You're listening to the PT Pinecast,
where smart people in healthcare come to
make noise.
Here's your host, Jimmy McKay.
Amit, thanks for hosting my show.
Is that what we're doing?
Feels like it.
We're going to flip things around.
Here,
usually I'm on the left and now I'll
switch.
Now I'm on the right.
Good.
Now I'm in the guest chair.
I am the host interviewing you this time.
And people who listen to this will get
an idea of why we're doing what we're
doing with this stuff.
And I think this was spurred from an
idea that you and I had when we
were doing the NBA thing.
And I said, you know,
you provide such a great thing
for everybody and opportunities to voice
our opinion about what's going on in the
industry.
You voice your opinion.
But how many people know your origin story
and know you?
And I'm going to get into it.
And I kind of figured out,
let me figure out how to use AI.
AI's in here doing all this stuff.
And I said, you know what?
I said to AI, I said, this host,
Jimmy McKay, you know,
what could I ask him?
What questions could I ask him if I
was the actual host?
So if this stuff is
talking about things that you didn't do,
then obviously I put the wrong Jimmy McKay
in.
I'm curious to find out.
I'm eager.
Yeah, let's see what it says.
So basically,
I'm going to read off questions and I
can't do it like a DJ like you.
So everybody out there, forgive me,
but I'll do my best.
So Jimmy,
you went from a rock radio physical
therapy.
Wait, what does it say?
You went from rock radio to physical
therapy.
Yep.
What was the moment that made you decide
to take that leap,
to go from rock radio to physical therapy?
Oh, I know exactly when it was.
I was driving home from the radio station
one day.
So like, I'll set this up.
All I wanted,
I did the morning announcements in sixth
grade.
then said i don't know what this is
but this is cool i went to college
for journalism and communications i ran
the college radio station for three years
and when i say college radio station small
tiny little upstate new york um catholic
school you know it's probably nine people
listening to the radio station when i did
my first show at like midnight no idea
what even physical therapy was at the time
no no no yeah i'm twenty one years
old right i all i want to do
is be a radio dj
And I worked the college radio station.
I get internships.
I wound up getting an internship one year
for a big station in New York.
If you're in,
if you're in New York area,
you knew as K rock,
it was WXRK where Howard Stern was like
based out of.
So he was simulcasted,
but that was the station.
That was like sort of my last internship.
And that was, I mean,
just an insane summer.
After that,
I got to come back home to the
Hudson Valley,
New York and run my hometown radio station
or help run my hometown radio station.
I was on the air and then I
would do off the air stuff.
So like dream job.
So I'm twenty one years old.
I have my dream job.
Right.
Fast forward a couple of years.
I moved to a bigger station and a
bigger market.
I get to do a little more.
Eventually,
my boss moves on to a bigger job.
I get to now take over my boss's
job.
I now have my dream job.
Eleven year old Jimmy McKay is now
Could not be happier.
I run a rock radio station.
I have a radio show five hours a
day.
I help other.
We just make up contests, give away.
The goal is just be interesting or try
to be interesting or be entertaining.
Right.
I'm doing that for several years.
And then in two thousand and eight to
get to your question,
when was the moment I knew I had
to make the jump is I had the
my iPhone.
We didn't call it the iPhone seventeen.
It was just iPhone.
the first one that came out, right?
It wasn't even iPhone one,
it was just iPhone.
And someone had texted me a link to
listen to something.
And I like pressed it in my car
and I have my car like plugged into
like my aux cord to my stereo.
And I was listening,
they sent me a link to listen to
a live stream from a radio station in
California when I was in Pennsylvania.
And I remember just thinking like,
wait a second,
you can do radio over this thing?
Like,
What does that mean?
And like,
it was like stuttery and buffery in two
thousand and eight.
But in my brain, I was like,
where does this go?
What happens when this gets less stuttery
and less buffery and gets better?
And went back to work the next day
and was like, hey, everybody,
we need to pay attention to this.
And nobody in the room thought this was
a threat at all.
And I looked at this as a thread
up and down.
And I didn't know what the jump was
going to be.
But I was like,
radio is not going to be the same
in ten years.
And I was like twenty eight at the
time.
I'm like,
what am I going to do for the
next thirty years of my life?
So went to go to law school,
got halfway through the Kaplan prep course
before I was like, no,
not I have no idea what language this
is.
I did a year of business school,
didn't mind that, but I didn't love it.
Um,
and then I was a weekend warrior
triathlete and the guy in charge of like
our bike rides was sort of a,
was a PT.
And I was like, this seems cool.
This seems interesting.
It seems people centered and hung up
everything I do.
Well,
I still needed like a year of
prerequisites.
So I was still like taking classes while
I was in the radio studio.
Um,
so I did that for a couple of
years until I got into PT school and
that was it.
So that's, that's,
that's where the change came from.
So while you're in PT school, you see,
obviously you're learning anatomy,
which is very different than being a DJ.
Did you at any point while you're in
PT school realize, Hey, you know,
I have a different, not take on things,
but my communication skill is very
different than some of these other
people's communication skills.
How do I meld the two together?
Or what can I use from my radio
background to make this more interesting?
Or were you just like,
I want to get through PT school.
I just want to be a clinician.
Yeah, I think the last one,
I think literally I looking back or what
I would tell someone is like,
if you have these different skills,
lean into them.
I think I was trying to just blend
in.
Like, no, I can.
I was trying to prove myself because a
lot of people were tenured.
Most of my class was ten years younger
than me.
So I was just trying to like, no,
I can do this.
I can keep up.
I can learn and I'm smart here.
It was probably like in the second year
of PT school when we went to do
like subjective exam.
And I remember my classmates were like,
very much like,
what are the nine questions I need to
ask?
And I'm like, well,
you don't just ask one and then wait
for the answer,
then pick your next question.
And to some of them, that was like...
gibberish.
They were like, no, no, no, no.
I need to memorize nine,
the nine questions.
We're going to be graded on this.
And I'm like, no,
like ask a question and then let that
answer dictate your next question.
But I never,
it wasn't until I accidentally started a
podcast.
Did I ever actually,
and even then I started it as a
goof.
Like I didn't think it was going to
be a thing and I'm still not sure
what the hell it is.
I think it's just art imitating life,
but no,
I'd love to say it was strategic.
It wasn't.
We got PT podcast,
which I call a media company,
but you know, so tell me this,
you've done hundreds of episodes.
What conversations changed the way you
think about our profession?
Everybody's in there giving their takes on
different things.
Is there something that you've heard that
you were like, Oh,
this changes the way I've been thinking
about things.
Um, most of them do.
Most of them change it.
Maybe it's not like the most profound,
you know, world changing way,
but I'll give an example.
I was probably like seven or eight months
in
maybe a year and change into the podcast.
I was getting close to graduating.
And we went on a service learning trip
to Costa Rica.
So we spent two weeks in an orphanage
in Costa Rica at the end of PT
school.
And I was like, this is cool.
But I still have no idea what the
hell I'm going to do when I graduate.
Everybody else is like locking up jobs.
They know exactly what setting they're
going to be in and where they're going
to work.
And I had no idea.
I was still like,
I don't think I belong here.
Just felt,
always felt like the black sheep.
And I met a kid in Costa Rica
who had muscular dystrophy.
And he had the greatest attitude on life
and didn't own his own clothing.
And yet woke up every day like the
happiest person on the planet.
Lived in an orphanage.
Isn't that just incredible?
I was like,
I couldn't wait to go down there and
show...
the people who worked in the orphanage and
the people down there, how much we knew.
And then that was the exact opposite is
I wound up learning from that.
So the thing that pissed me off was
he,
he just sat in a tilt and space
wheelchair all day.
He had some wrist function.
And I remember turning to a professor and
said,
if he was in the U S what
would he have technology wise?
And she was like, Oh, he'd have a,
probably have a power wheelchair,
but
Use this as learning experience.
How do you like price one of those?
How do you build one of those?
So we use like, you know,
company's website and she was asking me
questions and I was answering and then she
built it and she's like, now,
how much do you think this costs?
And I was like, I don't know,
fifteen grand.
She's like probably about thirty three.
And I was like, wow,
it was I think it was a little
more.
And I just started the podcast.
And then I was just pissed that like,
here's this kid who's got this great
outlook on life and he's just not going
to get this thing that could change his
minute to minute existence because he's
what?
He's born in Costa Rica and that's it.
So we started a GoFundMe page that night.
So the night the service ordering trip
ended, spring break started for a week.
So instead of flying home,
some of us stayed in Costa Rica and
had a couple bottles of rum.
And instead of me doing backflips into the
pool the first night,
I was at the kitchen counter figuring out,
how do you get thirty three grand for
a kid who doesn't own his own clothes?
So I just started doing episodes about it
and said, give me ten bucks,
give me ten bucks,
give me one hundred bucks.
And companies started coming on board.
People would be like,
here's a hundred bucks, you know, here,
just giving and never asking for anything
in return.
So I think we raised thirty three thousand
dollars in sixty six days.
Wow.
And so you asked me like what the
what the interview or the episode was that
showed me something.
It sort of showed me that like you
can use your familiar skills in unfamiliar
ways if you really lock on to a
goal.
Um, so like my goal was like,
I want to make sure I at least
accomplished something by the time I
graduated.
And that was the thing I was like,
I don't know what this,
these two things are connected,
but they're connected somehow.
So do you use your PT podcast company
or PT podcast website to help other,
let's say, um,
companies launch their own podcast or
their own companies to launch their own
podcast?
I've done that, but before we hit record,
um,
Gosh, healthcare.
Before I came to healthcare, I was like,
healthcare is just this big,
stable thing that has lots of money and
lots of smart people.
And this will be great.
Once I get in, I'm in.
And then I get here and realize what
margins are.
Yeah.
What margins are and what PT margins are.
And then, you know, I mean,
it's not like radio is unregulated,
but it wasn't as highly regulated.
Maybe it's, you know,
obviously healthcare should be regulated.
But like,
I remember just like talking to smart
people and watching them just be so like,
I understand your idea is good, Jimmy,
but like, it can't happen in healthcare.
And in the beginning being like,
I'll prove you wrong.
And most of them were like,
I'd love for you to prove me wrong.
They weren't doing it to be difficult.
So I've helped people.
It's a different planet.
Healthcare is a different planet.
I've been in it almost as long as
I was in radio.
And I can see the differences.
So yeah,
I've done a little bit of everything.
I threw a party at CSM a couple
years ago.
um where the thing was i was a
little pissed off i was like we all
come together we drop tens of you know
thousands and thousands of dollars on
hotel rooms and money and renting out a
conference center as a profession we go to
a city and drop lots of money but
i'm like where's the give where's the
where's the as soon as we leave and
you know the accounting association comes
in next week no one knows we were
here so i was like you can do
cool stuff
and make an impact.
So I rented out the San Diego Children's
Museum,
got liquor and a band and a comedian
and music and the whole nine.
And I raised one hundred twenty five
thousand dollars,
spent ninety and then gave the margin away
to three nonprofits.
And then I gave away how I did
it in a YouTube video and was waiting
for everybody to come Russian and steal
the idea.
And no one did so.
Yeah,
I don't I look at things differently,
but I also understand that there are rules
Yeah.
Well, you definitely give back.
I mean,
that's the whole reason that I was here,
and that's the reason I'm asking you
questions.
You served on the Foundation of Physical
Therapy Research Board of Trustees.
You've worked with the Academy of
Orthopedic PT.
You've held roles in Fox Rehab and Mount
Sinai.
What drives you to keep saying yes to
these opportunities?
Is it a meld of something?
What is it?
Yeah, there's a good fight.
Yeah.
I talked to a buddy who's sort of
a semi-career coach not long ago,
and we built this fictitious...
Because I'm like,
I don't know where to go.
For me,
there's no job description that I can
typically apply for.
Sometimes there are.
A marketing or communications role would
be a good fit sometimes.
But there's not a ton of them out
there.
And he literally said,
but what's the difference?
Why don't you just... So he said,
he's like...
if I gave you as much money as
you think you need all the resources and
you're going to go work at Samsung and
you're going to sell TVs,
would you want to do it?
And I was like, no.
And he's like, why?
And I'm like, there's no good fight there.
You know,
I'm not worried that the world is lacking
TVs or whatever.
And he's like, right.
So he's like,
you got to look for that.
So,
and it might seem like there wasn't a
good fight in radio, but there was like,
When you work for a radio station,
you try to make the radio station cool
because you have to build up audience.
So people think the product of a radio
station is the radio station.
It's not.
The product of a radio station is the
audience that you build every day.
Because then you take that audience and
you turn to a car dealer,
a restaurant franchise in your local
community and you go,
I can marry my audience to your needs.
I can put those things together.
And I like it because the audience never
paid for...
us to listen to us.
They voted with their time every single
day, every hour, every minute.
And if we earned it,
we had to earn it.
And we knew who our audience,
we knew what we owed them.
So I look at that in healthcare where
I'm like,
I know you're good at what you're doing,
but you have to earn their attention
before they think of you.
And I don't think that's on the first
things for people who own their own health
practices to think about.
Yeah.
Well,
you spent years putting other people's
stories out there.
What's something about your own journey
and in our profession that no one knows
about?
That no one knows?
I talk a lot,
so I don't know if there's anything that
people don't know about.
I think the funny part is I forget
that new people come to listen all the
time.
And I feel like I've told my story,
you know, fifty times in the last decade.
But still, when people come in,
they don't
they don't start with my background.
You know what I mean?
Like I remember someone's like,
I've been listening for three or four
years.
I just found out you used to be
in radio.
It makes complete sense.
And I'm like, how'd you not know that?
But I'm like,
I don't start every conversation with
that.
So I think like people need to remind,
people need to be reminded that a lot
of times they're interacting with you for
the first time.
But really the goal is them.
The goal is I make sure whatever I'm
doing is valuable to you or you're going
to stop listening or they get focused on.
Right.
So is there anything that people don't
know about me?
I don't know.
Well, you sit at a rare intersection,
and I was saying this to you before
too,
of clinical knowledge and professional
communication, right?
Which is very different than the typical
PT.
Where do you think that combination is
needed most right now in healthcare?
Oh,
right now in healthcare is making sure
that organizations can find the right
clinicians, right?
It used to be patient acquisition,
making sure people know what we do and
get them.
And from all the people that I talked
to, they're like, that's a problem,
but not in our top three right now.
We need to find and keep talent.
And then I come in and I go,
why can't you?
I just start doing what a PT does.
But it's also what a good journalist or
communicator does, which is like,
what are you doing now?
Who are you looking for?
Why can't you find them?
What have you tried that's worked?
What hasn't worked?
Let's write that down.
What are you trying to communicate?
Show me now how you're doing that.
And let's dissect what you're doing.
Because it's a shame to have a great
service or product
That could really help people,
not like just selling TVs.
And the reason you can't deliver more of
it is you can't find the right people.
And there are the right people out there.
So I didn't expect that because I don't
think that was the problem ten years ago.
It definitely was not the problem ten
years ago.
So that's the big one for me.
Ten years ago was explaining to patients
that we weren't personal trainers,
that we were physical therapists.
And how can you come to us and
what can we do for you as opposed
to a massage therapist?
It was just convincing people.
Now it's how do we get more people
into the profession or how do we recruit
more people?
Because we have now delivered a service
that people recognize and want.
How do we get more clinicians that want
to stay and they'll get burned out and
just enjoy what they do and wake up
in the morning wanting to help people?
Correct.
So I think in radio,
one of the things I got to do
or had to do was listen both ways.
So it wasn't just like, here's this thing,
audience, listen to it.
It was really like,
how do I pay attention to it?
Like, they don't like this.
okay, well then do I,
at what point do I stop doing whatever
it is that they don't like, right?
If one person doesn't like it,
that's nothing.
But if ten or a hundred of them
don't like it, that's signal.
So I do sit at that intersection where
I talk to a lot of clinicians and
a lot of owners and I'm saying,
you know, they're begging for mentorship.
What do you have?
I'm like, oh,
we put mentorship on the website.
And I'm like,
is there a program for that?
Yeah.
Is it good?
Nah, it could be better.
Or it is good.
How do you communicate that?
We say mentorship.
You say mentorship, they hear nothing.
They hear vagueness.
So it is,
I know people know me as the guy
who talks a lot,
but I do pay attention.
I do read and listen a lot because
that's the way to know what to talk
about, in my opinion.
Right.
Well, as far as you're headed, okay,
if the right opportunity landed in front
of you tomorrow,
one that fully used both your peaky brain
and your media skills,
what does that look like?
One of two situations for me,
because I'd like to stay in the
profession.
I really would.
It would either be working for a practice,
and I guess they would have to be
large enough to be able to hire someone
like me.
So we'll say like a mid-size to large
practice and help them just make their
good work well known so that they can
attract the people that they're a good fit
for.
I'd rather have them have...
half as many applications but have the
batting average of those half of those
applications be higher as in half the
amount of people apply next year but of
those people twice as many are good fits
and stick around for two to five years
so that's one side the other is i
do think there's a lot of opportunity for
technology
And I do hear from a lot of
technology people who are just like,
I made this great app or I made
this great platform and everyone's going
to buy it and love it.
All I got to do is buy some
apps.
And I'm like, yes, my friend,
I really wish it was that easy because
we'd have all this technology all over the
place that worked.
Right.
So I think there's some,
I think that's all because practice owners
are inundated with this is the next thing.
This is the next thing powered by AI.
Here's where it is.
So I think it's marrying the right people.
So a practice to the right clinician or
the technology to the right company to
make the best impact.
I don't want to just do more.
I want to do more right.
And I think that's simple,
but not necessarily easy all the time.
yeah i get it well what does it
feel like to be on the other side
of the mic being interviewed a little out
of control right because because do you do
more talking with me asking questions and
you're talking a lot or is it usually
the other way and while you're playing
you're playing tetris yeah i get to listen
a lot more uh when i'm when i'm
you know when i'm on your seat and
then i get to sort of
i just look at like everything someone's
talking about is like a point in the
middle of a dry erase board and then
i'm just wondering how does that apply to
this or how does that apply to that
because there's a straight line between
any two points you learn that in you
know fifth grade geometry and that's sort
of how i look about how i look
at topics or what we're talking about was
like okay how would that affect this or
what now or what next or how would
you i mean one of the one of
the first like ideas for launching the
podcast
I sat in a room full of,
I don't know,
a thousand people at a conference and
listened to someone on stage and they
were, you know,
yammering on about something that was
going over my head.
And I just assumed it was because I
was a second year student.
Well,
I meet him in the bar an hour
later and over two pints of beer,
I realized I understood everything that
guy was saying,
but he was on stage and he was
all buttoned up and he was a presenter
here.
We're having a conversation there.
He was doing a presentation and one beats
the other.
So I was like,
if I could do smart conversations at
scale,
Gosh, yeah, I mean,
the show's got like five or six million
downloads in the last couple of years.
Like it's a lot of just like information
bumping around in a digestible way.
Look where we are now with AI.
You could figure anything out,
but the problem is now you can figure
everything out.
What thing do you work on?
Now it's not the lack of information or
processing.
Now it's,
you have to focus on one thing.
What am I going to focus on?
It's wild.
Yeah.
It is wild, yeah.
Unfortunately,
sometimes you chase shiny objects,
but yeah.
Overwhelm.
Absolute overwhelm.
Completely agree.
Absolutely.
Anything that we did not touch upon that
you want everybody to know about you?
No, I mean, one thing you said,
you know,
is like my communication skill when I was
going through PT school,
I think a lot of people will undervalue
their own ability to communicate.
And the way they do it is they
try to over professionalize it where I
want people to keep it simple.
I'm like, you can only ask six questions,
right?
Who, what, where, when, why, how?
Like, that's it.
Now there's variations of those things.
Well,
I've seen your LinkedIn posts and you keep
it pretty simple.
I will tell you that.
It's like your superpower.
You simplify something and then you get a
lot of people interacting and people jump
on it and want to interact on it
because they're like, hey,
I have something to add to this.
They look at it like an open door.
I can understand this.
Now,
there are some things that require more
nuance and can get complicated.
But the person who can take a complicated
thing and explain it simply,
he really understands it.
I think that was Einstein.
If you can't explain it simply,
you don't understand it.
That might take a little longer,
but that was, I think, our problem.
And I think our profession has gotten
better at that in communicating what our
value is.
When you say I'm valuable, I'm like,
great, show me.
Can you point to the value?
Point to the outcome.
Um, I, that,
that's why I'm still bullish on,
on PT and healthcare is we're now in
a society that really values wellness.
And the one thing you can't,
the one thing you really own, right?
Your health.
Um,
and I think people are willing to lean
in a lot more now lean into doing
the work for that than they were maybe
ten or fifteen years ago.
And I think that's a good thing.
It's a good position to be in.
Yeah.
I think,
I think overall the APTA profession or the
APTA, you know, had,
had put a lot of value on what
we did and how to convince people and
just educate people, the public, right.
And they went hard at it and, and,
and I've seen it and that has changed.
Now I see them putting their sites on
reimbursement and educating re you know,
payers and things.
So, you know,
let's see if something comes there too,
because that would be great.
Agreed.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's great.
I think that's all the questions that I
could come up with that I felt like
they were intriguing enough and not
boring.
How did I do as a host?
You seemed curious.
I think that's all you need.
I mean,
and hosting a podcast or hosting a video
and talking to a patient for the first
time or the hundredth time,
I think it's the same thing.
right?
I mean,
Chris Voss is a hostage negotiator.
He said,
every conversation is a negotiation for
information.
I either want you to know something or
I'm trying to get information from you or
to you.
That's it.
Yeah.
So I know like a lot of times
it'll feel like, uh, um,
Well,
that's funny because it sounds very
similar to what I used to tell our
new PTs that would come in and they
were like, oh,
I don't like sales and things like that.
I said,
you understand that everything is sales.
When you go with your girlfriend to a
movie theater and you want this movie and
she wants that movie,
you're selling your idea.
When you're going to watch Netflix,
you're selling your idea.
When you go to a meal,
you're selling your idea.
That's all that is.
If you believe in what we do and
you believe that you can help the person,
you're not selling them.
You're educating them so they can make the
right choice.
Agreed.
And I'll even actually further bring the
crossbars closer,
which is I make suggestions,
but you make decisions.
So I know people are like,
I sold that.
I'm like, you explained it.
They still had to decide to buy or
do, right?
So we've heard this phrase before.
It's like,
you're pushing too hard on the sale.
And that makes the person just sort of
go, and you've heard, I've heard,
listened to really great salespeople say,
don't oversell.
Don't talk past the sell, right?
Explain it and then learn when to shut
up
Because that's the key.
They're going to now decide, yay or nay,
do I want to invest time, effort,
or money?
And that's really all you can invest,
time, effort,
or money into getting an outcome.
Your job is not to get them to
buy.
It's to explain as well as you can
what it is and what it solves,
what it does in the future,
and then let them decide.
I make suggestions, but ultimately,
whoever they is, they make decisions.
I get it.
I may have a little bit of a
different take on some of those things,
though.
I will tell you,
if I'm talking to somebody that I care
about,
let's say it was my mom or a
family member,
I will overcome their barriers to
something.
If they're like, no,
I don't want to do this.
Okay, well,
explain why you don't want to do it.
Well, sorry, that's a barrier.
You're still explaining the whole time.
Unless you got a gun...
Unless you got a gun.
Yeah, you're not forcing them, correct.
They have to decide.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So absolutely, like I make suggestions,
you make decisions.
But ultimately, unless I'm robbing you,
which is a pretty,
it's still a suggestion, right?
You can still decide if I got the
gun in my hand.
But really, it's like,
especially what we do in PT,
it's behavior change.
And you've been with people, you're like,
you're going to do this for a week
and you're going to stop.
I know it.
That's true because they weren't bought
in.
They weren't bought in and it wasn't their
idea.
They just kind of did it because they
got forced into it.
So there's truth to that,
a hundred percent truth to that.
We make suggestions and some people
suggest better than others.
A hundred percent agree.
Yes.
Some people are like, do this.
No.
Okay, moving on.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
There's an art and a science to this,
which is-
I was working with someone this morning
and there's an acronym called PESO,
Problem, Agitation, Solution, Outcome.
So it's a paradigm.
Don't you hate when ants start coming in
your house in the spring?
Ants can lead to infestations and damage.
Uh,
but putting these two dollar ant traps
around your house,
a hundred percent removes all the ants.
They, they eat it, they go home,
they die.
And now you never have to worry about
ants in your house.
Problem solved.
agitation, solution, outcome.
Look at any infomercial.
That's the order.
They go P-A-S-O, P-A-S-O.
They just repeat, repeat, repeat.
And then that's all they can do.
They suggest, they suggest, they suggest.
Do you want this outcome?
Yes.
And you have to do this.
Got it.
What's it cost?
Nineteen ninety five.
And operators are standing by while
supplies last.
Jimmy,
I'm always following you on LinkedIn,
but are there other channels that we
should follow you on that?
I do the, the,
the big four right now,
which is also my suggestion.
If you don't like.
playing or or consuming on a channel don't
go there so i do linkedin facebook
instagram youtube just because to me uh i
like like i don't do tiktok should i
haven't figured out your tiktok dances yet
i haven't done tiktok yes no no no
next but those are the big four that
i'm on
Nice.
Very nice.
Well,
thanks for the opportunity to interview
you.
Thank you.
I enjoyed it.
It was kind of fun sitting on this
side as opposed to the other side.
Yeah.
We'll figure out something for another
episode.
Sounds great.
I appreciate you interviewing me.
Thanks for making it not feel weird.
All right.
Thanks.
That's it for this one,
but we're just getting warmed up.
Smash follow, send it to a friend,
or crank up the next episode.
Want to go deeper?
Hit us at pgpiecast.com or find us on
YouTube and socials at pgpiecast.
And legally, none of this was advice.
It's for entertainment purposes only.
Bullshit!
See, Keith?
We read the script.
Happy now?