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Have you ever had a loved one leave

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the church and your relationship

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becomes awkward?

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This is so common and so sad.

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I got the chance to interview the Packard

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family who have been down this road. Cindy

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and Blair Packard are Orthodox believing parents and

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Josh, their son, and his wife have left

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the church.

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We came together to discuss their journey and

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it was amazing

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what they taught. They talked about the communications

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they regretted and how other siblings responded in

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positive and negative ways. They learned how to

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pick up the pieces again, express love, carry

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on, and build a beautiful relationship.

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This has become a favorite in the Questioning

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Saints virtual library.

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You can actually gain access to this interview

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at leadingsaints.org/fourteen.

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This will give you fourteen days to watch

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the Packard's interview and many others related to

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helping individuals

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who begin to question their faith.

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Go to leadingsafes.org/14

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and get access now.

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So my name is Kurt Frankem, and I

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am the founder and executive director of Leading

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Saints and, obviously, the host of the Leading

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Saints podcast. Now I started Leading Saints back

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in 02/2010. It was just a hobby blog

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and it grew from there. By the time,

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02/2014

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came around, we started the podcast and that's

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really when it got some,

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traction and took off, 02/2016.

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We became a five zero one c three

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nonprofit organization, and we've been growing ever since.

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And now I get the opportunity

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of interviewing and talking with remarkable people all

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over the world. Now this is a segment

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we do on the Leading Saints podcast called

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How I Lead, and we reach out to

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everyday leaders. They're not experts, gurus, authors,

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PhDs. They're just everyday leaders who've been asked

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to serve in a specific leadership calling, and

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we simply ask them, how is it that

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you lead? And they go through some remarkable

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principles that should be in a book, that

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should be behind a PhD. They're usually that

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good, and, we just talk about, sharing what

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the other guy is doing. And I remember

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being a leader just simply wanting to know,

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okay. I know what I'm trying to do,

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but what's the other guy doing? What's working

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for him? And so that's why every Wednesday

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or so, we publish these how I lead

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segments

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to share.

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Hello, and welcome to this episode of Leading

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Saints Today. I'm welcoming in Christy Wilwright Taylor

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who, wrote this book,

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Prepare Me for Thy Use. This is all

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about the mission years of Wilford

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Woodruff.

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As you know, there is a phenomenal

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organization called the Wilford Woodruff Papers who are

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taking all things Wilford Woodruff. Everything he wrote,

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received, sent, mailed, all of it, just like,

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you know, the Joseph Smith papers project,

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and they're compiling it. They're making it, searchable,

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and and so you can really dive into

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these,

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points of history. And part of that are

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books like this that Christie,

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so awesomely wrote, and it's published by Deseret

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Book, and you can find it there. And

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so I wanna bring Christy in. Of course,

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I love all things Wilford Woodruff. I actually

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interviewed her dad, Steven,

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Will Wright, and so we'll link to that.

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We tell some great leadership stories,

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from the life of Wilford Woodruff.

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And so,

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we we definitely talk about Wilford Woodruff here.

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This is kind of a bipolar

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episode, and that's my fault. Sometimes I wanna

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talk about Wilford Woodruff, and then Christy does

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a great job weaving in some Wilford Woodruff

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stories into her leadership journey as a stake

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relief society president. And that was, I mean,

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that's worth a listen itself,

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how she leads in Texas as a stake

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relief society president. And,

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just some, I mean, we, we get into,

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you know, talking to women about garments and

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temple recommends and talking about the tough issues

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in relief society and and why we should

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do that rather than just avoid it. And

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so really, really inspiring stuff. You're gonna love

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it. Here's my interview

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with Christy Wilwright Taylor.

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Alright. Christy Taylor, welcome to the Leading Saints

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podcast. Thank you. I'm glad to be here.

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Now you're, I have your book here that

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you sent me. Preparing Me or Prepare

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Me for Thy Use,

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Lessons from Wilford Woodruff's

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Mission Years. And,

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your maiden name is Will Wright, and I

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actually interviewed your dad, Stephen Will Wright, about

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Wilford Woodruff as well. That's right. And, I

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guess,

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what what's the connection to your family in

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Wilford Woodruff?

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Well,

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I mean, I'm not a I am not

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in Utah. I'm in Texas, but my parents

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are in Utah now, and so my dad.

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The Wolford order of papers started five years

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ago, and my dad started to get involved

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at the beginning.

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And so he was kinda pushing me

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from his end to get involved as well.

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And then our bishop here in Texas,

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he and his brother were involved, so I

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got I was I was getting some pressure

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from both sides.

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So I joined the project at its at

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the beginning, five years ago, and, my dad

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and I have both been on it ever

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since. He said he was only gonna be

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on it for six months. But

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Yeah. Yeah. So I think most people are

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familiar with the Joseph Smith papers, obviously, basically

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taking

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everything that Joseph Smith touched or wrote at,

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and, you know,

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organizing in a way that can be studied.

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Yep. And the same thing is being done

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through the Wilford Woodruff

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papers. Right? That's right. So, yeah, the Joseph

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Smith papers are obviously the gold standard of,

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you know, church historical documents like that. But,

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Wilford Woodruff, he's got about we've got about

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45,000

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pages on the website. You can see them

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all on gopherwoodruffpapers.org,

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and they're all searchable by

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people and places. And it's your the people

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are linked to FamilySearch, and you can

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find your own relatives,

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and you can search by topic and

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scripture reference and all sorts of things. It's

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really great.

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Because he really was the gold standard for

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journal keeping. Is that right? Absolutely. I mean,

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he had 31

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journals and daybooks. He kept records for about

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sixty four years.

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He's got about 30,000

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letters sent and received.

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Wow. Yeah. And I was, just reading in

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the introduction.

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Let's see. He was born in eighteen o

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seven. '18 o '7 and he died in

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1898.

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So he really

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his span

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really was the all of early church history.

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Yeah. And it just made me think, like,

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oh, he was just about the age of

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of Joseph Smith. And so if Joseph Smith

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would have lived his full life, you know,

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he would have maybe died around the same

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time that Wilford Woodruff died. Yeah. And so

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that's a lot a lot happened during those

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years. It's a lot of years. Yeah. Yeah.

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And I mean Wilford wrote a lot, but

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it wasn't really about him. It was about

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everything. I mean, he really cataloged just everything.

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Yeah. It's good stuff. And, so this is

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this book obviously about the lessons from Wilfred

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Woodruff mission years is are should we expect

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more and more of these types of books

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coming out?

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I I don't I don't know about that.

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You don't have to write them all, but,

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you know. But, yeah, this is his he

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served about seven missions in his first twelve

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years,

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before they

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the Saints headed west.

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So this is yeah. There's a lot of

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England in here and the United Brethren and

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all the discipleship

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that he learned, you know, in in training

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for his tenure as president

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during these mission years.

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So was there anything specific that led to

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a book specifically about the mission years? Or

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my my dad

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I helped my dad prepare a a conference

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talk for Wilfrid Ordiff,

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conference that we did a couple of years

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ago,

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about

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lessons in leadership, and that's what he talked

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about on your podcast when he was on.

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And,

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then I helped him write the article for

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Meridian Magazine, and that's on our website as

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well. And he kept saying stuff like, somebody

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should really write a book about this. And

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I was like, who are you talking to,

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dad?

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Yeah. So now there's a book.

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That's cool. And you're just trying to highlight

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as many of the fascinating stories from his

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his missionaries. Yeah. And if you read the

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book, it's mostly his words. There's a lot

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of his he's a great storyteller, very colorful,

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funny,

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really engaging. So it's it's a lot in

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his words.

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Yeah. That's awesome. Kind of an adventure story.

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And this is published by Deseret Book, and

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so it is for a general audience. Right?

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It's not just for Yeah. Geeky story. Center

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and Deseret Book. So, yeah, I think anybody

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it's not just for grand grandmas,

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or academics.

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Yeah. Yeah. And it'll be out on, May

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12.

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Awesome. Very good. Well, well, I definitely have

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to explore various ways we can continue to

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to talk about, Wilfred Woodrow's life and show

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the stories, but obviously, you know, there's so

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many that the book is a good place

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to go and to check out.

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But I also wanna invite you on to,

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talk about some of your time as you're

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currently serving as a stake relief society president.

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That is correct. Here in Texas North I'm

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in North Fort Worth. Yeah.

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Great. And is there a story behind you

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being called this to that to that role?

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I was released site president in our ward,

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and got, you know,

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borrowed from The ward. Into the stake

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about two years ago.

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Nice. And, do you do you remember anything

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from the beginning of that, like, just getting

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started in that role? I mean, sometimes we

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have these preconceived

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notions as far as what a stake, you

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know, stake leadership is like and what you

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do. But, what do you remember about just

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getting started? People live in fear of the

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stake calling. Right?

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Yeah.

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But,

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I remember being a little overwhelmed,

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but we've got a great state president,

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really supportive especially of the women. And,

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my sister's also a state courtly side president

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and one of my best friends, and so

268
00:10:20,664 --> 00:10:22,764
I had some I had some help.

269
00:10:23,705 --> 00:10:25,304
Yeah. Love it. So when you say your

270
00:10:25,304 --> 00:10:27,464
state president is supportive, I mean, what does

271
00:10:27,464 --> 00:10:28,284
that look like?

272
00:10:29,639 --> 00:10:32,279
He's well, he's always available to talk things

273
00:10:32,279 --> 00:10:33,179
through, and

274
00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:34,059
he's,

275
00:10:34,519 --> 00:10:35,019
very

276
00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:37,580
he's very interested in what

277
00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:39,399
I have to say in the women leaders,

278
00:10:39,399 --> 00:10:41,559
so the Stake Young Women's Stake Primary and

279
00:10:41,559 --> 00:10:42,620
Stake Relief Society.

280
00:10:43,914 --> 00:10:46,075
He gets us really involved in all the

281
00:10:46,075 --> 00:10:48,414
decision making and the meetings, and

282
00:10:49,835 --> 00:10:51,855
we really feel like we have a voice.

283
00:10:51,995 --> 00:10:52,495
And

284
00:10:53,035 --> 00:10:54,014
if we wanna

285
00:10:54,715 --> 00:10:56,394
enact some change, you know, you open up

286
00:10:56,394 --> 00:10:57,674
the handbook. And if it doesn't say it

287
00:10:57,674 --> 00:10:59,695
in the handbook, then we run with it.

288
00:11:00,529 --> 00:11:02,850
Nice. Love it. Is there anything specific as

289
00:11:02,850 --> 00:11:05,089
far as, like, change or adjustments you've made

290
00:11:05,089 --> 00:11:07,029
that, stand out over others?

291
00:11:07,570 --> 00:11:10,289
Well, we don't do stake high council speaking

292
00:11:10,289 --> 00:11:12,769
Sundays anymore. We do stake leadership Sundays. So

293
00:11:13,164 --> 00:11:15,565
Okay. We travel with the high councilors to

294
00:11:15,565 --> 00:11:16,044
speak,

295
00:11:16,845 --> 00:11:17,504
and we've

296
00:11:18,285 --> 00:11:20,845
trade off who speaks last so that it's

297
00:11:20,845 --> 00:11:22,365
not always the, you know, the high councilor

298
00:11:22,365 --> 00:11:23,264
speaking last.

299
00:11:23,804 --> 00:11:25,825
And I think that kind of visibility

300
00:11:26,285 --> 00:11:26,785
is

301
00:11:27,209 --> 00:11:29,769
great, and I think, the sisters in the

302
00:11:29,769 --> 00:11:32,110
stake appreciate seeing the sister leaders

303
00:11:33,049 --> 00:11:33,629
up there,

304
00:11:34,169 --> 00:11:36,649
getting to know us better. Yeah. That's awesome.

305
00:11:36,649 --> 00:11:37,389
That's great.

306
00:11:38,089 --> 00:11:40,110
And then how would you just describe the

307
00:11:40,485 --> 00:11:42,245
the church in in that area? What's the

308
00:11:42,245 --> 00:11:44,504
stake like as far as the the geographics

309
00:11:44,565 --> 00:11:47,684
of it and the different demographics? And we've

310
00:11:47,684 --> 00:11:49,384
got 10 wards in our stake.

311
00:11:50,004 --> 00:11:50,504
We

312
00:11:50,884 --> 00:11:51,625
go about

313
00:11:52,404 --> 00:11:55,044
thirty minutes either direction from where I am.

314
00:11:55,044 --> 00:11:56,990
So it's not I mean, it's not

315
00:11:57,290 --> 00:11:58,830
Utah, but it's not terrible.

316
00:12:00,009 --> 00:12:01,610
So we can get around to all of

317
00:12:01,610 --> 00:12:03,450
our wards and it's you know, there are

318
00:12:03,450 --> 00:12:04,809
there are a lot of Texans and a

319
00:12:04,809 --> 00:12:07,450
lot of Utahans really is probably the makeup

320
00:12:07,450 --> 00:12:08,190
of our

321
00:12:08,764 --> 00:12:09,264
people.

322
00:12:10,285 --> 00:12:11,184
Lot of families

323
00:12:11,565 --> 00:12:12,065
and,

324
00:12:14,044 --> 00:12:16,285
just growing really fast. I mean, we've got

325
00:12:16,285 --> 00:12:19,264
a temple going up in South Fort Worth

326
00:12:19,325 --> 00:12:19,825
and,

327
00:12:20,700 --> 00:12:23,820
hopefully, another one in McKinney coming soon. So

328
00:12:23,820 --> 00:12:25,279
that'll be three in the area.

329
00:12:25,740 --> 00:12:28,220
Wow. Yeah. So will it be just a

330
00:12:28,220 --> 00:12:29,840
a short ten, fifteen minute drive?

331
00:12:30,300 --> 00:12:32,720
No. Sadly, no. It'll still be about forty

332
00:12:32,940 --> 00:12:35,440
five minutes. Yeah. Okay. That's doable. Right?

333
00:12:37,575 --> 00:12:39,414
Awesome. Then maybe just talk to me about

334
00:12:39,414 --> 00:12:42,215
the, like, getting around to the different 10

335
00:12:42,215 --> 00:12:43,735
wards. Is that do you have a a

336
00:12:43,735 --> 00:12:45,495
routine? Is that something you do try and

337
00:12:45,495 --> 00:12:47,575
make visits there? Or what how do you

338
00:12:47,575 --> 00:12:50,110
engage with the wards? Yes. We're on a

339
00:12:50,110 --> 00:12:52,129
constant rotation. So I'd say,

340
00:12:52,750 --> 00:12:54,929
you know, part of the our

341
00:12:55,309 --> 00:12:57,070
I I talked to my presidency about, like,

342
00:12:57,070 --> 00:12:58,909
you know, what do what do we even

343
00:12:58,909 --> 00:13:01,445
do? Like, remind me what we do. It's

344
00:13:01,445 --> 00:13:02,625
a good place to start.

345
00:13:03,725 --> 00:13:05,884
And, you know, we really are want to

346
00:13:05,884 --> 00:13:08,605
minister to the leaders to and the Relief

347
00:13:08,605 --> 00:13:09,105
Society

348
00:13:09,404 --> 00:13:12,125
presidencies. So we are just on a constant

349
00:13:12,125 --> 00:13:13,904
rotation of visiting

350
00:13:14,445 --> 00:13:16,065
these wards. So we've got

351
00:13:16,950 --> 00:13:17,690
four buildings

352
00:13:17,990 --> 00:13:20,649
in our stake. Two of them are, like,

353
00:13:20,710 --> 00:13:22,950
quote unquote owned by our stake. So we've

354
00:13:22,950 --> 00:13:23,450
got,

355
00:13:24,149 --> 00:13:25,050
we can hit

356
00:13:26,149 --> 00:13:28,170
three wards in a Sunday.

357
00:13:28,629 --> 00:13:30,070
Mhmm. We have one building that has four

358
00:13:30,070 --> 00:13:31,670
wards, but I've never made it to four

359
00:13:31,670 --> 00:13:33,615
wards in a row. That's just that's like

360
00:13:33,615 --> 00:13:34,754
one of them I can handle.

361
00:13:35,375 --> 00:13:37,295
But we really are on a constant rotation

362
00:13:37,295 --> 00:13:37,875
to just

363
00:13:38,254 --> 00:13:40,095
be in as many war as war as

364
00:13:40,095 --> 00:13:42,575
in as many wards as we can all

365
00:13:42,575 --> 00:13:44,355
the time. And we feel like

366
00:13:45,350 --> 00:13:48,070
we've made it when they stop introducing us

367
00:13:48,070 --> 00:13:49,910
as a visitor in their ward, you know.

368
00:13:49,910 --> 00:13:52,070
Yeah. That's that's when we know that they're

369
00:13:52,070 --> 00:13:54,310
comfortable with us coming. Because we want them

370
00:13:54,310 --> 00:13:55,129
to feel like

371
00:13:55,430 --> 00:13:57,190
we're there we're not there to babysit them

372
00:13:57,190 --> 00:13:58,550
or to check up on them, but we're

373
00:13:58,550 --> 00:13:59,690
there to support them.

374
00:14:00,024 --> 00:14:01,464
And if they get to know us, the

375
00:14:01,464 --> 00:14:03,865
presidencies get to know us, and the sisters,

376
00:14:03,865 --> 00:14:05,485
then they're gonna be a lot more comfortable

377
00:14:06,024 --> 00:14:07,964
coming to us with questions and,

378
00:14:09,384 --> 00:14:12,504
you know, help letting us help them when

379
00:14:12,504 --> 00:14:13,485
they're stuck or

380
00:14:13,870 --> 00:14:15,470
need support or we try to tell them

381
00:14:15,470 --> 00:14:17,389
that we're their we wanna be their biggest

382
00:14:17,389 --> 00:14:17,889
cheerleaders.

383
00:14:18,910 --> 00:14:20,190
But to do that you just have to

384
00:14:20,190 --> 00:14:21,649
be everywhere all the time.

385
00:14:22,269 --> 00:14:23,950
Yeah. And then as you show up in

386
00:14:23,950 --> 00:14:26,110
an award, is there a certain game plan

387
00:14:26,110 --> 00:14:27,629
or something you try to accomplish? Is it

388
00:14:27,629 --> 00:14:29,975
mainly just being present, being their cheerleader? Do

389
00:14:29,975 --> 00:14:31,654
you try and meet with them after? Well,

390
00:14:31,654 --> 00:14:33,254
if we're doing a word conference, yeah, we

391
00:14:33,254 --> 00:14:34,315
meet with them after.

392
00:14:35,095 --> 00:14:36,855
But if we're just there on a regular

393
00:14:36,855 --> 00:14:38,715
Sunday, we just wanna visit.

394
00:14:39,095 --> 00:14:40,934
And it's a great way to see kinda

395
00:14:40,934 --> 00:14:43,350
what their strengths and weaknesses are, and it

396
00:14:43,350 --> 00:14:45,129
gives us a good picture of

397
00:14:45,990 --> 00:14:46,889
the pattern

398
00:14:47,429 --> 00:14:49,589
of the, you know, the health of the

399
00:14:49,669 --> 00:14:51,669
spiritual health of the sisters and the wards

400
00:14:51,669 --> 00:14:52,730
across the stake.

401
00:14:53,110 --> 00:14:54,629
And when we go to all of these

402
00:14:54,629 --> 00:14:56,835
wards, we can really see that pattern, and

403
00:14:56,835 --> 00:14:59,475
I think that helps the all of the

404
00:14:59,475 --> 00:15:00,615
relief sided presidencies

405
00:15:01,794 --> 00:15:03,235
to know that, you know, they're not alone.

406
00:15:03,235 --> 00:15:04,934
They're not the only one with this problem.

407
00:15:05,154 --> 00:15:07,075
Or let me tell you what this other

408
00:15:07,075 --> 00:15:09,075
ward is doing. Maybe this will help you,

409
00:15:09,075 --> 00:15:10,995
give you some ideas of, you know, how

410
00:15:10,995 --> 00:15:11,575
you can

411
00:15:12,009 --> 00:15:14,029
come get over this hurdle that you're facing,

412
00:15:14,570 --> 00:15:16,089
that kind of thing. And you just you

413
00:15:16,089 --> 00:15:18,250
don't know their strengths and weaknesses and their

414
00:15:18,250 --> 00:15:19,070
needs unless

415
00:15:19,690 --> 00:15:20,829
you're always there.

416
00:15:21,209 --> 00:15:23,209
Yeah. And this may be may be too

417
00:15:23,209 --> 00:15:25,424
on the spot of a question to just

418
00:15:25,424 --> 00:15:26,945
spring this on you, but let's see where

419
00:15:26,945 --> 00:15:27,504
it goes.

420
00:15:27,904 --> 00:15:29,664
Do do you tend to get sense, like,

421
00:15:29,664 --> 00:15:32,384
what are what are the different reliefsiding presence

422
00:15:32,384 --> 00:15:34,544
struggling with in their their role? Like, what

423
00:15:34,544 --> 00:15:35,825
are the issues that seem to come to

424
00:15:35,825 --> 00:15:37,500
the surface? Does anything come to mind?

425
00:15:38,299 --> 00:15:40,799
Well, we've got some issues with Unity.

426
00:15:41,980 --> 00:15:43,980
They want their sisters to feel more like

427
00:15:43,980 --> 00:15:45,820
a, you know, a ward family. And part

428
00:15:45,820 --> 00:15:47,820
of that is because our ward we changed

429
00:15:47,820 --> 00:15:49,899
our stake boundaries about eight eight or ten

430
00:15:49,899 --> 00:15:50,639
months ago.

431
00:15:51,415 --> 00:15:53,915
So some wards are still feeling that.

432
00:15:55,894 --> 00:15:57,415
So we talk about that a lot. I

433
00:15:57,415 --> 00:15:59,434
mean, there's always ministering, you know,

434
00:15:59,815 --> 00:16:02,295
ministering is working, it's not working. The interviews

435
00:16:02,295 --> 00:16:03,675
are working, they're not working.

436
00:16:05,750 --> 00:16:06,490
And just,

437
00:16:06,870 --> 00:16:09,370
and then there's always some teaching issues.

438
00:16:10,070 --> 00:16:12,870
And usually, the teacher the the really sighted

439
00:16:12,870 --> 00:16:14,090
presidencies don't

440
00:16:14,549 --> 00:16:16,950
bring up the teaching issues. That's something we

441
00:16:16,950 --> 00:16:19,269
notice just by being there. And we can

442
00:16:19,269 --> 00:16:20,870
pull them aside afterwards and say, did did

443
00:16:20,870 --> 00:16:22,605
you see how this kinda went off track?

444
00:16:22,605 --> 00:16:23,105
And

445
00:16:23,565 --> 00:16:25,404
you might think about, you know, you could

446
00:16:25,404 --> 00:16:26,625
address this or

447
00:16:27,084 --> 00:16:29,164
let me remind them about what it means

448
00:16:29,164 --> 00:16:31,084
to preside. You know, we talk about being

449
00:16:31,084 --> 00:16:33,164
a plant in the audience. You're you you

450
00:16:33,164 --> 00:16:34,605
don't get to just sit back. You are

451
00:16:34,605 --> 00:16:36,389
not off the clock once the lesson starts.

452
00:16:36,769 --> 00:16:37,509
You know?

453
00:16:38,769 --> 00:16:40,690
So if you're presiding, you need to preside

454
00:16:40,690 --> 00:16:42,209
and you need to right the ship or,

455
00:16:42,209 --> 00:16:43,889
you know, stick your hand up if it's

456
00:16:43,889 --> 00:16:45,190
going awry, and

457
00:16:45,970 --> 00:16:47,909
so we can see things like that also.

458
00:16:48,274 --> 00:16:50,434
Yeah. That that's great. And I imagine even

459
00:16:50,434 --> 00:16:52,595
if the the maybe the teacher is struggling

460
00:16:52,595 --> 00:16:54,434
or to get some participation and Yeah. You

461
00:16:54,434 --> 00:16:56,595
know, the teacher can help facilitate that. Yeah.

462
00:16:56,595 --> 00:16:59,394
For sure. Yeah. Anything else around the concept

463
00:16:59,394 --> 00:17:00,835
of unity? This is one of the principles

464
00:17:00,835 --> 00:17:02,914
you put on your on your list, because

465
00:17:02,914 --> 00:17:04,490
this is something that's on top minds of

466
00:17:04,490 --> 00:17:05,670
a lot of leaders. They're just

467
00:17:06,210 --> 00:17:08,450
stimulating unity. We want people to feel comfortable,

468
00:17:08,450 --> 00:17:10,289
but, you know, we want some authenticity there

469
00:17:10,289 --> 00:17:13,029
as well and Exactly. Anything comes to mind.

470
00:17:14,289 --> 00:17:15,730
Well, if I can tell a little Wilford

471
00:17:15,730 --> 00:17:17,250
Woodruff story, if that would be okay. Oh,

472
00:17:17,250 --> 00:17:18,930
I like it. I'm looking to leave it

473
00:17:18,930 --> 00:17:19,590
in here.

474
00:17:20,105 --> 00:17:21,884
In, 1887

475
00:17:22,904 --> 00:17:24,345
in the spring of eighteen eighty seven, it

476
00:17:24,345 --> 00:17:26,744
was clear that John Taylor, the third president

477
00:17:26,744 --> 00:17:28,424
of the church wasn't gonna be around much

478
00:17:28,424 --> 00:17:28,924
longer.

479
00:17:29,305 --> 00:17:32,505
And, you know, succession in the presidency hadn't

480
00:17:32,505 --> 00:17:34,940
gone very smoothly. Previously, it was three and

481
00:17:34,940 --> 00:17:36,940
a half years between Joseph Smith and Brigham

482
00:17:36,940 --> 00:17:38,779
Young and then three years between Brigham Young

483
00:17:38,779 --> 00:17:40,720
and John Taylor. And

484
00:17:41,019 --> 00:17:42,859
Wilford Woodruff was the president of the Quorum

485
00:17:42,859 --> 00:17:44,640
of the Twelve by this point, and,

486
00:17:46,684 --> 00:17:49,565
Heber j Grant was the a junior member

487
00:17:49,565 --> 00:17:51,025
of the quorum of the twelve.

488
00:17:52,045 --> 00:17:54,144
And Wilford knew Heber because

489
00:17:54,605 --> 00:17:57,565
Heber's dad, Jedediah Grant, was one of his

490
00:17:57,565 --> 00:17:59,325
friends from Zion's camp and all of these

491
00:17:59,325 --> 00:17:59,825
years.

492
00:18:00,269 --> 00:18:02,910
And so Heber j Grant came in and

493
00:18:02,910 --> 00:18:05,710
asked Wilford Woodruff in March of eighteen eighty

494
00:18:05,710 --> 00:18:06,210
seven,

495
00:18:06,910 --> 00:18:08,830
do we do you have to be the

496
00:18:08,830 --> 00:18:10,910
next prophet or could we just jump ahead

497
00:18:10,910 --> 00:18:12,075
to Joseph f Smith?

498
00:18:13,914 --> 00:18:16,315
And like, oh, that's kind of a question.

499
00:18:16,315 --> 00:18:18,335
Right? Like, you wanna skip me entirely?

500
00:18:20,075 --> 00:18:21,335
And he

501
00:18:21,755 --> 00:18:24,794
Wilford Woodruff was so gracious about the thing

502
00:18:24,794 --> 00:18:26,474
and his response. He wrote him a 10

503
00:18:26,474 --> 00:18:27,855
page letter in response,

504
00:18:28,610 --> 00:18:31,009
and he started off with, you asked me

505
00:18:31,009 --> 00:18:32,309
a question last time

506
00:18:32,610 --> 00:18:34,130
we met, which I was not prepared to

507
00:18:34,130 --> 00:18:35,650
answer at the time it was given. I've

508
00:18:35,650 --> 00:18:37,490
given the subject some thought and reflection, and

509
00:18:37,490 --> 00:18:39,170
now I feel prepared to answer the question.

510
00:18:39,170 --> 00:18:40,789
And then he goes on for 10 pages,

511
00:18:40,850 --> 00:18:42,289
and then he signs it, I remain your

512
00:18:42,289 --> 00:18:43,269
brother in the gospel.

513
00:18:43,890 --> 00:18:44,924
And And it's just

514
00:18:45,305 --> 00:18:45,884
so patient

515
00:18:46,345 --> 00:18:48,285
and gracious and sincere

516
00:18:48,585 --> 00:18:50,365
and just a real desire

517
00:18:51,464 --> 00:18:52,605
to help him understand.

518
00:18:53,464 --> 00:18:55,065
And so I I think of that a

519
00:18:55,065 --> 00:18:57,164
lot when we're talking about unity

520
00:18:57,545 --> 00:18:58,045
with

521
00:18:58,660 --> 00:19:01,059
our, you know, in the wards and with

522
00:19:01,059 --> 00:19:03,000
our presidents and in our presidencies

523
00:19:03,779 --> 00:19:07,220
about just being gracious and sincere and taking

524
00:19:07,220 --> 00:19:08,599
the time to really

525
00:19:09,059 --> 00:19:11,480
listen to what's going on.

526
00:19:11,934 --> 00:19:13,775
And I think that makes a big difference

527
00:19:13,775 --> 00:19:14,275
because

528
00:19:14,734 --> 00:19:16,095
nobody's gonna listen to you if you're not

529
00:19:16,095 --> 00:19:17,775
being sincere, if they think you're just in

530
00:19:17,775 --> 00:19:19,775
there to tell them what to do. Nobody

531
00:19:19,775 --> 00:19:22,095
wants that. Right? Right. Yeah. It doesn't get

532
00:19:22,095 --> 00:19:22,835
you anywhere.

533
00:19:23,214 --> 00:19:25,234
So, I mean, I think that

534
00:19:26,220 --> 00:19:27,200
those qualities

535
00:19:27,500 --> 00:19:28,720
can make a big difference.

536
00:19:29,740 --> 00:19:32,140
Yeah. I love that story. And and, I

537
00:19:32,140 --> 00:19:35,179
mean, Wilford Woodruff was just, an I I

538
00:19:35,179 --> 00:19:37,099
don't know if the expert's the right term,

539
00:19:37,099 --> 00:19:40,075
but he just he navigated some really tricky

540
00:19:40,075 --> 00:19:42,555
dynamics. Yeah. It was almost like as he

541
00:19:42,555 --> 00:19:44,634
was coming in, the church was sort of

542
00:19:44,634 --> 00:19:45,134
institutionalizing,

543
00:19:45,434 --> 00:19:47,295
right? It was it was becoming this

544
00:19:47,674 --> 00:19:50,095
this large moving organization.

545
00:19:50,555 --> 00:19:51,055
Yeah.

546
00:19:51,390 --> 00:19:51,830
And,

547
00:19:52,269 --> 00:19:54,109
you know, I just just the the stories,

548
00:19:54,109 --> 00:19:56,269
I I thoroughly enjoyed, you know, Saints volume

549
00:19:56,269 --> 00:19:58,769
two where it talks about just the the

550
00:19:59,150 --> 00:20:00,670
dynamics he had to deal with with the

551
00:20:00,670 --> 00:20:03,630
the polygamy issue and and, man, just some

552
00:20:03,630 --> 00:20:04,369
tough situations.

553
00:20:04,670 --> 00:20:06,744
Yeah. And you look back and, you know,

554
00:20:06,744 --> 00:20:08,204
his influence is obviously

555
00:20:08,585 --> 00:20:10,424
still with us and, you know, as as

556
00:20:10,424 --> 00:20:12,345
far as how we run and function and

557
00:20:12,424 --> 00:20:14,904
but even that succession those succession dynamics was

558
00:20:15,065 --> 00:20:16,744
Yeah. Was something that had to be figured

559
00:20:16,744 --> 00:20:18,825
out. And, he he did it, you know,

560
00:20:18,825 --> 00:20:20,105
I mean, with the help of others, but

561
00:20:20,105 --> 00:20:22,269
he had it he threaded that needle. But

562
00:20:22,269 --> 00:20:23,549
he was really clear that it was the

563
00:20:23,549 --> 00:20:25,789
unity with the other brethren that made all

564
00:20:25,789 --> 00:20:26,609
of that possible.

565
00:20:27,309 --> 00:20:29,150
Yeah. And now even today, that's a huge

566
00:20:29,150 --> 00:20:31,390
part of our leadership culture is that unity.

567
00:20:31,390 --> 00:20:33,329
Right? Yeah. Yeah. That's powerful.

568
00:20:33,710 --> 00:20:36,349
Awesome. Anything else around unity that, we would

569
00:20:36,349 --> 00:20:37,490
mention? Well, I think

570
00:20:37,924 --> 00:20:40,005
I don't I don't know if the sisters

571
00:20:40,005 --> 00:20:42,744
in the wards notice this quite as much,

572
00:20:43,444 --> 00:20:45,944
but I think the relief society presidents

573
00:20:46,325 --> 00:20:49,224
notice that we're on their team when we

574
00:20:49,924 --> 00:20:51,765
see it as our goal to make their

575
00:20:51,765 --> 00:20:52,505
job easier.

576
00:20:53,180 --> 00:20:54,079
So Yeah.

577
00:20:54,700 --> 00:20:56,319
We really try hard to

578
00:20:57,500 --> 00:20:59,579
help them find effective strategies and do some

579
00:20:59,579 --> 00:21:02,079
creative problem solving, you know, and,

580
00:21:03,500 --> 00:21:06,480
just make everything we do with them convenient

581
00:21:06,619 --> 00:21:08,225
for them. You know, we wanna do your

582
00:21:08,225 --> 00:21:10,785
training at your location on your timetable. We

583
00:21:10,785 --> 00:21:12,625
wanna come to you. We don't wanna make

584
00:21:12,625 --> 00:21:13,125
this

585
00:21:13,664 --> 00:21:16,305
harder for you, you know. The difference between

586
00:21:16,305 --> 00:21:17,825
a stake for the study president and ward

587
00:21:17,825 --> 00:21:19,765
for the study president really is how

588
00:21:20,190 --> 00:21:22,269
how many hours you're just in the trenches

589
00:21:22,269 --> 00:21:25,169
really. Mhmm. Yeah. That's true. With all of

590
00:21:25,389 --> 00:21:26,210
all of the

591
00:21:26,750 --> 00:21:28,750
little not they're not little, but I don't

592
00:21:28,750 --> 00:21:30,429
know so many problems and issues in the

593
00:21:30,429 --> 00:21:32,429
ward with so many people and the stake

594
00:21:32,429 --> 00:21:35,765
Relief Society presidency doesn't really get their hands

595
00:21:35,765 --> 00:21:37,684
quite that into everything else. But if we

596
00:21:37,684 --> 00:21:38,984
can make their job easier,

597
00:21:40,005 --> 00:21:40,744
and, you

598
00:21:41,045 --> 00:21:43,144
know, kind of anticipate their needs

599
00:21:43,525 --> 00:21:44,025
and

600
00:21:44,964 --> 00:21:47,525
get ahead of their needs really, then I

601
00:21:47,525 --> 00:21:50,700
think we're we're doing our job right. No.

602
00:21:50,700 --> 00:21:52,779
That's great. That's great. And and, you know,

603
00:21:52,779 --> 00:21:54,700
just communicating that that you're on their team.

604
00:21:54,700 --> 00:21:56,539
Right? Yeah. And and I think I I

605
00:21:56,539 --> 00:21:58,779
would imagine that, you know, there's there's a

606
00:21:58,779 --> 00:22:00,779
relationship there. Even if there's those moments like,

607
00:22:00,779 --> 00:22:02,059
hey. I I noticed something that they can

608
00:22:02,140 --> 00:22:03,740
you know, I'll give some feedback here. Like,

609
00:22:03,740 --> 00:22:05,440
they're more open to that when they know

610
00:22:05,634 --> 00:22:07,575
that you're rooting for them. Right? Yeah.

611
00:22:08,115 --> 00:22:09,954
And part of that is, like, I mean,

612
00:22:09,954 --> 00:22:12,454
advocating for their needs. So whatever

613
00:22:13,154 --> 00:22:14,615
whatever their needs are,

614
00:22:15,234 --> 00:22:17,654
I want them to know that our presidency

615
00:22:17,714 --> 00:22:19,714
is gonna speak up for them in state

616
00:22:19,714 --> 00:22:20,934
council or

617
00:22:21,529 --> 00:22:23,289
with their high councilor in their ward or

618
00:22:23,289 --> 00:22:24,970
with their bishop if I need to intervene

619
00:22:24,970 --> 00:22:26,349
or whatever it is that

620
00:22:27,369 --> 00:22:29,849
that I'm gonna follow through on what they

621
00:22:29,849 --> 00:22:31,609
need and then I'll report back so they

622
00:22:31,609 --> 00:22:34,335
know that I didn't just drop them. Yeah.

623
00:22:34,335 --> 00:22:35,394
That's really good.

624
00:22:35,775 --> 00:22:38,434
This next one's, I'm I'm intrigued. The foster

625
00:22:38,654 --> 00:22:39,795
doctrinal confidence.

626
00:22:40,174 --> 00:22:41,075
Tell me more.

627
00:22:42,255 --> 00:22:44,734
We talk about this a lot lately in

628
00:22:44,734 --> 00:22:45,474
our stake,

629
00:22:46,599 --> 00:22:47,799
and I think there are a few parts

630
00:22:47,799 --> 00:22:49,579
to it. First of all, I think it's

631
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:51,419
under and I think

632
00:22:51,799 --> 00:22:54,119
this is important for everybody, but for women

633
00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:54,619
especially,

634
00:22:55,079 --> 00:22:55,579
understanding

635
00:22:57,559 --> 00:22:59,419
Christ's doctrine and your

636
00:23:00,194 --> 00:23:02,674
priesthood authority. I think that gives you the

637
00:23:02,674 --> 00:23:05,315
confidence to act as a leader, a woman

638
00:23:05,315 --> 00:23:06,294
leader in the church.

639
00:23:06,835 --> 00:23:09,075
And I think we actually talk about it

640
00:23:09,075 --> 00:23:10,674
more than we think we do, we just

641
00:23:10,674 --> 00:23:11,974
don't call it

642
00:23:12,299 --> 00:23:15,120
priesthood authority. You know, you're delegated priesthood authority

643
00:23:15,740 --> 00:23:17,580
from your calling and you're sustained in your

644
00:23:17,580 --> 00:23:18,080
calling,

645
00:23:19,420 --> 00:23:21,100
and we talk a lot about, you know,

646
00:23:21,100 --> 00:23:23,259
you have a stewardship or you are sustained

647
00:23:23,259 --> 00:23:25,019
to do this. But if we actually label

648
00:23:25,019 --> 00:23:26,240
it as

649
00:23:26,644 --> 00:23:28,984
this is your delegated priesthood authority,

650
00:23:29,684 --> 00:23:31,384
it gives the sisters

651
00:23:31,924 --> 00:23:34,484
a lot more confidence to feel like, oh,

652
00:23:34,484 --> 00:23:36,244
well then, in that case, I think I

653
00:23:36,244 --> 00:23:38,325
can do this. I mean, and and even

654
00:23:38,325 --> 00:23:40,640
with ministering assignments, you know, in the handbook,

655
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,460
it says priesthood authority is delegated to members

656
00:23:43,599 --> 00:23:45,700
to serve as ministering brothers and sisters.

657
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,339
And so we bring that up a lot

658
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:48,980
with

659
00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:51,920
in our training and when we visit wards

660
00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:53,680
and stuff when they say, well, we're having

661
00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:56,054
a problem with sisters who, you know, they're

662
00:23:56,054 --> 00:23:57,575
nervous to go and knock on a strange

663
00:23:57,575 --> 00:23:59,734
door or to get to know someone that

664
00:23:59,734 --> 00:24:00,954
they haven't met before.

665
00:24:01,255 --> 00:24:03,494
And we remind them, well, remind them that

666
00:24:03,494 --> 00:24:04,315
this is their

667
00:24:04,694 --> 00:24:06,694
they have they have priesthood authority to do

668
00:24:06,694 --> 00:24:08,634
this. And and usually,

669
00:24:09,630 --> 00:24:11,710
they think, oh oh I never thought about

670
00:24:11,710 --> 00:24:13,009
it like that, you know.

671
00:24:13,549 --> 00:24:15,250
And if they can

672
00:24:16,910 --> 00:24:19,170
verbalize it kind of in those terms,

673
00:24:19,710 --> 00:24:21,809
I think it really gives them the confidence

674
00:24:21,869 --> 00:24:22,690
to do that.

675
00:24:23,755 --> 00:24:25,275
And then I you know, the other part

676
00:24:25,275 --> 00:24:27,295
of that is just that understanding

677
00:24:27,674 --> 00:24:28,575
Christ doctrine

678
00:24:29,355 --> 00:24:31,295
is a protection to the sisters.

679
00:24:31,835 --> 00:24:34,474
Mhmm. You know, people at least around here,

680
00:24:34,474 --> 00:24:36,494
the people that we talk to that have

681
00:24:36,929 --> 00:24:38,549
doubts or a faith crisis,

682
00:24:38,849 --> 00:24:40,929
they don't have a problem with Jesus so

683
00:24:40,929 --> 00:24:42,690
much. They have a problem with the people

684
00:24:42,690 --> 00:24:45,730
or the practices or the policies. You know,

685
00:24:45,730 --> 00:24:46,710
Jesus is good.

686
00:24:47,089 --> 00:24:48,230
It's everything else.

687
00:24:49,009 --> 00:24:51,429
So if we can focus more on

688
00:24:52,275 --> 00:24:53,174
Christ doctrine,

689
00:24:54,195 --> 00:24:56,535
that really acts as greater protection

690
00:24:57,315 --> 00:24:59,654
for them. And if they can realize, oh,

691
00:24:59,795 --> 00:25:02,275
this is culture this part's culture, this part's

692
00:25:02,275 --> 00:25:04,355
doctrine. And if I can separate those a

693
00:25:04,355 --> 00:25:06,035
little bit, then I'm okay with some of

694
00:25:06,035 --> 00:25:06,535
the

695
00:25:06,980 --> 00:25:09,220
the sticky parts of the doctrine or I

696
00:25:09,220 --> 00:25:11,220
mean, the sticky parts of the practice or

697
00:25:11,220 --> 00:25:13,220
the people that are bothering me because I'm

698
00:25:13,220 --> 00:25:14,920
good with I'm good with Jesus.

699
00:25:15,460 --> 00:25:17,619
Yeah. And does that typically come out through,

700
00:25:17,619 --> 00:25:19,799
like, lesson plans or, like, they're

701
00:25:20,174 --> 00:25:22,835
focusing more on the those core doctrines

702
00:25:23,215 --> 00:25:25,295
in in the lesson setting or Yeah. So

703
00:25:25,295 --> 00:25:26,015
we try to,

704
00:25:26,975 --> 00:25:27,475
emphasize

705
00:25:28,174 --> 00:25:30,434
a couple of things. Well, first of all,

706
00:25:30,575 --> 00:25:32,674
that when you're studying the scriptures

707
00:25:32,975 --> 00:25:33,475
or

708
00:25:34,140 --> 00:25:34,880
church history,

709
00:25:36,380 --> 00:25:38,460
figure out how it applies to you. You

710
00:25:38,460 --> 00:25:40,539
know, where are you in this story? And

711
00:25:40,539 --> 00:25:42,059
we get it all through church history, you

712
00:25:42,059 --> 00:25:43,599
know, Joseph in,

713
00:25:44,460 --> 00:25:46,380
the Sacred Grove, you know, he calls him

714
00:25:46,380 --> 00:25:48,224
Joseph my son. I mean, all throughout the

715
00:25:48,224 --> 00:25:50,565
scriptures, Alma, Enos, they call him by name.

716
00:25:51,904 --> 00:25:53,424
And this here in the Doctrine and Covenants,

717
00:25:53,424 --> 00:25:56,144
you know, Oliver, Peter, John, everybody, call him

718
00:25:56,144 --> 00:25:58,224
by name. So figure out where you are

719
00:25:58,224 --> 00:26:00,164
in the story because if

720
00:26:00,740 --> 00:26:03,299
if Christ is speaking to them, he's also

721
00:26:03,299 --> 00:26:04,359
speaking to you.

722
00:26:04,740 --> 00:26:06,580
So we point, you know, be a little

723
00:26:06,580 --> 00:26:09,160
bit more intentional about pointing that out. But

724
00:26:09,220 --> 00:26:10,359
in general, just

725
00:26:10,980 --> 00:26:13,220
get to Jesus faster in the lesson or

726
00:26:13,220 --> 00:26:15,365
in your testimony or in your talk. You

727
00:26:15,365 --> 00:26:16,585
know? Don't spend

728
00:26:17,125 --> 00:26:18,025
half the lesson

729
00:26:18,884 --> 00:26:21,205
on the other stories and stuff. But if

730
00:26:21,205 --> 00:26:23,445
you hit them hit hit straight from the

731
00:26:23,445 --> 00:26:25,225
start, you know, with the scripture or

732
00:26:25,845 --> 00:26:27,605
this is what president Nelson has to say

733
00:26:27,605 --> 00:26:29,009
about this or this is

734
00:26:29,570 --> 00:26:31,509
straight to straight to the Jesus part,

735
00:26:32,690 --> 00:26:35,170
it kinda colors the rest of the lesson

736
00:26:35,170 --> 00:26:35,990
and you don't

737
00:26:36,369 --> 00:26:38,630
get quite as distracted by the other stuff.

738
00:26:39,009 --> 00:26:41,170
Yeah. And this is good practice especially in

739
00:26:41,170 --> 00:26:43,434
a doctrine covenants here, right, where, you know,

740
00:26:43,434 --> 00:26:44,715
there's a lot of stories there. There's a

741
00:26:44,715 --> 00:26:45,994
lot of history there, and there's a lot

742
00:26:45,994 --> 00:26:48,875
to discuss and share and people and characters,

743
00:26:48,875 --> 00:26:50,315
you know, in the eighteen hundreds to talk

744
00:26:50,315 --> 00:26:52,715
about. Yeah. But you can also get to

745
00:26:52,715 --> 00:26:53,775
those those core

746
00:26:54,234 --> 00:26:54,734
Christ

747
00:26:55,115 --> 00:26:57,355
centered doctrines. Right? And well and and Doctrine

748
00:26:57,355 --> 00:26:59,769
and Covenants can sometimes feel a little bit

749
00:26:59,769 --> 00:27:02,170
administrative. You know? Mhmm. There's a lot of

750
00:27:02,250 --> 00:27:04,890
these sound like meetings of my last, you

751
00:27:04,890 --> 00:27:06,990
know, minutes from my last meeting or whatever.

752
00:27:07,450 --> 00:27:08,509
But if you can

753
00:27:08,809 --> 00:27:11,369
focus in on, you know, what what this

754
00:27:11,369 --> 00:27:13,644
actually meant to them and what it means

755
00:27:13,644 --> 00:27:14,545
to me and

756
00:27:15,085 --> 00:27:15,585
and

757
00:27:16,365 --> 00:27:18,525
it make it more personal and applicable to

758
00:27:18,525 --> 00:27:19,025
you.

759
00:27:19,565 --> 00:27:21,565
Really good. Really good. Anything else as as

760
00:27:21,565 --> 00:27:22,464
far as the

761
00:27:22,924 --> 00:27:24,625
the fostering doctrinal confidence?

762
00:27:26,390 --> 00:27:28,069
Well, this goes back to the unity a

763
00:27:28,069 --> 00:27:28,809
little bit,

764
00:27:29,429 --> 00:27:31,589
that, you know, you think

765
00:27:32,309 --> 00:27:34,549
how do you build unity in award? Is

766
00:27:34,549 --> 00:27:36,710
it from get to know you games and

767
00:27:36,710 --> 00:27:37,210
socializing?

768
00:27:38,230 --> 00:27:40,569
And, sure, you want everybody to

769
00:27:41,355 --> 00:27:42,795
get to know each other and things like

770
00:27:42,795 --> 00:27:43,615
that, but

771
00:27:43,994 --> 00:27:46,174
when you're in a lesson on Sunday,

772
00:27:46,795 --> 00:27:48,974
what really is gonna bring them together is

773
00:27:49,515 --> 00:27:51,454
sincere testimonies and witnessing

774
00:27:52,234 --> 00:27:53,775
of the savior in the lesson.

775
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:56,059
So if you can open up the discussion

776
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:58,220
like that and get some real

777
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,539
honest and vulnerable and

778
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:01,660
sincere

779
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:04,059
testimonies and love of the savior,

780
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:05,339
the sisters

781
00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:06,619
really

782
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,875
responded that well. And they they love the

783
00:28:09,875 --> 00:28:12,835
sister who shares something like that. And it

784
00:28:12,835 --> 00:28:13,734
really brings

785
00:28:14,755 --> 00:28:15,974
that Relief Society

786
00:28:16,755 --> 00:28:19,474
lesson, the people in that lesson together. Yeah.

787
00:28:19,474 --> 00:28:21,554
That's that's great. Because we do kinda default

788
00:28:21,554 --> 00:28:22,774
there. Right? So the socializing

789
00:28:23,234 --> 00:28:24,590
to to build unity. Like, oh, we just

790
00:28:24,590 --> 00:28:25,970
need to get together and talk more.

791
00:28:26,750 --> 00:28:28,190
But I think when we get together and

792
00:28:28,190 --> 00:28:30,910
witness more, you know, there's a natural bonding

793
00:28:30,910 --> 00:28:31,410
element

794
00:28:31,789 --> 00:28:33,710
in that ex in that exercise. Yeah. I

795
00:28:33,710 --> 00:28:35,730
mean, you can't really argue with someone's testimony.

796
00:28:35,870 --> 00:28:37,470
You know? I mean, you can argue with

797
00:28:37,470 --> 00:28:39,115
lots of other things that they might have

798
00:28:39,115 --> 00:28:40,794
to say, but you can't really argue with

799
00:28:40,794 --> 00:28:43,694
the sincerity of their witness of the savior.

800
00:28:44,634 --> 00:28:45,694
Yeah. That's fantastic.

801
00:28:46,075 --> 00:28:48,154
Yeah. Anything else we're missing as far as

802
00:28:48,154 --> 00:28:49,454
the the confidence part?

803
00:28:49,835 --> 00:28:52,734
Well, I do really appreciate this quote from,

804
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,140
elder Uchtdorf in his last conference talk.

805
00:28:56,519 --> 00:28:58,119
He says, if you are uncertain about a

806
00:28:58,119 --> 00:29:00,840
particular doctrine or practice or element of church

807
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,799
history, seek clarity with faith in Jesus Christ.

808
00:29:03,799 --> 00:29:04,779
Seek to understand

809
00:29:05,174 --> 00:29:07,815
his sacrifice for you, his love for you,

810
00:29:07,815 --> 00:29:09,115
his will for you.

811
00:29:09,575 --> 00:29:11,674
And I love that he points out doctrine

812
00:29:11,815 --> 00:29:12,634
and practice

813
00:29:12,934 --> 00:29:14,075
and church history

814
00:29:14,455 --> 00:29:16,695
and that all of those things apply to

815
00:29:16,695 --> 00:29:18,235
you. Yeah. Not,

816
00:29:18,615 --> 00:29:19,355
you know,

817
00:29:20,069 --> 00:29:20,569
understanding

818
00:29:20,869 --> 00:29:21,769
church history

819
00:29:22,309 --> 00:29:25,269
and the scriptures and Christ doctrine can only

820
00:29:25,269 --> 00:29:27,429
make you stronger. You know, you sometimes worry

821
00:29:27,429 --> 00:29:27,929
that

822
00:29:28,390 --> 00:29:30,230
you're gonna get into the weeds or you're

823
00:29:30,230 --> 00:29:31,990
gonna find out stuff that you don't really

824
00:29:31,990 --> 00:29:34,585
wanna know, But it it's really just the

825
00:29:34,585 --> 00:29:37,065
opposite. It it it can only strengthen your

826
00:29:37,065 --> 00:29:37,565
testimony.

827
00:29:38,424 --> 00:29:40,285
Yeah. That's true. He doesn't disappoint.

828
00:29:40,984 --> 00:29:42,744
Yeah. For sure. Yeah. And that leads into

829
00:29:42,744 --> 00:29:44,744
the next principle, don't be afraid of of

830
00:29:44,744 --> 00:29:47,826
hard questions and discussions. Is that is that

831
00:29:47,826 --> 00:29:50,252
what you're you're getting at there? Yeah. We

832
00:29:50,252 --> 00:29:52,679
we talk about we talk about that a

833
00:29:52,679 --> 00:29:55,712
lot in the in our stake, and we

834
00:29:55,712 --> 00:29:58,138
really want as stake leaders, you know, because

835
00:29:58,138 --> 00:30:00,455
like you were asking earlier, what is really

836
00:30:00,455 --> 00:30:02,215
the role of a stake leader? Well, we

837
00:30:02,215 --> 00:30:04,315
don't wanna seem like we're inaccessible

838
00:30:05,255 --> 00:30:06,634
or we just

839
00:30:07,335 --> 00:30:09,174
do things, you know, behind the curtain like

840
00:30:09,174 --> 00:30:11,195
the great and powerful Oz or whatever.

841
00:30:12,589 --> 00:30:15,330
So Yeah. They're just there are a lot

842
00:30:15,630 --> 00:30:18,049
of hard questions out there and hard problems.

843
00:30:18,349 --> 00:30:20,269
And, you know, I learned this when I

844
00:30:20,269 --> 00:30:22,190
had teenagers. I mean, I had my brother

845
00:30:22,190 --> 00:30:23,470
made me a t shirt one year for

846
00:30:23,470 --> 00:30:25,934
Christmas that says hashtag no more hard

847
00:30:26,335 --> 00:30:28,174
conversations. Like, I was just so tired of

848
00:30:28,174 --> 00:30:29,154
it all the time.

849
00:30:29,455 --> 00:30:29,955
Every

850
00:30:30,495 --> 00:30:30,995
but

851
00:30:31,455 --> 00:30:32,674
when you have some

852
00:30:33,055 --> 00:30:36,015
unity in this in your presidency and you're

853
00:30:36,015 --> 00:30:38,495
with your leaders and when you feel confident

854
00:30:38,495 --> 00:30:39,315
in the doctrine,

855
00:30:40,019 --> 00:30:42,519
those hard questions and those hard discussions

856
00:30:43,380 --> 00:30:44,759
are totally worth it,

857
00:30:45,140 --> 00:30:46,039
you know, because

858
00:30:46,500 --> 00:30:48,500
that's where the growth is. I mean, if

859
00:30:48,500 --> 00:30:49,960
we believe in ongoing restoration

860
00:30:50,500 --> 00:30:53,480
Yeah. That's the whole point is the questions

861
00:30:54,180 --> 00:30:54,680
and

862
00:30:56,414 --> 00:30:58,494
bringing up those hard topics that you know

863
00:30:58,494 --> 00:31:00,174
other people are thinking about that. So, I

864
00:31:00,174 --> 00:31:02,335
mean, sometimes they'll come to you with those

865
00:31:02,335 --> 00:31:02,835
topics,

866
00:31:03,294 --> 00:31:05,214
but other times you just hear rumblings and

867
00:31:05,214 --> 00:31:07,054
you're like, oh, this is something we need

868
00:31:07,054 --> 00:31:07,710
to address.

869
00:31:08,509 --> 00:31:10,450
Right? Yeah. So for example,

870
00:31:10,990 --> 00:31:11,970
when they change

871
00:31:12,349 --> 00:31:14,849
the question in the temple recommend interview about

872
00:31:14,909 --> 00:31:15,409
garments

873
00:31:15,789 --> 00:31:18,049
and what they read about the garments, like,

874
00:31:18,829 --> 00:31:21,009
we brought it up in state council

875
00:31:21,549 --> 00:31:22,690
and some of the

876
00:31:23,255 --> 00:31:25,575
state presidency said, oh, isn't this so great?

877
00:31:25,575 --> 00:31:27,974
And I was like, actually, and I raised

878
00:31:27,974 --> 00:31:28,714
my hand,

879
00:31:29,174 --> 00:31:31,255
we've got a few women who are having

880
00:31:31,255 --> 00:31:33,255
a problem with this because they're not quite

881
00:31:33,255 --> 00:31:35,309
sure how to interpret what this really means.

882
00:31:36,029 --> 00:31:37,630
And so we talked about it in state

883
00:31:37,630 --> 00:31:40,130
council, and then we went back and we

884
00:31:40,350 --> 00:31:42,350
the same week, we gathered all the Relief

885
00:31:42,350 --> 00:31:43,570
Society presidents together,

886
00:31:44,269 --> 00:31:45,870
and we said, you know, tell us what

887
00:31:45,870 --> 00:31:47,090
you're hearing about this.

888
00:31:47,470 --> 00:31:49,549
Tell us, you know, how you're addressing this.

889
00:31:49,549 --> 00:31:50,049
And

890
00:31:50,595 --> 00:31:52,115
these are then then I brought in, you

891
00:31:52,115 --> 00:31:53,335
know, I looked up

892
00:31:54,674 --> 00:31:55,335
the previous

893
00:31:55,954 --> 00:31:58,194
question in this in the temple recommend and

894
00:31:58,194 --> 00:32:00,275
the current one, and, you know, these are

895
00:32:00,275 --> 00:32:02,134
actually kinda the same. And,

896
00:32:02,674 --> 00:32:04,595
here's what the policy is, and here's what

897
00:32:04,595 --> 00:32:06,309
Albert Oaks had to say about it So

898
00:32:06,309 --> 00:32:07,289
that they were kind

899
00:32:07,910 --> 00:32:10,410
of armed with what they needed when these

900
00:32:10,789 --> 00:32:12,490
questions came up in their ward.

901
00:32:13,349 --> 00:32:15,269
And I think it'll happen again when we

902
00:32:15,269 --> 00:32:15,750
get,

903
00:32:16,150 --> 00:32:17,830
you know, new garments coming out at the

904
00:32:17,830 --> 00:32:19,305
end of the year. That's right. You know?

905
00:32:19,384 --> 00:32:22,205
Yeah. More questions. Right? Yeah. More clarification. More

906
00:32:22,424 --> 00:32:22,924
questions.

907
00:32:23,705 --> 00:32:25,785
Yeah. I I really appreciate it because I'm

908
00:32:25,865 --> 00:32:27,805
I mean, you could say

909
00:32:28,664 --> 00:32:32,105
maybe a really sunny president could maybe dodge

910
00:32:32,105 --> 00:32:32,845
some of those

911
00:32:33,329 --> 00:32:34,849
circumstances because, you know, they're not giving the

912
00:32:34,849 --> 00:32:37,089
temple recommend interview. So maybe, you know, that

913
00:32:37,169 --> 00:32:38,210
they don't have to worry about that, you

914
00:32:38,210 --> 00:32:39,669
know, a more direct conversation.

915
00:32:40,130 --> 00:32:41,490
And and maybe if it comes up in

916
00:32:41,490 --> 00:32:43,250
release, I think it may quickly change the

917
00:32:43,250 --> 00:32:45,250
subject or go a different direction. But I

918
00:32:45,250 --> 00:32:46,929
just love this approach of saying, no. Let's,

919
00:32:46,929 --> 00:32:48,954
like, let's talk about it as you know,

920
00:32:48,954 --> 00:32:51,054
all the early side presidencies and

921
00:32:51,434 --> 00:32:53,835
process it here. And then when you when

922
00:32:53,835 --> 00:32:55,914
you walk into that situation and, yeah, maybe

923
00:32:55,914 --> 00:32:57,674
nobody brings it up, but at least you're

924
00:32:57,674 --> 00:32:59,835
prepared Yeah. When they do. There's no point

925
00:32:59,994 --> 00:33:01,934
there's no benefit to being blindsided.

926
00:33:02,599 --> 00:33:03,099
Yeah.

927
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:05,480
You know? And I think we do that

928
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,559
we we shy away from that for a

929
00:33:07,559 --> 00:33:10,680
few reasons. Like, there's some fear with those

930
00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:13,080
hard topics. And one of them is that

931
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:14,059
if you're acknowledging

932
00:33:14,519 --> 00:33:17,080
people's questions or people's doubts that you're at

933
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:19,515
the same time propagating some doubts.

934
00:33:19,894 --> 00:33:22,134
Yeah. Right. But that's not the case at

935
00:33:22,134 --> 00:33:23,595
all. I mean, these people

936
00:33:24,295 --> 00:33:26,234
are, you know, they're gonna have questions

937
00:33:26,535 --> 00:33:29,015
and that's all that's all good. If we

938
00:33:29,015 --> 00:33:30,474
can talk about it more like,

939
00:33:30,775 --> 00:33:32,555
don't be afraid of your questions.

940
00:33:33,150 --> 00:33:34,910
Your questions is how you grow and how

941
00:33:34,910 --> 00:33:36,049
you learn

942
00:33:36,590 --> 00:33:38,509
more about the things you need to learn

943
00:33:38,509 --> 00:33:39,009
about.

944
00:33:39,869 --> 00:33:40,369
Sister

945
00:33:41,150 --> 00:33:42,849
Tracy Browning in her,

946
00:33:43,549 --> 00:33:46,450
last conference talk seeking answers to spiritual questions

947
00:33:46,509 --> 00:33:47,009
said,

948
00:33:47,375 --> 00:33:49,775
asking questions and searching for meaning are a

949
00:33:49,775 --> 00:33:52,195
natural and normal part of our mortal experience.

950
00:33:52,815 --> 00:33:55,315
At times, not readily having complete answers

951
00:33:55,615 --> 00:33:56,975
can bring us to the edge of our

952
00:33:56,975 --> 00:33:57,475
understanding,

953
00:33:57,934 --> 00:34:00,914
and those limitations can feel frustrating or overwhelming.

954
00:34:01,420 --> 00:34:03,660
Wondrously, heavenly father's plan of happiness for all

955
00:34:03,660 --> 00:34:06,000
of us is designed to help us progress

956
00:34:06,140 --> 00:34:08,860
despite our limitations and accomplish what we cannot

957
00:34:08,860 --> 00:34:10,940
accomplish on our own, even without a complete

958
00:34:10,940 --> 00:34:13,360
knowledge of all things. God's plan is merciful

959
00:34:13,420 --> 00:34:15,440
towards the limitations of our humanity.

960
00:34:16,364 --> 00:34:17,824
And I think if we can normalize

961
00:34:18,765 --> 00:34:19,664
having questions

962
00:34:20,204 --> 00:34:22,445
and bringing them up and let's talk through

963
00:34:22,445 --> 00:34:23,824
them, let's sort them out,

964
00:34:24,684 --> 00:34:25,664
you know, and

965
00:34:26,684 --> 00:34:29,500
the answers are good, you know. God's answers

966
00:34:29,500 --> 00:34:31,900
are good. So as long as you're getting

967
00:34:31,900 --> 00:34:32,719
them from

968
00:34:33,420 --> 00:34:34,960
reliable sources, you know,

969
00:34:36,779 --> 00:34:39,099
the scriptures and the words of the prophets

970
00:34:39,099 --> 00:34:41,339
and everything, you're gonna be happy with those

971
00:34:41,339 --> 00:34:42,719
answers. It's when

972
00:34:43,194 --> 00:34:45,194
you don't bring up the questions, the hard

973
00:34:45,194 --> 00:34:45,694
topics,

974
00:34:46,315 --> 00:34:48,155
and you take so you take them somewhere

975
00:34:48,155 --> 00:34:50,414
else instead. You know, that's when you really

976
00:34:50,954 --> 00:34:52,954
run into trouble, I think. Is there any

977
00:34:52,954 --> 00:34:54,714
other way that you encourage the the other

978
00:34:54,714 --> 00:34:56,690
release site press said to bring bring up

979
00:34:56,690 --> 00:34:58,449
topics? Or do you want me to wanna

980
00:34:58,449 --> 00:34:59,969
prepare it or you want a more proactive

981
00:34:59,969 --> 00:35:01,650
to bring it up? I mean, because I

982
00:35:01,650 --> 00:35:02,849
mean, there's a lot to talk about and,

983
00:35:02,849 --> 00:35:04,769
obviously, you know, we wanna get like you

984
00:35:04,769 --> 00:35:06,150
said, let's get to Jesus

985
00:35:06,449 --> 00:35:08,289
as quickly as possible. Not maybe some of

986
00:35:08,289 --> 00:35:09,924
the every question that's out there, but Yeah.

987
00:35:10,085 --> 00:35:11,444
I mean, how do you navigate that? Do

988
00:35:11,444 --> 00:35:12,644
do you encourage them to bring it up

989
00:35:12,644 --> 00:35:14,405
or just make sure they're prepared? Or Well,

990
00:35:14,405 --> 00:35:16,005
we want yeah. We make sure that they're

991
00:35:16,005 --> 00:35:18,724
prepared and that they're not afraid to to

992
00:35:18,724 --> 00:35:19,784
have those conversations.

993
00:35:20,565 --> 00:35:22,500
But, you know, now that the,

994
00:35:23,139 --> 00:35:24,900
the handbook is clear that you're supposed to

995
00:35:24,900 --> 00:35:26,119
have a counseling

996
00:35:26,820 --> 00:35:29,300
section at the beginning of your lessons in

997
00:35:29,300 --> 00:35:31,699
recite in elders quorum, you know, we talk

998
00:35:31,699 --> 00:35:32,980
about that. We talk about that as a

999
00:35:32,980 --> 00:35:34,440
good time. If you are hearing

1000
00:35:36,204 --> 00:35:36,704
rumblings

1001
00:35:37,085 --> 00:35:39,505
in your ward that need to be addressed,

1002
00:35:40,125 --> 00:35:41,644
that is a great time to bring them

1003
00:35:41,644 --> 00:35:42,545
up. So,

1004
00:35:42,925 --> 00:35:44,605
you know, in Texas, we'll go back to

1005
00:35:44,605 --> 00:35:46,684
the garment thing, it is so hot here

1006
00:35:46,684 --> 00:35:48,224
in the summer, you know. So

1007
00:35:48,525 --> 00:35:50,444
one question we said maybe you wanna bring

1008
00:35:50,444 --> 00:35:51,880
up, what do you do when it's a

1009
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:53,480
hundred and five degrees out and it is

1010
00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:54,839
so gross and you just

1011
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:57,239
it's hard to wear your garments? Let's talk

1012
00:35:57,239 --> 00:35:59,000
about that for a few minutes, you know.

1013
00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:00,219
And that's your counseling

1014
00:36:00,519 --> 00:36:01,019
topic.

1015
00:36:01,639 --> 00:36:03,320
So, you know, maybe bring up some of

1016
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:05,864
those because the more you just let people

1017
00:36:05,864 --> 00:36:07,704
think, oh, I'm not the only one who

1018
00:36:07,704 --> 00:36:09,385
thinks that, like, these are really hot and

1019
00:36:09,385 --> 00:36:09,885
sticky

1020
00:36:10,184 --> 00:36:12,585
in the Texas summer. Yeah. Right. You know,

1021
00:36:12,585 --> 00:36:15,625
they feel better. And Yeah. They're even if

1022
00:36:15,625 --> 00:36:17,164
you don't solve the problem,

1023
00:36:18,184 --> 00:36:18,684
they're,

1024
00:36:19,065 --> 00:36:20,445
you know, they're being heard.

1025
00:36:20,900 --> 00:36:23,539
Yeah. I love that. And and just again,

1026
00:36:23,539 --> 00:36:25,800
not that because anybody has the answer, but

1027
00:36:26,180 --> 00:36:28,019
or or everybody's gonna agree, but how do

1028
00:36:28,019 --> 00:36:29,300
you deal with that? You know, I'm not

1029
00:36:29,300 --> 00:36:30,980
the only one that's, you know, sweating like

1030
00:36:30,980 --> 00:36:32,039
crazy in July.

1031
00:36:32,420 --> 00:36:34,440
So, yeah, I think part of that is

1032
00:36:34,820 --> 00:36:36,039
with the hard topics,

1033
00:36:36,614 --> 00:36:37,675
you know, issue

1034
00:36:38,135 --> 00:36:40,614
is getting to the root of what they're

1035
00:36:40,614 --> 00:36:43,094
really asking or what the misunderstanding is. So

1036
00:36:43,094 --> 00:36:44,614
if you go back to the Wilford Woodruff

1037
00:36:44,614 --> 00:36:46,155
example with this letter,

1038
00:36:46,855 --> 00:36:48,875
that he wrote back to Heber J Grant.

1039
00:36:49,430 --> 00:36:52,730
Heber j Grant thought his question was,

1040
00:36:53,190 --> 00:36:55,030
I don't like George q Cannon very much,

1041
00:36:55,030 --> 00:36:57,670
and I don't want him to be in

1042
00:36:57,670 --> 00:36:59,590
the next presidency, so let's jump ahead to

1043
00:36:59,590 --> 00:37:01,670
Joseph f Smith. Like and you're kind of

1044
00:37:01,670 --> 00:37:04,155
old Wilfred, so let's just skip ahead.

1045
00:37:05,114 --> 00:37:07,675
But what, you know, Wilford figured out was

1046
00:37:07,675 --> 00:37:10,474
no. The question he's really asking is where

1047
00:37:10,474 --> 00:37:11,135
are the keys

1048
00:37:11,755 --> 00:37:14,175
of administrating the church kept?

1049
00:37:14,474 --> 00:37:16,414
And so that was the question he answered,

1050
00:37:16,795 --> 00:37:17,454
you know.

1051
00:37:17,914 --> 00:37:18,414
And

1052
00:37:18,969 --> 00:37:21,130
that is actually what they needed to know,

1053
00:37:21,130 --> 00:37:22,969
you know, that and that set up the

1054
00:37:22,969 --> 00:37:25,070
succession of all the future,

1055
00:37:25,369 --> 00:37:28,489
you know, his explanations sets up succession of

1056
00:37:28,489 --> 00:37:30,590
all the next presidents of the church

1057
00:37:30,984 --> 00:37:32,905
by spelling that out. But then he also

1058
00:37:32,905 --> 00:37:35,005
realized, well, I do need to address

1059
00:37:35,385 --> 00:37:36,445
this issue of

1060
00:37:36,824 --> 00:37:39,385
what's his problem with George Buchanan and how

1061
00:37:39,385 --> 00:37:40,045
are we gonna

1062
00:37:40,344 --> 00:37:43,304
get unified behind my presidency that includes George

1063
00:37:43,304 --> 00:37:45,760
Buchanan. You know. So he spent almost two

1064
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:46,260
years

1065
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:47,940
talking to his presidency

1066
00:37:48,239 --> 00:37:50,000
and the quorum of the 12 about how

1067
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:51,280
do I how do how do we get

1068
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:53,119
you guys comfortable enough that you'll sustain my

1069
00:37:53,119 --> 00:37:53,619
presidency.

1070
00:37:55,199 --> 00:37:55,699
And

1071
00:37:56,159 --> 00:37:57,599
and I mean, that's a great lesson and

1072
00:37:57,599 --> 00:37:59,380
it was hard, you know. I mean, he

1073
00:37:59,505 --> 00:38:01,184
he writes in his journal a lot, like,

1074
00:38:01,184 --> 00:38:03,184
this was a painful day, or we had

1075
00:38:03,184 --> 00:38:05,184
a hard day, or I couldn't sleep thinking

1076
00:38:05,184 --> 00:38:05,924
about this.

1077
00:38:06,545 --> 00:38:08,065
And he did it great. I mean, one

1078
00:38:08,065 --> 00:38:10,144
time he records in his journal, I think

1079
00:38:10,144 --> 00:38:11,744
I done wrong and I took the matter

1080
00:38:11,744 --> 00:38:13,664
too far. You know? He, like, maybe lost

1081
00:38:13,664 --> 00:38:14,324
his cool.

1082
00:38:14,780 --> 00:38:17,339
But other than that, he's very patient and

1083
00:38:17,339 --> 00:38:19,839
he lets them all get out their issues

1084
00:38:19,900 --> 00:38:22,380
and they just talk it out until everybody

1085
00:38:22,380 --> 00:38:23,119
feels better.

1086
00:38:23,900 --> 00:38:25,980
And, you know, he still he still had

1087
00:38:25,980 --> 00:38:28,400
the presidency he wanted. I mean, he still

1088
00:38:28,585 --> 00:38:30,605
it it was the same result, but

1089
00:38:30,905 --> 00:38:33,065
with all of the backing that he needed

1090
00:38:33,065 --> 00:38:35,144
and the understanding that the quorum of the

1091
00:38:35,144 --> 00:38:37,085
12 needed to make that work.

1092
00:38:37,465 --> 00:38:37,965
Yeah.

1093
00:38:38,664 --> 00:38:40,985
You know, in leadership, it rarely is about

1094
00:38:41,304 --> 00:38:42,844
it rarely is about the

1095
00:38:43,699 --> 00:38:45,380
about the answer, whether it's right or wrong.

1096
00:38:45,380 --> 00:38:46,900
It's more of, like, do we have a

1097
00:38:46,900 --> 00:38:49,380
culture here that we can wrestle towards an

1098
00:38:49,380 --> 00:38:52,500
answer and disagree and and understand, right, that,

1099
00:38:52,500 --> 00:38:54,339
wait, it's not just about the succession, it's

1100
00:38:54,339 --> 00:38:56,339
about how you feel about Josh Buchanan. Right?

1101
00:38:56,339 --> 00:38:57,880
Like, it's not just about

1102
00:38:58,775 --> 00:39:01,255
about the the the the garment or just

1103
00:39:01,255 --> 00:39:03,335
about following the prophet. Like, there's there's other

1104
00:39:03,335 --> 00:39:05,414
dynamics here that we could explore to better

1105
00:39:05,414 --> 00:39:06,394
understand and

1106
00:39:06,695 --> 00:39:09,335
and and, you know, find paths to be

1107
00:39:09,335 --> 00:39:09,835
faithful,

1108
00:39:10,295 --> 00:39:12,614
you know, in covenant people the best the

1109
00:39:12,614 --> 00:39:14,340
best way as possible. Yeah. So So I

1110
00:39:14,340 --> 00:39:16,099
think getting to the root of the problem,

1111
00:39:16,099 --> 00:39:18,519
figuring out what Yeah. What is the actual,

1112
00:39:18,820 --> 00:39:20,340
you know or does this person just need

1113
00:39:20,340 --> 00:39:21,079
to be heard?

1114
00:39:21,380 --> 00:39:23,960
Mhmm. You know? I mean, just this week,

1115
00:39:24,180 --> 00:39:26,739
our stake president got a got a letter

1116
00:39:26,739 --> 00:39:28,820
from a sister in the stake who wanted

1117
00:39:28,820 --> 00:39:31,224
to talk to him about something and so

1118
00:39:31,285 --> 00:39:33,445
it was a stake presidency and me because

1119
00:39:33,445 --> 00:39:34,805
she was a sister and we went just

1120
00:39:34,805 --> 00:39:37,045
sat down with her for forty five minutes

1121
00:39:37,045 --> 00:39:38,265
just just yesterday.

1122
00:39:38,965 --> 00:39:40,805
And, you know, part of it was she

1123
00:39:40,805 --> 00:39:42,565
wanted to be heard and she felt so

1124
00:39:42,565 --> 00:39:44,740
much better that we were gonna listen to

1125
00:39:44,740 --> 00:39:46,740
her. But part of it was some problem

1126
00:39:46,740 --> 00:39:48,340
solving. So, you know, come in with your

1127
00:39:48,340 --> 00:39:50,680
notebook. I never go anywhere without my notebook.

1128
00:39:50,980 --> 00:39:53,220
You know, write figure it out. Be the

1129
00:39:53,220 --> 00:39:55,079
problem solver that they need.

1130
00:39:56,394 --> 00:39:57,914
And I learned that right at the beginning

1131
00:39:57,914 --> 00:40:00,235
when I was a ward relief society president.

1132
00:40:00,235 --> 00:40:02,155
I when I was like two weeks in

1133
00:40:02,155 --> 00:40:03,755
and we had a really horrible death in

1134
00:40:03,755 --> 00:40:06,335
our ward and the bishop called and said,

1135
00:40:07,035 --> 00:40:08,894
you know, you're up. I need you here.

1136
00:40:09,914 --> 00:40:12,739
And I I was nervous and I showed

1137
00:40:12,739 --> 00:40:14,739
up with my with my notebook and I

1138
00:40:14,739 --> 00:40:15,239
was

1139
00:40:15,539 --> 00:40:16,980
I was where I needed to be and

1140
00:40:16,980 --> 00:40:18,659
I was taking notes the whole time and

1141
00:40:18,659 --> 00:40:21,059
then we got into solving all the rest

1142
00:40:21,059 --> 00:40:22,760
of the problems after that. But

1143
00:40:23,139 --> 00:40:24,280
you just have to

1144
00:40:24,625 --> 00:40:26,305
maybe think outside the box a little bit

1145
00:40:26,305 --> 00:40:28,144
and figure out how to be the problem

1146
00:40:28,144 --> 00:40:29,765
solver that they need. Yeah.

1147
00:40:30,065 --> 00:40:31,684
That's powerful. That's powerful.

1148
00:40:32,065 --> 00:40:32,864
Anything else,

1149
00:40:34,144 --> 00:40:35,985
around tough questions? Do we cover that pretty

1150
00:40:35,985 --> 00:40:38,144
well? Well, I mean, the last part I'd

1151
00:40:38,144 --> 00:40:40,049
say is for women especially,

1152
00:40:40,429 --> 00:40:42,429
and I mean for men, you know, get

1153
00:40:42,429 --> 00:40:44,769
the other side of the table involved. So

1154
00:40:45,069 --> 00:40:46,289
a lot of these questions,

1155
00:40:46,989 --> 00:40:48,989
I maybe can't solve, but I know who

1156
00:40:48,989 --> 00:40:49,489
can,

1157
00:40:49,869 --> 00:40:51,789
you know, or I can encourage this Relief

1158
00:40:51,789 --> 00:40:53,089
Society president to

1159
00:40:53,704 --> 00:40:55,945
call call your elders quorum president. This guy

1160
00:40:55,945 --> 00:40:57,324
should be your new best friend.

1161
00:40:57,784 --> 00:40:59,945
So get him on board, you know, see

1162
00:40:59,945 --> 00:41:01,385
if there's some stuff you guys can do

1163
00:41:01,385 --> 00:41:01,885
together

1164
00:41:02,585 --> 00:41:04,025
or, you know, let me call the high

1165
00:41:04,025 --> 00:41:05,945
councilor over your ward or let me call

1166
00:41:05,945 --> 00:41:08,059
your bishop and see if he has any

1167
00:41:08,059 --> 00:41:10,300
insight into this, or let me take this

1168
00:41:10,300 --> 00:41:11,199
to state council

1169
00:41:11,660 --> 00:41:12,719
so that you're getting,

1170
00:41:13,260 --> 00:41:15,260
you know, not just the women trying to

1171
00:41:15,260 --> 00:41:17,179
solve it from our side, but the men

1172
00:41:17,179 --> 00:41:19,099
involved. And then I think the more you

1173
00:41:19,099 --> 00:41:19,599
can

1174
00:41:20,885 --> 00:41:22,505
show that, you know,

1175
00:41:22,804 --> 00:41:24,804
that visibility of the women and the men

1176
00:41:24,804 --> 00:41:25,625
working together,

1177
00:41:26,964 --> 00:41:28,105
that that helps

1178
00:41:29,204 --> 00:41:31,204
that helps the women feel better about a

1179
00:41:31,204 --> 00:41:33,680
lot of the issues that they have. Is

1180
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:36,079
that, well, this isn't just, you know, the

1181
00:41:36,079 --> 00:41:37,920
women doing this around the kitchen table. This

1182
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:40,420
is all of the leaders working together

1183
00:41:40,720 --> 00:41:42,099
to help me solve this problem.

1184
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:45,539
Yeah. That's powerful. That's powerful. I love that.

1185
00:41:47,474 --> 00:41:49,315
Well, Christy, this has been great. I mean,

1186
00:41:49,315 --> 00:41:51,235
so much to learn, so many dynamics and

1187
00:41:51,235 --> 00:41:52,914
things to consider, I I think has been

1188
00:41:52,914 --> 00:41:54,515
really helpful. And and then, you know, throwing

1189
00:41:54,515 --> 00:41:56,994
in some Wilford Woodruff as well in there.

1190
00:41:56,994 --> 00:41:59,474
So story for everything. I know. Right? He

1191
00:41:59,555 --> 00:42:00,914
I mean, he was around so long and

1192
00:42:00,914 --> 00:42:02,375
wrote so much. So,

1193
00:42:03,050 --> 00:42:05,449
he he, I'm excited for his podcast in

1194
00:42:05,449 --> 00:42:06,909
the next life. I know.

1195
00:42:07,610 --> 00:42:08,989
So it's gonna be a lot.

1196
00:42:09,690 --> 00:42:11,329
And, obviously, if people wanna check it out,

1197
00:42:11,329 --> 00:42:12,969
I've just Desert Book is publishing it, so

1198
00:42:12,969 --> 00:42:15,704
you can get it, there. Desert Bookstore. Yep.

1199
00:42:16,505 --> 00:42:18,585
Or the RSC website, you know, the religious

1200
00:42:18,585 --> 00:42:19,644
studies center website.

1201
00:42:20,025 --> 00:42:22,585
Oh, cool. Yeah. The Desert Book website, I

1202
00:42:22,585 --> 00:42:24,204
I assume it will be on Amazon.

1203
00:42:24,664 --> 00:42:26,105
Yeah. I haven't seen it there yet, but

1204
00:42:26,265 --> 00:42:28,585
yeah. I'm sure it will be. And, you

1205
00:42:28,585 --> 00:42:30,344
know, now that I've written a book, I

1206
00:42:30,344 --> 00:42:31,085
get everybody

1207
00:42:31,409 --> 00:42:33,089
asked this question. Is it will it is

1208
00:42:33,089 --> 00:42:34,230
there an audio version?

1209
00:42:34,530 --> 00:42:36,849
There is not an audio version. Alright. Alright.

1210
00:42:36,849 --> 00:42:38,289
We'll have to deal with that. You're gonna

1211
00:42:38,289 --> 00:42:40,130
have to have, you know, someone sit and

1212
00:42:40,130 --> 00:42:42,609
read it to you. Yeah. And, you know,

1213
00:42:42,609 --> 00:42:45,045
I'll mention this sort of the online here

1214
00:42:45,045 --> 00:42:47,764
that if if you, if there's some stories

1215
00:42:47,764 --> 00:42:50,644
or concepts, especially this book specifically, I'd love

1216
00:42:50,644 --> 00:42:51,045
to,

1217
00:42:52,005 --> 00:42:54,085
continue to put that out there either through

1218
00:42:54,085 --> 00:42:56,750
like our our YouTube channel and getting information

1219
00:42:56,750 --> 00:42:58,589
out there. Because I just I love good

1220
00:42:58,589 --> 00:43:01,550
early church history story and especially Wilford Woodruff,

1221
00:43:01,550 --> 00:43:03,469
and so I'd love to promote more of

1222
00:43:03,469 --> 00:43:05,070
that as as much as possible. I was

1223
00:43:05,070 --> 00:43:07,070
I was surprised that there wasn't more written

1224
00:43:07,070 --> 00:43:09,570
about him. Considering as much as he's written,

1225
00:43:10,164 --> 00:43:12,184
I mean, there's a great book by the,

1226
00:43:14,005 --> 00:43:15,864
Wilfrid Ordiff's written as developing,

1227
00:43:16,244 --> 00:43:18,644
Wilf the development of temple doctrine written by

1228
00:43:18,644 --> 00:43:20,824
our executive director, Jennifer Mackley.

1229
00:43:21,125 --> 00:43:23,364
Oh, okay. And then there's a big, big

1230
00:43:23,364 --> 00:43:24,984
fat biography of him.

1231
00:43:25,559 --> 00:43:26,059
But

1232
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:28,840
it there you know, especially considering what a

1233
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:30,840
great missionary he was. I mean, what a

1234
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:32,460
powerful missionary and

1235
00:43:32,840 --> 00:43:34,680
how many great stories he had. I was

1236
00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:36,280
I was surprised that there was kind of

1237
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,474
a a hole in the market there. Yeah.

1238
00:43:38,474 --> 00:43:40,394
For sure. Well, I'm I'm glad you're contributing

1239
00:43:40,394 --> 00:43:42,474
and and writing more books like this and

1240
00:43:42,474 --> 00:43:44,394
encourage people to check it out. So last

1241
00:43:44,394 --> 00:43:45,934
question I have for you, Christy,

1242
00:43:46,235 --> 00:43:47,914
is as you can see your time as

1243
00:43:47,914 --> 00:43:49,835
a leader, how has being a leader helped

1244
00:43:49,835 --> 00:43:52,095
you become a better follower of Jesus Christ?

1245
00:43:54,670 --> 00:43:57,730
I think I've just learned a lot about

1246
00:43:59,150 --> 00:43:59,650
how

1247
00:44:00,430 --> 00:44:02,210
just beautiful and

1248
00:44:02,829 --> 00:44:04,050
merciful and joyful

1249
00:44:04,910 --> 00:44:06,530
the plan of salvation is.

1250
00:44:07,070 --> 00:44:07,570
And

1251
00:44:09,034 --> 00:44:09,614
I I

1252
00:44:10,154 --> 00:44:12,414
I can't I never get tired of

1253
00:44:13,114 --> 00:44:16,174
teaching that and helping our sisters understand

1254
00:44:17,275 --> 00:44:20,090
just just how beautiful the plan is. I

1255
00:44:20,090 --> 00:44:21,690
mean, you know, now I'm 42. He talks

1256
00:44:21,690 --> 00:44:23,610
about it as, you know, the plan of

1257
00:44:23,610 --> 00:44:25,369
mercy, the plan of salvation, the plan of

1258
00:44:25,369 --> 00:44:27,469
happiness, the plan of redemption. And it's

1259
00:44:28,170 --> 00:44:28,670
it's

1260
00:44:28,969 --> 00:44:31,130
the more you study it, the more I

1261
00:44:31,130 --> 00:44:32,030
study it,

1262
00:44:32,409 --> 00:44:33,469
the the more

1263
00:44:34,010 --> 00:44:36,764
I appreciate that. And, you know, there's a

1264
00:44:36,764 --> 00:44:38,445
lot of there's a lot of noise around

1265
00:44:38,445 --> 00:44:39,585
the gospel, but

1266
00:44:39,964 --> 00:44:43,164
the the plan of salvation is just beautiful

1267
00:44:43,164 --> 00:44:44,545
and amazing and

1268
00:44:45,085 --> 00:44:47,164
brings a lot of joy. And I love

1269
00:44:47,164 --> 00:44:49,230
that I love when we get to focus

1270
00:44:49,230 --> 00:44:49,890
on that.

1271
00:45:02,590 --> 00:45:05,385
And that concludes this how I lead interview.

1272
00:45:05,605 --> 00:45:07,444
I hope you enjoyed it. And, I would

1273
00:45:07,444 --> 00:45:09,284
ask you, could you take a minute and

1274
00:45:09,284 --> 00:45:11,204
drop this link in an email, on social

1275
00:45:11,204 --> 00:45:13,284
media, in a text, wherever it makes the

1276
00:45:13,284 --> 00:45:14,964
most sense, and share it with somebody who

1277
00:45:14,964 --> 00:45:17,940
could relate to this experience. And this is

1278
00:45:17,940 --> 00:45:20,179
how we develop as leaders, just hearing what

1279
00:45:20,179 --> 00:45:22,099
the other guy's doing, trying some things out,

1280
00:45:22,099 --> 00:45:23,079
testing, adjusting

1281
00:45:23,460 --> 00:45:24,760
for your area. And,

1282
00:45:25,300 --> 00:45:27,539
that's where great leadership's discovered. Right? So we

1283
00:45:27,539 --> 00:45:29,585
would love to have you, share this with,

1284
00:45:29,864 --> 00:45:32,684
somebody in this calling or a related calling,

1285
00:45:32,744 --> 00:45:34,744
and that would be great. And, also, if

1286
00:45:34,744 --> 00:45:35,644
you know somebody,

1287
00:45:36,025 --> 00:45:37,864
any type of leader who would be a

1288
00:45:37,864 --> 00:45:40,045
fantastic guest on the how I lead segment,

1289
00:45:40,505 --> 00:45:43,324
reach out to us. Go to leadingsaints.org/contact.

1290
00:45:43,569 --> 00:45:45,889
Maybe send this in individual an email letting

1291
00:45:45,889 --> 00:45:47,889
them know that you're going to be suggesting

1292
00:45:47,889 --> 00:45:50,130
their name for this interview. We'll reach out

1293
00:45:50,130 --> 00:45:51,170
to them and,

1294
00:45:51,730 --> 00:45:52,849
see if we can line them up. So,

1295
00:45:52,849 --> 00:45:55,269
again, go to leadingsaints.org/contact,

1296
00:45:55,329 --> 00:45:57,349
and there you can submit all the information

1297
00:45:57,635 --> 00:45:59,315
and let us know. And maybe they will

1298
00:45:59,315 --> 00:46:01,074
be on a future how I lead segment

1299
00:46:01,074 --> 00:46:02,614
on the Leading Saints podcast.

1300
00:46:02,994 --> 00:46:05,655
Remember, go to leadingsaints.org/14

1301
00:46:05,954 --> 00:46:08,114
to hear the Packard family's experience of when

1302
00:46:08,114 --> 00:46:09,570
loved ones leave the church.

1303
00:46:17,489 --> 00:46:20,070
It came as a result of the position

1304
00:46:20,130 --> 00:46:23,025
of leadership which was imposed upon us

1305
00:46:23,664 --> 00:46:26,224
by the God of heaven who brought forth

1306
00:46:26,224 --> 00:46:29,764
a restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

1307
00:46:30,224 --> 00:46:33,585
And when the declaration was made concerning the

1308
00:46:33,585 --> 00:46:36,464
own and only true and living Church upon

1309
00:46:36,464 --> 00:46:37,829
the face of the earth,

1310
00:46:38,309 --> 00:46:40,969
We were immediately put in a position of

1311
00:46:41,110 --> 00:46:41,610
loneliness,

1312
00:46:41,989 --> 00:46:43,610
the loneliness of leadership

1313
00:46:44,390 --> 00:46:47,450
from which we cannot shrink nor run away,

1314
00:46:48,511 --> 00:46:50,991
and to which we must face up with

1315
00:46:50,991 --> 00:46:52,452
boldness and courage

1316
00:46:53,151 --> 00:46:53,972
and ability.