1 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:11,039 Hello, and welcome to the Physics World Weekly 2 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:11,539 Podcast. 3 00:00:11,839 --> 00:00:13,059 I'm Hamish Johnston. 4 00:00:13,625 --> 00:00:14,125 Today, 5 00:00:14,425 --> 00:00:17,324 I'm going to explore the science and art 6 00:00:17,545 --> 00:00:19,085 of quantum steampunk 7 00:00:19,464 --> 00:00:21,085 with a theoretical physicist 8 00:00:21,464 --> 00:00:22,285 and a sculptor. 9 00:00:22,984 --> 00:00:26,125 But first, I'd like to thank Atlas Technologies 10 00:00:26,585 --> 00:00:29,390 for their generous support of this episode. 11 00:00:34,969 --> 00:00:37,950 This episode is supported by Atlas Technologies. 12 00:00:38,969 --> 00:00:40,030 Atlas custom 13 00:00:40,329 --> 00:00:41,629 aluminum and titanium 14 00:00:42,090 --> 00:00:43,070 vacuum chambers 15 00:00:43,435 --> 00:00:46,975 and hermetically sealed bonded bimetal components 16 00:00:47,594 --> 00:00:49,534 are used in quantum applications, 17 00:00:50,315 --> 00:00:52,255 physics labs, and semiconductor 18 00:00:52,715 --> 00:00:53,215 fabs. 19 00:00:53,594 --> 00:00:56,734 And they're built in a fully integrated facility 20 00:00:57,210 --> 00:00:58,670 with on-site design, 21 00:00:59,050 --> 00:01:00,829 development, and manufacturing 22 00:01:01,289 --> 00:01:01,789 capabilities. 23 00:01:02,649 --> 00:01:05,469 Let Atlas help you solve your next 24 00:01:05,770 --> 00:01:07,069 engineering challenge. 25 00:01:07,609 --> 00:01:12,109 Learn more at atlasuhv.com. 26 00:01:18,295 --> 00:01:20,295 Earlier this year, I had the pleasure of 27 00:01:20,295 --> 00:01:21,515 attending the Global 28 00:01:21,814 --> 00:01:25,034 Physics Summit of the American Physical Society, 29 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:28,500 which attracted about 14,000 30 00:01:28,719 --> 00:01:29,219 physicists 31 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:33,379 to a huge convention center in Anaheim, California. 32 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,379 That's where I met the steampunk artist, 33 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:38,900 Bruce Rosenbaum, 34 00:01:39,525 --> 00:01:42,185 who is exhibiting his beautiful sculpture 35 00:01:42,484 --> 00:01:44,025 of a quantum engine. 36 00:01:44,965 --> 00:01:47,944 It was created in collaboration with physicists, 37 00:01:48,645 --> 00:01:49,145 including 38 00:01:49,685 --> 00:01:50,185 Nicole 39 00:01:50,564 --> 00:01:51,064 Junger 40 00:01:51,365 --> 00:01:51,865 Halpern, 41 00:01:52,619 --> 00:01:56,879 who pioneered the scientific field of quantum steampunk. 42 00:01:58,060 --> 00:02:00,299 I was so taken by the art and 43 00:02:00,299 --> 00:02:02,399 science of quantum steampunk 44 00:02:02,700 --> 00:02:05,179 that I promised Bruce that I would have 45 00:02:05,179 --> 00:02:07,280 him and Nicole on the podcast. 46 00:02:07,995 --> 00:02:09,134 And here we are. 47 00:02:09,435 --> 00:02:11,215 Nicole joins me from Maryland 48 00:02:11,675 --> 00:02:13,375 and Bruce from Massachusetts. 49 00:02:14,314 --> 00:02:16,735 Welcome to both of you to the podcast. 50 00:02:17,115 --> 00:02:19,115 Thanks very much for having us. Yes. Thanks 51 00:02:19,115 --> 00:02:20,094 for having us. 52 00:02:20,555 --> 00:02:23,360 So Bruce, can we start with you? Can 53 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:25,939 you give us an idea of what 54 00:02:26,239 --> 00:02:27,459 steampunk is? 55 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:30,959 Sure. Well, it it sounds like a simple 56 00:02:30,959 --> 00:02:34,079 question. What is steampunk? But I think, you 57 00:02:34,079 --> 00:02:35,599 have 10 people in a room. You ask 58 00:02:35,599 --> 00:02:37,780 that question, you're gonna get 10 different answers. 59 00:02:37,985 --> 00:02:40,645 And there's probably even a difference between 60 00:02:41,185 --> 00:02:43,584 Nicole and I in terms of exactly what 61 00:02:43,584 --> 00:02:46,145 steampunk is. But for me, it's it it 62 00:02:46,145 --> 00:02:47,764 has its roots in science fiction. 63 00:02:48,625 --> 00:02:49,604 AW Jeter, 64 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:51,699 science fiction author, 65 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:54,639 in the nineteen eighties actually came up with 66 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:56,259 the, the term statement. 67 00:02:57,039 --> 00:02:57,539 And, 68 00:02:57,840 --> 00:02:58,479 really, it's, 69 00:02:59,199 --> 00:03:00,500 I kind of look at it, 70 00:03:00,959 --> 00:03:02,900 in in a science fiction 71 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:05,060 type of realm where 72 00:03:05,365 --> 00:03:08,004 it's this what if scenario, kind of this 73 00:03:08,004 --> 00:03:09,544 reimagined history. So 74 00:03:10,085 --> 00:03:13,125 it's what if during the Victorian period or 75 00:03:13,125 --> 00:03:14,665 the industrial age, that's, 76 00:03:15,044 --> 00:03:18,324 you know, roughly eighteen fifties to the nineteen 77 00:03:18,324 --> 00:03:21,430 hundreds. What if the people of that time, 78 00:03:21,430 --> 00:03:21,930 the 79 00:03:22,469 --> 00:03:23,049 the engineers, 80 00:03:23,509 --> 00:03:24,009 the, 81 00:03:24,949 --> 00:03:26,489 the inventors, the innovators, 82 00:03:26,870 --> 00:03:28,729 what if they had knowledge 83 00:03:29,590 --> 00:03:31,129 on modern or futuristic 84 00:03:32,069 --> 00:03:32,569 technology? 85 00:03:33,094 --> 00:03:35,495 How that would have changed anything. It's it's 86 00:03:35,495 --> 00:03:37,354 almost imagining if the computer 87 00:03:38,055 --> 00:03:40,694 was invented a hundred years before it actually 88 00:03:40,694 --> 00:03:41,194 was, 89 00:03:42,455 --> 00:03:44,715 invented, how that would have changed everything. 90 00:03:45,094 --> 00:03:47,310 And just to kinda give you a quick, 91 00:03:47,710 --> 00:03:49,169 story, a real story 92 00:03:49,629 --> 00:03:50,129 that, 93 00:03:50,430 --> 00:03:52,129 that could have been that scenario, 94 00:03:52,990 --> 00:03:55,169 if people are familiar with Charles Babbage, 95 00:03:55,870 --> 00:03:56,530 a mathematician, 96 00:03:57,629 --> 00:03:58,129 scientist, 97 00:03:58,669 --> 00:03:59,490 from England, 98 00:04:01,465 --> 00:04:02,665 I think it was in the late eighteen 99 00:04:02,665 --> 00:04:04,844 hundreds, he actually came up 100 00:04:05,224 --> 00:04:06,125 with a 101 00:04:09,465 --> 00:04:11,004 mechanical computer, basically, 102 00:04:11,465 --> 00:04:14,280 called the difference engine or the analytical engine. 103 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:17,079 And he actually drew it. He came up 104 00:04:17,079 --> 00:04:18,860 with the design, which was very complicated. 105 00:04:19,399 --> 00:04:21,720 And like a lot of inventors, you know, 106 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:24,279 they're they're looking for funding or money to 107 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:25,500 actually build thing, 108 00:04:25,879 --> 00:04:27,740 and he couldn't find funding. 109 00:04:28,785 --> 00:04:29,264 And, 110 00:04:29,745 --> 00:04:31,585 it wasn't until, I think, in the early 111 00:04:31,585 --> 00:04:33,985 two thousands, there was a museum in England 112 00:04:33,985 --> 00:04:37,025 that actually built it, this mechanical computer based 113 00:04:37,025 --> 00:04:39,045 on this design, and it actually worked. 114 00:04:39,745 --> 00:04:42,120 So people ask, well, what if we actually 115 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:43,100 did get funding? 116 00:04:43,639 --> 00:04:45,020 How could have 117 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:48,120 brought our modern computer, you know, in much 118 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:48,620 earlier. 119 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:51,240 And even, you know, maybe we would have 120 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:52,460 our quantum computer 121 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,080 right now if if that would have happened. 122 00:04:55,080 --> 00:04:55,580 So, 123 00:04:56,365 --> 00:04:58,205 but to to kind of put it in 124 00:04:58,205 --> 00:05:01,165 in in almost elementary or kind of math 125 00:05:01,165 --> 00:05:03,345 terms, I really think that, 126 00:05:04,285 --> 00:05:04,785 steampunk, 127 00:05:05,324 --> 00:05:07,185 is this fusion of history, 128 00:05:07,884 --> 00:05:08,764 art, and 129 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:13,919 So that so that's Babbage's folly that that 130 00:05:13,919 --> 00:05:16,720 you're referring to. And I, I mean, I 131 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:18,959 I was under the impression that it I 132 00:05:18,959 --> 00:05:21,220 mean, it really fits in with your definition 133 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,560 of steampunk punk because wasn't part of the 134 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:25,699 problem that 135 00:05:26,235 --> 00:05:27,694 the the the components 136 00:05:28,795 --> 00:05:29,375 that Babbage 137 00:05:30,235 --> 00:05:32,495 required in his calculating machine 138 00:05:33,035 --> 00:05:34,334 couldn't be machined 139 00:05:34,955 --> 00:05:37,455 to the to to the exacting tolerances 140 00:05:38,475 --> 00:05:40,610 back then, and it was it it it 141 00:05:40,610 --> 00:05:42,230 was only really with modern 142 00:05:42,930 --> 00:05:44,610 machining tools that, 143 00:05:45,410 --> 00:05:47,569 that that we could actually make one that 144 00:05:47,569 --> 00:05:49,750 wouldn't, you know, sort of immediately 145 00:05:50,129 --> 00:05:51,990 jam up because of 146 00:05:52,745 --> 00:05:55,404 imprecision. I mean, maybe that's apocryphal. Maybe 147 00:05:56,104 --> 00:05:57,704 that's my view of it. But I I 148 00:05:57,704 --> 00:06:01,164 do remember reading that somewhere, maybe when when 149 00:06:01,384 --> 00:06:04,185 his machine was was finally built. Yeah. I 150 00:06:04,185 --> 00:06:05,784 think he was ahead of his time in 151 00:06:05,784 --> 00:06:08,449 terms of actually, you know, fabricating it. 152 00:06:08,750 --> 00:06:10,829 But, I think that the tough part was 153 00:06:10,829 --> 00:06:13,329 just convincing people because it was so complicated. 154 00:06:13,870 --> 00:06:15,470 Like, people would be looking at it and, 155 00:06:15,470 --> 00:06:18,669 like, how is this thing gonna actually work 156 00:06:18,669 --> 00:06:19,649 and and think? 157 00:06:20,029 --> 00:06:22,384 You know? So so it wasn't till later, 158 00:06:22,384 --> 00:06:24,705 but but this is, you know, I think 159 00:06:24,705 --> 00:06:26,404 with with a lot of inventions, 160 00:06:27,504 --> 00:06:28,725 it is a confluence 161 00:06:29,025 --> 00:06:29,764 of different, 162 00:06:31,665 --> 00:06:33,925 technologies that need to come together 163 00:06:34,464 --> 00:06:35,764 to make it happen. 164 00:06:36,500 --> 00:06:38,759 So the timing of of 165 00:06:39,220 --> 00:06:42,019 these creations are always kind of dependent on 166 00:06:42,019 --> 00:06:43,399 what's going on in the world. 167 00:06:44,420 --> 00:06:45,939 And, Bruce, I met you, 168 00:06:46,339 --> 00:06:49,319 back in March at the Global Physics Summit 169 00:06:49,854 --> 00:06:50,834 in California. 170 00:06:51,454 --> 00:06:53,634 And you were exhibiting a a wonderful 171 00:06:53,935 --> 00:06:54,435 sculpture 172 00:06:55,214 --> 00:06:57,235 of a of a quantum engine. 173 00:06:58,334 --> 00:07:00,334 And I think it really cut caught the 174 00:07:00,334 --> 00:07:02,194 imagination of a lot of physicists, 175 00:07:03,269 --> 00:07:05,509 at the conference. Can you can you describe 176 00:07:05,509 --> 00:07:06,250 that work? 177 00:07:07,269 --> 00:07:08,949 Sure. So just a kinda little bit of 178 00:07:08,949 --> 00:07:10,870 background too on how I got connected to 179 00:07:10,870 --> 00:07:11,370 Nicole. 180 00:07:13,189 --> 00:07:15,050 I'm always looking for collaborations, 181 00:07:15,990 --> 00:07:18,490 and not with just other artists, but 182 00:07:19,084 --> 00:07:22,204 because I think steampunk is history plus art 183 00:07:22,204 --> 00:07:25,104 plus technology, I'm connecting with scientists 184 00:07:25,404 --> 00:07:28,464 and, other people in the STEM 185 00:07:29,164 --> 00:07:30,144 STEAM fields. 186 00:07:30,604 --> 00:07:31,084 And, 187 00:07:31,644 --> 00:07:32,524 I have this 188 00:07:34,099 --> 00:07:36,519 I set up a Google alert that basically 189 00:07:36,899 --> 00:07:38,979 gives me any links to anything that comes 190 00:07:38,979 --> 00:07:40,199 out about steampunk. 191 00:07:40,899 --> 00:07:42,979 And one day, what pops up? 192 00:07:43,620 --> 00:07:44,680 Quantum Steampunk. 193 00:07:45,379 --> 00:07:47,639 And I look closer, and it's Nicole's. 194 00:07:48,339 --> 00:07:50,705 She has a presentation. She has a book. 195 00:07:50,925 --> 00:07:53,324 And I'm, like, going, wow. This is, like, 196 00:07:53,324 --> 00:07:57,085 you know, something that, I'm really interested in 197 00:07:57,085 --> 00:07:57,985 looking into. 198 00:07:58,525 --> 00:08:01,085 We spoke to Nicole, and she was actually 199 00:08:01,085 --> 00:08:01,585 looking, 200 00:08:02,045 --> 00:08:05,170 potentially for an artist to help create kind 201 00:08:05,170 --> 00:08:06,149 of an educating 202 00:08:07,649 --> 00:08:08,389 and entertaining 203 00:08:09,170 --> 00:08:09,810 kind of, 204 00:08:10,290 --> 00:08:10,790 device, 205 00:08:12,210 --> 00:08:14,069 in installation that could 206 00:08:14,529 --> 00:08:15,810 teach people on, 207 00:08:16,975 --> 00:08:18,355 how classical thermodynamics 208 00:08:19,455 --> 00:08:20,754 could translate 209 00:08:21,535 --> 00:08:22,035 and 210 00:08:23,134 --> 00:08:24,115 build into 211 00:08:25,935 --> 00:08:26,435 quantum 212 00:08:27,295 --> 00:08:27,795 thermodynamics 213 00:08:28,254 --> 00:08:30,355 or or basically being able to control 214 00:08:31,290 --> 00:08:32,350 an an atom. 215 00:08:32,730 --> 00:08:33,450 And so, 216 00:08:34,009 --> 00:08:35,230 so we just 217 00:08:35,690 --> 00:08:37,210 we were kind of going back and forth. 218 00:08:37,210 --> 00:08:40,330 Like, there is no steampunk quantum engine right 219 00:08:40,330 --> 00:08:42,350 now, but what could it look like? 220 00:08:42,970 --> 00:08:43,470 And, 221 00:08:44,090 --> 00:08:46,029 I always loved the armillary 222 00:08:46,544 --> 00:08:48,865 stair, which is a representation of our solar 223 00:08:48,865 --> 00:08:50,304 system with kind of the sun in the 224 00:08:50,304 --> 00:08:52,245 middle and the planets going around it, 225 00:08:52,705 --> 00:08:56,464 almost like an atom too, what's going on 226 00:08:56,464 --> 00:08:57,605 going on inside. 227 00:08:58,065 --> 00:09:00,085 And so we kinda came up with this, 228 00:09:00,730 --> 00:09:03,450 the structure of what it could look like, 229 00:09:03,450 --> 00:09:04,269 and then 230 00:09:04,970 --> 00:09:05,870 was able to 231 00:09:06,170 --> 00:09:06,670 provide, 232 00:09:07,450 --> 00:09:09,769 the science, the real science behind it, 233 00:09:10,170 --> 00:09:11,389 in terms of what 234 00:09:11,769 --> 00:09:12,269 elements 235 00:09:13,544 --> 00:09:14,044 could, 236 00:09:15,064 --> 00:09:17,704 make sense in terms of creating this this 237 00:09:17,704 --> 00:09:18,204 engine. 238 00:09:18,824 --> 00:09:19,564 And so 239 00:09:20,024 --> 00:09:23,404 we just went back and forth and created 240 00:09:23,704 --> 00:09:25,245 a really cool 241 00:09:25,865 --> 00:09:26,365 illustration. 242 00:09:27,840 --> 00:09:30,320 And if you've seen Nicole in her presentation, 243 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:32,720 she usually has it as her as her 244 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:33,220 background, 245 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:34,500 and 246 00:09:35,039 --> 00:09:37,299 this was the inspiration for actually, 247 00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:38,660 fabricating. 248 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:42,764 And part of the steampunk ethos also is, 249 00:09:42,924 --> 00:09:44,545 you know, we wanted to engage. 250 00:09:45,004 --> 00:09:46,285 So how do we do that? We do 251 00:09:46,285 --> 00:09:47,264 that through movement, 252 00:09:48,365 --> 00:09:51,325 through lighting, through sound. So that was an 253 00:09:51,325 --> 00:09:53,485 important part of the way that we were 254 00:09:53,485 --> 00:09:56,519 going to actually build this. So we worked 255 00:09:56,519 --> 00:09:57,419 with a 256 00:09:58,759 --> 00:10:00,460 group near me in Massachusetts, 257 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:02,860 empire, 258 00:10:03,639 --> 00:10:04,460 and they, 259 00:10:04,919 --> 00:10:06,539 were able to CAD it. 260 00:10:06,919 --> 00:10:09,160 We actually put it, you know, in a 261 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:10,139 computer drawing, 262 00:10:10,784 --> 00:10:11,284 and, 263 00:10:12,384 --> 00:10:14,565 Nicole and I kinda went back and forth 264 00:10:14,625 --> 00:10:17,044 and, you know, wanted to make sure that 265 00:10:17,105 --> 00:10:19,105 the elements not only look good but make 266 00:10:19,105 --> 00:10:19,605 sense, 267 00:10:20,464 --> 00:10:21,764 in terms of its functionality. 268 00:10:22,909 --> 00:10:23,389 And, 269 00:10:23,870 --> 00:10:25,709 and part of it was that we created, 270 00:10:25,709 --> 00:10:27,329 you know, from classical thermodynamics, 271 00:10:28,190 --> 00:10:29,669 we had these these classical, 272 00:10:30,110 --> 00:10:30,610 engines 273 00:10:33,230 --> 00:10:35,534 with pistons and, you know, 274 00:10:36,414 --> 00:10:39,375 cycles and all that. So that was surrounding 275 00:10:39,375 --> 00:10:40,034 the sphere, 276 00:10:40,414 --> 00:10:43,875 and it was those elements that actually powered, 277 00:10:45,214 --> 00:10:45,615 the, 278 00:10:46,095 --> 00:10:47,394 the appearance of lasers 279 00:10:48,269 --> 00:10:50,769 that would go into a chamber, 280 00:10:51,149 --> 00:10:53,570 for trapped ions. And I'm I'll let Nicole 281 00:10:53,789 --> 00:10:56,350 talk more about, you know, how this all 282 00:10:56,350 --> 00:10:59,629 works. But having the movement and having the 283 00:10:59,629 --> 00:11:01,889 lasers kind of pop on, 284 00:11:02,945 --> 00:11:05,764 and and then also being able to, 285 00:11:06,785 --> 00:11:09,504 have a sound profile to it. So what 286 00:11:09,504 --> 00:11:11,264 does it sound for an engine to, you 287 00:11:11,264 --> 00:11:13,985 know, to develop, for it to turn on 288 00:11:13,985 --> 00:11:17,285 lasers to to ignite these, these ions? 289 00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:19,639 So we had fun with that too in 290 00:11:19,639 --> 00:11:21,100 terms of how that would do. 291 00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:23,960 And then so you would come up, you 292 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:26,920 hit the the button, and it comes alive. 293 00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:28,779 It's about a sixty second cycle. 294 00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:31,245 And it was it was really 295 00:11:31,944 --> 00:11:32,924 fantastic being 296 00:11:33,384 --> 00:11:34,985 at the at the summit because I had 297 00:11:34,985 --> 00:11:37,084 physicists coming and thinking 298 00:11:37,544 --> 00:11:40,024 this was, like, real, that we were actually 299 00:11:40,024 --> 00:11:43,544 dropping ions and, like, you know, making making 300 00:11:43,544 --> 00:11:45,485 this this, steam engine. 301 00:11:46,139 --> 00:11:46,639 But, 302 00:11:47,259 --> 00:11:48,800 again, an artist representation, 303 00:11:50,139 --> 00:11:52,320 with this kind of brainchild of 304 00:11:52,700 --> 00:11:53,920 of an artist in 305 00:11:55,259 --> 00:11:57,279 a in a quantum theoretical fist. 306 00:11:58,345 --> 00:11:59,625 Yeah. It is, 307 00:12:00,024 --> 00:12:02,524 I mean, it's a very beautiful object. And 308 00:12:02,585 --> 00:12:04,825 the thing that that struck me is that, 309 00:12:05,465 --> 00:12:08,205 you know, just a a few yards away 310 00:12:08,264 --> 00:12:10,365 in the sort of main exhibition, 311 00:12:11,039 --> 00:12:11,940 there were companies, 312 00:12:13,279 --> 00:12:15,940 that were selling stuff that looked 313 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:17,539 a lot like your 314 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:19,139 sculpture, which, 315 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:21,700 you know, I I thought that was fantastic. 316 00:12:22,320 --> 00:12:22,820 So, 317 00:12:23,919 --> 00:12:26,259 Nicole, you worked with Bruce, 318 00:12:26,825 --> 00:12:28,285 to create this sculpture. 319 00:12:28,904 --> 00:12:31,545 And I I suppose it's obvious looking at 320 00:12:31,545 --> 00:12:34,684 the sculpture that that a physicist was involved. 321 00:12:35,225 --> 00:12:37,644 What sort of ideas did you contribute? 322 00:12:38,985 --> 00:12:41,649 The first was the overall notion of quantum 323 00:12:41,649 --> 00:12:43,429 steampunk as Bruce described. 324 00:12:44,129 --> 00:12:46,950 One contribution was writing the grant proposal. 325 00:12:47,330 --> 00:12:50,129 It turns out that art, like science, involves 326 00:12:50,129 --> 00:12:52,149 a lot of just grinding logistics, 327 00:12:52,915 --> 00:12:54,615 including applying for funding. 328 00:12:57,154 --> 00:12:58,835 The kind of core notion is that of 329 00:12:58,835 --> 00:12:59,894 a quantum engine. 330 00:13:00,274 --> 00:13:01,254 Quantum engines 331 00:13:01,634 --> 00:13:02,295 have been 332 00:13:02,915 --> 00:13:06,195 theorized about since 1959 and 1967. 333 00:13:06,195 --> 00:13:08,179 The first proposal for a quantum engine was 334 00:13:08,179 --> 00:13:10,839 put forth then. They've been realized experimentally 335 00:13:11,220 --> 00:13:12,600 on a variety of platforms. 336 00:13:13,139 --> 00:13:15,000 We chose a trapped ion platform 337 00:13:15,699 --> 00:13:16,759 in part because 338 00:13:17,940 --> 00:13:20,839 I'm based at the University of Maryland, and 339 00:13:21,235 --> 00:13:22,294 Maryland has 340 00:13:22,915 --> 00:13:24,054 a lot of 341 00:13:24,915 --> 00:13:27,554 work on trapped ions and is partially known 342 00:13:27,554 --> 00:13:28,215 for that. 343 00:13:28,595 --> 00:13:28,995 So the 344 00:13:29,875 --> 00:13:31,794 we can get into later what a quantum 345 00:13:31,794 --> 00:13:32,695 engine is. 346 00:13:33,475 --> 00:13:35,254 But one reason why 347 00:13:35,715 --> 00:13:36,215 the 348 00:13:37,100 --> 00:13:40,220 center of the sculpture, which has the ion 349 00:13:40,220 --> 00:13:41,680 trap, looks so realistic 350 00:13:42,139 --> 00:13:43,920 is I have the good fortune 351 00:13:44,379 --> 00:13:46,620 to be friends with an ion trapper in 352 00:13:46,620 --> 00:13:49,660 Maryland, Elena Green, and she very kindly let 353 00:13:49,660 --> 00:13:51,180 me ask her a whole bunch of questions 354 00:13:51,180 --> 00:13:53,394 about how to make this piece look particularly 355 00:13:53,394 --> 00:13:53,894 realistic. 356 00:13:54,674 --> 00:13:56,134 Also, Bruce mentioned 357 00:13:56,995 --> 00:13:59,174 the armillary sphere, which is, 358 00:14:00,274 --> 00:14:03,095 an old time instrument and a very beautiful 359 00:14:03,394 --> 00:14:04,615 object that evokes 360 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:06,659 steampunk or clock punk. 361 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:07,860 The 362 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:09,360 the this 363 00:14:09,759 --> 00:14:11,759 so there is a sphere that bounds the 364 00:14:11,759 --> 00:14:12,259 sculpture 365 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:16,100 very beautifully, I think. It evokes the armillary 366 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:18,639 sphere. And on the other hand, it evokes 367 00:14:18,639 --> 00:14:19,539 the Bloch sphere. 368 00:14:19,855 --> 00:14:20,674 So the Bloch 369 00:14:21,054 --> 00:14:24,035 sphere represents the possible states of a qubit, 370 00:14:24,095 --> 00:14:25,955 the basic unit of quantum information. 371 00:14:27,774 --> 00:14:28,674 We also 372 00:14:29,934 --> 00:14:30,434 included 373 00:14:30,815 --> 00:14:33,715 a an arrow that represents a Bloch vector. 374 00:14:33,830 --> 00:14:35,590 So suppose that we have some qubits, a 375 00:14:35,590 --> 00:14:37,129 basic unit of quantum information, 376 00:14:38,149 --> 00:14:40,649 may be represented by within a trapped ion. 377 00:14:40,789 --> 00:14:43,529 This trapped ion is in some quantum state, 378 00:14:43,830 --> 00:14:47,110 which is represented geometrically by a point on 379 00:14:47,110 --> 00:14:48,649 or in the Bloch sphere. 380 00:14:49,235 --> 00:14:50,054 And when we 381 00:14:51,394 --> 00:14:53,735 do physics or do quantum computation, 382 00:14:54,434 --> 00:14:56,294 we often will represent 383 00:14:56,834 --> 00:14:59,315 the state of the qubits with an arrow 384 00:14:59,315 --> 00:15:01,154 that points from the center of the sphere 385 00:15:01,154 --> 00:15:02,389 out to 386 00:15:02,769 --> 00:15:05,110 the point that represents that that 387 00:15:06,050 --> 00:15:08,230 really is a solid representation of the state. 388 00:15:08,450 --> 00:15:11,350 Bruce found a beautiful arrow that was, 389 00:15:12,050 --> 00:15:12,550 fabricated 390 00:15:12,930 --> 00:15:15,250 in the early nineteen hundreds to serve as 391 00:15:15,250 --> 00:15:16,309 our block vector. 392 00:15:16,964 --> 00:15:17,464 The 393 00:15:18,804 --> 00:15:20,424 sculpture also has 394 00:15:21,284 --> 00:15:21,865 a representation 395 00:15:22,404 --> 00:15:25,125 of a battery that might be charged by 396 00:15:25,125 --> 00:15:26,424 the engines in 397 00:15:26,884 --> 00:15:27,464 the sculpture, 398 00:15:28,245 --> 00:15:29,464 and it has a representation 399 00:15:29,845 --> 00:15:32,330 of a clock that would time an engine 400 00:15:32,330 --> 00:15:32,830 cycle. 401 00:15:33,529 --> 00:15:35,789 Also, the sculpture has representations 402 00:15:36,330 --> 00:15:38,029 of hot and cold reservoirs, 403 00:15:38,570 --> 00:15:40,990 which play key roles in 404 00:15:41,370 --> 00:15:43,549 the functioning of a heat engine. 405 00:15:44,764 --> 00:15:46,764 I see. And I I wanted to ask 406 00:15:46,764 --> 00:15:50,065 you, Nicole, about the phrase quantum steampunk, 407 00:15:50,684 --> 00:15:53,085 which which you've coined. I mean, it it, 408 00:15:53,085 --> 00:15:54,705 you know, it sounds like a fun 409 00:15:55,085 --> 00:15:58,384 idea, but it it it's a physics concept, 410 00:15:58,445 --> 00:15:59,184 isn't it? 411 00:15:59,610 --> 00:16:00,570 The this, 412 00:16:01,289 --> 00:16:03,149 is it the idea of quantum steampunk? 413 00:16:03,450 --> 00:16:04,970 Can can you talk a bit about the 414 00:16:04,970 --> 00:16:07,070 physics of quantum steampunk? 415 00:16:08,250 --> 00:16:08,750 Sure. 416 00:16:09,769 --> 00:16:11,389 Quantum steampunk is 417 00:16:11,875 --> 00:16:14,375 in part another term that I use for 418 00:16:14,514 --> 00:16:16,675 and in part a term for the spirit 419 00:16:16,675 --> 00:16:17,975 and aesthetic of 420 00:16:18,595 --> 00:16:20,295 the field of quantum thermodynamics. 421 00:16:20,995 --> 00:16:21,975 The quantum thermodynamics 422 00:16:22,514 --> 00:16:25,559 is a subfield of quantum physics that has 423 00:16:26,039 --> 00:16:28,360 been around for many decades, but it started 424 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:30,379 booming within the past fifteen years. 425 00:16:31,159 --> 00:16:32,460 What is quantum thermodynamics? 426 00:16:32,919 --> 00:16:35,179 Well, first, what is ordinary thermodynamics? 427 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:36,620 The thermodynamics 428 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,580 is the study of energy. It was inspired 429 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:41,100 by the Industrial Revolution. 430 00:16:41,615 --> 00:16:43,615 So it was inspired by the historical setting 431 00:16:43,615 --> 00:16:46,914 that Bruce alluded to when defining steampunk. 432 00:16:48,254 --> 00:16:49,315 During this era, 433 00:16:49,855 --> 00:16:51,875 during the eighteen hundreds, people were 434 00:16:52,815 --> 00:16:55,454 realizing engines on a large scale for the 435 00:16:55,454 --> 00:16:56,190 first time 436 00:16:56,509 --> 00:16:57,649 to drive factories. 437 00:16:58,110 --> 00:17:00,990 So naturally, people wanted to understand how efficiently 438 00:17:00,990 --> 00:17:02,370 these engines could operate. 439 00:17:02,909 --> 00:17:03,409 Thermodynamics 440 00:17:03,789 --> 00:17:06,269 helps us understand what are the limitations on 441 00:17:06,269 --> 00:17:06,769 engines, 442 00:17:07,470 --> 00:17:09,069 what are heat and work, how do we 443 00:17:09,069 --> 00:17:12,049 quantify them, what are the relationships amongst them. 444 00:17:12,884 --> 00:17:13,384 In, 445 00:17:14,404 --> 00:17:16,105 this theory of thermodynamics 446 00:17:16,644 --> 00:17:17,144 was 447 00:17:17,765 --> 00:17:19,705 inspired by large classical systems, 448 00:17:20,644 --> 00:17:21,144 but 449 00:17:21,845 --> 00:17:24,164 there are quantum systems to which work and 450 00:17:24,164 --> 00:17:25,144 heat and efficiency 451 00:17:25,445 --> 00:17:27,720 are relevant as well. For instance, 452 00:17:28,419 --> 00:17:30,599 for most systems to 453 00:17:31,139 --> 00:17:33,779 exhibit quantum phenomena, they have to be cooled 454 00:17:33,779 --> 00:17:36,579 to very low temperatures, and cooling is a 455 00:17:36,579 --> 00:17:37,799 thermodynamic process. 456 00:17:38,579 --> 00:17:39,799 So in quantum thermodynamics, 457 00:17:40,555 --> 00:17:43,535 in part, well, I see us as addressing 458 00:17:43,595 --> 00:17:44,575 three main questions. 459 00:17:45,035 --> 00:17:46,795 First, we ask, how can the laws of 460 00:17:46,795 --> 00:17:47,295 thermodynamics 461 00:17:47,755 --> 00:17:48,494 be extended 462 00:17:49,515 --> 00:17:50,654 so that we can see 463 00:17:51,115 --> 00:17:53,434 how exactly they apply to small and quantum 464 00:17:53,434 --> 00:17:55,515 systems, so even systems that can entangle with 465 00:17:55,515 --> 00:17:57,690 each other? And sometimes we can use tools 466 00:17:57,690 --> 00:17:59,230 from quantum information theory 467 00:17:59,529 --> 00:18:02,349 to prove more detailed, more refined versions 468 00:18:03,049 --> 00:18:04,349 of the laws of thermodynamics. 469 00:18:05,369 --> 00:18:08,474 Second, we know from quantum information processing that 470 00:18:08,714 --> 00:18:12,015 quantum phenomena such as entanglement can enhance information 471 00:18:12,075 --> 00:18:13,694 processing tasks such as computation. 472 00:18:14,554 --> 00:18:17,194 Just as there are information processing tasks, there 473 00:18:17,194 --> 00:18:17,855 are thermodynamic 474 00:18:18,154 --> 00:18:21,615 tasks such as extracting work and powering batteries. 475 00:18:22,220 --> 00:18:25,180 So we ask, how can quantum phenomena enhance 476 00:18:25,180 --> 00:18:26,480 thermodynamic tasks? 477 00:18:26,940 --> 00:18:28,940 And finally, we can look at a system 478 00:18:28,940 --> 00:18:31,359 that is processing energy and ask, 479 00:18:32,059 --> 00:18:35,039 what behaviors can this system exhibit 480 00:18:35,595 --> 00:18:37,775 if it's quantum and not if it's classical? 481 00:18:37,994 --> 00:18:38,815 So we use 482 00:18:39,275 --> 00:18:39,775 thermodynamics 483 00:18:40,315 --> 00:18:43,434 to understand better what divides the classical realm 484 00:18:43,434 --> 00:18:44,654 from the quantum realm. 485 00:18:45,035 --> 00:18:46,575 So I see quantum thermodynamics 486 00:18:47,115 --> 00:18:47,615 as 487 00:18:48,509 --> 00:18:49,009 combining 488 00:18:49,710 --> 00:18:51,250 the Victorian setting 489 00:18:51,549 --> 00:18:52,289 of thermodynamics 490 00:18:53,070 --> 00:18:56,130 with the cutting edge and partially futuristic 491 00:18:57,070 --> 00:18:57,570 technology 492 00:18:58,029 --> 00:19:00,690 of quantum information science. I see 493 00:19:01,150 --> 00:19:01,650 steampunk 494 00:19:02,105 --> 00:19:04,345 or I see quantum thermodynamics as the real 495 00:19:04,345 --> 00:19:05,884 world version of steampunk. 496 00:19:06,265 --> 00:19:08,265 And to emphasize that fact, I use the 497 00:19:08,265 --> 00:19:10,825 term quantum steampunk, so partially to refer to 498 00:19:10,825 --> 00:19:13,545 the field of quantum thermodynamics and partially to 499 00:19:13,545 --> 00:19:14,924 refer to its aesthetic. 500 00:19:15,619 --> 00:19:17,619 I see. And one thing I wanted to 501 00:19:17,619 --> 00:19:19,080 ask you, Nicole, is, 502 00:19:19,779 --> 00:19:21,700 you know, I can remember many, many years 503 00:19:21,700 --> 00:19:23,799 ago when I was a physics undergraduate. 504 00:19:24,500 --> 00:19:25,320 We studied, 505 00:19:26,420 --> 00:19:29,460 quantum statistical mechanics where, you know, it's very 506 00:19:29,460 --> 00:19:30,920 important whether the 507 00:19:31,384 --> 00:19:31,884 components, 508 00:19:32,865 --> 00:19:35,644 of a system were fermions or bosons and, 509 00:19:35,704 --> 00:19:37,224 you know, we sort of added up all 510 00:19:37,224 --> 00:19:39,484 the degrees of freedom, etcetera, etcetera. 511 00:19:40,024 --> 00:19:42,204 Is I mean, is that different 512 00:19:42,585 --> 00:19:43,085 to 513 00:19:43,500 --> 00:19:44,640 quantum thermodynamics? 514 00:19:45,259 --> 00:19:47,839 Or is is that a part of quantum 515 00:19:47,900 --> 00:19:48,400 thermodynamics? 516 00:19:48,859 --> 00:19:50,539 Because, you know, that's what I thought of 517 00:19:50,539 --> 00:19:51,039 immediately, 518 00:19:51,740 --> 00:19:53,680 the sort of statistical mechanics 519 00:19:54,140 --> 00:19:55,740 of it. But, I mean, it sounds like 520 00:19:55,740 --> 00:19:56,960 there's something more, 521 00:19:57,954 --> 00:19:59,014 I don't know, fundamental 522 00:19:59,315 --> 00:20:00,694 with quantum thermodynamics. 523 00:20:01,234 --> 00:20:02,454 Is that right? Or 524 00:20:02,755 --> 00:20:03,154 are they 525 00:20:03,714 --> 00:20:05,014 I suppose they're related. 526 00:20:05,875 --> 00:20:08,434 Yes. I definitely say that they're related. I 527 00:20:08,434 --> 00:20:11,075 actually wrote a blog post exactly about your 528 00:20:11,075 --> 00:20:11,575 question 529 00:20:11,875 --> 00:20:13,950 because someone else asked it of me a 530 00:20:13,950 --> 00:20:14,690 while ago. 531 00:20:15,390 --> 00:20:17,070 One of the main points of that blog 532 00:20:17,070 --> 00:20:19,170 post is that thermodynamics 533 00:20:19,549 --> 00:20:22,109 is an operational theory. When we use an 534 00:20:22,109 --> 00:20:24,849 operational theory, often we think about 535 00:20:25,325 --> 00:20:27,805 an agent who is trying to perform some 536 00:20:27,805 --> 00:20:28,305 task 537 00:20:28,845 --> 00:20:30,224 given certain resources. 538 00:20:30,684 --> 00:20:33,005 We ask how efficiently the agent can perform 539 00:20:33,005 --> 00:20:33,744 this task. 540 00:20:34,525 --> 00:20:35,904 For instance, in thermodynamics, 541 00:20:36,444 --> 00:20:37,424 we might say, 542 00:20:37,980 --> 00:20:40,059 suppose we have a hot reservoir and a 543 00:20:40,059 --> 00:20:40,799 cold reservoir, 544 00:20:41,179 --> 00:20:44,880 how efficiently can we extract work from this 545 00:20:44,940 --> 00:20:45,839 set of reservoirs? 546 00:20:48,140 --> 00:20:51,019 Information theory two is an operational theory. For 547 00:20:51,019 --> 00:20:52,960 instance, we will often think about 548 00:20:53,365 --> 00:20:55,464 an Alice who wants to 549 00:20:55,845 --> 00:20:58,644 send information down a channel to Bob, and 550 00:20:58,644 --> 00:20:59,304 we ask 551 00:20:59,765 --> 00:21:02,005 how many bits of information, how many basic 552 00:21:02,005 --> 00:21:02,984 units of information 553 00:21:03,444 --> 00:21:05,970 can she squeeze her message into. So how 554 00:21:05,970 --> 00:21:08,450 efficiently can she send her information down the 555 00:21:08,450 --> 00:21:08,950 channel? 556 00:21:09,569 --> 00:21:10,789 That's a reason why 557 00:21:11,329 --> 00:21:12,929 it makes a lot of sense to apply 558 00:21:12,929 --> 00:21:15,029 quantum information theory to thermodynamics 559 00:21:15,410 --> 00:21:17,029 to get quantum thermodynamics. 560 00:21:18,690 --> 00:21:20,069 Oh, statistical mechanics 561 00:21:20,934 --> 00:21:22,955 definitely plays a role in thermodynamics. 562 00:21:23,815 --> 00:21:25,575 Just the focus tends to be a little 563 00:21:25,575 --> 00:21:26,075 different. 564 00:21:26,535 --> 00:21:28,955 When we're doing statistical mechanics, usually, 565 00:21:29,494 --> 00:21:31,434 we are calculating a partition function. 566 00:21:32,134 --> 00:21:34,234 Whereas when we're doing thermodynamics, 567 00:21:34,669 --> 00:21:36,049 we're thinking more about 568 00:21:37,710 --> 00:21:38,210 tasks, 569 00:21:38,589 --> 00:21:39,089 resources, 570 00:21:39,630 --> 00:21:40,130 efficiencies, 571 00:21:40,750 --> 00:21:41,250 and 572 00:21:41,710 --> 00:21:44,029 how we can break down the analysis of 573 00:21:44,029 --> 00:21:46,509 these efficiencies in quantities such as heat and 574 00:21:46,509 --> 00:21:47,255 work. Right. 575 00:21:48,355 --> 00:21:50,035 I see. So so I I can see 576 00:21:50,035 --> 00:21:52,355 the you know, there's a complete analogy, isn't 577 00:21:52,355 --> 00:21:54,375 there, to the to the Victorian 578 00:21:54,835 --> 00:21:55,335 engineers 579 00:21:55,954 --> 00:21:56,454 who 580 00:21:56,994 --> 00:21:59,335 really weren't interested in the microscopic 581 00:22:00,035 --> 00:22:02,355 nature of their systems. They just wanted a 582 00:22:02,355 --> 00:22:03,630 more efficient 583 00:22:04,250 --> 00:22:06,990 steam engine or a better a better pump. 584 00:22:08,329 --> 00:22:10,349 And and I suppose we want 585 00:22:11,049 --> 00:22:13,390 we want to be able to process quantum 586 00:22:13,450 --> 00:22:15,470 information in in a better way. 587 00:22:16,734 --> 00:22:19,375 Yes. So they had very particular goals. They 588 00:22:19,375 --> 00:22:21,375 had very particular tasks in mind, and they 589 00:22:21,375 --> 00:22:23,075 were limited to certain resources. 590 00:22:23,934 --> 00:22:26,414 Nowadays, since we know about quantum theory and 591 00:22:26,414 --> 00:22:27,075 we use 592 00:22:27,615 --> 00:22:29,875 density matrices all over our calculations, 593 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:32,819 I think that maybe the traditional 594 00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:36,099 boundary between statistical mechanics and thermodynamics 595 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:38,740 is breaking down a little bit. So 596 00:22:39,519 --> 00:22:41,380 one will often hear that 597 00:22:41,759 --> 00:22:44,099 if one is using probability distributions 598 00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:45,539 over microstates 599 00:22:46,275 --> 00:22:46,775 classically 600 00:22:47,234 --> 00:22:47,734 or 601 00:22:48,115 --> 00:22:49,095 density matrices 602 00:22:49,875 --> 00:22:52,515 when using a quantum model, then one is 603 00:22:52,515 --> 00:22:55,654 doing statistical mechanics rather than thermodynamics, 604 00:22:55,955 --> 00:22:58,855 which deals only with macroscopic properties. 605 00:22:59,634 --> 00:23:00,210 I think 606 00:23:00,529 --> 00:23:03,589 that view might not be the most relevant 607 00:23:03,970 --> 00:23:06,390 to today's world and to quantum thermodynamics 608 00:23:07,009 --> 00:23:09,269 because it is useful to use the apparatus 609 00:23:09,490 --> 00:23:12,069 of microscopic quantum theory and quantum thermodynamics. 610 00:23:12,904 --> 00:23:14,444 Just when we do quantum thermodynamics, 611 00:23:15,304 --> 00:23:16,044 we can 612 00:23:16,345 --> 00:23:19,224 use, say, the density matrix in order to 613 00:23:19,224 --> 00:23:21,484 calculate quantities like work and heat 614 00:23:22,025 --> 00:23:23,164 and derive 615 00:23:24,025 --> 00:23:26,505 more detailed versions of the second law of 616 00:23:26,505 --> 00:23:27,005 thermodynamics 617 00:23:28,099 --> 00:23:30,680 and reason about quantities like heat and work. 618 00:23:32,019 --> 00:23:32,980 I see. And, 619 00:23:33,460 --> 00:23:35,380 Bruce, I'd like to to to bring you 620 00:23:35,380 --> 00:23:36,119 back in. 621 00:23:37,059 --> 00:23:37,559 You're, 622 00:23:38,500 --> 00:23:40,980 you're not a physicist. You don't I don't 623 00:23:40,980 --> 00:23:43,559 think you have a a background in physics, 624 00:23:43,994 --> 00:23:47,295 but you've really embraced the concept of quantum 625 00:23:47,434 --> 00:23:47,934 steampunk, 626 00:23:48,714 --> 00:23:51,194 in your art. Did you have to learn 627 00:23:51,194 --> 00:23:52,095 some basic 628 00:23:52,394 --> 00:23:55,134 quantum physics in order to create, 629 00:23:55,835 --> 00:23:56,575 the sculpture? 630 00:23:57,990 --> 00:24:00,950 Well, it's, I jokingly tell people that, I'm 631 00:24:00,950 --> 00:24:02,630 not a physicist, but I play one on 632 00:24:02,630 --> 00:24:03,130 TV. 633 00:24:04,309 --> 00:24:06,789 I I have, you know, knowledge of basic 634 00:24:06,789 --> 00:24:09,130 concepts. I'm I'm I'm a curious person, and 635 00:24:09,714 --> 00:24:11,254 so I love technology. 636 00:24:11,875 --> 00:24:14,355 I love, you know, what's next, and I 637 00:24:14,355 --> 00:24:15,335 watch documentaries. 638 00:24:16,194 --> 00:24:17,654 I actually listen to 639 00:24:18,274 --> 00:24:18,774 Nicole's 640 00:24:19,075 --> 00:24:21,714 quantum steampunk presentation and and read her book, 641 00:24:21,714 --> 00:24:22,170 and 642 00:24:23,049 --> 00:24:23,630 and she 643 00:24:23,930 --> 00:24:25,769 she lays it out in a really great 644 00:24:25,769 --> 00:24:28,570 way layperson's way, you know, to make it 645 00:24:28,570 --> 00:24:29,070 understandable. 646 00:24:29,850 --> 00:24:31,930 So I I really when I'm, 647 00:24:32,330 --> 00:24:33,789 embarking on these, 648 00:24:34,934 --> 00:24:37,494 creation of these art installations, I I need 649 00:24:37,494 --> 00:24:39,994 to do my due diligence and research and 650 00:24:40,615 --> 00:24:42,634 and just kinda get a broad understanding, 651 00:24:43,734 --> 00:24:44,315 on what, 652 00:24:44,694 --> 00:24:45,994 you know, what this is, 653 00:24:46,375 --> 00:24:48,154 so we can that can be represented 654 00:24:48,779 --> 00:24:50,400 in the, in the sculpture. 655 00:24:50,859 --> 00:24:53,019 And, really, it's it's this, you know, putting 656 00:24:53,019 --> 00:24:55,820 my head in the past, the present, and 657 00:24:55,820 --> 00:24:58,460 the future. That's kind of what we're trying 658 00:24:58,460 --> 00:25:01,180 to represent here to make a timeless type 659 00:25:01,180 --> 00:25:02,454 of sculpture, 660 00:25:03,075 --> 00:25:03,474 that, 661 00:25:04,035 --> 00:25:05,494 again, both educates 662 00:25:06,115 --> 00:25:06,934 and entertains. 663 00:25:08,515 --> 00:25:10,994 So, so that's kind of, you know, my 664 00:25:10,994 --> 00:25:13,154 approach with every project, you know, if it's 665 00:25:13,154 --> 00:25:15,894 quantum physics or or anything else that, 666 00:25:17,259 --> 00:25:19,599 has this combination of history, art, and terminology. 667 00:25:20,619 --> 00:25:22,960 And, Nicole, do do you have a background 668 00:25:23,259 --> 00:25:24,000 in art? 669 00:25:25,820 --> 00:25:28,184 I don't have a background in visual arts. 670 00:25:28,505 --> 00:25:31,545 I have a background in writing that I've 671 00:25:31,545 --> 00:25:32,845 gotten through, say, 672 00:25:33,225 --> 00:25:34,285 writing a 673 00:25:35,785 --> 00:25:38,505 community column for a local newspaper when I 674 00:25:38,505 --> 00:25:41,225 was in high school. I also blog for 675 00:25:41,225 --> 00:25:44,130 Quantum Frontiers, Caltech's Quantum Blog once a month. 676 00:25:45,089 --> 00:25:47,170 And I consider writing to be an art, 677 00:25:47,170 --> 00:25:47,910 but I 678 00:25:48,289 --> 00:25:49,269 did not have 679 00:25:50,210 --> 00:25:53,029 experience with visual art before working with Bruce. 680 00:25:53,329 --> 00:25:55,089 Oh, right. And and how did you find 681 00:25:55,089 --> 00:25:57,410 that as a as a as a a 682 00:25:57,410 --> 00:25:58,369 scientist? Were you 683 00:25:59,934 --> 00:26:02,515 did did did you have a problem with 684 00:26:02,735 --> 00:26:03,235 maybe 685 00:26:03,775 --> 00:26:05,235 being too lit literal, 686 00:26:05,615 --> 00:26:07,055 if you see what I mean, in terms 687 00:26:07,055 --> 00:26:09,634 of expressing ideas? Or 688 00:26:09,934 --> 00:26:12,515 or did did you slot right in immediately 689 00:26:12,575 --> 00:26:14,250 and sort of understand, 690 00:26:14,950 --> 00:26:16,730 how Bruce was was working? 691 00:26:17,670 --> 00:26:20,170 I think we achieved a good balance of 692 00:26:21,750 --> 00:26:23,049 sufficient representation 693 00:26:23,509 --> 00:26:24,250 of reality 694 00:26:24,630 --> 00:26:25,450 and also 695 00:26:26,984 --> 00:26:29,005 aesthetics that extend beyond 696 00:26:29,705 --> 00:26:31,164 a mere accurate representation. 697 00:26:31,785 --> 00:26:33,545 We certainly went back and forth a great 698 00:26:33,545 --> 00:26:34,045 deal. 699 00:26:34,664 --> 00:26:36,424 I actually, this was a part of the 700 00:26:36,424 --> 00:26:37,565 process that, 701 00:26:38,505 --> 00:26:40,919 to me, was a little different from what 702 00:26:40,919 --> 00:26:42,460 I experienced in science. 703 00:26:43,159 --> 00:26:45,159 As a scientist, I go back and forth 704 00:26:45,159 --> 00:26:46,059 with my collaborators 705 00:26:47,319 --> 00:26:48,859 until everybody is satisfied. 706 00:26:49,639 --> 00:26:52,220 This might take days or weeks or months. 707 00:26:52,519 --> 00:26:54,839 And similarly, Bruce would go back and forth 708 00:26:54,839 --> 00:26:56,535 with me a great deal 709 00:26:57,234 --> 00:26:58,535 until we were satisfied 710 00:26:58,994 --> 00:27:01,255 with the look of something and also 711 00:27:01,555 --> 00:27:03,255 the representation of science. 712 00:27:04,035 --> 00:27:04,535 However, 713 00:27:05,474 --> 00:27:05,974 Bruce 714 00:27:06,355 --> 00:27:07,894 hires people like 715 00:27:08,970 --> 00:27:09,710 an illustrator 716 00:27:10,089 --> 00:27:11,950 or a design engineering team, 717 00:27:12,410 --> 00:27:14,890 and their time is very much on the 718 00:27:14,890 --> 00:27:16,890 clock. So I could not go back and 719 00:27:16,890 --> 00:27:19,309 forth with them just ad infinitum. 720 00:27:19,849 --> 00:27:20,750 So that was 721 00:27:21,289 --> 00:27:21,789 the, 722 00:27:22,345 --> 00:27:23,404 I think, the main 723 00:27:23,784 --> 00:27:26,105 difference between my experience with art and my 724 00:27:26,105 --> 00:27:29,224 experience with science that surprised me. But I 725 00:27:29,224 --> 00:27:30,984 think that we did manage to come up 726 00:27:30,984 --> 00:27:32,444 with a really great balance. 727 00:27:33,304 --> 00:27:35,144 So so how did it compare to, you 728 00:27:35,144 --> 00:27:37,470 know, let's say you you you you've got 729 00:27:37,470 --> 00:27:38,450 a great idea 730 00:27:38,829 --> 00:27:41,390 for a paper and you're collaborating with some 731 00:27:41,390 --> 00:27:41,890 people 732 00:27:42,509 --> 00:27:42,910 and, 733 00:27:43,309 --> 00:27:46,349 you know, you're you're perfecting your craft, you're 734 00:27:46,349 --> 00:27:48,750 you're working very hard to get things right 735 00:27:48,750 --> 00:27:51,555 and to to make it understandable. Was it 736 00:27:51,634 --> 00:27:53,894 was it a a process that was comparable 737 00:27:54,115 --> 00:27:56,355 to that, or was it was it very 738 00:27:56,355 --> 00:27:56,855 different? 739 00:27:58,195 --> 00:28:00,515 I'd say probably there were fewer rounds of 740 00:28:00,515 --> 00:28:02,855 back and forth in the context of art 741 00:28:03,555 --> 00:28:06,115 because we were working with people whose time 742 00:28:06,115 --> 00:28:08,789 was very limited, and we had limited budgets. 743 00:28:08,929 --> 00:28:11,089 And those two resources need to match up 744 00:28:11,329 --> 00:28:12,869 needed to match up with each other. 745 00:28:13,490 --> 00:28:13,990 But, 746 00:28:14,609 --> 00:28:16,769 occasionally, there was a little wiggle room so 747 00:28:16,769 --> 00:28:18,929 we could get in a few extra tweaks 748 00:28:18,929 --> 00:28:19,605 here and there. 749 00:28:22,005 --> 00:28:24,085 Okay, Nicole. We're we're getting towards the end 750 00:28:24,085 --> 00:28:25,065 of our conversation, 751 00:28:25,365 --> 00:28:25,684 but, 752 00:28:26,164 --> 00:28:27,924 I I just have to ask you about 753 00:28:27,924 --> 00:28:29,144 a bit more physics, 754 00:28:29,684 --> 00:28:32,085 seeing as this is the Physics World Weekly 755 00:28:32,085 --> 00:28:32,585 podcast. 756 00:28:34,230 --> 00:28:36,309 Can you can you talk a bit about 757 00:28:36,309 --> 00:28:39,109 the physics of quantum heat engines? What is 758 00:28:39,109 --> 00:28:41,430 a quantum heat engine, and why is it 759 00:28:41,430 --> 00:28:42,970 important to study them? 760 00:28:43,830 --> 00:28:46,809 Sure. I'll start with a basic heat engine. 761 00:28:47,615 --> 00:28:50,174 A heat engine is a device that takes 762 00:28:50,174 --> 00:28:51,715 any heat from a hot environment 763 00:28:52,174 --> 00:28:53,775 and expel some of that heat to a 764 00:28:53,775 --> 00:28:54,595 colder environment. 765 00:28:55,295 --> 00:28:57,795 The rest of the heats, the engine transforms 766 00:28:58,015 --> 00:28:59,075 into work. 767 00:28:59,455 --> 00:29:00,515 So more 768 00:29:01,619 --> 00:29:03,400 correlated or rather more 769 00:29:04,019 --> 00:29:06,980 organized energy that can be directly harnessed to 770 00:29:06,980 --> 00:29:10,180 do something like power a factory or charge 771 00:29:10,180 --> 00:29:10,759 a battery. 772 00:29:12,099 --> 00:29:15,059 A quantum heat engine is an object that 773 00:29:15,059 --> 00:29:17,944 essentially does the same thing. It takes in 774 00:29:18,325 --> 00:29:20,804 heat from a hot environment. It expels some 775 00:29:20,804 --> 00:29:22,345 of that heat to a cold environment, 776 00:29:22,884 --> 00:29:25,304 and the rest of the heat, it transforms 777 00:29:25,605 --> 00:29:26,105 into 778 00:29:26,964 --> 00:29:27,464 more 779 00:29:27,924 --> 00:29:29,065 organized work. 780 00:29:30,085 --> 00:29:32,720 An early question in quantum thermodynamics was, is 781 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:35,279 it even possible for a quantum system to 782 00:29:35,279 --> 00:29:37,599 act like a heat engine? This was a 783 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:39,920 this is a foundational question and I think 784 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:41,539 a question of just basic curiosity. 785 00:29:42,559 --> 00:29:43,220 But this 786 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:45,914 is the question that I alluded 787 00:29:47,835 --> 00:29:48,075 to that was addressed in the nineteen fifties 788 00:29:48,075 --> 00:29:49,055 and nineteen sixties. 789 00:29:49,595 --> 00:29:51,934 Folks argued that a single atom 790 00:29:52,315 --> 00:29:54,815 can function as a heat engine when it's 791 00:29:54,875 --> 00:29:56,414 working as a maser. 792 00:29:57,275 --> 00:29:59,980 A maser, as some listeners will know is 793 00:29:59,980 --> 00:30:02,000 the same thing as a laser, just emits 794 00:30:02,059 --> 00:30:04,299 microwave radiation. That's what they happen to be 795 00:30:04,299 --> 00:30:04,799 studying. 796 00:30:06,220 --> 00:30:08,559 Quantum heat engines now form 797 00:30:09,099 --> 00:30:09,920 a sandbox 798 00:30:10,460 --> 00:30:10,960 for 799 00:30:11,420 --> 00:30:13,680 exploring questions within quantum thermodynamics. 800 00:30:14,585 --> 00:30:17,224 Since lots of quantum heat engines have been 801 00:30:17,224 --> 00:30:19,865 designed and some have been realized experimentally, we 802 00:30:19,865 --> 00:30:22,765 can play with them to ask, for example, 803 00:30:23,384 --> 00:30:26,424 do quantum systems obey the same thermodynamic laws 804 00:30:26,424 --> 00:30:27,390 as classical ones? 805 00:30:28,190 --> 00:30:31,089 What is the right way mathematically to represent 806 00:30:31,150 --> 00:30:33,970 those laws of thermodynamics for quantum systems? 807 00:30:34,589 --> 00:30:38,589 And can quantum systems outperform classical counterparts in 808 00:30:38,589 --> 00:30:39,089 thermodynamic 809 00:30:39,470 --> 00:30:41,490 tasks? And exactly how 810 00:30:41,815 --> 00:30:45,015 and exactly what quantum resources do those engines 811 00:30:45,015 --> 00:30:45,515 need. 812 00:30:46,695 --> 00:30:48,855 I see. And so I'm I'm I'm just 813 00:30:48,855 --> 00:30:51,015 trying to come up with an example in 814 00:30:51,015 --> 00:30:52,615 my head. I mean, I I'm I don't 815 00:30:52,615 --> 00:30:53,515 know. Are you are 816 00:30:53,815 --> 00:30:55,335 you are you talking about a system? I 817 00:30:55,335 --> 00:30:56,634 don't know. That maybe 818 00:30:57,109 --> 00:30:57,609 comprises 819 00:30:57,910 --> 00:31:00,549 of lots of different spins that can interact 820 00:31:00,549 --> 00:31:01,450 with each other? 821 00:31:01,830 --> 00:31:04,730 And, the the quantum heat engine can 822 00:31:05,029 --> 00:31:07,750 sort of chug away and cause all those 823 00:31:07,750 --> 00:31:10,570 spins to align in a ferromagnetic 824 00:31:11,029 --> 00:31:11,529 way. 825 00:31:12,105 --> 00:31:13,785 And then, I don't know, maybe you could 826 00:31:13,785 --> 00:31:16,265 make a measurement of a magnetic field from 827 00:31:16,265 --> 00:31:17,085 that or 828 00:31:17,704 --> 00:31:19,065 I don't know. I'm I'm just trying to 829 00:31:19,065 --> 00:31:20,845 make sort sort of make it real. 830 00:31:21,785 --> 00:31:23,085 Yes. The recently 831 00:31:23,704 --> 00:31:25,404 people have begun 832 00:31:26,265 --> 00:31:26,765 designing 833 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:31,039 many body quantum engines, which is what you 834 00:31:31,039 --> 00:31:31,539 described. 835 00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:32,740 The 836 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:35,539 quantum engines that were analyzed 837 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:39,440 originally and early on, and the simplest quantum 838 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,734 engines consist of just a single particle each, 839 00:31:42,894 --> 00:31:43,394 like 840 00:31:43,695 --> 00:31:45,954 the the quantum engine identified 841 00:31:46,335 --> 00:31:49,394 in those papers from the 1950s and 1960s. 842 00:31:50,255 --> 00:31:53,134 Those quantum engines consisted of just one atom 843 00:31:53,134 --> 00:31:53,634 each. 844 00:31:54,654 --> 00:31:55,714 And our sculpture 845 00:31:56,339 --> 00:31:59,380 depicts a quantum engine formed from one trapped 846 00:31:59,380 --> 00:31:59,880 ion. 847 00:32:00,500 --> 00:32:02,519 We're used to from 848 00:32:03,299 --> 00:32:05,480 undergraduate statistical physics classes 849 00:32:06,019 --> 00:32:08,119 thinking in many cases about 850 00:32:08,740 --> 00:32:11,079 engines that undergo four stroke cycles. 851 00:32:11,535 --> 00:32:13,934 For example, the CARTO cycle is a four 852 00:32:13,934 --> 00:32:14,674 stroke cycle. 853 00:32:15,215 --> 00:32:17,775 The auto cycle that operates in many cars 854 00:32:17,775 --> 00:32:19,154 is a four stroke cycle. 855 00:32:19,455 --> 00:32:20,355 But we can 856 00:32:21,695 --> 00:32:24,430 put together a four stroke cycle to which 857 00:32:24,430 --> 00:32:25,410 we can subject 858 00:32:25,950 --> 00:32:27,650 an ion or an atom 859 00:32:28,269 --> 00:32:30,369 so that during two strokes, 860 00:32:32,590 --> 00:32:35,170 the atom or ion is interacting with 861 00:32:35,950 --> 00:32:37,964 an environment that might have a hot a 862 00:32:37,964 --> 00:32:40,144 high temperature or a low temperature. 863 00:32:40,684 --> 00:32:43,025 This bath might consist of radiation. 864 00:32:44,044 --> 00:32:45,664 During the other two strokes, 865 00:32:46,125 --> 00:32:47,664 we tune the Hamiltonian. 866 00:32:48,285 --> 00:32:50,444 So we, in the context of a trapped 867 00:32:50,444 --> 00:32:51,505 ion, could 868 00:32:51,980 --> 00:32:53,440 change the trapping potential. 869 00:32:54,140 --> 00:32:56,960 If we're tuning a parameter in a Hamiltonian, 870 00:32:57,580 --> 00:33:00,080 then we're tuning a control parameter. 871 00:33:00,700 --> 00:33:01,200 And 872 00:33:01,820 --> 00:33:03,039 work is 873 00:33:03,420 --> 00:33:06,000 energy that is controlled. It is directed. 874 00:33:06,595 --> 00:33:09,875 So when we perform tuning strokes, we tend 875 00:33:09,875 --> 00:33:10,934 to have the engine 876 00:33:11,715 --> 00:33:12,615 perform work. 877 00:33:13,154 --> 00:33:13,654 Whereas 878 00:33:13,955 --> 00:33:14,855 during the 879 00:33:15,555 --> 00:33:16,055 thermalization 880 00:33:16,434 --> 00:33:16,934 strokes, 881 00:33:17,315 --> 00:33:19,875 the engine is taking in or spitting out 882 00:33:19,875 --> 00:33:20,099 heat. 883 00:33:21,140 --> 00:33:23,299 And that's what an engine does. So a 884 00:33:23,299 --> 00:33:24,119 heat engine, 885 00:33:25,380 --> 00:33:28,019 or at least a conventional heat engine undergoing 886 00:33:28,019 --> 00:33:30,819 a four stroke cycle, will interact with heat 887 00:33:30,819 --> 00:33:32,955 baths during two strokes and 888 00:33:33,815 --> 00:33:36,375 have some of one of its parameters tuned 889 00:33:36,375 --> 00:33:37,994 during the other two strokes 890 00:33:38,455 --> 00:33:40,955 during which the engine can perform work. 891 00:33:41,335 --> 00:33:41,835 So 892 00:33:42,375 --> 00:33:45,255 a quantum engine can undergo these strokes like 893 00:33:45,255 --> 00:33:46,634 a classical heat engine. 894 00:33:47,015 --> 00:33:49,309 Just which parameters we tune 895 00:33:49,690 --> 00:33:51,289 are different in the quantum case than in 896 00:33:51,289 --> 00:33:53,150 the classical case, and 897 00:33:53,769 --> 00:33:56,190 the physical nature of the heat baths 898 00:33:56,490 --> 00:33:58,890 might be different in the quantum and classical 899 00:33:58,890 --> 00:33:59,390 cases. 900 00:34:00,569 --> 00:34:01,230 I see. 901 00:34:01,529 --> 00:34:02,029 Okay. 902 00:34:02,914 --> 00:34:04,775 And and, Bruce, are you, 903 00:34:05,954 --> 00:34:08,835 are you hooked on quantum steampunk now? Are 904 00:34:08,835 --> 00:34:10,914 you are you going to be working with 905 00:34:10,914 --> 00:34:12,375 Nicole or or maybe, 906 00:34:12,994 --> 00:34:13,734 other physicists 907 00:34:14,594 --> 00:34:14,994 in, 908 00:34:15,554 --> 00:34:16,775 creating more art 909 00:34:17,269 --> 00:34:19,130 based on the, on the thermodynamics 910 00:34:19,589 --> 00:34:20,889 of the quantum world? 911 00:34:21,909 --> 00:34:24,489 Yes. So, so a couple of things. 912 00:34:26,789 --> 00:34:29,349 When we first were talking about creating a 913 00:34:29,349 --> 00:34:31,130 steampunk quantum engine together, 914 00:34:31,905 --> 00:34:34,224 we were actually thinking bigger. We were thinking 915 00:34:34,224 --> 00:34:36,465 about a sculpture that could be eight foot 916 00:34:36,465 --> 00:34:36,965 route, 917 00:34:37,425 --> 00:34:39,905 you know, armillary sphere, something that you could 918 00:34:39,905 --> 00:34:41,905 literally walk into and, you know, be a 919 00:34:41,905 --> 00:34:42,644 part of. 920 00:34:43,025 --> 00:34:45,364 But, of course, the the size, the complexity, 921 00:34:45,505 --> 00:34:47,849 the scale, you know, we're we're talking about, 922 00:34:48,389 --> 00:34:50,489 you know, larger amounts of funding. 923 00:34:51,670 --> 00:34:54,469 Nicole was able to to, get this wonderful 924 00:34:54,469 --> 00:34:55,349 $10,000 925 00:34:55,349 --> 00:34:58,329 grant to build the sculpture that we did, 926 00:34:58,614 --> 00:35:00,855 but we still have in mind that we'd 927 00:35:00,855 --> 00:35:02,075 like to build something 928 00:35:02,535 --> 00:35:04,394 bigger, better, more interactive, 929 00:35:06,055 --> 00:35:07,195 more sci fi, 930 00:35:07,655 --> 00:35:09,735 you know, in a way. So, 931 00:35:10,055 --> 00:35:12,055 so we're still kind of out there. And 932 00:35:12,055 --> 00:35:12,954 if your listeners, 933 00:35:14,159 --> 00:35:16,639 would like to, you know, touch base with 934 00:35:16,639 --> 00:35:17,139 us, 935 00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,980 you can they can actually go to quantumsteampunk.org 936 00:35:21,359 --> 00:35:22,179 is the website 937 00:35:22,639 --> 00:35:25,039 and contact Nicole or I in terms of, 938 00:35:25,039 --> 00:35:27,380 you know, maybe helping us out with this 939 00:35:27,679 --> 00:35:28,980 this bigger sculpture. 940 00:35:30,195 --> 00:35:32,454 But, the other thing too is because, 941 00:35:33,394 --> 00:35:35,655 Nicole is at the University of Maryland, 942 00:35:36,195 --> 00:35:37,255 they have a whole 943 00:35:37,715 --> 00:35:40,914 kind of quantum campus there, the Discovery District, 944 00:35:40,914 --> 00:35:42,775 and we're talking with folks there. 945 00:35:43,359 --> 00:35:45,679 We're part we're trying to get part of 946 00:35:45,679 --> 00:35:47,139 of these quantum initiatives 947 00:35:47,679 --> 00:35:48,339 to do, 948 00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:49,859 statement pieces, 949 00:35:51,039 --> 00:35:51,539 quantum, 950 00:35:52,159 --> 00:35:52,980 art installations 951 00:35:53,679 --> 00:35:54,739 for that campus. 952 00:35:55,425 --> 00:35:57,744 So we're we're excited that we're working together 953 00:35:57,744 --> 00:35:59,684 and that we have all these connections now, 954 00:35:59,985 --> 00:36:02,385 and we really see that this is starting 955 00:36:02,385 --> 00:36:04,465 to to take hold and that we we'll 956 00:36:04,465 --> 00:36:06,164 we'll be able to do more together. 957 00:36:07,105 --> 00:36:09,344 That's great. And and what about you, Nicole? 958 00:36:09,344 --> 00:36:09,585 Are you 959 00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:13,819 has there been any sort of feedback from 960 00:36:14,039 --> 00:36:15,900 from your work in art 961 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:18,699 back into physics? Is has 962 00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:20,619 working with Bruce, 963 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:22,539 has that helped you consolidate 964 00:36:22,839 --> 00:36:24,539 ideas within your research? 965 00:36:25,974 --> 00:36:27,034 I find that 966 00:36:27,574 --> 00:36:30,695 engaging in art or writing helps me understand 967 00:36:30,695 --> 00:36:33,655 the physics better. Maybe it makes me read 968 00:36:33,655 --> 00:36:36,135 in details papers that I had just heard 969 00:36:36,135 --> 00:36:38,215 about. For example, what I have in mind, 970 00:36:38,215 --> 00:36:38,715 one 971 00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,599 engine paper that I read in detail for 972 00:36:42,599 --> 00:36:43,739 the sake of 973 00:36:44,039 --> 00:36:44,780 the sculpture. 974 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:48,619 An example of a project 975 00:36:49,559 --> 00:36:50,059 that 976 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:53,579 benefited my research because of engagement with arts 977 00:36:54,014 --> 00:36:56,734 actually came out of my book, which is 978 00:36:56,734 --> 00:36:58,355 closely related to the sculpture. 979 00:36:58,894 --> 00:37:00,734 So when I was writing my book, I 980 00:37:00,734 --> 00:37:03,375 had to write about what comes next for 981 00:37:03,375 --> 00:37:05,315 quantum thermodynamics in the epilogue. 982 00:37:05,934 --> 00:37:07,775 And I thought it would be useful for 983 00:37:07,775 --> 00:37:08,674 quantum thermodynamics 984 00:37:09,135 --> 00:37:11,929 to start to be useful, to be practical, 985 00:37:12,550 --> 00:37:14,010 kind of the way that thermodynamics 986 00:37:14,550 --> 00:37:16,969 originally went hand in hand with the Industrial 987 00:37:17,030 --> 00:37:17,530 Revolution. 988 00:37:18,230 --> 00:37:21,130 So shortly after writing that epilogue, 989 00:37:22,309 --> 00:37:24,404 I came across an experimentalist 990 00:37:24,704 --> 00:37:25,764 who asked me 991 00:37:26,224 --> 00:37:28,144 what experiments would be interesting to do in 992 00:37:28,144 --> 00:37:29,045 quantum thermodynamics. 993 00:37:29,824 --> 00:37:32,164 I told him of my desire for practicality 994 00:37:32,304 --> 00:37:33,284 for quantum thermodynamics, 995 00:37:33,824 --> 00:37:36,144 and we came up with a project that 996 00:37:36,144 --> 00:37:37,984 led to a whole line of research on 997 00:37:37,984 --> 00:37:39,444 autonomous quantum machines. 998 00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:43,159 So far, I don't have a whole line 999 00:37:43,159 --> 00:37:46,519 of research inspired by quantum stink buck artwork, 1000 00:37:46,519 --> 00:37:48,699 but I am definitely open to the possibility. 1001 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:51,480 Oh, that's great. That's great news. It sounds 1002 00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:53,019 like it's been a very fruitful 1003 00:37:53,585 --> 00:37:56,304 collaboration so far, and and long may it 1004 00:37:56,304 --> 00:37:56,804 last. 1005 00:37:57,505 --> 00:37:58,565 Bruce and Nicole, 1006 00:37:58,864 --> 00:38:00,885 thanks so much for coming on the podcast. 1007 00:38:01,344 --> 00:38:02,944 Thank you for hosting us. It's been a 1008 00:38:02,944 --> 00:38:05,135 pleasure. Thanks. Yes. It was a pleasure. 1009 00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:14,239 I'm afraid that's all the time we have 1010 00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:15,460 for this week's podcast, 1011 00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:17,460 which is supported generously 1012 00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:19,460 by Atlas Technologies. 1013 00:38:20,414 --> 00:38:22,755 Thanks to Nicole Junger Halpern 1014 00:38:23,135 --> 00:38:24,515 and Bruce Rosenbaum 1015 00:38:25,055 --> 00:38:26,434 for joining me today, 1016 00:38:26,735 --> 00:38:29,295 and a special thanks to our producer, Fred 1017 00:38:29,295 --> 00:38:29,795 Ailes. 1018 00:38:30,414 --> 00:38:32,894 We'll be back again next week. See you 1019 00:38:32,894 --> 00:38:33,394 then. 1020 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:40,579 Atlas Technologies 1021 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:42,820 is happy to support this episode 1022 00:38:43,119 --> 00:38:46,099 and the exciting work being done in quantum 1023 00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:46,660 science. 1024 00:38:47,344 --> 00:38:49,684 Atlas helps solve engineering challenges 1025 00:38:49,984 --> 00:38:50,484 everywhere, 1026 00:38:51,025 --> 00:38:52,005 particle colliders, 1027 00:38:52,385 --> 00:38:53,284 space missions, 1028 00:38:53,585 --> 00:38:54,085 quantum 1029 00:38:54,385 --> 00:38:54,885 cryogenics, 1030 00:38:55,344 --> 00:38:56,164 and more. 1031 00:38:56,625 --> 00:39:00,565 Custom vacuum chambers and bimetal flanges and fittings 1032 00:39:00,989 --> 00:39:02,369 are built in Atlas's 1033 00:39:02,750 --> 00:39:04,449 fully integrated facility 1034 00:39:04,750 --> 00:39:07,170 with on-site design, development, 1035 00:39:07,469 --> 00:39:08,530 and manufacturing 1036 00:39:08,909 --> 00:39:09,409 capabilities. 1037 00:39:10,269 --> 00:39:14,369 Learn more at atlasuhv.com.