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Alright. Here's our goal, folks. Leading Saints is

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no longer a podcast. Well, obviously, we are

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a podcast. We will continue to podcast, but

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we're really shifting our focus over to Zion

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Lab, which is an online community put on

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and developed by leading saints.

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And this is where we want to go

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and gather the masses

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and share ideas about leadership, share ideas about

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different callings, share ideas about building Zion.

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And this is the place that we want

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to make online, where all things are discussed,

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great ideas are shared, and that we can

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help one another in whatever calling we're in

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or what calling we're not in to feel

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like, you know, I've got purpose here. I

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can really make a difference in shifting culture

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in a better way or developing Zion in

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my own corner of the kingdom. So join

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us over at Zion Lab at leadingsaints.org/zion.

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And there, you can just jump in. It's

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free to join and create a profile and

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jump in and and look around and answer

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some questions. Leave a comment, pose a question.

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I think you'll benefit from the things we're

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doing over at Zion Lab. So join us.

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So you're checking us out as maybe a

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potential podcast you could start listening to. I

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know many of you have been listening for

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a long time, but let me just talk

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to the newbies for a minute. What is

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Leading Saints? What are we trying to do

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here with this podcast? Well, let me explain.

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Leading Saints is a nonprofit

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organization, a five zero one c three is

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what they call it, and we have a

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mission

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to help Latter day Saints be better prepared

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to lead. Now, of course, often means in

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the context of a calling. It may mean

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in your local community, your work assignments.

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We've heard about our content influencing all sorts

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of leaders in all sorts of different contexts.

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We invite you to listen to this episode

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and maybe a few others of our 500

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plus episodes that we have out there. Jump

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in and begin to learn and begin to

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consider some of these principles we talk about

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on the Leading Saints podcast. Here we go.

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Alright. I'm gonna call some of you out.

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Okay? This is where I'm just here to

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help, but do you have a disability specialist

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in your ward? It's in the handbook, folks.

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Alright. So let's get on board, make sure

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we have a disability specialist, and we are

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putting out resources like this episode

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to not only disability specialists, but to ward

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councils, bishoprics,

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whomever would benefit from these things to talk

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about

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autism and the spectrum of autism. And I

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have some phenomenal duo to bring into the

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leading saints podcast to talk about this. I

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talk with Liberty Kepford and Robert Johnson

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who wrote a book called autism in Christ's

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church, a phenomenal resource.

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There's not a ton of these types of

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resources out there. So when they come along,

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we gotta jump on them, make sure they're

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available. This is one maybe to put in

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the the Bishop library that every Bishop's office

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should have where disability specialists in the ward

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can better understand the stories of autism in

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the church, how individuals with autism have benefited

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from a community, from a ward, from callings,

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from all the things. Right? And also maybe

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the, unfortunately,

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experiences that happen that we can now learn

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from together to keep people engaged in the

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church who are maybe more atypical.

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And this church is for everyone, right? We're

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we're gathering Israel and, we get all types

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of neurodivergent

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individuals in that group. And so wanted to

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add this to a list of resources that

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we've put out there in leading saints. We're

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going to put those episodes, the past episodes

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we've done about this topic of autism and,

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the special needs and so forth in the

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show notes so that you can jump to

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those after listening to this discussion. And like

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we are continually doing, this is a live

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stream recorded

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episode. So over at Zion Lab, if you

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haven't joined us over there, do so. But

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we're, recording these episodes with a live studio

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audience who's, tuning in remotely. And so we

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get some some q and a at the

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end, and it's more interactive experience. And so

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keep your eye on Zion Lab to join

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us for future episodes about all sorts of

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episodes. Now let's get to it. Here's my

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interview with Liberty Kepford

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and Robert Johnson, the authors of autism in

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Christ's

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Church. Alright. We got, Liberty Kepford and Robert

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Johnson. This is a father daughter duo. Who's

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that's written the book, autism in Christ's church.

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So Liberty, let's start with you. Where where

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did the idea come from to write this

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book? Well, it started more with my dad

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that he's worked with people with autism and

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in the church,

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but I had a little more writing experience,

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more time to work on a project like

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that. And so he recruited me to

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join him. I interviewed

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a lot of different individuals and families about

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their experience with autism in the church

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and compiled that together and then worked with

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my dad to provide

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some extra tips analysis to go along with

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those stories.

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Nice. So, Robert, what's your expertise then? I

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was a special education teacher for thirty years,

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and I've been a board certified behavior analyst

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providing ABA services to individuals with autism

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for about seventeen years.

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And many, many times,

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I would work with wonderful families,

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and

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they had a very hard time staying in

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the church,

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at least attending church,

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and they felt very alone. They felt like

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it was just so difficult.

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And that was that was my thought is

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if I could bring together some stories, some

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information

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that could encourage them, inspire them,

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then they might have a better chance of

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being successful.

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Yeah. That's awesome. So in those, you said

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about seventeen years. Was this like a more

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like a therapy type setting that you're working

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with individuals or families, or what what did

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that look like day to day? As an

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ABA

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therapist,

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I'm kinda like a doctor, and I have

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registered behavioral technicians that work directly with individuals

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anywhere from five to twenty hours a week.

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And they run programs,

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communication,

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social, emotional.

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We work on replacement behaviors, a whole series

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of things to help them

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be successful,

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in the community, in the schools. Those are

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run-in homes,

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in schools, and in a center. We have

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a center. That's awesome. And so has there

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been, like,

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have there over the years, have you noticed

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other resources,

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you know, for Latter day Saints in relation

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to autism? Or There are starting to be

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more resources available.

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But

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as it the ABA world and the, you

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could say, the religious world are usually pretty

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separate.

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I'm unique in that case. I mean, there's

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a few little,

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like, websites and, you know, blogs and things

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like that.

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But as it relates

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specifically

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to

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God, very few. There's very few out there.

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Yeah. Well, this is great that you wrote

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this book, and it is primarily focused on

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an LDS audience. I mean, that's a reference

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to Christ's church. Right? Yes. Though I think

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that anybody that believes in Christ and and

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attends

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could probably benefit greatly from it, but it's

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definitely

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the stories are all members of the Church

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of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints. Nice.

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Now, Liberty, maybe tell me a little bit

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more about the story component of this because

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this isn't like, here's the, you know, the

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five chapters, the five step plan of just

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making church awesome or religion awesome for

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individuals and families, you know, who, they experience

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autism.

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What what's the story component in the the

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structure of the book? Well, this is a

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big reason of why we structured it this

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way is autism looks really different for different

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people. It's a spectrum,

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and

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we wanted to show that. And so just

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like you said, it's not like this is

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what you need to do to be successful

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in the church because there's not

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specific steps that would be perfect for that.

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But it just shows

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stories of people of different ages and abilities

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and genders and their experience.

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And there's some really awesome experiences

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and some harder ones, but to showcase all

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of that, there's 29 different stories, like you

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said, and how the book is structured is

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it's roughly in age order. And so that

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could help as you're reading it. If you

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have a family member with autism or you

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have autism, or you are a leader over

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people with autism, they can turn to stories,

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similar age group.

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There's also an index and a topical guide

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at the back so that you can look

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for specific

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topics. So like if you wanna hear stories

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about individuals

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passing the sacrament with autism and what that

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was like for them, you can go and

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find all the page numbers to help with

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your unique situation.

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Fantastic.

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So Liberty, what was your experience with autism

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or individuals with autism before diving into this

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project? It's a good question. It was a

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lot less formal than my dad's. Growing up

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with my dad, I heard a lot

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of behavior

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language all the time, heard about his work.

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And then I worked as a

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behavior technician a few different times

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when I was at college and a little

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in high school. But mostly it was just

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as a community member, as a member of

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the ward

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that when I was writing this book, I

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had

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a few

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people. I was in serving in the primary

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at that time. There were some kids in

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the primary with autism, some different people in

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the ward. And on my mission, I met

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different people with autism. So just as a

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friend and a ward member, I knew people.

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Yeah. And, Robert, for you, what,

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you know, what led you down this path

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of special education and and doing your the

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career that you had? Several things. I just

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wanted to add one thing Oh, sure. To

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the book. At the end of each chapter,

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there's just a short section with a few

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strategies,

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and they're fairly basic. And those strategies

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are also indexed in the end. That's usually

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what people want. They want Yeah. They What

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do I do? Right? I don't And they're

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they're I mean, they're not too specific, but

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I actually got into the field by accident.

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I

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was doing engineering,

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and I I wanted to maybe be a

271
00:10:03,714 --> 00:10:04,534
history teacher.

272
00:10:05,235 --> 00:10:07,954
And I worked with special needs kids at

273
00:10:07,954 --> 00:10:08,615
the pool

274
00:10:09,074 --> 00:10:10,375
and doing best buddies,

275
00:10:10,834 --> 00:10:11,334
and

276
00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:13,980
I thought, well, maybe I should I kinda

277
00:10:14,279 --> 00:10:15,820
was thinking about doing history.

278
00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:18,120
I went in and asked if I could

279
00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:20,600
get a minor, and I loved it so

280
00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:22,220
much. And here I am

281
00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:26,394
years later. Yeah. That's great. Now oftentimes, you'll

282
00:10:26,394 --> 00:10:28,875
hear as people talk about autism or they

283
00:10:28,875 --> 00:10:30,975
interact with individuals who are autistic,

284
00:10:31,274 --> 00:10:33,674
they'll say, oh, that he or she is

285
00:10:33,674 --> 00:10:35,995
on the spectrum. Right? And, I think we've

286
00:10:35,995 --> 00:10:36,975
experienced different,

287
00:10:37,340 --> 00:10:39,700
you know, different places on that spectrum with

288
00:10:39,820 --> 00:10:42,700
depending on individuals. How would you explain this

289
00:10:42,700 --> 00:10:45,040
dynamic, Robert, as far as the spectrum

290
00:10:45,500 --> 00:10:46,960
that autism represents?

291
00:10:47,340 --> 00:10:48,940
On maybe the lower end of the spectrum,

292
00:10:48,940 --> 00:10:50,080
you might have an individual

293
00:10:50,735 --> 00:10:51,394
that has

294
00:10:51,695 --> 00:10:54,254
intellectual disabilities. Maybe their IQ is, like, around

295
00:10:54,254 --> 00:10:55,714
50. They're nonverbal.

296
00:10:56,414 --> 00:10:58,034
They might have some very

297
00:10:58,495 --> 00:11:00,434
aggressive challenging behaviors.

298
00:11:00,975 --> 00:11:03,309
And as we move up, at the very

299
00:11:03,309 --> 00:11:05,549
opposite end, they might have an IQ of

300
00:11:05,549 --> 00:11:06,610
a 170

301
00:11:06,669 --> 00:11:10,589
and be so focused on science. There's one

302
00:11:10,589 --> 00:11:11,330
story about

303
00:11:11,789 --> 00:11:13,549
a a a wonderful lady that had that

304
00:11:13,549 --> 00:11:15,309
has a law degree, works in a law

305
00:11:15,309 --> 00:11:17,105
office, and they're they're they have this knit

306
00:11:17,184 --> 00:11:20,404
real narrow focus, but they struggle with communication

307
00:11:20,544 --> 00:11:23,825
skills, social skills, sometimes coping skills. And then

308
00:11:23,825 --> 00:11:26,144
everything in the middle in lots of different

309
00:11:26,144 --> 00:11:26,644
variations

310
00:11:27,585 --> 00:11:31,049
covers quite a vast array. So you'll find,

311
00:11:31,049 --> 00:11:34,569
especially with younger kids, those with aggressive behaviors

312
00:11:34,569 --> 00:11:36,409
that have a hard time sitting and they're

313
00:11:36,409 --> 00:11:37,850
very loud and they have a lot of

314
00:11:37,850 --> 00:11:39,850
stems, those are the ones that get the

315
00:11:39,850 --> 00:11:40,350
attention.

316
00:11:40,730 --> 00:11:41,789
And we're seeing

317
00:11:42,245 --> 00:11:45,445
now young adults that were maybe introverts, more

318
00:11:45,445 --> 00:11:46,904
quiet, pretty high

319
00:11:47,284 --> 00:11:49,845
intellectual, and they leave home and they go

320
00:11:49,845 --> 00:11:51,605
out into the world and they they can't

321
00:11:51,605 --> 00:11:54,485
function quite very, very well, and so they're

322
00:11:54,485 --> 00:11:57,430
getting a diagnosis a little bit later in

323
00:11:57,430 --> 00:12:00,310
life, usually between 18 and 30. There's just

324
00:12:00,310 --> 00:12:02,790
a lot that are finding that they're getting

325
00:12:02,790 --> 00:12:03,610
those diagnosis

326
00:12:04,149 --> 00:12:04,649
because

327
00:12:05,190 --> 00:12:07,930
in school, there's great structure. There's a routine.

328
00:12:08,070 --> 00:12:10,490
Things are very predictable. There's a big support

329
00:12:10,550 --> 00:12:12,884
network. They leave home, and they lose a

330
00:12:12,884 --> 00:12:14,725
lot of those supports, and they just can't

331
00:12:14,725 --> 00:12:16,024
they just can't make it.

332
00:12:16,565 --> 00:12:18,725
Yeah. And so as far as, you know,

333
00:12:18,725 --> 00:12:20,485
your work and your the book is concerned,

334
00:12:20,485 --> 00:12:22,504
I mean, we're we're talking about, you know,

335
00:12:22,884 --> 00:12:25,299
the autism in in Christchurch. You know, this

336
00:12:25,299 --> 00:12:27,620
may be those who are maybe have extreme

337
00:12:27,620 --> 00:12:30,179
handicaps or nonverbal or it's it's obvious that

338
00:12:30,179 --> 00:12:33,139
maybe they're they're atypical as opposed to somebody

339
00:12:33,139 --> 00:12:35,000
who may be the bishop, right, and experiences

340
00:12:35,139 --> 00:12:36,839
some level of of autism.

341
00:12:37,194 --> 00:12:39,054
And that is correct. We have,

342
00:12:39,595 --> 00:12:42,475
stories of mothers that have autism that are

343
00:12:42,475 --> 00:12:45,674
trying to be parents. We have older individuals

344
00:12:45,674 --> 00:12:47,674
like this, the one lady that is a

345
00:12:47,674 --> 00:12:50,235
lawyer, and everything in between. Those that have

346
00:12:50,235 --> 00:12:52,669
served missions and are mission age, young single

347
00:12:52,669 --> 00:12:53,169
adults,

348
00:12:53,629 --> 00:12:55,330
and quite a number

349
00:12:55,870 --> 00:12:59,389
of youth and primary age children. Liberty, anything

350
00:12:59,389 --> 00:13:01,149
that we're missing here so far that that

351
00:13:01,149 --> 00:13:02,909
you wanted to add? We have high functioning.

352
00:13:02,909 --> 00:13:04,725
We also have the lower functioning. We have

353
00:13:04,804 --> 00:13:06,804
some especially younger kids that we talk to

354
00:13:06,804 --> 00:13:09,605
their families who are nonverbal or are lower

355
00:13:09,605 --> 00:13:11,625
on the spectrum there. That's also represented.

356
00:13:12,164 --> 00:13:12,664
Awesome.

357
00:13:13,044 --> 00:13:15,845
So let's imagine in a hypothetical world, we're

358
00:13:15,845 --> 00:13:18,324
able to gather all the wards, all the,

359
00:13:18,324 --> 00:13:19,625
like, the ward councils

360
00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:23,139
of wards that have at least one autistic

361
00:13:23,279 --> 00:13:23,779
individual

362
00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:26,399
in the ward. And we gather in this

363
00:13:26,399 --> 00:13:28,639
conference, and you two are the the keynote

364
00:13:28,639 --> 00:13:30,339
speakers here. Where where's a good,

365
00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:31,860
jumping off point

366
00:13:32,235 --> 00:13:33,835
to I mean, where where would you start

367
00:13:33,835 --> 00:13:35,615
with that group of of church leaders?

368
00:13:35,995 --> 00:13:38,495
Well, I would say is my biggest takeaway

369
00:13:38,794 --> 00:13:42,335
of talking to these families is that disability

370
00:13:42,394 --> 00:13:44,174
specialists are so important.

371
00:13:44,700 --> 00:13:47,340
Disability specialist is a calling in the Church

372
00:13:47,340 --> 00:13:49,259
of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints at

373
00:13:49,259 --> 00:13:50,879
the ward and stake level

374
00:13:51,259 --> 00:13:52,879
that I think is underutilized.

375
00:13:53,340 --> 00:13:55,679
I haven't seen it in action that often,

376
00:13:55,980 --> 00:13:57,759
but so many stories

377
00:13:58,574 --> 00:14:00,814
involved either a disability specialist that made a

378
00:14:00,814 --> 00:14:03,694
huge difference or families that needed extra support

379
00:14:03,694 --> 00:14:05,235
and a disability specialist

380
00:14:05,694 --> 00:14:06,995
could have made a big difference.

381
00:14:07,454 --> 00:14:09,154
An example of this is

382
00:14:09,774 --> 00:14:11,875
the first story in the book is a

383
00:14:11,934 --> 00:14:12,754
mom telling

384
00:14:13,149 --> 00:14:15,970
about her two kids with autism. They're

385
00:14:16,269 --> 00:14:18,509
toddlers. There's there's a nursery age and one

386
00:14:18,509 --> 00:14:19,649
just starting primary,

387
00:14:20,269 --> 00:14:20,769
and

388
00:14:21,470 --> 00:14:23,970
they were a little lower on

389
00:14:24,269 --> 00:14:24,769
this

390
00:14:25,149 --> 00:14:25,649
spectrum.

391
00:14:26,325 --> 00:14:28,745
And she wanted church to be rejuvenating

392
00:14:29,045 --> 00:14:30,884
place for her and a time to worship

393
00:14:30,884 --> 00:14:33,365
and be with her peers. But all the

394
00:14:33,365 --> 00:14:35,684
time she was just with her kids and

395
00:14:35,684 --> 00:14:37,684
helping them because church was a lot for

396
00:14:37,684 --> 00:14:40,759
them. And it was so exhausting and she

397
00:14:40,759 --> 00:14:42,040
had to ask to be released from her

398
00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:43,639
calling and she was just following her kids

399
00:14:43,639 --> 00:14:44,700
around all the time.

400
00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:48,600
And that was pretty typical of parents with

401
00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:50,745
young kids with autism that I talked with.

402
00:14:50,825 --> 00:14:52,264
But there were a few that I talked

403
00:14:52,264 --> 00:14:54,585
with who had a disability specialist. Someone was

404
00:14:54,585 --> 00:14:56,605
called specifically to be with their child.

405
00:14:56,985 --> 00:14:58,745
So one story, there's this little boy in

406
00:14:58,745 --> 00:14:59,245
primary,

407
00:14:59,625 --> 00:15:02,184
and he would get overstimulated. It was hard

408
00:15:02,184 --> 00:15:03,600
for him to stay in there. But this

409
00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:05,600
man was called to be a disability specialist

410
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:07,679
and he would go walk the halls with

411
00:15:07,679 --> 00:15:09,200
him when he needed to step out. He

412
00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:11,759
would talk with the primary teachers, help make

413
00:15:11,759 --> 00:15:14,000
things the best they could for this boy

414
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:15,839
so that the primary teachers is also focused

415
00:15:15,839 --> 00:15:17,059
on all the other kids.

416
00:15:17,454 --> 00:15:20,115
And so I'm very passionate about having disability

417
00:15:20,174 --> 00:15:20,674
specialists.

418
00:15:21,054 --> 00:15:22,115
Yeah. Love it.

419
00:15:22,575 --> 00:15:24,735
Robert, anything you'd add to the disability specialist

420
00:15:24,735 --> 00:15:25,235
dynamic?

421
00:15:25,615 --> 00:15:27,235
To be a disability specialist,

422
00:15:27,774 --> 00:15:29,554
you need to just be confident.

423
00:15:29,909 --> 00:15:30,889
You need to care.

424
00:15:31,269 --> 00:15:33,429
You don't need to know a lot. You'll

425
00:15:33,429 --> 00:15:36,149
learn that along the way. But if you

426
00:15:36,149 --> 00:15:38,949
are willing if you're a compassionate person, if

427
00:15:38,949 --> 00:15:40,470
you want to help out, if you like

428
00:15:40,470 --> 00:15:43,925
to be with, these mostly children as or

429
00:15:43,925 --> 00:15:45,605
those that have used it in our book.

430
00:15:45,605 --> 00:15:48,325
But and and if you'll just listen and

431
00:15:48,325 --> 00:15:50,665
be aware, you can make a huge difference.

432
00:15:51,125 --> 00:15:53,144
You don't have to have any special skills.

433
00:15:53,365 --> 00:15:56,929
There's something about consistency and routine and knowing

434
00:15:56,929 --> 00:15:58,850
a little bit about the child and showing

435
00:15:58,850 --> 00:16:00,929
some love and kindness that just makes all

436
00:16:00,929 --> 00:16:03,009
of the difference, just all of the difference.

437
00:16:03,009 --> 00:16:05,330
And there's quite a few, like Liberty said,

438
00:16:05,330 --> 00:16:07,970
stories of how the child would wanna go

439
00:16:07,970 --> 00:16:10,465
sit with them in sacrament, meaning that they

440
00:16:10,465 --> 00:16:12,404
just make the difference between

441
00:16:12,784 --> 00:16:14,384
wanting to run out all of the time

442
00:16:14,384 --> 00:16:16,945
and actually staying and learning and listening and

443
00:16:16,945 --> 00:16:19,764
and having an experience and allowing the parents

444
00:16:20,144 --> 00:16:23,125
to also have a spiritual experience at church.

445
00:16:23,389 --> 00:16:25,870
Yeah. One other story with disability specialist, it

446
00:16:25,870 --> 00:16:28,029
was mostly with primary age kids. But there

447
00:16:28,029 --> 00:16:29,629
was one young woman's story, which I thought

448
00:16:29,629 --> 00:16:30,690
was really powerful

449
00:16:31,070 --> 00:16:33,309
that she had a hard time connecting with

450
00:16:33,309 --> 00:16:35,549
her peers and young women's, but they didn't

451
00:16:35,549 --> 00:16:36,990
always wanna talk about the same things. And

452
00:16:36,990 --> 00:16:38,350
she had a hard time wanting to go

453
00:16:38,350 --> 00:16:39,090
to activities.

454
00:16:39,495 --> 00:16:42,215
But they called a disability specialist who she

455
00:16:42,215 --> 00:16:45,174
was a young adult, newly married woman, and

456
00:16:45,174 --> 00:16:47,254
her calling was to go to young women's

457
00:16:47,254 --> 00:16:49,894
and Sunday school and youth activities with this

458
00:16:49,894 --> 00:16:51,735
girl. And they'd sit on the side and

459
00:16:51,735 --> 00:16:53,735
they'd talk about cats and anime and whatever

460
00:16:53,735 --> 00:16:55,730
she wanted to talk about. And it made

461
00:16:55,730 --> 00:16:57,409
such a big difference to her that she

462
00:16:57,409 --> 00:16:59,269
started wanting to go to those activities.

463
00:16:59,649 --> 00:17:02,289
So either even with older with youth and

464
00:17:02,289 --> 00:17:02,789
adults,

465
00:17:03,169 --> 00:17:05,269
disability specialists can make a big difference.

466
00:17:05,730 --> 00:17:06,630
I love that.

467
00:17:07,009 --> 00:17:09,134
So, obviously, I'm I'm thinking of, like, the

468
00:17:09,134 --> 00:17:11,534
music calling sometimes where, you know, those who

469
00:17:11,534 --> 00:17:13,214
play the organ or the piano, they kinda

470
00:17:13,214 --> 00:17:15,294
get pigeonholed and things like, well, hey. You

471
00:17:15,375 --> 00:17:16,894
you've got experience with this, so why don't

472
00:17:16,894 --> 00:17:18,815
we call you as the organist or whatever

473
00:17:18,815 --> 00:17:20,434
it is? And I would imagine

474
00:17:20,779 --> 00:17:22,299
maybe a lot of leaders fall into this

475
00:17:22,299 --> 00:17:24,460
trap of being like, well, let's see. Cindy

476
00:17:24,460 --> 00:17:26,539
has autism, and her mom is in our

477
00:17:26,539 --> 00:17:28,639
ward. Let's call her mom as a disability

478
00:17:28,700 --> 00:17:30,700
specialist, and I'm gathering that's maybe not the

479
00:17:30,700 --> 00:17:31,440
best strategy.

480
00:17:31,980 --> 00:17:34,484
Yeah. Really common in the book is moms

481
00:17:34,484 --> 00:17:37,204
who end up being their kids' primary teacher

482
00:17:37,204 --> 00:17:39,125
and young woman's leader and just following them

483
00:17:39,125 --> 00:17:40,884
all through because they know how to help

484
00:17:40,884 --> 00:17:42,484
them. And so I think sometimes it can

485
00:17:42,484 --> 00:17:44,484
be a good fit, but helpful to give

486
00:17:44,484 --> 00:17:46,164
them a break to be able to do

487
00:17:46,164 --> 00:17:49,039
other things. Yeah. Because this isn't necessarily all

488
00:17:49,039 --> 00:17:51,359
about the individual with autism. It could be

489
00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:53,519
those loved ones surrounding them that you want

490
00:17:53,519 --> 00:17:55,380
them to enjoy church and to

491
00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,880
participate and have a sanctifying experience. But if

492
00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:00,320
they're, you know, just doing what they do

493
00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:02,420
at home anyways of, you know, keeping

494
00:18:02,904 --> 00:18:04,664
track of the individual and helping them with

495
00:18:04,664 --> 00:18:07,144
their behavior or whatever, then kinda it can

496
00:18:07,144 --> 00:18:09,724
really, you know, hurt the the the household.

497
00:18:09,785 --> 00:18:12,345
Right? And I'm just gonna add, I wanna

498
00:18:12,345 --> 00:18:13,005
be positive,

499
00:18:13,305 --> 00:18:16,105
but for every person that was focused on

500
00:18:16,105 --> 00:18:17,085
in our story,

501
00:18:17,419 --> 00:18:19,599
in our book, there's probably 30

502
00:18:19,900 --> 00:18:22,480
that that that aren't there Yeah. Because

503
00:18:22,859 --> 00:18:24,380
it was hard, and they didn't have the

504
00:18:24,380 --> 00:18:26,700
support network, and they gave up at least

505
00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:27,519
for a period.

506
00:18:27,980 --> 00:18:28,640
The likelihood

507
00:18:29,019 --> 00:18:30,319
like, some of the statistics

508
00:18:31,054 --> 00:18:33,615
for families that have an a child with

509
00:18:33,615 --> 00:18:35,694
autism is, like, there's, like, a three times

510
00:18:35,694 --> 00:18:37,315
greater chance of divorce.

511
00:18:37,934 --> 00:18:40,595
It's very easy to feel alone and

512
00:18:40,974 --> 00:18:43,775
just, like, it's too hard. And to get

513
00:18:43,775 --> 00:18:45,954
up and get your child there

514
00:18:46,319 --> 00:18:48,240
is, you know, you you think about how

515
00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:49,919
how hard it was just to get your

516
00:18:49,919 --> 00:18:52,880
own children there. It's just compounded and and

517
00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:53,380
magnified.

518
00:18:53,759 --> 00:18:56,159
And especially if you're a single mom, which

519
00:18:56,159 --> 00:18:58,740
so many of my clients are, it's just

520
00:18:58,865 --> 00:19:01,424
for grandmas. Many of the stories talk about

521
00:19:01,424 --> 00:19:02,164
the grandmas

522
00:19:02,545 --> 00:19:04,805
that are raising these some of these kids.

523
00:19:05,105 --> 00:19:06,484
It's hard. Yeah.

524
00:19:06,785 --> 00:19:08,945
Like, with the disability specialists, obviously, you know,

525
00:19:08,945 --> 00:19:10,384
this is a calling that's in the handbook.

526
00:19:10,384 --> 00:19:12,164
You know, there's some guidance, there's resources,

527
00:19:12,509 --> 00:19:14,430
There's and I believe there's a great, you

528
00:19:14,430 --> 00:19:16,750
know this thing's like great Facebook group about

529
00:19:16,750 --> 00:19:18,990
disability specialists that I think that I've I've

530
00:19:18,990 --> 00:19:20,769
seen and resources like that.

531
00:19:21,070 --> 00:19:22,670
What advice would you give to a ward

532
00:19:22,670 --> 00:19:25,070
who's like, well, it doesn't seem like we

533
00:19:25,070 --> 00:19:27,309
need, you know, disability specialist. I mean, should

534
00:19:27,309 --> 00:19:30,085
they just have one no matter what, or

535
00:19:30,085 --> 00:19:32,005
should they wait for that apparent need to

536
00:19:32,005 --> 00:19:34,105
be present? There's a couple of principles.

537
00:19:34,484 --> 00:19:36,585
We're talking primarily to,

538
00:19:36,964 --> 00:19:39,304
like, leaders of the church that

539
00:19:39,684 --> 00:19:42,484
the greatest revelation I think that god gives

540
00:19:42,484 --> 00:19:43,384
to his children

541
00:19:43,799 --> 00:19:45,820
come to parents about their children.

542
00:19:46,279 --> 00:19:48,920
When a mother and a father are just

543
00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:51,000
working so hard to try and figure things

544
00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:51,500
out,

545
00:19:51,799 --> 00:19:53,660
God teaches them a lot.

546
00:19:54,039 --> 00:19:56,279
And the leader should listen to those parents.

547
00:19:56,279 --> 00:19:57,720
They should go talk to them and find

548
00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,394
out what they need. A disability specialist,

549
00:20:01,095 --> 00:20:04,375
might look like somebody that that's assigned as

550
00:20:04,375 --> 00:20:06,615
a minister that just is their friend, and

551
00:20:06,615 --> 00:20:08,775
they might not need somebody at church. Most

552
00:20:08,775 --> 00:20:10,695
of the stories that we talk about have

553
00:20:10,695 --> 00:20:13,590
somebody at church. And so listen to those

554
00:20:13,590 --> 00:20:17,609
parents. They know and also empower those parents.

555
00:20:18,070 --> 00:20:20,410
Sometimes it's just, as we talked about earlier,

556
00:20:20,470 --> 00:20:22,869
to make them in charge, but just giving

557
00:20:22,869 --> 00:20:24,250
them knowledge and resources.

558
00:20:24,789 --> 00:20:26,710
One of the stories talks about them bringing

559
00:20:26,710 --> 00:20:27,450
their own

560
00:20:27,914 --> 00:20:31,295
RBT to church with them. And as I

561
00:20:31,355 --> 00:20:32,955
went through some of these stories, I was

562
00:20:32,955 --> 00:20:35,195
amazed at how many of the RBTs that

563
00:20:35,195 --> 00:20:37,434
worked with some of these children were members

564
00:20:37,434 --> 00:20:38,654
of the church already

565
00:20:39,035 --> 00:20:40,174
and naturally

566
00:20:40,634 --> 00:20:43,349
were very concerned and helped them. The second

567
00:20:43,349 --> 00:20:45,829
principle What's the what's the RBT? A registered

568
00:20:45,829 --> 00:20:48,329
behavioral technician. Okay. Got it. It's the

569
00:20:48,630 --> 00:20:50,630
and a lot of the stories, they weren't

570
00:20:50,630 --> 00:20:52,789
part of it, but anybody that receives ABA

571
00:20:52,789 --> 00:20:55,849
services gets it from a registered behavioral technician.

572
00:20:56,255 --> 00:20:58,355
That's what Liberty was for a while.

573
00:20:59,215 --> 00:21:01,215
All my girls got that opportunity as they

574
00:21:01,215 --> 00:21:03,394
were growing up. The other principle

575
00:21:03,775 --> 00:21:06,195
is that leaders have the right to revelation.

576
00:21:06,735 --> 00:21:09,130
And as as they listen and as that

577
00:21:09,130 --> 00:21:11,690
revelation sometimes it doesn't have to be the

578
00:21:11,690 --> 00:21:12,190
bishop.

579
00:21:12,490 --> 00:21:15,049
Maybe it's the primary president. Maybe it's the

580
00:21:15,049 --> 00:21:17,609
young woman's leader. Maybe it's one of the

581
00:21:17,609 --> 00:21:19,929
youth in the young women. We have the

582
00:21:19,929 --> 00:21:20,910
story of Olivia

583
00:21:21,434 --> 00:21:23,274
and one of the members of the ward,

584
00:21:23,274 --> 00:21:24,894
that was actually one of my daughters,

585
00:21:25,274 --> 00:21:25,774
Carolina,

586
00:21:26,234 --> 00:21:28,894
befriended her and they got really close.

587
00:21:29,274 --> 00:21:31,774
And she was kind of like the disability

588
00:21:31,914 --> 00:21:34,380
specialist. She never had that title, but she

589
00:21:34,380 --> 00:21:37,099
was there at the right times and she

590
00:21:37,099 --> 00:21:39,180
would they would talk before an activity. If

591
00:21:39,180 --> 00:21:41,580
it was too loud, Olivia would just stay

592
00:21:41,580 --> 00:21:44,220
home. But if she came, she'd explain what

593
00:21:44,220 --> 00:21:45,900
was gonna happen and she could come sit

594
00:21:45,900 --> 00:21:48,484
by her and talk, and Carolina would introduce

595
00:21:48,484 --> 00:21:50,565
her to other people. And it worked really,

596
00:21:50,565 --> 00:21:51,224
really well.

597
00:21:51,684 --> 00:21:53,365
So if you just pay attention, there might

598
00:21:53,365 --> 00:21:54,664
be a natural person

599
00:21:55,044 --> 00:21:56,505
that just kind of gravitates,

600
00:21:56,964 --> 00:21:59,284
but revelation, I think that's why there's no

601
00:21:59,284 --> 00:22:00,025
right answers.

602
00:22:00,349 --> 00:22:02,190
There isn't, like, do this, this, and this,

603
00:22:02,190 --> 00:22:03,970
and you'll be covered in your award.

604
00:22:04,349 --> 00:22:05,490
No. When the need arises,

605
00:22:06,190 --> 00:22:07,170
look at, listen,

606
00:22:07,549 --> 00:22:10,130
and communicate, and the right answers will come.

607
00:22:10,349 --> 00:22:12,910
Is it off the wall idea to involve,

608
00:22:12,910 --> 00:22:14,954
like, a youth as a disability specialist that,

609
00:22:15,674 --> 00:22:18,734
especially if the the autistic individuals is youth

610
00:22:19,115 --> 00:22:20,954
age? I think that'd be great. And I

611
00:22:20,954 --> 00:22:22,714
think even in wards, there could be a

612
00:22:22,714 --> 00:22:25,355
team of disability specialists depending on the needs.

613
00:22:25,355 --> 00:22:27,115
So maybe there'd be, like, a young woman,

614
00:22:27,115 --> 00:22:28,335
a young man, an adult,

615
00:22:28,634 --> 00:22:31,720
depending on who needs the extra help. Awesome.

616
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:33,559
Anything to add to that, Robert? There's kind

617
00:22:33,559 --> 00:22:35,640
of a a a feeling that if you're

618
00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:36,380
on the spectrum,

619
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,700
you don't really need social interaction,

620
00:22:39,079 --> 00:22:40,220
and that's not true.

621
00:22:40,519 --> 00:22:42,519
It's usually they like fewer people, and they

622
00:22:42,519 --> 00:22:44,839
have deeper relationships with the few that they

623
00:22:44,839 --> 00:22:46,184
have. They need

624
00:22:46,565 --> 00:22:48,805
that just as much as anybody else. And

625
00:22:48,805 --> 00:22:51,525
it's so much easier for a youth to

626
00:22:51,525 --> 00:22:53,684
visit with another youth. It's so much more

627
00:22:53,684 --> 00:22:55,465
powerful to have that relationship

628
00:22:55,845 --> 00:22:58,085
than to have somebody that's twenty years older

629
00:22:58,085 --> 00:23:01,079
than them come in. And so yeah. Yeah.

630
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:02,059
That's great.

631
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:04,299
Talk to me about as far as councils

632
00:23:04,679 --> 00:23:05,179
go,

633
00:23:05,559 --> 00:23:07,880
how should councils be involved or what's the

634
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:10,279
thought behind that? The church loves to use

635
00:23:10,279 --> 00:23:10,779
councils,

636
00:23:11,079 --> 00:23:11,819
and councils

637
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:12,859
create

638
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:14,700
really good revelation

639
00:23:15,445 --> 00:23:16,424
because the people

640
00:23:16,805 --> 00:23:18,744
that are closest that have that information

641
00:23:19,365 --> 00:23:21,865
are able to share and we work together.

642
00:23:22,085 --> 00:23:23,525
And when we think of councils, you, you

643
00:23:23,525 --> 00:23:25,285
know, think of a ward council or a

644
00:23:25,285 --> 00:23:26,025
youth council,

645
00:23:26,325 --> 00:23:27,545
and those are important.

646
00:23:27,924 --> 00:23:28,424
But

647
00:23:28,809 --> 00:23:30,589
when you are supporting a child

648
00:23:30,970 --> 00:23:31,710
with autism

649
00:23:32,089 --> 00:23:32,910
in the church,

650
00:23:33,289 --> 00:23:34,670
the disability specialist,

651
00:23:35,130 --> 00:23:37,289
you know, say it's a primary child, and

652
00:23:37,289 --> 00:23:40,570
there's the disability specialist, there's the parent, maybe

653
00:23:40,570 --> 00:23:43,690
there's the primary counselor that's kind of over

654
00:23:43,690 --> 00:23:45,045
that. And if those individuals

655
00:23:46,305 --> 00:23:48,005
work together and regularly

656
00:23:48,305 --> 00:23:48,805
meet

657
00:23:49,184 --> 00:23:51,445
and have some very specific goals

658
00:23:51,904 --> 00:23:53,984
and they get some training if they need

659
00:23:53,984 --> 00:23:55,825
to, maybe from a stake person or from

660
00:23:55,825 --> 00:23:58,244
an outside, I don't wherever that those expertise

661
00:23:58,464 --> 00:24:00,319
are, and they work towards

662
00:24:00,619 --> 00:24:01,359
the goal,

663
00:24:01,660 --> 00:24:03,579
they will get much better results than if

664
00:24:03,579 --> 00:24:05,980
you're just like, oh, here's a bit disability

665
00:24:05,980 --> 00:24:08,559
specialist, you go work with them, and

666
00:24:08,859 --> 00:24:11,179
the disability specialist that may not know very

667
00:24:11,179 --> 00:24:13,119
much, there isn't a lot of communication,

668
00:24:13,894 --> 00:24:16,154
and things fall apart quite regularly.

669
00:24:16,774 --> 00:24:18,375
And it doesn't take very much time. You

670
00:24:18,375 --> 00:24:20,134
know, you could meet for five minutes after

671
00:24:20,134 --> 00:24:21,994
church and just talk about how it went,

672
00:24:22,054 --> 00:24:24,375
what are your goals, what do we need,

673
00:24:24,375 --> 00:24:26,454
what resources could we pull in, and you

674
00:24:26,454 --> 00:24:27,434
just go forward.

675
00:24:28,069 --> 00:24:30,410
And so that's one vision of a council.

676
00:24:30,789 --> 00:24:32,710
Perfect. Very good. Anything you'd add to that,

677
00:24:32,710 --> 00:24:33,210
Liberty?

678
00:24:33,589 --> 00:24:34,089
Yeah.

679
00:24:34,630 --> 00:24:37,269
Almost every story that we have in here

680
00:24:37,269 --> 00:24:40,154
dealing with parents and talking about their kids,

681
00:24:40,315 --> 00:24:42,955
of huge aspect was communication that they were

682
00:24:42,955 --> 00:24:43,455
communicating

683
00:24:43,835 --> 00:24:46,715
with their children's leaders and teachers to make

684
00:24:46,715 --> 00:24:49,195
that work. And I think a council is

685
00:24:49,195 --> 00:24:51,595
a great setting for that. In a public

686
00:24:51,595 --> 00:24:54,394
school setting, if a kid has autism or

687
00:24:54,394 --> 00:24:55,295
different disabilities,

688
00:24:55,930 --> 00:24:56,430
they'll

689
00:24:56,970 --> 00:24:58,890
meet every few months. My dad would know

690
00:24:58,890 --> 00:25:01,289
better than me, but meet to talk about

691
00:25:01,289 --> 00:25:03,390
their individualized education plan.

692
00:25:03,690 --> 00:25:05,289
And that would be a whole team that

693
00:25:05,289 --> 00:25:07,230
it would be the teacher and the administrator

694
00:25:07,450 --> 00:25:09,049
and the special ed teacher that they'd meet

695
00:25:09,049 --> 00:25:11,424
together and talk about the child and their

696
00:25:11,424 --> 00:25:13,265
goals and how they're doing. And I think

697
00:25:13,265 --> 00:25:14,404
something very similar

698
00:25:14,785 --> 00:25:16,565
in a church setting is important.

699
00:25:16,945 --> 00:25:19,265
Yeah. And I would imagine it's easy for

700
00:25:19,265 --> 00:25:20,785
that group to just be like, you know,

701
00:25:20,785 --> 00:25:22,945
I'm the disability specialist. That means I just

702
00:25:22,945 --> 00:25:25,424
try and distract Johnny for two hours so

703
00:25:25,424 --> 00:25:27,160
that, you know, the rest of church can

704
00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:30,440
happen when it's Best snacks. What's that? I

705
00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:32,700
have the best snacks and they'll put That's

706
00:25:32,700 --> 00:25:34,920
right. Yeah. Bring the snacks. Let's just, you

707
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,320
know, pace the the hallways and get through

708
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:38,680
it and move on. But there's probably a

709
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:40,214
lot more to that because, like you said,

710
00:25:40,214 --> 00:25:42,714
they need they need social engagement.

711
00:25:43,174 --> 00:25:45,015
That doesn't mean you just you know, you're

712
00:25:45,015 --> 00:25:46,375
just trying to distract them the whole time.

713
00:25:46,375 --> 00:25:48,134
How can we work them in in a

714
00:25:48,134 --> 00:25:50,535
way that's not overly distracting or, you know,

715
00:25:50,535 --> 00:25:53,230
that's benefit that everybody can benefit from, you

716
00:25:53,230 --> 00:25:54,049
know, their life.

717
00:25:54,509 --> 00:25:55,789
I think with that, there's a lot to

718
00:25:55,789 --> 00:25:58,190
be said to be flexible with individuals with

719
00:25:58,190 --> 00:26:00,669
autism and their families. Like, we have one

720
00:26:00,669 --> 00:26:03,490
story with this little boy who got overstimulated

721
00:26:03,869 --> 00:26:06,674
in primary, especially during singing time. And so

722
00:26:06,674 --> 00:26:08,755
his mom talked with one of the members

723
00:26:08,755 --> 00:26:10,674
of the primary presidency and they switched. So

724
00:26:10,674 --> 00:26:12,994
he'd have class with his peers, just a

725
00:26:12,994 --> 00:26:15,554
few of them before singing time. So that

726
00:26:15,554 --> 00:26:17,394
if that was too stressful, it wouldn't affect

727
00:26:17,394 --> 00:26:19,714
the class time. So just little adjustments can

728
00:26:19,714 --> 00:26:21,335
be made that can help a lot.

729
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:23,339
That's great. Great example.

730
00:26:23,799 --> 00:26:26,859
In relation to the too deep concept, obviously,

731
00:26:27,079 --> 00:26:29,339
if it's, you know, if it's a youth,

732
00:26:29,559 --> 00:26:31,799
just like all youth and their children, there's

733
00:26:31,799 --> 00:26:34,095
always gonna be a too deep, you know,

734
00:26:34,414 --> 00:26:36,674
leader teacher dynamic happening.

735
00:26:37,054 --> 00:26:39,855
Is there anything outside the normal that wouldn't

736
00:26:39,855 --> 00:26:42,654
be encouraged there or same same idea? You

737
00:26:42,654 --> 00:26:44,575
wouldn't want to have one of the teachers

738
00:26:44,575 --> 00:26:46,515
be the disability specialist because

739
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:48,799
it's very likely that you're gonna have to

740
00:26:48,799 --> 00:26:52,019
leave quite regularly Yeah. Depending on the situation.

741
00:26:52,559 --> 00:26:54,640
And so I don't know. That's one of

742
00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:56,420
those things you'd have to work out locally.

743
00:26:56,720 --> 00:26:59,600
Yeah. And if, obviously, that disability specialist has

744
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:01,680
to leave with that individual, again, that two

745
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,585
d leadership is is needed wherever they go.

746
00:27:04,585 --> 00:27:07,545
Right? So very good. Very good. What was

747
00:27:07,545 --> 00:27:09,144
the story that stood out, that you wrote

748
00:27:09,144 --> 00:27:10,825
about in the book? One story we've taught

749
00:27:10,825 --> 00:27:12,744
a lot about primary kids, but one about

750
00:27:12,744 --> 00:27:13,484
an adult

751
00:27:13,865 --> 00:27:15,325
was this man named Spencer.

752
00:27:15,869 --> 00:27:16,369
And

753
00:27:16,670 --> 00:27:17,170
he

754
00:27:17,789 --> 00:27:19,329
when he was young in primary,

755
00:27:20,269 --> 00:27:22,509
he had a disability specialist that helped him

756
00:27:22,509 --> 00:27:24,269
out. And then he had a really good

757
00:27:24,269 --> 00:27:26,589
ward support as a young man, and he

758
00:27:26,589 --> 00:27:29,150
got help blessing and passing the sacrament and

759
00:27:29,150 --> 00:27:30,944
really enjoyed that and kind of got a

760
00:27:30,944 --> 00:27:31,845
community there.

761
00:27:32,224 --> 00:27:33,684
But then he moved

762
00:27:34,144 --> 00:27:35,765
when I think he was a priest

763
00:27:36,144 --> 00:27:38,545
to a different ward, and the transition was

764
00:27:38,545 --> 00:27:40,085
really tough. And

765
00:27:40,384 --> 00:27:42,625
I think the story was really interesting because

766
00:27:42,625 --> 00:27:44,750
he was the same, but just how his

767
00:27:44,750 --> 00:27:46,690
leaders responded in these different situations

768
00:27:47,390 --> 00:27:48,769
affected him really negatively.

769
00:27:49,230 --> 00:27:52,269
In his new ward, his bishop was really

770
00:27:52,269 --> 00:27:53,730
worried about him socially.

771
00:27:54,029 --> 00:27:55,789
I would say things like, oh, don't do

772
00:27:55,789 --> 00:27:57,650
that. That's weird. That's not normal.

773
00:27:58,095 --> 00:27:58,595
And

774
00:27:58,974 --> 00:28:01,694
the bishop's wife talked to Spencer's mom and

775
00:28:01,694 --> 00:28:03,694
was like, I'm so impressed with how you

776
00:28:03,694 --> 00:28:04,994
hide Spencer's disability.

777
00:28:05,535 --> 00:28:07,294
And they'd make comments like this that made

778
00:28:07,294 --> 00:28:09,154
him feel, like, really othered.

779
00:28:09,535 --> 00:28:11,535
And at that point, he stopped going to

780
00:28:11,535 --> 00:28:12,990
church as a young man

781
00:28:13,950 --> 00:28:15,950
and made some different choices in his life

782
00:28:15,950 --> 00:28:17,890
as he grew into adulthood.

783
00:28:18,269 --> 00:28:20,690
Then as an adult, he started missing

784
00:28:21,150 --> 00:28:22,529
things that he had in church,

785
00:28:22,990 --> 00:28:25,875
and he started to go back as an

786
00:28:25,875 --> 00:28:27,634
adult back to church and started to read

787
00:28:27,634 --> 00:28:29,474
the scriptures and he changed his work schedule

788
00:28:29,474 --> 00:28:31,634
so he could go as he remembered those

789
00:28:31,634 --> 00:28:33,255
good memories before of leaders.

790
00:28:33,795 --> 00:28:35,255
So I just love that story

791
00:28:35,634 --> 00:28:38,410
as a caution, but also thinking about those

792
00:28:38,410 --> 00:28:40,330
youth leaders before of how they were including

793
00:28:40,330 --> 00:28:41,869
him that just felt so natural.

794
00:28:42,250 --> 00:28:44,009
I also think that it can be tough

795
00:28:44,009 --> 00:28:46,410
in transitions. Like if you move that things

796
00:28:46,410 --> 00:28:48,570
we talked about, like communication and councils are

797
00:28:48,570 --> 00:28:51,044
especially important that when someone moves into your

798
00:28:51,044 --> 00:28:52,724
ward, that's when you need to be really

799
00:28:52,724 --> 00:28:55,304
talking to the parents and get a disability

800
00:28:55,444 --> 00:28:57,224
specialist and make things work.

801
00:28:57,525 --> 00:28:59,684
I love that story. Very good. Tell me

802
00:28:59,684 --> 00:29:01,924
about as far as using strength and service

803
00:29:01,924 --> 00:29:02,424
opportunities

804
00:29:03,250 --> 00:29:04,549
for people with autism.

805
00:29:05,009 --> 00:29:07,190
Individuals that are on the spectrum

806
00:29:07,569 --> 00:29:10,230
often have what we call, like, splinter skills,

807
00:29:10,369 --> 00:29:12,549
where they have a huge fascination

808
00:29:13,169 --> 00:29:14,390
or a a fantastic

809
00:29:14,769 --> 00:29:16,309
skill in one area.

810
00:29:16,755 --> 00:29:18,835
And it might be math or science or

811
00:29:18,835 --> 00:29:19,894
English or

812
00:29:20,275 --> 00:29:21,015
it depends.

813
00:29:21,394 --> 00:29:23,714
And sometimes that's what gets them in trouble

814
00:29:23,714 --> 00:29:25,714
is they they appear to be so so

815
00:29:25,714 --> 00:29:26,214
intelligent,

816
00:29:26,595 --> 00:29:29,234
but then in a different area, they're lacking

817
00:29:29,234 --> 00:29:30,375
some basic skills.

818
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:33,720
And just like I mean, the Lord says

819
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,359
everyone should have a calling. Everyone should have

820
00:29:36,359 --> 00:29:38,440
a friend, and everyone should be nourished by

821
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:40,440
the good word of of God. And it's

822
00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:42,140
the same thing for these individuals.

823
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:45,319
If we can find out what those strengths

824
00:29:45,319 --> 00:29:46,299
are, and sometimes

825
00:29:46,674 --> 00:29:48,674
we're gonna have to have revelation and we're

826
00:29:48,674 --> 00:29:50,535
gonna have to have some trial and error,

827
00:29:50,595 --> 00:29:52,595
but they will rise and they will do

828
00:29:52,595 --> 00:29:55,154
some fantastic things. I'll tell you a story

829
00:29:55,154 --> 00:29:58,275
about he's probably 30 now, and he's actually

830
00:29:58,275 --> 00:29:59,734
not a story in the book, but

831
00:30:00,079 --> 00:30:02,799
he just didn't wanna be around people, he

832
00:30:02,799 --> 00:30:04,320
would run away all the time, he had

833
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:05,380
all kinds of issues,

834
00:30:05,759 --> 00:30:07,220
and he lived with his mom,

835
00:30:07,519 --> 00:30:09,359
but he he was in a ranching community

836
00:30:09,359 --> 00:30:11,599
and a lot of people knew him and

837
00:30:11,599 --> 00:30:14,019
he got called to be the executive secretary.

838
00:30:14,464 --> 00:30:17,105
He just loves computers. He's so so good

839
00:30:17,105 --> 00:30:20,224
at it, and he actually would sit on

840
00:30:20,224 --> 00:30:20,964
the stand,

841
00:30:21,265 --> 00:30:23,664
and he would count the people and do

842
00:30:23,664 --> 00:30:25,585
all of the records, but he didn't have

843
00:30:25,585 --> 00:30:27,265
to talk to people. And when he did

844
00:30:27,265 --> 00:30:29,105
talk to them, he had a very specific

845
00:30:29,105 --> 00:30:29,605
purpose

846
00:30:30,089 --> 00:30:31,069
for the interchange,

847
00:30:31,529 --> 00:30:34,009
and so he felt comfortable with that. He

848
00:30:34,009 --> 00:30:36,009
did that calling for nine years, and he

849
00:30:36,009 --> 00:30:37,390
just got he was just released.

850
00:30:38,009 --> 00:30:40,250
Most people would say, oh, just leave him

851
00:30:40,250 --> 00:30:42,329
alone. He doesn't wanna he doesn't wanna be

852
00:30:42,329 --> 00:30:42,829
part.

853
00:30:43,345 --> 00:30:45,904
But he was pushed, and he accepted that

854
00:30:45,904 --> 00:30:47,764
calling and and did great.

855
00:30:48,144 --> 00:30:50,784
And every individual has some strength. I think

856
00:30:50,784 --> 00:30:52,005
of Olivia.

857
00:30:52,544 --> 00:30:53,764
She loved to crochet,

858
00:30:54,065 --> 00:30:56,304
and she did a class in young women's

859
00:30:56,304 --> 00:30:58,420
where she taught everyone how to crochet, and

860
00:30:58,420 --> 00:31:00,259
she would crochet little things and give it

861
00:31:00,259 --> 00:31:02,420
to the other girls. And that helped her

862
00:31:02,420 --> 00:31:04,519
feel a connection, a belonging,

863
00:31:04,980 --> 00:31:06,740
something that she could give and not just

864
00:31:06,740 --> 00:31:08,660
have to always be always having to get

865
00:31:08,660 --> 00:31:10,660
help and always being the one that needs

866
00:31:10,660 --> 00:31:13,575
the extra friend, like, she's a project. She

867
00:31:13,575 --> 00:31:15,515
started to feel like she really belonged.

868
00:31:15,974 --> 00:31:18,375
Yeah. I'm curious. This is maybe a random

869
00:31:18,375 --> 00:31:21,174
question, but, like, obviously, we're talking about autism.

870
00:31:21,174 --> 00:31:23,894
Is it appropriate to ask somebody? Like, are

871
00:31:23,894 --> 00:31:24,714
you autistic?

872
00:31:25,015 --> 00:31:27,339
Or, like, is is that helpful to know?

873
00:31:27,339 --> 00:31:28,859
Or is it just sort of you perceive

874
00:31:28,859 --> 00:31:31,419
that and act accordingly? Or what thoughts come

875
00:31:31,419 --> 00:31:33,759
to mind? Every person is so different,

876
00:31:34,140 --> 00:31:35,519
but I think being

877
00:31:36,220 --> 00:31:36,720
direct

878
00:31:37,019 --> 00:31:38,159
is always

879
00:31:38,714 --> 00:31:40,095
a basic characteristic,

880
00:31:40,474 --> 00:31:43,375
and it's not not a 100% true, but

881
00:31:43,434 --> 00:31:45,755
individuals on the spectrum are very, very black

882
00:31:45,755 --> 00:31:48,255
and white, and they're very concrete.

883
00:31:48,954 --> 00:31:50,015
Feelings, emotions,

884
00:31:50,474 --> 00:31:52,015
they have a hard time understanding

885
00:31:52,554 --> 00:31:54,419
for the most part. And so if you're

886
00:31:54,419 --> 00:31:56,579
very direct and say, hey. I've noticed this.

887
00:31:56,579 --> 00:31:57,720
Are you on the spectrum?

888
00:31:58,179 --> 00:32:00,179
Usually, they'll say they'll they'll be real honest

889
00:32:00,179 --> 00:32:01,940
with you. You'll read some of the stories

890
00:32:01,940 --> 00:32:04,259
where they're embarrassed and it takes them a

891
00:32:04,259 --> 00:32:06,904
while to accept the fact, but once they

892
00:32:06,904 --> 00:32:07,404
do,

893
00:32:07,944 --> 00:32:09,544
then they do really great with it. There's

894
00:32:09,544 --> 00:32:11,964
other that they're very proud of it. There's

895
00:32:12,105 --> 00:32:14,105
I mean, that that they want that to

896
00:32:14,105 --> 00:32:16,744
be like, we talk about an individual with

897
00:32:16,744 --> 00:32:17,244
autism

898
00:32:17,704 --> 00:32:20,069
or it's an autistic person. There's a whole

899
00:32:20,069 --> 00:32:22,150
group that are like, that's my main thing.

900
00:32:22,150 --> 00:32:23,750
I love that. That's what I want. Others

901
00:32:23,750 --> 00:32:25,750
that are like, no. I'm a person that

902
00:32:25,750 --> 00:32:28,230
has this you know, we talk about disability

903
00:32:28,230 --> 00:32:29,990
specialists. A lot of people don't see it

904
00:32:29,990 --> 00:32:31,669
as a disability, and even that is a

905
00:32:31,669 --> 00:32:32,809
little bit of offensive

906
00:32:33,265 --> 00:32:34,865
to some of those individuals, and we need

907
00:32:34,865 --> 00:32:37,345
to be careful about that. But I think

908
00:32:37,345 --> 00:32:39,265
being direct is what is what I would

909
00:32:39,265 --> 00:32:40,785
be what I would do. As soon as

910
00:32:40,785 --> 00:32:42,724
my time as bishop, I had this clerk

911
00:32:42,785 --> 00:32:45,664
who was different and but he was very,

912
00:32:45,664 --> 00:32:46,164
like,

913
00:32:46,490 --> 00:32:48,330
he's very good with math and, like, focus.

914
00:32:48,330 --> 00:32:50,009
And he was, like, the best clerk I

915
00:32:50,009 --> 00:32:51,930
ever had during my time. I've I've never

916
00:32:51,930 --> 00:32:54,170
been so in order with, you know, all

917
00:32:54,170 --> 00:32:55,630
all things the clerk manages.

918
00:32:55,930 --> 00:32:57,609
And I'm like, well, I guess I don't

919
00:32:57,609 --> 00:32:59,609
know if he was autistic. Right? But he

920
00:32:59,609 --> 00:33:02,109
was definitely kinda different and maybe social

921
00:33:02,625 --> 00:33:04,144
dynamics were a little bit off with him.

922
00:33:04,144 --> 00:33:05,904
But, man, he was so good in that

923
00:33:05,904 --> 00:33:07,904
role. Yeah. I love that. And that's the

924
00:33:07,904 --> 00:33:09,924
thing. A lot of older individuals

925
00:33:10,464 --> 00:33:11,525
weren't diagnosed,

926
00:33:11,904 --> 00:33:14,384
but they they kinda know, and they might

927
00:33:14,384 --> 00:33:16,224
not know they're not gonna talk about that.

928
00:33:16,224 --> 00:33:19,029
But the younger generation, they they know exactly

929
00:33:19,029 --> 00:33:21,190
what's going on. But it like, you know,

930
00:33:21,190 --> 00:33:23,429
going back to you talk about those with

931
00:33:23,429 --> 00:33:26,329
autism are oftentimes direct and maybe their communication,

932
00:33:26,390 --> 00:33:28,230
maybe in a meeting, they came across as

933
00:33:28,230 --> 00:33:30,390
abrasive or, like, man. Like, you just said

934
00:33:30,549 --> 00:33:31,909
I can't believe you just said that. Right?

935
00:33:31,909 --> 00:33:34,215
And so sometimes I have that private conversation

936
00:33:34,215 --> 00:33:36,375
to be like, let me just understand where

937
00:33:36,375 --> 00:33:39,095
you're coming from here. Like because once that's

938
00:33:39,095 --> 00:33:40,934
established, I'm like, oh, yeah. Actually, I am

939
00:33:40,934 --> 00:33:42,695
on the spectrum or whatever it is. And

940
00:33:42,695 --> 00:33:44,875
it's like, okay. Well, now I I can

941
00:33:45,095 --> 00:33:47,335
understand maybe how you say things better, not

942
00:33:47,335 --> 00:33:49,559
because you're trying to be mean or offensive

943
00:33:49,559 --> 00:33:51,960
or overly direct. It's just the way you

944
00:33:51,960 --> 00:33:53,880
communicate, and that's okay. And you hit on

945
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:55,500
a on an extremely important

946
00:33:55,799 --> 00:33:58,859
issue in the ABA world. We teach routines,

947
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:01,424
and there's a lot of stories about leaders

948
00:34:01,424 --> 00:34:03,264
that taught the youth how to pass the

949
00:34:03,264 --> 00:34:06,464
sacrament and how powerful that was. But we

950
00:34:06,464 --> 00:34:08,545
call it scripts, and it's it talks about

951
00:34:08,545 --> 00:34:10,464
it in in some of the summaries of

952
00:34:10,464 --> 00:34:11,125
the chapters.

953
00:34:11,744 --> 00:34:12,724
When an individual

954
00:34:13,184 --> 00:34:16,179
is having social faux pas, and especially if

955
00:34:16,179 --> 00:34:17,619
you've had a little talk about it, if

956
00:34:17,619 --> 00:34:19,860
you pull them aside afterward and say, hey.

957
00:34:19,860 --> 00:34:21,699
This is what happened, and this is kind

958
00:34:21,699 --> 00:34:23,719
of how it was perceived, and that's why.

959
00:34:23,860 --> 00:34:25,460
Then they learn that script, and they don't

960
00:34:25,460 --> 00:34:27,219
do it again. And if you say this

961
00:34:27,219 --> 00:34:28,844
is how this is a better way to

962
00:34:28,844 --> 00:34:30,605
do it and maybe even practice it if

963
00:34:30,605 --> 00:34:33,244
they're into that, that situation will never happen

964
00:34:33,244 --> 00:34:35,885
again. But if somebody doesn't give them the

965
00:34:35,885 --> 00:34:38,125
script, they're just gonna repeat it over and

966
00:34:38,125 --> 00:34:40,364
over and over again. I mean, that's not

967
00:34:40,364 --> 00:34:42,210
what we want. We want to teach them,

968
00:34:42,530 --> 00:34:45,269
and the routines and the scripts at church

969
00:34:45,570 --> 00:34:47,570
are unique. That's not something they're gonna learn

970
00:34:47,570 --> 00:34:49,589
in an ABA therapy setting.

971
00:34:49,889 --> 00:34:50,630
It'll be

972
00:34:50,929 --> 00:34:53,510
from a parent, from an individual that cares,

973
00:34:53,889 --> 00:34:57,030
and most often, it's received very, very well.

974
00:34:57,250 --> 00:34:57,750
Yeah.

975
00:34:58,215 --> 00:34:58,715
Liberty?

976
00:34:59,175 --> 00:35:00,474
On this topic of,

977
00:35:00,775 --> 00:35:02,695
like, if you are trying to decide if

978
00:35:02,695 --> 00:35:03,755
someone has autism,

979
00:35:04,135 --> 00:35:04,795
I think

980
00:35:05,335 --> 00:35:07,494
in general, we should be, I don't know,

981
00:35:07,494 --> 00:35:10,055
as leaders, understanding of people who might seem

982
00:35:10,055 --> 00:35:11,655
a little different even if we're not sure

983
00:35:11,655 --> 00:35:13,809
of the exact diagnosis Cause sometimes it can

984
00:35:13,809 --> 00:35:14,710
be really invisible.

985
00:35:15,170 --> 00:35:17,409
One of the stories is about my friend

986
00:35:17,409 --> 00:35:18,550
Zacharias and

987
00:35:19,170 --> 00:35:19,750
he served

988
00:35:20,369 --> 00:35:22,929
a cross sliding mission. And on his mission,

989
00:35:22,929 --> 00:35:25,409
he sometimes had a hard time interacting with

990
00:35:25,409 --> 00:35:26,230
ward members

991
00:35:26,664 --> 00:35:28,984
because of his autism and different social things

992
00:35:28,984 --> 00:35:31,164
he had. But he told a story about

993
00:35:31,224 --> 00:35:31,724
how

994
00:35:32,025 --> 00:35:34,264
a member of his ward council brought a

995
00:35:34,264 --> 00:35:35,964
non member friend to a ward activity.

996
00:35:36,505 --> 00:35:39,144
And Zacharias and his companion didn't know that

997
00:35:39,144 --> 00:35:40,744
the person was a non member, didn't talk

998
00:35:40,744 --> 00:35:42,659
to them at all, missed it. And then

999
00:35:42,659 --> 00:35:44,199
that Sunday in ward council,

1000
00:35:44,659 --> 00:35:47,539
the leader brought it up and was grilling

1001
00:35:47,539 --> 00:35:49,079
the elders, was not impressed.

1002
00:35:49,699 --> 00:35:52,260
And it was so hard for Zacharias because

1003
00:35:52,260 --> 00:35:54,019
he didn't have his normal coping skills on

1004
00:35:54,019 --> 00:35:56,634
his mission, and he had a hard time

1005
00:35:56,634 --> 00:35:59,194
trusting members and trusting himself as a missionary

1006
00:35:59,194 --> 00:36:01,295
after that. And so I think even

1007
00:36:01,594 --> 00:36:03,054
like with higher functioning

1008
00:36:03,434 --> 00:36:05,934
people with autism and adults with autism,

1009
00:36:06,234 --> 00:36:08,315
that it might not always be visible their

1010
00:36:08,315 --> 00:36:10,654
autism, but we still should be understanding.

1011
00:36:11,369 --> 00:36:14,269
Another story with this is they're these

1012
00:36:14,730 --> 00:36:16,809
twins that I, that we have a story

1013
00:36:16,809 --> 00:36:17,309
about

1014
00:36:17,690 --> 00:36:20,650
and they were like pre stage, I think.

1015
00:36:20,650 --> 00:36:22,029
And they both had autism

1016
00:36:22,329 --> 00:36:25,085
and they went on a scouting trip, which

1017
00:36:25,085 --> 00:36:26,284
was kind of a big deal for them.

1018
00:36:26,284 --> 00:36:27,744
And they were camping and

1019
00:36:28,045 --> 00:36:30,385
made them nervous. These different things was tricky.

1020
00:36:30,525 --> 00:36:32,525
And so they really like to stay by

1021
00:36:32,525 --> 00:36:34,444
the center of camp, by the food and

1022
00:36:34,444 --> 00:36:35,344
the other leaders.

1023
00:36:35,885 --> 00:36:37,964
And they wouldn't go off with the other

1024
00:36:37,964 --> 00:36:40,160
boys that much. And one of their leaders

1025
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:41,680
had such a hard time with that and

1026
00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:43,200
would yell at them and say, get out,

1027
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,440
stop eating food, go spend time with the

1028
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:46,260
other boys.

1029
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:49,059
And it freaked the kids out. And afterwards,

1030
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:51,360
the boys talked to their mom about this.

1031
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:52,740
The mom talked to the leader

1032
00:36:53,135 --> 00:36:55,155
and she told me that it felt like

1033
00:36:55,375 --> 00:36:56,974
the leader thought that she was making up

1034
00:36:56,974 --> 00:36:58,734
excuses for a son and like, it wasn't

1035
00:36:58,734 --> 00:37:00,734
a real thing. So I think be really

1036
00:37:00,734 --> 00:37:03,375
sensitive in these areas as a leader that

1037
00:37:03,375 --> 00:37:05,135
we are listening to the parents, that even

1038
00:37:05,135 --> 00:37:07,179
if we're not sure what's going on our

1039
00:37:07,179 --> 00:37:07,679
understanding.

1040
00:37:08,300 --> 00:37:09,519
Yeah. That's really helpful.

1041
00:37:09,820 --> 00:37:11,579
And, you know, you talk about, like, that

1042
00:37:11,579 --> 00:37:14,219
missionary with just the social skills of

1043
00:37:14,619 --> 00:37:16,640
or social interaction with ward members.

1044
00:37:17,099 --> 00:37:18,940
I mean, just like all of us, I

1045
00:37:18,940 --> 00:37:21,675
mean, I imagine that, you know, I think

1046
00:37:21,675 --> 00:37:23,755
all of us experience as missionaries, you get

1047
00:37:23,755 --> 00:37:25,914
better socially. Right? You learn how to talk

1048
00:37:25,914 --> 00:37:27,434
with people you don't know and interact with

1049
00:37:27,434 --> 00:37:29,755
people and ask questions and so forth. And

1050
00:37:29,755 --> 00:37:31,535
I I would imagine, you know, they're

1051
00:37:31,835 --> 00:37:34,315
with practice, they obviously are learning things as

1052
00:37:34,315 --> 00:37:36,140
well. Trying to think exactly what I'm asking,

1053
00:37:36,140 --> 00:37:38,460
but just, like, obviously, we encourage them into

1054
00:37:38,460 --> 00:37:39,900
that. We can't just say, oh, well, they're

1055
00:37:39,900 --> 00:37:41,500
autistic, so they just don't do well with

1056
00:37:41,500 --> 00:37:43,180
that. So let's avoid those situations. I mean,

1057
00:37:43,180 --> 00:37:44,860
they will get better, but it's also not

1058
00:37:44,860 --> 00:37:46,320
that you're going to overcome

1059
00:37:46,780 --> 00:37:49,099
autism with practice. Right? That's not how it

1060
00:37:49,099 --> 00:37:51,674
works. And I'll just say, I've worked with

1061
00:37:51,674 --> 00:37:52,815
thousands of individuals,

1062
00:37:53,434 --> 00:37:53,934
hundreds

1063
00:37:54,394 --> 00:37:54,974
very intensely.

1064
00:37:55,835 --> 00:37:57,914
And with the help, kind of like the

1065
00:37:57,914 --> 00:38:00,414
example that I was sharing about social skills,

1066
00:38:00,714 --> 00:38:02,574
they can make so much progress.

1067
00:38:02,889 --> 00:38:04,409
And I'll just give a couple of examples.

1068
00:38:04,409 --> 00:38:05,849
You know, you work with a a young

1069
00:38:05,849 --> 00:38:09,130
child that has very serious challenging behavior, and

1070
00:38:09,130 --> 00:38:11,130
you just teach them. You give them coping

1071
00:38:11,130 --> 00:38:13,289
skills, and you teach them routines and and

1072
00:38:13,289 --> 00:38:15,449
how to persist at difficult tasks, and to

1073
00:38:15,449 --> 00:38:17,974
stay to stay on task longer and to

1074
00:38:17,974 --> 00:38:19,035
interact with others.

1075
00:38:19,335 --> 00:38:21,655
And pretty quick, they go from having this

1076
00:38:21,655 --> 00:38:23,894
full time aid to being able to be

1077
00:38:23,894 --> 00:38:25,655
in the first grade classroom or the second

1078
00:38:25,655 --> 00:38:26,394
grade classroom

1079
00:38:26,695 --> 00:38:28,775
without any supports. And we see some of

1080
00:38:28,775 --> 00:38:31,240
those stories in the book where, you know,

1081
00:38:31,240 --> 00:38:34,039
their parent would go or the disability specialist

1082
00:38:34,039 --> 00:38:36,280
would go with them. And if they are

1083
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:36,780
learning,

1084
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:38,920
if there's a little bit of knowledge there

1085
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:41,160
that's going with that, they're gonna pick up

1086
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:43,640
on that. They're gonna feel that the routines

1087
00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:45,375
and the safe place is going to be

1088
00:38:45,375 --> 00:38:46,574
church. They're gonna be like, I love to

1089
00:38:46,574 --> 00:38:48,094
go to church because we do this, this,

1090
00:38:48,094 --> 00:38:49,534
and this, and I know what I know

1091
00:38:49,534 --> 00:38:50,974
kind of what people are gonna ask me

1092
00:38:50,974 --> 00:38:53,074
and what the topics are. And

1093
00:38:53,375 --> 00:38:55,155
they can be very successful

1094
00:38:55,775 --> 00:38:58,255
and gain friends and feel the spirit. We

1095
00:38:58,255 --> 00:39:00,349
can't feel the spirit if you don't feel

1096
00:39:00,349 --> 00:39:02,050
safe, if you're afraid.

1097
00:39:02,510 --> 00:39:04,130
And we can create that environment

1098
00:39:04,590 --> 00:39:07,090
with education. Education is a huge piece.

1099
00:39:07,550 --> 00:39:09,869
Love it. That's really encouraging to hear. Let's

1100
00:39:09,869 --> 00:39:11,710
talk about maybe just, like, the different

1101
00:39:12,275 --> 00:39:13,974
like, autism at different ages.

1102
00:39:14,434 --> 00:39:16,195
And maybe you just give us a crash

1103
00:39:16,195 --> 00:39:18,195
course starting at nursery and let's go up.

1104
00:39:18,195 --> 00:39:19,635
I mean, who wants to who wants to

1105
00:39:19,635 --> 00:39:22,114
jump into that? Yeah. I think some of

1106
00:39:22,114 --> 00:39:24,515
it for younger ages, we've talked more about

1107
00:39:24,515 --> 00:39:25,015
the

1108
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:28,000
as young children in nursery and primary, a

1109
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:28,739
lot of times

1110
00:39:29,199 --> 00:39:30,960
more of the conversation in the book is

1111
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:32,659
about their parent that

1112
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,280
primary and nursery are different than the normal

1113
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:37,119
routines. And so it's hard for a lot

1114
00:39:37,119 --> 00:39:39,199
of kids with autism to be in those

1115
00:39:39,199 --> 00:39:39,699
settings.

1116
00:39:40,025 --> 00:39:41,945
And so a lot of times, it is

1117
00:39:41,945 --> 00:39:43,545
hard for the parent that they always have

1118
00:39:43,545 --> 00:39:45,545
to be there with them helping them. And

1119
00:39:45,545 --> 00:39:46,364
so I think

1120
00:39:46,744 --> 00:39:49,065
nursery and primary level, that's when we need

1121
00:39:49,065 --> 00:39:50,824
to think about the parent and have disability

1122
00:39:50,824 --> 00:39:53,224
specialists have extra resources for them so that

1123
00:39:53,224 --> 00:39:55,739
church can be an uplifting time for the

1124
00:39:55,739 --> 00:39:56,880
child and the parent.

1125
00:39:57,260 --> 00:39:59,500
Awesome. Anything you'd add to that, Robert? I'll

1126
00:39:59,500 --> 00:40:01,340
talk about young men, young women. Yeah. Let's

1127
00:40:01,340 --> 00:40:03,599
go there. There's a tricky transition,

1128
00:40:04,300 --> 00:40:06,780
especially with, individuals that are maybe a little

1129
00:40:06,780 --> 00:40:07,519
higher functioning

1130
00:40:07,994 --> 00:40:10,315
that they learn all of the routines, they're

1131
00:40:10,315 --> 00:40:12,474
able to interact with their peers, they're doing

1132
00:40:12,474 --> 00:40:14,574
pretty good, and then they get to be

1133
00:40:14,634 --> 00:40:16,094
11, 12, 13.

1134
00:40:16,714 --> 00:40:17,775
And all of a sudden,

1135
00:40:18,074 --> 00:40:20,714
what kids say isn't really what they mean

1136
00:40:20,714 --> 00:40:22,894
anymore. You know, they have a little conversation

1137
00:40:23,114 --> 00:40:25,829
about how somebody is really pretty or handsome

1138
00:40:25,829 --> 00:40:27,750
or whatever, or how they don't like this

1139
00:40:27,750 --> 00:40:30,069
teacher, and the child with autism goes and

1140
00:40:30,069 --> 00:40:30,889
tells them.

1141
00:40:31,510 --> 00:40:32,949
Oh, yeah. And then they get in big

1142
00:40:32,949 --> 00:40:33,449
trouble,

1143
00:40:33,750 --> 00:40:35,690
and then there's a lot of fallout

1144
00:40:35,989 --> 00:40:39,275
with that. And so when they are transitioning

1145
00:40:39,494 --> 00:40:41,835
into those ages, it's really good

1146
00:40:42,135 --> 00:40:44,135
to have if the adult can kind of

1147
00:40:44,135 --> 00:40:47,114
watch, and when those situations start to happen,

1148
00:40:47,255 --> 00:40:49,014
they can intervene. They can or they can

1149
00:40:49,014 --> 00:40:50,369
say, hey. Why don't you go talk to

1150
00:40:50,369 --> 00:40:51,969
that friend? Look at this activity. Let me

1151
00:40:51,969 --> 00:40:54,389
show you how it works, and help them

1152
00:40:54,529 --> 00:40:58,230
learn how to enter those conversations, those activities

1153
00:40:59,089 --> 00:40:59,589
safely.

1154
00:41:00,049 --> 00:41:02,130
It's just very powerful to have a little

1155
00:41:02,130 --> 00:41:03,029
bit of supervision,

1156
00:41:03,730 --> 00:41:05,509
and a lot of times the church part

1157
00:41:05,644 --> 00:41:07,405
works pretty well. By the time they're in

1158
00:41:07,405 --> 00:41:08,844
young men's, young women's, they can go to

1159
00:41:08,844 --> 00:41:10,844
class, they can pass their sacrament, they can

1160
00:41:10,844 --> 00:41:13,405
do those kind of things. And just there's

1161
00:41:13,405 --> 00:41:14,925
a story in the book about a young

1162
00:41:14,925 --> 00:41:16,704
man that blessed the sacrament,

1163
00:41:17,164 --> 00:41:18,545
and he made a mistake,

1164
00:41:18,950 --> 00:41:20,890
and he didn't wanna go back to church.

1165
00:41:21,030 --> 00:41:23,030
And so the leaders, you know, they were

1166
00:41:23,030 --> 00:41:25,990
really careful and and and reached out and

1167
00:41:25,990 --> 00:41:27,990
kind of helped, you know, some of those

1168
00:41:27,990 --> 00:41:30,789
issues that happen to to show love and

1169
00:41:30,789 --> 00:41:32,010
support, and usually

1170
00:41:32,375 --> 00:41:34,454
things work out if there's a little bit

1171
00:41:34,454 --> 00:41:36,534
of follow through. Yeah. And and it really

1172
00:41:36,534 --> 00:41:39,574
is sometimes in those nuanced experiences like blessing

1173
00:41:39,574 --> 00:41:42,214
the sacrament where it's like a simple, you

1174
00:41:42,214 --> 00:41:45,420
know, understanding of we you know, that individual

1175
00:41:45,559 --> 00:41:47,079
reads it once the best they can, and

1176
00:41:47,079 --> 00:41:48,599
we call it good, and we don't make

1177
00:41:48,599 --> 00:41:49,880
a thing out of it. Right? Or have

1178
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:52,679
them repeat it multiple times and just Right.

1179
00:41:52,679 --> 00:41:54,440
And, again, that's something that maybe would come

1180
00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:56,840
through discussions of things. But but those little

1181
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:58,360
things can go a long way or making

1182
00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:00,835
them feel safe or more making them feel

1183
00:42:00,835 --> 00:42:03,414
the routine more clear. It's huge. It's huge.

1184
00:42:03,795 --> 00:42:05,715
Yeah. And sometimes, you know, on Leasing Saints,

1185
00:42:05,715 --> 00:42:07,875
we you know, we're all about, you know,

1186
00:42:07,875 --> 00:42:11,155
dynamic and different leadership and trying new things.

1187
00:42:11,155 --> 00:42:11,655
And

1188
00:42:11,954 --> 00:42:13,839
and I can see that, you know, that's

1189
00:42:13,839 --> 00:42:15,280
something to be aware of. It's good to

1190
00:42:15,280 --> 00:42:17,199
try new things, but if you're shuffling the

1191
00:42:17,199 --> 00:42:19,280
deck every every week with, like, now we're

1192
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:20,500
doing this and that, and

1193
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:22,800
that can be very unsettling, I would imagine,

1194
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:24,880
for those on the spectrum. It would be.

1195
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:25,380
And

1196
00:42:25,784 --> 00:42:27,065
and if you're gonna do those kind of

1197
00:42:27,065 --> 00:42:27,804
things, just

1198
00:42:28,264 --> 00:42:30,505
some talking beforehand and some practice and a

1199
00:42:30,505 --> 00:42:33,085
little bit of conversation and a debriefing after

1200
00:42:33,545 --> 00:42:34,764
goes miles.

1201
00:42:35,304 --> 00:42:37,304
Yeah. Anything else with youth, or should we

1202
00:42:37,304 --> 00:42:38,789
move on to young single adults?

1203
00:42:39,190 --> 00:42:41,429
With youth, I think, like my dad said,

1204
00:42:41,429 --> 00:42:43,829
the social aspect is really important and leaders

1205
00:42:43,829 --> 00:42:45,210
can do a lot because

1206
00:42:45,590 --> 00:42:47,829
for people who don't have autism at that

1207
00:42:47,829 --> 00:42:48,329
age,

1208
00:42:48,710 --> 00:42:50,390
it's also a weird time to figure out

1209
00:42:50,390 --> 00:42:52,250
how things work, but the leaders can help

1210
00:42:52,514 --> 00:42:55,154
supervise to make sure that you with autism

1211
00:42:55,154 --> 00:42:58,114
aren't hurt. A few different experiences in the

1212
00:42:58,114 --> 00:43:00,755
book, kids at that age felt bullied at

1213
00:43:00,755 --> 00:43:03,014
church and didn't wanna go anymore because

1214
00:43:03,315 --> 00:43:04,835
maybe kids are just teasing me, but they're

1215
00:43:04,835 --> 00:43:06,755
actually bullying. I'm not sure, but they felt

1216
00:43:06,755 --> 00:43:08,969
that they were being attacked because it was

1217
00:43:08,969 --> 00:43:10,989
different in that way. And so

1218
00:43:11,449 --> 00:43:15,050
supervision, making sure that friendships work. I also

1219
00:43:15,050 --> 00:43:16,750
think being patient and flexible

1220
00:43:17,289 --> 00:43:18,590
with their different interests.

1221
00:43:19,130 --> 00:43:20,190
Like these

1222
00:43:20,605 --> 00:43:22,844
12 and 13 year olds that I talked

1223
00:43:22,844 --> 00:43:24,065
with, they still

1224
00:43:24,445 --> 00:43:26,285
wanted to play with Legos and talk about

1225
00:43:26,285 --> 00:43:29,005
dinosaurs and things that their peers didn't love

1226
00:43:29,005 --> 00:43:31,164
to talk about. But leaders can step in

1227
00:43:31,164 --> 00:43:34,160
there or disability specialists and connect with them

1228
00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:36,000
over what they care about even if it's

1229
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,340
not what most of their class cares about.

1230
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:40,340
Yeah. That's really good. Technology

1231
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:44,480
is just fantastically huge with most individuals on

1232
00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:46,559
the spectrum. They love the routine. They love

1233
00:43:46,559 --> 00:43:48,815
the video games. It's their comfort. It's their

1234
00:43:48,815 --> 00:43:49,714
coping skill,

1235
00:43:50,014 --> 00:43:52,494
and they might be playing roadblocks or whatever

1236
00:43:52,494 --> 00:43:55,295
it is right during class and have their

1237
00:43:55,295 --> 00:43:58,514
big headphones on and not seeming to care

1238
00:43:58,815 --> 00:44:01,190
or listen. Well, I worked with one young

1239
00:44:01,190 --> 00:44:03,909
man that literally turned his back to the

1240
00:44:03,909 --> 00:44:06,710
class and would sit there. And that's where

1241
00:44:06,710 --> 00:44:09,190
having a lot of communication with the parent

1242
00:44:09,349 --> 00:44:12,010
because maybe that's a win that they're there,

1243
00:44:12,309 --> 00:44:14,069
and maybe it's not. And maybe we need

1244
00:44:14,069 --> 00:44:15,210
to have different expectations.

1245
00:44:16,045 --> 00:44:16,784
But technology,

1246
00:44:17,485 --> 00:44:18,864
I've also been amazed,

1247
00:44:19,644 --> 00:44:21,344
especially 10, 11, 12, 13.

1248
00:44:21,804 --> 00:44:23,885
Child comes in with autism. He's playing a

1249
00:44:23,885 --> 00:44:26,125
cool game, and all of a sudden, four

1250
00:44:26,125 --> 00:44:27,885
of the other boys are sitting behind them

1251
00:44:27,885 --> 00:44:28,945
watching them,

1252
00:44:29,324 --> 00:44:31,909
and the teacher loses. And so there's gotta

1253
00:44:31,909 --> 00:44:33,289
be some conversation

1254
00:44:33,589 --> 00:44:34,889
about how that works.

1255
00:44:35,349 --> 00:44:37,509
It can be a powerful friend, but a

1256
00:44:37,509 --> 00:44:39,289
lot of times, you know, if a parent,

1257
00:44:39,589 --> 00:44:41,829
that's their that's all that's the only way

1258
00:44:41,829 --> 00:44:43,429
they can get their child there, and that's

1259
00:44:43,429 --> 00:44:45,130
the only way that they can be successful.

1260
00:44:45,695 --> 00:44:48,094
And so that's okay. And the disability specialist

1261
00:44:48,094 --> 00:44:50,175
learns all about roadblocks and talks to them

1262
00:44:50,175 --> 00:44:52,114
about it and and moves forward.

1263
00:44:52,414 --> 00:44:54,414
And there's a lot of other issues outside

1264
00:44:54,414 --> 00:44:56,994
of church that become very, very important

1265
00:44:57,375 --> 00:45:00,275
with all youth, but I think just understanding

1266
00:45:00,989 --> 00:45:03,230
that role in this whole thing is is

1267
00:45:03,230 --> 00:45:03,730
important.

1268
00:45:04,030 --> 00:45:04,530
Yeah.

1269
00:45:04,909 --> 00:45:06,130
Anything, with

1270
00:45:06,429 --> 00:45:08,849
YSAs and above? I mean, I guess YSAs

1271
00:45:08,909 --> 00:45:10,909
are as adult as, maybe a 40 year

1272
00:45:10,909 --> 00:45:12,829
old, but just just figuring out, I don't

1273
00:45:12,829 --> 00:45:15,724
know. Is there a different, you know, delineation

1274
00:45:15,784 --> 00:45:18,105
there? I think a big thing is what

1275
00:45:18,105 --> 00:45:20,585
we talked about before is utilizing their skills

1276
00:45:20,585 --> 00:45:21,964
and helping them get involved.

1277
00:45:22,264 --> 00:45:24,505
A lot of the hard things that came

1278
00:45:24,505 --> 00:45:25,864
with being a member of the church with

1279
00:45:25,864 --> 00:45:29,239
autism of the individuals I talked with is

1280
00:45:29,380 --> 00:45:31,699
the social aspect that they didn't know how

1281
00:45:31,699 --> 00:45:33,380
to connect with people. They'd go to church,

1282
00:45:33,380 --> 00:45:35,699
but they would feel kind of isolated or

1283
00:45:35,699 --> 00:45:37,780
not exactly sure how they should be. But

1284
00:45:37,780 --> 00:45:39,860
there's one mom I talked with, and she

1285
00:45:39,860 --> 00:45:42,199
got in charge of having playgroups

1286
00:45:42,500 --> 00:45:44,474
with other moms with kids in her church.

1287
00:45:44,795 --> 00:45:46,315
And because she did that, she got to

1288
00:45:46,315 --> 00:45:48,335
know them when she never would have otherwise.

1289
00:45:49,595 --> 00:45:52,635
And a lot also, they're brilliant, great gospel

1290
00:45:52,635 --> 00:45:54,555
teachers, and they could teach Sunday school and

1291
00:45:54,555 --> 00:45:56,875
be a big part of things if we

1292
00:45:56,875 --> 00:45:57,855
give them the opportunity.

1293
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:01,039
Awesome. I'm gonna add Yeah. The number one

1294
00:46:01,039 --> 00:46:04,340
question or the number one concern usually is

1295
00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:04,980
missions,

1296
00:46:05,519 --> 00:46:08,160
how that works. And there's some stories about

1297
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:09,780
individuals that went on missions,

1298
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:12,554
some that went for a little while on

1299
00:46:12,554 --> 00:46:14,894
a mission, some that served service missions.

1300
00:46:15,275 --> 00:46:17,355
Service missions has been a game changer for

1301
00:46:17,355 --> 00:46:19,755
this group. I mean, there's some special missions

1302
00:46:19,755 --> 00:46:22,554
like in the family history department and different

1303
00:46:22,554 --> 00:46:25,034
places where they just shine and they do

1304
00:46:25,034 --> 00:46:25,534
well.

1305
00:46:26,030 --> 00:46:29,150
And there's actually a chapter where the mission

1306
00:46:29,150 --> 00:46:29,650
president

1307
00:46:29,949 --> 00:46:32,609
gives some of his feelings about missionaries

1308
00:46:32,989 --> 00:46:34,769
that were on the spectrum that served.

1309
00:46:35,150 --> 00:46:35,650
And

1310
00:46:35,949 --> 00:46:37,329
a mission is so hard

1311
00:46:37,710 --> 00:46:38,849
because you leave

1312
00:46:39,224 --> 00:46:41,545
so many supports, and you're just kinda flying

1313
00:46:41,545 --> 00:46:43,945
on your own. And so if an individual

1314
00:46:43,945 --> 00:46:45,625
is in a place where they can serve

1315
00:46:45,625 --> 00:46:48,184
a mission or even a service mission, there's

1316
00:46:48,184 --> 00:46:50,425
so much that can be done to prepare

1317
00:46:50,425 --> 00:46:51,805
them in advance

1318
00:46:52,105 --> 00:46:54,045
for that. And then when they get there,

1319
00:46:54,140 --> 00:46:56,780
to have some simple supports in place that

1320
00:46:56,780 --> 00:46:58,860
just could make a huge difference in them

1321
00:46:58,860 --> 00:46:59,599
being successful.

1322
00:47:00,140 --> 00:47:01,500
That's great. I'm glad you brought that up

1323
00:47:01,500 --> 00:47:03,420
because that is a, you know, pivotal part

1324
00:47:03,420 --> 00:47:05,660
in our Latter day Saint experience is is

1325
00:47:05,660 --> 00:47:08,445
the mission experience. So really good. Anything else

1326
00:47:08,445 --> 00:47:11,664
as far as adults or anything like that?

1327
00:47:11,965 --> 00:47:13,184
We do have some chapters

1328
00:47:13,724 --> 00:47:14,545
of moms,

1329
00:47:14,925 --> 00:47:17,485
of older individuals that have been married and

1330
00:47:17,485 --> 00:47:18,224
then divorced,

1331
00:47:18,684 --> 00:47:20,224
and some of their trials.

1332
00:47:21,329 --> 00:47:23,910
On the positive side, usually these individuals,

1333
00:47:24,690 --> 00:47:27,329
they accepted the gospel of Jesus Christ. They

1334
00:47:27,329 --> 00:47:29,730
had the spirit of God with them. They

1335
00:47:29,730 --> 00:47:32,450
felt Christ changing them and helping them be

1336
00:47:32,450 --> 00:47:32,950
successful.

1337
00:47:33,329 --> 00:47:34,309
They talk about

1338
00:47:34,815 --> 00:47:37,135
feeling like they always God was always there

1339
00:47:37,135 --> 00:47:39,554
for them even if nobody else was.

1340
00:47:40,014 --> 00:47:42,094
On the darker side, if you're on the

1341
00:47:42,094 --> 00:47:44,034
spectrum, it's much harder to

1342
00:47:44,335 --> 00:47:47,135
maintain a long term relationship, and there is

1343
00:47:47,135 --> 00:47:48,114
a lot of divorce.

1344
00:47:48,599 --> 00:47:51,579
There's also you'll you'll hear the word suicide,

1345
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:54,200
and and a lot of the individual went

1346
00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:56,059
through times when they felt like

1347
00:47:56,360 --> 00:47:58,920
I don't belong. Why am I here? And

1348
00:47:58,920 --> 00:47:59,739
it was usually,

1349
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:02,220
either the the the gospel

1350
00:48:03,234 --> 00:48:06,215
or their children or, somebody that they loved

1351
00:48:06,434 --> 00:48:07,894
that they couldn't leave them.

1352
00:48:08,434 --> 00:48:10,434
And as and as a leader, you know,

1353
00:48:10,434 --> 00:48:12,914
as a former bishop, when those things happen,

1354
00:48:12,914 --> 00:48:14,835
we have to be prepared for that and

1355
00:48:14,835 --> 00:48:16,695
give them the support professionally

1356
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:18,460
that is required.

1357
00:48:18,839 --> 00:48:19,579
Really good.

1358
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:21,799
And one question that came through is, I

1359
00:48:21,799 --> 00:48:24,440
work with missionaries and some have autism. However,

1360
00:48:24,440 --> 00:48:27,159
it is not necessarily diagnosed prior to coming

1361
00:48:27,159 --> 00:48:29,000
in in the field. And what would be

1362
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:31,239
the best way to handle this? Any thoughts

1363
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:33,094
from your mind? I think some of that

1364
00:48:33,094 --> 00:48:33,994
depends on

1365
00:48:34,534 --> 00:48:36,855
how able to do the work the person

1366
00:48:36,855 --> 00:48:39,414
is. I think in some situations, if someone

1367
00:48:39,414 --> 00:48:41,335
is really struggling on a mission, they should

1368
00:48:41,335 --> 00:48:43,655
go home. But I also think that in

1369
00:48:43,655 --> 00:48:44,554
a lot of cases

1370
00:48:44,934 --> 00:48:47,594
that these individuals have a lot to offer.

1371
00:48:47,809 --> 00:48:49,329
My dad talked a little bit about the

1372
00:48:49,329 --> 00:48:52,150
mission president who talked about his feelings.

1373
00:48:52,690 --> 00:48:54,609
He I loved some of the things he

1374
00:48:54,609 --> 00:48:56,210
said. He talked about how as a new

1375
00:48:56,210 --> 00:48:58,070
mission president, he really struggled

1376
00:48:58,530 --> 00:49:01,170
because so many of the missionaries were coming

1377
00:49:01,170 --> 00:49:03,534
and they weren't prepared and they couldn't do

1378
00:49:03,534 --> 00:49:05,534
the social aspects or the teaching for a

1379
00:49:05,534 --> 00:49:06,594
lot of different reasons.

1380
00:49:06,974 --> 00:49:09,795
And included in that was individuals with autism.

1381
00:49:10,175 --> 00:49:11,695
And he was like, why are they here?

1382
00:49:11,695 --> 00:49:12,675
What should we do?

1383
00:49:12,974 --> 00:49:15,695
But then they had a zone conference where

1384
00:49:15,695 --> 00:49:18,255
missionaries bore their testimonies. And this missionary got

1385
00:49:18,255 --> 00:49:20,710
up and he bore his testimony and he

1386
00:49:20,710 --> 00:49:21,369
was really

1387
00:49:21,670 --> 00:49:24,070
honest and self aware. And he said that

1388
00:49:24,070 --> 00:49:24,570
he

1389
00:49:24,950 --> 00:49:26,950
couldn't have been there if it wasn't for

1390
00:49:26,950 --> 00:49:27,930
Jesus Christ.

1391
00:49:28,390 --> 00:49:30,329
And it hit that mission president

1392
00:49:30,950 --> 00:49:32,470
that that was true. It's true for all

1393
00:49:32,470 --> 00:49:33,930
of us, but it's really visible

1394
00:49:34,390 --> 00:49:36,914
with some of these individuals with autism

1395
00:49:38,094 --> 00:49:40,175
that he was giving all he could. And

1396
00:49:40,175 --> 00:49:42,114
just the fact that he was there was

1397
00:49:42,655 --> 00:49:45,934
such a missionary tool, such a testament of

1398
00:49:45,934 --> 00:49:48,659
Jesus Christ power, even if he couldn't I

1399
00:49:48,659 --> 00:49:50,500
mean, you talk about it eloquently or working

1400
00:49:50,500 --> 00:49:52,260
with members was hard or whatever his challenge

1401
00:49:52,260 --> 00:49:52,760
is

1402
00:49:53,059 --> 00:49:55,619
that his presence there was a testament of

1403
00:49:55,619 --> 00:49:56,519
Jesus Christ.

1404
00:49:56,820 --> 00:49:59,715
Love that. Alright. Any other if there's any

1405
00:49:59,715 --> 00:50:00,215
questions

1406
00:50:00,675 --> 00:50:01,875
you can put in the question box or

1407
00:50:01,875 --> 00:50:03,394
if you wanna raise your hand and unmute,

1408
00:50:03,394 --> 00:50:05,715
we'd love to hear from you. Britta, go

1409
00:50:05,715 --> 00:50:07,095
ahead. I actually

1410
00:50:07,474 --> 00:50:09,875
I'm kind of a discussion person, so I

1411
00:50:09,875 --> 00:50:10,375
just

1412
00:50:10,755 --> 00:50:11,405
had the need to jump in and confirm

1413
00:50:11,405 --> 00:50:11,525
a whole lot of what was being said.

1414
00:50:11,525 --> 00:50:12,775
I've been in inclusion,

1415
00:50:19,030 --> 00:50:20,010
therapist, and I've done

1416
00:50:20,390 --> 00:50:21,369
community inclusion for

1417
00:50:21,750 --> 00:50:24,809
about thirty years, but 21 really intensely

1418
00:50:25,190 --> 00:50:27,530
working with children in day camps and

1419
00:50:28,014 --> 00:50:30,275
swimming lessons and training young

1420
00:50:30,815 --> 00:50:31,795
camp counselors.

1421
00:50:32,335 --> 00:50:35,234
And then, obviously, I'm in a ward. And

1422
00:50:35,614 --> 00:50:37,135
it was all, like, one of my thoughts

1423
00:50:37,135 --> 00:50:38,894
was you said, what if you have one

1424
00:50:38,894 --> 00:50:40,494
in your ward? You're gonna have way more

1425
00:50:40,494 --> 00:50:42,230
than one. Even if you don't know you

1426
00:50:42,230 --> 00:50:44,889
have it. You have dozens of them being

1427
00:50:44,949 --> 00:50:45,449
neuro

1428
00:50:46,069 --> 00:50:49,109
atypical is probably more like a fifty fifty

1429
00:50:49,109 --> 00:50:52,089
split. If you want my perspective on it,

1430
00:50:52,150 --> 00:50:54,869
we've got all kinds of interesting people in

1431
00:50:54,869 --> 00:50:55,690
God's kingdom

1432
00:50:55,989 --> 00:50:57,050
and in the world.

1433
00:50:57,405 --> 00:51:00,525
Anyways, I love everything I heard. It rings

1434
00:51:00,525 --> 00:51:01,905
true to my experience.

1435
00:51:02,684 --> 00:51:04,605
One other thought that came to my mind

1436
00:51:04,605 --> 00:51:06,445
is that I would just sort of throw

1437
00:51:06,445 --> 00:51:08,204
out there is the ones that we think

1438
00:51:08,204 --> 00:51:09,025
are nonverbal

1439
00:51:09,565 --> 00:51:11,965
and society has decided they have a low

1440
00:51:11,965 --> 00:51:12,465
IQ.

1441
00:51:12,890 --> 00:51:15,130
I would say that my experience has taught

1442
00:51:15,130 --> 00:51:17,070
me that we should not make that assumption

1443
00:51:17,369 --> 00:51:17,869
ever

1444
00:51:18,170 --> 00:51:21,530
because they may actually be the wisest of

1445
00:51:21,530 --> 00:51:22,030
all.

1446
00:51:22,329 --> 00:51:24,349
And they're in a body that doesn't cooperate,

1447
00:51:24,824 --> 00:51:27,784
but their spiritual strength may be literally beyond

1448
00:51:27,784 --> 00:51:28,525
our comprehension.

1449
00:51:29,304 --> 00:51:32,105
And we might just need to view them

1450
00:51:32,105 --> 00:51:32,605
very

1451
00:51:32,984 --> 00:51:35,484
differently than they typically are viewed.

1452
00:51:35,864 --> 00:51:38,344
And, anyways, Liberty and Robert, I was just

1453
00:51:38,344 --> 00:51:38,844
absolutely

1454
00:51:39,144 --> 00:51:39,644
impressed.

1455
00:51:40,130 --> 00:51:42,070
I'll probably take a look at your book,

1456
00:51:42,449 --> 00:51:44,369
but I think this is the Lord's kingdom,

1457
00:51:44,369 --> 00:51:46,610
and this needs to be the safest place

1458
00:51:46,610 --> 00:51:47,989
for all of Galt's children,

1459
00:51:48,690 --> 00:51:51,890
period. And if nothing else happens other than

1460
00:51:51,890 --> 00:51:54,469
they know they're loved, then we've succeeded.

1461
00:51:55,074 --> 00:51:56,614
Great reminder. Thanks, Brita.

1462
00:51:56,994 --> 00:51:59,795
And any any other liberty or Robert, any

1463
00:51:59,795 --> 00:52:02,675
other point principle concept story? I just wanna

1464
00:52:02,675 --> 00:52:04,295
piggyback on what she said.

1465
00:52:04,594 --> 00:52:07,074
I have worked with with a lot of

1466
00:52:07,074 --> 00:52:07,974
different families

1467
00:52:08,355 --> 00:52:10,619
for years and years and years, and they

1468
00:52:10,619 --> 00:52:13,279
float around and I keep track of them.

1469
00:52:13,339 --> 00:52:14,880
And I I think that's a principle

1470
00:52:15,179 --> 00:52:17,980
in the church, especially when they get in

1471
00:52:17,980 --> 00:52:20,699
the young young adults, keeping track of them

1472
00:52:20,699 --> 00:52:22,159
and following them around.

1473
00:52:22,605 --> 00:52:25,025
And I've had very sacred,

1474
00:52:25,565 --> 00:52:26,065
powerful

1475
00:52:26,525 --> 00:52:27,025
experiences

1476
00:52:27,724 --> 00:52:29,025
with some of these individuals.

1477
00:52:29,644 --> 00:52:31,804
I'll just share one. I was working with

1478
00:52:31,804 --> 00:52:33,824
this young family, single mom.

1479
00:52:34,125 --> 00:52:35,804
He had broke his hips when he was

1480
00:52:35,804 --> 00:52:37,724
in kindergarten and had a cast on, had

1481
00:52:37,724 --> 00:52:40,090
all kinds of challenging behaviors because of it,

1482
00:52:40,090 --> 00:52:42,329
and he would click. And I just thought,

1483
00:52:42,329 --> 00:52:44,269
he can there's something here.

1484
00:52:44,570 --> 00:52:46,650
And I worked with him, and I I

1485
00:52:46,650 --> 00:52:48,809
remember one day I was we were working

1486
00:52:48,809 --> 00:52:50,730
and he I'd have him jump and I

1487
00:52:50,730 --> 00:52:52,764
pull him up. He's probably 10, about a

1488
00:52:52,764 --> 00:52:54,545
hundred and twenty pounds, a big, big kid.

1489
00:52:54,925 --> 00:52:57,244
And I'd say, just say jump and say

1490
00:52:57,244 --> 00:52:59,164
jump. And he did that, and he wouldn't

1491
00:52:59,164 --> 00:53:01,324
say it. And then about the twelfth time,

1492
00:53:01,324 --> 00:53:02,304
he said jump.

1493
00:53:02,764 --> 00:53:05,184
And for the next three hours,

1494
00:53:05,599 --> 00:53:07,039
I pushed him up, and I got him

1495
00:53:07,039 --> 00:53:08,980
to say jump about 40 times.

1496
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:11,599
And I remember driving home, and I couldn't

1497
00:53:11,599 --> 00:53:14,079
I couldn't hardly keep my hand. My arms

1498
00:53:14,079 --> 00:53:16,400
hurt so bad on the steering wheel. And

1499
00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:18,340
now he he speaks pretty well.

1500
00:53:18,764 --> 00:53:21,344
And I know that in the next life,

1501
00:53:21,484 --> 00:53:23,644
I'm gonna see him, and we're gonna look

1502
00:53:23,644 --> 00:53:25,804
each other in the eye, and our spirits

1503
00:53:25,804 --> 00:53:27,804
will know each other, and he will be

1504
00:53:27,804 --> 00:53:29,824
glorious and amazing. He'll be wonderful.

1505
00:53:30,364 --> 00:53:31,904
And I hope that

1506
00:53:32,300 --> 00:53:34,619
my part in that is acceptable to the

1507
00:53:34,619 --> 00:53:35,119
lord

1508
00:53:35,659 --> 00:53:38,699
and to him. Yeah. Absolutely. That's sweet. Can

1509
00:53:38,699 --> 00:53:40,219
I add on to that? Yeah.

1510
00:53:40,940 --> 00:53:43,420
Just as I was talking with these people,

1511
00:53:43,420 --> 00:53:46,239
it was such a sacred experience for me.

1512
00:53:46,385 --> 00:53:48,804
And I felt so much that God loves

1513
00:53:48,864 --> 00:53:49,684
these individuals

1514
00:53:49,984 --> 00:53:51,525
and he loves their families

1515
00:53:51,905 --> 00:53:52,644
so much

1516
00:53:53,025 --> 00:53:53,764
that they

1517
00:53:54,065 --> 00:53:55,284
have so much to offer.

1518
00:53:55,585 --> 00:53:57,025
I was also so impressed as I was

1519
00:53:57,025 --> 00:53:58,385
talking to them that so many of them

1520
00:53:58,385 --> 00:54:01,170
were really excited to get their stories told.

1521
00:54:01,329 --> 00:54:03,969
That this is an important issue. There's things

1522
00:54:03,969 --> 00:54:05,969
here they want to have their stories told,

1523
00:54:05,969 --> 00:54:07,329
and so I'm glad I could be part

1524
00:54:07,329 --> 00:54:10,369
of that. Yeah. That's awesome. Well, I I'm

1525
00:54:10,369 --> 00:54:13,089
imagining the books are available on Amazon. Any

1526
00:54:13,089 --> 00:54:14,530
other place you would send them if they

1527
00:54:14,530 --> 00:54:16,954
wanna know more about the book or about

1528
00:54:16,954 --> 00:54:18,735
any other resources you offer?

1529
00:54:19,035 --> 00:54:21,454
Yeah. It's on Amazon and Barnes and Noble.

1530
00:54:21,755 --> 00:54:23,695
Alright. Well, we'll look for it for sure.

1531
00:54:23,914 --> 00:54:26,394
Marty's got a question. Thank you very much

1532
00:54:26,394 --> 00:54:28,795
for this. It's a wonderful, wonderful thing to

1533
00:54:28,795 --> 00:54:29,295
discuss.

1534
00:54:30,090 --> 00:54:31,390
Much of what is said

1535
00:54:31,769 --> 00:54:32,510
is applicable

1536
00:54:33,450 --> 00:54:36,170
to other people who aren't on the autism

1537
00:54:36,170 --> 00:54:38,269
spectrum but have mental health challenges.

1538
00:54:38,809 --> 00:54:40,650
And as we look, you know, I look

1539
00:54:40,650 --> 00:54:41,710
in my own congregations,

1540
00:54:42,704 --> 00:54:45,425
I see that there are so many people

1541
00:54:45,425 --> 00:54:46,325
with challenges

1542
00:54:46,785 --> 00:54:48,965
that we need to look out and

1543
00:54:49,425 --> 00:54:52,085
watch for them and realize that everyone

1544
00:54:52,785 --> 00:54:53,285
needs

1545
00:54:53,585 --> 00:54:54,085
someone

1546
00:54:54,465 --> 00:54:56,789
to care for them and watch over them.

1547
00:54:56,869 --> 00:54:58,869
And that's why the ministering program, I think,

1548
00:54:58,869 --> 00:55:01,050
is so very important in the church.

1549
00:55:01,670 --> 00:55:04,090
If we rise up and do that work,

1550
00:55:04,469 --> 00:55:06,410
it can really change lives.

1551
00:55:06,869 --> 00:55:07,610
Thanks, Marty.

1552
00:55:07,910 --> 00:55:10,585
Alright. What maybe Robert, just let's, round this

1553
00:55:10,585 --> 00:55:12,744
off with what final encouragement would you give

1554
00:55:12,744 --> 00:55:14,844
to a group of church leaders who

1555
00:55:15,224 --> 00:55:18,025
just really wanna, you know, make church and

1556
00:55:18,025 --> 00:55:20,025
just their Latter day Saint life a a

1557
00:55:20,025 --> 00:55:22,619
positive experience for those who are autistic?

1558
00:55:23,079 --> 00:55:25,000
God is in the details. This is his

1559
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:27,079
church. This is his work. He wants you

1560
00:55:27,079 --> 00:55:27,900
to be successful.

1561
00:55:28,519 --> 00:55:30,760
And as you are humble, as you turn

1562
00:55:30,760 --> 00:55:32,940
to the Lord, as you listen carefully

1563
00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:35,260
to those parents, to those individuals,

1564
00:55:35,994 --> 00:55:38,255
as you just show some genuine interest,

1565
00:55:38,875 --> 00:55:41,534
use others in the ward. The Lord will,

1566
00:55:41,594 --> 00:55:43,195
I think, prompt you. And as you use

1567
00:55:43,195 --> 00:55:43,855
the hierarchy,

1568
00:55:44,315 --> 00:55:46,795
as you go to those individuals that are

1569
00:55:46,795 --> 00:55:49,295
closest to those in individuals on the spectrum,

1570
00:55:49,820 --> 00:55:51,840
that wonderful things will happen.

1571
00:55:52,219 --> 00:55:55,659
The Lord wants everyone to feel safe, to

1572
00:55:55,659 --> 00:55:57,920
have peace, to learn his gospel,

1573
00:55:58,300 --> 00:56:01,039
to accept Jesus Christ, to be able to

1574
00:56:01,179 --> 00:56:01,679
renew,

1575
00:56:01,980 --> 00:56:04,000
their covenants and partake of the sacrament,

1576
00:56:04,525 --> 00:56:05,824
And that is everyone.

1577
00:56:06,525 --> 00:56:07,025
Sometimes

1578
00:56:07,324 --> 00:56:10,065
the individuals that come, we are on trial

1579
00:56:10,125 --> 00:56:11,565
to see how well we're going to serve

1580
00:56:11,565 --> 00:56:13,804
them, as we just heard from Marty. And

1581
00:56:13,804 --> 00:56:14,304
sometimes

1582
00:56:14,764 --> 00:56:15,505
those individuals

1583
00:56:15,804 --> 00:56:17,550
have unique talents and gifts

1584
00:56:17,949 --> 00:56:20,829
that are going to save us. They're going

1585
00:56:20,829 --> 00:56:21,329
to

1586
00:56:21,789 --> 00:56:23,630
be put in places. And I I've seen

1587
00:56:23,630 --> 00:56:25,869
this over and over again over my time,

1588
00:56:25,869 --> 00:56:27,010
working with these individuals,

1589
00:56:27,390 --> 00:56:29,390
how you think I give and give and

1590
00:56:29,390 --> 00:56:31,704
give, and then they give things happen. The

1591
00:56:31,704 --> 00:56:33,545
Lord sets it up and you're just like,

1592
00:56:33,545 --> 00:56:34,045
wow.

1593
00:56:34,824 --> 00:56:35,324
Wow.

1594
00:56:35,784 --> 00:56:37,885
There's things there that that just

1595
00:56:38,264 --> 00:56:39,885
affect me in powerful ways.

1596
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:49,679
The end. That's it for this leading saints

1597
00:56:49,679 --> 00:56:51,679
episode. I encourage you to check out some

1598
00:56:51,679 --> 00:56:53,760
of the most popular episodes of the podcast

1599
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:55,440
that we list at the bottom of the

1600
00:56:55,440 --> 00:56:57,440
show notes. If you haven't listened to all

1601
00:56:57,440 --> 00:56:58,934
of those, do so now.

1602
00:57:10,055 --> 00:57:12,474
It came as a result of the position

1603
00:57:12,535 --> 00:57:15,550
of leadership which was imposed upon us

1604
00:57:15,929 --> 00:57:17,949
by the God of heaven who brought

1605
00:57:18,250 --> 00:57:21,550
forth a restoration of the gospel of Jesus

1606
00:57:21,690 --> 00:57:22,190
Christ.

1607
00:57:22,969 --> 00:57:23,949
When the declaration

1608
00:57:24,250 --> 00:57:26,590
was made concerning the only

1609
00:57:27,289 --> 00:57:29,690
true and living Church upon the face of

1610
00:57:29,690 --> 00:57:30,344
the earth,

1611
00:57:30,984 --> 00:57:33,164
we were immediately put in a position

1612
00:57:33,625 --> 00:57:34,204
of loneliness,

1613
00:57:34,585 --> 00:57:36,125
the loneliness of leadership

1614
00:57:36,933 --> 00:57:39,833
from which we cannot shrink nor run away,

1615
00:57:40,614 --> 00:57:43,094
and to which we must face up with

1616
00:57:43,094 --> 00:57:44,554
boldness and courage

1617
00:57:45,094 --> 00:57:45,913
and ability.