You're listening to the Loving BDSM podcast, episode
four thirty five. Kayla Lords here with the
one, the only, the sleepy,
eepy
John Brownstone who's a true trooper because,
you don't really you're not really all awake
with us, but you're here and I appreciate
you. Had a shitty night's sleep last night.
I know. I know. Insomnia,
my best friend.
Yeah. He's come to sit with me again.
Mhmm. Yeah.
I I believe insomnia is more of a
frenemy. Mhmm.
Putting that out there.
So I've been asked to keep us on
point today. Uh-huh.
Look. I'm gonna take it on as a
task. I'm gonna do my best.
Just do what daddy says. I've gotta try.
We're all fucking hard.
That is not what we're here for this
week. This week, the topic comes from actual
multiple questions we have received recently
from submissives who have introduced their partner to
a specific type of dynamic
and then are hesitant
to, like, say, I need more. I want
this. They are they too much? Are they
too needy? They they're y'all are having the
feels out there, and so we're gonna talk
about that. Welcome to the Loving BDSM podcast.
If this is your first time listening, glad
to have you. If you're back for another
week, welcome back. Loving BDSM is produced every
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Blah blah blah,
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podcast every Wednesday. All links are in the
show notes.
Okay. So before we get into
this week's episode,
we are sponsoring us again.
We just would like to remind everybody that
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Most importantly, the reason mentioning it, like, now,
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yeah. I I I try to get
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I appreciate that. Mhmm. So,
whether you're brand new to us and did
not know or you're like, oh, I'd forgotten,
but also I'm ready to spend a little
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That's us. We are a literal two person
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It used to be weapons of ass destruction,
but now it's just hitty shit.
That that seems on brand quite frankly. That
really, really really does. Yeah. Okay. So
this week's talk I'm actually gonna be referring
to my notes because there were so many
points that I wanted to touch on because
this is not a broad topic. It's actually
a fairly narrow topic,
but there's a lot that can be said
about it.
JB's doing a lot of moving over here.
Yeah.
You just know I'm gonna need that mouse,
right, that you've just taken away to the
other side of the
Well, I'm gonna need it too.
Anyway,
so
this the idea for this episode came as
I was looking through the emails we received
for our q and a episodes where folks
submit
cues for us to a. And I was
trying to pull one for Monday's episode.
And in at least two of the questions,
there was an almost word for word similar
situation.
In these specific cases,
the dom was a, caregiver,
specifically daddy dom, that they had been kind
of introduced to it by their submissive. They
did not know they were into it and,
you know, had that moment of having to
get comfortable with it. Right? But the submissive
was like, hell yeah. This is my jam.
And then the submissive hits a point where
they're they want to ask for more. They
want to do more. They want more from
their daddy dom partner,
but now they're like, uh-oh. I think I'm
being too much. I think I'm being too
needy. And it's the similar vibe that I
have seen from
primarily
submissives, but I have no doubt there are
dominants who go through your own version of
this,
where you just worry you're too much. To
the point that way
back in episode 60 Wow. Right? Twenty sixteen
That was back in the day. Twenty sixteen
for anybody who wants to know. We actually
talked
about the too much, too needy,
thing that submissives go through as some of
the myths that submissives believe about themselves. I've
linked it in the places for anybody who
wants to go that far back in the
archive.
But this was more, in that case, it
was that general idea that just even mentioning
your needs somehow makes you too much too
needy. This is to me a much more
specific thing where one partner
introduces
the other partner
to a type of power exchange dynamic that
they had not necessarily considered before.
That partner goes through some period of maybe
discomfort, maybe just this is awkward because I'm
new and I don't know how I feel
about it yet, but then gets to the
point where they're like, Yeah, we can do
this.
And then that original partner's like
kinda gets it in their head of, maybe
they don't really like it as much as
they're pretending to. And if I ask for
more,
I'm doing too much. I'm asking for things
that right.
So that's this specific
conversation. Now here are from the emails,
that we received,
the,
the quest
the specific question
comments from each one. For this first one,
I want more of this dynamic more often,
but I don't want to ask because I
don't want to want him to agree
just because he loves me and wants to
make me happy.
But
but you you want them to agree to
do stuff because they love you and want
you to be happy. Right? Right. So They're
yeah. Okay. And the next one and, y'all,
these were like, I had to go check.
I was like, did somebody send the same
email twice? It does not appear to me.
This one says, I know that he says
that he likes it, but I worry that
I am now stopping him from exploring other
aspects of kink because he knows how much
I like him being daddy. I believe him
when he says he likes taking on that
role. I feel like a horrible person if
I ask for more as I don't want
to take advantage when he's taking on that
role
because he wants to make me happy because
he loves me.
I'm I'm seeing a common theme here. I
know.
I know. Now I have not had them,
I have not had in the past that
kind of question
come up worded quite that closely together,
but the sentiment is sort of the same.
Over the years, it's like, I introduced this,
so
am I wrong, bad, blah blah blah for
wanting more than this part that I know
my partner's comfortable with? So let's sort of
talk about this. And for anybody who's interested,
I double checked my thinking on this because
my thinking on relationships
comes from all of the various sources of
things I have learned including my own experience,
but I wanna make sure I was sort
of saying these things correctly. So
I'm I'm over on therapy Jeff's Instagram
account. I'm at the Gottman Institute,
which is like,
I don't know if they're great and amazing,
but they're kind of well known relationship folks.
They're quoting Esther Perel who is like the
the expert on intimacy and and, you know,
sex in relationships. Like, I'm trying to get
my shit together. So where this is coming
from is not just that I have pulled
it out of my ass. I have backed
it up from others who are professionals who
pulled it out of their ass. Thank you
very much. So let's talk start with the
first point of this because this there's no
singular place that these feelings come from,
and there's no singular reason why people feel
this way. But there are some things to
kind of
think about and also go down kind of
a checklist of of where is this coming
from. So the first thing that I've heard
over and over and over again
is that and it was a weird feeling
to to thing to kinda wrap my mind
around at first, but then I realized we've
already done this.
It's the concept that we teach our partners
how to love us, care for us, do
for us the things we want them to
be able to do. Correct. And it's as
long as they're willing to be teachable.
It you mentioned it in an episode the
Monday video actually about not being a mind
reader. Correct. Right? Correct. So And that and
that you hear it more often
referred to as to the Dom Mhmm. To
the big d. Mhmm.
But
the same goes for for the little s.
Absolutely.
That whole, you know, mind reading thing goes
both ways. These specific questions, I don't think
it was not the mind reading aspect because
they're like, I know I've gotta say it,
but I'm afraid to say it. But that,
I think, is a core
kind of thing
to,
remember in a relationship regardless of how you
style your power exchange, regardless of whether it's
romantic, sexual, platonic.
We are teaching our partners mutually Mhmm. How
to care for us. Right. And
they can only do that with the information
we
give them about what we want and need.
Right? Mhmm. And I think that's a a
a pretty clear
concept. I don't think I think once if
it's foreign to you, like, think about it
for a minute but it kind of makes
sense. You know, if you've ever been that
person in a relationship who's like and I
said this. I said this when I was
vanilla. Well, I want flowers but I don't
want to have to ask for flowers because
I want you to want to get me
flowers.
I don't think What's wrong with that picture?
I don't think that way anymore, but I
was I know I'm not alone. I know
a lot of people who still think that
way. And it's this idea of I kind
of want you to just intuit the things
I need. And Mhmm.
Can you get to that point? Can Jay
is after however many years now, more than
a decade, can Jamie look at me sometimes
and go, I know exactly what she needs?
Sure. But how did he get there? Because
I spent a lot of time teaching him
and showing him and telling
and but wait. And, you know, it it's
funny, and it and it gives me a
bit of cringe,
you know, whether
on TikTok or or,
Instagram, where I see a lot of this
stuff,
you know, you see
a lot of women
who are like, well, he should know. Oh,
yeah. There's
there's a lot of that out there. Why
didn't he just know? Why didn't he just
do?
And
And not to stereotype, but I think most
of us can stereotype that's typically
non kink thinking. That's vanilla thinking, and it's
the old,
you know, cliches and paradigms and the things
we have to break free from in order
to have a happy, healthy, power, and shared
relationship. And that's what it was. A lot
of the ones that I come across like
that, they all seem to be non kinky
relationships.
Kinky relationship. True true true. Of course you
can, but that's where then you get the
why am I miserable? Why am I not
getting what I want? Why is my dom
not reading my mind? Why doesn't my submissive
just know what they're supposed to do? Like,
that's where you get the dissatisfaction because
if the one of the first tenants of
BDSM in any way, power exchange or just
kinky play, is communication
See what then we all have to use
our our big kid voices and say the
thing. Need one of those Times Square signs
on, you know, you wear and it just
scrolls, you know, what you're thinking and wanting
and needing. Nope. You don't want that. You
look. I want to be able to choose
what I share.
Not just because sometimes I I'm a bitch
in my head. Sure. But also it I
got hamsters running on broken hamster wheels up
here.
Nobody would be able to follow that. My
little board would give out and be like,
nope. We can't keep up with this crazy
shit. Mhmm. Mhmm. So when we talk about,
power exchange and the idea of teaching our
partners what we need Right.
As you're doing that, when you're new to
your dynamic, whether it's the style of dynamic
or power exchange in general,
you are both learning simultaneously.
So like in the case of these specific
questions we got, they figured out and their
partners said, sure, let's do this of the
caregiver
little kind of dynamic.
And they knew to ask for things in
the beginning of that, but in this case
the submissives of, hey, let's do this. And
it's
as
of, hey, let's do this. And it's as
you get that that and you maybe start
to feel safer, the trust develops, you just
learn more about what you want, but then
you realize that you want new and more
things.
That is a natural progression of this. Sure.
And and, you know, just like us, we
are not the same people we were when
we met. No. You know, how many years
ago now?
Two weeks ago.
Yeah. At least. Something like that. I'm too
young. Yeah. And and and people change, people
grow, you know, different things.
And,
you know,
even us, we are not the same. Our,
power exchange is different. Mhmm. Definitely different from
what it was.
We are different how we handle our power
exchange. We some things we still want the
same stuff, some things are a little different
that we want. But
the the point of it is, you know,
through this growth, through this change, we have
kept communicating.
Mhmm. K? So we know where each one
is and what the other wants. Right. Absolutely.
So that's kind of the
starting point for anybody who might be recognizing
themselves in some of this
we're doing this thing, I want more, I
don't I'm afraid to say more, right? Those
kinds of things. So let's start with just
keep that in your mind. We are each
we are all teaching each other how
we
want to be treated, be loved, be whatever
Mhmm. In these relationships. That's just part of
it. And and the the
air quotes I won't say easiest. The simplest
method, which is not the easiest because it's
it is difficult, is clear communication. Just sit
down at some time that works for both
of you and go, hey.
This is a thing I can't stop thinking
about. This is a thing I'd like to
try. Right?
The,
the ask does not mean you get it.
So if the worry is too much, too
demanding, too whatever,
you know, that you leave that that ball
in your partner's court to decide that they
want to
Right? Because,
go back to it, nobody's a mind reader.
Right? Okay. So
let's go through the sure. Go ahead. And
then ahead. And then and then you gotta
be careful too because you may come to
me and ask me, say, you know, daddy,
I I want this. I, you know, can
you
and I'll be like, yeah. But I'm gonna
put my own little twist on it.
Oh, I know. There are times I'll actually
say, I really wanna ask you for this
thing, but I know some of the ways
you could take this in a whole different
direction, and I am now afraid to ask
you this thing.
And that's part of the communication process of
me saying, hey. I I I wanna tell
you a thing, but I'm a little uneasy,
uncertain.
My uncertainty comes from knowing JB. In the
beginning days, it's the not knowing. It's the
not knowing how your partner might respond. So
let's go through
some of the things that could be
leading to these feelings, this too much, too
needy, I can't ask for these things. Right?
And it's not that
a single one will be right. It could
be some combination.
Hell, I've got one, two, three, six here,
and they could be something I hadn't considered.
But these are the what I think
are the most common ones. We'll go through
them point by point. Okay.
This one, I didn't ask the question. It's
a point I need everybody to remember. Your
needs are valid. That's true. And so then
the question I want you to ask yourself
feelings. Right. Is do I think that I'm
not I'm not allowed to have these needs,
that I'm wrong for having these needs, that,
I'm doing in this for these people who
ask the question, they're submissives. But so am
I doing submission wrong? Right? Am I doing
power exchange wrong because I have these needs?
And then those again,
the point to remember
is that your needs are valid. They're valid.
It's like your emotions are valid. It's the
the thing that you feel, the thing that
you want is always valid. It's the action
that you take that determines whether it's okay
or not. Right?
And if you do not,
there's a word I want and I can't
think of it. But basically, if you do
not believe internally
that what you want is okay to want,
it becomes a whole hell of a lot
harder to tell your partner that you want
the thing. Right?
Now I think some of that could be
carried over from the taboo of kink. Right?
I'm not supposed to want this. This is,
you know Mhmm. Some part of my upbringing
is convincing me this is wrong. Well, I
mean, you know, I I know for myself,
there was a in the especially in the
very beginning, in the early days
of of my journey in the lifestyle,
there was a lot of, religious guilt. True.
Yeah. Oh, yeah. I can imagine. That that
sparked feelings of that, you know.
Right. So then it becomes harder to say
the thing you want because you're like, I
feel like shit for this. There's the other
side, and I'm speaking specifically to submissives here.
I'm sure it can happen to doms, but
I think it's gonna happen in a different
way and
maybe even be rare, but I don't know.
For submissives to have needs and wants can
feel
like it's somehow wrong because, well, I'm a
submissive.
I'm supposed to want what my partner wants.
No. Mm-mm. That's
no.
Ideally, you'll want at least some of what
your partner wants because if you don't, then
I think you're incompatible.
But you get to want and need what
you want and need. Right. It's like a
Venn diagram. It it's an overlap. That's that's
my favorite analogy. It's yeah. You find the
Venn diagram. There's your wants and needs, their
wants and needs. And Where it overlaps? What
meets in the middle. And that's what you're
gonna focus on. And y'all might pull in
things that you want more than your partner
does. And they want and you might allow
yourself to do things that they want more
than you do. That comes after time, experience,
and trust. Right. And and, yeah. Because I
yeah. I was gonna add to that too.
You know, one once trust,
then that opens the door for other things
too. Right. Exactly.
But where you begin
at the at the start is the Venn
diagram. Right? Is the overlap. And then you
can expand from there. Mhmm. And that Venn
diagram will absolutely shift and change over time
because, like we said earlier,
there will be things that you didn't know
you wanted until you learned about it. Right?
And now you've got to talk about it.
And is your partner interested or not? Are
they willing to do it or not?
I think there's this thing thinking that if
our partner is not as excited and enthusiastic
about a thing as we are,
then we should not do it. Right.
And you want them to be willing and
not coerce and to be like, heck yeah.
I'm all in on this.
But sometimes,
you want something more than your partner wants
it. Yeah. That's okay. As long as it's
not completely
uneven where you are always getting what you
want more than your partner is getting what
they want or yeah. And one of you
is not experiencing,
air quote, this because it's subjective, enough of
what you want while your partner seems to
be swimming in what they want. Those imbalances
are a problem.
Now, you know, I I will say sometimes,
you know, as as a big d,
there are times
you can, you know, especially if you've been
with somebody long enough, you can kind of,
get a feeling of where they're at. Mhmm.
Mhmm. Absolutely.
Like,
for you, Monday was a very,
very emotional day. Oh, yeah. It's a rough
day. Yep. It was a rough day. And
and what did I do that night? I
spanked your ass. You did. It was delight.
I flogged your ass. You got me giggling
Yeah. At certain points. Right. Mhmm. Mhmm. So,
you know,
you sometimes you can kinda see,
you know, as how things And also you're
basing it on past experiences. We've gone through
emotional times together. We've explored how we deal
with those things. So Now you're pulling
from experience. Advantage that, you know, we we
are pretty much together all day long. Yes.
That does help.
That does help. You know. So that that
does help to a certain extent. I don't
have to communicate quite as much because he's
already witnessed it. Yeah. The communication comes in
if JB does not understand my response to
something
or if I have been processing in my
mind and and realized some things that would
not have been
obvious from the interaction or that are new
if it's new information to me, it's 99%
of the time new information to JB.
So, yeah, there is that, okay, if he
can see it me going through it, then
he kind of can get an idea
of what's what. Right. Mhmm. But the the
thing there that always remains true is that
if JB reads the room incorrectly,
I always have the ability to say for
it out or go, hey. Absolutely. I see
what you're trying to do here. I really
appreciate it, but this is not Not the
time. This is not it. We gotta do
something different. Yeah.
And, you know, being able to say that
again,
I'm starting drinking game. How many times do
I say trust in this episode?
That comes down to trust. It comes down
to confidence in in our relationship and in
knowing I can say that, and I'm not
afraid to have to put this, you know,
the brakes on something
because it's not really what I want or
need in the moment, and it's enough of
a not want or need that it's like,
we I don't wanna do this.
And I want everybody to walk into any
kink situation and immediately be able to do
that, but I know that, you know, when
you're new and you're developing the trust between
you and a power exchange,
it can take a while for that to
feel easy.
Like, it is always available and everybody should
always use it, but
it's over time that it can get easier.
So
I kind of combined point one and two
because
saying that your needs are valid is then
you have to
the opposite to that is or the question
to that is Mhmm. Do you think you
don't deserve what you want? Right? That you're
not worthy of it, that you're not allowed
to have it.
Typically, submissives
feel I think feel this,
strongly.
Not all submissives, not all the time, but
if this is a feeling you're having,
yeah, because of the the bullshit tropes we're
given. I can imagine
because you talked about, like, religious guilt. I
can imagine Dom's feeling this way.
But I and you are only one Dom.
You do not speak for all Dom's everywhere.
I know that.
Have you ever had that feeling with any
partner before me, since whatever,
where you did not want to
you didn't feel like you could
initiate or ask for or negotiate
a type of play, a type of dynamic,
anything
within kink
because maybe you shouldn't do that. Maybe it
was too much. Maybe it was
Yes.
Okay. Tell us about that.
It, you know, it it it's mostly been
in the past Sure.
At this point. But,
you know, it it it just comes to
a
to a point, you know, you you talk
about, you know, I
I don't really
like this term
in a sense, you know,
not enough.
Yeah. I don't like it either. Okay. Not
enough.
I I I don't like it because
it it's not a matter of
not being enough,
it
is more a matter, I think, of your
kinks being misaligned.
Yes. And that is, I think, the fact
of it. But before we learn that, we
feel the way. Or you need to, you
know, talk, and and kind of
negotiate and find the middle ground.
You know, but, yeah, there there have been
times in the past where,
you know,
no, I I can't quite go that far,
you know. I I It's too much. It's
too much. Too much. Yeah. Yeah. You know,
it it's it's,
it's my boundary,
so to speak, you know. But that that
boundary, was it a boundary because you
you felt like you were asking for too
much or you needed too much or that
you in this case, maybe you shouldn't be
go back with the religious guilt that you
shouldn't be doing. Should is, like, the keyword
there. I should, I shouldn't.
You know, the the the the whole religious
guilt, yeah. That that was a big thing
for me to get over Mhmm. Early on.
Mhmm. And,
you know, it
for the most part, I'm past it. Every
once in a while
Sure. You know,
certain it kinda
peeks its head out.
Well, at this point, was it
not it was it was more than half
your life at this point? You were in
your thirties, into your forties before you kinda
got away from some of that, or were
you closer to 50?
Probably late closer to 50.
That's a lot of time. Yeah. I mean,
you're only you're not quite mid sixties yet.
So
that's a lot of time to have been
indoctrinated in into certain ways of thinking, to
have been treated certain ways based on x
y z, and then to
undo
that so that you could then
do Move forward. Move forward. Right. And live
your best kink life. Right. Right. You know?
But, you know, getting getting back to that
whole thing,
for the most part, it it's kinda like,
you know
you know, yeah, you you like spanking,
and and I like spanking,
you know, but then after that, you wanna
go into this deep humiliation scene, and, you
know, I I can't do that. That's not
who I am Right. Kind of thing. You
know, so,
yeah.
Either way, it it's not about not being
enough. It's about being whether
your kids align. Absolutely. That is always true.
Yeah. That is always true. But that that
deep seated thought of thinking it Mhmm. Is
what folks have to What? Yeah. If that
resonates to overcome. You gotta look at it
and know that's what it is, and then
overcome it. That's that angry voice in your
head.
Yep. Okay. So let's go through our list.
The next one, and this one speaks specifically
to submissives
because of that too much myth thing from
episode 60 in 2016.
And I I want you to ask yourself
if these
feelings resonate, if you have had this similar
kind of, oh, I can't ask for this
thing.
Are you worried that you're somehow not really
submissive, not air quote, not submissive enough,
not being submissive
when you
ask for things?
None of that's true, by the way.
Right. But that doesn't stop us from
find people we can trust
and, you know, become comfortable with who we
are and all that and mature in our
kink life. That doesn't mean it's not something
that you might think for whatever reason. Whether
you got sucked into some one true way
bullshit or you've heard too many people tell
you there's a right way
bullshit or you've heard too many people tell
you there's a right way and a wrong
way to do this and, you know, there's
all kinds of reasons that we might have
those thoughts. But when you're going,
oh, I I shouldn't ask for this. I
can't ask for this. I'm I'm gonna be
too much. Maybe I'm being too needy.
The too much and too needy is its
own thing, but it I think it also
can come from other places. And one of
those things is do you somehow not feel
like you're being submissive enough when you just
ask for what the fuck you want?
You are. Because here's the thing, here's the
thing. When I ask JB for something,
that's me communicating clearly my needs. Right? My
wants, my desires.
What I then do
is I sit back and wait for JB's
response. That's two things. One, that's consent. Right?
Everybody gets that. But also, if he consents
to it, then it's within his power. It's
within his control. He's still very much a
dominant. I am still very much a submissive
because all I've done is say, hey. I'd
like this thing. And, And, you know, let's
talk about our limits. Let's negotiate it. But,
hey. Here's what you need to know about
me liking this thing and wanting this thing.
And then the ball's in his fucking court,
and he gets to decide, and he is
in charge of all of that, and he
has the power and control.
Communicating your needs does not somehow, oh, this
is so gross to me, make you less
submissive.
It makes you a responsible
kinkster.
Right. You know? It makes you it it
makes you the a purse the type of
kinkster that your partner can trust.
You know? If you're not talking about your
wants and needs out of some,
you know,
belief or fear that to do so is
somehow not submissive,
it makes me wanna gag,
but you are then
you know, you're you're not somebody that your
partner can trust either because how can they
make,
well informed decisions if they don't know what
you want and need? They you you know
Mhmm. Also,
I need everybody, but definitely submissives who struggle
with this, to please advocate for yourself.
All you're doing in that point, when you
give consent, when you withdraw consent, when you
share your wants, needs, when you share your
boundaries and limits, that is you are advocating
for yourself. You are saying, hey, this is
a thing that I as a human being
want regardless of
roles, titles, labels we use, and I'm gonna
share that information with a person I think
can be trusted with it
because now you know more about me. And
we go back up to the very first
point. I'm teaching you what you need to
know about me. Right. Sometimes you're teaching it
as you're fucking learning it, which can be
a little bit of a mind fuck.
It is so hot in here. I'm already
sweaty. I know.
I cannot remember,
because my mind is Swiss cheese,
ever having that feeling of I'm not really
submissive for wanting the thing. Did did you
ever get that vibe for me? Have you
ever had that experience with any other partners
who kind of would think they weren't supposed
to ask for anything?
No. No. What I remember is not not
wanting to make to I don't think I
ever had the I'm I'm not being submissive
when I do this.
I remember
not
trusting
anybody
well enough to
share my deep deepest, darkest desires and secrets.
Like, that felt scary to do.
And
you built up the trust and broke down
the six foot thick walls I had,
and became the safe person, so I knew
that I could. But you did it by
asking questions. Yeah. You did it by being
curious. And then when I answered those questions
and when I showed you bits and pieces
of who I was,
there was never judgment. No. When you genuinely
like something, I could see that you genuinely
are, like, hot damn. This is good. Like,
I could I could sense that
you nobody needs it, but
sometimes we do that approval of you said
a thing, and I'm I'm really vibing with
that thing you said. You know, you gave
me enough of the the positive
feedback kind of thing
that that made it safe for me to
do that. And you made it clear to
me from the very beginning that I had
to tell you stuff. I that was that
was part of this. Right.
And I think that's important as well. Yeah.
That does not mean that there aren't folks
too many folks walking around going, well, I'm
not very submissive if I do this.
Okay. Here's here's one. Here's one. And I
think this goes back to where you're talking
about religious guilt because there's that would be
one reason you might feel this way. Mhmm.
If you're feeling like you can't ask for
these things, is it because you're ashamed of
your needs? Yeah. Yeah. Are you ashamed of
Mhmm. Ashamed of wanting anything at all, ashamed
of wanting more than you've already negotiated,
ashamed of wanting the things specifically you want
because there's
because there's some part of you that still
believes I'm not supposed air quote, this supposed
to want to. There is a good amount
of folks, and
even on the s side of Slash, because
I've had many tell me this.
You know, one was like,
you know, I I I love the the
whole little,
you know, caregiver, but
I'm I'm ashamed to let that side Mhmm.
Show because, you know, we're we're supposed to
be adults. We're, you know,
I wish I had some, like,
smart,
quick,
whatever thing to go, here's how you deal
with shame.
I am not that smart.
I I think there's lots of components to
that.
The
within our relationship I do not have a
lot of memories of feeling shame between you
and I, and I think part of that
is because we had a solid enough foundation.
And you were I had the
good fortune
that you were more experienced
and had kind of become comfortable in your
own kink self.
So,
you know, you could encourage me to
say what I need to say, and and
you would you would say the things like,
you can tell me anything. Like, no judgment
here. And sometimes that's what we need to
hear, and we need to hear it all
the time until we can internalize it and
believe it.
But there's, you know,
undoing
shame within ourselves is its own,
like, journey. Like, there's because there's different reasons
for it. There's different ways that it impacts
us. You know, it then I mean, I
I won't go into too much detail. I've
talked about enough over the years, but, you
know, I've talked about how, you know, I
in in the early days, I had,
trouble reconciling
hitting somebody. Right. Right.
And that and those kinds of right. There's
that feeling of I'm not supposed to want
this. I should be ashamed of myself. Right.
I
was raised
as all good
should have been a boomer but she had
me young so technically Gen X old parents
do, with their girls of you have to
be an independent woman.
You need to have your own money. Don't
depend on a man for nothing.
Like, maybe not all get that, but it's
a common experience
of, amongst women as of a certain age
at this point. And I had to give
up that
feeling
of I didn't have to give it up.
I had to reconcile that feeling with, yes,
but I wanna submit to the right person.
I wanna do what the right person says.
And for me, that tends to be men.
Right? Like, those masculine people at minimum, but
my whole experience is men. And so I'm
in in that way, I'm completely going against
everything my
I've been taught
from the cradle
about how I'm supposed to interact in the
world as a woman.
And there is some
there's some back and forth in your own
head about that. There's some getting comfortable with
uncomfortable things. There's
unpacking the shit that ever, you know, that
that is attached to any shame we feel
about what we want.
And I think, you know
when you're unwilling or uncertain about going hey
I need this thing, I want this thing,
do do that check because here's the thing
you can have been kinky for ten, fifteen,
twenty years,
think you've worked through everything,
and then hit a moment where, oh, I
guess this is rearing its ugly head again.
I have to kind
of rework through it.
Like whack a mole. It is like whack
a mole. And if if you're a person
who's saying, well, more more than just one
of these points is resonating, that means you're
just playing a a bigger game of whack
a mole because
it's it's all the things.
Here's the one. Mhmm. There's the these last
two
are pointedly
about these these specific questions. Yeah.
So I'm afraid to ask. I'm gonna come
across as too much too needy. I've introduced
them to this. How do I know they
really like this thing? I like it more
than they do so they won't wanna do
these things. I'm being too much, right?
Do you trust your partner to
set and communicate their own boundaries?
Your partner is a grown ass adult who
needs to be working on their own communication
skills. So when you want something from them
and you are uncertain
as to whether they would want to do
it with you and you're telling yourself, I'm
too much. I'm too needy.
You are taking away
the,
there's a word. I can't think of it.
The autonomy of your own partner
to decide what they want to do with
and for you. K.
Right? Yeah. You are not required to ask
for the things that come into your head.
Not every fantasy is meant to, like, actually
happen in real life. You're not required to
do that. But when it's something you really
want and you can't stop thinking about how
you really like to ask for it, but
you assume you know
why you're not gonna get it or why
you don't deserve it. Let's go back to
that. Do you think you don't deserve it?
You've just taken away that choice from your
partner who might abso fucking lily do it
for you just because you want it, and
it makes them happy to make you happy.
Like, that's the other part of this that
I think gets forgotten.
Sometimes we as partners
do shit for the sole purpose
to make our partner happy and that is
legitimate
and that is absolutely
a part of any fucking relationship where you
care about the other person.
And we are all worthy of that. Let's
go back up to do I deserve this?
We are all worthy of that kind of
care.
But I need to expect if I have
to be a grown ass adult and use
my big girl words, I have to expect
that my partner is also a grown ass
adult and will use their big person words
as well and will communicate.
Even if it's hard, even if it's awkward,
even
and I think you take that choice away
from a partner who wants you to be
happy.
And I say that they want you to
be happy because of these specific questions. Hey,
I introduced this this dynamic
and that it wasn't their thing at first,
but now it's their thing.
Well, clearly, they tried a thing that wasn't
an immediate limit
because they knew it would make you happy
and then they found their own happiness in
it.
That's that's free will, baby. Like,
let people make those choices
for themselves.
Right.
The last one,
and this one I think is is really
common for different reasons. Yep.
Fear of rejection. Oh, yeah. Absolutely.
Absolutely.
That,
having someone
reject your feelings, your thoughts, your ideas,
is terrifying.
Yes.
Yes. You know, especially when it comes to
relationships,
you know, especially when you want to change
something up in a big way Mhmm. In
a relationship.
Yeah. That that's oh, man.
That's the big one. And that's we probably
could have started there because most people
who
are in touch with, you know, that have
that experience are there people out there maybe
who've never feared rejection in their lives?
I'm sure they're they exist. I need you
to bottle whatever that is Right. And become
a billionaire because we could all use whatever
that is. Mhmm.
And the fear of rejection
in kink, I think, might have
some layers to it because we're already doing
something that a vast majority of the world
tells us we're not supposed to do, that
we're not supposed to want, that's not okay,
that's outside of the norm, that is that
weird kink thing where, like, whatever bullshit you've
heard
to to kind of even make you question
yourself whether you're are, quote, supposed to want
this or supposed to do this
and then add the fear of rejection on
top. Right.
That that's tough. Yeah. It is tough.
I think that
if you are not the person blessed with
just no fear of rejection ever and you're
just able to handle it, so happy for
you.
Could not be me. I I think that
goes back to it's a trust and time
thing. Right? Like,
I have serious trust issues, so I'm not
gonna ask the person I met five minutes
ago to spank my ass. That's not happening.
That's not how I roll,
for a lot of reasons. But part of
that is I don't know them and I
don't know how they would respond. I don't
know what that rejection would feel like. I
think we are all as adults aware that
at any point you can the thing you're
asking for can be rejected. Right? But
if you don't know how that person will
reject you that can that can
be nerve wracking. That can be scary. Right?
And to these
folks specifically or to anybody who resonates with
the initial questions that were asked,
you know, think back to
other times when your partner had to tell
you no or tell you they didn't wanna
do something. Were they kind about it? Were
they respectful?
Did they care about your feelings?
Then there's a pretty good bet they're all
almost always gonna be that way. Everybody's got
their triggers and everybody's got their bad days,
but in general
they're gonna find some way to
either gently tell you no or the thing
that makes me nervous for them, but might
work out okay,
try it
just to see. Like, because it makes you
happy they might try it.
The scary part of that is
somebody who is too much of a people
pleaser and will do shit they don't like
simply because
they don't want to have the hard conversation.
They're afraid of your reaction if they have
to tell you no. Like, all that stuff,
we probably need to do an episode on
people pleasing if we haven't already, because that's
that's a big deal in Mhmm. In any
relationship.
But, yeah, like, are are you afraid they're
gonna tell you no? And if it's not
that you're afraid they're gonna just tell you
no in general, is it are you afraid
of how they're gonna tell you no? And
is that based on experience with that partner?
Or is that just based on other stuff
you've gone through in life and is, you
know,
carrying over? But if your partner has gently,
kindly,
respectfully, whatever whatever said, yeah. That's not my
jam. I'm not gonna do that,
then
that's a you know, you've got to I
think you've got to think consciously about that
and go, okay. Wait. I'm being I'm being
afraid of this because I don't wanna hear
no. I wanna do the thing I wanna
do, but also because I'm afraid they're gonna
shame me. They're they're gonna make me feel
bad. But wait. They've never made me feel
bad, so this should be okay.
And sometimes you ask for a thing, and
the way you word it or the specific
thing you ask for our partner is like,
nah, that's not my jam, but maybe you
find a compromise that works for both of
you. You don't ever know
until you have
the conversation.
Right. True. True.
Now somebody, and it was on FetLife when
I posted about this episode,
mentioned the other kind of side of this
sort of relationship. So in this case,
the thing that started this episode and this
conversation
was people who were in seem to be
healthy,
loving power exchanges where each partner is willing
to give their partner as much as they
can and but the submissives are still worried
that it's it's too much. Right? That thing
of well I introduced it to them so
they probably don't really like it as much
much as I like it.
Let's go back to they don't have to.
They just have to be willing to do
it
because maybe it makes you happy and that
that's enough for them. Right?
But there's the other side of it where
you introduce your partner to something, you start
getting nervous, you're asking for too much, not
because they are doing it for you, but
because they're not doing it for you. And
they are not they're saying all the right
words,
but they're not their actions are not Not
matching. Matching up.
That is
probably a that's a separate issue of
minimum incompatibility.
Probably some communication issues on their part. They're
just not saying,
hey, I don't wanna do that thing, and
somehow they'd rather
be an untrustworthy,
un,
irresponsible
partner than just have the hard conversation.
Giving side eye to that.
So there's there this is, there's two sides
to this minimum, two sides to this. There's
the loving relationships where where you've got a
partner who's absolutely willing to try, but the
other partner doesn't trust that that that's real
or that they're doing the right thing or
they think that they are being selfish or
whatever whatever. And then you've got the other
part where they're like,
yeah, I'll try. Yeah, we can do this.
Then they don't
And so then you don't wanna ask for
more because you're barely getting what you asked
for in the first place.
It's all a hot mess. I much prefer
to deal I much prefer that everybody gets
to deal with it on the loving
side, the giving side of my partner supports
me, but I am terrified of that. Why
are they doing that?
Am I allowed to be supported like that?
Yes.
Yes, you are.
And probably just to to
tie it all together from the perspective that
we discussed in this episode,
of this weird feeling of if I introduced
it to them and it was not their
original idea
that they maybe don't like it as much
as they say,
Or do they usually lie to you? Are
they usually untruthful
and and doing things they hate to do
because it makes you happy? Well, then then
we need to talk about people pleasing. Again,
where that's a whole separate
conversation.
But
your partner will
let me speak to submissives out there. How
many submissives
in like maybe long term or
romantic
power exchanges
have done a thing for your dom that
you know damn good and well
you would never do if they hadn't asked
you.
Right. That's part of submission for some of
us, right?
Why
can't a dom do a thing that it
never occurred to them to do before,
but they were willing to try it because
you like it and you want it and
you need it. And they do not have
objections to it. It's not a hard limit.
They're not grossed out by it. Like, they're
like, no. This is I didn't know it
would be like this, and I'm let's continue.
Like, how come you're not worthy of the
same thing that your own dom is worthy
of? That you would do for your dom
easily. Right?
I just
there's all kinds it's it's layered. It is.
It is. And,
you know, I I think one of the
the the biggest things about it all is,
you know, the the fact that,
you know, doms don't go to a dom
school
Right. And learn,
you know,
this is dominance. This is what it is,
cut and dry, you know. The same thing
with submission. And it's not. It it is
a broad spectrum
Mhmm. Of things. Mhmm.
Yep.
So And, thank you Silent. Well, we did
do people pleasing episode three twenty six. It
felt familiar. Mhmm. It felt familiar. See, now
this is a whole separate issue, but now
I'm back to I really think we should
do,
air quote, classics
of episodes once a week from our archive.
Because so many things we talk about today
go back to what we've talked about in
the past. Anyway, that's a whole other thing.
I have the task of staying on track.
I'm trying to accomplish the task. Yes.
So this is a multilayered
situation.
Yeah. To to answer those specific questions that
came in because they won't be a Q
and A episode on their own because we're
doing it here, right?
Ask them.
If you trust them enough and they've earned
your trust to do these things with them,
to have told them in the first place
you wanted this you liked this kind of
dynamic or you liked these activities,
trust them enough
to be honest with you.
Now Mhmm. If they're not if there are
times they have not been honest with you,
that's a whole separate thing.
That has nothing to do with being too
much or too needy.
And
as the internet taught me several years ago
that I have tried to like internalize,
if anybody tells you that you are somehow
too much, just tell them to go find
less. Okay?
For the person who cares about you, you're
not too much. And I say that as
somebody who is objectively
too much. Okay?
I have a lot of thoughts. I have
a lot of words. I don't know how
to modulate the volume of my voice. I
am either shouting or you can't hear a
word I've said. Right? I am so sorry
to anybody who listens to any of our
episodes with earbuds in. I know what I
do. I'm trying to be better.
I
am objective
I won't say them too much. I am
objectively
a lot.
Right?
No, there are a lot of fucking people
who could not handle me and I don't
want them to try, thank you very much.
That does not make me bad, that does
not make them bad. It makes us incompatible.
Somehow,
someway, this universe
created
JB and went,
you'll do. You gotta go through some shit
for a few decades before you find her.
But you'll be able to handle her.
Right? And that's all that matters.
I don't- I- I could be too much
for the next person. I know there are
people who listen to this podcast and watch
these videos and go, Oh, hell no. I
could never.
Good. I wouldn't want you to because we'd
both be miserable.
But if you've got a partner who kind
of like listens to your ideas and goes,
Yeah, we can do that. And they accept
you for who you are
in general,
you're not too much for them. You're not
too needy. You have needs
and
maybe you're a lot, but hey, guess what?
They fucking like that about you or they
wouldn't be there.
Says somebody who has been rejected
many times over
for being
a lot trademark registered trademark. Okay?
So
I am very warm because it is very
hot in here. And I dropped the AC
several degrees too. You're do you're you're doing
our best. I know. You're trying. So
do
you have any final thoughts?
No.
Cool. We went through all my points. No.
I added some extras in there. You did.
None of the points feel like they connected,
but they were all valid points in my
mind at least.
I will remind everybody, just because those are
the things that we could think of that
could be part of this does not mean
that's all that there is. So True.
There we go. So
if you would like,
we can go into a bonus section. Are
we, good? I don't know.
Keep it kinky, y'all. And we'll see you
next week.
Oh my god. Okay.
I
tried to plan better and Swiss cheese brain.
I meant to bring my hair tie in
with me.
Can I go get my hair tie and
you do the filler filler? And You I'll
get it for you. Do you know where
it is? Where is it? It's in one
of two places. It's either on
the side table next to the couch
or on my vanity.
Before you go,
can I talk to the crickets, please?
Yes. You may. It's about to be a
very long moment if he said no.
I just have to stare at you and
you'd be a participant
in, my predicament
of bondage, apparently.
Oh my god.
Oh, wow. That was closer.
It was on the kitchen. Oh, no. No.
No. That's not the one I'm talking about.
This is broken. But it's
daddy? Daddy. It's literally an elastic
ring. It's black. Okay.
I said hair tie, but I maybe I
don't know. I don't know what they're called
anymore?
Ponytail holder. That's that's that's that was it.
That was it.
Uh-oh, so.
We have not we're not talking about it
actively, but we did mention it to one
another today about how last summer we had
to go into evening
live streams because of the heat.
We are not actively planning that right now,
but we're gonna have to do something because
this heat is only about to get worse.
Oh, please do not fall. Was it the
dog? Yeah. Okay.
I love that she likes to be near
me, but when she's directly under foot, it's
So,
but I am leaning
into the, hey. Can we get a quote
from our kinky
HVAC friend
for the idea to make it not so
freaking hot in here? Yeah. Because it's what
what typically happens in the summer is, first
of all, JB
doesn't work outside all day because you just
cannot. So he goes out, like, early in
the morning and is done very early, but
I can't work
in the office when it's hot through the
midday.
So I work in the morning and in
the evening, and then I can't even stand
to be sitting in this office usually from
about one to
four, fourth, or five.
That that's not gonna work. Like, we we
gotta find a way. Yeah. Oh, and Silent
said,
Silent said, I do love the conflict of
I wanna grow my hair combined with living
in Florida during perimenopause.
I have already decided that whenever
I finally just do it and make the
damn appointment, I'm gonna get my hair cut
short. Again, not as short as I've had
in the past,
but short because I gotta get it off
my neck.
I can't sleep with it this way, and
I'm not functioning in this heat this way.
Undercut?
No. I'm gonna have everything go up. There'll
still be enough to grab. Do not worry.
I will not sacrifice having my hair pulled
for short hair. Okay. Mm-mm. Not purposely, anyway.
But I'm yeah. Part of the reason I'm
not sleeping well, both from a heat perspective
and just a life perspective is my hair
is, like, it's all I can feel. And
I'm I'll wake up in the middle of
the night to move my hair out of
the way, but I can't pull it back
and tie it back or whatever because then
I can feel the bumps and and
So
Well, you know,
take Tayshia, as tired as I am, if
she walked away and I was sitting here,
there's a good chance I would have started
snoring.
That's probably true. That's probably true.
For the bonus section,
Lola is still,
a a mess and a menace. Yep.
Onyx and Ella,
messes and menaces. Mhmm.
The kids are the kids,
I saw a guy, y'all.
We've mostly been
mostly been working yeah. You mentioned it earlier.
Monday was an emotional day. Mhmm.
I'm growing as a parent.
It's delightful.
And and I say this, and I do
mean it, but that doesn't make it always
easy.
Anytime the 15 year old behaves as a
typical teenager would, it is
wonderful, but also sometimes
it's very stressful.
And I had to,
use
I had to I had to
I'm in the process of teaching the 15
year old a lesson that the 19 year
old picked up on fairly quickly, which is
if I tell you, you can tell me
anything and I'm I will not freak out
on you, like, in that moment. I mean
that.
It's it's a
it's so much emotional regulation to do it.
But I would rather have the relationship where
the kids can come say what they've gotta
say, tell me the thing that is not
good, that is scary, that they need help
with,
rather than be afraid of my response.
That was easy with the 19 year old
because the 19 year old, if you are
one of his trusted people, he does not
have a thought you don't know about at
some point that he is his mother's child.
No brain dump.
He is his mother's child.
The 15 year old is not wired that
way. And that's okay. Like, it's not it's
just I have
I'm at the big age of four am
I 45? Yeah. 45.
Relearning how to parent teenagers and that kind
of like, I don't like that part because,
it's exhausting. But
so I actually yeah.
Big conversations
where I just I just kept my cool,
and I was like, okay. And tell me
about this and tell me about that. And
then at the end, because
look. I'm a smart ass bitch. I just
am.
After
everything and I
went back to them and was like, hey.
Do you remember that thing that thing where
I say you can tell me anything, I
will not freak out? And they go, yeah.
I'm like, do you believe me yet?
And I no. Because if I got trust
issues, that apparently is genetic for the youngest.
So it'll take a minute. But I was
like, okay. Okay. You're gonna you're gonna tell
me this stuff, and it's it's gonna it's
fine. It's fine. We'll deal with it. We'll
deal with it. We'll deal with it.
Are you safe? Are you well? Okay. That's
what matters. That's what matters.
Yay, parenting.
So,
the
for podcast listeners, by the time you hear
the sound of our voice, it's over. For
anybody watching on the live stream, it's actually
still happening.
The, Dom Sub,
dynamic virtual summit, as of the time of
recording, is still going on. Seems to be
going fairly well.
For YouTube folks who will see this by
Thursday at I don't know what time, you
can still sign up if you want.
The free ticket, you only get access to
what's currently happening. But,
if you have
room in your budget, you can buy
lifetime access so you can watch the stuff
you missed too.
But, yeah, that seems to be going
really well.
I was in the middle during our session,
I was in the middle of doing, like,
85 things
on deadline. So I was like, oh, okay.
Never mind.
And and spending
let's have been a week now
back and forth with our tech person of
why isn't the kinkery working properly? Why can't
I get here? Why is it giving me
that error message? What is happening? Yeah.
It's fine. It's fine. It's fine. It's fine.
It's fine. It's fine. It's fine.
It's fine.
So yeah. Mhmm. It's that's there's not a
lot. I'm too hot to think of anything.
That's part of it. I feel like my
tired. I know. I'm not asking you to
think of anything.
But I feel like my brain is melting,
and I just cannot Yeah. Thoughts will not
stick in. I know. So, yeah, we're same
old same old. Mhmm.
Other than I'm melting and you're exhausting. Yep.
Exhausted. Not exhausting. I'm exhausting. You're just exhausted.
Wow. That was a bad slip of the
tongue. Oh.
That was a bad slip of the tongue.
Before you even slip there, something you're not
telling me? No. No. I promise you. I
know who was the exhausted one in this
relationship. And I know who made them that
way. So it's okay. It's okay. But for
the sake of you maybe getting a nap,
and I guess we can go. And, I'll
I'll have less clothes on in a good
five minutes because I'm too damn hot. I
know.
Okay.
Thank y'all for being here, especially to the
bitter end. Right. We We'll see y'all next
time. Uh-huh. Okay. Bye. Bye.