1 00:00:01,919 --> 00:00:05,379 I feel like going through my life story, 2 00:00:05,679 --> 00:00:07,759 it actually it just makes it makes me 3 00:00:07,759 --> 00:00:09,699 smile, and it makes me 4 00:00:11,279 --> 00:00:13,460 this is where the emotion comes in. 5 00:00:14,925 --> 00:00:16,704 It makes me really proud 6 00:00:17,725 --> 00:00:20,464 of staying with my own process inside. 7 00:00:22,204 --> 00:00:25,085 Welcome, everybody. My name is Drew Horning, and 8 00:00:25,085 --> 00:00:28,064 this podcast is called Love's Everyday Radius. 9 00:00:28,879 --> 00:00:30,739 It's brought to you by the Hoffman Institute 10 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,780 and its stories and anecdotes 11 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:35,939 and people we interview 12 00:00:36,399 --> 00:00:38,020 about their life post process 13 00:00:38,399 --> 00:00:40,899 and how it lives in the world radiating 14 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:41,700 love. 15 00:00:42,575 --> 00:00:44,034 This episode contains 16 00:00:44,414 --> 00:00:47,075 descriptions of child sexual abuse. 17 00:00:47,454 --> 00:00:48,755 Please use your discretion. 18 00:00:57,490 --> 00:01:00,690 Cindy, welcome to the Hoffman podcast. Hi Drew, 19 00:01:00,690 --> 00:01:01,730 thank you. It's 20 00:01:02,609 --> 00:01:04,689 I was really excited and looking forward to 21 00:01:04,689 --> 00:01:06,770 being here and having a conversation with you 22 00:01:06,770 --> 00:01:09,189 today. Oh I mean we are excited to 23 00:01:09,344 --> 00:01:11,984 get you on record and interview you. This 24 00:01:11,984 --> 00:01:14,224 is a thing we do where we interview 25 00:01:14,224 --> 00:01:14,724 teachers 26 00:01:15,105 --> 00:01:16,484 about who they are, 27 00:01:17,025 --> 00:01:18,645 about how they came to Hoffman. 28 00:01:19,025 --> 00:01:21,284 Mhmm. So as you think about you, 29 00:01:22,145 --> 00:01:24,385 where do we begin this story? Where should 30 00:01:24,385 --> 00:01:25,230 we start it? 31 00:01:26,430 --> 00:01:30,030 Well, I was lucky enough, I feel lucky, 32 00:01:30,030 --> 00:01:31,569 to have done the Hoffman process 33 00:01:32,750 --> 00:01:35,090 back in 2017, 34 00:01:35,790 --> 00:01:38,590 and it had been recommended by somebody who 35 00:01:38,590 --> 00:01:39,570 had done the process. 36 00:01:40,215 --> 00:01:41,895 And for me, I was at that place 37 00:01:41,895 --> 00:01:43,814 in my life where I had had a 38 00:01:43,814 --> 00:01:45,834 few traumatic things. One in particular, 39 00:01:46,614 --> 00:01:48,075 I had had a really 40 00:01:48,454 --> 00:01:50,534 bad car accident in which I suffered a 41 00:01:50,534 --> 00:01:53,594 brain injury, a traumatic brain injury. Wow. 42 00:01:53,895 --> 00:01:54,395 And 43 00:01:56,100 --> 00:01:58,359 when I look back on 44 00:01:59,380 --> 00:02:00,200 my years, 45 00:02:02,180 --> 00:02:02,680 I 46 00:02:03,060 --> 00:02:05,620 had gained what we at the process call 47 00:02:05,620 --> 00:02:06,120 patterns. 48 00:02:06,915 --> 00:02:08,615 And so my success 49 00:02:09,314 --> 00:02:10,135 was based 50 00:02:10,675 --> 00:02:11,335 on my 51 00:02:12,194 --> 00:02:14,775 brain working really, really well. 52 00:02:15,155 --> 00:02:15,655 And 53 00:02:16,115 --> 00:02:18,675 I had accomplished many things in my professional 54 00:02:18,675 --> 00:02:19,175 life. 55 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:21,960 And then in a split second, it felt 56 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:23,719 like that was taken away where all of 57 00:02:23,719 --> 00:02:26,219 a sudden a brain injury, I couldn't think 58 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:29,980 the way that I was used to. So 59 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:32,460 when when you say brain injury 60 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:33,260 Yeah. 61 00:02:33,825 --> 00:02:35,504 What, like, what is that? What does that 62 00:02:35,504 --> 00:02:36,325 even mean? 63 00:02:36,784 --> 00:02:37,605 What happened? 64 00:02:38,224 --> 00:02:38,965 Great question. 65 00:02:39,425 --> 00:02:41,985 So I, unfortunately, was in an auto accident 66 00:02:41,985 --> 00:02:44,325 where someone had fallen asleep and 67 00:02:44,784 --> 00:02:47,264 hit my car, and myself and my son 68 00:02:47,264 --> 00:02:49,939 was in the car. And I woke up 69 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:54,180 about twenty four hours later in trauma ICU, 70 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:55,860 and I had a skull fracture 71 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:59,060 and lots of broken ribs. And 72 00:03:00,319 --> 00:03:01,139 I couldn't 73 00:03:03,064 --> 00:03:04,444 think and process 74 00:03:04,905 --> 00:03:06,284 the way I used to. 75 00:03:06,745 --> 00:03:07,245 So 76 00:03:07,544 --> 00:03:09,384 when I look at the definition of a 77 00:03:09,384 --> 00:03:11,084 brain injury for me, 78 00:03:12,025 --> 00:03:12,844 the leftovers 79 00:03:13,305 --> 00:03:14,364 for that were, 80 00:03:14,824 --> 00:03:16,620 I swapped words a lot. 81 00:03:17,180 --> 00:03:17,919 I couldn't 82 00:03:18,860 --> 00:03:19,360 process 83 00:03:20,219 --> 00:03:22,159 the way that I used to. 84 00:03:23,259 --> 00:03:24,860 Kind of a quick phrase might be I 85 00:03:24,860 --> 00:03:27,019 couldn't think straight Mhmm. The way I used 86 00:03:27,019 --> 00:03:28,239 to. And because 87 00:03:30,745 --> 00:03:33,724 my definition of success and how I navigated 88 00:03:33,865 --> 00:03:34,685 in the world 89 00:03:35,944 --> 00:03:38,344 depended on my brain functioning, all of a 90 00:03:38,344 --> 00:03:39,485 sudden it felt like 91 00:03:41,224 --> 00:03:42,985 I had to learn a different way of 92 00:03:42,985 --> 00:03:43,485 being. 93 00:03:43,870 --> 00:03:46,349 And so following my brain injury, I would 94 00:03:46,349 --> 00:03:48,370 say the first couple years, I was just 95 00:03:49,870 --> 00:03:52,349 pissed off, if that's a okay word to 96 00:03:52,349 --> 00:03:54,129 say. Right? I was just really angry 97 00:03:54,510 --> 00:03:56,450 because I'd worked really hard, 98 00:03:57,084 --> 00:03:58,844 in my life to get to a certain 99 00:03:58,844 --> 00:04:00,625 place that I deemed as, 100 00:04:02,044 --> 00:04:02,544 successful. 101 00:04:03,245 --> 00:04:05,425 And when I look back, they were also 102 00:04:06,685 --> 00:04:08,224 I grew up Midwestern 103 00:04:09,469 --> 00:04:09,969 America, 104 00:04:10,510 --> 00:04:12,270 blue collar family, and I was the first 105 00:04:12,270 --> 00:04:13,569 one to go to college. 106 00:04:14,270 --> 00:04:16,589 And so I really prided myself on my 107 00:04:16,589 --> 00:04:17,810 success with education 108 00:04:20,269 --> 00:04:21,889 and being in a profession 109 00:04:22,589 --> 00:04:23,089 that, 110 00:04:24,345 --> 00:04:25,564 academic profession 111 00:04:26,345 --> 00:04:27,324 in which 112 00:04:28,345 --> 00:04:28,845 I 113 00:04:30,985 --> 00:04:32,204 was stoic 114 00:04:32,985 --> 00:04:33,485 and 115 00:04:34,985 --> 00:04:36,604 really relied on 116 00:04:37,750 --> 00:04:38,250 thinking 117 00:04:39,110 --> 00:04:40,009 and doing. 118 00:04:41,270 --> 00:04:43,270 But what I also learned and what my 119 00:04:43,270 --> 00:04:45,850 brain injury helped me to learn was that 120 00:04:46,310 --> 00:04:48,949 I also was really walled off from my 121 00:04:48,949 --> 00:04:49,449 emotions, 122 00:04:50,014 --> 00:04:50,834 from my body. 123 00:04:51,134 --> 00:04:53,294 There's a piece about not being connected to 124 00:04:53,294 --> 00:04:54,115 your feelings 125 00:04:54,814 --> 00:04:56,894 in part because of that's how you were 126 00:04:56,894 --> 00:04:59,774 raised, a more stoic kind of a family 127 00:05:00,014 --> 00:05:02,194 Be happy. Atmosphere. Be happy. 128 00:05:02,975 --> 00:05:03,855 There's also the, 129 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:07,860 impact of the brain injury. Yeah. 130 00:05:08,800 --> 00:05:10,959 But tell us a little bit about your 131 00:05:10,959 --> 00:05:13,620 childhood. Like, we all get patterns from childhood. 132 00:05:14,319 --> 00:05:16,659 What happened what happened in yours? 133 00:05:16,959 --> 00:05:17,459 Yeah. 134 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:18,339 So, 135 00:05:19,944 --> 00:05:21,384 as I said right it was a it 136 00:05:21,384 --> 00:05:22,125 was a 137 00:05:22,665 --> 00:05:24,045 really loving atmosphere 138 00:05:24,585 --> 00:05:25,404 growing up, 139 00:05:25,785 --> 00:05:27,884 and my parents were very positive. 140 00:05:29,064 --> 00:05:31,485 Everything we needed, they provided for. 141 00:05:33,470 --> 00:05:36,350 And at the same time, feelings weren't talked 142 00:05:36,350 --> 00:05:36,850 about. 143 00:05:37,949 --> 00:05:38,689 We didn't 144 00:05:39,470 --> 00:05:39,970 discuss 145 00:05:40,750 --> 00:05:42,050 how to move through 146 00:05:42,509 --> 00:05:43,490 deeper emotions 147 00:05:43,870 --> 00:05:44,370 and 148 00:05:44,910 --> 00:05:45,810 hard things. 149 00:05:46,454 --> 00:05:46,954 And 150 00:05:47,415 --> 00:05:49,435 so when I was younger, unfortunately, 151 00:05:49,894 --> 00:05:50,875 I had experienced, 152 00:05:52,134 --> 00:05:53,915 sexual abuse as a child. 153 00:05:54,535 --> 00:05:56,854 And at one point, my parents had found 154 00:05:56,854 --> 00:05:59,035 out about it and called a family meeting. 155 00:05:59,470 --> 00:05:59,970 And 156 00:06:00,910 --> 00:06:03,089 I remember in that moment that 157 00:06:04,990 --> 00:06:05,889 the languaging 158 00:06:06,430 --> 00:06:06,930 was, 159 00:06:08,910 --> 00:06:11,089 don't do that. It's not right. 160 00:06:12,884 --> 00:06:15,044 And then they moved on from it. They 161 00:06:15,044 --> 00:06:17,384 just buried it. Don't do what? 162 00:06:18,324 --> 00:06:21,144 You shouldn't have ex you shouldn't be 163 00:06:21,845 --> 00:06:22,345 having 164 00:06:24,004 --> 00:06:25,944 you shouldn't be sexual 165 00:06:26,245 --> 00:06:27,625 in this way. 166 00:06:28,060 --> 00:06:29,740 And I was a kid and didn't know 167 00:06:29,740 --> 00:06:31,660 what was happening to me. So in a 168 00:06:31,660 --> 00:06:32,160 way, 169 00:06:32,699 --> 00:06:34,620 it wasn't their intention, but there was a 170 00:06:34,620 --> 00:06:36,860 shaming with that. That's not a proper thing 171 00:06:36,860 --> 00:06:38,860 to do. We don't do that. We don't 172 00:06:38,860 --> 00:06:40,319 do that. And then 173 00:06:40,634 --> 00:06:43,834 we just buried it in the sand. And 174 00:06:43,834 --> 00:06:44,974 so as a 175 00:06:45,354 --> 00:06:45,854 kid, 176 00:06:46,314 --> 00:06:48,634 we learned to just bury all emotions. It 177 00:06:48,634 --> 00:06:51,454 wasn't okay to talk about hard things. And 178 00:06:52,314 --> 00:06:52,814 so 179 00:06:53,189 --> 00:06:55,590 here you fast forward to now I'm an 180 00:06:55,590 --> 00:06:56,810 adult. Yes. 181 00:06:57,110 --> 00:07:00,310 I had a very strong coping strategy. Don't 182 00:07:00,310 --> 00:07:02,470 talk about feelings. Don't talk about hard things 183 00:07:02,470 --> 00:07:03,210 that happen. 184 00:07:04,550 --> 00:07:07,770 So be very stoic in intellect, and then 185 00:07:08,645 --> 00:07:09,145 intellect, 186 00:07:09,764 --> 00:07:11,845 you know, gets Offline because of the brain 187 00:07:11,845 --> 00:07:14,025 injury. Because of the brain injury. 188 00:07:14,485 --> 00:07:14,985 And 189 00:07:16,165 --> 00:07:18,504 so moving through my life, and 190 00:07:19,125 --> 00:07:21,365 this was I would have been in my 191 00:07:21,525 --> 00:07:23,225 moving towards my late forties 192 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:25,100 and 193 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:27,259 was in a place where 194 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:30,379 I had done a lot of work. 195 00:07:31,240 --> 00:07:31,979 I had 196 00:07:32,759 --> 00:07:34,860 done therapy with licensed, 197 00:07:35,399 --> 00:07:35,899 trained 198 00:07:36,625 --> 00:07:37,125 clinicians 199 00:07:37,665 --> 00:07:39,345 and done a lot of work on my 200 00:07:39,345 --> 00:07:40,725 sexual abuse healing 201 00:07:41,665 --> 00:07:43,205 and had worked with 202 00:07:44,145 --> 00:07:46,725 licensed professionals regarding my brain injury. 203 00:07:48,064 --> 00:07:49,665 But there was a place that I knew 204 00:07:49,665 --> 00:07:52,689 I still wasn't able to connect into. I 205 00:07:52,689 --> 00:07:55,490 knew there was something that lived deeper within 206 00:07:55,490 --> 00:07:55,990 myself, 207 00:07:56,610 --> 00:07:58,930 but I didn't quite know how to get 208 00:07:58,930 --> 00:07:59,430 there. 209 00:08:00,449 --> 00:08:02,610 And so is that when Hoffman came in 210 00:08:02,610 --> 00:08:05,009 the pitch? Hoffman came in. Wow. Yeah. Tell 211 00:08:05,009 --> 00:08:07,009 us about that. You you step into your 212 00:08:07,009 --> 00:08:07,509 week. 213 00:08:07,875 --> 00:08:10,855 Yeah. What begins to happen as you 214 00:08:11,235 --> 00:08:13,395 have all this clarity? Because more and more 215 00:08:13,395 --> 00:08:14,855 people are coming to the process 216 00:08:15,395 --> 00:08:18,115 having done work already. So you have been 217 00:08:18,115 --> 00:08:21,154 both done work on your your brain injury, 218 00:08:21,154 --> 00:08:24,300 done work on your childhood sexual abuse Yeah. 219 00:08:24,500 --> 00:08:26,520 And yet you step into this immersive 220 00:08:26,900 --> 00:08:28,120 cellular journey. 221 00:08:29,139 --> 00:08:30,600 What happens? Yeah. 222 00:08:31,860 --> 00:08:34,440 Well, in in hindsight now, 223 00:08:36,674 --> 00:08:38,754 what what I loved is when we were 224 00:08:38,754 --> 00:08:40,995 getting ready to do this interview, you had 225 00:08:40,995 --> 00:08:42,774 posed the question of why. 226 00:08:43,475 --> 00:08:45,235 And I thought about that the over the 227 00:08:45,235 --> 00:08:47,495 last couple days about why the process. 228 00:08:48,434 --> 00:08:51,815 And what I realized is that why 229 00:08:52,269 --> 00:08:55,329 it's still evolving. It's still revealing itself. 230 00:08:56,429 --> 00:08:59,649 And one of those whys was learning 231 00:09:00,350 --> 00:09:01,329 who I was, 232 00:09:01,629 --> 00:09:03,089 who I really was 233 00:09:03,629 --> 00:09:05,235 versus living out 234 00:09:05,794 --> 00:09:08,514 what I had been taught and what had 235 00:09:08,514 --> 00:09:09,334 been modeled 236 00:09:09,875 --> 00:09:10,695 growing up. 237 00:09:11,794 --> 00:09:12,294 And 238 00:09:13,714 --> 00:09:15,554 I feel like I hit a point in 239 00:09:15,554 --> 00:09:16,695 my life where 240 00:09:17,794 --> 00:09:20,375 I didn't really have a clear 241 00:09:21,759 --> 00:09:24,500 knowing and a connection to myself. 242 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:26,660 And 243 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:28,419 the process 244 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:33,620 very quickly, I really realized in the process 245 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:34,340 that 246 00:09:37,045 --> 00:09:40,184 I had consistently been seeking outside 247 00:09:40,565 --> 00:09:41,065 validation 248 00:09:41,605 --> 00:09:44,085 from others in love. I mean, my my 249 00:09:44,085 --> 00:09:45,065 parents were 250 00:09:45,605 --> 00:09:47,684 lifers with each other. I mean, they were 251 00:09:47,684 --> 00:09:48,184 this 252 00:09:48,539 --> 00:09:52,220 beautiful, loving couple together, married over fifty years 253 00:09:52,220 --> 00:09:54,000 before each of them passed away. 254 00:09:54,779 --> 00:09:56,159 And for myself, 255 00:09:57,820 --> 00:09:58,879 I had been married, 256 00:09:59,740 --> 00:10:00,480 and then 257 00:10:02,134 --> 00:10:03,894 I had been married about ten years and 258 00:10:03,894 --> 00:10:06,075 then fell deeply in love with a woman. 259 00:10:07,414 --> 00:10:10,214 And so all of a sudden, who I 260 00:10:10,214 --> 00:10:12,534 thought I was and what I knew, but 261 00:10:12,534 --> 00:10:13,034 also 262 00:10:14,214 --> 00:10:16,615 realized I had been living this model that 263 00:10:16,615 --> 00:10:17,355 my parents 264 00:10:18,399 --> 00:10:21,379 had taught to me and modeled beautifully, 265 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:23,059 but inside 266 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:26,340 it wasn't me. It just wasn't me. 267 00:10:26,799 --> 00:10:28,980 And so I was in a conundrum 268 00:10:29,279 --> 00:10:30,259 within myself. 269 00:10:31,475 --> 00:10:34,294 And what I realized is that the process 270 00:10:34,355 --> 00:10:35,174 very quickly 271 00:10:36,754 --> 00:10:37,575 is about 272 00:10:38,434 --> 00:10:41,014 connecting into that authentic you. 273 00:10:42,514 --> 00:10:44,820 And through the expressive work 274 00:10:46,019 --> 00:10:46,759 and the 275 00:10:47,620 --> 00:10:50,600 quieting myself and listening during the process, 276 00:10:52,419 --> 00:10:53,559 I was able to 277 00:10:54,660 --> 00:10:57,320 peel back a lot of those layers from 278 00:10:57,914 --> 00:11:00,235 the trauma of sexual abuse going up. So 279 00:11:00,235 --> 00:11:00,735 putting 280 00:11:01,115 --> 00:11:01,615 really 281 00:11:02,075 --> 00:11:02,575 strong 282 00:11:03,434 --> 00:11:05,695 coping strategies in place for that. 283 00:11:06,554 --> 00:11:08,875 And then the head injury adding into that. 284 00:11:08,875 --> 00:11:11,549 And then also this, well, who am I? 285 00:11:11,789 --> 00:11:13,950 Because what I realized is my whole life 286 00:11:13,950 --> 00:11:15,169 I had tried to 287 00:11:15,549 --> 00:11:16,049 pattern 288 00:11:16,589 --> 00:11:17,730 my life after 289 00:11:18,429 --> 00:11:20,049 what my parents modeled, 290 00:11:20,669 --> 00:11:22,669 while at the same time having a deep 291 00:11:22,669 --> 00:11:25,644 inner knowing that it wasn't who I was. 292 00:11:25,945 --> 00:11:28,424 I am not them. I'm not them, but 293 00:11:28,424 --> 00:11:31,304 yet I was rigid in holding on to 294 00:11:31,304 --> 00:11:33,245 trying to be like them even though 295 00:11:33,784 --> 00:11:35,245 I wasn't. Yeah. 296 00:11:35,705 --> 00:11:36,205 Yeah. 297 00:11:36,664 --> 00:11:38,764 Wow. So there's a a soup. 298 00:11:39,149 --> 00:11:40,850 The the head injury, 299 00:11:41,389 --> 00:11:41,709 the, 300 00:11:42,669 --> 00:11:44,929 understanding of you being gay 301 00:11:45,470 --> 00:11:48,509 Mhmm. The childhood sexual abuse, all that sort 302 00:11:48,509 --> 00:11:49,250 of swims 303 00:11:49,709 --> 00:11:50,209 Yeah. 304 00:11:50,669 --> 00:11:51,730 In your 305 00:11:52,294 --> 00:11:52,794 process, 306 00:11:53,414 --> 00:11:55,414 what happens towards the end of the week? 307 00:11:55,414 --> 00:11:57,174 How do you begin to make sense of 308 00:11:57,174 --> 00:11:59,815 it all? Well, that's where there's a piece 309 00:11:59,815 --> 00:12:02,554 during the process that that we call expressive 310 00:12:02,694 --> 00:12:03,194 work. 311 00:12:03,654 --> 00:12:05,759 And that's where it felt like I was 312 00:12:05,759 --> 00:12:08,340 really able to use my voice 313 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:12,320 and open up parts of me that had 314 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:15,139 felt so walled off and confused 315 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:16,580 within myself. 316 00:12:17,519 --> 00:12:19,514 And what I also realized is 317 00:12:21,115 --> 00:12:21,855 I had 318 00:12:22,634 --> 00:12:23,134 unfairly 319 00:12:24,634 --> 00:12:25,695 put expectations 320 00:12:26,315 --> 00:12:27,774 and in a way burden 321 00:12:28,634 --> 00:12:31,375 on partners that I had been with. 322 00:12:32,570 --> 00:12:34,029 And so to 323 00:12:34,730 --> 00:12:37,790 be able to use my voice that week, 324 00:12:37,850 --> 00:12:40,190 to be able to write and express 325 00:12:40,649 --> 00:12:41,629 and to move 326 00:12:42,090 --> 00:12:43,070 what I had 327 00:12:44,889 --> 00:12:45,389 really 328 00:12:46,504 --> 00:12:48,205 packed down within myself 329 00:12:49,625 --> 00:12:50,764 to free that 330 00:12:51,945 --> 00:12:53,404 really freed up 331 00:12:54,264 --> 00:12:55,884 me getting to know 332 00:12:56,504 --> 00:12:58,985 who I was and what my voice was 333 00:12:58,985 --> 00:13:01,485 rather than seeking the external 334 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:02,820 validation. 335 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:07,299 That's great insight. You had packed it down. 336 00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:09,839 And by using your voice, you were really 337 00:13:09,839 --> 00:13:11,220 able to go places 338 00:13:11,839 --> 00:13:14,959 that you hadn't previously gone. Yeah. And, you 339 00:13:14,959 --> 00:13:17,059 know, some people might say, do I, 340 00:13:17,785 --> 00:13:18,285 why 341 00:13:18,825 --> 00:13:21,705 expression? Why this cathartic work? Do I really 342 00:13:21,705 --> 00:13:24,184 need to use my voice? Yeah. And for 343 00:13:24,184 --> 00:13:24,684 you, 344 00:13:25,225 --> 00:13:28,125 like, what was it like to I imagine 345 00:13:28,184 --> 00:13:30,029 right out of the gate, you're not like, 346 00:13:30,190 --> 00:13:31,250 here's my truth. 347 00:13:31,629 --> 00:13:33,710 I'm speaking it. No. Imagine it was a 348 00:13:33,710 --> 00:13:35,330 bit of a wrestling match 349 00:13:35,790 --> 00:13:38,190 with your internal patterns that had been in 350 00:13:38,190 --> 00:13:39,810 existence for a couple decades 351 00:13:40,350 --> 00:13:42,110 Yeah. By the time you took the process. 352 00:13:42,110 --> 00:13:44,370 Several decades. So how was that 353 00:13:44,924 --> 00:13:46,144 struggle? Yeah. 354 00:13:47,085 --> 00:13:47,904 For me 355 00:13:49,004 --> 00:13:51,745 for me, what I realize is if if 356 00:13:51,804 --> 00:13:55,004 if most people describe me as a teenager 357 00:13:55,004 --> 00:13:56,625 in my twenties and my thirties, 358 00:13:57,940 --> 00:13:59,779 Even my ex husband had said this. He 359 00:13:59,779 --> 00:14:01,639 used to say, you're like a brick wall. 360 00:14:02,179 --> 00:14:02,679 And 361 00:14:03,059 --> 00:14:03,960 I presented 362 00:14:04,659 --> 00:14:05,399 as really 363 00:14:05,940 --> 00:14:06,440 angry 364 00:14:07,379 --> 00:14:08,919 and closed off. 365 00:14:09,860 --> 00:14:10,360 And 366 00:14:11,294 --> 00:14:13,634 in the expression work, it wasn't about 367 00:14:14,014 --> 00:14:14,514 anger 368 00:14:15,054 --> 00:14:16,355 and being angry 369 00:14:16,735 --> 00:14:17,235 at 370 00:14:18,095 --> 00:14:20,414 what had happened to me and trying to 371 00:14:20,414 --> 00:14:22,735 figure, you know, with the brain injury and 372 00:14:22,735 --> 00:14:23,394 the abuse. 373 00:14:24,289 --> 00:14:26,709 It wasn't about being angry. What I realized 374 00:14:26,850 --> 00:14:28,549 is it was about 375 00:14:31,169 --> 00:14:33,350 being able to shift that from 376 00:14:36,049 --> 00:14:36,549 anger 377 00:14:38,305 --> 00:14:38,805 to 378 00:14:40,225 --> 00:14:40,725 expansiveness. 379 00:14:41,985 --> 00:14:45,425 It let me be expansive rather than pushing 380 00:14:45,425 --> 00:14:48,085 down. I was now able to 381 00:14:48,785 --> 00:14:49,685 open up 382 00:14:51,809 --> 00:14:54,370 and move through the world that felt much 383 00:14:54,370 --> 00:14:57,490 more authentic and real rather than having to 384 00:14:57,490 --> 00:14:57,990 stay 385 00:14:59,410 --> 00:15:00,769 closed off. So let me ask you a 386 00:15:00,769 --> 00:15:03,009 question. If I if somebody had said to 387 00:15:03,009 --> 00:15:06,549 you, like, take this anger energy and get 388 00:15:06,904 --> 00:15:10,105 the insight is this, the unlock is this, 389 00:15:10,105 --> 00:15:11,085 the hack 390 00:15:11,705 --> 00:15:14,504 is this, the the new way of framing 391 00:15:14,504 --> 00:15:15,965 this is to go from 392 00:15:16,345 --> 00:15:18,045 anger to expansiveness 393 00:15:18,504 --> 00:15:21,179 to Mhmm. Would that have worked if someone 394 00:15:21,179 --> 00:15:22,840 had just told you the insight? 395 00:15:23,539 --> 00:15:24,759 No. No. 396 00:15:25,299 --> 00:15:25,799 Because 397 00:15:27,379 --> 00:15:30,039 it wasn't until I experienced it 398 00:15:30,340 --> 00:15:32,519 and felt that shift within myself. 399 00:15:34,924 --> 00:15:37,424 And what I would say also is realizing 400 00:15:37,965 --> 00:15:41,825 that that resource actually did live within me. 401 00:15:42,285 --> 00:15:44,445 I did have that resource, and it had 402 00:15:44,445 --> 00:15:45,665 been there all along. 403 00:15:45,980 --> 00:15:48,540 Do do you know when it happened in 404 00:15:48,540 --> 00:15:51,440 your cathartic or expressive experience? 405 00:15:51,899 --> 00:15:54,879 Did you feel it emerge in your belly, 406 00:15:55,100 --> 00:15:55,759 in your 407 00:15:56,379 --> 00:15:57,914 solar plexus? Like, 408 00:15:58,794 --> 00:16:01,034 do you have a sense of how it 409 00:16:01,034 --> 00:16:03,514 kind of or maybe it's so mysterious we 410 00:16:03,514 --> 00:16:06,574 don't really know how these things the wisdom 411 00:16:06,634 --> 00:16:07,774 comes from within. 412 00:16:08,315 --> 00:16:10,095 Yes. It feels mysterious. 413 00:16:10,980 --> 00:16:12,839 What it also felt like is 414 00:16:16,820 --> 00:16:19,080 at one point during the process, 415 00:16:21,299 --> 00:16:21,799 something 416 00:16:22,500 --> 00:16:23,879 shifted within me 417 00:16:24,419 --> 00:16:25,399 through the experiences 418 00:16:27,154 --> 00:16:29,575 that a student goes through in the process. 419 00:16:30,754 --> 00:16:33,554 There's a shift from having to know things 420 00:16:33,554 --> 00:16:34,855 and figure it out 421 00:16:35,714 --> 00:16:37,414 to be one step ahead, 422 00:16:38,970 --> 00:16:39,470 analyzing, 423 00:16:39,769 --> 00:16:40,269 processing, 424 00:16:40,809 --> 00:16:43,289 which I was really good at and spent 425 00:16:43,289 --> 00:16:44,509 most of the time doing, 426 00:16:44,970 --> 00:16:46,269 to all of a sudden, 427 00:16:47,289 --> 00:16:48,750 there was an opening, 428 00:16:49,209 --> 00:16:51,690 a space that was created where all of 429 00:16:51,690 --> 00:16:52,350 a sudden, 430 00:16:52,730 --> 00:16:53,470 I realized 431 00:16:55,154 --> 00:16:57,414 that I wanted to be more curious 432 00:16:58,434 --> 00:17:00,455 and responsive in life, 433 00:17:00,914 --> 00:17:02,914 and I had been living from a place 434 00:17:02,914 --> 00:17:04,054 of being reactive. 435 00:17:04,835 --> 00:17:07,255 Just react, react, react versus 436 00:17:07,875 --> 00:17:09,815 there was all of a sudden this calmness 437 00:17:10,349 --> 00:17:13,150 Once some space was cleared, a calmness to 438 00:17:13,150 --> 00:17:13,650 say, 439 00:17:14,269 --> 00:17:14,769 woah. 440 00:17:16,429 --> 00:17:17,569 How can I just 441 00:17:18,349 --> 00:17:20,289 sense be in the sensing 442 00:17:20,910 --> 00:17:22,609 of my life and the experiences 443 00:17:22,910 --> 00:17:25,410 that I have rather than having to wrestle 444 00:17:26,154 --> 00:17:27,214 and fight those? 445 00:17:27,755 --> 00:17:29,134 And how did that impact 446 00:17:29,515 --> 00:17:30,734 the rest of your week? 447 00:17:32,795 --> 00:17:35,214 When once you had that insight that 448 00:17:35,515 --> 00:17:37,835 just open up, just relax, be a little 449 00:17:37,835 --> 00:17:40,875 more curious, stop trying to predict what's gonna 450 00:17:40,875 --> 00:17:41,375 happen, 451 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:42,980 Did 452 00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:48,420 that impact and affect how the week unfolded 453 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:49,140 for you? 454 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:51,380 Yes. Yes. 455 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:54,640 And I'm I'm I'm going I'm actually in 456 00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:56,894 the middle of going back and re experiencing, 457 00:17:56,894 --> 00:17:59,394 and that's what I find that's so yeah. 458 00:17:59,455 --> 00:18:01,055 Wow. And that's what I find that's so 459 00:18:01,055 --> 00:18:02,355 beautiful about the processes. 460 00:18:02,734 --> 00:18:04,654 Even though I did the process while it 461 00:18:04,654 --> 00:18:05,394 would be, 462 00:18:06,894 --> 00:18:08,355 eight and a half years ago, 463 00:18:11,055 --> 00:18:11,955 my body, 464 00:18:12,549 --> 00:18:13,349 Right? My 465 00:18:13,750 --> 00:18:16,730 I still feel that. There's still a connection 466 00:18:17,509 --> 00:18:18,570 to what happened 467 00:18:18,950 --> 00:18:20,089 during that week 468 00:18:21,109 --> 00:18:21,609 and 469 00:18:23,109 --> 00:18:23,930 what continues 470 00:18:24,309 --> 00:18:25,049 to evolve 471 00:18:25,589 --> 00:18:28,170 even today, eight and a half years later. 472 00:18:29,075 --> 00:18:30,855 And what I would say is how 473 00:18:31,234 --> 00:18:34,115 it shifted during that week was there was 474 00:18:34,115 --> 00:18:34,855 a softness. 475 00:18:36,835 --> 00:18:38,855 There was a softness, and 476 00:18:39,474 --> 00:18:42,055 I'll come back to that word, an expansiveness 477 00:18:43,330 --> 00:18:44,390 that came in. 478 00:18:44,769 --> 00:18:46,710 And I would also say curious 479 00:18:47,090 --> 00:18:47,590 curiosity. 480 00:18:49,170 --> 00:18:49,670 Wow. 481 00:18:49,970 --> 00:18:50,869 What have I 482 00:18:51,650 --> 00:18:53,430 been so busy controlling 483 00:18:53,890 --> 00:18:55,029 and afraid of 484 00:18:55,570 --> 00:18:56,070 experiencing 485 00:18:56,450 --> 00:18:57,430 my whole life? 486 00:18:58,375 --> 00:19:01,674 And now it's almost like that script flipped 487 00:19:01,734 --> 00:19:02,234 where, 488 00:19:02,855 --> 00:19:03,355 woah. 489 00:19:03,815 --> 00:19:05,835 What do I now get to experience 490 00:19:08,055 --> 00:19:10,134 and be part of in my life? And 491 00:19:10,134 --> 00:19:11,595 how do I just allow 492 00:19:13,859 --> 00:19:14,920 life to happen 493 00:19:15,220 --> 00:19:16,359 and need it 494 00:19:16,740 --> 00:19:18,980 versus wrestling and fighting it? That's a great 495 00:19:18,980 --> 00:19:21,460 word you used earlier. Right? That wrestling and 496 00:19:21,460 --> 00:19:23,400 fighting versus allowing. 497 00:19:24,740 --> 00:19:27,244 And do you see that as a Hoffman 498 00:19:27,384 --> 00:19:29,325 process teacher now that you're 499 00:19:29,865 --> 00:19:32,125 you've been teaching for years do you see 500 00:19:32,664 --> 00:19:35,785 that same struggle with your students and how 501 00:19:35,785 --> 00:19:37,244 do you support them 502 00:19:37,704 --> 00:19:40,984 in letting go and allowing? It's easy words 503 00:19:40,984 --> 00:19:44,190 to say but it's a hard place to 504 00:19:44,730 --> 00:19:47,230 to live and surrender to. Is it not? 505 00:19:47,369 --> 00:19:47,869 Yes. 506 00:19:48,329 --> 00:19:49,869 Yes. And I see that. 507 00:19:50,490 --> 00:19:52,809 And and that's what I feel is is 508 00:19:52,809 --> 00:19:54,569 one of the blessings and the honor of 509 00:19:54,569 --> 00:19:55,869 being a Hoffman teacher 510 00:19:56,735 --> 00:20:00,174 is I really believe in being able to 511 00:20:00,174 --> 00:20:03,134 walk alongside them and just holding space for 512 00:20:03,134 --> 00:20:04,035 what they discover 513 00:20:04,575 --> 00:20:05,394 about themselves. 514 00:20:05,695 --> 00:20:07,634 And what you said earlier is 515 00:20:07,934 --> 00:20:09,695 is a is a is a thought that 516 00:20:09,695 --> 00:20:11,715 I have. It's a great phrase of, 517 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:14,740 if somebody would have told 518 00:20:15,039 --> 00:20:17,299 me, it doesn't have the same impact 519 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:19,460 as just allowing 520 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:22,339 and holding the space as a teacher 521 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:24,180 for our 522 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:25,700 students 523 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:27,059 to move into 524 00:20:29,065 --> 00:20:30,125 what is emerging 525 00:20:30,825 --> 00:20:31,724 within themselves. 526 00:20:33,464 --> 00:20:35,784 And that's what I was able to experience, 527 00:20:35,784 --> 00:20:36,524 and that's 528 00:20:37,224 --> 00:20:38,825 that's what led me to want to be 529 00:20:38,825 --> 00:20:40,605 a teacher at the end of the week. 530 00:20:40,730 --> 00:20:42,349 I mean, I'm I'm a trained, 531 00:20:42,809 --> 00:20:43,789 licensed clinician. 532 00:20:44,890 --> 00:20:46,089 I think this And you were a therapist. 533 00:20:46,089 --> 00:20:47,630 And I was yeah. Psychotherapist. 534 00:20:47,930 --> 00:20:50,190 And I also, I teach at Western Michigan 535 00:20:50,250 --> 00:20:53,369 University. I teach graduate and undergraduate students in 536 00:20:53,369 --> 00:20:56,109 the social work department at Western Michigan University. 537 00:20:56,894 --> 00:20:57,875 And oftentimes, 538 00:20:59,215 --> 00:21:00,115 during classes, 539 00:21:02,335 --> 00:21:05,615 students who are becoming therapists, they wanna have 540 00:21:05,615 --> 00:21:07,715 the right words. They wanna have, 541 00:21:08,095 --> 00:21:09,775 you know, the perfect thing to say to 542 00:21:09,775 --> 00:21:13,220 people to help them. And oftentimes my role, 543 00:21:13,279 --> 00:21:15,119 it's the same with the Hoffman teacher but 544 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:17,359 also theirs, it's not about having the right 545 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:18,500 thing to say. 546 00:21:19,039 --> 00:21:21,140 It's about really being present 547 00:21:21,759 --> 00:21:24,880 and holding the space for them to discover 548 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:26,660 that path that they're on. 549 00:21:27,184 --> 00:21:27,984 Yeah. I mean, it's a, 550 00:21:28,704 --> 00:21:31,345 you're the teacher. You're the professor. You're the 551 00:21:31,345 --> 00:21:34,224 one that has the wisdom, the knowledge you 552 00:21:34,224 --> 00:21:36,785 impart to these students. That's why they're there. 553 00:21:36,785 --> 00:21:39,345 They're taking notes. Mhmm. And yet part of 554 00:21:39,345 --> 00:21:40,650 what you're saying is that 555 00:21:41,130 --> 00:21:43,450 you're guiding them to the wisdom that lives 556 00:21:43,450 --> 00:21:43,950 within. 557 00:21:44,330 --> 00:21:44,830 Yes. 558 00:21:45,609 --> 00:21:47,769 And what I would also add on to 559 00:21:47,769 --> 00:21:48,670 that, Drew, 560 00:21:49,049 --> 00:21:49,549 is 561 00:21:50,890 --> 00:21:53,690 I've now not been in relationship for about 562 00:21:53,690 --> 00:21:56,115 three years. I've been single. And I and 563 00:21:56,275 --> 00:21:57,015 even though 564 00:21:57,795 --> 00:22:00,434 I date on occasion, I've been single, and 565 00:22:00,434 --> 00:22:02,674 it's it's the first time in my entire 566 00:22:02,674 --> 00:22:04,535 life that I've not been in a relationship. 567 00:22:05,634 --> 00:22:08,134 And while I still hope to have that 568 00:22:08,914 --> 00:22:09,414 and 569 00:22:10,940 --> 00:22:12,799 and would like to be, 570 00:22:13,180 --> 00:22:14,880 what I realized is 571 00:22:15,660 --> 00:22:16,480 I really 572 00:22:17,259 --> 00:22:19,420 like my own company. I like who I 573 00:22:19,420 --> 00:22:19,920 am, 574 00:22:20,299 --> 00:22:21,519 and I had never 575 00:22:22,625 --> 00:22:25,204 felt that way before. It was always about 576 00:22:25,664 --> 00:22:29,024 getting that external validation. Oh, if somebody loves 577 00:22:29,024 --> 00:22:31,264 me, if somebody wants to be with me, 578 00:22:31,264 --> 00:22:33,524 then I'm lovable, then I'm okay. 579 00:22:34,065 --> 00:22:35,524 And that's where the process 580 00:22:36,079 --> 00:22:38,799 has really helped me also. And what I 581 00:22:38,799 --> 00:22:39,700 realize is 582 00:22:41,279 --> 00:22:43,279 many people who come to the process, it's 583 00:22:43,279 --> 00:22:45,599 a common phrase we hear is, I don't 584 00:22:45,599 --> 00:22:47,519 know how to love myself. I don't know 585 00:22:47,519 --> 00:22:49,424 how to give to myself. I don't know 586 00:22:49,424 --> 00:22:51,825 how to connect into my deeper knowing and 587 00:22:51,825 --> 00:22:54,464 my deeper deeper wisdom and have that love 588 00:22:54,464 --> 00:22:55,125 for myself. 589 00:22:56,464 --> 00:22:58,304 And so in that place, it's another, 590 00:23:01,024 --> 00:23:01,524 just 591 00:23:02,170 --> 00:23:05,130 incredible experience to hold that space and presence 592 00:23:05,130 --> 00:23:05,789 for people 593 00:23:06,410 --> 00:23:07,309 to learn 594 00:23:07,930 --> 00:23:10,490 how to love themselves and to go, wow. 595 00:23:10,490 --> 00:23:12,890 I'm I'm pretty good company. And what do 596 00:23:12,890 --> 00:23:15,765 you mean? Being with myself. This is so 597 00:23:15,765 --> 00:23:18,424 good because it's such a simple idea and 598 00:23:18,565 --> 00:23:20,345 it's such a an important 599 00:23:21,365 --> 00:23:23,944 nuanced journey towards self love. 600 00:23:24,244 --> 00:23:26,345 So what's it like to be a steward 601 00:23:26,565 --> 00:23:29,519 of this self love? To be a guide 602 00:23:29,519 --> 00:23:30,740 for these students 603 00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:32,500 in their week, 604 00:23:33,120 --> 00:23:36,240 guiding them back towards their own wisdom, their 605 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:37,940 own love, their own compassion? 606 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:40,480 How is that for you to be on 607 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:40,980 that? 608 00:23:42,715 --> 00:23:43,934 Gone from student 609 00:23:44,315 --> 00:23:47,215 now to teacher to guide to space holder. 610 00:23:49,994 --> 00:23:52,715 The word that comes often is just 611 00:23:56,630 --> 00:23:59,910 it's an honor. It's an honor to hold 612 00:23:59,910 --> 00:24:00,410 space, 613 00:24:01,110 --> 00:24:02,570 and it also feels 614 00:24:04,150 --> 00:24:04,650 purposeful 615 00:24:04,950 --> 00:24:06,410 is the word that comes. 616 00:24:06,950 --> 00:24:09,369 But I hesitated on that because 617 00:24:09,830 --> 00:24:11,049 that purpose 618 00:24:12,335 --> 00:24:15,695 also knowing that I'm doing what feels purposeful 619 00:24:15,695 --> 00:24:16,434 to me 620 00:24:16,815 --> 00:24:18,115 allows me also 621 00:24:19,134 --> 00:24:21,234 to stay centered and grounded. 622 00:24:22,414 --> 00:24:25,075 Right? So it feels centering. It feels grounding 623 00:24:25,934 --> 00:24:26,434 because 624 00:24:27,980 --> 00:24:29,759 being able to just really 625 00:24:30,299 --> 00:24:31,359 hold the container 626 00:24:31,980 --> 00:24:32,720 for students 627 00:24:33,900 --> 00:24:34,960 during the week, 628 00:24:35,660 --> 00:24:37,580 people come there to do hard work. I 629 00:24:37,580 --> 00:24:39,500 came to the process. That's what led me 630 00:24:39,500 --> 00:24:40,320 to the process, 631 00:24:40,774 --> 00:24:42,855 is I knew I wanted to get to 632 00:24:42,855 --> 00:24:44,694 a certain place. I knew there was a 633 00:24:44,694 --> 00:24:45,194 place 634 00:24:45,494 --> 00:24:48,154 that lived within me. I just didn't know 635 00:24:48,214 --> 00:24:49,515 how to get there 636 00:24:49,894 --> 00:24:52,774 and how to be that because I'd get 637 00:24:52,774 --> 00:24:55,170 swept up in patterns. I get swept up 638 00:24:55,170 --> 00:24:57,990 in those shoulds and those shouldn'ts from childhood 639 00:24:58,049 --> 00:24:59,750 that were just so ingrained 640 00:25:00,529 --> 00:25:01,190 in me. 641 00:25:01,970 --> 00:25:02,710 And so 642 00:25:03,089 --> 00:25:05,269 learning how to hold all 643 00:25:05,934 --> 00:25:08,595 the beautiful qualities that I did learn 644 00:25:09,455 --> 00:25:11,075 and were modeled growing up 645 00:25:11,535 --> 00:25:12,355 while simultaneously 646 00:25:13,055 --> 00:25:13,955 just holding 647 00:25:16,255 --> 00:25:18,894 what wasn't mine and what I knew wasn't 648 00:25:18,894 --> 00:25:20,515 my path and really wasn't 649 00:25:21,269 --> 00:25:21,769 internally 650 00:25:22,630 --> 00:25:23,130 me. 651 00:25:23,990 --> 00:25:26,710 And so now hold just holding both of 652 00:25:26,710 --> 00:25:28,090 those side by side 653 00:25:29,590 --> 00:25:30,730 gently and lovingly, 654 00:25:32,070 --> 00:25:34,150 and I bring that into the students because 655 00:25:34,150 --> 00:25:35,930 that's what I see in the students 656 00:25:36,554 --> 00:25:38,554 when they come due to the process. There's 657 00:25:38,554 --> 00:25:39,855 this inner turmoil, 658 00:25:40,954 --> 00:25:43,134 either in their profession or their relationships 659 00:25:43,595 --> 00:25:45,454 or in their relationship with themselves, 660 00:25:46,954 --> 00:25:49,194 and how to bring all those beautiful wonderful 661 00:25:49,194 --> 00:25:51,054 qualities that they do have alongside 662 00:25:54,109 --> 00:25:54,930 with reconnecting 663 00:25:55,950 --> 00:25:58,430 to who they know they are authentically and 664 00:25:58,430 --> 00:25:59,329 being able 665 00:26:00,269 --> 00:26:02,670 to touch upon that and be able to 666 00:26:02,670 --> 00:26:06,130 then start to live again from that place 667 00:26:06,595 --> 00:26:07,414 within themselves. 668 00:26:07,794 --> 00:26:09,815 I love that. I love it. 669 00:26:10,595 --> 00:26:12,674 As, you know, you you referenced I wanna 670 00:26:12,674 --> 00:26:15,315 ask a question about because at at the 671 00:26:15,315 --> 00:26:17,734 process, we talk about the positive legacy 672 00:26:18,514 --> 00:26:20,940 of our mother and our father. And at 673 00:26:20,940 --> 00:26:22,160 some point during the week, 674 00:26:23,259 --> 00:26:24,240 we have an experience 675 00:26:24,619 --> 00:26:25,519 in honoring 676 00:26:26,539 --> 00:26:30,140 that they actually did, on some level, give 677 00:26:30,140 --> 00:26:32,659 us things that we want to embrace Yeah. 678 00:26:32,859 --> 00:26:35,005 Double down on a little bit. We wanna 679 00:26:35,005 --> 00:26:37,825 tease out the difference between the the patterned 680 00:26:37,964 --> 00:26:40,365 part that they gave us, but there are 681 00:26:40,365 --> 00:26:41,904 many wonderful qualities. 682 00:26:42,525 --> 00:26:44,065 And for you, it sounds like 683 00:26:44,684 --> 00:26:45,664 you're reclaiming, 684 00:26:46,525 --> 00:26:49,424 having teased out some of those patterns around 685 00:26:50,170 --> 00:26:50,670 emotions 686 00:26:51,289 --> 00:26:53,950 and only certain emotions are allowed, 687 00:26:54,410 --> 00:26:56,269 what have you come to embrace 688 00:26:56,730 --> 00:26:58,269 as the positive legacy 689 00:26:58,650 --> 00:27:00,109 of your mom and your dad? 690 00:27:01,049 --> 00:27:02,589 Oh, it's a great question 691 00:27:03,130 --> 00:27:04,990 in that way. And and because 692 00:27:05,705 --> 00:27:08,505 sometimes I also hear from students, I'll preface 693 00:27:08,505 --> 00:27:09,724 this with saying, sometimes 694 00:27:10,825 --> 00:27:13,164 actually oftentimes I'll hear from students saying, 695 00:27:14,424 --> 00:27:16,765 you know, I didn't have these huge traumatic 696 00:27:16,904 --> 00:27:18,904 things. Right? I actually had a pretty good 697 00:27:18,904 --> 00:27:19,404 childhood. 698 00:27:20,369 --> 00:27:22,390 And and what I would say about myself 699 00:27:22,690 --> 00:27:25,490 and with other people coming to the process 700 00:27:25,490 --> 00:27:26,789 is what I say is, 701 00:27:27,569 --> 00:27:30,069 yes, and there are still patterns 702 00:27:31,009 --> 00:27:34,230 that are having some they're having real consequences 703 00:27:34,450 --> 00:27:37,005 in your life, that you aren't living this 704 00:27:37,005 --> 00:27:38,144 true and authentic 705 00:27:39,325 --> 00:27:41,904 place where you're really centered and connected. 706 00:27:42,605 --> 00:27:44,065 And so for me, 707 00:27:44,845 --> 00:27:45,505 it was 708 00:27:45,964 --> 00:27:47,264 loyalty to family. 709 00:27:47,940 --> 00:27:51,079 Right? There was such a loyalty to family 710 00:27:51,299 --> 00:27:52,119 and relationship. 711 00:27:54,019 --> 00:27:54,519 And 712 00:27:56,980 --> 00:27:58,519 in that place that I 713 00:27:58,819 --> 00:27:59,559 held that 714 00:28:00,194 --> 00:28:00,934 so tightly, 715 00:28:02,274 --> 00:28:04,755 I lost track of who I was within 716 00:28:04,755 --> 00:28:05,255 that. 717 00:28:05,875 --> 00:28:06,615 Sounds like 718 00:28:06,994 --> 00:28:07,494 loyalty 719 00:28:07,954 --> 00:28:08,855 to the extreme, 720 00:28:09,234 --> 00:28:09,734 loyalty 721 00:28:10,194 --> 00:28:12,855 to the denial of who you are. Yes. 722 00:28:13,154 --> 00:28:15,480 Yes. And so now I feel like I'm 723 00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,960 in that place where I can still hold 724 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,759 on to those great things of loyalty. Right? 725 00:28:20,759 --> 00:28:22,700 That deep connection to people 726 00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:23,820 and 727 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,505 showing up showing up and being loving, 728 00:28:28,765 --> 00:28:29,345 a wholeness. 729 00:28:29,644 --> 00:28:32,384 Right? A wholeness within that with also 730 00:28:33,325 --> 00:28:35,984 not dipping back into the patterns 731 00:28:36,845 --> 00:28:37,345 of, 732 00:28:37,644 --> 00:28:39,644 oh, now I'm moving away from who I 733 00:28:39,644 --> 00:28:40,144 am 734 00:28:41,819 --> 00:28:44,940 and and and who I know my my 735 00:28:44,940 --> 00:28:45,839 being is 736 00:28:46,140 --> 00:28:48,460 within that. It can be a complicated thing 737 00:28:48,460 --> 00:28:49,200 to both 738 00:28:49,900 --> 00:28:52,960 remember love both your parents have passed. Yeah. 739 00:28:53,164 --> 00:28:55,904 So to hold them with deep respect, 740 00:28:56,284 --> 00:28:58,304 care, and love in their memory 741 00:28:59,164 --> 00:29:01,424 and all the wonderful things they gave you. 742 00:29:01,644 --> 00:29:03,265 And at the same time, 743 00:29:03,884 --> 00:29:06,204 remember some of the patterns and the stuff 744 00:29:06,204 --> 00:29:07,744 they taught you as problematic 745 00:29:08,549 --> 00:29:09,049 and 746 00:29:09,590 --> 00:29:12,330 as hard on you and having a negative 747 00:29:12,470 --> 00:29:15,509 consequence. Yeah. To hold both those isn't how 748 00:29:15,509 --> 00:29:17,990 do you navigate the the both end of 749 00:29:17,990 --> 00:29:20,090 your mom and dad's legacy? 750 00:29:20,549 --> 00:29:21,049 Oh, 751 00:29:23,105 --> 00:29:24,884 how I hold both of those 752 00:29:25,345 --> 00:29:28,305 is that's where I really utilize the tools 753 00:29:28,305 --> 00:29:28,965 and practices. 754 00:29:30,144 --> 00:29:30,884 I know 755 00:29:31,184 --> 00:29:33,105 I I have friends lots of friends who 756 00:29:33,105 --> 00:29:33,765 are psychotherapists 757 00:29:34,144 --> 00:29:36,625 because that's that was my profession before becoming 758 00:29:36,625 --> 00:29:37,285 a teacher. 759 00:29:37,769 --> 00:29:39,630 And they've often asked me the question, 760 00:29:40,970 --> 00:29:44,490 why the process? Right? Why why this Hoffman 761 00:29:44,490 --> 00:29:46,570 process? Oh, this is good. So these people 762 00:29:46,570 --> 00:29:47,230 in the, 763 00:29:48,170 --> 00:29:48,670 psychology 764 00:29:49,130 --> 00:29:49,630 field 765 00:29:49,930 --> 00:29:50,590 as therapists 766 00:29:51,095 --> 00:29:53,914 are kinda curious with you and your Hoffman. 767 00:29:54,214 --> 00:29:54,714 Yeah. 768 00:29:55,095 --> 00:29:57,174 Very much so. They wanna know what what 769 00:29:57,174 --> 00:29:59,095 makes Hoffman different from the work that we 770 00:29:59,095 --> 00:30:01,755 do. Exactly. And so what do you say? 771 00:30:01,815 --> 00:30:04,214 Well, what I often say is is it's 772 00:30:04,214 --> 00:30:05,355 it's not a replacement 773 00:30:05,970 --> 00:30:06,470 or, 774 00:30:08,929 --> 00:30:09,909 counter to. 775 00:30:10,210 --> 00:30:11,890 What I like to say is it's a 776 00:30:11,890 --> 00:30:12,390 complimentary 777 00:30:13,409 --> 00:30:14,950 because it is really important 778 00:30:15,730 --> 00:30:16,710 to have 779 00:30:17,490 --> 00:30:18,710 a, like, a professionally 780 00:30:19,569 --> 00:30:20,710 trained licensed 781 00:30:22,914 --> 00:30:24,774 therapist that can help you through 782 00:30:26,355 --> 00:30:27,794 some of the issues that you have in 783 00:30:27,794 --> 00:30:30,855 your life. And where Hoffman for me Hoffman 784 00:30:30,914 --> 00:30:31,974 came in complimentary 785 00:30:32,355 --> 00:30:34,454 and really walked alongside of it 786 00:30:34,755 --> 00:30:35,255 where 787 00:30:36,549 --> 00:30:38,470 I was able to get in touch with 788 00:30:38,470 --> 00:30:40,789 what we talk about at the processes, those 789 00:30:40,789 --> 00:30:42,170 other aspects of ourselves 790 00:30:42,630 --> 00:30:45,529 really deepening into, well, what are my emotions 791 00:30:45,910 --> 00:30:46,410 and 792 00:30:47,269 --> 00:30:49,694 staying with that and feeling it. 793 00:30:50,335 --> 00:30:50,835 Because 794 00:30:51,615 --> 00:30:54,034 as wonderful as my childhood was, 795 00:30:54,335 --> 00:30:56,414 we didn't learn how to stay with those 796 00:30:56,414 --> 00:30:58,034 really hard deep feelings 797 00:30:58,974 --> 00:31:01,315 and let them be as reverent 798 00:31:02,734 --> 00:31:03,554 in our 799 00:31:03,855 --> 00:31:04,355 life 800 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:06,220 as 801 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:07,740 the positive, 802 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:10,940 always being happy and 803 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:13,559 finding the good in every not finding the 804 00:31:13,559 --> 00:31:15,259 good in everything, I should say. 805 00:31:15,720 --> 00:31:18,619 That would be the patterned version because Yeah. 806 00:31:18,724 --> 00:31:20,345 There is pain and pain 807 00:31:20,805 --> 00:31:22,884 and sadness. Rather than being able to just 808 00:31:22,884 --> 00:31:25,545 be and sit in that sadness and really 809 00:31:26,244 --> 00:31:28,345 be able to move through it versus, 810 00:31:28,884 --> 00:31:30,805 you know, pushing it away and pushing it 811 00:31:30,805 --> 00:31:33,130 away. Damn. And the other aspects that I 812 00:31:33,130 --> 00:31:34,910 would say is is the process 813 00:31:36,809 --> 00:31:38,809 really helped me get in touch with my 814 00:31:38,809 --> 00:31:42,970 body because I really disconnected from that, from 815 00:31:42,970 --> 00:31:44,750 the abuse as a child. 816 00:31:45,130 --> 00:31:45,950 And also, 817 00:31:47,795 --> 00:31:49,734 not going into to the feelings. 818 00:31:51,154 --> 00:31:51,974 And so 819 00:31:52,595 --> 00:31:53,095 coming 820 00:31:53,474 --> 00:31:56,195 back full circle to, oh, I'm able to 821 00:31:56,195 --> 00:31:57,734 stop and say, okay. 822 00:31:58,769 --> 00:32:00,710 I might have a hard situation 823 00:32:01,090 --> 00:32:03,410 that might be happening, or I might feel 824 00:32:03,410 --> 00:32:04,630 upset about something. 825 00:32:05,410 --> 00:32:07,269 And I'm able to just pause 826 00:32:07,570 --> 00:32:08,070 now 827 00:32:09,170 --> 00:32:12,210 and have all those good qualities that my 828 00:32:12,210 --> 00:32:14,644 family taught me, which is like, k. It'll 829 00:32:14,644 --> 00:32:15,384 be okay. 830 00:32:17,525 --> 00:32:19,384 Things will work themselves through 831 00:32:20,644 --> 00:32:23,444 and bring in the other, which is and 832 00:32:23,444 --> 00:32:25,704 what is my body feeling in this moment? 833 00:32:26,244 --> 00:32:28,884 And letting my body feel it and not 834 00:32:28,884 --> 00:32:30,679 pushing it away. What am 835 00:32:31,220 --> 00:32:34,179 I emotionally feeling this morning? And really being 836 00:32:34,179 --> 00:32:35,240 with it and giving 837 00:32:36,179 --> 00:32:37,319 those their 838 00:32:37,779 --> 00:32:38,599 due diligence 839 00:32:39,220 --> 00:32:40,200 and their 840 00:32:42,625 --> 00:32:44,404 their voice. Yeah. So 841 00:32:44,865 --> 00:32:47,924 why has allowing your feelings to 842 00:32:48,224 --> 00:32:49,984 be a part of the dialogue and in 843 00:32:49,984 --> 00:32:50,944 particular around, 844 00:32:51,505 --> 00:32:53,125 allowing your body sensations 845 00:32:54,119 --> 00:32:56,619 to be held with reverence. 846 00:32:57,319 --> 00:32:59,720 Why is that helping you in your life? 847 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:01,559 Why is that a a better path for 848 00:33:01,559 --> 00:33:02,059 you? 849 00:33:03,799 --> 00:33:06,359 What I find for myself is I'm more 850 00:33:06,359 --> 00:33:08,059 present in every moment. 851 00:33:09,035 --> 00:33:10,954 I used to be very much into the 852 00:33:10,954 --> 00:33:12,015 pre prehofen, 853 00:33:13,115 --> 00:33:14,095 doing, doing, doing, 854 00:33:14,554 --> 00:33:17,054 doing, always thinking ahead, always strategizing, 855 00:33:17,755 --> 00:33:19,775 always planning, always solving. 856 00:33:20,794 --> 00:33:21,294 And 857 00:33:23,369 --> 00:33:25,529 I feel like now I'm able to just 858 00:33:25,529 --> 00:33:28,829 be in the present moment, in each moment. 859 00:33:29,130 --> 00:33:30,990 I don't have to look ahead. 860 00:33:32,250 --> 00:33:34,490 I don't have to stay stuck in the 861 00:33:34,490 --> 00:33:34,990 past. 862 00:33:35,625 --> 00:33:38,204 I can just truly be in each 863 00:33:38,505 --> 00:33:39,005 present 864 00:33:39,865 --> 00:33:40,365 moment. 865 00:33:40,744 --> 00:33:41,244 Yeah. 866 00:33:41,785 --> 00:33:44,105 Presence is such a, you know, a word 867 00:33:44,105 --> 00:33:47,224 that's thrown out around a lot, but when 868 00:33:47,224 --> 00:33:50,204 you're talking about not future tripping and not, 869 00:33:50,585 --> 00:33:51,325 you know, 870 00:33:51,839 --> 00:33:53,380 ruminating in the past 871 00:33:53,839 --> 00:33:56,400 that does leave this one final place to 872 00:33:56,400 --> 00:33:58,480 hang out in. What's it like to be 873 00:33:58,480 --> 00:33:59,299 more present 874 00:33:59,920 --> 00:34:01,759 in your life as a result of this 875 00:34:01,759 --> 00:34:02,259 work? 876 00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:05,599 My nervous system 877 00:34:06,944 --> 00:34:07,444 Huge. 878 00:34:08,065 --> 00:34:08,885 Is calm. 879 00:34:10,144 --> 00:34:12,784 And even when things arise, like, a a 880 00:34:12,784 --> 00:34:14,085 quick example is 881 00:34:14,385 --> 00:34:15,925 yesterday, I got online, 882 00:34:16,304 --> 00:34:18,864 my financial person it's the end of the 883 00:34:18,864 --> 00:34:20,864 year and my financial person said, I'm gonna 884 00:34:20,864 --> 00:34:22,139 switch a couple things. So I thought, oh, 885 00:34:22,139 --> 00:34:23,659 I'll get online and just take a look 886 00:34:23,659 --> 00:34:25,280 at the account, see what he did. 887 00:34:25,900 --> 00:34:27,659 So I bring it up online, and it 888 00:34:27,659 --> 00:34:29,519 says I have $27 889 00:34:30,619 --> 00:34:32,319 in my retirement account. 890 00:34:32,940 --> 00:34:33,440 Now 891 00:34:33,815 --> 00:34:36,235 there should have been a few more zeros 892 00:34:36,295 --> 00:34:37,035 after that. 893 00:34:38,375 --> 00:34:39,675 And in that moment, 894 00:34:40,535 --> 00:34:43,195 of course, I had a reaction. I'm like, 895 00:34:43,335 --> 00:34:44,315 just for a moment. 896 00:34:45,175 --> 00:34:46,875 And then I just softened 897 00:34:47,175 --> 00:34:49,660 because all my Hoffman tools and practices came 898 00:34:49,660 --> 00:34:51,420 in, and I just softened in that moment. 899 00:34:51,420 --> 00:34:52,239 And I thought, 900 00:34:52,619 --> 00:34:53,920 just pause for a moment. 901 00:34:54,539 --> 00:34:56,559 There's got to be a really good explanation 902 00:34:56,700 --> 00:34:57,360 for this. 903 00:34:58,300 --> 00:35:00,880 And I found myself getting curious. 904 00:35:01,739 --> 00:35:03,039 I wonder what happened. 905 00:35:04,594 --> 00:35:07,094 And what I realized is in the past, 906 00:35:08,914 --> 00:35:10,054 I would have went 907 00:35:10,434 --> 00:35:11,414 down a very 908 00:35:11,875 --> 00:35:14,514 chaotic road. I would have immediately called him. 909 00:35:14,514 --> 00:35:16,409 I would have been freaking out. I would 910 00:35:16,409 --> 00:35:18,750 have panicked. My nervous system would have exploded 911 00:35:19,050 --> 00:35:19,550 inside. 912 00:35:20,889 --> 00:35:21,389 And 913 00:35:21,929 --> 00:35:23,929 I realized, wow, I don't have to go 914 00:35:23,929 --> 00:35:24,750 to that place. 915 00:35:25,769 --> 00:35:27,710 How can I be curious about 916 00:35:28,135 --> 00:35:28,954 and respond 917 00:35:29,335 --> 00:35:31,974 versus react in this moment? And then I 918 00:35:31,974 --> 00:35:34,394 thought, wow. This is this has been 919 00:35:34,855 --> 00:35:35,675 the brilliance 920 00:35:37,095 --> 00:35:38,235 and the benefit 921 00:35:39,255 --> 00:35:41,675 that is now deeply ingrained in me, 922 00:35:41,974 --> 00:35:44,550 like, embodied in me, is to be able 923 00:35:44,550 --> 00:35:45,369 to respond 924 00:35:47,269 --> 00:35:49,690 when things happen versus react. 925 00:35:50,309 --> 00:35:52,869 So I called my adviser. I said, this 926 00:35:52,869 --> 00:35:53,369 happened. 927 00:35:53,750 --> 00:35:55,349 And he said, wow. I bet you you 928 00:35:55,349 --> 00:35:56,410 just freaked out. 929 00:35:56,950 --> 00:35:58,010 And I said, 930 00:35:58,469 --> 00:35:59,369 for a moment, 931 00:36:00,255 --> 00:36:02,574 literally for a moment, because it that's a 932 00:36:02,574 --> 00:36:05,454 normal it's normal that that would happen, but 933 00:36:05,454 --> 00:36:07,454 it didn't last. And that's what I noticed 934 00:36:07,454 --> 00:36:10,674 is my nervous system calls calms much faster. 935 00:36:11,295 --> 00:36:13,295 And it ended up being I'd actually used 936 00:36:13,295 --> 00:36:14,579 a wrong sign on, 937 00:36:15,059 --> 00:36:17,059 and I didn't even know that I had 938 00:36:17,059 --> 00:36:19,480 a different account from a way, way old 939 00:36:19,780 --> 00:36:23,300 retirement fund where there was $27 940 00:36:23,300 --> 00:36:24,280 left in it. 941 00:36:25,059 --> 00:36:25,960 And so 942 00:36:26,340 --> 00:36:28,920 in that moment, it all worked out fine. 943 00:36:29,105 --> 00:36:31,045 Soon as I did the right sign on, 944 00:36:31,184 --> 00:36:33,364 everything was there that was supposed to be. 945 00:36:33,824 --> 00:36:35,904 And I thought to myself, this is the 946 00:36:35,904 --> 00:36:37,284 epitome right here 947 00:36:37,824 --> 00:36:38,324 of 948 00:36:39,585 --> 00:36:42,085 how I'm living my life differently 949 00:36:42,464 --> 00:36:45,449 Beautiful. Since the process. Beautiful. It kinda works 950 00:36:45,449 --> 00:36:47,550 that way, doesn't it? Where sometimes 951 00:36:48,250 --> 00:36:50,250 we don't know we get the gains we 952 00:36:50,250 --> 00:36:52,269 get until we have an experience, 953 00:36:52,969 --> 00:36:55,050 and then we're like, oh, that that was 954 00:36:55,050 --> 00:36:58,030 different. That was better. Yeah. I like that. 955 00:36:58,730 --> 00:36:59,230 Wonderful. 956 00:36:59,784 --> 00:37:00,284 So 957 00:37:01,224 --> 00:37:03,465 you talked a lot, Cindy, about tools and 958 00:37:03,465 --> 00:37:06,125 practices, and I really wanna end this conversation 959 00:37:06,744 --> 00:37:08,525 without checking in with a teacher 960 00:37:08,985 --> 00:37:11,965 about her own favorite tools and practices. 961 00:37:12,510 --> 00:37:14,829 What do you do? What do you like? 962 00:37:14,829 --> 00:37:15,969 What are some of the, 963 00:37:16,590 --> 00:37:19,230 tools and tricks in your tool bag that 964 00:37:19,230 --> 00:37:20,369 you use to 965 00:37:20,829 --> 00:37:23,789 stay grounded to do do this work? It's 966 00:37:23,789 --> 00:37:26,110 a it's a great question, Drew, because what 967 00:37:26,110 --> 00:37:28,715 what automatically comes to mind is oftentimes 968 00:37:29,015 --> 00:37:30,155 as as a teacher, 969 00:37:30,614 --> 00:37:33,575 oftentimes I talk with students, and they may 970 00:37:33,575 --> 00:37:36,055 be a month or two out from having 971 00:37:36,055 --> 00:37:37,735 done their process. They might be a year 972 00:37:37,735 --> 00:37:39,414 out from doing their process. They might be 973 00:37:39,414 --> 00:37:41,809 two years out from doing their process. And 974 00:37:42,269 --> 00:37:44,590 and on occasion, I hear, wow. Right? I 975 00:37:44,590 --> 00:37:46,610 don't feel like I'm really utilizing 976 00:37:47,070 --> 00:37:49,869 the tools. But when we start talking about 977 00:37:49,869 --> 00:37:51,789 them, and I know this is true for 978 00:37:51,789 --> 00:37:52,769 myself, is 979 00:37:54,110 --> 00:37:56,449 what I what what we discover, 980 00:37:57,444 --> 00:37:59,364 what I discover and talk through with students 981 00:37:59,364 --> 00:38:02,324 is they are. They're using them every single 982 00:38:02,324 --> 00:38:04,505 day and they're really subtle. 983 00:38:04,804 --> 00:38:05,864 Right? They're just 984 00:38:06,244 --> 00:38:09,764 because they've embodied it. They've become those tools 985 00:38:09,764 --> 00:38:11,924 and practices. Cindy, this is so good. So 986 00:38:11,924 --> 00:38:12,744 their definition 987 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:14,780 of using the tools 988 00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:16,940 isn't inclusive 989 00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:20,200 of what they're actually doing that is more 990 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:21,900 subtle, more embodied, 991 00:38:22,519 --> 00:38:24,059 but equally as powerful. 992 00:38:24,599 --> 00:38:25,094 Yes. 993 00:38:25,414 --> 00:38:29,094 And so those tools and practices is similar 994 00:38:29,094 --> 00:38:30,614 to the story I just told us. In 995 00:38:30,614 --> 00:38:31,355 that moment, 996 00:38:32,295 --> 00:38:34,215 I was able to pause and take in 997 00:38:34,215 --> 00:38:34,875 a breath, 998 00:38:35,574 --> 00:38:37,755 connected in with my spiritual self. 999 00:38:38,135 --> 00:38:39,275 I got curious 1000 00:38:41,380 --> 00:38:43,699 instead of going into patterns of doom and 1001 00:38:43,699 --> 00:38:45,079 gloom and dread and, 1002 00:38:45,539 --> 00:38:48,340 you know, thinking my financial advisor was, you 1003 00:38:48,340 --> 00:38:50,199 know, somewhere on a beach in The Bahamas 1004 00:38:50,260 --> 00:38:52,119 enjoying With your retirement. 1005 00:38:52,887 --> 00:38:54,255 Right. And so 1006 00:38:55,195 --> 00:38:55,695 pausing, 1007 00:38:57,755 --> 00:38:59,775 connecting into the different 1008 00:39:00,315 --> 00:39:02,655 aspects of myself. What's my body 1009 00:39:03,275 --> 00:39:05,755 experiencing right now? And how do I listen 1010 00:39:05,755 --> 00:39:07,135 to what it needs? 1011 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,400 What is my emotional self? How do I 1012 00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:11,940 let that just move through? 1013 00:39:12,639 --> 00:39:14,719 Take a breath and be with that. Those 1014 00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:16,820 are kind of in the moment tools 1015 00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:19,599 as opposed to stepping out of life doing 1016 00:39:19,599 --> 00:39:21,760 a quad check or a centering practice or 1017 00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:22,980 a gratitude practice. 1018 00:39:23,494 --> 00:39:25,114 You're talking about embodied 1019 00:39:25,735 --> 00:39:26,635 in the moment 1020 00:39:26,934 --> 00:39:27,675 check ins 1021 00:39:28,454 --> 00:39:31,094 that are very subtle and yet really keep 1022 00:39:31,094 --> 00:39:31,914 you grounded. 1023 00:39:32,375 --> 00:39:34,394 So the other tool that I utilize 1024 00:39:35,574 --> 00:39:37,574 that I didn't the first couple years for 1025 00:39:37,574 --> 00:39:38,715 whatever reason, 1026 00:39:39,015 --> 00:39:40,510 and I that's the other thing is I 1027 00:39:40,510 --> 00:39:41,809 find the tools and practices, 1028 00:39:42,269 --> 00:39:45,170 they they come in. Some are more prevalent 1029 00:39:45,230 --> 00:39:47,010 at certain times and certain experiences, 1030 00:39:47,389 --> 00:39:48,369 and then others 1031 00:39:48,670 --> 00:39:50,989 will come back in here, and then others 1032 00:39:50,989 --> 00:39:52,589 I use less and then they come back 1033 00:39:52,589 --> 00:39:55,244 in. But the one that I probably use 1034 00:39:55,244 --> 00:39:57,005 the most now is what we call pre 1035 00:39:57,005 --> 00:39:57,505 cycling, 1036 00:39:57,885 --> 00:39:58,625 and that's 1037 00:39:59,085 --> 00:40:01,585 imagining a situation that I'm going into 1038 00:40:01,885 --> 00:40:02,864 where I know 1039 00:40:03,244 --> 00:40:03,744 that 1040 00:40:04,045 --> 00:40:07,340 there's going to be some energy that will 1041 00:40:07,340 --> 00:40:09,180 probably come up. It might be a hard 1042 00:40:09,180 --> 00:40:09,680 conversation. 1043 00:40:10,380 --> 00:40:12,960 It might be something that might be stressful. 1044 00:40:13,579 --> 00:40:14,400 And I will 1045 00:40:15,820 --> 00:40:16,960 imagine myself 1046 00:40:17,579 --> 00:40:18,079 connected 1047 00:40:18,804 --> 00:40:20,105 to my spiritual self, 1048 00:40:20,485 --> 00:40:21,784 connected into 1049 00:40:22,724 --> 00:40:25,204 my wholeness and who I know I can 1050 00:40:25,204 --> 00:40:25,704 be 1051 00:40:26,965 --> 00:40:29,304 before I enter into that situation. 1052 00:40:29,684 --> 00:40:31,284 So good. And so by the time I 1053 00:40:31,284 --> 00:40:32,025 get there, 1054 00:40:32,565 --> 00:40:33,625 I walk in 1055 00:40:34,659 --> 00:40:36,199 rather than going into patterns 1056 00:40:36,579 --> 00:40:37,400 and reaction. 1057 00:40:38,019 --> 00:40:40,679 I'm able to move into that space. 1058 00:40:41,139 --> 00:40:42,739 And how long does that take, that pre 1059 00:40:42,739 --> 00:40:45,159 cycling little thing for you when you're Seconds. 1060 00:40:45,300 --> 00:40:49,114 Seconds. Seconds. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and and 1061 00:40:49,114 --> 00:40:49,855 in the process, 1062 00:40:50,155 --> 00:40:52,795 we we it's much longer because we really 1063 00:40:52,795 --> 00:40:53,295 teach 1064 00:40:54,474 --> 00:40:57,514 teach that in a didactic way. But once 1065 00:40:57,514 --> 00:40:59,755 you practice that and you build that muscle 1066 00:40:59,994 --> 00:41:01,989 You can compress it a little bit. That's 1067 00:41:01,989 --> 00:41:03,910 that's an important piece. It doesn't need to 1068 00:41:03,910 --> 00:41:05,769 be this elongated thing 1069 00:41:06,230 --> 00:41:08,250 that you can get the essence of it, 1070 00:41:08,550 --> 00:41:11,530 and it really works for you. Yeah. Yeah. 1071 00:41:11,750 --> 00:41:14,789 And I find that with students, oftentimes, they'll 1072 00:41:14,789 --> 00:41:16,410 say, wow. I can do this. 1073 00:41:17,105 --> 00:41:19,344 Right? It's just it's automatic now. I can 1074 00:41:19,344 --> 00:41:19,924 do it 1075 00:41:20,464 --> 00:41:22,625 in the moment. It only takes a few 1076 00:41:22,625 --> 00:41:23,125 seconds. 1077 00:41:23,905 --> 00:41:24,405 Yeah. 1078 00:41:25,505 --> 00:41:27,824 How you doing? What's it like to to 1079 00:41:27,824 --> 00:41:29,824 sit and reflect? I mean, you went way 1080 00:41:29,824 --> 00:41:33,099 back, Cindy, and then brought in your your 1081 00:41:33,099 --> 00:41:33,599 experience 1082 00:41:34,219 --> 00:41:35,519 leading up to being 1083 00:41:35,900 --> 00:41:38,639 a student and then being a teacher. 1084 00:41:39,260 --> 00:41:40,559 You you have 1085 00:41:41,500 --> 00:41:44,400 so stewarded so much good stuff in Canada 1086 00:41:44,460 --> 00:41:46,784 that's you teach both places, but 1087 00:41:47,264 --> 00:41:47,764 you've 1088 00:41:48,144 --> 00:41:51,264 also, you live in Canada part time. I 1089 00:41:51,264 --> 00:41:54,885 do. I do. So I live actually near 1090 00:41:55,025 --> 00:41:56,244 the site that 1091 00:41:56,864 --> 00:41:58,804 where the process is taught in Canada, 1092 00:41:59,570 --> 00:42:00,070 And 1093 00:42:00,449 --> 00:42:02,309 I moved there about, 1094 00:42:02,769 --> 00:42:04,530 two years ago, and I'm now a dual 1095 00:42:04,530 --> 00:42:06,869 citizen. Oh. And so, 1096 00:42:07,489 --> 00:42:09,489 I feel very fortunate that I get to 1097 00:42:09,489 --> 00:42:11,889 teach in The United States for the process, 1098 00:42:11,889 --> 00:42:14,150 and I also get to teach in Canada. 1099 00:42:17,785 --> 00:42:19,164 And I feel like 1100 00:42:19,785 --> 00:42:22,985 going through my life story and actually it 1101 00:42:22,985 --> 00:42:25,305 just makes it makes me smile, and it 1102 00:42:25,305 --> 00:42:25,785 makes me 1103 00:42:28,739 --> 00:42:30,840 this is where the emotion comes in. 1104 00:42:34,500 --> 00:42:36,280 It makes me really proud 1105 00:42:37,380 --> 00:42:40,039 of staying with my own process inside 1106 00:42:41,135 --> 00:42:43,315 and feeling the hurt and the disappointments, 1107 00:42:44,335 --> 00:42:46,355 not only from others, but within myself. 1108 00:42:47,295 --> 00:42:49,855 Right? Those places where I've made mistakes, those 1109 00:42:49,855 --> 00:42:52,514 places where I've tripped up, those places where 1110 00:42:54,110 --> 00:42:55,650 I haven't made good choices, 1111 00:42:57,630 --> 00:43:00,269 but also able to hold those with such 1112 00:43:00,269 --> 00:43:02,289 love and gentleness of knowing 1113 00:43:03,309 --> 00:43:04,905 I was doing my best 1114 00:43:06,025 --> 00:43:08,425 and that it doesn't end here. Hopefully, I 1115 00:43:08,425 --> 00:43:10,985 still have many, many more years ago, but 1116 00:43:10,985 --> 00:43:12,605 that the combination 1117 00:43:13,304 --> 00:43:14,364 and the confluence 1118 00:43:15,224 --> 00:43:16,925 of all of these experiences 1119 00:43:18,230 --> 00:43:20,569 make up the whole of who I am. 1120 00:43:21,909 --> 00:43:22,409 And 1121 00:43:24,469 --> 00:43:27,849 that's what the process allows, and and I 1122 00:43:28,069 --> 00:43:28,969 get the 1123 00:43:30,069 --> 00:43:32,329 I get to witness that with the students. 1124 00:43:33,494 --> 00:43:35,594 I get to witness that with the students, 1125 00:43:35,894 --> 00:43:38,954 and they're coming into their life experience 1126 00:43:40,295 --> 00:43:42,315 and being able to love themself 1127 00:43:43,014 --> 00:43:43,514 through 1128 00:43:44,614 --> 00:43:46,074 it all also. 1129 00:43:47,255 --> 00:43:48,315 Wow. You are 1130 00:43:48,869 --> 00:43:49,369 embodying 1131 00:43:50,069 --> 00:43:50,730 the work, 1132 00:43:51,269 --> 00:43:52,569 embodying your essence, 1133 00:43:53,190 --> 00:43:55,049 and I am grateful 1134 00:43:55,670 --> 00:43:58,089 grateful for you, grateful for this conversation. 1135 00:43:58,630 --> 00:44:01,269 Thank you, Cindy. Thank you, Drew. Appreciate it. 1136 00:44:01,269 --> 00:44:02,715 Thank you for having me here. 1137 00:44:05,035 --> 00:44:05,535 Thanks. 1138 00:44:15,769 --> 00:44:17,949 Thank you for listening to the Hoffman podcast. 1139 00:44:18,409 --> 00:44:20,570 My name is Matt Brannigan. I'm the CEO 1140 00:44:20,570 --> 00:44:22,269 of the Hoffman Institute Foundation 1141 00:44:22,570 --> 00:44:24,809 and a Hoffman teacher. Our mission is to 1142 00:44:24,809 --> 00:44:27,449 provide greater access to the wisdom and power 1143 00:44:27,449 --> 00:44:30,269 of love within ourselves, in our relationships, 1144 00:44:30,785 --> 00:44:31,684 and in the world. 1145 00:44:31,985 --> 00:44:34,405 To learn more or to support our mission, 1146 00:44:34,465 --> 00:44:37,765 we invite you to visit hoffmaninstitute.org.