And now, the Street Photography Magazine podcast with
your host, Bob Patterson.
Hey, guys. Welcome back.
It's
Bob Patterson at Street Photography Magazine. I'm the
publisher,
and
our guest today is an upcoming
featured photographer
in, the magazine.
He's already published one article with us,
and he's,
got another one in the works
that we'll publish after his feature.
And his name is, JM Simpson or John
Simpson.
John has he's an interesting guy, and and
I think you're gonna understand that as we
get into it. He's he's a retired history
professor,
also a former military, and he is he
was a embedded photographer
in Iraq and Afghanistan multiple
times,
during the hot wars over there.
And I hope I hope that was the
right term. You know?
But, anyway,
and he's doing some really
deep and interesting work among the homeless in
his area of Olympia, Washington. We're gonna talk
about all those things. So, John, welcome. Thanks
for being with us today.
Well, thank you very much for the invitation,
Bob. It is a pleasure to be here
and to meet you.
Same here. Same here. You know, when I
saw your work and your
style, I knew this this is a person
we need
to get on the show and to be
in the magazine because I know others can
learn a lot from you.
Thank you.
So,
alright.
I guess before we get deep into the
photography stuff, why don't you just give us
a little of your background, how you
became a actually, a photojournalist.
And,
just tell your story.
Okay. Well,
I started this journey and my journey in
photojournalism
by reading the newspaper
And one day, I was looking at some
of the photographs in the paper, and I
thought to myself,
I can do a better job.
And mind you, this was
about 40 years ago.
And this is a man who had,
the only camera experience I had was with
a Brownie
and a Kodak Instamatic.
And so I set myself the task of
learning everything I could about how cameras worked,
how film worked, how developing worked.
And,
about 9 months later, I had a Nikon
fm2 with a 50 millimeter lens.
I liked new PAM 400.
I had a way of developing,
and I walked into a
a small
weekly
newspaper's
office,
asked the editor for an assignment.
I got one assignment, and I've never looked
back.
Here we are today.
Yeah. Started.
Yeah. That's
a very
interesting,
interesting way to get started. What would have
happened if you didn't get the assignment?
I would have gone back a second or
third time because I've noticed throughout life that
persistence does pay off, and I would have
just kept going back and asking
again for an opportunity. And that's all I
ask. That's all I need.
And once I have it, I will run
with it.
You don't ask? You don't get. Yeah. That's
right. And if they say no, then ask
why?
Tell me why. But be persistent. Be polite,
Which, by the way, is a very,
smart way to work with homeless individuals.
Be polite
when talking with them. Respect them.
I think that applies to every person you
deal with. Absolutely.
And we don't have
very much of it
in these days.
Unfortunately,
you are correct.
But that can change.
Alright. Well, let's,
let's back up a little bit. So you
you were embedded
in,
well, 2 different wars or
say more in 2 different places. I don't
know how you look at it. But how
did that happen? How does it how does
a
a history professor
wind up on the ground
with them Afghanistan and Iraq. Afghanistan and Iraq.
How how did that happen?
Well,
I,
that weekly newspaper that I referenced a moment
ago
covers Joint Base Lewis McChord.
And,
I, as a photojournalist,
when I photograph and when I wrote stories,
I did what the soldiers were doing. I
am very physically fit.
I have had a fair amount of experience
in the military.
So working with the army, working with the
soldiers was not a big or hard job.
And, one day, I was standing. It was
about
5 o'clock in the morning
with a group of soldiers, and they were
preparing to do a, a physical challenge
that involved things like, you know, wading through
water, crawling through mud, and carrying telephone poles.
I was part of that group, but I
was also photographing
as we worked.
Anyway, 2 hours and 46 minutes later,
we complete the course,
and the commander of that particular brigade looked
at me and said, I would like you
to embed with my brigade when we go
to
Mosul, Baghdad.
And that was in 2,005.
Wow.
I spent 2 months in Mosul
covering the war. I thought
this is this has been my I've I've
done a good job. I was glad to
have done this to tell the story through
photos and writing about our soldiers.
I thought that was it. Well, it wasn't.
It was the first of
5 embedments to Iraq and 3 to Afghanistan.
And, And you were correct earlier. Both were
hot wars.
Both were hot wars.
So
were you ever
in in danger for your own life? Were
you in situations where you're being fired on?
Yes.
That was more often than not. I, like
I say, I
I believe that if you're going if I
was going to work with these young men
and women,
that I should face
the same situations that they did.
And so being outside The Wire,
numerous occasions,
on many of those occasions, we did come
under fire.
How much
control
do embedded photographers or journalists have over
what they photograph or what they report?
Is it because they've given you this opportunity,
they're gonna point you in a direction to
do this or that, or is it completely
up to you?
I don't know what it was like for
other journalists and photojournalists.
For me,
I knew the brigade.
I knew the command.
I knew the process before embedding.
So when I was embedded
Mhmm. I had a pretty much free
hand
in covering what I wanted to cover. At
no point was I censored. At no point
was I directed or steered.
I had a like I say, I was,
in many ways, I was trusted.
And I think developing that bond of trust
with your host, in this case, the brigade,
was important to the success I had.
Where did that work go? Was that did
they did the army
or did the army use it for anything,
or was it No. Just yours? This? No.
This that small newspaper I referenced earlier. Okay.
Yeah. It but it that paper is the
Ranger Newspaper.
It is a privately owned weekly newspaper that's
been in business for almost 70 years.
And the paper has a readership of about
30,000,
and it's in the Pacific Northwest.
So it was I, that
was it's the images are still mine, and
they ran them. So and the stories. Wow.
Yeah. It's
Deranger, did they primarily cover
Joint base Muslim corps. Days. Okay. And the
reserve community, the active duty community, the guard
community. Correct.
The I I don't know if you've heard
many of our podcasts or well, you you
said you've listened to quite a few.
Sometimes I talk about my grandfather, my my
mother's father, who was a newspaper man in
Indiana.
So so you say you're you're from Indiana?
Yep.
And, he was he was the publisher of
the Kokomo Tribune in Kokomo.
And after he retired,
he started a newspaper, a small town newspaper
in, Greentown, Indiana,
which is not far from Kokomo.
And he eventually,
started to publish the base newspaper
for what was Bunker Hill,
Air Force Base
in Peru, Indiana. It's spelled like the country
Peru, but they kinda pronounce it Peru.
And and, eventually, they changed the name to
Grissom Air Force Base after
after Gus Grissom.
And
so, yeah, he published their newspaper,
and
he was there a lot. When I was
in high school,
he
took my friend and I up there, and
they let us get in let us,
fly a simulator of
of the, the hustler.
What what was it? What was what's the
hustler? The hustler? Is it b
58?
No. I don't know. I don't know. Oh,
okay. Well, I thought you were Air Force,
so that you might. I was, but
I I flew on a C-141.
Oh, okay. Yeah. It's a little different, different.
Different plane. Different plane. Yeah. Anyway, it was
a bomber, you know?
Anyway,
so we got to do that. I I
I thought it was it was pretty cool.
And then they let him he got to
ride in a fighter jet. And they Yeah.
Blew up to Alaska
and back and then, like, to California and
back, you know, in one day, of course.
Yeah.
Yeah. That was
what an experience.
I think you might be thinking that B
52, which was the,
Air Force's
predominant bomber. No. No. This is they don't
they don't fly it anymore. It's called the
Hustler. I'm gonna I'm gonna look it up
here after we're done here.
Oh my. Matter of fact, that was the
name of the newspaper.
Okay.
But, I won't stop here, Dub, but I'm
I'm gonna look it up because it was
Yeah.
It was, something
they they didn't use it
much, I guess.
Well, whatever.
We're not here to talk about bombers.
Yeah. Yes. So
so
where was I anyway? So, yeah, I think
that's that's so interesting. Now
all the time you spent
basically as an embedded photojournalist, how did that
affect
your personal style? And how did it,
what did you learn in that process that
helps you
photographing
the homeless from really deep inside? I mean,
you're practically
embedded in their lives, it looks to me.
That is a fair assessment.
What did I take
from the experiences embedded
photojournalists?
I think
the
you have to show a measure of respect
to your subject, whether that subject is a
soldier,
homeless person, if you're covering a
parade.
It's the respect you give to your subject,
and I think that's first and foremost.
I also have a tendency
to work close.
Yes. You do.
I told I used to tell I used
to teach every so often when I wasn't
teaching history class. I teach a class in
photography and photojournalism.
I used to tell students
don't be afraid to get close enough where
you can hear their heart beating
because then you're going to fill the frame.
You're going to tell a story
and you
want that eye contact.
But so when when I for what I
carry over from my experiences in Afghanistan and
Iraq
is that don't be afraid to, you know,
be respectful and get close. Tell a good
story,
by doing that. And that is exactly what
I do,
with my work as a documentary photographer.
Yeah. Those are words of wisdom, and and
you live by it.
It's funny. Ashley and I were were looking
at your work,
your your most recent,
the the,
the jungle story.
And,
she said
she goes, wow. How did you know, he
must have a lot of guts to go
in there in into that encampment.
And,
and then I told her how you were
embedded in Iraq. And she goes, okay. Never
mind.
That's where I got it.
Yeah. There's a little bit of that, but,
it's interesting you make that comment because
you are correct,
or I have noticed
there is a difference between,
working with
individuals who live in an encampment
as opposed to
the homeless who live on the streets. Mhmm.
I have and it is much it is
easier
to
photograph,
talk with,
associate with
the homeless who live on the streets
than it is with the homeless who are
living in an encampment. There's a there's a
much more of a closed,
a little more suspicious.
And I understand that.
I understand that because they'll tell you why
they are that way.
But there is definitely a difference. And, yeah,
sometimes it can get a little
what's the word I want? Dicey
in an encampment that you have not experienced
on the streets.
I'd like to take a quick break to
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And now back to the show.
So you were you were telling me earlier,
as part of your career as a history
professor, you also taught a course on Vietnam.
And
I remember Vietnam as a kid,
and it was always on television.
It was probably the first war that was
ever covered like that,
to to that degree, and and and had
a big effect on people's opinions back home.
And having been one of the people who
were embedded
in one of today or 2 of today's
wars, I mean,
is there a big difference
between
how
the journalists back in the seventies and the
sixties operated
as compared to,
the journalists today or now it's 20 years
ago?
That's a very good question. And, again, I
can only go on what I experienced. Mhmm.
If it's If I compare myself to the
mobility
and the ability to move around theater
like the photojournalists did in Vietnam,
I pretty much had the same going for
me.
But saying that, I also know in Iraq
and Afghanistan
that
other journalists
and photojournalists
did not have the same mobility.
So I think
it comes down to
how I approached
my subject matter, how I approached the military,
how I approached the army, how I got
to know the brigade commander and its leadership,
and then focus on a particular, say, a
particular battalion, get to know that leadership.
I became someone that,
as I used to tell myself on missions,
you are an asset. You do not become
a liability
to these men
and women who are putting their lives on
the line.
And, for me, it it, in a sense,
it it paid off. I,
I had a great deal of mobility
and latitude
in every time I was embedded.
I mean, heck, Bob. I was on a
150 plus combat missions. I mean, I I
really got to know what was going on
and who was doing what and how something
might should go. And so, yeah, there was
there was some
reciprocity there.
Did were you ever in a situation where
you yourself had to shoot back?
Yeah. I suppose I can answer that question
now because we've got some time between us.
Oh. Yeah. Four times I put the camera
down and I,
used a sidearm.
Yes.
Because at that point,
I mean, 1st and foremost,
these
young men and women, they're risking their lives.
And if I can help
defend those lives, sure, I certainly
was not adverse to doing so.
Oh, he had no choice.
Yeah. That is exactly right. It was there
were several instances where it was all hands
on deck.
So do you have any of the photographs
now? I'm sure you do. Or or have
you shown any of your work that you
made?
With regard to, Iraq and Afghanistan?
Yeah. Just
yes. I give I've given a number of
public
exhibitions,
usually set to music and video.
And then
a couple years ago, I donated
a number of those images to the
Army War College at Carlisle Barracks, Pennsylvania.
Really? I was also out here at Joint
Base Lewis McChord. There's a museum And I
also did the same thing. I left I've
given a number of those images to that
museum.
But, yes, I have
used to, you know
I'd be invited by, say, the VFW, or
I was invited once by the city of
Lakewood, Washington.
Show up with a video and your photographs,
and you talk about it, and you engage
in a conversation with your audience. Yeah.
It has I have done that. Yeah. That's
really cool.
I should point out here,
and it it doves in it dovetails nicely
with the idea of photographing the homeless.
I don't do this for me.
I did it for the men and women
who served.
And as far as,
the documentary on the homeless,
I want their story told. This has nothing
to do with me. It has everything to
do with these individuals.
Yes.
That's when you make
the really good work, I think. Exactly. I
think we were talking earlier, and I said,
I don't go out looking for a photograph.
Yeah. No. They come to me. I just
let it happen. I just, you know,
I don't take a lot of photographs when
I'm out.
I do emphasize quality over quantity.
But, when I start, you know, I may
sit and talk for 20, 25, 30 minutes
with a group of homeless men and women.
And then along the way, I say, hey.
Do you mind if I make a photograph
or 2?
And, I mean, it's literally
1, 2, 3.
But, by that time,
I pretty much have an idea how I'm
going to compose this. I mean, everything else
becomes almost
automatic. You know, your s you know, your
ISO or your f stop. Yeah. You've got
it composed.
Just
do it.
Wow.
You're,
I know you've been a subscriber for a
while. I don't know if you've ever had
a chance to look back.
It was a couple years ago. We featured,
Jeremy Stevens
who,
he's,
he was a drill sergeant
in the army, and
he this this was several years ago.
He he doesn't live too far from me.
He lives
nearby Fredericksburg, Virginia.
And,
but as a drill sergeant, he photographed his
his troops,
these kids they were training. You know, they
were all, like, right out of high school,
but he just he really
you know, as a drill sergeant, he had
to be hard on him, but he he
loved them.
And, you know, I had very deep feelings
for them, and you can see it in
his work.
And he,
he does, obviously, he does street photography,
and he also photographs,
the Bluegrass community in this part of the
country. And,
but his work with those kits,
to me was really special because, you know,
you could tell he really cared about him.
Mhmm.
And, and and I see that in your
work as well.
Thank you. For sojokes.
Yes. I mean, you're you're you're you're touching
a nerve here with me because
my
feelings
about the homeless
is that I'm afraid
that they are being marginalized.
They are being ignored.
They are talked about as a line item
in a budget.
That that the the whole condition of homelessness
has become sort of
normalized in America,
And, they are stereotyped.
And, none of that is true. And, if
my photographs
of them
can move the needle
any closer to we need to address this
problem and we need to do it in
a logical, compassionate,
concise manner.
That's all I need to know. That's all
I give a damn
The,
so many
of us, I'll say, us, people
who wanna make
good street photographs
are always on the hunt for a cool
shot.
Yeah.
And
I'm I'm looking for a shot that
you know, it's the nice thing about documentary
photography. It doesn't have to be perfect.
Yes. It doesn't have to be it can
be
it could you you can make
compositional mistakes,
but if the photograph
works,
you've done your job.
And and like I say, with regard to
the homeless,
that is all I wanna do. It is
like I
say, it's not about me.
It's about
what you see
when you look into their eyes.
That's what this is about. You also mentioned
this this gentleman, Jeremy Stephens, that it reminded
me
of a podcast you did recently
of a photographer, a street photographer by the
name of Valerie Jardine. Oh, yeah.
And I think she,
when I read when I listened to the
podcast, I thought, she's got it figured out.
Well, she's quite good. Yeah. I work
her idea, that idea, work with limitations.
It's a paradoxical,
almost oxymoronic
idea,
but
that's exactly what I use here, again, with
the homeless.
One camera,
one lens.
As the Marines would say, when you have
nothing to work with, work with nothing.
No excuses.
Complete the mission. And,
I think she put her finger
on a lot of
ideas and thoughts that I've had
when it comes to the actual photography.
Yeah. When you look at her work,
I think virtually
pardon? I'm humbled
when I see her work. I think Oh,
yeah. She's
she's good. Yeah. She's a real deal.
I think, every one of those is made
with a Fuji X100
series camera, which is a 35 millimeter lens
equivalent. Yep. That's it.
Yep. That's it.
I use speaking of cameras, I like to
use an Olympus,
M1 Mark 2. Mhmm. It's a,
an 18,
excuse me, 8 to 18 millimeter Leica
lens.
Really? And I,
the other time every every once in a
while, I'll go out with an old used
Nikon DF
with a 24 millimeter lens. Yeah. That's and
that's another thing about my photography.
I'm not hung up on megapixels
and sensor size
nonsense.
I think Pretty much. Yep.
The the key the camera you've got in
your hand is the best camera. Use it.
Yeah. Yep. Yep.
I agree.
The,
I was gonna say
not long ago,
I heard from,
another photographer we've we've had on a few
times, Pia Perlin. She's
she's,
like, French battalion.
She's a scientist,
biologist,
great photographer,
great street photographer.
She wrote a article that we're gonna publish,
and she made a point was the more
personal
your photograph is,
the more personal it is to you, the
more universal
it is
to every everyone else.
And
I thought, gee, that makes a lot of
sense.
Yeah. It does. And and I see that
I see that in your work. I can
tell it's quite personal.
Yes. And I got may I just from
looking at the photograph, I can see you
spend time,
like you said,
getting to know these people
and and being very respectful
when you come to make a photograph of
them. And it and it just shows,
I guess, the universal nature of of all
of us.
You know, we all want the same things.
We wanna be safe. We want,
you know,
food, and we want our families to be
safe. And,
if we don't
have a bad habit of this. It never
escapes my attention that
I know that I can go back to
my home.
I can go to the refrigerator.
I can watch television. Yeah. I will I
have a bed to sleep in.
And when you're
working with
people who spent the night
on the sidewalk
or who live under
tarps
and tents
and it's raining outside or it's 14 degrees
outside. Yeah.
Yes.
I,
I'm very thankful for what I have, and
I'm very mindful of what these
human beings
confront on a daily basis.
And, that, therefore,
I think society should not be so quick
to judge these people.
Yeah. I agree with you. What does your
family say about you
venturing out?
I think
my daughter who
she's 19
She I think she likes what dad does.
Yeah. My wife is very supportive.
My wife works in mental health. Oh. So
we
we talk in terms of her mental health
understanding and the work I do.
I I I and I think our our
14 year old,
he knows dad does this, but I don't
think quite in that 14 year old mind,
it's it's not it's not there yet as
far as Yeah. Sure. What I'm trying to
do. So I am supported. I mean, there's
no question about that. My wife has been
very good about me. You know, I get
up at 3 o'clock in the morning to
be out on the streets by 4.
Wow. And I'll be gone on these when
I go out to, to photograph.
I'm gone for 6, 7 hours.
I mean, this isn't a, you know, well,
I'm down here for half an hour. No.
You
respect
the homelessness'
time. In a sense, when I'm on the
streets,
look at it a little differently. You're in
their space.
You are in their home. Yeah. If you
want to do the encampments,
you don't just barge in. I mean, you
call it, you know, may I may I
approach your property? May I approach where you're
living?
You you take your time. You're respectful.
And I find that that pays off.
Do you follow any of the other
photographers who have been documenting the homeless like
Suitcase Joe,
Julia Dean in LA. She does a lot
of work and, Yes. To a degree, I
have.
But I'm reminded of something that John Steinbeck
said when he was asked,
Does he keep an eye on what other
writers are writing?
And his response was, no, I'm too busy
doing my own writing. And in a way,
Bob, I
am quite frankly, I'm focused on what I'm
doing here. I'm aware of certain individuals.
But do I follow in the sense of
who's doing what? No, I don't. I'm aware,
but I've got my own lane to stay
in.
So
where are you going with all this work
that you're you're producing?
That's a damn good question.
First of all, I never thought that I
would be interviewed
by you
and be published in this magazine.
That was one way of
presenting the topic of homelessness in America.
But I have been working,
collaborating
with a
philosophy professor
who works at Bates College in Lewiston, Maine.
And, this man's name is Paul Scofield,
and
he is
thinking about doing a book.
Mhmm. And, if he does, if this all
comes to fruition,
the plan is that my photographs or some
of them would appear
in his book.
The other to answer your question, I
I kind of keep my eye on perhaps
there might be a grant,
that comes in the future. And if so,
I can definitely avail myself to that.
Yeah. I see why you're a fan of
Dorothea Lange.
Bingo. Boy, you put your finger right on
it. Yeah. Yeah. I just finished reading a
book,
about her written by a historian named Linda
Gordon.
It is a very well done book.
I am writing this down.
Nah. It's quite alright.
I like our I would say we mentioned
earlier, I like our sort of free flow
conversational
approach here. So yeah.
I I think it's,
I think it's more interesting to listen to
as well.
Well, wait till you get me really going.
Oh, really? Okay. What does that take?
Yeah. What'll really get me going is when
I have homeless people telling me that other
folks drive by at night, throw fruit, rocks,
popcorn.
Yes.
And,
I have words for those individuals, and I
don't think you want them repeated here.
Yeah. We won't. It's
Less can.
You can. No. No. No. Well, then I
have to we have to check a little
box Yeah. Yeah. With
the I in Itunes.
Yeah. There you go. So so we keep
we try to keep the use the clean
box as much as possible.
Bingo.
Well
well, I tell you. So what
what's next for you? What else are you
are you working on anything else, or this
is just all consuming?
This is pretty much all consuming.
I should also point out
I don't
photograph
every
day.
Yeah. I There are there are times when
I
I have to tell myself,
You need to back off, John.
You're getting too close.
Mhmm. Sometimes, what I tell my wife is
know, my my wife sees all of my
photos.
And I ask her what she thinks.
And she'll say,
these are really, really good, honey. You've done
a really good job here. Mhmm. And I
say, yes.
A photographing
misery
and something that I shouldn't have to photograph
in America in the first place.
And that is that is those are my
feelings. You can
I come back from most assignments
feeling conflicted?
You can do good work.
You can be complemented for that work just
as you've done. Mhmm. But then I I'm
I'm not I'm it never escapes me. And
I shouldn't have to be doing this in
the first place.
We need
people should not be without housing
in this country in the 21st century,
and Baobai can take you into places here
in Olympia
where they're living like they're in 17th century.
Wow. Starting a fire to stay warm in
a tunnel
is 17th century living
or living under a building.
Is
is I mean, it's almost like living in
a cave.
We shouldn't have to be doing this. And
yet, I go in there and do it.
And I can have, you know like I
say, it's like it comes back to this
is not about me. This is about these
individuals
and how we need to get a grip
on this growing epidemic
of homelessness in America.
Wow. Is this something you can ever walk
away from?
Or
maybe
abandon is probably more of a
I may there may come a day when
I won't
be doing this kind of work, but I
don't think this work will ever leave me.
Mhmm.
I mean, it's it's kinda like being embedded
in Iraq and Afghanistan. Yeah.
You for a long time, I thought, well,
I can cover the war and the war
will have no effect on me. And I
was wrong.
It did and still does have an effect.
I think the same can be said
of
documenting
through photography
the plight of the homelessness
of the homeless.
Yeah. There's
there has to be other places to show
this work. I mean, I'm happy we were
able to do it,
but, are you looking to do
a gallery exhibit or your own book?
I like the full the lot the former
idea, a gallery exhibit. I'm I I have
to admit that I'm not,
savvy in how all of that works.
I'm,
I was let me put it to you
this way. When I I mentioned, Paul Scofield
a moment ago. Mhmm. And he has a
Twitter account. And he put just 9 of
my photographs on that account.
3,000,000
views later. Woah.
72 hours, and I thought, maybe somebody will
say, hey.
I have this gallery.
Could I talk with you?
Something like that. I haven't actively gone out
looking for
Mhmm. The gallery.
I've been, like I said earlier to you
before we went on air,
I've been kidded about having zero social media
presence.
And that and there's a reason for that.
This isn't for me. Yeah.
Yeah. And all that.
So I I I like I said,
I'll it'll come to me. I'll just let
it roll along. I have right now, my
my
plan is, well, tomorrow morning, I'll be in
downtown Olympia
letting the photograph come to me. And I'll
just keep doing this work. I'll keep working
with different
agencies or papers or
perhaps even a gallery.
We'll just take it as it comes.
Yeah. Wouldn't hurt if you had a website.
Understood.
I hear it loud. Heard that before.
Yes. I have.
Well,
sorry. You probably see me. I keep looking
away because there's a book on my shelf
that I'm
I'm probably gonna grab here before we're done.
But
if you use Adobe
No. I will not use Adobe here. You
get me going again, Bob. Okay. Well, alright.
I don't wanna.
Say well, they when you have an Adobe
account, you can they have a portfolio built
in, and it's easy easy to set up
a portfolio. But okay. Something about subscription?
No.
I
I prefer to own my own tools. Yeah.
I understand that. Yeah. Yeah.
Same applies to Lightroom.
Yeah. It's it's Adobe. It's it's a subscription.
Nope. I,
I go a different way. I if you
if you had asked me during this interview
if I had to describe myself in one
word, that word would be outlier.
Definitely an outlier. Yeah. That's alright. That's alright.
Yeah.
So what are you what are you editing
with?
I use,
Topaz Studio 2
and Nike FX Silver.
Yeah. Silver effects. Yeah. Yeah. I like that.
That is that is a very good,
Yeah. It is. I really appreciate that. Yeah.
Yeah. It's, it's quite a product. I've I've
had it off and on
since before Google bought it and let it
go.
Yeah.
We're not using it right now.
Okay. I'm back now. I I just had
to get this,
this book because I wanted to put in
my hand here.
And it's
a book called homeless in the land of
plenty by Mark Schuman, which you,
I talked to him about this
on the show,
earlier this year.
And,
Mark traveled around the country
doing something similar to
what you're doing.
And the reason I I I brought him
up I
I know you're you're busy doing your own
work, so I I
that's a valid point, but
it, it's worth checking out his work as
well.
But,
a few weeks ago, I was contacted by
a musician,
and I'm sorry I forget his name.
He wrote
a song about the homeless, and you could
tell he very he was very deeply about
their situation.
And
and, you know, he sent me the song,
and I listened to it. I go, wow.
And and, I was just really good. The
guy is very good. Very good musician,
songwriter.
And, I
I think he was interested in finding some
photographs.
And I so I connected him with Mark,
and I think
he's gonna make a video with a song
in the background, and he's gonna use some
of Mark's photos. And,
if you're
interested, I may introduce him to you as
well.
I would very much
like that.
And by the way, everything you've mentioned starting
with the hustler,
I've written down
names,
book titles
because I will research every single one of
them. Alright.
I read. This is how I learn. And,
yes, I would very much like the opportunity
to work with that musician.
Oh, very good. Alright. I'll
I'll contact them this afternoon after after we
get off. I I
I was gonna do it earlier, but I
wanted to talk to you first.
Well, you also have my permission if you
wanna forward some of those images I've sent.
Oh, really?
And my,
my,
email address, and Okay. Very much would like
that. Alright. Alright.
Thank you. That sounds good. Yeah. It was
your work, so I don't
you know? We've got no say so over
anybody anybody's work because it's theirs.
Nope. That's why I thought I'd say something.
I you have my permission to use as
you see fit.
Oh, thank you. Thank you.
So,
one other thing I I forgot to ask
earlier. So before we wrap it up, just
gonna ask. Okay. You were in the Air
Force.
Mhmm. What'd you do in the Air Force?
You you said you flew cargo planes? Yeah.
For the first couple of years, I was
enlisted as a load master on the c
141
b Starlifter.
I earned a direct commission.
I was,
from that point on, I was a logistics
officer,
for a little while with the air force
and a lot of time with the army.
And, it was a very interesting career as
an air force officer
working with the army.
I think I think of it as one
of the high points of my life. Yeah.
That's really something.
Well, I gotta say thank you for your
service.
You're welcome. America is worth it. And and
thank you for what you're doing
to help. Thank you for what you do.
I mean, I you,
before I subscribed
to Street Photography Magazine,
I did a search.
And, what drew me to you besides the
format and how the magazine was presented in
these podcasts
is that,
you probably know this, but this magazine is
very highly rated
in this country.
And I thought that's a magazine that I
wanna be associated with. So thank you.
Well, thanks. I,
I love the compliment.
Yeah. You notice we don't,
we don't sell advertising,
so we're not beholden to anybody but our
subscribers.
I,
I I like that. I think you're doing
doing damn good work. Yeah. And
then doing the advertising thing is the easy
way.
Yeah. I I agree.
I agree.
Yeah. Yeah. This is tough, but it's a
labor of love.
And On both ends. Yes.
Yeah. Good. Good. Well, thank you very much.
Alright. So, I know you don't have a
website.
And,
do you have a social media presence you
can share with everybody
for your stuff? What I can. I am
there is a an organization,
Social
Documentary Network. Oh, yeah. SDN. Sure.
And if you go to the search box,
and you type in John Simpson,
I have 4 exhibits hanging.
And the last one,
which I I think I posted about a
week ago,
are the images from the jungle.
Okay. So and then then there's another one.
There are other images of the homeless. So,
yes,
people wanna take a look at some of
my work, but that's where I do,
put my work
because I think there, it could make a
difference.
I like SDR. Yeah. Oh, yes. Yes.
Me too. And,
several of the people
we've had in the magazine,
I've gotten to know personally, have
published work through them. Yeah. And,
Yeah. They're they're they're quite good. Yeah. I
did see your stuff in there. I'll just
we'll just link to that.
I appreciate that. Thank you. Yeah. And then
any place
between now and when we publish your
your story,
then we'll,
There is there's a small newspaper.
It's a daily online newspaper. I'm wearing a
hat. It's called the J. O. L. T.
I saw that too. Yeah. The J. O.
L. T. Stands for Journal of Olympia
Lacey Tumwater.
It's the J. O. L. T. News.com.
Some of the articles I've written about the
homeless, and there'll be a photo or 2
accompanying,
appear in that publication.
I consider myself a contributor.
Bowling to those as well. I appreciate that.
Thank you.
Very good. Very good.
Well, John,
thanks again.
You're welcome. I really appreciate it. It's a
lot of fun speaking with you,
and
I hope to do it again soon.
I appreciate everything you've done today for me,
for this opportunity.
And, yeah, I've actually started to roll around
a third idea for a,
or an article at some point
for Street Photography Magazine.
Your thoughts about the show go a long
way in helping us decide on the guests
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So please take a few moments to write
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It helps us know if we're on the
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The editor of Street Photography Magazine is Ashley
Riefo,
and our audio engineer is Russell Boyd from
Weebit Studios found at weebitstudios.co.uk.
I'm Bob Patterson, and this is the Street
Photography Magazine podcast,
a service
of Street Photography Magazine.