1 00:00:01,679 --> 00:00:03,600 It was so intense. There was so much 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:05,120 to work through in a week. I mean, 3 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:06,879 I came out of that floating on air. 4 00:00:06,879 --> 00:00:09,359 It was really incredible. And my kids saw 5 00:00:09,359 --> 00:00:11,039 it immediately. They were young, you know, and 6 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:13,139 they're like, dad, you've lost your stress face. 7 00:00:14,144 --> 00:00:16,864 Welcome, everybody. My name is Drew Horning, and 8 00:00:16,864 --> 00:00:19,925 this podcast is called Love's Everyday Radius. 9 00:00:20,545 --> 00:00:22,644 It's brought to you by the Hoffman Institute, 10 00:00:22,864 --> 00:00:25,605 and it's stories and anecdotes 11 00:00:26,224 --> 00:00:27,765 and people we interview 12 00:00:28,210 --> 00:00:29,829 about their life post process 13 00:00:30,210 --> 00:00:31,989 and how it lives in the world 14 00:00:32,289 --> 00:00:33,590 radiating love. 15 00:00:34,369 --> 00:00:35,750 This episode contains 16 00:00:36,210 --> 00:00:38,309 graphic descriptions of trauma, 17 00:00:38,850 --> 00:00:41,350 substance abuse, and reproductive 18 00:00:41,729 --> 00:00:42,229 grief. 19 00:00:42,534 --> 00:00:43,914 Please use your discretion. 20 00:00:50,134 --> 00:00:52,475 Hey, everybody. Welcome to the Hoffman podcast. 21 00:00:52,854 --> 00:00:55,594 Steve Chechu is with me. Welcome, Steve. 22 00:00:56,079 --> 00:00:58,159 Thank you, Drew. Nice to be here. How 23 00:00:58,159 --> 00:01:00,479 are you doing? I'm doing really well, really 24 00:01:00,479 --> 00:01:03,280 well. I just came back off a weekend 25 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:04,640 with my daughter who was at a ski 26 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,759 competition and, she did well and she was, 27 00:01:08,399 --> 00:01:10,000 skied with joy in her heart. And that's 28 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:11,895 what I was hoping. And in kind of 29 00:01:11,895 --> 00:01:14,615 a consequential ski event called free ride, big 30 00:01:14,615 --> 00:01:16,935 mountain, where she's jumping off cliffs and tight 31 00:01:16,935 --> 00:01:19,495 trees and very hard event to watch as 32 00:01:19,495 --> 00:01:20,075 a parent. 33 00:01:20,615 --> 00:01:22,855 Just praying for her safety and she had 34 00:01:22,855 --> 00:01:24,775 a great result and, and it was really, 35 00:01:25,420 --> 00:01:26,939 it was great. It's great for the family. 36 00:01:26,939 --> 00:01:28,540 Ma was there with my wife and we 37 00:01:28,540 --> 00:01:29,439 just got back. 38 00:01:29,740 --> 00:01:32,959 And so, yeah. Wonderful weekend. Thank you. Beautiful. 39 00:01:33,420 --> 00:01:35,819 So, Steve, it's a bit ironic that your 40 00:01:35,819 --> 00:01:39,020 daughter's doing all this big mountain skiing, jumping 41 00:01:39,020 --> 00:01:40,159 off cliffs, because 42 00:01:40,525 --> 00:01:42,924 you have quite an experience you had many 43 00:01:42,924 --> 00:01:45,244 years ago, didn't you? Yes. I did. Can 44 00:01:45,244 --> 00:01:46,924 you tell us a little bit about it? 45 00:01:46,924 --> 00:01:48,685 Yes. I was caught in an avalanche in 46 00:01:48,685 --> 00:01:51,644 a helicopter ski trip outside of Revelstoke, British 47 00:01:51,644 --> 00:01:52,144 Columbia. 48 00:01:52,459 --> 00:01:54,219 We were skiing in a group of 12, 49 00:01:54,219 --> 00:01:56,299 but we're skiing in the trees. And, you 50 00:01:56,299 --> 00:01:57,599 know, you each have a partner 51 00:01:58,219 --> 00:02:00,959 in that particular accident. My partner was killed 52 00:02:01,180 --> 00:02:03,119 and I survived kind of miraculously. 53 00:02:03,739 --> 00:02:05,715 I still to this day, don't really know. 54 00:02:06,034 --> 00:02:06,774 Can't comprehend 55 00:02:07,554 --> 00:02:09,634 how that happened. When you're skiing in the 56 00:02:09,634 --> 00:02:12,114 trees in Canada, you're in these kind of 57 00:02:12,114 --> 00:02:13,414 bowling lane size 58 00:02:13,715 --> 00:02:14,215 openings 59 00:02:14,995 --> 00:02:16,995 where you ski for a while and can 60 00:02:16,995 --> 00:02:20,060 make maybe five, seven, 10 turns, And then 61 00:02:20,060 --> 00:02:21,740 you'll come to what's called a tree fence 62 00:02:21,740 --> 00:02:23,419 where the tree is really narrowed down and 63 00:02:23,419 --> 00:02:25,500 then you have to make either very short 64 00:02:25,500 --> 00:02:27,180 turns to get around that tree fence. And 65 00:02:27,180 --> 00:02:30,300 then that bowling lane size alley will, will 66 00:02:30,300 --> 00:02:31,680 open again for you. 67 00:02:32,014 --> 00:02:33,614 And that can go for, you know, a 68 00:02:33,614 --> 00:02:35,055 1,500 69 00:02:35,055 --> 00:02:38,094 vertical feet. And so when the avalanche hit, 70 00:02:38,094 --> 00:02:39,634 my partner had gone first 71 00:02:40,175 --> 00:02:42,594 and I was getting ready to go. 72 00:02:43,055 --> 00:02:45,294 We had gotten roughly two feet of no 73 00:02:45,294 --> 00:02:48,010 new snow overnight on top of what was 74 00:02:48,010 --> 00:02:50,490 very cold snow that had been sitting around 75 00:02:50,490 --> 00:02:52,889 for two weeks. In that condition, you get 76 00:02:52,889 --> 00:02:55,469 what's called surface horror, which is a, dangerous 77 00:02:56,010 --> 00:02:58,169 bad layer so that that new snow can 78 00:02:58,169 --> 00:03:00,495 slide off that layer. But typically in the 79 00:03:00,495 --> 00:03:02,094 trees, the trees anchor the snow. So that 80 00:03:02,094 --> 00:03:03,235 doesn't happen. 81 00:03:03,534 --> 00:03:05,935 Partner goes first. I was gonna start in 82 00:03:05,935 --> 00:03:08,014 his track, but the snow started to solidify, 83 00:03:08,014 --> 00:03:09,294 get a little bit warmer and a little 84 00:03:09,294 --> 00:03:10,175 too fast. So I said, you know what? 85 00:03:10,175 --> 00:03:11,935 I'm gonna just hike around these two little 86 00:03:11,935 --> 00:03:14,415 small pine trees and find my fresh line, 87 00:03:14,415 --> 00:03:15,900 which I did. And And as soon as 88 00:03:15,900 --> 00:03:17,740 I made one turn, I hear the scream 89 00:03:17,740 --> 00:03:20,300 avalanche and I look over my right shoulder 90 00:03:20,300 --> 00:03:21,659 and I thought it was just gonna be 91 00:03:21,659 --> 00:03:24,060 slough coming through the trees, maybe enough to 92 00:03:24,060 --> 00:03:26,139 knock me down. Instead, I see these giant 93 00:03:26,139 --> 00:03:26,639 blocks, 94 00:03:27,020 --> 00:03:29,340 which are slabs, you know, they're two feet 95 00:03:29,340 --> 00:03:31,735 high and they're going at an enormous rate 96 00:03:31,735 --> 00:03:33,335 of speed and they're hitting the trees and 97 00:03:33,335 --> 00:03:35,675 they're exploding and they're just like this thud. 98 00:03:35,974 --> 00:03:37,995 And I look over my right shoulder 99 00:03:38,375 --> 00:03:39,754 and then over my left 100 00:03:40,135 --> 00:03:41,895 as I'm skiing and I see that the 101 00:03:41,895 --> 00:03:44,215 slide has, has progressed further on the left 102 00:03:44,215 --> 00:03:44,715 side. 103 00:03:45,030 --> 00:03:47,849 So I basically make a snap decision to 104 00:03:48,389 --> 00:03:50,709 ski one big sweeping turn. And I see 105 00:03:50,709 --> 00:03:52,709 a group of old hemlock trees, large growth 106 00:03:52,709 --> 00:03:54,969 hemlocks, and I come right in behind it, 107 00:03:55,109 --> 00:03:57,289 drop my poles and I lean back 108 00:03:57,665 --> 00:04:00,384 and the slide hits the trees, goes right 109 00:04:00,384 --> 00:04:02,224 around me. And I think, oh, I'm gonna 110 00:04:02,224 --> 00:04:04,465 survive. Like it just went around me. But 111 00:04:04,465 --> 00:04:06,625 instead it came underneath me and picked me 112 00:04:06,625 --> 00:04:07,685 up like a hovercraft 113 00:04:08,305 --> 00:04:09,925 about 10 feet in the air. 114 00:04:10,620 --> 00:04:13,020 And then I start going straight down the 115 00:04:13,020 --> 00:04:13,520 slope 116 00:04:13,979 --> 00:04:15,900 in the middle of the avalanche. So I'm 117 00:04:15,900 --> 00:04:17,660 on my back. I've got both my skis 118 00:04:17,660 --> 00:04:19,100 on. I dropped my poles to down my 119 00:04:19,100 --> 00:04:21,019 pole straps on, which thank God, because you 120 00:04:21,019 --> 00:04:22,939 can't really swim if you're holding on your 121 00:04:22,939 --> 00:04:24,955 poles. And I started doing the backstroke 122 00:04:25,495 --> 00:04:26,935 to stay up on top. And as I'm 123 00:04:26,935 --> 00:04:28,634 doing the backstroke, the trees are 124 00:04:29,014 --> 00:04:30,395 whizzing by my head. 125 00:04:30,855 --> 00:04:33,014 And I'm, I'm saying to myself mentally, I'm 126 00:04:33,014 --> 00:04:34,694 like, wow, this is, you know, really dangerous 127 00:04:34,694 --> 00:04:36,475 because these are removable objects. 128 00:04:36,930 --> 00:04:39,189 If I hit one, it's gonna be consequential. 129 00:04:39,490 --> 00:04:41,350 And as I started to pick up speed, 130 00:04:41,810 --> 00:04:44,209 I realized that I had to hit one 131 00:04:44,209 --> 00:04:46,209 because if I didn't, the next one after 132 00:04:46,209 --> 00:04:48,529 that would kill me for sure. So I 133 00:04:48,529 --> 00:04:51,329 still had the, some directional capability because I 134 00:04:51,329 --> 00:04:53,628 had my skis on. So I'm doing the 135 00:04:53,628 --> 00:04:55,558 backstroke and I see this giant hemlock and 136 00:04:55,558 --> 00:04:57,487 I'm like, that's the one I've gotta hit 137 00:04:57,487 --> 00:04:59,417 this tree. And I kind of steered my 138 00:04:59,417 --> 00:05:01,346 way into it and put both feet out 139 00:05:01,346 --> 00:05:03,276 in front of me and I hit the 140 00:05:03,276 --> 00:05:05,205 tree and I literally saw my right leg 141 00:05:05,205 --> 00:05:07,135 do a three sixty spin to the right 142 00:05:07,135 --> 00:05:09,459 and a three sixty spin to the left, 143 00:05:09,459 --> 00:05:11,379 but kept going. And so now I've got 144 00:05:11,379 --> 00:05:13,779 a broken leg and I'm continuing to swim 145 00:05:13,779 --> 00:05:14,759 and I'm like, okay, 146 00:05:15,139 --> 00:05:16,899 I'm picking up speed again. It slowed me 147 00:05:16,899 --> 00:05:19,220 down just a hair. So I'm coming down 148 00:05:19,220 --> 00:05:20,980 and I get through one tree fence. And 149 00:05:20,980 --> 00:05:22,500 then the next tree fence I come to, 150 00:05:22,500 --> 00:05:23,824 I'm like, okay, this is it. Like, Like, 151 00:05:23,824 --> 00:05:25,185 I'm not going to get through this one. 152 00:05:25,185 --> 00:05:26,785 This one's going to take me out for 153 00:05:26,785 --> 00:05:28,805 sure. And everything goes dark 154 00:05:29,185 --> 00:05:31,444 and I can't remember. I just don't recall 155 00:05:31,824 --> 00:05:33,745 how I got to the other side. And 156 00:05:33,745 --> 00:05:35,365 to this day, I still don't remember 157 00:05:35,665 --> 00:05:38,189 how or why or what happened, but 158 00:05:38,649 --> 00:05:40,169 I get to the other side and I 159 00:05:40,169 --> 00:05:41,789 continue down the slide and, 160 00:05:42,409 --> 00:05:43,709 you know, we've gone probably 161 00:05:44,089 --> 00:05:47,370 600 vertical feet and I see another tree 162 00:05:47,370 --> 00:05:48,970 and I try to grab it with my 163 00:05:48,970 --> 00:05:49,789 left arm. 164 00:05:50,305 --> 00:05:52,305 The snowpack is so deep there. The top 165 00:05:52,305 --> 00:05:54,144 of that tree, like it was 15 feet, 166 00:05:54,144 --> 00:05:56,464 but there's 15 feet of snow. So that's 167 00:05:56,464 --> 00:05:58,464 a 30 foot tall tree. And I try 168 00:05:58,464 --> 00:05:59,745 and grab the top of it with my 169 00:05:59,745 --> 00:06:01,504 left arm, almost pulled my shoulder out of 170 00:06:01,504 --> 00:06:04,080 the socket, continue to go down the hill 171 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:05,920 and I'm still doing the backstroke. And then 172 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:07,680 finally it starts to slow down. I'm like, 173 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:09,360 okay, I think I'm going to make this. 174 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:12,160 And oddly started to feel protected, like some 175 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:14,639 powers over looking and I'm not going to 176 00:06:14,639 --> 00:06:16,944 die. And so I start to slow down. 177 00:06:16,944 --> 00:06:18,944 And then, when I, I finally come to 178 00:06:18,944 --> 00:06:21,525 rest, I've got the snow under my armpits 179 00:06:21,745 --> 00:06:23,285 with my arms up above. 180 00:06:23,745 --> 00:06:25,904 I have my left leg kind of like 181 00:06:25,904 --> 00:06:26,645 a contortionist 182 00:06:28,305 --> 00:06:29,430 with the ski tip 183 00:06:29,990 --> 00:06:32,410 facing my right shoulder on my left leg, 184 00:06:32,629 --> 00:06:34,870 completely bent behind me. And then my right 185 00:06:34,870 --> 00:06:36,629 leg is, is broken is off to the 186 00:06:36,629 --> 00:06:38,789 right, but I'm compacted and snow. I cannot 187 00:06:38,789 --> 00:06:39,289 move. 188 00:06:39,750 --> 00:06:41,370 My brother was on this trip 189 00:06:42,004 --> 00:06:44,165 and he saw me go by him and 190 00:06:44,165 --> 00:06:45,064 he's like, swim, 191 00:06:45,685 --> 00:06:48,824 swim. Swimming is the stroke people do 192 00:06:49,365 --> 00:06:52,324 in the really only thing you can do 193 00:06:52,324 --> 00:06:55,205 to try and prevent yourself from being buried 194 00:06:55,205 --> 00:06:56,024 by an avalanche. 195 00:06:56,459 --> 00:06:58,319 You swim to stay up on the surface. 196 00:06:58,379 --> 00:07:00,220 Like if you were in the big ocean 197 00:07:00,220 --> 00:07:02,139 wave and you get pounded by that wave, 198 00:07:02,139 --> 00:07:04,220 you're constantly trying to swim to the surface, 199 00:07:04,220 --> 00:07:06,459 right? It's the same kind of feeling. And 200 00:07:06,459 --> 00:07:08,060 while that snow is moving and there's a 201 00:07:08,060 --> 00:07:09,579 lot of air in it, no problem. But 202 00:07:09,579 --> 00:07:12,355 as it starts to consolidate it, basically all 203 00:07:12,355 --> 00:07:13,875 the air goes out of the snowpack and 204 00:07:13,875 --> 00:07:16,274 it turns to cement. So when you finally 205 00:07:16,274 --> 00:07:17,955 come to rest, you're hoping that you're near 206 00:07:17,955 --> 00:07:19,875 the surface. And if you are, you're gonna 207 00:07:19,875 --> 00:07:21,895 try and punch a hole around your face 208 00:07:21,955 --> 00:07:24,055 and get your hands to create a cup 209 00:07:24,300 --> 00:07:25,819 so that you can breathe so that you 210 00:07:25,819 --> 00:07:27,819 don't breathe in your own CO2. And that's 211 00:07:27,819 --> 00:07:29,259 what kills a lot of people if you're 212 00:07:29,259 --> 00:07:31,740 buried. Now I was super fortunate that I 213 00:07:31,740 --> 00:07:33,500 wasn't buried. I was just up to my 214 00:07:33,500 --> 00:07:35,980 chest and my armpits. So the swimming, you 215 00:07:35,980 --> 00:07:37,805 know, saved my life, for sure. 216 00:07:38,185 --> 00:07:40,685 I've never done anything so animalistic 217 00:07:41,064 --> 00:07:41,564 and 218 00:07:42,024 --> 00:07:43,944 difficult in my life. Like, you know, when 219 00:07:43,944 --> 00:07:45,865 you're gonna die, you're like, okay, you do 220 00:07:45,865 --> 00:07:48,665 everything you can not to. It worked out 221 00:07:48,665 --> 00:07:51,250 my favor that way. So my brother then 222 00:07:51,250 --> 00:07:53,009 comes down to me and was like, Hey, 223 00:07:53,009 --> 00:07:54,370 I broke my leg. I broke my leg, 224 00:07:54,370 --> 00:07:56,530 but my left leg feels like I'm gonna 225 00:07:56,530 --> 00:07:58,689 get snapped in two because I'm so out 226 00:07:58,689 --> 00:07:59,509 of position. 227 00:07:59,970 --> 00:08:02,290 And so he digs me out, gets my 228 00:08:02,290 --> 00:08:04,665 left leg free, takes that ski off. And 229 00:08:04,665 --> 00:08:06,745 then we continue to dig and dig around 230 00:08:06,745 --> 00:08:08,665 my right leg. And I looked down and 231 00:08:08,665 --> 00:08:10,665 I'm like, okay, this is the craziest thing 232 00:08:10,665 --> 00:08:12,105 I've ever seen with my own body. My 233 00:08:12,105 --> 00:08:14,024 right leg is at a 90 degree angle 234 00:08:14,024 --> 00:08:15,865 to the right at the boot top. So 235 00:08:15,865 --> 00:08:17,879 I have to pick up my boot and 236 00:08:17,879 --> 00:08:20,439 straighten my leg in an intense amount of 237 00:08:20,439 --> 00:08:22,120 pain. And I could, you know, just feel 238 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,279 the bones kind of grinding on one another 239 00:08:24,279 --> 00:08:25,259 as I do that. 240 00:08:25,639 --> 00:08:27,819 So now I'm, I'm like completely discombobulated. 241 00:08:28,534 --> 00:08:30,854 I'm frantic. And then we're like, where's Steve? 242 00:08:30,854 --> 00:08:33,174 He was in front of me. So other 243 00:08:33,174 --> 00:08:34,875 people start to finally come around 244 00:08:35,254 --> 00:08:37,754 and they start looking for, for Steve. And 245 00:08:38,214 --> 00:08:39,914 he turns out to be about 246 00:08:40,294 --> 00:08:42,154 a 100 feet below me 247 00:08:42,500 --> 00:08:44,600 over a rollover and I can't see him. 248 00:08:45,059 --> 00:08:47,559 And so my other friends in that group, 249 00:08:47,620 --> 00:08:49,000 they're performing CPR. 250 00:08:49,620 --> 00:08:51,779 They dig him out. His hand was up 251 00:08:51,779 --> 00:08:54,019 above the snow. That's how they found him. 252 00:08:54,019 --> 00:08:57,460 Other helicopter companies come through. They ski past 253 00:08:57,460 --> 00:08:59,774 me with these big orange boxes with defibrillators 254 00:09:00,075 --> 00:09:01,675 and they race past me and they're like, 255 00:09:01,675 --> 00:09:03,195 what are your injuries? I'm like, I broke 256 00:09:03,195 --> 00:09:04,634 my leg. They leave me and they go 257 00:09:04,634 --> 00:09:07,115 into one that's more life threatening and they're 258 00:09:07,115 --> 00:09:09,435 down there trying to revive Steve. And my 259 00:09:09,435 --> 00:09:12,235 brother goes halfway down to that rollover and 260 00:09:12,235 --> 00:09:14,580 he's looking down at our other friends and 261 00:09:14,580 --> 00:09:16,580 he's, he kind of puts thumbs up, thumbs 262 00:09:16,580 --> 00:09:19,379 down and he gets the thumbs down and, 263 00:09:19,379 --> 00:09:20,820 you know, he lets me know that Steve 264 00:09:20,820 --> 00:09:21,480 had perished. 265 00:09:22,019 --> 00:09:24,759 And so obviously incredibly emotional, 266 00:09:25,139 --> 00:09:26,919 very distraught at this point. 267 00:09:28,004 --> 00:09:29,225 Now I'm like, okay, 268 00:09:29,924 --> 00:09:31,125 how are they gonna get me out of 269 00:09:31,125 --> 00:09:33,845 here? It's snowing very hard. It's, somewhat of 270 00:09:33,845 --> 00:09:34,424 a blizzard. 271 00:09:35,044 --> 00:09:36,964 We hear a helicopter approach. They put me 272 00:09:36,964 --> 00:09:39,365 on a gurney. They drop a long line 273 00:09:39,365 --> 00:09:42,179 from this hovering helicopter. That's a 100 feet 274 00:09:42,179 --> 00:09:44,019 and the line's not long enough. It can't 275 00:09:44,019 --> 00:09:45,000 reach the gurney. 276 00:09:45,539 --> 00:09:47,079 So they fly away 277 00:09:47,459 --> 00:09:49,379 and I'm like, oh my gosh, I don't 278 00:09:49,379 --> 00:09:52,100 think I could handle being in a sled 279 00:09:52,100 --> 00:09:54,105 behind, you know, one of these guides trying 280 00:09:54,105 --> 00:09:55,625 to navigate me through the trees and in 281 00:09:55,625 --> 00:09:58,445 Canada, they're not allowed to administer pain medication 282 00:09:58,504 --> 00:10:00,184 on the slope. So I had no pain 283 00:10:00,184 --> 00:10:01,865 medication. So it had been three hours and 284 00:10:01,865 --> 00:10:03,945 I literally thought that my leg was cut 285 00:10:03,945 --> 00:10:05,784 off inside my boot. I couldn't feel it 286 00:10:05,784 --> 00:10:07,225 anymore. I was telling my brother, I think 287 00:10:07,225 --> 00:10:09,059 I cut my leg off. He's like, no, 288 00:10:09,059 --> 00:10:10,279 no, it's still attached. 289 00:10:10,980 --> 00:10:12,759 And I was pretty much delirious. 290 00:10:13,460 --> 00:10:15,540 So then the helicopter goes away and I 291 00:10:15,540 --> 00:10:17,059 think, oh my gosh, it's not gonna come 292 00:10:17,059 --> 00:10:19,059 back. And then fifteen minutes later, you hear 293 00:10:19,059 --> 00:10:20,759 the thud of the rotors 294 00:10:21,404 --> 00:10:23,725 and it comes back with 150 foot long 295 00:10:23,725 --> 00:10:25,084 line to give you a sense of the 296 00:10:25,084 --> 00:10:26,764 size of these old growth trees are that 297 00:10:26,764 --> 00:10:28,764 tall. Right. So he drops the long line 298 00:10:28,764 --> 00:10:30,144 down to the gurney. 299 00:10:30,445 --> 00:10:32,764 There's a guide that actually holds on to 300 00:10:32,764 --> 00:10:34,924 the cross bracing of this. It's like a 301 00:10:34,924 --> 00:10:35,424 triangulated 302 00:10:35,804 --> 00:10:37,959 cable goes to each edge of the gurney 303 00:10:37,959 --> 00:10:39,720 and he stands on the gurney and holds 304 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:40,220 it. 305 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:42,279 And so they start to lift me up 306 00:10:42,279 --> 00:10:43,639 out of these trees. And as we get 307 00:10:43,639 --> 00:10:45,399 to the top, the trees are swaying in 308 00:10:45,399 --> 00:10:46,059 the wind 309 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:47,879 and I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna 310 00:10:47,879 --> 00:10:49,799 get ping ponged off the tops of these 311 00:10:49,799 --> 00:10:50,299 trees. 312 00:10:50,845 --> 00:10:53,644 The helicopter pilot just pulls me straight up 313 00:10:53,644 --> 00:10:55,804 like a beautiful maneuver. And I didn't hit 314 00:10:55,804 --> 00:10:56,705 any of the trees. 315 00:10:57,085 --> 00:10:59,485 And now we start to fly to what 316 00:10:59,485 --> 00:11:01,164 I'm thinking is either in a hospital or 317 00:11:01,164 --> 00:11:02,465 an ambulance or whatever. 318 00:11:02,845 --> 00:11:06,299 And we're literally 3,000 feet above the valley 319 00:11:06,299 --> 00:11:08,480 floors in between these giant mountain ranges. 320 00:11:08,940 --> 00:11:11,519 The cable that's holding the, to the helicopters 321 00:11:11,580 --> 00:11:13,179 in this big C shape and I'm just 322 00:11:13,179 --> 00:11:15,179 going, oh my gosh, like if that thing 323 00:11:15,179 --> 00:11:17,179 snaps or the bolt lets you go, I'm 324 00:11:17,179 --> 00:11:18,860 gonna fall to my death. And like, I 325 00:11:18,860 --> 00:11:20,940 couldn't handle it. I was just about freaking 326 00:11:20,940 --> 00:11:21,524 out here. 327 00:11:22,004 --> 00:11:24,245 They land the helicopter and put me into 328 00:11:24,245 --> 00:11:26,004 a smaller helicopter, which he calls an A 329 00:11:26,004 --> 00:11:27,845 star where they pull out the seat next 330 00:11:27,845 --> 00:11:29,524 to the pilot. And they had to wedge 331 00:11:29,524 --> 00:11:31,865 me in, in the gurney in this helicopter 332 00:11:32,085 --> 00:11:34,085 and my feet got pushed up against the 333 00:11:34,085 --> 00:11:36,745 dash and basically passed out from the pain. 334 00:11:37,139 --> 00:11:39,700 So wake up in mid flight land and 335 00:11:39,700 --> 00:11:42,680 there's an ambulance waiting on some county road. 336 00:11:42,899 --> 00:11:44,420 That's, you know, like an hour from the 337 00:11:44,420 --> 00:11:46,580 hospital and I get into the ambulance and 338 00:11:46,580 --> 00:11:49,454 they finally have laughing gas that they can 339 00:11:49,454 --> 00:11:50,815 give me. And I'm I'm sitting there and 340 00:11:50,815 --> 00:11:52,815 I put the mask on and I, I 341 00:11:52,815 --> 00:11:54,514 felt like dark fate. I was just like, 342 00:11:55,375 --> 00:11:57,615 you know, sucking in this laughing gas, trying 343 00:11:57,615 --> 00:11:59,454 to, you know, give me some relief. And 344 00:11:59,454 --> 00:12:01,615 I get to the hospital and they're like, 345 00:12:01,615 --> 00:12:03,629 okay, we're gonna pull your boot off. And 346 00:12:03,629 --> 00:12:04,870 I was like, oh, they're gonna cut it 347 00:12:04,870 --> 00:12:06,149 off with a saw. And they're like, no, 348 00:12:06,149 --> 00:12:08,309 we gotta take it off. And so my 349 00:12:08,309 --> 00:12:10,629 brother and, and when two other people on 350 00:12:10,629 --> 00:12:12,070 the trip, you know, they open the cuff 351 00:12:12,070 --> 00:12:13,350 and they pull the boot off and I 352 00:12:13,350 --> 00:12:14,330 pass out again. 353 00:12:14,710 --> 00:12:16,230 And then the third time I pass out 354 00:12:16,230 --> 00:12:17,769 is when he sets the leg. 355 00:12:18,375 --> 00:12:20,054 So then we, it turns out that I'm, 356 00:12:20,054 --> 00:12:21,274 you know, I'm in the hospital. 357 00:12:21,815 --> 00:12:23,495 They tell me that they can't perform the 358 00:12:23,495 --> 00:12:23,995 surgery. 359 00:12:24,534 --> 00:12:26,715 And this is where the story is quite 360 00:12:26,774 --> 00:12:29,654 wild because my wife was there and normally 361 00:12:29,654 --> 00:12:30,875 this is a boys trip 362 00:12:31,254 --> 00:12:33,095 and Steve, who was one of the, you 363 00:12:33,095 --> 00:12:34,589 know, it was my partner who was killed, 364 00:12:34,589 --> 00:12:36,850 who organized this trip. He's like, you know, 365 00:12:37,230 --> 00:12:38,589 I told him, I said, Hey, we've been 366 00:12:38,589 --> 00:12:40,509 trying to get pregnant. We've been having difficulty. 367 00:12:40,509 --> 00:12:42,509 My wife's the happy lady. And she wants 368 00:12:42,509 --> 00:12:43,709 to come. And he's like, you know, the 369 00:12:43,709 --> 00:12:45,789 rules, there's no wives, no girlfriends. Like, if 370 00:12:45,789 --> 00:12:47,649 you wanna make babies, go to the beach. 371 00:12:47,855 --> 00:12:49,855 And I was, you know, upset about that. 372 00:12:49,855 --> 00:12:51,215 I was like, no, you know, I've paid 373 00:12:51,215 --> 00:12:52,735 and I'm going. And my wife was like, 374 00:12:52,735 --> 00:12:54,335 I'm going to, and I'll just come and 375 00:12:54,335 --> 00:12:55,855 stay in a different hotel and they won't 376 00:12:55,855 --> 00:12:57,375 know the difference and you can come visit 377 00:12:57,375 --> 00:12:58,195 me at night. 378 00:12:58,654 --> 00:13:00,654 So that's what we did. That was our 379 00:13:00,654 --> 00:13:01,154 plan. 380 00:13:01,879 --> 00:13:02,779 So it turns 381 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:05,240 out that she's there. She's a nurse and 382 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:07,080 I had her emotional support and it was 383 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:09,879 amazing and incredible that she was even on 384 00:13:09,879 --> 00:13:12,440 this trip. We find out that the weather 385 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:14,360 is getting worse. It, the snow had turned 386 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:15,019 to rain. 387 00:13:15,404 --> 00:13:17,565 Avalanches are coming in from all sides of 388 00:13:17,565 --> 00:13:19,404 the highways and they're closing down this little 389 00:13:19,404 --> 00:13:21,164 town of Revelstoke and there's no way in 390 00:13:21,164 --> 00:13:23,245 or out. And they say like, this is 391 00:13:23,245 --> 00:13:25,324 our last weather opportunity. You can get in 392 00:13:25,324 --> 00:13:27,565 this helicopter and go right now. I was 393 00:13:27,565 --> 00:13:30,179 in a hospital gown. I had no, you 394 00:13:30,179 --> 00:13:32,419 know, no clothing on other than this hospital 395 00:13:32,419 --> 00:13:34,740 gown. I'm sitting on a bare bottom of 396 00:13:34,740 --> 00:13:36,579 a helicopter, not in the seat because my 397 00:13:36,579 --> 00:13:38,500 leg is extended because it's in an air 398 00:13:38,500 --> 00:13:41,139 cast and she's got her back to me 399 00:13:41,139 --> 00:13:42,740 and my back is to her so that 400 00:13:42,740 --> 00:13:45,014 she could support me because she's a nurse. 401 00:13:45,014 --> 00:13:47,174 They gave her the ability to actually inject 402 00:13:47,174 --> 00:13:48,075 me with Dilata 403 00:13:48,615 --> 00:13:49,835 as needed for pain. 404 00:13:50,214 --> 00:13:52,934 So we fly from Revelstoke to Kelowna. We 405 00:13:52,934 --> 00:13:55,174 get a private airplane that comes up from 406 00:13:55,174 --> 00:13:57,335 Telluride that will fly me to Aspen for 407 00:13:57,335 --> 00:13:57,835 surgery. 408 00:13:58,230 --> 00:14:00,870 I get to Aston at twelve midnight, and 409 00:14:00,870 --> 00:14:02,949 they perform surgery at one in the morning. 410 00:14:02,949 --> 00:14:04,949 And they did what's called a nail surgery 411 00:14:04,949 --> 00:14:07,190 where they insert a nail down my tibia, 412 00:14:07,190 --> 00:14:09,829 which was a compound tibia, fibula fracture where 413 00:14:09,829 --> 00:14:12,004 the where the bone had actually broken the 414 00:14:12,004 --> 00:14:14,085 skin. And that's why I felt like I'd 415 00:14:14,085 --> 00:14:16,725 lost my leg because it actually had penetrated 416 00:14:16,725 --> 00:14:18,085 the skin. There was a fair amount of 417 00:14:18,085 --> 00:14:20,325 blood in the boot and everything else. And 418 00:14:20,325 --> 00:14:21,384 they did that surgery. 419 00:14:21,924 --> 00:14:23,304 So I'll fast forward. 420 00:14:23,684 --> 00:14:25,710 We conceived the night before the accident. 421 00:14:26,269 --> 00:14:28,350 I was like, wow, this is the silver 422 00:14:28,350 --> 00:14:30,269 lining, a soul for a soul. If I 423 00:14:30,269 --> 00:14:32,269 can get anything out of this, what's that 424 00:14:32,269 --> 00:14:34,429 sign from the universe? And that's what we 425 00:14:34,429 --> 00:14:35,330 thought it was. 426 00:14:35,710 --> 00:14:36,929 Three months go by 427 00:14:37,230 --> 00:14:39,730 a difficult recovery and we lose that pregnancy. 428 00:14:40,235 --> 00:14:42,555 So I'm starting to hit some really deep 429 00:14:42,555 --> 00:14:45,215 depression. I'm also starting to get some really 430 00:14:45,355 --> 00:14:48,875 significant survivor guilt over the accident because why 431 00:14:48,875 --> 00:14:50,795 did Steve die? Why did I live? How 432 00:14:50,795 --> 00:14:52,315 did I make it through there? He had 433 00:14:52,315 --> 00:14:54,014 two children. I had no children, 434 00:14:54,339 --> 00:14:56,179 you know, all these things. And then we 435 00:14:56,179 --> 00:14:58,500 had this little argument before we ski just 436 00:14:58,500 --> 00:15:00,740 over something silly about turn shape. I make 437 00:15:00,740 --> 00:15:02,580 a big turn shape and I take up 438 00:15:02,580 --> 00:15:04,019 room and he was like, you're taking up 439 00:15:04,019 --> 00:15:05,700 too much room. You're not leaving me on 440 00:15:05,700 --> 00:15:07,299 track powder. And I said, okay, you go 441 00:15:07,299 --> 00:15:09,524 first. I'm so sorry. Like you go, I'll 442 00:15:09,524 --> 00:15:11,605 go second this time. And so he goes 443 00:15:11,605 --> 00:15:14,085 first and he gets killed. So I'm starting 444 00:15:14,085 --> 00:15:16,004 to think like all these things are, what 445 00:15:16,004 --> 00:15:17,605 if I had stayed home and did go 446 00:15:17,605 --> 00:15:19,605 to the beach instead of going on the 447 00:15:19,605 --> 00:15:21,524 strip, would that have been a different outcome? 448 00:15:21,524 --> 00:15:24,309 So I'm starting to really have these heavy 449 00:15:24,309 --> 00:15:25,850 survivor guilt emotions 450 00:15:26,230 --> 00:15:27,610 that are taking over. 451 00:15:27,910 --> 00:15:30,149 So again, fast forward further down the road, 452 00:15:30,149 --> 00:15:32,490 now we're, we get fourteen years 453 00:15:32,870 --> 00:15:35,750 away from this. And I still don't realize 454 00:15:35,750 --> 00:15:38,065 how much this is weighing on me. I'm 455 00:15:38,065 --> 00:15:40,704 now starting to develop a home for sale 456 00:15:40,704 --> 00:15:42,464 and in a market that I saw was 457 00:15:42,464 --> 00:15:45,264 improving, but started to stall and started to 458 00:15:45,264 --> 00:15:46,324 have some really 459 00:15:46,784 --> 00:15:49,424 heavy dark thoughts. You know, I had that. 460 00:15:49,424 --> 00:15:52,059 And then I also had a relationship with 461 00:15:52,059 --> 00:15:54,000 my father that wasn't really 462 00:15:54,539 --> 00:15:56,700 close. It wasn't that there was really any 463 00:15:56,700 --> 00:15:58,620 problems. It was just that we never had 464 00:15:58,620 --> 00:16:00,379 a relationship where we could talk to each 465 00:16:00,379 --> 00:16:01,899 other, where I could call him up on 466 00:16:01,899 --> 00:16:03,419 the phone and say, Hey, I'm struggling with 467 00:16:03,419 --> 00:16:05,205 this. Or can you help me with that? 468 00:16:05,205 --> 00:16:07,044 Or, or, or he would ask me what's 469 00:16:07,044 --> 00:16:08,804 going on in your life and how are 470 00:16:08,804 --> 00:16:09,705 you doing? And 471 00:16:10,245 --> 00:16:12,485 it just wasn't that relationship our entire lives. 472 00:16:12,485 --> 00:16:13,845 I left home when I was 18, I 473 00:16:13,845 --> 00:16:16,164 moved to Aspen. You know, she didn't approve 474 00:16:16,164 --> 00:16:18,570 and I just never had the ability to 475 00:16:18,570 --> 00:16:20,410 get to the bottom of what the issue 476 00:16:20,410 --> 00:16:22,410 was. So all these things are starting to 477 00:16:22,410 --> 00:16:25,050 compound. And my wife is like, you're not 478 00:16:25,050 --> 00:16:27,309 doing well. We need some type of intervention. 479 00:16:27,370 --> 00:16:28,269 We need something 480 00:16:28,730 --> 00:16:31,465 to help you move through these issues. And 481 00:16:31,465 --> 00:16:33,945 she had discovered the Hoffman process. A friend 482 00:16:33,945 --> 00:16:35,325 of hers had gone through it. 483 00:16:35,705 --> 00:16:37,865 She introduced that concept to me. And I 484 00:16:37,865 --> 00:16:39,465 was like, Hey, whatever I can do to 485 00:16:39,465 --> 00:16:42,345 help. Cause our relationship was struggling and my 486 00:16:42,345 --> 00:16:44,745 parenting was struggling and all these things. And 487 00:16:44,745 --> 00:16:46,740 I think what happened was the stress of 488 00:16:46,980 --> 00:16:49,879 this decision to build a home and to 489 00:16:50,019 --> 00:16:52,980 risk financially a lot by collateralizing a lot 490 00:16:52,980 --> 00:16:55,399 of the assets that we had to fail. 491 00:16:55,539 --> 00:16:58,339 It could be almost catastrophic financially. So all 492 00:16:58,339 --> 00:16:59,940 this started to weigh on me to the 493 00:16:59,940 --> 00:17:01,299 point where I was like, I have got 494 00:17:01,299 --> 00:17:03,995 to do something. And so Hoffman was what 495 00:17:03,995 --> 00:17:05,634 we decided and I just decided all of 496 00:17:05,634 --> 00:17:07,315 a sudden, look, I'm all in. I'm going 497 00:17:07,315 --> 00:17:09,355 to go into this thing with nothing but 498 00:17:09,355 --> 00:17:11,775 good intentions and go a 100%. 499 00:17:12,154 --> 00:17:15,079 I had realized that drinking was creating 500 00:17:15,380 --> 00:17:17,539 depression for me. I would drink one day 501 00:17:17,539 --> 00:17:19,480 later, I'd be fine. But two days later, 502 00:17:19,859 --> 00:17:21,940 I would be depressed. And I could almost 503 00:17:21,940 --> 00:17:24,419 identify how bad the depression was by what 504 00:17:24,419 --> 00:17:26,259 alcohol I was drinking. Baku was the worst. 505 00:17:26,259 --> 00:17:27,539 Then I went to tequila and it was 506 00:17:27,539 --> 00:17:29,654 like tequila is fine. And then it wasn't 507 00:17:29,654 --> 00:17:32,315 fine. And then beer wasn't fine. And finally 508 00:17:32,934 --> 00:17:33,674 I decided 509 00:17:33,975 --> 00:17:36,695 that alcohol wasn't serving my highest and best 510 00:17:36,695 --> 00:17:39,355 purpose and I quit cold turkey on my 511 00:17:39,654 --> 00:17:40,715 50 birthday. 512 00:17:41,255 --> 00:17:41,755 So 513 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:44,320 that was good. Cause going into Hoffman, I, 514 00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:45,460 I was not drinking, 515 00:17:46,079 --> 00:17:48,640 not imbibing in anything and went in there 516 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:50,400 with a clear head and said, okay, I 517 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:51,619 can do this without 518 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:54,559 any kind of crutch without any kind of, 519 00:17:54,559 --> 00:17:55,539 outside influence. 520 00:17:55,924 --> 00:17:58,164 So whatever I feel is is truly what 521 00:17:58,164 --> 00:17:59,525 I'm gonna feel. And I think that was 522 00:17:59,525 --> 00:18:02,005 really important for me to do that. Take 523 00:18:02,005 --> 00:18:03,544 us to Hoffman. 524 00:18:03,924 --> 00:18:04,744 You're there. 525 00:18:05,204 --> 00:18:07,125 Maybe even take us to a moment in 526 00:18:07,125 --> 00:18:09,625 time. What's happening in your week? 527 00:18:10,069 --> 00:18:11,829 I think it was the second day. I 528 00:18:11,829 --> 00:18:13,210 don't know if I've ever been 529 00:18:13,589 --> 00:18:15,690 sadder in my life where I realized 530 00:18:15,990 --> 00:18:19,130 that this relationship with my father was so 531 00:18:19,589 --> 00:18:22,410 poor that I just didn't have the ability 532 00:18:22,470 --> 00:18:24,575 to talk to him, you know, man to 533 00:18:24,575 --> 00:18:26,654 man and, and have this relationship. And it 534 00:18:26,654 --> 00:18:29,134 saddened me because he was now in the 535 00:18:29,134 --> 00:18:31,075 throes of dementia and Parkinson's. 536 00:18:31,695 --> 00:18:33,455 The writing was on the wall that I 537 00:18:33,455 --> 00:18:35,855 could never have that conversation with him. It 538 00:18:35,855 --> 00:18:36,595 had passed. 539 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:38,460 And so that realization 540 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:40,700 hit me like a ton of bricks. 541 00:18:41,159 --> 00:18:43,000 It was from that moment of like being 542 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:44,380 at the lowest of lows 543 00:18:44,759 --> 00:18:46,919 that I was able to build myself back 544 00:18:46,919 --> 00:18:48,539 up during that week. 545 00:18:48,839 --> 00:18:50,839 And, you know, I had a tremendous coach 546 00:18:50,839 --> 00:18:53,475 in Kevin. So we worked through that. You 547 00:18:53,475 --> 00:18:54,455 know, there were moments 548 00:18:54,835 --> 00:18:57,075 in the Hoffman where during that week where 549 00:18:57,075 --> 00:18:59,015 I was able to tap into 550 00:18:59,475 --> 00:19:00,615 my spirit self. 551 00:19:01,075 --> 00:19:03,394 I have a belief in the afterlife, and 552 00:19:03,394 --> 00:19:05,634 I think that it's been informed by certain 553 00:19:05,634 --> 00:19:08,150 things. And one of those things in that 554 00:19:08,150 --> 00:19:09,289 avalanche was 555 00:19:09,750 --> 00:19:11,930 when Steve's body was being taken out, 556 00:19:12,309 --> 00:19:14,490 you know, on a sled behind a guide, 557 00:19:14,710 --> 00:19:16,150 there was a person that came to visit 558 00:19:16,150 --> 00:19:17,750 me in the hospital that was one of 559 00:19:17,750 --> 00:19:19,884 the participants in the trip. And he was 560 00:19:19,884 --> 00:19:21,724 a good friend of mine from Telluride. And 561 00:19:21,724 --> 00:19:23,105 he comes to me and he says, 562 00:19:23,484 --> 00:19:25,085 he goes, Steve, I don't even know how 563 00:19:25,085 --> 00:19:26,365 to tell you this, but I'm just gonna 564 00:19:26,365 --> 00:19:27,884 tell you. And I don't know why the 565 00:19:27,884 --> 00:19:29,164 guide came to me, because this is the 566 00:19:29,164 --> 00:19:30,365 first time I've been on this trip. You 567 00:19:30,365 --> 00:19:31,484 know, you've been on this trip with all 568 00:19:31,484 --> 00:19:32,924 these other friends. You've been doing this for 569 00:19:32,924 --> 00:19:34,599 ten years, but he came to me and 570 00:19:34,599 --> 00:19:35,960 I'm coming to you to tell you this 571 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,359 story. The guide picked him out and he 572 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:38,859 said, 573 00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:40,839 I'm not a religious man. And I'm just 574 00:19:40,839 --> 00:19:42,519 gonna tell you what I saw. I've taken 575 00:19:42,519 --> 00:19:44,539 Steve's body out. I come around the tree 576 00:19:44,759 --> 00:19:46,440 and there he is. He's standing right in 577 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:48,144 front of me and he says, tell my 578 00:19:48,144 --> 00:19:49,205 girls I'm okay. 579 00:19:49,664 --> 00:19:51,765 So this is the ski guide 580 00:19:52,144 --> 00:19:54,244 that said he saw 581 00:19:54,785 --> 00:19:56,325 your partner, Steve, 582 00:19:56,945 --> 00:19:59,585 standing there. Well, the guide's not the stranger. 583 00:19:59,585 --> 00:20:01,285 The guide had skied with him before. 584 00:20:01,744 --> 00:20:03,799 He says to the guide, tell my girls 585 00:20:03,799 --> 00:20:05,640 I'm okay. So now the guy's got this 586 00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:07,720 story. He tells it to the new guy 587 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:09,640 on the trip. Yeah. Who comes to the 588 00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:11,660 hospital and tells me. I see. 589 00:20:12,279 --> 00:20:14,380 Tell my girls I'll be okay. 590 00:20:14,839 --> 00:20:15,339 Wow. 591 00:20:15,984 --> 00:20:19,365 So you're referencing that you believe in some 592 00:20:19,904 --> 00:20:23,524 higher power more than what is happening here. 593 00:20:23,825 --> 00:20:25,924 I definitely believe in a different dimension, 594 00:20:26,384 --> 00:20:28,164 100%, because other things 595 00:20:28,784 --> 00:20:29,524 have happened 596 00:20:29,904 --> 00:20:32,609 that I can explain to you that came 597 00:20:32,609 --> 00:20:33,429 out of Hoffman 598 00:20:33,730 --> 00:20:36,210 from the relationships that I made. And one 599 00:20:36,210 --> 00:20:37,190 of them was 600 00:20:37,730 --> 00:20:39,809 in that week, you can try and tap 601 00:20:39,809 --> 00:20:42,450 into your higher spiritual power. When there was 602 00:20:42,450 --> 00:20:44,869 this one event where I just got absolutely 603 00:20:45,009 --> 00:20:47,144 lit up, Like I've never been before. It 604 00:20:47,144 --> 00:20:49,964 was as close to seeing my higher power 605 00:20:50,184 --> 00:20:52,424 in real life, you know, with my eyes 606 00:20:52,424 --> 00:20:54,664 closed that I could, and I drew a 607 00:20:54,664 --> 00:20:56,664 mandala of it, you know, and I will 608 00:20:56,664 --> 00:20:58,519 send that to you. We'll put that in 609 00:20:58,519 --> 00:21:00,679 our show notes in case people wanna look 610 00:21:00,679 --> 00:21:03,319 at what you drew. So I kinda crossed 611 00:21:03,319 --> 00:21:04,759 over the plane just a little bit, and 612 00:21:04,759 --> 00:21:06,140 I go outside and there's 613 00:21:06,679 --> 00:21:08,519 I I'm just seeing things like I've never 614 00:21:08,519 --> 00:21:10,694 seen them before. They've clarity of which I 615 00:21:10,694 --> 00:21:12,535 was seeing the color and the trees and 616 00:21:12,535 --> 00:21:14,234 the, I go on this hike and I, 617 00:21:14,375 --> 00:21:16,394 I mean, it was just like mind blowing 618 00:21:16,775 --> 00:21:18,775 how visual and how in tune and how 619 00:21:18,775 --> 00:21:20,295 present I was. It was one of the 620 00:21:20,295 --> 00:21:23,009 greatest moments I've ever had. And then come 621 00:21:23,009 --> 00:21:25,250 back and, and go through this whole week 622 00:21:25,250 --> 00:21:26,789 long process and really, 623 00:21:27,650 --> 00:21:29,029 really feel like I've 624 00:21:29,490 --> 00:21:31,809 met my depression head on and I've been, 625 00:21:31,809 --> 00:21:33,109 taking antidepressants 626 00:21:33,410 --> 00:21:35,730 and trying several different types of medication. I 627 00:21:35,730 --> 00:21:37,410 could never stay on them, but the side 628 00:21:37,410 --> 00:21:39,214 effects were just overwhelming 629 00:21:39,755 --> 00:21:42,255 and I couldn't do it. To this day, 630 00:21:42,474 --> 00:21:44,795 those practices we did at Hoffman is what 631 00:21:44,795 --> 00:21:46,795 cured my depression. I've never been in the 632 00:21:46,795 --> 00:21:49,275 black hole since that trip. It's been 2019. 633 00:21:49,275 --> 00:21:51,480 So we're going on seven years. Wow. 634 00:21:52,019 --> 00:21:54,519 When you say the practices and tools, what 635 00:21:54,740 --> 00:21:57,299 stands the test of time all these years 636 00:21:57,299 --> 00:21:59,159 later after doing the process? 637 00:21:59,700 --> 00:22:02,019 There was a a moment in that process 638 00:22:02,019 --> 00:22:04,919 where I could visualize depression. I could actually 639 00:22:05,059 --> 00:22:07,625 identify it. There was a a specific 640 00:22:08,164 --> 00:22:10,325 tool that was given to me. I could 641 00:22:10,325 --> 00:22:12,424 see it. I drew a picture of it, 642 00:22:12,485 --> 00:22:15,045 and then I was able to overcome it. 643 00:22:15,045 --> 00:22:17,445 I mean, literally pulverized it into the ground. 644 00:22:17,445 --> 00:22:18,965 And then once it was done, it was 645 00:22:18,965 --> 00:22:20,119 over. Identifying 646 00:22:20,740 --> 00:22:24,180 the dark side and conjuring an image and 647 00:22:24,180 --> 00:22:26,900 then engaging in expressive work, it's a huge 648 00:22:26,900 --> 00:22:27,880 piece of the process. 649 00:22:28,259 --> 00:22:30,680 Have you been able to go back 650 00:22:31,299 --> 00:22:33,559 and tell Steve's daughters 651 00:22:34,660 --> 00:22:35,160 that 652 00:22:35,484 --> 00:22:36,304 he's okay? 653 00:22:36,924 --> 00:22:39,664 You know, I haven't. I'm writing a memoir. 654 00:22:39,964 --> 00:22:41,964 And in that memoir, I hope to share 655 00:22:41,964 --> 00:22:42,704 with them. 656 00:22:43,005 --> 00:22:43,984 How are his 657 00:22:44,524 --> 00:22:47,744 wife and his kids doing? Well, he's divorced. 658 00:22:47,964 --> 00:22:50,119 He had a girlfriend at the time. His 659 00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:52,360 kids are now probably in their thirties. One 660 00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:54,279 of them has a child. The other one 661 00:22:54,279 --> 00:22:55,799 just got married. So we were at both 662 00:22:55,799 --> 00:22:58,360 weddings and had chances to visit with them 663 00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:01,240 and the grandchild. And so we're still close. 664 00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:02,840 They don't live in Telluride, but when they 665 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,394 come visit, we often get together. So that's 666 00:23:05,394 --> 00:23:07,795 great. Tell us a little bit about what 667 00:23:07,795 --> 00:23:11,335 motivated you to sort of take the intensity 668 00:23:11,474 --> 00:23:12,454 of that memory, 669 00:23:13,075 --> 00:23:15,974 your Hoffman experience, and fishing, 670 00:23:16,434 --> 00:23:18,180 and write a memoir. 671 00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:22,019 I wanted to take a metaphorical journey about 672 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:25,200 fly fishing stories of fish that I've caught 673 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:26,799 in my lifetime ever since I was a 674 00:23:26,799 --> 00:23:28,820 little boy, big fish that I've lost. 675 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,019 Really incredible stories. One of them in Mexico 676 00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:34,134 with a, with a guy that I met 677 00:23:34,134 --> 00:23:36,375 that got tied into a blue marlin in, 678 00:23:36,375 --> 00:23:38,475 in a 16 foot aluminum panga, 679 00:23:38,855 --> 00:23:40,215 you know, that took us out into the 680 00:23:40,215 --> 00:23:43,174 ocean. I've been in, in New Zealand and, 681 00:23:43,174 --> 00:23:45,494 and tied into like the biggest brown trout 682 00:23:45,494 --> 00:23:48,380 I've ever seen. And these fish that I've 683 00:23:48,380 --> 00:23:51,099 encountered with, it's just kind of this connection 684 00:23:51,099 --> 00:23:51,599 that 685 00:23:51,900 --> 00:23:53,920 is oddly similar to 686 00:23:54,380 --> 00:23:57,259 this fleeting moment of hanging onto something and 687 00:23:57,259 --> 00:23:59,740 then losing it. So I just wrote this 688 00:23:59,740 --> 00:24:00,880 story that intertwines 689 00:24:01,500 --> 00:24:04,305 not only Steve, but I basically have lost 690 00:24:04,305 --> 00:24:06,565 five of my closest friends in my lifetime. 691 00:24:07,105 --> 00:24:09,445 Five? You've lost five friends? 692 00:24:09,825 --> 00:24:12,085 Yeah. Five friends in five miscarriages. 693 00:24:12,785 --> 00:24:16,244 Five of your close friends have died, including 694 00:24:16,305 --> 00:24:17,445 Steve in the avalanche, 695 00:24:17,929 --> 00:24:19,690 and you and your wife have had five 696 00:24:19,690 --> 00:24:20,190 miscarriages. 697 00:24:20,809 --> 00:24:22,829 Yeah. And now we have two daughters. 698 00:24:23,130 --> 00:24:26,089 So with those 10 losses, plus it sounds 699 00:24:26,089 --> 00:24:28,650 like you wove in lots of fish that 700 00:24:28,650 --> 00:24:31,609 you lost off the line. I imagine there's 701 00:24:31,609 --> 00:24:32,509 a some 702 00:24:33,075 --> 00:24:34,454 felt sense of loss. 703 00:24:34,755 --> 00:24:36,994 Yeah. It's this connection. It's the loss of 704 00:24:36,994 --> 00:24:38,914 the connection, or you just wanted to see 705 00:24:38,914 --> 00:24:40,835 something so desperately and hold it in your 706 00:24:40,835 --> 00:24:42,835 hand for a second. I release everything I 707 00:24:42,835 --> 00:24:44,755 catch. So it's not like I'm gonna eat 708 00:24:44,755 --> 00:24:46,740 it. It's just that moment of like, oh 709 00:24:46,740 --> 00:24:48,580 my gosh, like I've just been connected to 710 00:24:48,580 --> 00:24:51,059 the most beautiful thing in nature. Well, how 711 00:24:51,059 --> 00:24:53,480 do you make sense of that? Those losses 712 00:24:53,620 --> 00:24:54,840 and navigating, 713 00:24:55,539 --> 00:24:58,440 moving on from them, making sense of them. 714 00:24:58,615 --> 00:25:00,875 That's the journey of how do you overcome 715 00:25:01,015 --> 00:25:01,515 this? 716 00:25:01,894 --> 00:25:04,534 It's really missing these people so much and 717 00:25:04,534 --> 00:25:06,774 not having the conversation and the laughter and 718 00:25:06,774 --> 00:25:08,615 the times that we got to enjoy together. 719 00:25:08,615 --> 00:25:10,214 So a lot of it is just memory. 720 00:25:10,214 --> 00:25:12,054 A lot of it is I visit with 721 00:25:12,054 --> 00:25:14,279 them. I have this place that I hike 722 00:25:14,279 --> 00:25:17,240 to locally and there's this little meadow that 723 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,339 I go when I sit and I chat. 724 00:25:19,799 --> 00:25:22,200 You commune with them, if you will. You 725 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:23,259 live near Telluride? 726 00:25:23,559 --> 00:25:25,240 Yeah. I live in the town of Telluride 727 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:26,679 and I have a great hike right out 728 00:25:26,679 --> 00:25:28,519 my back door called the Judd Movie Trail. 729 00:25:28,519 --> 00:25:30,224 And there's this place on the Judd Movie 730 00:25:30,224 --> 00:25:32,384 that I go and I sit or every 731 00:25:32,384 --> 00:25:34,545 time I pass it, I say, hello. I 732 00:25:34,545 --> 00:25:36,164 just keep them in my heart. 733 00:25:36,785 --> 00:25:38,545 It was so intense. There was so much 734 00:25:38,545 --> 00:25:39,845 to work through in a week. 735 00:25:40,464 --> 00:25:41,984 I mean, I came out of that floating 736 00:25:41,984 --> 00:25:44,359 on air. It was really incredible. And my 737 00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:46,359 kids saw it immediately. They were young, you 738 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:47,880 know, and they're like, dad, you've lost your 739 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:50,200 stress face. And so they could really tell 740 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,279 it. When I learned so much about modeling, 741 00:25:52,279 --> 00:25:54,039 I was like, oh my gosh, this tension, 742 00:25:54,039 --> 00:25:56,599 this anxiety, this depression, I'm passing this on 743 00:25:56,599 --> 00:25:58,414 on my kids. I can't do that. They 744 00:25:58,414 --> 00:26:01,534 were in those impressionable years of seven, eight, 745 00:26:01,534 --> 00:26:03,375 nine years old. And I knew that I 746 00:26:03,375 --> 00:26:05,454 just couldn't do it anymore. Like that was 747 00:26:05,454 --> 00:26:08,015 just such a bad parenting thing for them 748 00:26:08,015 --> 00:26:10,174 to see that the relationship I have with 749 00:26:10,174 --> 00:26:12,194 my girls now is just remarkable. 750 00:26:12,849 --> 00:26:15,409 It's remarkable. I'm so blessed. And I truly 751 00:26:15,409 --> 00:26:17,009 put so much of that on the ability 752 00:26:17,009 --> 00:26:18,309 to work through those things. 753 00:26:18,690 --> 00:26:19,829 Had you previously 754 00:26:20,369 --> 00:26:21,909 been one to 755 00:26:22,369 --> 00:26:23,669 express your feelings, 756 00:26:23,970 --> 00:26:26,869 name your feelings, work through your feelings? 757 00:26:27,505 --> 00:26:31,184 No. I've internalized them, held onto them. They 758 00:26:31,184 --> 00:26:32,785 would build up and build up and build 759 00:26:32,785 --> 00:26:35,044 up and then either have blowups, 760 00:26:35,744 --> 00:26:36,884 that type of thing. 761 00:26:37,744 --> 00:26:39,859 Very rarely does that happen anymore. 762 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,319 The ability just to talk through things and 763 00:26:42,319 --> 00:26:44,880 to look at myself and to label things 764 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:46,400 and say, okay, I'm doing this, I'm doing 765 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:48,319 that. I gotta work on it and improve. 766 00:26:48,319 --> 00:26:50,079 So those are really things that I was 767 00:26:50,079 --> 00:26:52,259 able to improve upon personally. 768 00:26:53,039 --> 00:26:53,474 Not 769 00:26:53,875 --> 00:26:56,454 expressing feelings, pushing them away 770 00:26:56,755 --> 00:26:59,494 doesn't really make it better, does it? No. 771 00:26:59,634 --> 00:27:00,454 Not at all. 772 00:27:00,835 --> 00:27:03,714 Identify it and confront it and move through 773 00:27:03,714 --> 00:27:04,214 it. 774 00:27:04,595 --> 00:27:06,914 You know, that's another tool that I've I've 775 00:27:06,914 --> 00:27:07,815 been able to 776 00:27:08,140 --> 00:27:08,880 help utilize. 777 00:27:09,900 --> 00:27:10,480 I don't 778 00:27:10,779 --> 00:27:12,460 journal the way I did. I journaled for 779 00:27:12,460 --> 00:27:13,819 a long time. You know, I did my 780 00:27:13,819 --> 00:27:16,700 projects for close to a year. I still 781 00:27:16,700 --> 00:27:19,019 do them mentally, but now writing the memoir, 782 00:27:19,019 --> 00:27:20,539 a lot of that kind of comes back. 783 00:27:20,539 --> 00:27:22,539 It somewhat takes the place of that to 784 00:27:22,539 --> 00:27:23,279 some degree. 785 00:27:23,674 --> 00:27:25,214 What's it been like to put 786 00:27:25,994 --> 00:27:29,275 pen to paper and put words to so 787 00:27:29,275 --> 00:27:31,275 much of what's happened to you? How has 788 00:27:31,275 --> 00:27:34,154 that experience been? It's been cathartic. It's been 789 00:27:34,154 --> 00:27:36,234 great. It's been hard. I can write about 790 00:27:36,234 --> 00:27:38,869 fishing a lot more easily than I can. 791 00:27:39,909 --> 00:27:40,409 You 792 00:27:40,950 --> 00:27:42,569 know, vulnerable stuff like 793 00:27:42,869 --> 00:27:44,710 issues that I had with my first wife, 794 00:27:44,710 --> 00:27:47,509 for instance, or, you know, issues that I, 795 00:27:47,509 --> 00:27:48,250 I had 796 00:27:48,789 --> 00:27:51,595 confronting my depression and things like that. You 797 00:27:51,595 --> 00:27:53,434 know, it's just vulnerable. You know, I'm writing 798 00:27:53,434 --> 00:27:55,115 this and, you know, my clients are gonna 799 00:27:55,115 --> 00:27:56,795 read this and people that I've been working 800 00:27:56,795 --> 00:27:58,795 with and, are gonna go, oh, gosh, you 801 00:27:58,795 --> 00:28:01,035 know that about you or whatever. But at 802 00:28:01,035 --> 00:28:02,955 this point, I think it's important for my 803 00:28:02,955 --> 00:28:03,455 kids. 804 00:28:03,914 --> 00:28:05,375 What do you hope your 805 00:28:05,674 --> 00:28:07,569 kids take from 806 00:28:08,269 --> 00:28:08,769 reading 807 00:28:09,630 --> 00:28:12,930 what has happened, the stories you've written about? 808 00:28:13,069 --> 00:28:15,470 What's the possible takeaway that they might get 809 00:28:15,470 --> 00:28:16,210 from it? 810 00:28:16,509 --> 00:28:18,269 That I hope that they see that their 811 00:28:18,269 --> 00:28:21,765 dad's vulnerable, that he's being authentic, that he's 812 00:28:21,765 --> 00:28:23,684 had a lot of difficulty in his life, 813 00:28:23,684 --> 00:28:25,605 but he's got back up and he's been 814 00:28:25,605 --> 00:28:26,105 resilient. 815 00:28:26,484 --> 00:28:28,325 He's marched forward in, in the face of 816 00:28:28,325 --> 00:28:29,924 a lot of loss and still has a 817 00:28:29,924 --> 00:28:32,164 lot of joy. He's kind of trying to 818 00:28:32,164 --> 00:28:34,325 put his right foot forward all the time 819 00:28:34,325 --> 00:28:35,700 and lead a good life. 820 00:28:36,099 --> 00:28:37,460 I think we do that as a family. 821 00:28:37,460 --> 00:28:40,740 I think our relationship with nature is wonderful. 822 00:28:40,740 --> 00:28:43,220 Like my kids love being outdoors. They love 823 00:28:43,220 --> 00:28:44,899 to ski with me and my wife. They 824 00:28:44,899 --> 00:28:47,139 love to fish. They love to hike. So 825 00:28:47,139 --> 00:28:50,054 we have this really wonderful connection with nature 826 00:28:50,275 --> 00:28:51,954 and they see that and they feel that 827 00:28:51,954 --> 00:28:52,934 and they realize 828 00:28:53,474 --> 00:28:55,554 how blessed they are to have this kind 829 00:28:55,554 --> 00:28:56,454 of life. 830 00:28:57,075 --> 00:28:59,234 They've done some travel. My oldest is now 831 00:28:59,234 --> 00:29:01,474 in a curated gap year. She's currently in 832 00:29:01,474 --> 00:29:02,759 Africa and 833 00:29:03,140 --> 00:29:04,440 she just continually 834 00:29:05,140 --> 00:29:06,900 come back and say how grateful she is 835 00:29:06,900 --> 00:29:08,740 for the way she was raised and what 836 00:29:08,740 --> 00:29:11,079 she's seen and and how she can incorporate 837 00:29:11,140 --> 00:29:12,359 that into her life. 838 00:29:12,660 --> 00:29:14,684 How does the book end? I'll tell you 839 00:29:14,684 --> 00:29:16,924 one story. So one of the friends that 840 00:29:16,924 --> 00:29:17,904 I met at Hoffman 841 00:29:18,284 --> 00:29:19,744 introduced me to an intuitive. 842 00:29:20,125 --> 00:29:21,825 How would you describe an intuitive? 843 00:29:22,444 --> 00:29:24,765 Someone who can connect you with the different 844 00:29:24,765 --> 00:29:25,265 dimension. 845 00:29:25,644 --> 00:29:27,609 And it was just this random thing where 846 00:29:27,609 --> 00:29:29,289 he said, I had this appointment and I 847 00:29:29,289 --> 00:29:30,490 can't make it. Do you want it? And 848 00:29:30,490 --> 00:29:32,730 I said, Yeah, absolutely. Because I, I wanna 849 00:29:32,730 --> 00:29:34,169 be able to see if I can connect 850 00:29:34,169 --> 00:29:35,470 with Steve, my partner. 851 00:29:35,929 --> 00:29:37,149 Because I had to resolve, 852 00:29:37,609 --> 00:29:39,230 was that survivor guilt? 853 00:29:39,775 --> 00:29:42,015 Was there truth in my feeling of like, 854 00:29:42,015 --> 00:29:44,035 Hey, I didn't go first. You did. 855 00:29:44,575 --> 00:29:46,494 What if I went first? This would be 856 00:29:46,494 --> 00:29:47,474 a different outcome. 857 00:29:48,095 --> 00:29:49,775 And I wanted to find out if that 858 00:29:49,775 --> 00:29:51,875 had anything to do with the accident. 859 00:29:52,589 --> 00:29:54,589 So she was amazing. And she opens up 860 00:29:54,589 --> 00:29:56,829 this channel and we have this conversation and 861 00:29:56,829 --> 00:29:58,369 he's like, absolutely not. 862 00:29:59,150 --> 00:30:00,990 And she was able to tell me what 863 00:30:00,990 --> 00:30:03,230 he's doing in the afterlife, which is this 864 00:30:03,230 --> 00:30:03,730 incredible 865 00:30:04,365 --> 00:30:06,765 building of community and tearing it down and 866 00:30:06,765 --> 00:30:09,964 having these meetings with these incredible souls. You 867 00:30:09,964 --> 00:30:11,565 know what I've done? I mean, it was 868 00:30:11,565 --> 00:30:12,625 really wild stuff. 869 00:30:13,244 --> 00:30:15,744 I'm asking questions and he's answering them. 870 00:30:16,525 --> 00:30:18,765 He's like, don't feel guilty. It had nothing 871 00:30:18,765 --> 00:30:19,740 to do with you. 872 00:30:20,220 --> 00:30:22,700 Zero. And I'm actually upset at you for 873 00:30:22,700 --> 00:30:24,299 feeling this way for this long. You've been 874 00:30:24,299 --> 00:30:26,059 wasting all this time and all this energy 875 00:30:26,059 --> 00:30:27,579 on that that had nothing to do with 876 00:30:27,579 --> 00:30:28,079 it. 877 00:30:28,619 --> 00:30:30,319 And so it was his journey. 878 00:30:30,859 --> 00:30:33,179 So the the next thing I ask her 879 00:30:33,179 --> 00:30:33,679 is 880 00:30:34,325 --> 00:30:36,724 I say, okay, well, I'm, I'm through that. 881 00:30:36,724 --> 00:30:38,984 But I felt oddly protected 882 00:30:39,845 --> 00:30:42,244 during this avalanche. I'm going down. I think 883 00:30:42,244 --> 00:30:44,005 I'm gonna die. I don't die. And then 884 00:30:44,005 --> 00:30:45,765 I feel like I'm protected. And I'm like, 885 00:30:45,765 --> 00:30:48,404 was that God protecting me? And she says, 886 00:30:48,404 --> 00:30:49,559 no, it was your angels. 887 00:30:50,519 --> 00:30:51,880 And, you know, I started to get all 888 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:53,400 choked up. And I was like, well, who 889 00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:54,299 were my angels? 890 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:56,360 And she said, well, it was your great 891 00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:58,759 grandfather who you never met who died in 892 00:30:58,759 --> 00:31:01,100 a car accident when my father was eight. 893 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,220 And then she says your two unborn daughters. 894 00:31:05,154 --> 00:31:07,095 What was that like to hear that? 895 00:31:08,275 --> 00:31:09,075 You know, I, it, 896 00:31:10,914 --> 00:31:12,595 you know, to this day, it just makes 897 00:31:12,595 --> 00:31:13,095 me 898 00:31:14,115 --> 00:31:15,414 just feel so grateful. 899 00:31:16,674 --> 00:31:18,694 Sorry to get emotional about it. 900 00:31:20,090 --> 00:31:22,170 All the loss that we had, the five 901 00:31:22,170 --> 00:31:22,670 miscarriages, 902 00:31:23,609 --> 00:31:25,289 it all started to make sense. It was 903 00:31:25,289 --> 00:31:27,690 like, okay. Those were just these little journeys 904 00:31:27,690 --> 00:31:30,330 that those children were on that they were 905 00:31:30,330 --> 00:31:32,410 only supposed to be on that journey for 906 00:31:32,410 --> 00:31:34,269 this really short period of time. 907 00:31:34,785 --> 00:31:35,684 But that wasn't 908 00:31:36,065 --> 00:31:38,065 the journey that they were supposed to fulfill 909 00:31:38,065 --> 00:31:38,965 in this lifetime. 910 00:31:39,505 --> 00:31:41,825 And that the two girls that we have, 911 00:31:41,825 --> 00:31:43,424 they were the ones that we were supposed 912 00:31:43,424 --> 00:31:44,085 to have. 913 00:31:44,465 --> 00:31:46,484 I truly believe they chose us. 914 00:31:46,865 --> 00:31:49,744 When you're ready and we're ready, we're gonna 915 00:31:49,744 --> 00:31:50,244 come. 916 00:31:51,019 --> 00:31:52,319 Both those births were 917 00:31:52,779 --> 00:31:53,440 at home 918 00:31:53,740 --> 00:31:54,880 in a birth tub, 919 00:31:55,500 --> 00:31:57,039 and my wife delivered 920 00:31:57,500 --> 00:31:59,339 naturally. And I was in the tub with 921 00:31:59,339 --> 00:31:59,839 her 922 00:32:00,299 --> 00:32:02,299 and two of the most beautiful experiences of 923 00:32:02,299 --> 00:32:04,154 our lives. So we have 924 00:32:04,535 --> 00:32:05,595 all this loss, 925 00:32:06,295 --> 00:32:07,994 and yet we have this incredible 926 00:32:08,694 --> 00:32:09,194 gain. 927 00:32:09,654 --> 00:32:10,634 It's just remarkable. 928 00:32:11,734 --> 00:32:13,115 That's beautiful, Steve. 929 00:32:13,654 --> 00:32:15,194 The gain, the loss, 930 00:32:16,150 --> 00:32:16,890 the progression. 931 00:32:18,309 --> 00:32:19,529 What's it like to 932 00:32:19,990 --> 00:32:20,490 reflect 933 00:32:21,430 --> 00:32:24,309 on the book, on your life, on these 934 00:32:24,309 --> 00:32:24,809 losses, 935 00:32:25,269 --> 00:32:25,769 on 936 00:32:26,549 --> 00:32:29,430 these two beautiful beings? The whole thing, what's 937 00:32:29,430 --> 00:32:31,944 it like to talk about it here? It's 938 00:32:31,944 --> 00:32:34,825 this immense gratitude every day. How did I 939 00:32:34,825 --> 00:32:36,825 live this life? This you know, I wanted 940 00:32:36,825 --> 00:32:38,265 to be a skier as a young kid, 941 00:32:38,265 --> 00:32:40,045 and I live in this town, and I 942 00:32:40,265 --> 00:32:41,865 live across from the ski area, and I 943 00:32:41,865 --> 00:32:43,565 can go up on any day and 944 00:32:44,049 --> 00:32:46,210 and ski and be in nature and enjoy 945 00:32:46,210 --> 00:32:48,450 that and and get this just like soul 946 00:32:48,450 --> 00:32:48,950 fulfilling 947 00:32:49,890 --> 00:32:52,130 wonder in my heart from being outside and 948 00:32:52,130 --> 00:32:54,529 its incredible beauty of this place we live 949 00:32:54,529 --> 00:32:57,250 in. I'm just so grateful. I can go 950 00:32:57,250 --> 00:32:59,170 back and connect these dots and they all 951 00:32:59,170 --> 00:32:59,865 line up. 952 00:33:00,505 --> 00:33:01,944 You know, and I still have my challenges 953 00:33:01,944 --> 00:33:03,464 and I still have my problems and I 954 00:33:03,464 --> 00:33:04,744 still have the things that I have to 955 00:33:04,744 --> 00:33:06,984 work through on a daily basis and the 956 00:33:06,984 --> 00:33:09,164 petty shit that we all deal with. But 957 00:33:09,545 --> 00:33:11,704 when I can just separate myself from that 958 00:33:11,704 --> 00:33:13,289 and say, stop, you know, just look at 959 00:33:13,289 --> 00:33:15,130 what you have in these beautiful girls and 960 00:33:15,130 --> 00:33:17,710 my wonderful wife, you just have this gratitude. 961 00:33:18,730 --> 00:33:19,710 And it's really 962 00:33:20,169 --> 00:33:22,029 what keeps me going 963 00:33:22,490 --> 00:33:24,649 when all the little shit becomes a little 964 00:33:24,649 --> 00:33:26,575 overwhelming. I just go back to that and 965 00:33:26,575 --> 00:33:28,575 I just go back to my gratitude practice 966 00:33:28,575 --> 00:33:30,654 and say, okay, the rest of it's bullshit. 967 00:33:30,654 --> 00:33:33,375 Doesn't mean anything. It just keep stacking the 968 00:33:33,375 --> 00:33:33,875 gratitude. 969 00:33:34,255 --> 00:33:36,255 And that's just, you know, the way I 970 00:33:36,255 --> 00:33:37,934 like to lead my life and it's been 971 00:33:37,934 --> 00:33:41,140 remarkable. So I'm, I'm truly, truly blessed But 972 00:33:41,140 --> 00:33:42,759 to all the things that have happened, 973 00:33:43,220 --> 00:33:45,779 I'm just feel like I'm the luckiest man 974 00:33:45,779 --> 00:33:46,440 in the world. 975 00:33:47,059 --> 00:33:49,079 For that luck and for 976 00:33:49,779 --> 00:33:50,279 your 977 00:33:51,140 --> 00:33:52,679 stacking of the gratitude, 978 00:33:52,980 --> 00:33:54,119 I love that, Steve. 979 00:33:54,535 --> 00:33:57,275 Thanks very much for this conversation. I'm grateful 980 00:33:57,575 --> 00:33:58,555 for your sharing. 981 00:33:59,174 --> 00:34:01,575 Thank you, Drew. I appreciate you pulling that 982 00:34:01,575 --> 00:34:03,174 out of me. It's hard. Like, there's a 983 00:34:03,174 --> 00:34:05,734 lot of emotions still. I would bet there 984 00:34:05,734 --> 00:34:07,115 are so many emotions. 985 00:34:07,450 --> 00:34:08,989 And I'm grateful for your parents. 986 00:34:09,289 --> 00:34:09,690 They're, 987 00:34:10,170 --> 00:34:11,230 wonderful people. 988 00:34:11,610 --> 00:34:13,309 They were a big part of my career. 989 00:34:13,530 --> 00:34:15,210 I have a lot of gratitude for them, 990 00:34:15,210 --> 00:34:17,610 and I loved your parents. You know, they 991 00:34:17,610 --> 00:34:20,809 were really, really special to me. It's the 992 00:34:20,809 --> 00:34:22,829 funny part of our story that 993 00:34:23,264 --> 00:34:27,204 I've known about you, Steve, for decades, literally 994 00:34:27,264 --> 00:34:30,964 decades. You're friends with my parents. And then 995 00:34:31,344 --> 00:34:32,404 two months ago, 996 00:34:32,864 --> 00:34:35,284 somehow you and my mom were talking, and 997 00:34:35,589 --> 00:34:37,670 you found out I was a Hoffman process 998 00:34:37,670 --> 00:34:39,909 teacher. She found out you had done the 999 00:34:39,909 --> 00:34:40,409 process 1000 00:34:40,869 --> 00:34:42,389 and that you were writing a book about 1001 00:34:42,389 --> 00:34:43,369 it. Amazing. 1002 00:34:44,069 --> 00:34:46,789 Isn't it? My again, just the dots in 1003 00:34:46,789 --> 00:34:48,170 life. Such synchronicity, 1004 00:34:49,324 --> 00:34:49,824 Absolutely. 1005 00:34:50,204 --> 00:34:51,984 I also call it synchro destiny. 1006 00:34:52,364 --> 00:34:54,605 The people who you meet that you didn't 1007 00:34:54,605 --> 00:34:56,924 know at the time how important they might 1008 00:34:56,924 --> 00:34:58,924 be in your life. All these little moments 1009 00:34:58,924 --> 00:35:01,264 that come together, they can be life changing. 1010 00:35:01,644 --> 00:35:02,144 Beautiful. 1011 00:35:02,684 --> 00:35:05,109 Well, thank you, Steve. It's an honor. The 1012 00:35:05,109 --> 00:35:08,730 Hoffman process changed my life. I'm eternally grateful, 1013 00:35:09,109 --> 00:35:11,289 and I can recommend it to more people. 1014 00:35:11,429 --> 00:35:12,089 Thank you. 1015 00:35:22,695 --> 00:35:24,795 Thank you for listening to the Hoffman podcast. 1016 00:35:25,175 --> 00:35:27,335 My name is Matt Brannigan. I'm the CEO 1017 00:35:27,335 --> 00:35:30,215 of the Hoffman Institute Foundation and a Hoffman 1018 00:35:30,215 --> 00:35:32,980 teacher. Our mission is to provide greater access 1019 00:35:32,980 --> 00:35:35,380 to the wisdom and power of love within 1020 00:35:35,380 --> 00:35:37,079 ourselves, in our relationships, 1021 00:35:37,539 --> 00:35:39,940 and in the world. To learn more or 1022 00:35:39,940 --> 00:35:42,019 to support our mission, we invite you to 1023 00:35:42,019 --> 00:35:43,335 visit hoffman institute