1
00:00:03,306 --> 00:00:06,174
Up of the news this evening is speculation

2
00:00:06,174 --> 00:00:07,344
concerning a real fact

3
00:00:08,180 --> 00:00:10,807
behind the department of health announcement about a

4
00:00:10,807 --> 00:00:11,307
radioactive

5
00:00:11,762 --> 00:00:14,866
spill who supposed to have occurred yesterday at

6
00:00:14,866 --> 00:00:16,140
the state nuclear plant.

7
00:00:17,350 --> 00:00:19,750
Die only to live again in a younger

8
00:00:19,750 --> 00:00:19,989
body,

9
00:00:20,629 --> 00:00:22,149
then you can tell me if the operation

10
00:00:22,149 --> 00:00:24,469
was a success my functioning now.

11
00:00:25,349 --> 00:00:26,925
But I'm determined to have your

12
00:00:28,083 --> 00:00:30,080
You're listening to the really awful movies podcast,

13
00:00:30,240 --> 00:00:32,237
the celebration of genre cinema.

14
00:00:42,379 --> 00:00:45,429
From our downtown headquarters. Here's episode 4 70

15
00:00:45,726 --> 00:00:48,037
of the really awful movies podcast. A look

16
00:00:48,037 --> 00:00:50,756
back at murder by Decree.

17
00:00:51,312 --> 00:00:53,299
This week was a confluence of factors here.

18
00:00:53,538 --> 00:00:54,356
We had the

19
00:00:55,048 --> 00:00:56,741
passing of Canadian

20
00:00:57,274 --> 00:00:57,774
legendary

21
00:00:58,243 --> 00:01:01,577
screen icon, Donald Sutherland, and a a social

22
00:01:01,577 --> 00:01:03,347
media reminder that it was been

23
00:01:03,879 --> 00:01:06,515
6 years, I guess, to the week, that

24
00:01:06,912 --> 00:01:08,104
Jeff and I had did a

25
00:01:09,137 --> 00:01:12,078
trip over to England and to visit London

26
00:01:12,078 --> 00:01:14,723
where we actually did partake of

27
00:01:15,273 --> 00:01:17,426
a jack the ripper tour as it's a

28
00:01:17,426 --> 00:01:19,818
bit of a cottage industry actually in the

29
00:01:19,818 --> 00:01:20,956
in the east end

30
00:01:21,413 --> 00:01:23,827
and white Chapel. And there's

31
00:01:24,458 --> 00:01:26,075
almost all these kind of

32
00:01:26,612 --> 00:01:29,084
competing tours that are happening to this day,

33
00:01:30,201 --> 00:01:34,544
and it's amazing the incredible stain power and

34
00:01:34,682 --> 00:01:35,182
the

35
00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:37,256
explosion continued

36
00:01:39,309 --> 00:01:41,006
proliferation of theories and

37
00:01:41,317 --> 00:01:44,438
suspect put forward as the the mystery is

38
00:01:44,653 --> 00:01:48,148
on ending and un yielding and will likely

39
00:01:48,148 --> 00:01:48,942
never be solved.

40
00:01:49,514 --> 00:01:51,772
Those few months in 18 88

41
00:01:51,991 --> 00:01:54,968
when the east side of London was terrorized

42
00:01:55,188 --> 00:01:55,907
by the

43
00:01:56,466 --> 00:01:57,665
knife wielding a assailant.

44
00:01:58,157 --> 00:02:00,699
Who was, I guess, given the nickname of

45
00:02:00,858 --> 00:02:03,106
Jack The ripper. Now, there been different

46
00:02:03,718 --> 00:02:04,218
counts

47
00:02:04,750 --> 00:02:05,068
and

48
00:02:05,624 --> 00:02:06,124
portrayal

49
00:02:06,674 --> 00:02:08,694
of the the killings throughout,

50
00:02:09,314 --> 00:02:09,814
cinema,

51
00:02:10,514 --> 00:02:11,014
and

52
00:02:11,794 --> 00:02:15,558
there's 1... Something from the eighties with Michael

53
00:02:15,717 --> 00:02:17,546
Keane that I hadn't had a chance to

54
00:02:17,546 --> 00:02:21,466
check out. I did go to the premier

55
00:02:21,602 --> 00:02:23,192
screening of from hell.

56
00:02:23,844 --> 00:02:26,165
For of the 2000 and I wanna say

57
00:02:26,165 --> 00:02:27,284
it's 2002,

58
00:02:27,764 --> 00:02:28,885
Johnny depp vehicle,

59
00:02:29,284 --> 00:02:30,965
and, of course, named after the,

60
00:02:31,685 --> 00:02:33,205
infamous from hell letter.

61
00:02:33,936 --> 00:02:35,626
Of course, there's hundreds of letters

62
00:02:36,079 --> 00:02:37,984
sent to Scotland yard and

63
00:02:38,858 --> 00:02:41,104
police and the vigilance committee

64
00:02:41,573 --> 00:02:44,916
from p people with insights into the case,

65
00:02:45,075 --> 00:02:47,304
and even from people claiming to be the

66
00:02:47,304 --> 00:02:48,896
per himself, And I honestly,

67
00:02:49,629 --> 00:02:50,830
can't for the life of me,

68
00:02:51,550 --> 00:02:52,050
recall

69
00:02:52,349 --> 00:02:55,150
too many details about the from hell movie

70
00:02:55,150 --> 00:02:58,030
other than that I had bumped into a

71
00:02:58,030 --> 00:02:58,530
friend

72
00:02:59,082 --> 00:03:00,670
earlier on in the day and we decided

73
00:03:00,670 --> 00:03:02,735
to catch up over beers on a patio,

74
00:03:02,893 --> 00:03:03,290
and

75
00:03:03,846 --> 00:03:06,308
we were pretty much in the bag, and

76
00:03:06,308 --> 00:03:08,469
that probably accounted for the fact that there...

77
00:03:08,629 --> 00:03:09,849
The film wasn't overly

78
00:03:10,469 --> 00:03:10,949
memorable.

79
00:03:11,270 --> 00:03:11,770
However,

80
00:03:12,550 --> 00:03:12,789
I think,

81
00:03:13,830 --> 00:03:15,129
I'm gonna have to probably

82
00:03:15,682 --> 00:03:17,933
revisited at some point, although I think the

83
00:03:17,990 --> 00:03:20,400
reviews bear out my my sort of a

84
00:03:20,617 --> 00:03:22,208
anti to that 1. Now,

85
00:03:23,178 --> 00:03:26,360
that's a completely different experience from my first

86
00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:28,747
viewing of murdered by the decree, which was

87
00:03:28,747 --> 00:03:29,962
when I was a kid

88
00:03:30,354 --> 00:03:32,668
And between ages, if I wanna say like,

89
00:03:32,987 --> 00:03:34,364
8 and 12

90
00:03:34,822 --> 00:03:36,577
before your parents could really shuttle you off

91
00:03:36,577 --> 00:03:39,229
to a summer camp, I spent summers at

92
00:03:39,229 --> 00:03:39,729
my

93
00:03:40,030 --> 00:03:40,750
grandparents place,

94
00:03:41,310 --> 00:03:43,150
and it was outside of the city, and

95
00:03:43,150 --> 00:03:45,889
they various had different farms in Southeastern

96
00:03:46,270 --> 00:03:46,590
Ontario.

97
00:03:47,404 --> 00:03:49,478
And at 1 point they're in this little

98
00:03:49,478 --> 00:03:49,717
town.

99
00:03:50,355 --> 00:03:52,987
And so I'd spent the summer over there.

100
00:03:53,147 --> 00:03:55,460
And, of course, back in the day, you

101
00:03:55,460 --> 00:03:58,343
weren't... It weren't gifted with some fu some

102
00:03:58,343 --> 00:04:01,524
cable package, and I think various, they did

103
00:04:01,524 --> 00:04:03,217
have a satellite dish

104
00:04:03,592 --> 00:04:05,422
access to different channels. But for the most

105
00:04:05,422 --> 00:04:07,581
part, it was 1 of those rabbit ear

106
00:04:07,581 --> 00:04:09,646
scenarios where you just got whatever you got.

107
00:04:10,044 --> 00:04:12,664
And whatever happened to be the local news

108
00:04:12,664 --> 00:04:14,412
from, I guess, the closest city would be

109
00:04:14,571 --> 00:04:16,917
Peter bro it's a little kind of Pod

110
00:04:17,136 --> 00:04:20,248
university town about 2 hours from here. It

111
00:04:20,248 --> 00:04:21,068
really is

112
00:04:21,446 --> 00:04:23,600
not much or was not much at the

113
00:04:23,600 --> 00:04:25,760
time. In terms of entertainment,

114
00:04:26,553 --> 00:04:29,330
absent sent the, maybe 10 to 12 channels.

115
00:04:30,123 --> 00:04:30,623
Now

116
00:04:31,645 --> 00:04:33,890
1 of these channels happened to run

117
00:04:34,263 --> 00:04:37,674
this late seventies film that caught my attention

118
00:04:37,674 --> 00:04:40,072
because At the time, I had developed a

119
00:04:40,072 --> 00:04:42,297
kind of a nascent interest in a true

120
00:04:42,297 --> 00:04:44,999
crime based on the writings of Max Hai,

121
00:04:45,237 --> 00:04:45,896
the wonderfully

122
00:04:46,430 --> 00:04:46,930
named

123
00:04:47,638 --> 00:04:48,914
he sounds like he's straight out of a

124
00:04:48,914 --> 00:04:51,307
dash aisle ham novel or something. And I

125
00:04:51,307 --> 00:04:53,461
think he he kind of took to that

126
00:04:53,461 --> 00:04:55,614
as well with Fed fedora as whatnot. He

127
00:04:55,614 --> 00:04:56,832
was a crime writer

128
00:04:57,304 --> 00:04:59,373
for the Toronto Son, 1 of the local

129
00:04:59,373 --> 00:05:02,078
rags here, in an author of several books

130
00:05:02,078 --> 00:05:04,386
as well in which he detailed in the

131
00:05:04,386 --> 00:05:05,204
con comp

132
00:05:05,739 --> 00:05:07,768
compilation form a bunch of different

133
00:05:08,226 --> 00:05:10,722
famous true crime cases, 1 of which

134
00:05:11,100 --> 00:05:13,495
was jack the ripper of course. So I

135
00:05:13,495 --> 00:05:15,571
even as a young kid had known about

136
00:05:15,571 --> 00:05:18,132
the exploits of saucy jack well before I,

137
00:05:18,370 --> 00:05:19,483
I caught any

138
00:05:20,039 --> 00:05:23,058
film adaptations or a chronic link of the

139
00:05:23,058 --> 00:05:26,816
life of the notorious killer, often, I guess,

140
00:05:27,294 --> 00:05:29,525
the the man credited with

141
00:05:30,163 --> 00:05:32,234
know, Dare say, putting serial killers on the

142
00:05:32,234 --> 00:05:34,157
map even though obviously, it by no means

143
00:05:34,157 --> 00:05:38,356
the first, but the confluence of of a

144
00:05:38,356 --> 00:05:41,784
high degree of literacy plus the proliferation of

145
00:05:41,784 --> 00:05:44,410
the penny dreadful falls and how popular mass

146
00:05:44,410 --> 00:05:46,718
media was and and yellow journalism at the

147
00:05:46,718 --> 00:05:49,678
time that he was definitely the most well

148
00:05:49,678 --> 00:05:51,668
known and continues to be to this day.

149
00:05:52,146 --> 00:05:52,305
So,

150
00:05:53,022 --> 00:05:55,569
I happen to, on, through Tv guide or

151
00:05:55,569 --> 00:05:57,578
some such source see that there was this

152
00:05:57,578 --> 00:05:59,976
film called murder by Decree, which was about

153
00:05:59,976 --> 00:06:02,293
the jack the ripper murders, and I watched

154
00:06:02,293 --> 00:06:05,510
it and I was so filled with terror

155
00:06:05,823 --> 00:06:08,449
that I couldn't sleep all night, and I

156
00:06:08,449 --> 00:06:11,154
basically had to console myself with this kind

157
00:06:11,154 --> 00:06:13,007
of a crummy little

158
00:06:13,555 --> 00:06:15,855
tiny radio that I took under the covers

159
00:06:15,855 --> 00:06:17,861
with me, and I just put it on

160
00:06:17,916 --> 00:06:19,740
whatever happened to be the programming at the

161
00:06:19,740 --> 00:06:20,985
time. I think it was

162
00:06:21,579 --> 00:06:23,163
Peter Bro Pete's hockey game,

163
00:06:23,956 --> 00:06:25,936
that which is a a lower level kind

164
00:06:25,936 --> 00:06:27,942
of a minor league hockey,

165
00:06:28,883 --> 00:06:31,499
league in in Canada, and and are my

166
00:06:31,499 --> 00:06:33,242
province of Ontario. So I just put on

167
00:06:33,242 --> 00:06:35,486
the play by play would have been around

168
00:06:35,875 --> 00:06:37,235
I don't even know. I guess they must

169
00:06:37,235 --> 00:06:39,314
have had this on Tv at around 8,

170
00:06:39,555 --> 00:06:40,995
and maybe the game was still going at

171
00:06:40,995 --> 00:06:42,914
around 10, and I'd gone to bed, and,

172
00:06:42,995 --> 00:06:44,694
of course, Had my own room in this

173
00:06:44,929 --> 00:06:47,966
you know, very off the beaten path, house

174
00:06:47,966 --> 00:06:51,163
just basically surrounded by woods and and nature,

175
00:06:51,323 --> 00:06:54,141
and I was just beyond mortified and terrified

176
00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:56,923
because to the credit of director Bob Clark,

177
00:06:57,002 --> 00:07:00,027
who many people know obviously through the Poe

178
00:07:00,027 --> 00:07:03,726
shots and that iconic and and very, very

179
00:07:03,943 --> 00:07:05,855
influential filming in its own right, Black Christmas.

180
00:07:06,413 --> 00:07:08,245
And he gives us that kind of twist

181
00:07:08,245 --> 00:07:08,723
as well.

182
00:07:09,693 --> 00:07:13,434
And gives us this really incredible San and

183
00:07:13,434 --> 00:07:16,401
then the cobb stones and just the cl

184
00:07:16,617 --> 00:07:19,338
closeness of that part of London. And And

185
00:07:19,338 --> 00:07:21,800
it it's funny. Like, how impactful that was

186
00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:22,435
at the time,

187
00:07:23,230 --> 00:07:25,454
even though I was only even just barely

188
00:07:25,454 --> 00:07:27,543
diving into a so called ripper,

189
00:07:27,917 --> 00:07:30,721
and it was prior to me knowing really

190
00:07:30,721 --> 00:07:32,019
any of the major

191
00:07:32,716 --> 00:07:34,871
particulars or the specifics about the case other

192
00:07:34,871 --> 00:07:37,926
than knowing perhaps maybe the canonical 5 victims

193
00:07:38,238 --> 00:07:40,482
and the fact that maybe prostitution was prevalent

194
00:07:40,696 --> 00:07:42,837
and the... And then I... Actually, I think

195
00:07:42,837 --> 00:07:45,875
mis a bunch of things as so many

196
00:07:46,104 --> 00:07:48,737
of the jack the ripper Lore is as

197
00:07:48,737 --> 00:07:51,451
well, is just that. It's just myth. There's

198
00:07:51,451 --> 00:07:53,786
so many things actually that this film

199
00:07:54,098 --> 00:07:56,395
gets wrong. It's kind of shocking to behold,

200
00:07:56,712 --> 00:07:58,163
and it makes you sort of question

201
00:07:58,614 --> 00:08:01,015
the notion of artistic license and

202
00:08:01,323 --> 00:08:03,859
how far you can get away from the

203
00:08:03,859 --> 00:08:05,682
facts, you know, just the facts, man as

204
00:08:05,682 --> 00:08:07,742
a, like, a nineties forties detective would say.

205
00:08:08,139 --> 00:08:08,589
And

206
00:08:09,027 --> 00:08:11,676
how far you get away from what actually

207
00:08:11,892 --> 00:08:13,882
transpired back in those those times.

208
00:08:14,518 --> 00:08:17,224
And my god, is is there a lot

209
00:08:17,224 --> 00:08:19,793
of deviation from what to happened. I mean,

210
00:08:20,272 --> 00:08:22,610
this is prevalent to this day with the

211
00:08:22,670 --> 00:08:25,067
the kind of proliferation of of

212
00:08:25,627 --> 00:08:26,766
non fiction books

213
00:08:27,225 --> 00:08:27,725
around

214
00:08:28,039 --> 00:08:29,573
this subject matter. And

215
00:08:29,949 --> 00:08:32,656
invariably, the probe is depicted with a top

216
00:08:32,656 --> 00:08:34,169
hat or a copy, as they called them,

217
00:08:34,646 --> 00:08:35,624
which was the

218
00:08:36,570 --> 00:08:39,530
a calling cart for a, an established gentleman

219
00:08:39,586 --> 00:08:41,570
or a doctor or a professor or an

220
00:08:41,570 --> 00:08:44,689
accountant or some sort of professional person and

221
00:08:45,079 --> 00:08:46,038
it's the last thing,

222
00:08:47,157 --> 00:08:49,794
someone would wear in a poor part of

223
00:08:49,794 --> 00:08:52,431
town unless they were looking to be upward

224
00:08:52,431 --> 00:08:53,445
mobile and maybe

225
00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:54,914
procured 1 of these

226
00:08:55,947 --> 00:08:58,489
items in order to look rich. But is

227
00:08:58,489 --> 00:09:01,428
it certainly would not be something common to

228
00:09:01,428 --> 00:09:03,309
wear. And it's funny of all things

229
00:09:03,669 --> 00:09:06,409
that the deer stalker had is what

230
00:09:06,870 --> 00:09:08,470
Jack the ripper that's as close as we

231
00:09:08,470 --> 00:09:10,230
can get from by all accounts to what

232
00:09:10,230 --> 00:09:13,265
he probably did wear, according to eye witness

233
00:09:13,265 --> 00:09:16,283
accounts and the 1 person who possibly may

234
00:09:16,283 --> 00:09:18,428
have, you know, stumbled upon them because, of

235
00:09:18,428 --> 00:09:20,912
course, what murder by Decree is is an

236
00:09:20,912 --> 00:09:25,156
imagining of Sherlock Holmes himself and doctor Watson

237
00:09:25,214 --> 00:09:27,455
on the hunt for the killer at the...

238
00:09:27,931 --> 00:09:29,994
At the the in the fall of 18

239
00:09:29,994 --> 00:09:32,295
88. And it's it's it's quite interesting. I

240
00:09:32,295 --> 00:09:34,357
mean, I think Christopher Plum is amazing.

241
00:09:34,929 --> 00:09:37,875
In the role. It's just so effortlessly charming,

242
00:09:38,035 --> 00:09:39,787
and we're introduced to the twos some having

243
00:09:39,787 --> 00:09:41,937
this dialogue as they're waiting for the prince

244
00:09:41,937 --> 00:09:43,664
of wales to show up to some sort

245
00:09:43,865 --> 00:09:46,424
Opera or theater event. I can't remember which,

246
00:09:46,745 --> 00:09:48,204
and it is

247
00:09:48,824 --> 00:09:51,784
really the the banter between, but, I believe

248
00:09:51,784 --> 00:09:53,879
it's James Mason is the actor. Who was

249
00:09:53,879 --> 00:09:55,559
a a close friend of plumbers as well,

250
00:09:55,720 --> 00:09:58,279
and and they give so much joy to

251
00:09:58,279 --> 00:10:00,039
the role, and it... It's it's... And I

252
00:10:00,039 --> 00:10:01,659
think something like a hound of the Ba

253
00:10:01,894 --> 00:10:04,205
people often point to Peter Cushing is the

254
00:10:04,205 --> 00:10:06,458
man who really was the 1 who wholly

255
00:10:06,675 --> 00:10:09,327
embodied Sherlock Holmes, But I think plumber gives

256
00:10:09,558 --> 00:10:10,354
gives really

257
00:10:11,150 --> 00:10:13,219
the sinks his teeth into the role and

258
00:10:13,219 --> 00:10:16,164
does does so effortlessly and makes this despite

259
00:10:16,164 --> 00:10:19,363
all its historical flaws, so eminent watch as

260
00:10:19,363 --> 00:10:21,997
does the director flare of bob Clark who

261
00:10:21,997 --> 00:10:22,715
gives us all this.

262
00:10:23,673 --> 00:10:25,189
Kind of what has become a trope of

263
00:10:25,189 --> 00:10:27,595
the genre in a way is all this

264
00:10:28,788 --> 00:10:31,355
fog and dry ice. And that's come to

265
00:10:31,412 --> 00:10:33,479
be part and parcel of so many accounts

266
00:10:33,479 --> 00:10:35,626
of the ripper murders when in reality, it

267
00:10:35,626 --> 00:10:38,503
was just your typical cool fall night, and

268
00:10:38,503 --> 00:10:39,457
there wasn't anything,

269
00:10:40,014 --> 00:10:42,795
if particularly foggy, there wasn't any snow. It

270
00:10:42,795 --> 00:10:44,783
wasn't any any of these things that are

271
00:10:44,783 --> 00:10:46,947
just there to enrich the experience like some

272
00:10:46,947 --> 00:10:49,023
sort of a Maria Ba film or, some...

273
00:10:49,342 --> 00:10:51,417
Something like that. Just to add this air

274
00:10:51,417 --> 00:10:53,993
of men and in intrigued that wasn't particularly

275
00:10:54,211 --> 00:10:56,785
necessary, but definitely appreciated even if it made

276
00:10:56,785 --> 00:10:58,945
it look like some sort of. Eighties metal

277
00:10:58,945 --> 00:11:01,264
video or or or something like that. And

278
00:11:01,264 --> 00:11:04,004
it it's just funny again, the proliferation of

279
00:11:04,319 --> 00:11:04,819
of

280
00:11:05,191 --> 00:11:07,652
mistakes in this film and no doubt because

281
00:11:07,652 --> 00:11:09,159
it was based on this book with the

282
00:11:09,159 --> 00:11:12,199
very unfortunate title of Jack Ripper the final

283
00:11:12,413 --> 00:11:12,572
solution.

284
00:11:13,464 --> 00:11:17,060
That was penn by Stephen Knight and became

285
00:11:17,300 --> 00:11:19,778
a sort of a d facto bible of,

286
00:11:20,257 --> 00:11:22,575
of, of apology, at least for the time

287
00:11:22,575 --> 00:11:24,427
before they figured out that a lot of

288
00:11:24,427 --> 00:11:26,664
what... A lot of its contents were just

289
00:11:26,664 --> 00:11:27,164
sheer

290
00:11:28,342 --> 00:11:30,989
speculation and and, mistakes and

291
00:11:31,545 --> 00:11:35,434
not exactly the most thorough or or or

292
00:11:35,434 --> 00:11:37,736
scholar production ever committed to film, but it's

293
00:11:37,736 --> 00:11:39,220
something I think from hell

294
00:11:39,579 --> 00:11:41,494
actually dives into as well. So you have

295
00:11:41,494 --> 00:11:44,527
all these little mistakes that make its way

296
00:11:44,527 --> 00:11:45,166
into the film,

297
00:11:45,804 --> 00:11:47,581
the connection between this

298
00:11:48,293 --> 00:11:50,287
I think Duke Clarence, which is a Gods

299
00:11:50,287 --> 00:11:52,600
son of Queen Victoria. But on whom they

300
00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,470
pinned the the murderers despite him being, I

301
00:11:55,470 --> 00:11:57,246
think, in actual history

302
00:11:57,799 --> 00:11:57,959
potentially,

303
00:11:58,839 --> 00:12:01,399
homosexual and not the kind of in cell

304
00:12:01,399 --> 00:12:02,459
that people

305
00:12:02,919 --> 00:12:05,159
suspect to Jack the ripper was, and maybe

306
00:12:05,159 --> 00:12:07,562
someone who contracted a v entrepreneurial disease, someone

307
00:12:07,562 --> 00:12:10,026
who was rejected by women, 1 of these

308
00:12:10,026 --> 00:12:10,526
people

309
00:12:11,298 --> 00:12:12,887
that he doesn't really fit the profile, but

310
00:12:12,887 --> 00:12:15,558
it's just idle speculation because there's very little

311
00:12:15,777 --> 00:12:18,015
really tying him to the scene, but Bob

312
00:12:18,255 --> 00:12:21,531
Clark and Company and the screen play writers

313
00:12:21,691 --> 00:12:23,264
I believe a noted play right. His name

314
00:12:23,464 --> 00:12:25,302
escapes me, but they can cock this big

315
00:12:25,621 --> 00:12:28,737
Masonic connection and infuse this thing with the

316
00:12:28,737 --> 00:12:29,796
all sorts of cons

317
00:12:30,669 --> 00:12:33,143
Mum jumbo, and, particularly in the case of,

318
00:12:33,941 --> 00:12:36,676
speaking of the late great, Donald Sutherland as,

319
00:12:37,214 --> 00:12:40,922
historical footnote Robert Lee. Who as a teen

320
00:12:41,061 --> 00:12:42,040
claimed to have

321
00:12:42,657 --> 00:12:45,292
relayed post messages from Prince Albert to Queen

322
00:12:45,611 --> 00:12:47,607
Victoria. So he was a bit of a

323
00:12:47,607 --> 00:12:48,779
nut job and

324
00:12:49,536 --> 00:12:52,245
actually, in real life looked a bit like

325
00:12:52,245 --> 00:12:54,874
a segment freud, but he's got this mutton

326
00:12:54,874 --> 00:12:55,693
chops and

327
00:12:56,229 --> 00:12:57,981
sutherland is so over the top in this

328
00:12:57,981 --> 00:13:01,032
role. And he believes to be experiencing these

329
00:13:01,032 --> 00:13:03,669
visions of the killings, and he was p

330
00:13:03,669 --> 00:13:07,186
reportedly bringing these to Scotland Yard attention or

331
00:13:07,186 --> 00:13:10,629
whoever the the attending detectives were... And there's

332
00:13:10,629 --> 00:13:12,802
very scant to the non existent

333
00:13:13,258 --> 00:13:15,823
mention of his involvement in a case to

334
00:13:15,823 --> 00:13:17,499
the point that it it was non existent,

335
00:13:17,658 --> 00:13:19,653
but they still ran with this, and he

336
00:13:19,653 --> 00:13:21,808
actually appears I think from Hell as well.

337
00:13:22,207 --> 00:13:23,139
Even though he's

338
00:13:23,498 --> 00:13:23,998
basically

339
00:13:24,455 --> 00:13:28,041
a non entity. And for whatever, his spiritual,

340
00:13:28,519 --> 00:13:28,998
medium,

341
00:13:29,954 --> 00:13:31,171
credentials, they didn't

342
00:13:31,641 --> 00:13:34,103
if they even crossed the desk of an

343
00:13:34,103 --> 00:13:36,723
inspector at all, but would never went further

344
00:13:36,723 --> 00:13:38,391
than that. And, in fact, I think a

345
00:13:38,391 --> 00:13:41,039
an account set that, his name was actually

346
00:13:41,039 --> 00:13:42,000
a miss spelling,

347
00:13:42,959 --> 00:13:44,959
in in referenced in 1 of the p

348
00:13:44,959 --> 00:13:47,279
reported jack, the ripper letters, which I think

349
00:13:47,279 --> 00:13:49,766
was referred to as decks and not leaves,

350
00:13:49,846 --> 00:13:51,591
but it looked kind of similar at 4

351
00:13:51,591 --> 00:13:53,496
letter word and it was actually turned out

352
00:13:53,496 --> 00:13:55,400
to be a reference to detectives or slang

353
00:13:55,400 --> 00:13:57,488
at that point. And speaking of the letter...

354
00:13:57,648 --> 00:13:59,906
Like, when you have really hundreds of letters

355
00:14:00,045 --> 00:14:02,523
taunting the police or crack pots or cranks

356
00:14:02,523 --> 00:14:04,441
or whoever I was trying to just... This

357
00:14:04,441 --> 00:14:05,580
was, like, trolling

358
00:14:06,052 --> 00:14:07,504
hundred 50 years before

359
00:14:07,877 --> 00:14:09,487
online trolling. It's

360
00:14:09,939 --> 00:14:10,598
kind of

361
00:14:11,050 --> 00:14:11,550
ridiculous,

362
00:14:12,002 --> 00:14:12,502
but

363
00:14:13,128 --> 00:14:14,344
well, actual

364
00:14:15,196 --> 00:14:17,980
experts in the subject matter only really attribute

365
00:14:17,980 --> 00:14:19,514
1 letter, and

366
00:14:20,064 --> 00:14:22,858
to the potential per who we all know

367
00:14:22,858 --> 00:14:25,833
is Jack the ripper, and that's largely because

368
00:14:26,291 --> 00:14:29,220
it came complete with a human kidney. And

369
00:14:29,418 --> 00:14:32,443
1 has to imagine even with grave robbing

370
00:14:32,443 --> 00:14:34,751
being so, prevalent at the time that the

371
00:14:34,751 --> 00:14:37,138
human kidney wouldn't exactly be easy to come

372
00:14:37,138 --> 00:14:39,303
by necessarily. And Certainly,

373
00:14:39,941 --> 00:14:41,378
the type of person who would be able

374
00:14:41,378 --> 00:14:41,777
to

375
00:14:42,495 --> 00:14:44,809
you know, procure 1 of these things plus

376
00:14:44,809 --> 00:14:47,059
the tendency to write a letter and do

377
00:14:47,059 --> 00:14:48,737
that. I think is a is a little

378
00:14:48,737 --> 00:14:50,974
bit much for a prank. So... And I

379
00:14:50,974 --> 00:14:52,812
think, some accounts anyway,

380
00:14:53,611 --> 00:14:56,682
believe that that the equivalent

381
00:14:57,778 --> 00:14:58,278
investigators

382
00:14:58,896 --> 00:15:01,769
did link a disease kidney that was taking

383
00:15:01,769 --> 00:15:03,820
taken out of 1 of the victims. So

384
00:15:04,496 --> 00:15:06,325
It's it's also funny too. I mean, this

385
00:15:06,325 --> 00:15:07,916
is a movie that features the top hat.

386
00:15:08,234 --> 00:15:10,835
It also features a stage coach, and

387
00:15:11,833 --> 00:15:14,310
experts of course, point out that there's no

388
00:15:14,310 --> 00:15:17,346
way that the cl cl of of of

389
00:15:17,346 --> 00:15:19,756
horse hoo would have been a thing at

390
00:15:19,756 --> 00:15:21,272
around at the time that,

391
00:15:21,911 --> 00:15:23,587
the murders took place, which is in the

392
00:15:23,587 --> 00:15:25,583
early hours of the morning when people were

393
00:15:25,583 --> 00:15:28,070
settling in to bed. There's no way people

394
00:15:28,070 --> 00:15:29,743
would put up with a horse coming through

395
00:15:29,743 --> 00:15:31,575
a 2 and 3 in the morning. Because

396
00:15:31,575 --> 00:15:32,075
as

397
00:15:32,451 --> 00:15:34,761
today, no 1 would wanna hear that, especially

398
00:15:34,761 --> 00:15:36,925
with hundreds of people trying to get the

399
00:15:36,925 --> 00:15:38,430
a little bit of sleep that they could.

400
00:15:38,668 --> 00:15:40,278
It's just not something

401
00:15:40,650 --> 00:15:41,704
that would

402
00:15:42,076 --> 00:15:45,514
take place, especially given that, you're going into

403
00:15:45,514 --> 00:15:47,754
a very impoverished area and it's almost like

404
00:15:47,754 --> 00:15:49,595
driving around with a ferrari at some point.

405
00:15:49,914 --> 00:15:52,014
If you're gonna go dressed to the nines

406
00:15:52,075 --> 00:15:53,049
in this fancy,

407
00:15:53,688 --> 00:15:56,325
fancy mode of transportation and to go around

408
00:15:56,325 --> 00:15:57,763
and and talk about a way you would

409
00:15:57,763 --> 00:16:00,241
be recognized is if this was your vehicle

410
00:16:00,241 --> 00:16:02,572
as in the case of murdered by decree

411
00:16:02,572 --> 00:16:05,366
where you see this. I believe at some

412
00:16:05,366 --> 00:16:08,559
point the body is dumped out of the

413
00:16:08,559 --> 00:16:10,635
the carriage. So I think they even played

414
00:16:10,635 --> 00:16:11,009
with

415
00:16:11,687 --> 00:16:14,320
with facts there because only 1 of the

416
00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:16,952
5 canonical victims was actually killed indoors. The

417
00:16:16,952 --> 00:16:19,344
rest were killed outdoors. So it they have

418
00:16:19,344 --> 00:16:20,995
there... They're playing fast and loose with the

419
00:16:21,114 --> 00:16:23,023
facts. So not just the facts, man. This

420
00:16:23,023 --> 00:16:25,750
is really, really you know, craziness

421
00:16:26,205 --> 00:16:27,898
and a lot of just

422
00:16:28,368 --> 00:16:31,080
you know, artistic license up the Yin, but

423
00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:34,191
there's no denying how accurately they at least

424
00:16:34,191 --> 00:16:36,584
tried to reproduce these streets and getting back

425
00:16:36,584 --> 00:16:38,753
to Jeff and, we were on this trek,

426
00:16:39,153 --> 00:16:41,331
and we actually did a tour and we

427
00:16:41,550 --> 00:16:44,426
visited Mit Square, which is not even designated

428
00:16:44,426 --> 00:16:46,987
thus anymore. And is where I wanna say

429
00:16:47,067 --> 00:16:49,131
Catherine Ed was found or Mary Kelly. I

430
00:16:49,131 --> 00:16:51,276
can't remember which. You know, this is the

431
00:16:51,276 --> 00:16:53,738
the financial part of London, at least depending

432
00:16:53,738 --> 00:16:54,612
on where you are,

433
00:16:55,741 --> 00:16:58,052
with the the mile spanning the where the

434
00:16:58,052 --> 00:17:00,044
5 different bodies were found. 1 is on

435
00:17:00,044 --> 00:17:02,058
the edge of London it's very, very

436
00:17:02,689 --> 00:17:04,362
corporate and then easy to go out, it

437
00:17:04,362 --> 00:17:05,238
becomes a lot more

438
00:17:05,796 --> 00:17:08,027
well, as it was back then, new immigrants

439
00:17:08,027 --> 00:17:09,244
and more

440
00:17:09,939 --> 00:17:12,091
more gritty. And as you go... As you

441
00:17:12,091 --> 00:17:14,494
travel further east. But it was interesting to

442
00:17:14,494 --> 00:17:14,994
see

443
00:17:15,687 --> 00:17:18,473
the spots where these things took place. I

444
00:17:18,473 --> 00:17:19,905
have some photos on Facebook.

445
00:17:20,318 --> 00:17:23,171
And Buck Rowe has subsequently been renamed to

446
00:17:23,171 --> 00:17:25,311
something else. 1 of the other major streets.

447
00:17:25,548 --> 00:17:27,585
I believe it was Do was renamed to

448
00:17:27,863 --> 00:17:30,254
Now, I think I think Enrique Street, I

449
00:17:30,254 --> 00:17:30,732
don't know. It's...

450
00:17:31,529 --> 00:17:33,601
The the neighborhoods changed so much, but there's

451
00:17:33,601 --> 00:17:36,166
still a few points of interest. Like a

452
00:17:36,166 --> 00:17:37,598
school that was founded in the,

453
00:17:38,235 --> 00:17:40,463
mid nineteenth century that's still there where 1

454
00:17:40,463 --> 00:17:43,144
of the victims was. And it really is

455
00:17:43,583 --> 00:17:46,134
a fascinating case to say the least. And

456
00:17:46,134 --> 00:17:48,126
just by virtue of the fact that there's

457
00:17:48,126 --> 00:17:50,597
been an explosion in suspect, and everyone p

458
00:17:50,597 --> 00:17:53,245
reports to have Oh, now I have the

459
00:17:53,245 --> 00:17:53,745
definitive

460
00:17:54,123 --> 00:17:56,677
answer, and they've claimed to have Dna that's

461
00:17:57,395 --> 00:18:00,122
fail safe and a slam dunk meanwhile. When

462
00:18:00,122 --> 00:18:02,827
you have women who are living in dos

463
00:18:02,827 --> 00:18:04,497
housing, what they call it or what we

464
00:18:04,497 --> 00:18:06,566
would call in these shores, flop house,

465
00:18:07,138 --> 00:18:09,783
or even something as as

466
00:18:10,156 --> 00:18:13,017
barren and basic and and d demeanor as

467
00:18:13,017 --> 00:18:13,993
coffin housing

468
00:18:14,303 --> 00:18:16,773
which is exactly as it sounds, or

469
00:18:17,331 --> 00:18:18,685
I think it was called a a penny.

470
00:18:19,163 --> 00:18:20,996
No, I I forget what it was a

471
00:18:20,996 --> 00:18:21,369
an

472
00:18:21,809 --> 00:18:22,309
penny.

473
00:18:22,849 --> 00:18:23,670
It's it's

474
00:18:24,210 --> 00:18:26,849
some... I think there's a reference to how

475
00:18:26,849 --> 00:18:29,490
the, et ideology or origin of hangover could

476
00:18:29,490 --> 00:18:31,443
have been. That it's

477
00:18:31,820 --> 00:18:32,320
this

478
00:18:32,778 --> 00:18:34,534
basically a bench that you can sit at,

479
00:18:34,773 --> 00:18:36,768
and I think a penny sitter. Something like

480
00:18:36,768 --> 00:18:39,337
that where you... There's a rope drawn across

481
00:18:39,337 --> 00:18:39,577
and your...

482
00:18:40,375 --> 00:18:42,211
You can just sit there and catch some

483
00:18:42,211 --> 00:18:44,947
z's, and then at the end of your

484
00:18:45,165 --> 00:18:47,401
stint after you've paid your 4 or 5

485
00:18:47,401 --> 00:18:50,048
pence. Then they release the rope, it's almost

486
00:18:50,048 --> 00:18:52,202
like some bad night nightclub, and then your

487
00:18:52,202 --> 00:18:54,196
fall down and you wake up. So you're

488
00:18:54,196 --> 00:18:56,748
basically sitting there almost like a bad coach

489
00:18:56,748 --> 00:18:58,915
seat on an airplane or whatever you're sitting

490
00:18:58,915 --> 00:19:00,509
there and this rope is prop you up,

491
00:19:00,907 --> 00:19:02,421
a penny sitter or a hangover,

492
00:19:02,899 --> 00:19:05,369
and this is what the poor w or

493
00:19:05,369 --> 00:19:06,882
as they were called at the time, the

494
00:19:06,882 --> 00:19:07,382
unfortunate

495
00:19:07,854 --> 00:19:10,088
were referred to and that's all they had

496
00:19:10,088 --> 00:19:10,588
to

497
00:19:11,843 --> 00:19:14,397
do to survive is come up with a

498
00:19:14,397 --> 00:19:17,289
4 pens to to state at dos housing

499
00:19:17,289 --> 00:19:19,130
or some sort of lodging or in the

500
00:19:19,130 --> 00:19:20,269
case of all these victims

501
00:19:20,650 --> 00:19:23,309
turning to the world's oldest profession. And

502
00:19:24,022 --> 00:19:25,717
there are some London ce

503
00:19:26,172 --> 00:19:27,207
where you can see

504
00:19:28,083 --> 00:19:31,029
markers of grave sites where people have left

505
00:19:31,029 --> 00:19:33,356
pennies as a tribute the victims who didn't

506
00:19:33,356 --> 00:19:33,856
have

507
00:19:34,233 --> 00:19:36,865
enough... Didn't have the requisite forfeit to be

508
00:19:36,865 --> 00:19:40,375
able to find safe if very demo and

509
00:19:40,375 --> 00:19:43,339
crowded lodging at the times. So anyway, a

510
00:19:43,339 --> 00:19:45,969
murder by decree is so, you know, full

511
00:19:45,969 --> 00:19:46,469
of

512
00:19:47,164 --> 00:19:49,793
atmosphere, and, there's a scene by the T

513
00:19:49,793 --> 00:19:51,626
that's a I really remember as a kid

514
00:19:51,626 --> 00:19:53,790
that was really impactful as well with,

515
00:19:54,427 --> 00:19:55,086
I think

516
00:19:55,541 --> 00:19:58,088
sherlock holmes trying to command boats to try

517
00:19:58,088 --> 00:20:00,157
and, catch up to a suspect. I don't

518
00:20:00,157 --> 00:20:01,724
remember the details exactly, but

519
00:20:02,401 --> 00:20:03,594
Bob Clark gives us,

520
00:20:04,310 --> 00:20:06,457
hefty atmosphere and the performance is a great.

521
00:20:06,617 --> 00:20:08,287
I mean, you got John Gill good in

522
00:20:08,287 --> 00:20:10,771
this thing. You've got Jean vie B y,

523
00:20:11,169 --> 00:20:13,343
who is from a dead ringer, a Canadian

524
00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:14,298
actress from Montreal,

525
00:20:15,153 --> 00:20:18,101
the appointment I mentioned James Mason, Christopher Plum,

526
00:20:18,594 --> 00:20:20,907
And, of course, the lake Great Donald Sutherland,

527
00:20:21,066 --> 00:20:22,103
who was the star of 1 of my

528
00:20:22,103 --> 00:20:23,459
favorite horror movies of all time.

529
00:20:24,256 --> 00:20:25,532
Invasion of the body snatch is, of course,

530
00:20:25,691 --> 00:20:27,900
the 78 remake, which is

531
00:20:28,657 --> 00:20:30,730
maybe the second best remake of all time

532
00:20:30,730 --> 00:20:32,643
after the fly, But I mean, my god,

533
00:20:32,882 --> 00:20:35,035
the this was... I mean, it's always a

534
00:20:35,035 --> 00:20:37,280
joy to revisit this 1 and it still

535
00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,186
gives me the chills to see that opening

536
00:20:39,186 --> 00:20:40,933
scene and amidst the fog, and it really

537
00:20:40,933 --> 00:20:42,227
is like, the

538
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:44,268
cinematography is weird. It's like, it's a bit

539
00:20:44,268 --> 00:20:45,935
hard to make things out, and I think

540
00:20:45,935 --> 00:20:48,840
that's by design. And I think it's

541
00:20:49,216 --> 00:20:50,092
quite interesting,

542
00:20:51,367 --> 00:20:53,611
especially how Sherlock Holmes is tasked to be

543
00:20:53,611 --> 00:20:56,149
called into action by the the citizens committee,

544
00:20:56,863 --> 00:20:57,181
who's

545
00:20:57,815 --> 00:21:00,036
in whose membership included mister Lu.

546
00:21:01,007 --> 00:21:03,479
To whom 1 of the famous letters was

547
00:21:03,479 --> 00:21:03,718
addressed.

548
00:21:04,355 --> 00:21:06,986
Catch me if you can. Right? So the

549
00:21:06,986 --> 00:21:10,511
taunting, almost Bt k style. Of of detectives

550
00:21:10,511 --> 00:21:12,028
and and maybe you could throw in the

551
00:21:12,188 --> 00:21:13,885
Zodiac killer as well. So

552
00:21:14,263 --> 00:21:15,561
really a a fascinating

553
00:21:16,259 --> 00:21:17,956
character from history, a fascinating

554
00:21:18,509 --> 00:21:21,084
part of the city to visit, and it's

555
00:21:21,143 --> 00:21:22,499
it's so funny. Like, I mean, it was

556
00:21:22,579 --> 00:21:24,175
Jeff first time to the city, but there's

557
00:21:24,175 --> 00:21:25,852
was a few key things that we didn't

558
00:21:25,852 --> 00:21:27,703
even get a chance to see.

559
00:21:28,661 --> 00:21:30,677
I wanna even say it was maybe

560
00:21:31,055 --> 00:21:33,471
Saint. Paul's Cathedral. There... There's a few

561
00:21:33,849 --> 00:21:36,418
key things that we may have overlooked in

562
00:21:36,418 --> 00:21:38,431
the city of London as we're just busy

563
00:21:38,568 --> 00:21:41,275
going checking out Camden and the electric Avenue

564
00:21:41,275 --> 00:21:43,185
and all these different kinds of places that...

565
00:21:43,981 --> 00:21:44,141
Like,

566
00:21:44,794 --> 00:21:47,035
this is a city that requires just, you,

567
00:21:47,115 --> 00:21:48,794
you know, maybe a month or 2 months

568
00:21:48,794 --> 00:21:51,595
to to visit to get a more drawn

569
00:21:51,595 --> 00:21:53,528
out understanding of it. And at the time,

570
00:21:53,607 --> 00:21:55,841
we podcast hands of the ripper from the

571
00:21:55,841 --> 00:21:59,510
seventies other fun and very, very artistic license,

572
00:21:59,829 --> 00:22:02,142
well, creative interpretation of what happened way back

573
00:22:02,142 --> 00:22:02,914
when. And

574
00:22:03,594 --> 00:22:05,831
quite compelling in its own right, but I

575
00:22:05,831 --> 00:22:08,308
have a special connection to this 19 79

576
00:22:08,308 --> 00:22:08,548
effort.

577
00:22:09,747 --> 00:22:11,839
Of course, due to my fondness of for

578
00:22:11,999 --> 00:22:14,393
Bob Clark and Black Christmas, which was film,

579
00:22:14,552 --> 00:22:16,387
not a 15 minute drive North of may

580
00:22:16,387 --> 00:22:19,555
here, but, yeah, you gotta you gotta love

581
00:22:20,151 --> 00:22:22,380
neurology. It shows no signs of ab bait,

582
00:22:22,936 --> 00:22:25,107
so much in into, so much

583
00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:27,049
excitement and

584
00:22:27,488 --> 00:22:28,705
it really is

585
00:22:29,481 --> 00:22:32,271
re... It resonates through time because the issues

586
00:22:32,271 --> 00:22:35,561
that resonated and affected them that then

587
00:22:36,428 --> 00:22:39,863
racial tensions, poverty, wealth and inequality, police in,

588
00:22:40,950 --> 00:22:43,171
extreme poverty, all these things are probably gonna

589
00:22:43,171 --> 00:22:46,376
be with us. For time memorial. So if

590
00:22:46,376 --> 00:22:48,693
it's fascinating to see how this was tackled,

591
00:22:48,853 --> 00:22:51,010
but I would certainly like to see a

592
00:22:51,010 --> 00:22:51,510
straight

593
00:22:52,383 --> 00:22:53,680
Jack the ripper filmic

594
00:22:54,057 --> 00:22:56,689
adaptation that just plays with everything right down,

595
00:22:57,167 --> 00:22:57,487
you know,

596
00:22:58,523 --> 00:23:00,437
Donald Rumble below, I believe is 1 of

597
00:23:00,437 --> 00:23:01,289
the the

598
00:23:01,808 --> 00:23:04,519
the... 1 of the foremost authors, maybe follow

599
00:23:04,519 --> 00:23:06,911
1 of his books and and speakers or

600
00:23:06,911 --> 00:23:09,383
someone who that was bona fide. Can't be

601
00:23:09,383 --> 00:23:10,020
a questioned.

602
00:23:10,433 --> 00:23:12,652
Someone with a really solid understanding and not

603
00:23:12,652 --> 00:23:14,895
veer into this miso masonic

604
00:23:15,346 --> 00:23:17,351
royal mum jumbo and just sticking

605
00:23:17,739 --> 00:23:19,893
to the basics and maybe incorporate a little

606
00:23:19,893 --> 00:23:21,967
bit more about the victim's life. I think

607
00:23:21,967 --> 00:23:23,403
that'd be very impactful and I think it'd

608
00:23:23,403 --> 00:23:25,652
be very interesting to see on the silver

609
00:23:25,652 --> 00:23:27,726
screen. Anyway, hope you enjoyed the show. We'll

610
00:23:27,726 --> 00:23:28,922
talk you soon. Take care.