> 00:16:34,080 she was like, 465 00:16:34,620 --> 00:16:36,620 you know, and then and she didn't remember 466 00:16:36,620 --> 00:16:39,375 me. Right. And it and it was because 467 00:16:39,375 --> 00:16:41,134 she that's what she did for all her 468 00:16:41,134 --> 00:16:42,894 students. That was just my Yeah. Yeah. You 469 00:16:42,894 --> 00:16:44,975 know? That that's what she did for all 470 00:16:44,975 --> 00:16:47,455 her students. You really encouraged me. Okay. Yeah. 471 00:16:47,455 --> 00:16:49,375 Yeah. Make good one. You you feel special. 472 00:16:49,375 --> 00:16:49,875 Yeah. 473 00:16:50,269 --> 00:16:51,409 Specialist. Right? And they're 474 00:16:52,110 --> 00:16:53,409 like, oh. What was your name again? 475 00:16:54,190 --> 00:16:56,190 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. And I 476 00:16:56,190 --> 00:16:57,809 and I think were you a good student? 477 00:16:59,149 --> 00:17:01,169 I mean In your own definition of it? 478 00:17:01,309 --> 00:17:03,629 I don't know what that I mean, early 479 00:17:03,629 --> 00:17:06,154 on, I was, you know, good, and then 480 00:17:06,154 --> 00:17:08,714 I figured out that I could just pass 481 00:17:08,714 --> 00:17:10,555 the tests Yeah. And not do the homework. 482 00:17:10,555 --> 00:17:12,634 Yeah. Yeah. And, so that's what I did. 483 00:17:12,634 --> 00:17:13,755 So I was like, if I could get 484 00:17:13,755 --> 00:17:15,275 a a on the test and not do 485 00:17:15,275 --> 00:17:16,650 the homework, I'll get a c. 486 00:17:17,130 --> 00:17:17,630 And, 487 00:17:18,410 --> 00:17:19,390 and a c is passing. 488 00:17:19,690 --> 00:17:21,130 You know? And so I did that. But 489 00:17:21,130 --> 00:17:23,450 then you get to the age where you 490 00:17:23,450 --> 00:17:25,369 start cutting and not showing up for the 491 00:17:25,369 --> 00:17:27,170 test. Uh-huh. Yep. So then that Yeah. Yeah. 492 00:17:27,289 --> 00:17:29,210 That ends up being so I don't know 493 00:17:29,210 --> 00:17:31,265 if I was a a good student. But 494 00:17:31,265 --> 00:17:32,164 what got me 495 00:17:32,464 --> 00:17:34,785 to be a better student was I I 496 00:17:34,785 --> 00:17:37,765 started getting involved in organizing. And so then 497 00:17:38,065 --> 00:17:39,904 then then I was reading all of these 498 00:17:39,904 --> 00:17:42,544 things because I was interested in them Yeah. 499 00:17:42,625 --> 00:17:44,099 And because they had to do with with 500 00:17:44,099 --> 00:17:46,019 the struggle. And I would show up to 501 00:17:46,019 --> 00:17:48,119 class just to argue with the teacher. 502 00:17:48,579 --> 00:17:50,339 Yes. Right? Yes. And I feel like that 503 00:17:50,339 --> 00:17:51,880 was your whole education, Kev. 504 00:17:52,500 --> 00:17:54,099 A little bit. A little bit. I did 505 00:17:54,099 --> 00:17:55,700 a little bit of that. A little bit 506 00:17:55,700 --> 00:17:57,735 of that. Yeah. And so and so it 507 00:17:57,735 --> 00:17:58,475 it made 508 00:17:58,855 --> 00:18:01,735 me really engaged. I mean, an example of 509 00:18:01,735 --> 00:18:02,215 that is, 510 00:18:03,414 --> 00:18:05,894 there was a a a South African youth 511 00:18:05,894 --> 00:18:07,515 group called the Young Comrades. 512 00:18:08,215 --> 00:18:08,695 And, 513 00:18:09,649 --> 00:18:12,130 they were part of the Soweto Uprising. They 514 00:18:12,130 --> 00:18:13,809 came out of that and part of the 515 00:18:13,809 --> 00:18:14,549 whole boycott 516 00:18:15,250 --> 00:18:17,889 of the the the school system that happened 517 00:18:17,889 --> 00:18:18,789 for many years. 518 00:18:19,089 --> 00:18:19,589 But 519 00:18:19,970 --> 00:18:21,889 I saw an interview that happened with them 520 00:18:21,889 --> 00:18:23,409 in, like, 1982 521 00:18:23,409 --> 00:18:25,409 while nobody was going to school, and these 522 00:18:25,409 --> 00:18:27,545 are 13 year olds. Yep. Yep. And they 523 00:18:27,545 --> 00:18:28,605 were talking about 524 00:18:29,865 --> 00:18:32,205 Reagan and the the the the the the 525 00:18:32,345 --> 00:18:34,045 trade policies that were happening 526 00:18:34,825 --> 00:18:37,065 between The US and Europe and the Soviet 527 00:18:37,065 --> 00:18:38,744 Union Yep. And how that had to and 528 00:18:38,744 --> 00:18:40,700 and they were talk they they were they 529 00:18:40,700 --> 00:18:43,660 had literature references and the reason why is 530 00:18:43,660 --> 00:18:45,980 because they were engaged in struggles. So all 531 00:18:45,980 --> 00:18:47,039 of these ideas, 532 00:18:47,580 --> 00:18:50,299 all of these things had a meaning that 533 00:18:50,299 --> 00:18:52,140 they could place within their head and their 534 00:18:52,140 --> 00:18:53,265 education Yep. 535 00:18:54,224 --> 00:18:54,724 Became, 536 00:18:55,105 --> 00:18:56,785 you know, more so than they they would 537 00:18:56,785 --> 00:18:59,025 have gotten. Now now, the best of both 538 00:18:59,025 --> 00:19:02,224 worlds is to be in school and be 539 00:19:02,224 --> 00:19:04,625 involved in struggle. Yep. But in this case, 540 00:19:04,625 --> 00:19:06,224 the point is is that a lot of 541 00:19:06,224 --> 00:19:07,845 students tune out because, 542 00:19:09,019 --> 00:19:11,200 you know, they're they're being they they even 543 00:19:11,740 --> 00:19:13,039 even if it's unconsciously, 544 00:19:13,659 --> 00:19:16,139 understand they're just being taught the things that 545 00:19:16,139 --> 00:19:17,819 they need to get by to get a 546 00:19:17,819 --> 00:19:19,980 job as opposed to the things that they 547 00:19:19,980 --> 00:19:22,059 need to change the world around them. Yeah. 548 00:19:22,059 --> 00:19:24,220 And many of them will, you know, like, 549 00:19:24,220 --> 00:19:26,944 it's it's not, you know, it it you 550 00:19:26,944 --> 00:19:29,424 know, they they memorize all sorts of other 551 00:19:29,424 --> 00:19:31,345 things that they're interested in. That's right. They 552 00:19:31,345 --> 00:19:32,625 know all these That is right. And it's 553 00:19:32,625 --> 00:19:35,105 because they see a connection to their life. 554 00:19:35,105 --> 00:19:36,404 But if we have something 555 00:19:38,140 --> 00:19:40,140 that is actually trying to change the world 556 00:19:40,220 --> 00:19:41,700 and I've seen teachers do this. There was 557 00:19:41,700 --> 00:19:44,619 a teacher named Sarah Fuchs at Castlemont High 558 00:19:44,619 --> 00:19:47,420 School in the nineties, and she was getting 559 00:19:47,420 --> 00:19:49,180 her kids involved in, 560 00:19:49,660 --> 00:19:51,680 she was getting her kids in in involved 561 00:19:51,740 --> 00:19:52,140 in, 562 00:19:52,855 --> 00:19:53,434 the Mumea, 563 00:19:54,375 --> 00:19:56,634 Ray Mumea campaign. Yeah. And, 564 00:19:57,335 --> 00:20:00,214 you know, and and and all those students 565 00:20:00,214 --> 00:20:03,335 that got involved started getting really involved in 566 00:20:03,335 --> 00:20:06,054 school and really wanting to talk about these 567 00:20:06,054 --> 00:20:07,595 things and and and it made 568 00:20:07,940 --> 00:20:10,039 them see themselves in the world, 569 00:20:11,220 --> 00:20:13,299 you know, and which which which gave them 570 00:20:13,299 --> 00:20:15,940 the impetus for for for for other stuff. 571 00:20:15,940 --> 00:20:17,720 Now because of all that, 572 00:20:18,099 --> 00:20:18,759 the school, 573 00:20:20,105 --> 00:20:21,785 tried to fire her. Of course. Of course. 574 00:20:21,785 --> 00:20:23,785 Of course. And the students shut the school 575 00:20:23,785 --> 00:20:25,865 down. There you go. That's right. And got 576 00:20:25,865 --> 00:20:26,605 her rehired. 577 00:20:26,904 --> 00:20:29,464 Yeah. Right? And and and because they, you 578 00:20:29,464 --> 00:20:31,545 know, but they but but but my point 579 00:20:31,545 --> 00:20:32,525 is, I think, 580 00:20:33,220 --> 00:20:35,559 you know, that that being involved 581 00:20:35,860 --> 00:20:38,660 in changing the world around you makes you 582 00:20:38,660 --> 00:20:41,539 understand how important you are. Yeah. Yeah. I 583 00:20:41,539 --> 00:20:43,380 think that's such a powerful statement. You made 584 00:20:43,380 --> 00:20:45,700 the statement in your keynote that, you know, 585 00:20:45,700 --> 00:20:47,365 it's one thing to teach history, but but 586 00:20:47,365 --> 00:20:49,524 it's another thing to apply it. Right? So 587 00:20:49,524 --> 00:20:51,444 I so how do you know, I I've 588 00:20:51,444 --> 00:20:53,865 never understood this myself when I see teachers 589 00:20:54,085 --> 00:20:56,884 teaching about protest movements, but not sort of 590 00:20:56,884 --> 00:20:59,204 saying Having students experience the protest. There are 591 00:20:59,204 --> 00:21:01,125 things right now that people are protesting. There 592 00:21:01,125 --> 00:21:03,049 are things right now affecting your communities 593 00:21:03,429 --> 00:21:05,450 and and bringing it to life, that application. 594 00:21:05,589 --> 00:21:07,029 What are you going to do with this? 595 00:21:07,029 --> 00:21:09,190 I think that's such an important, like, driving 596 00:21:09,190 --> 00:21:10,630 question for all of us that you pose 597 00:21:10,630 --> 00:21:12,470 to us. It's like, how are you applying 598 00:21:12,470 --> 00:21:13,990 this? And if you can't apply it, why 599 00:21:13,990 --> 00:21:16,664 are you teaching it? Yeah. You know? That's 600 00:21:16,664 --> 00:21:18,424 definitely what I feel. You know? And I 601 00:21:18,424 --> 00:21:20,025 think what came up in our Denver teacher 602 00:21:20,025 --> 00:21:22,345 strike is, you know, why aren't teachers willing 603 00:21:22,345 --> 00:21:24,345 to walk out for issues like Black Lives 604 00:21:24,345 --> 00:21:26,605 Matter? No. That's right. That's our Yep. Immigrant 605 00:21:26,825 --> 00:21:29,259 children, you know, to make sure. And so 606 00:21:29,259 --> 00:21:31,500 I think this bigger picture of application of 607 00:21:31,500 --> 00:21:32,319 having the kids 608 00:21:32,700 --> 00:21:33,200 learn 609 00:21:33,500 --> 00:21:34,000 by 610 00:21:34,460 --> 00:21:34,960 watching 611 00:21:35,259 --> 00:21:38,140 us engage in activism or them engaging in 612 00:21:38,140 --> 00:21:41,674 activism themselves is really critical. Yeah. And and 613 00:21:41,674 --> 00:21:44,154 maybe teachers are willing. Yep. I don't know 614 00:21:44,154 --> 00:21:46,335 if it's been put up for for, 615 00:21:47,195 --> 00:21:49,055 a a vote. And also also, 616 00:21:50,394 --> 00:21:52,954 there's a idea of what, you know, in 617 00:21:52,954 --> 00:21:54,359 in some of these talks of what the 618 00:21:54,519 --> 00:21:56,519 community will accept. Yep. Yep. Yep. And and 619 00:21:56,519 --> 00:21:58,519 those things. So that comes that's where the 620 00:21:58,519 --> 00:22:00,220 organizers come in. It's showing, 621 00:22:00,839 --> 00:22:02,839 you know, where the world is at in 622 00:22:02,839 --> 00:22:03,339 relationship 623 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:06,519 to where teachers are at or where anyone 624 00:22:06,519 --> 00:22:08,619 is at. And and and how those things 625 00:22:08,679 --> 00:22:10,299 can can come to pass. 626 00:22:11,214 --> 00:22:13,534 And and because it it might not maybe 627 00:22:13,534 --> 00:22:14,595 it's not something, 628 00:22:15,534 --> 00:22:17,774 as much of a national policy. Maybe there's 629 00:22:17,774 --> 00:22:19,794 something like I said, like a a 630 00:22:20,148 --> 00:22:20,648 a 631 00:22:21,001 --> 00:22:21,501 a 632 00:22:21,855 --> 00:22:23,694 a young person of color gets murdered by 633 00:22:23,694 --> 00:22:26,119 the police. Yep. Right. Those teachers showing that 634 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:26,859 they are 635 00:22:27,319 --> 00:22:28,380 that that they 636 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:30,779 are connected with the community, 637 00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:34,039 that does a lot. That changes also their 638 00:22:34,039 --> 00:22:36,704 relationship with the students Absolutely. As well. Yep. 639 00:22:37,184 --> 00:22:38,464 And and and so but 640 00:22:39,265 --> 00:22:41,505 so I think that that that and and 641 00:22:41,505 --> 00:22:42,884 then on the other hand, 642 00:22:43,585 --> 00:22:44,325 those students, 643 00:22:44,625 --> 00:22:46,164 especially if they're in high school, 644 00:22:46,464 --> 00:22:47,524 in a few years, 645 00:22:47,984 --> 00:22:48,484 they're 646 00:22:49,279 --> 00:22:50,579 they're thought of as 647 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:52,880 non students and the community. Yep. That's right. 648 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:54,319 Yep. And that changed That's right. Or their 649 00:22:54,319 --> 00:22:56,339 teachers. Yep. Yep. Yep. Right? Yep. 650 00:22:56,799 --> 00:22:59,679 And and and so what we're doing right 651 00:22:59,679 --> 00:23:00,659 now is shaping 652 00:23:01,195 --> 00:23:01,934 not only 653 00:23:02,474 --> 00:23:05,275 what's happening in the profession of teaching Mhmm. 654 00:23:05,355 --> 00:23:07,595 What you do but but in the the 655 00:23:07,595 --> 00:23:08,575 broader community. 656 00:23:08,955 --> 00:23:11,375 Yeah. Yeah. And and when you talk about 657 00:23:11,755 --> 00:23:12,255 capitalism 658 00:23:12,555 --> 00:23:15,660 and and really trying to, you know, destroy 659 00:23:15,660 --> 00:23:17,279 it or alter it or, 660 00:23:18,140 --> 00:23:18,880 you know, 661 00:23:20,380 --> 00:23:23,019 do something to it. Right? Right? Well, I 662 00:23:23,019 --> 00:23:24,559 believe that we should have a 663 00:23:25,019 --> 00:23:26,619 we should have a world in which the 664 00:23:26,619 --> 00:23:29,340 people democratically control the wealth that we create 665 00:23:29,340 --> 00:23:30,720 with our labor. Absolutely. 666 00:23:31,605 --> 00:23:32,105 So, 667 00:23:32,644 --> 00:23:34,964 you know, and what so so and that's 668 00:23:34,964 --> 00:23:38,404 where actual power is is is where the 669 00:23:38,404 --> 00:23:41,704 wealth is created. Yeah. Yeah. Right? So, 670 00:23:43,204 --> 00:23:44,825 so so I think 671 00:23:45,444 --> 00:23:46,345 showing that 672 00:23:47,170 --> 00:23:47,990 gives people 673 00:23:48,450 --> 00:23:50,369 more of an idea like how you know, 674 00:23:50,369 --> 00:23:52,390 we teach all these tidbits of history. 675 00:23:52,769 --> 00:23:55,109 And so beyond the applying it, 676 00:23:55,410 --> 00:23:57,009 a lot of it is confusing to a 677 00:23:57,009 --> 00:23:58,450 lot of people. I know this happened on 678 00:23:58,450 --> 00:24:00,049 this date. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. On 679 00:24:00,049 --> 00:24:00,869 that date. 680 00:24:01,315 --> 00:24:03,875 And the why is always told in this 681 00:24:03,875 --> 00:24:06,595 little small detail that doesn't have Right. Yeah. 682 00:24:06,595 --> 00:24:08,355 Very quick. You know, it's like so and 683 00:24:08,355 --> 00:24:09,335 so got assassinated, 684 00:24:09,795 --> 00:24:11,654 so this happened. But no 685 00:24:12,275 --> 00:24:14,430 often it's not, there's not a general 686 00:24:14,970 --> 00:24:18,009 idea of how society is working Yep. To 687 00:24:18,009 --> 00:24:20,250 do this. And and and often also what 688 00:24:20,250 --> 00:24:22,730 comes up in school is an idea of 689 00:24:22,730 --> 00:24:25,609 what's going on around us that's confusing. Right. 690 00:24:25,609 --> 00:24:26,109 So, 691 00:24:26,730 --> 00:24:27,549 for example, 692 00:24:28,865 --> 00:24:31,684 if you're teaching in communities of color, often, 693 00:24:32,465 --> 00:24:34,965 you know, often one of the subjects is, 694 00:24:35,505 --> 00:24:38,384 violence and and and gun violence. People killing 695 00:24:38,384 --> 00:24:40,319 each other. And a lot of times, we'll 696 00:24:40,559 --> 00:24:43,539 because we don't have an analysis of class 697 00:24:43,679 --> 00:24:46,079 that teaches us how capitalism works Yep. We 698 00:24:46,079 --> 00:24:48,099 look for answers. And so we're like, oh, 699 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:48,740 people 700 00:24:49,679 --> 00:24:50,819 are violent because 701 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,839 of, you know, their family. Yep. Yep. Or 702 00:24:53,839 --> 00:24:56,654 they're violent because they're not they don't they're 703 00:24:56,654 --> 00:24:58,335 not being taught the right things. They don't 704 00:24:58,414 --> 00:25:00,015 they haven't been taught how to get a 705 00:25:00,015 --> 00:25:02,414 job. And all of these things community. Make 706 00:25:02,414 --> 00:25:04,975 sense if you don't look. And and and 707 00:25:04,975 --> 00:25:06,575 they don't make sense because we try to 708 00:25:06,575 --> 00:25:08,335 fit some in that way. Yep. But the 709 00:25:08,335 --> 00:25:10,840 truth is is this, and this is what 710 00:25:10,860 --> 00:25:13,720 we need to be teaching is that capitalism 711 00:25:13,940 --> 00:25:16,019 must have a certain amount of unemployed people 712 00:25:16,019 --> 00:25:18,039 in order to exist. Yep. Yep. Yep. Right? 713 00:25:18,100 --> 00:25:19,380 And a certain amount of people who are 714 00:25:19,380 --> 00:25:21,539 just ridiculously rich. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. But 715 00:25:21,539 --> 00:25:22,039 but 716 00:25:22,340 --> 00:25:24,340 if you have no if you have zero 717 00:25:24,340 --> 00:25:24,840 unemployment, 718 00:25:25,424 --> 00:25:25,924 then 719 00:25:26,225 --> 00:25:28,144 you have then then people that have a 720 00:25:28,144 --> 00:25:29,525 job can demand whatever 721 00:25:29,904 --> 00:25:31,505 wage they want. And they don't even need 722 00:25:31,505 --> 00:25:33,265 a union. They can be like, you can't 723 00:25:33,265 --> 00:25:35,745 fire me. Give me 30 an hour. Give 724 00:25:35,745 --> 00:25:37,710 me 50 an hour. Yep. Yep. Right? 725 00:25:38,589 --> 00:25:39,470 So you see, 726 00:25:39,869 --> 00:25:42,529 publications like Wall Street Journal and Financial Times 727 00:25:42,589 --> 00:25:45,470 publicly worrying when the unemployment rate goes low. 728 00:25:45,470 --> 00:25:47,230 Not It's too low. Not not that they 729 00:25:47,230 --> 00:25:49,149 think it'll ever be at zero, but as 730 00:25:49,149 --> 00:25:50,130 it goes low, 731 00:25:51,345 --> 00:25:54,085 in real time, wages come up. Yep. Yep. 732 00:25:54,224 --> 00:25:57,105 And in real time, stocks go down and 733 00:25:57,105 --> 00:25:59,825 and and because profits are going down. And 734 00:25:59,825 --> 00:26:02,565 so they worry that when as the unemployment 735 00:26:02,704 --> 00:26:04,704 rate goes low. So what this means is 736 00:26:04,704 --> 00:26:06,839 if you have a system in which there 737 00:26:06,839 --> 00:26:08,919 must be a certain amount of unemployed people, 738 00:26:08,919 --> 00:26:10,440 that means you have a system in which 739 00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:12,839 there must be a certain amount of unemployed 740 00:26:12,839 --> 00:26:15,099 people that need to eat. Yep. Yep. Right? 741 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:16,380 And and then 742 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:19,240 they that means they have to get involved 743 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:21,424 in illegal business. Yep. Because they're not gonna 744 00:26:21,424 --> 00:26:24,484 let themselves starve. And if you have illegal 745 00:26:24,545 --> 00:26:27,105 business, you have the same violence that legal 746 00:26:27,105 --> 00:26:29,585 business has. That's right. All legal all business, 747 00:26:29,585 --> 00:26:32,065 legal and illegal uses violence. Yep. You we're 748 00:26:32,065 --> 00:26:34,580 in this convention center. The hotel next door 749 00:26:34,580 --> 00:26:36,180 can't decide to build a golf course through 750 00:26:36,180 --> 00:26:38,019 because whoever owns the convention center is gonna 751 00:26:38,019 --> 00:26:40,420 be like, no. We have the deed. That 752 00:26:40,420 --> 00:26:43,140 deed doesn't mean shit unless there's people with 753 00:26:43,140 --> 00:26:45,460 guns call police Right. That are gonna enforce 754 00:26:45,460 --> 00:26:45,884 it. 755 00:26:47,484 --> 00:26:48,102 There you go. Always. And those and and 756 00:26:48,102 --> 00:26:49,325 and and and and it's always that. It's 757 00:26:49,325 --> 00:26:50,224 all you know, 758 00:26:52,045 --> 00:26:54,125 back in the twenties when liquor was illegal, 759 00:26:54,125 --> 00:26:56,445 if you rob the liquor dude, the police 760 00:26:56,445 --> 00:26:58,365 come the the the gangsters come after you. 761 00:26:58,365 --> 00:27:00,339 Yep. Yep. Yep. Right. Now it's legal. You 762 00:27:00,339 --> 00:27:02,059 rob the liquor dude, the police come after 763 00:27:02,059 --> 00:27:04,179 you. Yeah. Twenty years ago in Oakland, you 764 00:27:04,179 --> 00:27:05,779 rob the we do, you probably get away 765 00:27:05,779 --> 00:27:08,259 with it. But maybe a few gangsters might 766 00:27:08,259 --> 00:27:09,319 come after you. Yeah. 767 00:27:10,259 --> 00:27:12,099 Right now, it's legal. You rob the we 768 00:27:12,099 --> 00:27:14,444 do, the police come after you. Here's the 769 00:27:14,444 --> 00:27:16,684 thing, we're teaching and and and so here 770 00:27:16,845 --> 00:27:18,384 here here's the thing. So 771 00:27:18,765 --> 00:27:21,644 all these folks are all they're doing is 772 00:27:21,644 --> 00:27:22,144 regulating 773 00:27:22,765 --> 00:27:25,565 they're regulating their business. You can't if you're 774 00:27:25,565 --> 00:27:27,484 a dope dealer, you can't go to court 775 00:27:27,484 --> 00:27:29,130 and say, your honor, we're supposed to get 776 00:27:29,130 --> 00:27:30,890 a whole key of cocaine. Clearly, this is 777 00:27:30,890 --> 00:27:33,450 half baker's soda. I demand roasted two strikes. 778 00:27:33,450 --> 00:27:35,930 That's right. That's right. There's there's no zoning 779 00:27:35,930 --> 00:27:37,609 commission and say Yep. Where you say this 780 00:27:37,609 --> 00:27:39,650 block was only zone for two sponsored violence. 781 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:40,509 Two, 782 00:27:40,940 --> 00:27:43,369 cocaine vendors. Yeah. We need a permit for 783 00:27:43,369 --> 00:27:45,664 this third one. Right? You can't do that. 784 00:27:45,664 --> 00:27:46,325 No. So 785 00:27:46,704 --> 00:27:47,204 so, 786 00:27:47,585 --> 00:27:49,525 so illegal business practitioners 787 00:27:50,065 --> 00:27:53,525 regulate themselves and so therefore, that's where violence 788 00:27:53,585 --> 00:27:55,664 comes from. And out of that, yes, a 789 00:27:55,664 --> 00:27:58,509 culture comes because out of whatever business is 790 00:27:58,509 --> 00:28:00,590 going on, a culture comes. Out of teaching, 791 00:28:00,590 --> 00:28:02,430 there's a culture that comes. Yeah. If you 792 00:28:02,430 --> 00:28:03,570 have a fishing village, 793 00:28:03,950 --> 00:28:06,349 you know, there there's a culture that comes. 794 00:28:06,349 --> 00:28:08,590 If you want that fishing village to sing 795 00:28:08,590 --> 00:28:10,830 agricultural songs, you're gonna have to move them 796 00:28:10,830 --> 00:28:13,765 to where there is dirt to play. Right. 797 00:28:13,765 --> 00:28:15,325 Right. Right. Right. You start singing away from 798 00:28:15,325 --> 00:28:18,085 the fish. Cultural songs, they might like it. 799 00:28:18,085 --> 00:28:19,845 They might like the tune, but they're not 800 00:28:19,845 --> 00:28:21,605 gonna start the if they start singing, they're 801 00:28:21,605 --> 00:28:23,525 gonna change it to being about fishing. So 802 00:28:23,525 --> 00:28:24,984 if we wanna change 803 00:28:25,445 --> 00:28:25,945 that, 804 00:28:26,329 --> 00:28:28,890 we gotta teach not only that that that 805 00:28:28,970 --> 00:28:30,970 what this means is that if you wanna 806 00:28:30,970 --> 00:28:33,529 get rid of that violence Yep. You gotta 807 00:28:33,529 --> 00:28:36,089 have a whole different economic system. That's right. 808 00:28:36,089 --> 00:28:38,410 And now and and so that also has 809 00:28:38,410 --> 00:28:40,804 to do with how we teach our students 810 00:28:41,024 --> 00:28:42,804 about what's happening with violence. 811 00:28:43,264 --> 00:28:45,284 And and that it's not just a mindset. 812 00:28:45,825 --> 00:28:47,505 Yeah. Yeah. There's some of that that has 813 00:28:47,505 --> 00:28:49,264 to do with culture and stuff like that. 814 00:28:49,264 --> 00:28:52,144 But at the at the basis of it 815 00:28:52,144 --> 00:28:54,224 is if you wanna stop violence, we gotta 816 00:28:54,224 --> 00:28:55,444 change the whole system. 817 00:28:55,819 --> 00:28:58,059 And showing them that, hey. This struggle, we're 818 00:28:58,059 --> 00:28:59,500 about to go on strike, and it's about 819 00:28:59,500 --> 00:29:01,740 that. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Having that big deal. 820 00:29:01,740 --> 00:29:03,839 I think I think that's, really important. 821 00:29:04,859 --> 00:29:07,019 This bigger idea of understanding the culture that 822 00:29:07,019 --> 00:29:08,779 we're trying to create. And I feel like 823 00:29:08,779 --> 00:29:09,440 at times, 824 00:29:10,404 --> 00:29:12,664 in Denver public schools, we're asked to create, 825 00:29:12,724 --> 00:29:15,045 you know, to just replicate the culture of 826 00:29:15,045 --> 00:29:17,705 oppression that exists. Right. And and we are, 827 00:29:18,085 --> 00:29:18,744 you know, 828 00:29:19,365 --> 00:29:21,765 try to, people try to convince us that 829 00:29:21,765 --> 00:29:23,224 somehow these reforms 830 00:29:24,140 --> 00:29:25,900 are going to lead to the liberation. It 831 00:29:25,900 --> 00:29:28,460 will they're just really replicating. It's empowerment. Right? 832 00:29:28,460 --> 00:29:30,539 Like, that's what we call empowerment in our 833 00:29:30,539 --> 00:29:32,539 district is that we want the kids to 834 00:29:32,539 --> 00:29:35,100 be to grow up and fully participate in 835 00:29:35,100 --> 00:29:37,795 this system and reap all of its all 836 00:29:37,795 --> 00:29:40,434 of its, like, material benefits without actually looking 837 00:29:40,434 --> 00:29:42,355 what the system is actually serving and what 838 00:29:42,355 --> 00:29:44,914 and what the overall purpose of the system 839 00:29:44,914 --> 00:29:46,835 is. And and be let me be clear. 840 00:29:46,835 --> 00:29:48,775 We need some we need reforms, 841 00:29:49,315 --> 00:29:51,380 but but we need to to 842 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:54,960 that we gain through movements. Yes. Right? And 843 00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:55,460 teaching 844 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,580 and using those to teach that 845 00:29:59,119 --> 00:30:01,440 struggle is what gets these things changed, but 846 00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:04,480 also with the with the a radical vision 847 00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:06,994 of where we wanna go Right. Yep. Yep. 848 00:30:07,075 --> 00:30:08,914 After that. And and that these are That 849 00:30:08,914 --> 00:30:10,674 clear view. Forms on the way to this 850 00:30:10,674 --> 00:30:14,035 larger movement, this larger societal change. Yeah. Yeah. 851 00:30:14,035 --> 00:30:15,414 And when you were talking, 852 00:30:16,035 --> 00:30:17,634 in your keynote, you mentioned 853 00:30:18,049 --> 00:30:19,890 and it it changed my perspective because you 854 00:30:19,890 --> 00:30:21,089 mentioned 51% 855 00:30:21,089 --> 00:30:21,669 of millennials 856 00:30:22,049 --> 00:30:22,950 supporting socialism, 857 00:30:23,329 --> 00:30:24,390 43% 858 00:30:24,529 --> 00:30:27,490 of all people supporting socialism. Right. And the 859 00:30:27,490 --> 00:30:29,169 way I think it's presented in the media 860 00:30:29,169 --> 00:30:30,869 is, like, this is so unrealistic. 861 00:30:31,494 --> 00:30:32,855 Look. Only 43% 862 00:30:32,855 --> 00:30:34,934 of the people are there, or only 51% 863 00:30:34,934 --> 00:30:36,534 of the people are there. But I think 864 00:30:36,534 --> 00:30:38,214 what what you help me see is this 865 00:30:38,214 --> 00:30:40,454 bigger picture is it's a a long term 866 00:30:40,454 --> 00:30:43,654 movement. Yeah. And that if we're at 4351% 867 00:30:43,654 --> 00:30:46,119 right now, where are we gonna be? And 868 00:30:46,119 --> 00:30:48,200 think about the percentage on the other side 869 00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:51,000 of that that wouldn't say that Yep. Out 870 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,759 right. Yep. Wouldn't it would say that to 871 00:30:52,759 --> 00:30:54,519 a poster? Right? Agree with a lot of 872 00:30:54,519 --> 00:30:56,839 the the the the things that are being 873 00:30:56,839 --> 00:30:58,919 said. So a lot of that is is, 874 00:30:58,919 --> 00:30:59,579 you know, 875 00:31:00,605 --> 00:31:01,184 you know, 876 00:31:01,724 --> 00:31:03,404 of of course, there are people that that 877 00:31:03,565 --> 00:31:05,085 and they would go along with a lot 878 00:31:05,085 --> 00:31:07,644 of those people taking that poll didn't understand 879 00:31:07,644 --> 00:31:09,244 there was another 51%. 880 00:31:09,244 --> 00:31:10,845 Yep. Yep. Yep. You know? So there are 881 00:31:10,845 --> 00:31:13,164 people that are influenced by where they think 882 00:31:13,164 --> 00:31:14,845 the rest of the world is. Yep. Yep. 883 00:31:14,845 --> 00:31:16,659 Yep. Yep. Yeah. That's right. 884 00:31:17,279 --> 00:31:18,900 That's right. Yeah. No. It's incredible, 885 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:21,359 to just, like I don't know. You you 886 00:31:21,359 --> 00:31:23,359 have this, like, moment where you actually start 887 00:31:23,359 --> 00:31:25,759 thinking about what's possible and and what kind 888 00:31:25,759 --> 00:31:28,400 of society we wanna build. And, and just 889 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,305 so those words are so important. Like, what 890 00:31:30,305 --> 00:31:31,744 is the big picture of what we want 891 00:31:31,744 --> 00:31:32,244 to, 892 00:31:32,785 --> 00:31:35,184 accomplish with with young people in our in 893 00:31:35,184 --> 00:31:35,924 our schools? 894 00:31:36,705 --> 00:31:38,785 So I think I think we have a 895 00:31:38,785 --> 00:31:41,105 little just a couple minute more or so 896 00:31:41,105 --> 00:31:42,965 with you. We thank you so much. 897 00:31:43,345 --> 00:31:45,609 But I I I think we would both 898 00:31:45,609 --> 00:31:47,289 be disappointed. What's your thoughts about the state 899 00:31:47,289 --> 00:31:48,349 of hip hop today? 900 00:31:49,369 --> 00:31:51,210 Had to get into that question. What what 901 00:31:51,210 --> 00:31:53,769 are your thoughts? Well, here's the thing is 902 00:31:53,769 --> 00:31:54,829 that, you know, 903 00:31:56,410 --> 00:31:58,845 when we were when when when when we 904 00:31:58,845 --> 00:32:00,845 were first coming out, there was a lot 905 00:32:00,845 --> 00:32:02,845 of people that liked hip hop from ten 906 00:32:02,845 --> 00:32:04,285 years ago that was like, oh, look at 907 00:32:04,285 --> 00:32:05,884 the state of hip hop today. Yeah. Yeah. 908 00:32:05,884 --> 00:32:07,884 You know? Right. It's always gonna be 909 00:32:08,765 --> 00:32:11,585 there there's gonna be, you know, different movements 910 00:32:11,644 --> 00:32:13,250 that that that we 911 00:32:14,430 --> 00:32:16,670 artistically that we don't understand, that we don't, 912 00:32:16,670 --> 00:32:18,509 you know and while at the I can 913 00:32:18,509 --> 00:32:20,430 say that I'm not into some of the 914 00:32:20,430 --> 00:32:21,950 new styles that are coming out. And I 915 00:32:21,950 --> 00:32:23,630 can say, like, oh, we would have thought 916 00:32:23,630 --> 00:32:25,390 that was weak. Like, it's not that it's 917 00:32:25,390 --> 00:32:27,309 new. It's like that was around, and we 918 00:32:27,309 --> 00:32:28,450 just thought it was weak. 919 00:32:29,494 --> 00:32:32,294 However, I understand that it's really there's no 920 00:32:32,294 --> 00:32:35,174 objective truth in that. Right? Yeah. There's it's 921 00:32:35,174 --> 00:32:36,315 just Yep. About 922 00:32:36,694 --> 00:32:37,194 people 923 00:32:37,734 --> 00:32:40,394 are making art on the wavelength that connects 924 00:32:40,454 --> 00:32:43,115 to people where where they're at right now. 925 00:32:43,174 --> 00:32:45,029 And and, you know, I'm 926 00:32:46,130 --> 00:32:47,349 who am I to say 927 00:32:47,809 --> 00:32:50,609 about whether it's objectively good or not. I 928 00:32:50,609 --> 00:32:52,130 mean, I think some of the thing, you 929 00:32:52,130 --> 00:32:52,950 know, like 930 00:32:53,329 --> 00:32:55,809 the the I I've definitely been known as 931 00:32:55,809 --> 00:32:58,134 a lyricist, but I think that so there's 932 00:32:58,134 --> 00:33:00,454 something to be said about stuff that's called 933 00:33:00,454 --> 00:33:00,954 lyricism 934 00:33:01,734 --> 00:33:02,234 that 935 00:33:02,694 --> 00:33:05,255 is really not try not about connecting to 936 00:33:05,255 --> 00:33:07,835 people. That's more like Mhmm. You know, mentally 937 00:33:07,894 --> 00:33:10,734 masturbating and and really and and you can't 938 00:33:10,934 --> 00:33:12,214 masturbating. You can't really, 939 00:33:13,159 --> 00:33:14,839 you know, you can't really judge it because 940 00:33:14,839 --> 00:33:16,440 they're just using a whole bunch of words. 941 00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:18,440 Yep. Yep. You know, look at these words 942 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,359 I looked up in the dictionary and, you 943 00:33:20,359 --> 00:33:23,079 know, and and, you know, oh, I'm I 944 00:33:23,079 --> 00:33:25,259 did this many similes, that many metaphors, 945 00:33:25,605 --> 00:33:27,605 So therefore, it's good. And you can't really 946 00:33:27,605 --> 00:33:29,204 judge it by that. The way you judge 947 00:33:29,204 --> 00:33:31,044 artists Right. How does it connect to people? 948 00:33:31,044 --> 00:33:32,724 Yep. What does it make people feel? Yeah. 949 00:33:32,724 --> 00:33:34,325 What does it make people think? And because 950 00:33:34,325 --> 00:33:36,585 I didn't kinda grow up with that stuff, 951 00:33:36,964 --> 00:33:38,700 I can't say you know, I'll say this. 952 00:33:39,179 --> 00:33:40,319 One time I was, 953 00:33:40,940 --> 00:33:43,419 when when jungle was was Oh, yeah. Yeah. 954 00:33:43,419 --> 00:33:45,339 Yeah. Yeah. Was was just coming. I was 955 00:33:45,339 --> 00:33:47,019 like, I know I I thought about, like, 956 00:33:47,019 --> 00:33:48,940 what is this? This is like some, you 957 00:33:48,940 --> 00:33:52,539 know, white people dancing type shit. And and 958 00:33:52,539 --> 00:33:53,039 then 959 00:33:53,484 --> 00:33:55,404 then I then I went to London and 960 00:33:55,404 --> 00:33:57,085 to this club called The Fridge and went 961 00:33:57,085 --> 00:33:57,904 in the basement. 962 00:33:58,284 --> 00:34:01,085 And everybody was, like, just grinding on each 963 00:34:01,085 --> 00:34:01,585 other. 964 00:34:02,204 --> 00:34:03,964 And the mute and then and the music 965 00:34:03,964 --> 00:34:05,644 was playing loud. I looked around. I was 966 00:34:05,644 --> 00:34:07,789 like, oh. This is it. I get it. 967 00:34:07,789 --> 00:34:09,969 I get it. I get it. Right? Because 968 00:34:10,110 --> 00:34:12,110 you you can't listen to it out of 969 00:34:12,110 --> 00:34:14,750 context. You have to be part of that 970 00:34:14,750 --> 00:34:17,150 world that needs it. Yeah. Right? Yeah. No 971 00:34:17,150 --> 00:34:19,255 doubt. And so, you know, I'll say I'll 972 00:34:19,255 --> 00:34:20,775 say that. And I'll say as far as 973 00:34:20,775 --> 00:34:22,394 the content of where hip hop 974 00:34:22,695 --> 00:34:25,434 is, that's just us. That's our fault. Like, 975 00:34:25,815 --> 00:34:28,135 if there is no movement Yeah. Like, I 976 00:34:28,135 --> 00:34:30,394 came out of a movement that created me 977 00:34:30,534 --> 00:34:33,480 wanting to put my ideas into this art. 978 00:34:33,559 --> 00:34:35,659 If we don't have a movement that's moving 979 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:37,960 people back in their houses while they're being 980 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:40,519 evicted and those, you know, then then we 981 00:34:40,519 --> 00:34:42,359 don't have the 12 year old kids seeing 982 00:34:42,359 --> 00:34:45,000 that movement and then rapping about it. Yep. 983 00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:45,820 Yeah. Right? 984 00:34:46,184 --> 00:34:48,824 So people aren't gonna rap about these ideas 985 00:34:48,824 --> 00:34:49,724 that they don't 986 00:34:50,265 --> 00:34:52,105 that they don't see around them. So we 987 00:34:52,105 --> 00:34:54,425 have to make these movements more radical and 988 00:34:54,425 --> 00:34:55,164 more visible 989 00:34:55,545 --> 00:34:57,485 and and and and actually 990 00:34:57,864 --> 00:35:00,744 involved in campaigns that affect people's lives, and 991 00:35:00,744 --> 00:35:02,750 that will change the music. 992 00:35:04,730 --> 00:35:06,730 And folks, that was our interview with the 993 00:35:06,730 --> 00:35:10,269 imminent Boots Riley, creative artist and revolutionary. 994 00:35:11,289 --> 00:35:14,085 You may know him as the creator of 995 00:35:14,085 --> 00:35:15,284 Sorry to Bother You, 996 00:35:15,684 --> 00:35:18,724 or of the eminent incredible revolutionary hip hop 997 00:35:18,724 --> 00:35:19,224 group, 998 00:35:19,684 --> 00:35:20,344 The Coup. 999 00:35:21,284 --> 00:35:23,925 For Boots Riley, for Kevin Adams, I am 1000 00:35:23,925 --> 00:35:26,644 Hernardo Munoz wishing you today and always in 1001 00:35:26,644 --> 00:35:28,744 this hot summer to stay dope.