1 00:00:04,750 --> 00:00:08,400 Okay. So you're here for some great church leadership content. 2 00:00:08,700 --> 00:00:10,240 The podcast is great, 3 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:15,000 but there's also another piece of content you need to be enjoying each week. 4 00:00:15,290 --> 00:00:18,840 It is the leading saints email newsletter. Now I get it. 5 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:22,320 Email newsletters feel so 2006, you know, 6 00:00:22,540 --> 00:00:24,840 but it isn't as old fashioned, as you might think. 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:28,880 It's actually one of the most popular pieces of content that leading saints 8 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:30,200 produces each week. 9 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:34,680 I share a unique leadership thought that can only be found in the newsletter. 10 00:00:34,830 --> 00:00:38,000 I keep it short and sweet. 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So look for leading saints in your inbox, 19 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:08,640 by going to leading saints.org/fourteen, or click the link in the show notes. 20 00:01:26,690 --> 00:01:29,880 So you're checking us out as maybe a potential podcast. 21 00:01:30,020 --> 00:01:31,600 You could start listening to, 22 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,040 I know many of you have been listening for a long time, 23 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,560 but let me just talk to the newbies for a minute. What is leading saints? 24 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:40,520 What are we trying to do here with this podcast? Well, 25 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:44,040 let me explain leading saints is that nonprofit organization, 26 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:46,160 a 5 0 1 C three is what they call it. 27 00:01:46,580 --> 00:01:51,480 And we have a mission to help latter day saints be better prepared to lead. 28 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:54,680 Now, of course, that often means in the context of a calling, 29 00:01:54,730 --> 00:01:57,800 it may mean in your local community, your work assignments. 30 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:03,000 We've heard about our content influencing all sorts of leaders in all sorts of 31 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:03,840 different contexts. 32 00:02:04,130 --> 00:02:08,400 We invite you to listen to this episode and maybe a few others of our 500 plus 33 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:09,840 episodes that we have out there. 34 00:02:10,070 --> 00:02:14,360 Jump in and begin to learn and begin to consider some of these principles we 35 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:15,920 talk about on the leading saints podcast 36 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:45,840 today, we're headed out to California with Kathy Marler. How are you Kathy? 37 00:02:46,220 --> 00:02:48,200 I'm doing great. Thank you. How are you today? 38 00:02:48,750 --> 00:02:51,240 Very good. Well, I'm excited to have you on here. 39 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:54,960 We actually met in person years ago. Uh, I, I don't know if it was years ago, 40 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:58,920 but a few years ago when, uh, I was in your area and had the privilege of doing, 41 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,720 doing a fireside for your stake. And, uh, 42 00:03:01,830 --> 00:03:05,160 I don't remember much of our conversation, but we did meet right. . 43 00:03:05,250 --> 00:03:07,000 We did actually. Yes we did. 44 00:03:07,220 --> 00:03:10,200 And I can still remember some of the things you talked about about being great 45 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:11,880 leaders in our area, so, okay. 46 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:14,440 That was great. Thank you. And they just split the stake. 47 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:18,000 So I'll take all the credit for the, there you go. The growth and success. Yeah. 48 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:23,280 nice. Now maybe just give us a quick background of you and, 49 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:24,360 and put yourself into context. 50 00:03:24,790 --> 00:03:27,200 Well, I joined the church when I was 18 years old, 51 00:03:27,210 --> 00:03:30,560 friends introduced me to the church and, um, 52 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:34,040 married my husband a couple years later, he went to dental school. 53 00:03:34,710 --> 00:03:39,600 I had been at BYU when we met and who dated and, um, 54 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:42,880 got married, had five children. And over the years we've had, uh, 55 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:45,680 a lot of different opportunities to serve in the church. 56 00:03:45,980 --> 00:03:50,960 And it's been a really wonderful experience for us to serve together in some of 57 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:54,560 our calling, uh, and served sometimes completely separate. 58 00:03:54,650 --> 00:03:57,200 He served as a Bishop when we were quite young. 59 00:03:57,750 --> 00:04:01,680 I served as a director of public affairs in the San Diego and, uh, 60 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:06,440 lower or Southern orange county and Riverside area for a number of years. 61 00:04:06,900 --> 00:04:10,160 And then we were called to serve as mission president and, uh, 62 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:12,440 companion in Peru a few years ago. 63 00:04:12,740 --> 00:04:17,720 And right now we are currently serving as church service mission leaders here in 64 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:19,320 the Newport beach service mission. 65 00:04:19,770 --> 00:04:22,920 Awesome. Wow. There's a lot there for sure. And so are you, 66 00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:24,560 were you born and raised in California then? 67 00:04:24,730 --> 00:04:26,840 Um, I was actually born in Washington state, 68 00:04:26,980 --> 00:04:31,880 but moved to California Southern California when I was 12 and have been here 69 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:32,650 ever since. 70 00:04:32,650 --> 00:04:35,800 Awesome. Very good. And, uh, you had, uh, 71 00:04:35,990 --> 00:04:39,080 I guess what the launched this, uh, 72 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:43,600 this interview was every week as I send out the weekly newsletter is I put a 73 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:44,600 question of the week in there, 74 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:47,280 and these are just random questions that come to mind. Uh, 75 00:04:47,280 --> 00:04:50,200 some of them you can probably tell are more thoughtful than others, but, um, 76 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:54,720 the question that week was how has serving in church leadership been a blessing 77 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:57,720 and a sacrifice for your family? And I guess the, 78 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:02,440 the reason I asked this question was there's sort of this cultural norm or this 79 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:07,560 cultural feeling. We wanna perpetuate that all callings are a blessing. And, 80 00:05:07,740 --> 00:05:09,240 you know, we've heard the, the, 81 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:12,960 the stories of the blessings that come and I've witnessed those blessings. 82 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:13,793 They've been wonderful, 83 00:05:13,820 --> 00:05:17,800 but then we shy away from the really messy parts of sometimes serving the 84 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:21,680 calling when it's really becomes a sacrifice to the point that it's impacting a 85 00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:26,560 family or a career or whatever it be. And so that's what I was hopefully, uh, 86 00:05:26,590 --> 00:05:30,640 trying to stimulate from those that, that read the newsletter. And, uh, you, 87 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:34,880 you sent back a great sort of, it was, it was a longer than typical email, 88 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:39,320 but I appreciated every word just from your experience. Um, what, 89 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:40,640 maybe let's just start there. 90 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:45,280 What intrigued you about this question about seeing sacrifice and 91 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:47,000 blessings when it comes to callings? 92 00:05:47,550 --> 00:05:48,040 Well, 93 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:51,160 I think the first thing that popped into my mind was when my husband was called 94 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:52,520 to be a counselor in the Bishop, 95 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,720 Rick and I was sitting in sacrament meeting with a brand new baby. And, um, 96 00:05:57,230 --> 00:06:02,160 I remember being just so excited. I was a new convert at church. 97 00:06:02,210 --> 00:06:05,480 My husband was being called to be in the Bishop, Rick, 98 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:09,520 and they called his name and we all raised our hands and he stood up and walked 99 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:12,040 away and left me with five children. And I, 100 00:06:12,230 --> 00:06:16,400 I started to cry and my mother-in-law leaned over and said, oh, 101 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:18,280 this is such a wonderful spiritual experience. 102 00:06:18,300 --> 00:06:20,360 And I didn't have the nerve to tell her, 103 00:06:20,630 --> 00:06:23,240 this is the most frightening thing that's ever happened in my life. 104 00:06:23,310 --> 00:06:28,200 I can't do this by myself, huge sacrifice. Um, for me, um, 105 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:31,920 I was spoiled to have him with me all those years, but, um, and then I, 106 00:06:32,290 --> 00:06:33,680 as I thought of that, 107 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:36,880 I thought of all the blessings that we had from him serving as a Bishop, 108 00:06:37,290 --> 00:06:41,960 me as his wife and the calling that I had while he was the Bishop. And, um, 109 00:06:42,330 --> 00:06:45,160 so felt like I wanted to write and share some of those experiences. 110 00:06:45,220 --> 00:06:48,080 I'm sure other women have them and they need to know it's okay to feel terrible 111 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:51,040 when your husband gets up and walks away to go sit on the stand, you. 112 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:53,760 Know? Yeah. Yeah. And did that, I mean, 113 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:57,200 would you say that feeling perpetuated at maybe during that first year, 114 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:01,520 second year or, or how did you, where'd you go from, from that pew feeling like, 115 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:02,760 oh, no, I feel abandoned here. 116 00:07:03,750 --> 00:07:06,040 I think, um, yeah, there were, 117 00:07:06,040 --> 00:07:10,320 I would say it only took a few weeks cuz my husband he's, he's a great dad. 118 00:07:10,820 --> 00:07:15,640 And I had a three year old son who was, I would say way overactive. And he, 119 00:07:15,770 --> 00:07:18,040 um, he, he said, let's, 120 00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:21,200 let's try something new since he isn't really doing so good. 121 00:07:21,220 --> 00:07:25,560 Not having both of us there. How about if we have this new thing that if, 122 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,280 if he's, if I, if he's good during sacrament meeting, 123 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:30,520 he'd come sit on my lap after the sacrament. 124 00:07:30,700 --> 00:07:34,360 And this three year old became the perfect gentleman in sacrament meeting 125 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:39,240 because he wanted to go sit on his dad's lap. Um, it didn't happen right away. 126 00:07:39,430 --> 00:07:42,760 I could tell you a story of when my husband, uh, 127 00:07:42,870 --> 00:07:47,840 held up his three fingers for him to have to perhaps go out and spank him. 128 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:51,480 And he went to three and when he saw my husband stand up on the stand to come 129 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:55,920 take care of his son. Oh wow, dad, please don't kill me. So, um, 130 00:07:56,030 --> 00:07:59,640 that was, you know, not every week went perfect, but, 131 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:01,160 but it's worth the sacrifice. 132 00:08:01,470 --> 00:08:03,880 Yeah. Um, and then was, 133 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,440 was he called as a Bishop after that as being in the Bishop, 134 00:08:06,440 --> 00:08:08,000 Rick or how soon did that calling come? He was. 135 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:08,880 Called two years later. 136 00:08:08,930 --> 00:08:12,360 He was called to be the Bishop when the Bishop was called to be the state 137 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:17,240 president served there. Then he served in high council, state presidency. 138 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:20,880 And then after that was when we were called serve, um, uh, 139 00:08:20,890 --> 00:08:23,360 in Peru as mission president. Oh, wow. 140 00:08:24,010 --> 00:08:25,800 So one thing after the other, some leaders. 141 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:27,560 Together, right. I think that's that's. 142 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:31,320 Right. Yep. Yep. And so it was just one, one calling after the other then. 143 00:08:31,900 --> 00:08:35,880 For him and for me, um, I was in relief society, presidencies. 144 00:08:36,110 --> 00:08:39,960 I was the director of public affairs for San Diego. Um, 145 00:08:39,990 --> 00:08:42,160 kind of the face of the church, if you will, 146 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:44,840 to the media mm-hmm and religious organizations. 147 00:08:45,330 --> 00:08:50,120 So we both stayed very active with our callings and learned how to 148 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:51,120 shuffle back and forth, 149 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:55,840 making sure one of us was at home when the other one was out serving and when we 150 00:08:55,840 --> 00:08:57,800 could we'd take the whole family wherever we were. 151 00:08:58,390 --> 00:09:01,320 Yeah. Yeah. Um, did, 152 00:09:01,420 --> 00:09:04,600 was there any shift in dynamic when he was called as the Bishop, 153 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:08,280 as opposed to just, you know, a member of the, of the Bishop, Rick, 154 00:09:10,230 --> 00:09:12,140 as far as like the dynamic of your family? 155 00:09:13,260 --> 00:09:17,140 Because the, the, some of the, there were some ladies, for instance, 156 00:09:17,140 --> 00:09:20,580 in the ward that didn't think it was appropriate for my son to sit on their 157 00:09:20,580 --> 00:09:24,820 dad's lap when he was the Bishop, he was their Bishop. And, um, 158 00:09:25,110 --> 00:09:28,940 so that, uh, he had to have some discussions with people in the ward. 159 00:09:28,970 --> 00:09:32,860 I remember him telling one lady that, well, this, this, he only, you have, 160 00:09:32,860 --> 00:09:36,300 anyone could be your Bishop. My soul only has one dad, 161 00:09:36,300 --> 00:09:40,500 one example of how to act during sacrament meeting. And so, you know, 162 00:09:40,500 --> 00:09:45,440 kind of the whole ward had to change, not just our family dynamics. 163 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:49,040 Yeah. Um, to make sure that our family was always taken care of. 164 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:53,100 And I grateful that, that we were able to work together to make that happen. 165 00:09:53,850 --> 00:09:57,580 Love it. And then, uh, so during the, this time, 166 00:09:57,580 --> 00:10:00,820 was he Bishop when you were called as the public affairs director in San San 167 00:10:00,820 --> 00:10:05,110 Diego or no, I'm really making you think . 168 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:09,350 Uh, I, no, he, he, 169 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:11,470 he had been released and he was on the high council. 170 00:10:11,940 --> 00:10:16,150 Okay. And what, what do you remember from that calling as far as, um, you know, 171 00:10:16,150 --> 00:10:19,510 I know there's many words and stakes that are trying to make it a good effort 172 00:10:19,510 --> 00:10:21,150 with, with public affairs and whatnot. 173 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:24,030 Do any specific principles come to mind with how you serve there? 174 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,710 So, um, as the director of public affairs, I think one of our, 175 00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:31,630 my responsibilities was to put the church in a good light, 176 00:10:31,630 --> 00:10:34,670 but to always be honest and answer all the questions that needed to, 177 00:10:34,670 --> 00:10:38,190 especially to the media or the religious leaders, um, 178 00:10:38,190 --> 00:10:40,430 our family dynamics changed again then, 179 00:10:40,430 --> 00:10:44,190 because I was in a position where I was working with state presidents, area, 180 00:10:44,190 --> 00:10:48,150 seventies, general authorities in salt lake, um, 181 00:10:48,150 --> 00:10:52,790 bringing tours to the okra mountain temple house, for example. Um, 182 00:10:52,790 --> 00:10:56,950 so I was way more and he was the one that then in addition to being a dentist 183 00:10:56,950 --> 00:11:00,830 and working and being on the high council, he was, um, doing a lot of the, 184 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:05,590 at home, keeping the home fires burning while I was doing my calling as well. 185 00:11:05,980 --> 00:11:09,110 Yeah. So I was appreciated how much, um, you know, 186 00:11:09,110 --> 00:11:13,190 we were able to work together to make me have this great opportunity. 187 00:11:13,190 --> 00:11:16,430 It was a wonderful opportunity that I had to work with so many wonderful 188 00:11:16,430 --> 00:11:17,310 brethren in the church. 189 00:11:17,420 --> 00:11:18,090 Yeah. 190 00:11:18,090 --> 00:11:22,590 And so you said you took trips out to OKR the okra mountain temple open house 191 00:11:22,780 --> 00:11:25,510 mm-hmm . Yep. So like did, uh, 192 00:11:25,580 --> 00:11:29,550 with latter day saints or just anybody who wanted to go, or how did that work? 193 00:11:30,020 --> 00:11:33,310 I was a member of two, uh, interreligious uh, 194 00:11:33,310 --> 00:11:37,310 organizations one had the head, um, 195 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:43,450 Imam from the mosque, uh, and various non-Christian religions. 196 00:11:43,700 --> 00:11:47,650 Another one was an organization that was, um, 197 00:11:47,650 --> 00:11:50,570 leaders of some of the mega Christian churches, 198 00:11:50,790 --> 00:11:55,360 the Catholic church Episcopal church, um, such as the, um, 199 00:11:56,850 --> 00:12:01,780 Archbishop, uh, of the Catholic church here. And we invited them, uh, 200 00:12:01,780 --> 00:12:06,140 elder Haney and, um, I, and one of Holly brown was her name. 201 00:12:06,140 --> 00:12:08,140 One of my counselors. We, um, 202 00:12:08,140 --> 00:12:13,140 took two sets of tours up to the okra mounted temple for them to be able to have 203 00:12:13,140 --> 00:12:16,140 the opportunity to be in the temple they met with, um, 204 00:12:16,140 --> 00:12:19,380 some of the brethren while they were there were taken on a special tour at the 205 00:12:19,380 --> 00:12:23,300 time it was with elder Clayton. And I can't remember the other brother's name. 206 00:12:24,310 --> 00:12:28,500 Um, he was the head of the temple department at the time. And, um, 207 00:12:28,500 --> 00:12:33,140 so we went and, uh, took them to the temple, answered all their questions, 208 00:12:33,140 --> 00:12:38,060 spent three days, touring, salt lake, temple square, um, giving them a, 209 00:12:38,060 --> 00:12:42,820 a wonderful opportunity to see the gospel of Jesus Christ in action. 210 00:12:42,820 --> 00:12:45,700 We took them to welfare square and they saw what we really do. 211 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:47,380 And some of these people, 212 00:12:47,380 --> 00:12:50,860 it really changed how they felt about the church and that, 213 00:12:50,860 --> 00:12:53,500 which we do to participate in our communities. 214 00:12:54,010 --> 00:12:58,420 Some even went so far as to see the Christian side of our faith. 215 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:03,460 Not only do we, um, have the name of Jesus Christ in our church, 216 00:13:03,460 --> 00:13:07,820 but that we truly are Christian and that we live our lives in very Christlike 217 00:13:07,820 --> 00:13:08,653 manner. 218 00:13:08,710 --> 00:13:10,330 Wow. And so did you, 219 00:13:10,330 --> 00:13:14,170 do you do fly out to Utah or put 'em on a bus or how did they get out there? 220 00:13:14,540 --> 00:13:16,290 We flew them to Utah. 221 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:17,370 Really. Wow. 222 00:13:17,370 --> 00:13:19,250 Yeah. They, you know, back in the day, 223 00:13:19,250 --> 00:13:24,170 Delta had tickets for a lot less than they do now. Yeah. and in fact, 224 00:13:24,170 --> 00:13:25,330 we had a, a, 225 00:13:25,390 --> 00:13:29,530 one of the major leaders passed away while we were ready to plan a trip. 226 00:13:29,530 --> 00:13:33,010 And we got a call the day before that we needed to that some of the PE leaders 227 00:13:33,010 --> 00:13:36,330 couldn't come and instead of, um, canceling, 228 00:13:36,330 --> 00:13:40,610 we rescheduled and just bought a new set of tickets because we weren't able to 229 00:13:40,610 --> 00:13:44,330 get the airline to refund our, our tickets. And so, you know, 230 00:13:44,330 --> 00:13:45,930 we were okay with that because we were, 231 00:13:46,020 --> 00:13:48,050 we knew we were doing something really great. 232 00:13:48,050 --> 00:13:52,810 And some of these leaders from San Diego and orange county, our people that, um, 233 00:13:52,810 --> 00:13:55,770 have been on CNN specialists, 234 00:13:55,770 --> 00:13:58,810 they've been people that have worked with some of the presence of the 235 00:13:58,810 --> 00:14:01,690 United States, uh, as religious leaders. 236 00:14:01,910 --> 00:14:06,810 And so these were people that it was good to have them see the 237 00:14:06,810 --> 00:14:07,890 church in action. Yeah. 238 00:14:07,890 --> 00:14:11,450 And to not just take all the rumors that they'd heard in their lives about the 239 00:14:11,450 --> 00:14:12,240 church. 240 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:15,530 Yeah. And the, and the temple open house experience would be great. 241 00:14:15,530 --> 00:14:19,410 And then obviously being so close to some of the, the church, uh, welfare, 242 00:14:19,510 --> 00:14:22,530 you know, centers and whatnot. Uh, so they could really see that. 243 00:14:22,530 --> 00:14:26,490 I love that idea. Did that, was that a unique idea for your area or did you, 244 00:14:26,490 --> 00:14:27,690 how did you come up with that idea? 245 00:14:28,980 --> 00:14:29,330 Um, 246 00:14:29,330 --> 00:14:33,210 El Dhani and I just chatted when he was my state president at the time and he 247 00:14:33,210 --> 00:14:36,650 was over the regional public affairs. And, um, he, 248 00:14:36,980 --> 00:14:40,850 he and I were just sitting at the desk one day waiting for a meeting to start, 249 00:14:40,850 --> 00:14:45,170 and we started brainstorming with our committee and that idea came forward and 250 00:14:45,700 --> 00:14:48,810 he, he was a make it happen, state president. I'm sure. 251 00:14:48,810 --> 00:14:52,440 That's why he's now a 70 and very president. 252 00:14:53,030 --> 00:14:56,240 Nice, nice. And, um, yeah, cuz I, 253 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:59,360 I think it just does so much of giving them an experience. Right. 254 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:02,520 Cause I think in interfaith efforts, it's more of like, all right, 255 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:05,440 what's the local service project we can get together on and help out, 256 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:06,160 which is good. You know, 257 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:10,680 those are always gonna be coming up and helping and just serve type of efforts, 258 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:13,040 but to say, Hey, why don't we, uh, 259 00:15:13,050 --> 00:15:17,080 we put it together a budget to help you have an experience with our faith. 260 00:15:17,220 --> 00:15:20,320 And that probably changed them and their perception of latter day saints 261 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:21,153 forever. Right. 262 00:15:21,500 --> 00:15:22,680 I'm I'm sure it has. 263 00:15:22,830 --> 00:15:27,600 I am nice it's years later now and we still have good relationships with many of 264 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:31,440 those people and it's, it was a wonderful experience for them and for us. 265 00:15:31,710 --> 00:15:35,160 Yeah. And now president Nelson, I mean, there's, there's probably gonna be a, 266 00:15:35,160 --> 00:15:39,920 a temple dedication every weekend here in a, in a few months, would you know, 267 00:15:39,920 --> 00:15:44,080 in Utah or elsewhere that, uh, you know, that that'll be a lot a great, I, 268 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:48,800 I just love this strategy of using some of these big events, cuz I think as, 269 00:15:48,890 --> 00:15:52,320 uh, as a temple dedication or open house comes up, it's like, okay, 270 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:56,200 I'm gonna take my family, but oh I wish I could take my neighbor or, you know, 271 00:15:56,200 --> 00:15:58,040 and of course we make those invitations if we can, 272 00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,680 but to really plan ahead and say, now I'm gonna put a, 273 00:16:01,190 --> 00:16:04,480 a strategy together so that we're gonna start talking to our neighbors now, 274 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:06,920 or we're gonna start reaching out to the, you know, 275 00:16:06,920 --> 00:16:08,120 interfaith efforts right now. 276 00:16:08,130 --> 00:16:12,160 So that when that open house comes they'll of course take you up on that 277 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:13,480 invitation. You know, it's really we. 278 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:16,040 Talking. And I think that when you use the term use these opportunities, 279 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:20,680 I'd like to say that these opportunities are there and we need to take advantage 280 00:16:20,770 --> 00:16:23,880 of the fact, there it is. These people really want to see, 281 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:25,960 they want to know they have questions, right. 282 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:30,960 And I'll tell you walking the halls of a temple and asking, um, uh, 283 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:33,080 elder Clayton, for instance, questions. 284 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:37,200 They actually had the opportunity of being with elder Ballard as well. Um, 285 00:16:37,260 --> 00:16:42,200 and to be with them and to ask any question they wanted to about the church and 286 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:47,040 there was no ducking or hiding the brethren were straightforward answering every 287 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:47,360 question, 288 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:51,680 which set a great example for me and how I could answer questions better back 289 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:55,000 home with everyone else. And um, so it, 290 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:57,080 it really did increase the, 291 00:16:57,940 --> 00:17:02,760 the good name as well as the opinion that these leaders had 292 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:03,593 of the church. 293 00:17:03,870 --> 00:17:08,680 Yeah. Awesome. All right. Wanna, um, uh, go back to your, 294 00:17:08,750 --> 00:17:12,280 sort of your journey with serving with your husband in various leadership 295 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:15,520 capacities, whether officially like a, as a mission leader, 296 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:19,400 couple or unofficially as maybe the Bishop's wife, um, 297 00:17:19,430 --> 00:17:22,200 during that time as Bishop specifically, did, 298 00:17:22,420 --> 00:17:24,320 was there anything that you did to, 299 00:17:24,330 --> 00:17:28,640 or you both did to have you more involved or participate or were you just 300 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:31,680 holding things down at, at home or how did that any, 301 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:33,120 anything come to mind during those years? 302 00:17:33,470 --> 00:17:36,320 Well, I was ha I was still having children. Um, 303 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:40,040 and so I was pretty much keeping the home fires burning. I was also a, 304 00:17:40,070 --> 00:17:43,720 a counselor in the relief society presidency during that time, uh, 305 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:46,640 for part of the time he was the Bishop. And, um, 306 00:17:47,590 --> 00:17:52,120 so I think that I actually tried to be less involved. 307 00:17:52,450 --> 00:17:56,400 Uh, in some ways we had a really wonderful, strong relief society president. 308 00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:01,040 That was just amazing when I was released from being, uh, she a new, 309 00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:03,720 when the new president was called, I was not in that presidency. 310 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:07,360 Mm-hmm and she was just fantastic. And she just was able to, 311 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:11,400 you know, handle so many things and it was great. And I, 312 00:18:12,360 --> 00:18:15,810 I didn't want to, in some ways be involved, you know, when the phone rang, 313 00:18:15,910 --> 00:18:19,130 for instance, I, if you don't stop someone right away, 314 00:18:19,130 --> 00:18:22,170 sometimes people think the Bishop's wife already knows everything that's going 315 00:18:22,170 --> 00:18:26,370 on. And so some people jump right in and start telling you, 316 00:18:27,070 --> 00:18:30,170 you know, confessing their sins or whatever, cuz I think, you know, 317 00:18:30,170 --> 00:18:34,050 and you don't, and you don't want to be in that position nor should you be. 318 00:18:34,660 --> 00:18:38,250 So I really, um, I think in that area I kept, 319 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:43,130 I tried to keep back and just be, I was already very friendly, um, 320 00:18:43,130 --> 00:18:45,450 and outgoing and just tried to had, 321 00:18:45,450 --> 00:18:48,130 having had been in the relief society presidency too. 322 00:18:48,130 --> 00:18:51,370 I knew most of the sisters. So I just continued those relationships, 323 00:18:51,370 --> 00:18:54,410 friendships and making sure that they were ministered too properly. 324 00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:58,610 Yeah. Uh, what do you remember? What's the story behind you being called to, 325 00:18:58,700 --> 00:18:59,690 to serve in Peru? 326 00:19:02,180 --> 00:19:06,930 Uh, sitting at home one morning, the phone rang and someone said, 327 00:19:07,060 --> 00:19:09,530 um, I can't remember her name. 328 00:19:09,610 --> 00:19:12,970 She said she was a secretary for elder Christofferson. 329 00:19:12,970 --> 00:19:17,810 And I said the elder Christofferson, I actually thought it was a joke. So, 330 00:19:17,940 --> 00:19:21,770 um, it wasn't a joke. And um, 331 00:19:21,770 --> 00:19:25,650 so the next day we had an appointment over, uh, it wasn't zoom, 332 00:19:25,650 --> 00:19:29,490 but the church's version of zoom. Yeah. Back in the day. Um, 333 00:19:29,490 --> 00:19:32,130 that was about nine years ago now. So, um, 334 00:19:32,150 --> 00:19:36,010 and he interviewed us and at the end of the interview, he said, you know, 335 00:19:36,100 --> 00:19:39,530 if we call you back in a month or so, you know, great. 336 00:19:39,530 --> 00:19:44,290 And if we don't have a great life and um, then about a month later, 337 00:19:44,700 --> 00:19:49,090 uh, we received a phone call and it was, um, president Oak DOF, 338 00:19:49,380 --> 00:19:49,730 uh, 339 00:19:49,730 --> 00:19:53,690 his secretary that was calling to set up an appointment and he met with us and 340 00:19:53,810 --> 00:19:58,290 again, over zoom, uh, called my husband and myself to serve, uh, 341 00:19:58,290 --> 00:20:02,730 his mission president and companion in, uh, Truheo Peru. Nice. Well, 342 00:20:02,730 --> 00:20:06,490 he actually called us to serve a Spanish speaking mission and we didn't get our, 343 00:20:06,510 --> 00:20:09,930 our assignment of where to serve until January. 344 00:20:10,660 --> 00:20:11,493 Oh, nice. 345 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:15,890 Nice. So, and I'll tell you, um, talk about, um, you know, your question, 346 00:20:15,890 --> 00:20:19,520 a sacrifice and a blessing. I, um, 347 00:20:21,140 --> 00:20:25,270 when I received that call, I, I said, yes, I, I didn't question that, 348 00:20:25,740 --> 00:20:27,950 that if, if a profit called me on the phone, 349 00:20:27,950 --> 00:20:32,270 I wouldn't say yes to them that I would serve. But when I was done, 350 00:20:32,270 --> 00:20:36,470 I really questioned if I would be able to serve. And, um, 351 00:20:37,060 --> 00:20:40,030 I asked my husband actually, if he'd leave so I could pray. 352 00:20:40,030 --> 00:20:43,350 And I knee down beside my desk and out my computer. 353 00:20:43,350 --> 00:20:48,040 And I just pled with the Lord to please gimme a testimony of all the things I 354 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:52,480 needed to have a testimony of. And I specifically just started with, did I, 355 00:20:52,550 --> 00:20:53,280 I questioned, 356 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:57,720 did I really know Joseph Smith was a prophet of God and I knelt down and said, 357 00:20:58,230 --> 00:21:01,320 I, I have to know this. Now I'm gonna teach missionaries of this. 358 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:06,240 I'm going to have to bear testimony. This can't be well sure. 359 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,520 I joined the church and I thought it was a great idea. 360 00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:12,280 And I think he is or sure he is, but I had to know for sure. 361 00:21:13,100 --> 00:21:17,410 And I'm kneeling beside my desk. Um, for me, 362 00:21:17,410 --> 00:21:21,970 the heavens opened and the feelings within me, I heard a, a, 363 00:21:22,120 --> 00:21:25,650 a voice in my heart that said, you've always known, 364 00:21:26,230 --> 00:21:28,490 but you deserve to have this experience. 365 00:21:29,030 --> 00:21:33,970 And I was just overwhelmed with knowing that indeed Joseph Smith was a 366 00:21:33,970 --> 00:21:37,170 prophet of God and that everything I believed in was true. 367 00:21:37,590 --> 00:21:40,970 And I started then studying, uh, preaching my gospel and, 368 00:21:41,790 --> 00:21:45,410 and asking that question on all those principles so that when I got to the 369 00:21:45,410 --> 00:21:49,650 mission field a few months later, I, I was in, I was all in. 370 00:21:50,220 --> 00:21:50,640 So. 371 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:53,690 Yeah. Yeah. And that, then that, uh, you know, 372 00:21:53,690 --> 00:21:56,530 being called to something like that, obviously it's a, you know, 373 00:21:56,530 --> 00:21:59,090 when we talk about sacrifice and blessings and whatnot, 374 00:21:59,090 --> 00:22:02,250 obviously there's some very practical sacrifices that'll have to happen. 375 00:22:02,250 --> 00:22:05,130 You know, you're moving across the world and, um, you know, 376 00:22:05,130 --> 00:22:09,770 the shift of family dynamics and all that. Um, but I'm curious, like, would, 377 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:12,050 I guess I'm just thinking about those, 378 00:22:12,150 --> 00:22:16,410 the other wives out there to former priesthood leaders, 379 00:22:16,420 --> 00:22:18,370 or even current priesthood leaders who, 380 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:22,780 who are feeling sort of this sense of inadequacy or this sense of being 381 00:22:22,780 --> 00:22:25,860 dismissed or forgotten about, or not included in the work, 382 00:22:25,860 --> 00:22:28,860 because just the nature of how these, these callings are, 383 00:22:28,860 --> 00:22:31,940 and was this call as on a mission, 384 00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:35,460 did it feel a little heavier because you were actually being called yourself, 385 00:22:35,990 --> 00:22:39,260 uh, to that role rather than just, uh, as a supportive role. 386 00:22:39,540 --> 00:22:42,620 Right. I wasn't just, somebody's just somebody's wife, 387 00:22:42,930 --> 00:22:44,500 I guess that's a para way to put that. 388 00:22:44,790 --> 00:22:45,740 We, we get it, we. 389 00:22:45,740 --> 00:22:49,300 Get it. It was my calling and I, I had to rise to the occasion, 390 00:22:49,550 --> 00:22:52,780 be what I needed to be. Um, I needed to love 391 00:22:54,450 --> 00:22:58,440 in our case 618 missionaries. Um, you know, 392 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:02,480 that was a little UN daunting to me. Uh, as I thought about it, you know, 393 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:06,320 it's okay to love your mutual class or your Laurel group, you know, of, 394 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:08,280 of 12 girls. Um, 395 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:12,440 but to have 618 or how many ever we were going to have, 396 00:23:13,130 --> 00:23:17,520 um, and know that we needed to love them and guide them and help them. It was, 397 00:23:17,850 --> 00:23:20,640 it was pretty overwhelming for me and yet, um, 398 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,920 because I didn't just get to sit back and say, you know, 399 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,080 the buck stops with you, honey. So I don't really need to worry about it. 400 00:23:27,150 --> 00:23:31,600 I had to worry too. You know, I was the one with every missionary when, 401 00:23:31,950 --> 00:23:34,920 when one was having a problem and was meeting with my husband, 402 00:23:35,430 --> 00:23:39,400 I was the one with the companion and making sure they had a good experience and 403 00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:43,800 they knew they were loved and that whatever was happening with that missionary, 404 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:46,040 wasn't going to, you know, it, 405 00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:49,280 it could have an effective changing their lives for the good or the bad. 406 00:23:49,280 --> 00:23:54,160 And my job in a foreign language was to let them feel that love 407 00:23:54,580 --> 00:23:55,600 and, um, 408 00:23:55,600 --> 00:24:00,200 learn enough Spanish to be able to communicate with them and have them know that 409 00:24:00,230 --> 00:24:03,520 I let them and cared for them and wanted to help them through these hard times. 410 00:24:03,830 --> 00:24:06,840 Yeah. And obviously, I, I think many of us familiar, 411 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:08,840 just the process of obviously getting ready, 412 00:24:08,930 --> 00:24:12,440 there's probably a lot of personal study and preparation and all sorts of things 413 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:14,000 that happen, you know, as, uh, 414 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,680 up building up towards the summer when you actually leave. 415 00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:20,960 And then there's the mission leader, seminar, whatever they call it these days, 416 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,080 you know, over several days and here from, 417 00:24:23,510 --> 00:24:25,280 I think every member of the Corps of the 12, 418 00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:28,800 and it's just a remarkable experience, but then, then you're in Peru, 419 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:33,800 your feet land on that soil. How do you, what, how did you as the, 420 00:24:33,810 --> 00:24:38,200 as a mission leader that again, I, I think we have this, uh, 421 00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:41,440 tradition of calling them the, the wife of the mission present, 422 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,800 but you are a mission leader. You're a set apart as a mission leader, 423 00:24:45,020 --> 00:24:46,960 but from your perspective, from your experience, 424 00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:48,920 how did you get going in that calling? 425 00:24:50,360 --> 00:24:54,970 Well, I think it was helpful that president UDF at the time of my call said this 426 00:24:54,970 --> 00:24:55,290 Friday, 427 00:24:55,290 --> 00:24:59,090 someone's going to call you on the phone and you're going to start doing Spanish 428 00:24:59,090 --> 00:25:03,850 lessons at the MTC . And so, um, I, 429 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:09,050 they sent me books and I started studying not only, um, 430 00:25:09,750 --> 00:25:14,570 the Spanish materials from the MTC, um, over zoom, but also, 431 00:25:14,660 --> 00:25:18,450 uh, they invited me to come and I could spend as much time there as I wanted to. 432 00:25:18,450 --> 00:25:22,690 And since the call came in November and we weren't leaving until the end of 433 00:25:22,690 --> 00:25:24,810 June, that gave me plenty of time. 434 00:25:24,810 --> 00:25:29,250 So I actually was able to spend six weeks up at the MTC in two week 435 00:25:29,250 --> 00:25:31,290 increments, again, um, 436 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:35,930 a husband's calling a sacrifice by our whole family. Um, 437 00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:41,870 we had to sell our home, uh, to serve. Um, 438 00:25:42,410 --> 00:25:46,550 and so we sold our home and moved in with my daughter. Um, 439 00:25:46,690 --> 00:25:51,150 and so she was there with my husband while he kept working. And, and we, 440 00:25:51,150 --> 00:25:55,750 there were also classes we attended on preaching my gospel and how to be a good 441 00:25:55,750 --> 00:25:59,310 mission president and companion. And, and then we, uh, 442 00:25:59,770 --> 00:26:04,470 and then I would leave for two weeks at a time and, and he would stay home and, 443 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:08,310 um, and all the kids by then were married. Our kids were married and, um, 444 00:26:08,570 --> 00:26:11,670 all of them had children by the time we left on our mission. 445 00:26:11,670 --> 00:26:15,110 So we weren't taking children with this, but, um, 446 00:26:15,110 --> 00:26:19,030 it changed the whole dynamics I had. We had both have older parents, my, um, 447 00:26:19,030 --> 00:26:23,830 father actually passed away while you were on our mission. And, um, so the kids, 448 00:26:24,170 --> 00:26:27,070 our children, and, and in-laws needed to take, 449 00:26:27,070 --> 00:26:31,750 they took a big lion share portion of work and a responsibility and 450 00:26:32,030 --> 00:26:35,190 sacrifice as well, uh, when we accepted this call. 451 00:26:36,140 --> 00:26:40,710 Yeah. Yeah. And then what did you feel? Um, 452 00:26:40,710 --> 00:26:42,310 and I don't know, maybe this guidance was given, 453 00:26:42,310 --> 00:26:45,800 but did you feel an extra responsibility working with, uh, 454 00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:48,640 the sister missionaries, uh, uh, in the mission. 455 00:26:48,980 --> 00:26:51,840 You know, I did. And it was wonderful. Um, 456 00:26:52,100 --> 00:26:56,080 for us it was a real blessing. We were called right as the 18, 457 00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,640 19 year old age change. So the first, um, 458 00:27:01,230 --> 00:27:06,160 when we went to the, um, mission leaders or mission president's, um, 459 00:27:06,830 --> 00:27:09,120 conference, what was that called? You, you have. 460 00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:10,480 The name? Yeah, the seminar. The. 461 00:27:10,620 --> 00:27:15,320 Yes. Okay. The mission leaders seminar. Um, it was, um, 462 00:27:15,610 --> 00:27:15,960 we, 463 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:20,880 we actually met about 17 of our missionaries who had all come and 464 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:25,600 this was first group coming out after the age change. So we, 465 00:27:25,690 --> 00:27:28,000 um, arrived in Peru. 466 00:27:28,020 --> 00:27:32,760 And two days later we had about 28 missionaries 467 00:27:32,910 --> 00:27:33,743 arrive. 468 00:27:34,100 --> 00:27:39,000 And many of them were sisters because you had the 1920 and 21 469 00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:43,840 year olds all coming in this group. And it was thrilling to work with them. 470 00:27:43,870 --> 00:27:47,440 It's when they changed the sister leader program in the mission, 471 00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:51,720 so that we had sister leaders, sister leader trainers. So, um, 472 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:56,040 I was able to help them organize this entire, uh, 473 00:27:56,040 --> 00:28:00,480 new way of serving a mission as a sister missionary. And, um, how, 474 00:28:00,500 --> 00:28:04,520 how we, we just had great experiences together. I had, 475 00:28:04,690 --> 00:28:09,200 we had activities for them and growth experiences with them, as well as, 476 00:28:09,490 --> 00:28:13,200 um, with the zone leaders and in the zone conferences that we, um, 477 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:18,120 held and then Nian conferences. So it was great to be with those sisters and, 478 00:28:18,120 --> 00:28:22,480 and I'm still, I'm still close to the sisters. We, after nine years, 479 00:28:22,490 --> 00:28:26,960 we still have reunions. We I'm, I wish a happy birthday on their birthdays. 480 00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,440 Thank you, Facebook. And, um, it's, 481 00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:35,240 it's been great because most of our missionaries were Latin and from south 482 00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:39,640 America. And so, uh, that 80%, our only way to contact them, 483 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:43,360 to keep in touch with them and to have this relationship is through the 484 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:44,120 internet. Now, 485 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:48,000 even though we have returned once to visit them and have a reunion down there, 486 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,680 but most of what we do is, is over the internet. 487 00:28:51,030 --> 00:28:53,240 Yeah. And then what was, uh, 488 00:28:54,350 --> 00:28:57,160 your I'm just thinking of different components of, of a mission, 489 00:28:57,160 --> 00:29:00,480 like zone conference, right? Like, how did you, what was your, um, 490 00:29:01,750 --> 00:29:03,960 your contribution to zone conference, 491 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:05,640 or how did you involve yourself with those? 492 00:29:06,390 --> 00:29:10,120 Well, as my husband's companion, I was involved in most things. Um, 493 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:13,520 most of our leadership meetings with in fact, I'd all of them. 494 00:29:13,630 --> 00:29:18,160 I went to the weekly, um, leadership meeting with the two zone, uh, 495 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:22,880 the two mission assistants. And, um, we met, 496 00:29:23,190 --> 00:29:26,640 I had a voice like the assistant or my husband, 497 00:29:26,660 --> 00:29:30,560 and we would have these discussions about where we wanted the mission to go, 498 00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:34,520 what inspiration we'd received, um, how we wanted to move forward, 499 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:38,600 what missionaries were struggling and needed someone to go out and we'd say, 500 00:29:39,070 --> 00:29:42,480 okay, last time elders, Ava went sister Marler. 501 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,760 Now you're gonna go and I'd go out with two elders and help them teach and, 502 00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,400 and train them and help them to grow. In some cases, 503 00:29:49,470 --> 00:29:51,280 they'd send me out sister Marlow, 504 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:55,080 you need to go out with these missionaries because this elder Satello is 505 00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:55,480 amazing. 506 00:29:55,480 --> 00:30:00,280 And he's gonna teach you some great things about how to teach the gospel. And, 507 00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,720 um, so that was great, um, to have those opportunities, 508 00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,800 but I really felt like I was really a companion with my husband, 509 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:12,400 literally mm-hmm and we worked on almost all things. 510 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,120 There were certain things that, um, I wasn't involved with such as, um, GLE, 511 00:30:17,330 --> 00:30:22,320 um, needs that maybe came up with the missionaries. But, um, as I said, 512 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:25,480 at those times when he was meeting with the missionary, that was struggling, 513 00:30:25,830 --> 00:30:29,160 I was with their companion and sometimes even out, um, 514 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:32,960 teaching the gospel with a couple other missionaries as they were out, 515 00:30:32,970 --> 00:30:36,320 so that they would continue to have a great experience when one wasn't able to 516 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:36,910 be there. 517 00:30:36,910 --> 00:30:40,840 Yeah. How did, did your Spanish improve pretty well over the three years? 518 00:30:40,990 --> 00:30:44,000 Yeah, because I went from not speaking Spanish at all to, 519 00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:47,080 I won't say I'm fluent, but I'm understandable. 520 00:30:47,420 --> 00:30:52,000 And the holy ghost is a great translator and so, yeah, I've spoken in, 521 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:56,720 uh, state conferences almost, probably every other week. And, um, 522 00:30:56,720 --> 00:31:01,240 then words, if we, every week we spoke in one or two words. So, 523 00:31:01,610 --> 00:31:02,443 um, I, 524 00:31:02,750 --> 00:31:06,640 I started out only reading my talks and then I had some 525 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:11,960 wonderful, um, assistance to the president who, um, said, 526 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:16,480 it's time to put it down. You gotta, you gotta go with the spirit. And, uh, 527 00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:19,160 so then I think my Spanish had to improve then too, 528 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:22,200 and they'd sit in the front row so that if I look down, 529 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:24,920 they helped me with the words and, and it got to be that, 530 00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:29,600 that every member of every stake would help me with my Spanish. Um, 531 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:33,800 as I gave my talks and it was a wonderful experience and we've developed 532 00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:37,040 wonderful friendships and felt so loved by the people of Peru. 533 00:31:37,150 --> 00:31:39,640 I wouldn't change that experience for every anything, 534 00:31:39,830 --> 00:31:44,160 even though it was probably the most difficult three years of my entire life. 535 00:31:44,630 --> 00:31:49,000 Yeah. Wow. What an experience and what a blessing for sure. And a sacrifice, 536 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:53,360 you know, um, love it. So maybe as we wrap up here, 537 00:31:54,110 --> 00:31:59,040 I just wanna sort of wrap up on the, the topic of the wife of the leader. 538 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:02,840 Right. And, and, you know, I think they've, they've made some good steps with, 539 00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:06,680 you know, changing the title, you know, calling a mission, president wife, 540 00:32:06,710 --> 00:32:09,760 a mission leader, and that's, that's, that's good. Um, 541 00:32:09,900 --> 00:32:14,000 but sometimes it's easy for, you know, cuz some like being a Bishop's wife, 542 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:15,280 you know, that's not an official calling, 543 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,720 even though it feels like a calling there's a lot that responsibility and 544 00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:20,600 sacrifice that comes with that. Um, 545 00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:25,120 what could leaders better understand as far as, uh, the topic of, 546 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:27,720 of the wife, of the leader of the priesthood leader? 547 00:32:29,310 --> 00:32:29,800 Well, 548 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:34,720 I hope that the leaders realize that the wife of a church leader still 549 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:39,480 has a lot of capabilities and abilities and that they don't need to necessarily 550 00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:40,600 be released to be 551 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:47,690 a once a week teacher, uh, once a month teacher in relief society. 552 00:32:47,690 --> 00:32:50,930 Those callings are all important. There's not a calling that isn't important, 553 00:32:50,990 --> 00:32:55,890 but you don't need to always be released to have your husband be, uh, 554 00:32:55,890 --> 00:32:58,130 in a calling of service. Um, 555 00:32:58,130 --> 00:33:02,810 and I think that the more that we discuss with husbands and 556 00:33:02,810 --> 00:33:03,730 wives, families, 557 00:33:03,730 --> 00:33:07,050 what their situation is for some they need that they need to be released. 558 00:33:07,050 --> 00:33:10,890 You have small children home, someone's gotta attend them, you know? And, um, 559 00:33:11,110 --> 00:33:15,250 but other times it might be that the husband and wife would be able to Coser in 560 00:33:15,250 --> 00:33:18,010 different capacities, in different callings in the church. 561 00:33:18,010 --> 00:33:20,810 I know my husband like said when he was a Bishop, I was a counselor, 562 00:33:20,810 --> 00:33:23,210 a relief society presidency. Um, 563 00:33:23,210 --> 00:33:26,690 I have a daughter who was a primary president when her husband was a counselor 564 00:33:26,690 --> 00:33:28,930 and a Bishop, Rick. Um, if, 565 00:33:28,930 --> 00:33:31,890 if you have the capability and the desire to continue serving, 566 00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:35,770 I think the brethren should know that there are many of us that would love that. 567 00:33:35,770 --> 00:33:37,210 And yeah, um, that, 568 00:33:37,210 --> 00:33:40,970 it's a real blessing that we have that we bring blessings to our families when 569 00:33:40,970 --> 00:33:42,770 we serve, even when they're sacrifices. 570 00:33:42,770 --> 00:33:46,930 And I wouldn't wanna give up one of the opportunities I had because I had great 571 00:33:46,930 --> 00:33:51,170 priesthood leaders that recognized that we both had leadership capabilities and 572 00:33:51,170 --> 00:33:55,330 that we could, um, serve. Um, the other thing I'd like to say though, is, um, 573 00:33:56,110 --> 00:34:00,650 men who have a Bishop state president mission, 574 00:34:00,650 --> 00:34:04,730 president temple president calling, they, they hold a hold keys. 575 00:34:05,310 --> 00:34:08,690 And I think it would be great if women understood the keys of the priesthood 576 00:34:08,690 --> 00:34:12,810 just a little bit better so that they knew how to help and be a help meet and 577 00:34:12,810 --> 00:34:17,450 how to be a co-leader with their husband when they have the keys. You know, 578 00:34:17,810 --> 00:34:20,330 somebody has to be where, as I said earlier, 579 00:34:20,330 --> 00:34:24,770 the buck stops here and it's where the keys are. And, um, 580 00:34:24,820 --> 00:34:27,450 so that's something as a convert to the church, 581 00:34:27,450 --> 00:34:31,650 I felt blessed that I took a class at BYU and they talked about priesthood keys 582 00:34:31,650 --> 00:34:36,210 and I grew gained it, that testimony of that early. So that for me, 583 00:34:36,210 --> 00:34:37,690 it was never a conflict, 584 00:34:38,150 --> 00:34:42,410 but rather a joy to be able to serve by his side and help him to succeed. 585 00:34:42,410 --> 00:34:44,930 And then he lifted me up and helped me to succeed. 586 00:34:44,930 --> 00:34:47,530 As I served alongside of him in our different callings. 587 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:53,050 What would you say to maybe a, a wife of a leader who is really having a, 588 00:34:53,050 --> 00:34:54,130 going through a tough time, 589 00:34:54,130 --> 00:34:58,490 maybe feeling dismissed or like her influence isn't 590 00:34:58,490 --> 00:35:02,210 reaching the levels that she'd like or any, any, you know, just, 591 00:35:02,260 --> 00:35:04,770 or just bogged down by the day to day, you know, 592 00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:09,290 things that happen in a family and as her husband has to rush off to a meeting 593 00:35:09,290 --> 00:35:12,090 or whatever, any, any encouragement you give to that individual. 594 00:35:12,930 --> 00:35:14,820 Sure. First knee down and pray. 595 00:35:14,900 --> 00:35:17,740 Jesus is your best friend and he's gonna help you through everything. 596 00:35:17,740 --> 00:35:18,860 Mm-hmm number two, 597 00:35:19,170 --> 00:35:22,900 make sure your husband realizes that the most important thing he's gonna do for 598 00:35:22,900 --> 00:35:25,700 the rest of his life is be a husband and father to your family. 599 00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:30,700 And our husbands need to know that they need to see that and they need to know 600 00:35:30,700 --> 00:35:34,860 how much they're needed to be in the home and to help us that we don't need to 601 00:35:34,860 --> 00:35:39,680 feel like we're just the housewife. When our husband is out serving, 602 00:35:40,090 --> 00:35:44,760 he should be just our husband first and just the father 603 00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:49,120 second. And then third, he's gonna be whatever calling he has in the church. 604 00:35:49,820 --> 00:35:50,440 And, um, 605 00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:55,330 I think when husbands come to realize that and wives and husbands work 606 00:35:55,530 --> 00:35:57,290 together and have discussions, I say now, 607 00:35:57,290 --> 00:35:59,770 after you've gone up off your knees and had the discussion with the Lord, 608 00:35:59,770 --> 00:36:01,170 have it with your spouse. 609 00:36:01,350 --> 00:36:03,690 And if you need to have it with your priesthood leaders, 610 00:36:04,380 --> 00:36:07,610 we need it's okay for us to say, I have an idea. 611 00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:10,370 I have a thought or this might not be working so well. 612 00:36:10,370 --> 00:36:12,090 Have you ever considered something different? 613 00:36:12,350 --> 00:36:15,690 And anytime I have approached a priesthood leader in a calling, 614 00:36:15,900 --> 00:36:18,450 or just because they happen to be my priesthood leader, 615 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:23,730 I have never had anyone put me down or make me feel less than they've said. 616 00:36:23,730 --> 00:36:27,610 That is something I've never thought about. We sometimes see change. 617 00:36:27,610 --> 00:36:31,810 We sometimes don't, but I've always, at least felt like I was listened to. And, 618 00:36:32,530 --> 00:36:35,350 and I was helped in whatever my situation was. 619 00:36:37,130 --> 00:36:39,260 Love it. Well, the last question I have for you is, 620 00:36:39,260 --> 00:36:41,660 as you reflect back on your time as being a leader, 621 00:36:41,660 --> 00:36:45,300 how has being a leader helped you become a better follower of Jesus Christ? 622 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,130 I think that as we lead, 623 00:36:48,820 --> 00:36:52,210 we realize that we don't have the, 624 00:36:55,290 --> 00:36:59,880 we don't have all the tools. We need to be the best leader we might want to be. 625 00:37:00,660 --> 00:37:04,920 And, um, that humility turning to the savior and asking him, 626 00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:08,040 where does he want me to go? What does he want me to do? 627 00:37:08,740 --> 00:37:13,440 Has helped me to be the leader that I've been able to become, 628 00:37:14,010 --> 00:37:18,800 um, both a leader beside my husband and his callings and a leader in my own, 629 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:23,600 right? As the Lord has seen fit to call me to various callings. Um, 630 00:37:23,660 --> 00:37:27,520 for instance, now with service mission leaders, we have a code calling, 631 00:37:27,770 --> 00:37:31,680 neither one of us are, if you will, above or below the other, 632 00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:35,840 neither one of us have keys. My husband doesn't hold keys. So we work together, 633 00:37:35,870 --> 00:37:38,440 absolutely linked arm and arm in our calling. 634 00:37:38,980 --> 00:37:41,760 And I think that's what the savior wants us to do with him. 635 00:37:41,980 --> 00:37:44,880 And by being a leader, it's taught me to humble myself, 636 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:46,800 to be a better follower of Jesus Christ, 637 00:37:46,990 --> 00:37:50,960 a better follower of the leaders that I have that are called to preside over me. 638 00:37:51,340 --> 00:37:55,680 And I appreciate those leaders, our prophets apostles, bishops, 639 00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:58,000 state presidents, mission presidents, 640 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:01,200 and temple presidents that preside over me in different areas of my life. 641 00:38:01,530 --> 00:38:05,400 So that I'm able to be the best. I can be one step at a time. 642 00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:17,780 And that concludes this, how I lead interview. I hope you enjoyed it. And, uh, 643 00:38:17,780 --> 00:38:18,380 I would ask you, 644 00:38:18,380 --> 00:38:22,060 could you take a minute and drop this link in an email on social media, 645 00:38:22,110 --> 00:38:22,943 in a text, 646 00:38:23,580 --> 00:38:26,780 wherever it makes the most sense and share it with somebody who could relate to 647 00:38:26,780 --> 00:38:31,020 this, this experience. And this is how we, how we develop as leaders, 648 00:38:31,020 --> 00:38:33,820 just hearing what the other guy's doing, trying some things out, testing, 649 00:38:33,820 --> 00:38:37,320 adjusting for your area. And, uh, that's, 650 00:38:37,430 --> 00:38:40,920 that's where great leadership's discovered, right? So we would love to have you, 651 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,880 uh, share this with, uh, somebody in this calling or a related calling. 652 00:38:44,980 --> 00:38:48,280 And that would be great. And also if you know of somebody, uh, 653 00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:52,080 any type of leader who would be a fantastic guest on the, how I lead segment, 654 00:38:52,410 --> 00:38:55,480 uh, reach out to us, go to leading saints.org/contact, 655 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:58,080 maybe send this in individual, an email, 656 00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:01,480 letting them know that you're going to be suggesting their name for this 657 00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:05,520 interview. We'll reach out to them and, uh, see if we can line 'em up. So again, 658 00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:07,360 go to leading saints.org/contact, 659 00:39:07,580 --> 00:39:10,640 and there you can submit all the information and let us know, 660 00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,600 and maybe they will be on a feature how I lead segment on the leading saints 661 00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:18,840 podcast And remember to get on the email newsletter list, 662 00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:19,720 simply go to leading. 663 00:39:19,720 --> 00:39:24,720 Saints.org/it. 664 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,520 Came as a result of position of leadership, 665 00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:39,440 which was imposed upon us by the God of heaven, 666 00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:44,200 who brought forth a restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ. 667 00:39:44,660 --> 00:39:49,520 And when the declaration was made concerning the own and only true 668 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,080 and living church upon the face of the earth, 669 00:39:52,530 --> 00:39:56,280 we were immediately put in a position of loneliness, 670 00:39:56,300 --> 00:40:01,240 the loneliness of leadership from which we cannot shrink nor 671 00:40:01,240 --> 00:40:06,080 run away and to which we must face up with boldness 672 00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:08,360 and courage and ability.