1
00:00:05,359 --> 00:00:07,919
How's your teaching calling going? Have you ever

2
00:00:07,919 --> 00:00:10,000
asked a question during the second hour and

3
00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:12,160
suddenly everyone is looking at the carpet in

4
00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:12,660
silence?

5
00:00:13,125 --> 00:00:15,765
There are proven methods to stimulate class discussion

6
00:00:15,765 --> 00:00:17,065
that work like a charm.

7
00:00:17,445 --> 00:00:20,484
David Farnsworth does a masterful job presenting on

8
00:00:20,484 --> 00:00:23,385
this very subject in the Teaching Saints virtual

9
00:00:23,605 --> 00:00:24,105
library.

10
00:00:24,564 --> 00:00:26,910
What questions get people talking? How can you

11
00:00:26,910 --> 00:00:29,630
effectively listen to the answer they're saying without

12
00:00:29,630 --> 00:00:31,710
being distracted of where you wanna take the

13
00:00:31,710 --> 00:00:35,070
class next? These are crucial principles to consider,

14
00:00:35,070 --> 00:00:37,310
especially in this time of come follow me

15
00:00:37,310 --> 00:00:39,890
Sunday school. You can watch David Farnsworth's

16
00:00:40,215 --> 00:00:43,914
presentation by visiting leadingsaints.org/fourteen.

17
00:00:44,375 --> 00:00:46,695
There, you can gain free access for fourteen

18
00:00:46,695 --> 00:00:49,414
days to the Teaching Saints virtual library where

19
00:00:49,414 --> 00:00:51,975
you'll find hours and hours of content to

20
00:00:51,975 --> 00:00:54,394
help you be a better prepared Sunday teacher.

21
00:00:57,850 --> 00:00:59,690
Before we jump into the content of this

22
00:00:59,690 --> 00:01:01,690
episode, I kinda feel it's important that I

23
00:01:01,690 --> 00:01:03,609
introduce myself. Now many of you have been

24
00:01:03,609 --> 00:01:06,730
around a long time. You're well familiar with

25
00:01:06,730 --> 00:01:08,969
my voice and the the with Leading Saints

26
00:01:08,969 --> 00:01:09,790
as an organization.

27
00:01:10,334 --> 00:01:12,015
But if you're not, well, my name is

28
00:01:12,015 --> 00:01:14,094
Kurt Frankem, and I am the executive director

29
00:01:14,094 --> 00:01:16,494
of Leading Saints and the podcast host. Now

30
00:01:16,494 --> 00:01:18,594
Leading Saints is a nonprofit organization

31
00:01:19,454 --> 00:01:22,015
dedicated helping Latter day Saints be better prepared

32
00:01:22,015 --> 00:01:24,010
to lead. And we do that through, well,

33
00:01:24,010 --> 00:01:26,409
content creation like this podcast and many other

34
00:01:26,409 --> 00:01:28,349
resources at leadingsaints.org.

35
00:01:28,489 --> 00:01:31,209
And, we don't act like we have all

36
00:01:31,209 --> 00:01:32,349
the answers or,

37
00:01:32,810 --> 00:01:34,490
know exactly what a leader should do or

38
00:01:34,490 --> 00:01:36,189
not do, but we like to explore

39
00:01:36,534 --> 00:01:39,094
the concepts of leadership, the science of leadership,

40
00:01:39,094 --> 00:01:41,655
what people are researching about leadership, and see

41
00:01:41,655 --> 00:01:43,814
how we can apply them to a Latter

42
00:01:43,814 --> 00:01:45,995
day Saint world. So here we go.

43
00:01:46,375 --> 00:01:49,174
The following episode is a throwback episode, one

44
00:01:49,174 --> 00:01:52,075
that was published previously and was extremely popular.

45
00:01:52,215 --> 00:01:53,950
To see the details of when this was

46
00:01:53,950 --> 00:01:56,909
originally published, see the show notes. Enjoy this

47
00:01:56,909 --> 00:01:57,890
throwback episode.

48
00:02:03,629 --> 00:02:05,715
Folks, we did it. I had the opportunity

49
00:02:05,854 --> 00:02:08,334
to track down Dave Butler from Don't Miss

50
00:02:08,334 --> 00:02:10,675
This, the YouTube channel that many of you

51
00:02:10,894 --> 00:02:13,534
are familiar with. It's, one of these, come

52
00:02:13,534 --> 00:02:14,275
follow me

53
00:02:14,735 --> 00:02:17,455
YouTube channels where every week they put out

54
00:02:17,455 --> 00:02:18,114
a video

55
00:02:18,460 --> 00:02:20,699
discussing some of the concepts in that week's

56
00:02:20,699 --> 00:02:23,020
come follow me lesson. David Butler has been

57
00:02:23,020 --> 00:02:24,219
in the CES program,

58
00:02:24,540 --> 00:02:27,840
teaching. He currently teaches at Utah Valley University

59
00:02:27,900 --> 00:02:28,879
Institute of Religion

60
00:02:29,260 --> 00:02:31,580
and is such a phenomenal teacher. And, obviously,

61
00:02:31,580 --> 00:02:32,860
I don't need to say that to those

62
00:02:32,860 --> 00:02:36,215
who have seen David Butler in action. And

63
00:02:36,215 --> 00:02:36,875
he is,

64
00:02:37,414 --> 00:02:39,094
and so real and fun and,

65
00:02:39,574 --> 00:02:41,894
which doesn't won't surprise you in this episode

66
00:02:41,894 --> 00:02:43,914
where we just talk real and

67
00:02:44,215 --> 00:02:46,614
and it's a fun discussion. And he's funny

68
00:02:46,614 --> 00:02:48,192
and it's but but he's so sincere and,

69
00:02:48,969 --> 00:02:49,469
and,

70
00:02:50,009 --> 00:02:51,930
he's had an opportunity to serve as a

71
00:02:51,930 --> 00:02:53,650
bishop. And so this is an interview, a

72
00:02:53,650 --> 00:02:55,210
a conversation with Dave Butler that you probably

73
00:02:55,210 --> 00:02:56,569
won't find anywhere else,

74
00:02:56,889 --> 00:02:59,449
because we delve into his journey as being

75
00:02:59,449 --> 00:03:02,394
a bishop and how he approached the the

76
00:03:02,394 --> 00:03:04,634
different concerns with the word council and sacrament

77
00:03:04,634 --> 00:03:07,194
meeting and and how he developed vision and

78
00:03:07,194 --> 00:03:09,435
purpose and and some of his tips are

79
00:03:09,435 --> 00:03:11,194
so helpful. You're gonna love it. And then

80
00:03:11,194 --> 00:03:13,354
we just jump into his teaching style where

81
00:03:13,354 --> 00:03:15,354
he always teaches in the context of grace

82
00:03:15,354 --> 00:03:16,495
and how you do that,

83
00:03:17,389 --> 00:03:19,409
books he's written, Come Follow Me,

84
00:03:20,270 --> 00:03:22,030
how we should see Come Follow Me, and

85
00:03:22,030 --> 00:03:23,310
and what do we do if we start

86
00:03:23,310 --> 00:03:25,709
to beat ourselves up about, failing at Come

87
00:03:25,709 --> 00:03:28,509
Follow Me. And so why why we should

88
00:03:28,509 --> 00:03:30,030
call it a resource and not a program,

89
00:03:30,030 --> 00:03:32,465
like, so many pearls of wisdom here. You're

90
00:03:32,465 --> 00:03:34,165
gonna love it. So here's my interview

91
00:03:34,545 --> 00:03:35,605
with Dave Butler.

92
00:03:43,349 --> 00:03:45,590
Here I am on the campus of UVU.

93
00:03:45,590 --> 00:03:47,270
I guess we're at we're in the Institute

94
00:03:47,270 --> 00:03:50,629
Building, the Utah Valley University Institute Building with

95
00:03:50,629 --> 00:03:52,310
Dave Butler. How are you, Dave? Very good.

96
00:03:52,310 --> 00:03:54,389
Thank you. Awesome. No. I went here, when

97
00:03:54,389 --> 00:03:55,129
it was UVSC.

98
00:03:55,525 --> 00:03:56,805
Oh, really? Yeah. I have a two year

99
00:03:56,805 --> 00:03:58,645
degree. So I've walked these halls and attended

100
00:03:58,645 --> 00:04:01,365
classes here, and and it's it's kinda cool

101
00:04:01,365 --> 00:04:02,965
to be back. You are at home. That's

102
00:04:02,965 --> 00:04:04,965
right. Welcome home. Thank you. Thank you. So

103
00:04:04,965 --> 00:04:06,425
how long have you been here?

104
00:04:07,044 --> 00:04:08,789
This three years, I think.

105
00:04:09,669 --> 00:04:11,269
Yeah. Someone just asked me yesterday, and so

106
00:04:11,269 --> 00:04:12,310
I was trying to figure it out. And

107
00:04:12,310 --> 00:04:13,989
then I got bored trying to figure it

108
00:04:13,989 --> 00:04:16,009
out. So but about three years.

109
00:04:16,629 --> 00:04:18,949
Yeah. And so teaching here. What's your journey

110
00:04:18,949 --> 00:04:19,449
into

111
00:04:20,310 --> 00:04:22,535
CES? I mean, did you were you the

112
00:04:22,535 --> 00:04:24,375
return missionaries? Like, there's nothing else I must

113
00:04:24,375 --> 00:04:25,654
do in this world Oh. But teach the

114
00:04:25,654 --> 00:04:28,214
gospel. Maybe opposite. I mean, I I like,

115
00:04:28,214 --> 00:04:30,294
wait. Not opposite because I really came home,

116
00:04:30,294 --> 00:04:32,154
and I like to teach you the gospel.

117
00:04:32,214 --> 00:04:32,875
Yeah. Sure.

118
00:04:33,894 --> 00:04:35,850
I I taught at the MTC and

119
00:04:36,250 --> 00:04:38,490
loved teaching at the MTC. Mhmm. Like, it

120
00:04:38,490 --> 00:04:40,730
was kind of my first teaching experience ever,

121
00:04:40,730 --> 00:04:42,750
was teaching the MTC. And I I would

122
00:04:42,889 --> 00:04:44,589
like, if they called me tomorrow

123
00:04:44,970 --> 00:04:46,410
and said, do you wanna come back and

124
00:04:46,410 --> 00:04:48,524
teach? For $7.50 an hour. I would just

125
00:04:48,604 --> 00:04:50,044
I would not even pray about it. I

126
00:04:50,044 --> 00:04:51,644
would do it. I would just go because

127
00:04:51,644 --> 00:04:53,805
I loved it so much. That's awesome.

128
00:04:54,125 --> 00:04:57,185
It honestly, like, it was golden to me.

129
00:04:57,564 --> 00:05:00,125
This is pretty golden here too, in fact.

130
00:05:00,125 --> 00:05:00,600
Like,

131
00:05:01,160 --> 00:05:03,480
at the UVU Sort of an extension of

132
00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:05,240
the MTC in some ways. It feels like

133
00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,399
it. It just is it's it's super great.

134
00:05:07,399 --> 00:05:09,740
So, anyways, I actually had

135
00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:12,040
I have, like, a distinct memory from high

136
00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:14,875
school sitting in economics class, and maybe it's

137
00:05:14,875 --> 00:05:16,795
because it was economics, and just sitting there

138
00:05:16,795 --> 00:05:20,014
and, like, drifting off, which was a normal

139
00:05:20,154 --> 00:05:22,735
thing for me, and thinking to myself,

140
00:05:23,274 --> 00:05:25,055
why would anybody be a teacher?

141
00:05:25,595 --> 00:05:27,055
What a dumb idea.

142
00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:28,959
You know, I legit, like I was like,

143
00:05:28,959 --> 00:05:31,300
I, and I made a vow to myself,

144
00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:33,139
no matter what,

145
00:05:33,519 --> 00:05:35,139
I will never, ever

146
00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:37,439
be a teacher, you know, it's kind of

147
00:05:37,439 --> 00:05:40,079
less words, right? I legit, it was like,

148
00:05:40,079 --> 00:05:41,774
I'm not ever, ever going to do it.

149
00:05:42,014 --> 00:05:44,095
And then I was in college and had

150
00:05:44,095 --> 00:05:45,694
no idea what I wanted to do with

151
00:05:45,694 --> 00:05:48,254
my life. Still don't, for the record. Like,

152
00:05:48,254 --> 00:05:49,394
I still am, like,

153
00:05:50,095 --> 00:05:52,495
kinda consider this, like, a temporary thing. This

154
00:05:52,495 --> 00:05:53,935
is fun. So you'll do this a while

155
00:05:53,935 --> 00:05:55,615
now. Yeah. This is now, like, an eleven

156
00:05:55,615 --> 00:05:57,540
year or whatever, twelve year temporary thing.

157
00:05:58,660 --> 00:06:00,500
You know, which isn't that long, you know?

158
00:06:00,500 --> 00:06:01,220
But I,

159
00:06:02,259 --> 00:06:04,020
I I was in college and met up

160
00:06:04,020 --> 00:06:05,939
with a buddy of mine. We went out

161
00:06:05,939 --> 00:06:08,100
to lunch, and we were gonna start a

162
00:06:08,100 --> 00:06:11,345
dental lab together. Oh. Just because Not you

163
00:06:11,345 --> 00:06:13,185
didn't wanna become a dentist. No. No. My

164
00:06:13,185 --> 00:06:14,705
dad's a dentist, so for some reason, I

165
00:06:14,705 --> 00:06:16,225
felt like I was an expert in that

166
00:06:16,225 --> 00:06:18,225
field. And it felt like, oh, we could

167
00:06:18,225 --> 00:06:19,584
make a dental lab, and it was gonna

168
00:06:19,584 --> 00:06:20,644
be good money and,

169
00:06:20,944 --> 00:06:22,944
like, a great part time job maybe turned

170
00:06:22,944 --> 00:06:25,620
into something afterwards. Or and so we were

171
00:06:25,620 --> 00:06:27,699
meeting to kinda talk about details, and he

172
00:06:27,699 --> 00:06:29,460
he had I said, what are what what

173
00:06:29,460 --> 00:06:30,980
classes are you taking? This semester is about

174
00:06:30,980 --> 00:06:31,800
to start at BYU.

175
00:06:32,340 --> 00:06:33,780
And I and he'd said, I'm gonna take

176
00:06:33,780 --> 00:06:35,699
this one called Teaching the Gospel. And I

177
00:06:35,699 --> 00:06:38,100
was like, oh, well, I needed a religion

178
00:06:38,100 --> 00:06:40,214
credit. And I was like, that would be

179
00:06:40,214 --> 00:06:41,995
cool. Like, I should take it with you

180
00:06:42,134 --> 00:06:44,214
because that'd be fun, number one, to take

181
00:06:44,214 --> 00:06:46,375
a class together. That's how all my class

182
00:06:46,375 --> 00:06:48,134
decisions went, by the way. Like, they had

183
00:06:48,134 --> 00:06:48,954
nothing to do

184
00:06:49,574 --> 00:06:50,074
with,

185
00:06:51,529 --> 00:06:53,529
like, my what, like, what I needed or

186
00:06:53,529 --> 00:06:56,009
whatever. It was purely like, oh, I'll take

187
00:06:56,009 --> 00:06:56,829
it with a friend.

188
00:06:57,850 --> 00:06:58,350
And

189
00:06:58,970 --> 00:07:00,670
I didn't know that it was,

190
00:07:01,050 --> 00:07:03,930
like, what's called preservice, like, this class to

191
00:07:03,930 --> 00:07:04,750
kind of help

192
00:07:05,084 --> 00:07:07,644
find people who are interested in teaching Seminary

193
00:07:07,644 --> 00:07:08,305
and Institute.

194
00:07:08,764 --> 00:07:10,845
And it's not only that. It's also, like,

195
00:07:10,845 --> 00:07:12,845
legit for people who, like, want to learn

196
00:07:12,845 --> 00:07:14,605
how to be a better teacher. Yeah. And

197
00:07:14,605 --> 00:07:16,464
so I was like, well, I feel like

198
00:07:16,524 --> 00:07:19,220
I'm gonna teach my whole life, you know,

199
00:07:19,220 --> 00:07:20,600
at home, in church,

200
00:07:20,900 --> 00:07:23,160
wherever. So I might as well be great.

201
00:07:23,220 --> 00:07:24,660
And I went in and they started talking

202
00:07:24,660 --> 00:07:27,699
about seminaries, and and I was like, what

203
00:07:27,699 --> 00:07:29,540
in the world is going on? I didn't

204
00:07:29,540 --> 00:07:31,960
even know that seminary was, like,

205
00:07:32,435 --> 00:07:34,595
a thing. Because you're from Texas. Yeah. Yeah.

206
00:07:34,595 --> 00:07:36,675
Early morning seminary was here. Yeah. And so

207
00:07:36,675 --> 00:07:39,395
I didn't know that, like and then and

208
00:07:39,395 --> 00:07:40,915
then, like, we had an assignment to go

209
00:07:40,915 --> 00:07:42,295
watch a seminary class.

210
00:07:42,675 --> 00:07:44,355
And I went to one, and I was

211
00:07:44,355 --> 00:07:44,855
like,

212
00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:47,319
then for the first time, I put two

213
00:07:47,319 --> 00:07:49,079
and two together, why there were all these

214
00:07:49,079 --> 00:07:50,620
mini churches in Utah.

215
00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:52,600
Like, I always saw Right by high school.

216
00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:54,519
Right. And I never put it together they

217
00:07:54,519 --> 00:07:56,920
were by high schools. I have zero sense

218
00:07:56,920 --> 00:07:58,839
of direction. You should know. So, like, I

219
00:07:58,839 --> 00:08:00,360
will drive on a road. I have driven

220
00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:02,654
on 98 times, and it is a new

221
00:08:02,654 --> 00:08:04,574
experience for me, which makes my life really

222
00:08:04,574 --> 00:08:06,014
fun. Probably a good thing in some ways.

223
00:08:06,014 --> 00:08:07,455
Yeah. It's true. I I actually live a

224
00:08:07,455 --> 00:08:08,814
really fun life because I will drive on

225
00:08:08,814 --> 00:08:10,014
this road and be like, what a cool

226
00:08:10,014 --> 00:08:12,014
road. And Jenny's like, this is how we

227
00:08:12,014 --> 00:08:14,139
come home every week. And I'm like, oh,

228
00:08:14,139 --> 00:08:16,860
well, it looks different today. Yeah. But, so

229
00:08:16,860 --> 00:08:18,300
I put it all together, and I went

230
00:08:18,300 --> 00:08:19,579
in, and I was like, wait. This is

231
00:08:19,579 --> 00:08:21,419
like a church. It's like a little church.

232
00:08:21,419 --> 00:08:24,139
And I was so fascinated and still no

233
00:08:24,139 --> 00:08:24,639
interest

234
00:08:25,019 --> 00:08:26,479
really in Uh-huh. In teaching.

235
00:08:26,779 --> 00:08:29,574
Although I should say this, I also put

236
00:08:29,574 --> 00:08:31,435
together when I was in that class

237
00:08:32,054 --> 00:08:34,294
that there was this poster on campus at

238
00:08:34,294 --> 00:08:36,535
BYU that said something about, do you have

239
00:08:36,615 --> 00:08:38,154
do you wanna teach youth?

240
00:08:38,774 --> 00:08:40,980
And every time I saw that poster, like,

241
00:08:40,980 --> 00:08:43,159
I was drawn to it. Uh-huh. Like,

242
00:08:43,700 --> 00:08:45,940
legit, like, more than just, like, oh, what

243
00:08:45,940 --> 00:08:47,700
a I mean, it was a dumpy looking

244
00:08:47,700 --> 00:08:50,259
poster, like bad marketing. You know, like, it

245
00:08:50,259 --> 00:08:52,500
just wasn't cool or anything, but I, like,

246
00:08:52,500 --> 00:08:55,139
had, like, a, like, a spiritual draw to

247
00:08:55,139 --> 00:08:55,639
it.

248
00:08:56,004 --> 00:08:56,745
And so,

249
00:08:57,605 --> 00:08:59,605
anyways So little by little, you were Yeah.

250
00:08:59,605 --> 00:09:01,204
Yeah. Into this. Right? And it's so funny

251
00:09:01,204 --> 00:09:03,704
that I looked back years later. It's like,

252
00:09:03,845 --> 00:09:05,524
I I really think I was drawn to

253
00:09:05,524 --> 00:09:06,504
that. You know?

254
00:09:06,884 --> 00:09:07,384
Whether

255
00:09:07,684 --> 00:09:10,164
I don't know. Whether it was heaven drawing

256
00:09:10,164 --> 00:09:11,464
me to it or just

257
00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:13,759
a personal interest or I don't I don't

258
00:09:13,759 --> 00:09:15,519
know. But I there was some sort of

259
00:09:15,519 --> 00:09:17,759
draw to it. And, anyways, took the class,

260
00:09:17,759 --> 00:09:19,300
and then I moved to Hawaii

261
00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:21,759
Naturally. To go to school. Right? And so

262
00:09:21,759 --> 00:09:23,839
I just kinda left that behind. And Uh-huh.

263
00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:25,759
And when we moved back, we moved back

264
00:09:25,759 --> 00:09:26,580
mostly because

265
00:09:27,004 --> 00:09:28,605
Jenny was about to have a baby and

266
00:09:28,605 --> 00:09:29,264
we thought,

267
00:09:30,125 --> 00:09:31,725
what are we doing? Like, can we are

268
00:09:31,725 --> 00:09:33,565
we gonna live here forever or what what

269
00:09:33,725 --> 00:09:35,745
anyways. And part of that decision

270
00:09:36,205 --> 00:09:38,225
was I'm still sort of intrigued by

271
00:09:39,129 --> 00:09:41,629
what could be, you know, in that world.

272
00:09:41,689 --> 00:09:44,569
And yeah. So so anyways, there you go.

273
00:09:44,569 --> 00:09:46,250
I so I kind of fell into it.

274
00:09:46,250 --> 00:09:47,610
So there wasn't, like, a moment where you

275
00:09:47,610 --> 00:09:49,769
thought, alright, now I I promised myself I'll

276
00:09:49,769 --> 00:09:51,370
be a teacher. No. Never. Just little by

277
00:09:51,370 --> 00:09:53,209
little, suddenly, this is the direction Yeah. And

278
00:09:53,209 --> 00:09:54,914
I still I still, like,

279
00:09:55,394 --> 00:09:55,894
at

280
00:09:56,195 --> 00:09:58,454
least once a year, I have a running,

281
00:09:58,914 --> 00:09:59,414
like,

282
00:09:59,794 --> 00:10:01,154
voice in the back of my head that's

283
00:10:01,154 --> 00:10:03,074
always just a battle, I guess. It's just

284
00:10:03,074 --> 00:10:04,514
kind of like, I don't I don't think

285
00:10:04,514 --> 00:10:05,975
I wanna do this forever.

286
00:10:06,754 --> 00:10:09,379
I'm too, like, bored of things too fast,

287
00:10:09,379 --> 00:10:11,059
you know, where I'm just like, what what

288
00:10:11,059 --> 00:10:12,659
else should I do? Where else should I

289
00:10:12,659 --> 00:10:14,899
go? And I have too much of, like,

290
00:10:14,899 --> 00:10:17,059
an entrepreneurial spirit where I'm like, I wanna

291
00:10:17,059 --> 00:10:19,379
build something, and I wanna, like, grow it.

292
00:10:19,379 --> 00:10:21,879
You know? And but then I also love,

293
00:10:22,725 --> 00:10:26,084
like, I love being in the classroom, and

294
00:10:26,084 --> 00:10:26,745
I love

295
00:10:27,284 --> 00:10:29,204
one on ones with people, and I love,

296
00:10:29,204 --> 00:10:31,845
like, the connections and relationships I've made in

297
00:10:31,845 --> 00:10:34,024
in this world. You know?

298
00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,240
I don't think I was, like, put together

299
00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:40,220
to work for anybody. You know? Mhmm. So

300
00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:43,179
that's probably why, like, I don't love, like,

301
00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:45,799
I don't love administrative things at all. I

302
00:10:45,799 --> 00:10:47,835
don't love meetings. I love them

303
00:10:48,215 --> 00:10:50,455
zero. I I and so all of that

304
00:10:50,455 --> 00:10:52,475
part of this world can, like,

305
00:10:52,774 --> 00:10:54,774
grind on me. But then I'll get back

306
00:10:54,774 --> 00:10:55,674
into the classroom

307
00:10:56,134 --> 00:10:57,654
and have that experience, and then I think

308
00:10:57,735 --> 00:10:59,274
It's all worth it. And I think, oh,

309
00:10:59,335 --> 00:11:00,794
I love this. Yeah.

310
00:11:01,110 --> 00:11:02,470
So somehow if I can find a way

311
00:11:02,470 --> 00:11:05,190
to do that without all the meetings and

312
00:11:05,190 --> 00:11:06,730
the schedules and the,

313
00:11:07,750 --> 00:11:09,669
you know, then I then Yeah. It would

314
00:11:09,669 --> 00:11:11,830
be great. But yeah. I did. So I

315
00:11:11,830 --> 00:11:14,034
fell into it. Don't know how long I'll

316
00:11:14,034 --> 00:11:15,954
do it, but for sure, I know I

317
00:11:15,954 --> 00:11:17,574
wanna teach people about Jesus

318
00:11:18,355 --> 00:11:20,834
my whole life, and I love way. Whether

319
00:11:20,834 --> 00:11:22,834
it's a formal classroom or not. Right. And

320
00:11:22,834 --> 00:11:25,475
I and I love people. I love people's

321
00:11:25,475 --> 00:11:27,174
stories. I love people.

322
00:11:27,980 --> 00:11:30,700
They're my passion. So That's awesome. So this

323
00:11:30,700 --> 00:11:31,200
place

324
00:11:31,580 --> 00:11:32,080
teaching

325
00:11:32,460 --> 00:11:34,620
in this kind of place is like I

326
00:11:34,620 --> 00:11:36,300
mean, I've had a chance to leave several

327
00:11:36,300 --> 00:11:38,000
times, and nothing's been

328
00:11:38,620 --> 00:11:40,940
better. I mean, more money, better schedule, sure,

329
00:11:40,940 --> 00:11:42,240
all those. But I'm like,

330
00:11:43,115 --> 00:11:45,834
if if if man, I just love people

331
00:11:45,834 --> 00:11:49,034
and Jesus too much that this place fits

332
00:11:49,034 --> 00:11:50,714
me in that regard. Yeah.

333
00:11:51,514 --> 00:11:53,194
Sometimes I don't feel like I fit in

334
00:11:53,194 --> 00:11:54,095
in this world.

335
00:11:54,794 --> 00:11:57,514
You know? The Seminary Institute world, I've always

336
00:11:57,514 --> 00:11:59,509
felt like a square peg here

337
00:12:00,289 --> 00:12:00,769
that,

338
00:12:01,169 --> 00:12:03,009
I just think a little differently, and I

339
00:12:03,009 --> 00:12:03,829
can tell.

340
00:12:04,370 --> 00:12:04,870
And,

341
00:12:06,529 --> 00:12:09,089
it's a little bit too formal for my

342
00:12:09,089 --> 00:12:11,829
personality. Uh-huh. It's all been fine,

343
00:12:12,209 --> 00:12:13,110
mostly because

344
00:12:13,664 --> 00:12:16,544
I love everybody I worked with and all

345
00:12:16,544 --> 00:12:17,684
the students

346
00:12:18,144 --> 00:12:18,725
that, you know

347
00:12:19,105 --> 00:12:20,705
Yeah. I mean, some of the people I've

348
00:12:20,705 --> 00:12:22,784
taught are still, like, they're, like, my dear

349
00:12:22,784 --> 00:12:25,024
friends. They'll be lifelong friends. Right. And and

350
00:12:25,024 --> 00:12:27,389
so it's just been fantastic. Let's talk about

351
00:12:27,389 --> 00:12:28,590
that more because I'm I'm curious because I

352
00:12:28,590 --> 00:12:30,429
know there are people certain people that may

353
00:12:30,429 --> 00:12:31,870
be called to a leadership position, and I

354
00:12:31,870 --> 00:12:33,009
think, oof, like,

355
00:12:33,550 --> 00:12:35,790
I I get that I was called and

356
00:12:35,790 --> 00:12:37,790
I'm happy to serve, but I just don't

357
00:12:37,790 --> 00:12:39,250
fit this mold. Like,

358
00:12:39,745 --> 00:12:41,425
maybe articulate that further. What do you mean

359
00:12:41,425 --> 00:12:43,264
by that? I mean, is it you don't

360
00:12:43,264 --> 00:12:44,865
you don't love the white shirt and tie

361
00:12:44,865 --> 00:12:46,945
daily or I mean Of course not. That's

362
00:12:46,945 --> 00:12:48,785
the easiest And he isn't as a gym

363
00:12:48,785 --> 00:12:50,165
closer enough for the record.

364
00:12:51,585 --> 00:12:53,264
Because I meant to get here early to

365
00:12:53,264 --> 00:12:55,445
work out before the podcast and then

366
00:12:55,799 --> 00:12:57,179
schedule the whole workout.

367
00:12:57,559 --> 00:12:59,799
But now you how would you articulate that

368
00:12:59,799 --> 00:13:01,399
more that people could maybe relate to? I

369
00:13:01,399 --> 00:13:03,960
mean, what without getting yourself in trouble? No.

370
00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:05,000
No. No. I don't I don't no. I

371
00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:06,600
don't I don't think I don't think it's

372
00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:08,440
a secret or and I don't think there's

373
00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:10,975
anything wrong with it either. I mean, look.

374
00:13:10,975 --> 00:13:12,894
A business gets to decide what their brand

375
00:13:12,894 --> 00:13:14,815
is gonna be, you know, and it's like,

376
00:13:14,815 --> 00:13:16,815
okay. This is our business, and someone's decided

377
00:13:16,815 --> 00:13:18,095
what the brand is gonna be. And, like

378
00:13:18,174 --> 00:13:19,235
and if you don't wanna

379
00:13:19,774 --> 00:13:22,654
be that brand, then that's the business's decision.

380
00:13:22,654 --> 00:13:24,670
Right? So it's not like I'm in no

381
00:13:24,670 --> 00:13:27,230
position to, like, start a revolution or, like,

382
00:13:27,230 --> 00:13:29,389
or anything like that. I will I do

383
00:13:29,389 --> 00:13:31,230
like to push boundaries a little bit and

384
00:13:31,230 --> 00:13:32,830
say, like, wait. Why are we doing this?

385
00:13:32,830 --> 00:13:34,670
Uh-huh. And why are and not to be

386
00:13:34,670 --> 00:13:36,450
contrary Yeah. Legitimately

387
00:13:36,910 --> 00:13:39,154
because, like, you know, I was texting with

388
00:13:39,154 --> 00:13:40,934
Jenny the other day and she just said,

389
00:13:41,235 --> 00:13:43,335
do you think you were just born

390
00:13:43,715 --> 00:13:46,134
that way to to, like, that you question

391
00:13:46,355 --> 00:13:48,995
everything and that you wonder, like and she

392
00:13:48,995 --> 00:13:50,835
says, I just have always just, like, done

393
00:13:50,835 --> 00:13:52,980
what people told me to do. Yeah. And

394
00:13:52,980 --> 00:13:55,139
and that's her personality. And I just and

395
00:13:55,139 --> 00:13:56,440
I was like, oh, well,

396
00:13:57,379 --> 00:13:59,379
probably I mean, because I don't, like, wake

397
00:13:59,379 --> 00:14:01,059
up in the morning and think, what can

398
00:14:01,059 --> 00:14:03,139
I question? You know? What can I, like,

399
00:14:03,139 --> 00:14:03,960
push against?

400
00:14:04,500 --> 00:14:05,080
I legitimately,

401
00:14:05,540 --> 00:14:06,679
like am like,

402
00:14:07,144 --> 00:14:09,625
wait. Why are we doing this? Yeah. When

403
00:14:09,625 --> 00:14:11,784
I was serving as as bishop don't let

404
00:14:11,784 --> 00:14:13,304
me get away from whatever your question was.

405
00:14:13,304 --> 00:14:14,504
No. This is right. Remind me what it

406
00:14:14,504 --> 00:14:16,105
is in a second. When I was serving

407
00:14:16,105 --> 00:14:18,264
as bishop, like, there were several times where

408
00:14:18,264 --> 00:14:20,024
I was like like, I would look at

409
00:14:20,024 --> 00:14:21,804
sacrament meeting and I would think,

410
00:14:22,700 --> 00:14:24,940
why how come how come we do the

411
00:14:24,940 --> 00:14:26,000
sacrament first?

412
00:14:26,700 --> 00:14:29,259
And why are why does a man always

413
00:14:29,259 --> 00:14:30,000
speak last?

414
00:14:30,300 --> 00:14:32,960
Mhmm. And why do we, like, have

415
00:14:33,420 --> 00:14:35,534
song talks? You know? And I was like,

416
00:14:35,694 --> 00:14:36,514
is that a

417
00:14:36,894 --> 00:14:39,054
rule? Can we change that? Like, it just

418
00:14:39,054 --> 00:14:41,134
doesn't seem you know? And so, like and

419
00:14:41,134 --> 00:14:43,534
and why do we have you know? And

420
00:14:43,534 --> 00:14:45,294
and, you know, the young women would come,

421
00:14:45,294 --> 00:14:46,495
like, we need a camp director. And I

422
00:14:46,495 --> 00:14:47,694
was like, why do you need a camp

423
00:14:47,694 --> 00:14:48,194
director?

424
00:14:48,519 --> 00:14:50,200
Does camp have to be five days? Is

425
00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:52,120
that a rule? Like or, you know, like,

426
00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:54,379
the scouts. Like, Jenny served in Cub Scouts

427
00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:56,519
and nursery at the same time because nobody

428
00:14:56,519 --> 00:14:57,740
else would take the calling.

429
00:14:58,759 --> 00:15:00,279
And you were the bishop? Yeah. Because she

430
00:15:00,279 --> 00:15:01,725
was like, I'll just do it. She was

431
00:15:01,725 --> 00:15:03,404
like, I'll just do it. I mean, she

432
00:15:03,404 --> 00:15:05,485
loved nursery by the way, but she hated

433
00:15:05,485 --> 00:15:07,644
Cub Scouts. And I was like, I don't

434
00:15:07,644 --> 00:15:09,485
think you have to meet every week. If

435
00:15:09,485 --> 00:15:11,024
it's burnout for you,

436
00:15:11,404 --> 00:15:13,565
then give homework to the kids for, like,

437
00:15:13,565 --> 00:15:15,620
the second week of the month. And then

438
00:15:15,620 --> 00:15:17,000
the fourth one can be the

439
00:15:17,379 --> 00:15:19,379
pack whatever. And then I was like, you

440
00:15:19,379 --> 00:15:21,779
don't have to do it how everybody's always

441
00:15:21,779 --> 00:15:24,600
done it. Yeah. Like, find the best way.

442
00:15:24,899 --> 00:15:26,419
Sometimes I dream of, like

443
00:15:27,139 --> 00:15:29,080
and maybe it can happen post corona.

444
00:15:29,534 --> 00:15:31,454
I dream of, like Does that world exist,

445
00:15:31,454 --> 00:15:33,855
really? Please tell me it exists. Please tell

446
00:15:33,855 --> 00:15:35,075
me I will die.

447
00:15:35,774 --> 00:15:36,095
I,

448
00:15:36,575 --> 00:15:38,514
I'm like, what if a ward

449
00:15:39,054 --> 00:15:39,554
scrapped

450
00:15:40,174 --> 00:15:40,674
everything,

451
00:15:41,054 --> 00:15:42,514
you know, all programs,

452
00:15:43,509 --> 00:15:45,990
And you walked in and looked at people

453
00:15:45,990 --> 00:15:49,049
first and said, what do the people

454
00:15:49,509 --> 00:15:50,649
actually need?

455
00:15:51,110 --> 00:15:53,209
And then start bringing in

456
00:15:53,829 --> 00:15:55,769
programs that match the needs

457
00:15:56,070 --> 00:15:57,049
instead of

458
00:15:57,985 --> 00:15:59,985
getting called as a young women's president and

459
00:15:59,985 --> 00:16:02,225
saying, what's a young women's president supposed to

460
00:16:02,225 --> 00:16:04,625
do? Give me my, like, what are all

461
00:16:04,625 --> 00:16:05,985
the things? Oh, well, you're supposed to do

462
00:16:05,985 --> 00:16:07,264
camp once a year, and you're supposed to

463
00:16:07,264 --> 00:16:09,665
you're supposed to and it actually might look

464
00:16:09,665 --> 00:16:10,165
identical.

465
00:16:10,529 --> 00:16:12,210
Right. You know, it might end up looking.

466
00:16:12,210 --> 00:16:14,930
Because if I, like, if I did that

467
00:16:14,930 --> 00:16:16,769
and walked in and said, okay. What do

468
00:16:16,769 --> 00:16:17,830
our people need?

469
00:16:18,290 --> 00:16:20,710
Well, what we would want something for,

470
00:16:21,889 --> 00:16:24,470
to study the scriptures together as a community.

471
00:16:25,054 --> 00:16:26,735
And I think and then we would invent

472
00:16:26,735 --> 00:16:28,654
Sunday school. And we're like, okay. And then

473
00:16:28,654 --> 00:16:30,095
we we would probably need something for the

474
00:16:30,095 --> 00:16:30,595
kids.

475
00:16:31,054 --> 00:16:32,654
Right. And then we would invent prime you

476
00:16:32,654 --> 00:16:34,495
know, which is what happened initially. Yeah. Right?

477
00:16:34,495 --> 00:16:36,095
Yeah. That's where all these came from. Yeah.

478
00:16:36,095 --> 00:16:37,534
It didn't come from the prophet. It came

479
00:16:37,534 --> 00:16:39,490
from sort of grassroots. Yeah. The need. What

480
00:16:39,490 --> 00:16:40,610
was the need? Yeah. And it was just

481
00:16:40,610 --> 00:16:42,290
like and then and then someone asked the

482
00:16:42,290 --> 00:16:44,529
question. But now, like, it's all set up,

483
00:16:44,529 --> 00:16:46,450
and it's kind of like instead, we're so

484
00:16:46,450 --> 00:16:49,750
program centered instead of people centered. Uh-huh. And

485
00:16:50,315 --> 00:16:51,834
I don't think we have to scrap everything,

486
00:16:51,834 --> 00:16:53,934
but I think we ought to scrap mindset

487
00:16:54,315 --> 00:16:56,394
and and start with thinking, like, if I

488
00:16:56,394 --> 00:16:58,075
got called as a young woman's president I

489
00:16:58,075 --> 00:16:59,115
don't know why I keep using that. I

490
00:16:59,115 --> 00:17:01,054
will never be a young woman's president, everybody.

491
00:17:02,154 --> 00:17:03,914
You know? But, you know, I just I

492
00:17:03,914 --> 00:17:05,615
would wanna go in and say,

493
00:17:05,980 --> 00:17:06,480
okay.

494
00:17:07,019 --> 00:17:08,480
Here are the girls. Yeah.

495
00:17:09,019 --> 00:17:11,339
And here are the other leaders, and and

496
00:17:11,339 --> 00:17:12,139
what do what do we

497
00:17:12,859 --> 00:17:14,299
what do they need? Right. What can we

498
00:17:14,299 --> 00:17:14,799
create,

499
00:17:15,339 --> 00:17:17,359
you know, for them? And there's so many

500
00:17:17,740 --> 00:17:20,894
reasons, that these this is perpetuated. But, you

501
00:17:20,894 --> 00:17:22,174
know, you may be called as a young

502
00:17:22,174 --> 00:17:24,015
woman's president and not you, but others. But,

503
00:17:24,414 --> 00:17:25,575
and you sort of feel like, what was

504
00:17:25,575 --> 00:17:27,615
the last person doing? And that must worked.

505
00:17:27,615 --> 00:17:29,214
That must have worked. So let's keep doing

506
00:17:29,214 --> 00:17:31,134
that. Right? Right. And so we just sort

507
00:17:31,134 --> 00:17:32,279
of do do and or I don't wanna

508
00:17:32,279 --> 00:17:34,119
change it and hurt her feelings or his

509
00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:36,859
feelings because obviously you had something going there.

510
00:17:37,399 --> 00:17:39,240
But I remember when I got called in

511
00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:41,319
the stake presidency, we, you know, were starting

512
00:17:41,319 --> 00:17:42,940
the the, ward conferences.

513
00:17:43,654 --> 00:17:45,014
And we had seen you know, I'd been

514
00:17:45,014 --> 00:17:46,615
a bishop before that. We'd seen how the

515
00:17:46,615 --> 00:17:48,294
stake did word conferences. And we just took

516
00:17:48,294 --> 00:17:50,534
a moment as the stake presidency said, let's

517
00:17:50,534 --> 00:17:53,335
imagine we know nothing about word conferences. And

518
00:17:53,335 --> 00:17:55,095
somebody hands us a handbook and says, you

519
00:17:55,095 --> 00:17:56,934
know, there's a few paragraphs here. Your, like

520
00:17:57,095 --> 00:17:59,250
Yeah. Whatever your purpose is. And so me

521
00:17:59,250 --> 00:18:00,529
and the other counselor, we went in a

522
00:18:00,529 --> 00:18:02,210
room for a couple hours. We just said,

523
00:18:02,210 --> 00:18:03,889
we know nothing. And what does it say?

524
00:18:03,889 --> 00:18:05,250
And we we just wrote down what it

525
00:18:05,250 --> 00:18:06,450
said. And then we said, now let's create

526
00:18:06,450 --> 00:18:09,009
something remarkable following these guidelines. And we went

527
00:18:09,009 --> 00:18:11,115
in a completely different direction as the old

528
00:18:11,115 --> 00:18:13,115
state presidency, and it was remarkable. Right? But

529
00:18:13,115 --> 00:18:14,954
I think it's especially from a leadership standpoint.

530
00:18:14,954 --> 00:18:17,035
It's just that exercise of saying, okay. Let's

531
00:18:17,035 --> 00:18:20,494
imagine you've never heard of girls camp before.

532
00:18:20,634 --> 00:18:22,234
Yeah. What do we do? What does the

533
00:18:22,234 --> 00:18:24,170
handbook say? And then what do the girls

534
00:18:24,170 --> 00:18:25,809
really need? Yeah. You know, do we have

535
00:18:25,809 --> 00:18:27,529
to go to a a campground or all

536
00:18:27,529 --> 00:18:29,049
these things? Right? Yeah. And I really think

537
00:18:29,049 --> 00:18:31,609
the power comes in, like, beginning with people

538
00:18:31,609 --> 00:18:32,269
and purposes.

539
00:18:33,130 --> 00:18:35,529
And I think that's where the exercise is.

540
00:18:35,529 --> 00:18:36,734
It's not like a

541
00:18:37,615 --> 00:18:39,054
exercise of, like, let's be different for the

542
00:18:39,054 --> 00:18:40,974
sake of being different because Yeah. My type

543
00:18:40,974 --> 00:18:41,554
of personality

544
00:18:41,855 --> 00:18:44,095
could easily fall into that, where it's like

545
00:18:44,095 --> 00:18:45,694
you're just, you know and I and I

546
00:18:45,694 --> 00:18:47,454
could see where somebody and I feel like

547
00:18:47,454 --> 00:18:48,894
I have to check myself all the time.

548
00:18:48,894 --> 00:18:49,394
Like,

549
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:51,920
Have I now Brent like, have I now,

550
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:54,080
like, given myself this new identity of the

551
00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:55,840
guy who does things differently? And and I

552
00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:57,840
really don't. I honestly do not think of

553
00:18:57,840 --> 00:18:58,980
myself that way.

554
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:00,980
And I don't mean to be

555
00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:03,440
contrary. And I don't want people to think

556
00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:06,775
that I am, but I learned somewhere along

557
00:19:06,914 --> 00:19:09,015
the road that there isn't a mold.

558
00:19:09,555 --> 00:19:10,515
You know? And once

559
00:19:10,994 --> 00:19:13,575
I feel like I gave that up. Mhmm.

560
00:19:13,634 --> 00:19:15,714
Any, like, last thought of, like, this is

561
00:19:15,875 --> 00:19:18,355
there are ways that things should be done

562
00:19:18,355 --> 00:19:19,875
and and stuff. I I just

563
00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:22,400
I mean, there's things I feel like are

564
00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:24,880
just really loose that we don't necessarily hold

565
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:25,380
loosely.

566
00:19:25,759 --> 00:19:27,279
And there are things that I think are

567
00:19:27,279 --> 00:19:28,180
really important,

568
00:19:28,559 --> 00:19:31,119
and we should hold those. Like, those should

569
00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:33,759
be the shoulds. And and figuring out what

570
00:19:33,759 --> 00:19:35,945
that is, I think, is important for a

571
00:19:35,945 --> 00:19:37,945
person. So going back to your time as

572
00:19:37,945 --> 00:19:40,065
as bishop, like, was it just any way

573
00:19:40,184 --> 00:19:42,664
any other ways this this personality trait or

574
00:19:42,664 --> 00:19:44,904
this perspective was manifest other than maybe just

575
00:19:44,904 --> 00:19:48,150
asking questions and more often? Or how else

576
00:19:48,150 --> 00:19:49,990
did did this manifest itself as in your

577
00:19:49,990 --> 00:19:51,269
role as bishop? Well and what do you

578
00:19:51,269 --> 00:19:52,710
mean? What what are you asking? As far

579
00:19:52,710 --> 00:19:53,430
as, like,

580
00:19:53,830 --> 00:19:54,730
as pushing,

581
00:19:55,109 --> 00:19:55,609
like,

582
00:19:56,150 --> 00:19:58,230
as pushing against sort of that culture that

583
00:19:58,230 --> 00:20:00,230
sometimes is established that we the, you know,

584
00:20:00,230 --> 00:20:01,990
we it's often termed the unwritten order of

585
00:20:01,990 --> 00:20:04,674
things, which like, the men speaking or praying

586
00:20:04,674 --> 00:20:05,714
at the end of the meeting, like, that's

587
00:20:05,714 --> 00:20:07,234
the unwritten order of things. When in reality,

588
00:20:07,234 --> 00:20:09,394
it's like I didn't even understand that phrase,

589
00:20:09,394 --> 00:20:10,054
the guy.

590
00:20:10,755 --> 00:20:12,115
Right. Yeah. But it's it's one thing that

591
00:20:12,115 --> 00:20:13,554
gets thrown around. So is there anything else

592
00:20:13,554 --> 00:20:15,714
you did to sort of just keep stay

593
00:20:15,714 --> 00:20:18,419
fresh and making sure that you're really focusing

594
00:20:18,419 --> 00:20:19,960
on people rather than programs?

595
00:20:21,220 --> 00:20:21,720
Well,

596
00:20:22,659 --> 00:20:23,319
I think,

597
00:20:23,940 --> 00:20:25,639
one of the things that I,

598
00:20:26,740 --> 00:20:29,940
looked my ward council, like, serving with my

599
00:20:29,940 --> 00:20:32,579
ward council is, at that time as bishop,

600
00:20:32,579 --> 00:20:33,079
is

601
00:20:33,414 --> 00:20:35,894
one of the sweetest experiences of my whole

602
00:20:35,894 --> 00:20:36,795
life. Mhmm.

603
00:20:37,734 --> 00:20:39,414
I didn't wanna be bishop. I didn't wanna

604
00:20:39,414 --> 00:20:41,974
be in charge. That's not my personality to

605
00:20:41,974 --> 00:20:43,974
be the in charge person. Uh-huh. You know?

606
00:20:43,974 --> 00:20:45,734
Like, I just I wanna be the idea

607
00:20:45,734 --> 00:20:47,025
generator and, like, the,

608
00:20:47,980 --> 00:20:49,740
the teacher everyone's told me. Yeah. Yeah. You

609
00:20:49,740 --> 00:20:51,179
know what I mean? And I and I

610
00:20:51,179 --> 00:20:53,019
just I didn't the thing I hated most

611
00:20:53,019 --> 00:20:55,659
about being bishop was just, like, everybody wanted

612
00:20:55,659 --> 00:20:57,419
to ask me about all the things. You

613
00:20:57,419 --> 00:20:59,099
know? Like, how many cups should we buy?

614
00:20:59,099 --> 00:21:00,380
And I was like, I don't I don't

615
00:21:00,380 --> 00:21:02,220
wanna be in charge of everything. And then

616
00:21:02,220 --> 00:21:04,215
I I wanna show up to the Christmas

617
00:21:04,215 --> 00:21:06,455
party and like it and not be in

618
00:21:06,455 --> 00:21:07,974
charge of it. You know what I mean?

619
00:21:07,974 --> 00:21:10,055
Yeah. I can so all the things that

620
00:21:10,055 --> 00:21:11,734
I was in charge of I remember first

621
00:21:11,734 --> 00:21:13,174
getting called. I'm gonna get to your question.

622
00:21:13,174 --> 00:21:14,934
I promise. Yeah. You're good. And, like, reading

623
00:21:14,934 --> 00:21:15,755
through the handbook.

624
00:21:16,230 --> 00:21:18,150
And I was like, I'm in charge of

625
00:21:18,150 --> 00:21:18,650
everything.

626
00:21:19,349 --> 00:21:21,029
And then my daughter passed by. She's like,

627
00:21:21,029 --> 00:21:22,950
well, you are the bishop. I was like,

628
00:21:22,950 --> 00:21:24,549
well, this shouldn't I shouldn't be in charge

629
00:21:24,549 --> 00:21:26,309
of all anyways, I didn't like being in

630
00:21:26,309 --> 00:21:28,549
charge of everything. But serving with that ward

631
00:21:28,549 --> 00:21:30,890
council, one of the things that I

632
00:21:31,444 --> 00:21:34,325
looked for when I called somebody to the

633
00:21:34,325 --> 00:21:36,424
ward council I mean, before I

634
00:21:36,805 --> 00:21:39,845
because, you know, when when extending callings, you

635
00:21:39,845 --> 00:21:42,085
know, I always started with just, like, I'm

636
00:21:42,085 --> 00:21:44,565
just looking and asking and thinking and stuff

637
00:21:44,565 --> 00:21:46,529
like that, and then I would be prayerful

638
00:21:46,529 --> 00:21:46,929
about it. But,

639
00:21:48,289 --> 00:21:49,970
one of the questions I would ask is,

640
00:21:49,970 --> 00:21:51,589
does this person have,

641
00:21:52,369 --> 00:21:53,589
a missionary heart?

642
00:21:54,369 --> 00:21:56,710
Meaning, are they a people centered person?

643
00:21:57,250 --> 00:21:58,950
You know? Because I was like, that's that's

644
00:21:59,089 --> 00:22:00,069
who I want

645
00:22:01,164 --> 00:22:02,785
in, you know, serving together

646
00:22:03,244 --> 00:22:06,205
on this. I called ourselves the worship team.

647
00:22:06,205 --> 00:22:07,724
The worship team? Yeah. I was like, you

648
00:22:07,724 --> 00:22:08,224
guys.

649
00:22:08,525 --> 00:22:10,365
And one of the things that we did

650
00:22:10,365 --> 00:22:12,224
is I just said, listen.

651
00:22:13,549 --> 00:22:15,309
One of the things that I loved with

652
00:22:15,309 --> 00:22:17,570
our word council is we we

653
00:22:18,829 --> 00:22:21,329
got together as a word council right as,

654
00:22:22,829 --> 00:22:23,570
we were

655
00:22:24,765 --> 00:22:27,005
being trained on sacrament meeting in the Sabbath

656
00:22:27,005 --> 00:22:28,845
day. Do you remember that? Like, however It

657
00:22:28,845 --> 00:22:31,345
was a big push. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And

658
00:22:31,404 --> 00:22:32,705
I was, like,

659
00:22:33,805 --> 00:22:34,305
struck.

660
00:22:34,924 --> 00:22:36,785
I remember president Nelson,

661
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:39,799
before he was president Nelson, like, just pleading,

662
00:22:39,799 --> 00:22:42,220
let's give sacrament meeting back to the savior.

663
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:45,500
And looking at it, when they said

664
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:47,960
the question that the quorum of the twelve

665
00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:50,119
and first presidency went to the Lord with

666
00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:51,659
was, how do we increase

667
00:22:52,039 --> 00:22:53,019
faith in God

668
00:22:53,855 --> 00:22:55,695
and the savior? And I was like, that's

669
00:22:55,695 --> 00:22:58,515
where we have to start because that is

670
00:22:58,575 --> 00:23:00,434
what's going on here. It's not,

671
00:23:00,735 --> 00:23:03,455
let's do Sabbath day stuff, and let's do

672
00:23:03,455 --> 00:23:05,455
something with sacrament meeting. It was, what was

673
00:23:05,455 --> 00:23:06,434
the actual question?

674
00:23:06,849 --> 00:23:09,269
Mhmm. Question was, how do we increase faith

675
00:23:09,649 --> 00:23:11,349
in God the father in the Son?

676
00:23:12,049 --> 00:23:14,529
So we took that, and and then we

677
00:23:14,529 --> 00:23:15,269
just said,

678
00:23:16,049 --> 00:23:19,190
let's let's make a sacrament meeting a meeting

679
00:23:19,569 --> 00:23:20,069
where

680
00:23:21,025 --> 00:23:22,085
people leave

681
00:23:22,384 --> 00:23:23,285
with a more

682
00:23:24,065 --> 00:23:26,464
thrilling feel for God the father and the

683
00:23:26,464 --> 00:23:29,184
son and, like, with greater faith in them

684
00:23:29,184 --> 00:23:30,804
and trusting them and just

685
00:23:31,744 --> 00:23:34,545
loving them and feeling loved more. Like, that's

686
00:23:34,545 --> 00:23:37,420
our, like, that's our purpose and our

687
00:23:38,200 --> 00:23:41,080
intention. Yeah. And I called them the worship

688
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:41,900
team because

689
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:44,700
I was like, listen. In every other church,

690
00:23:46,599 --> 00:23:48,200
They got a worship team. Right? Yeah. Yeah.

691
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:50,839
And you have to create an experience for

692
00:23:50,839 --> 00:23:52,654
people that that they're gonna come back to.

693
00:23:52,654 --> 00:23:55,375
Yeah. It's people centered. It's like, let's create

694
00:23:55,375 --> 00:23:57,295
something for the people. Or they can go

695
00:23:57,295 --> 00:23:58,575
down the street and find a better church

696
00:23:58,575 --> 00:24:00,015
that does that. Exactly. Yeah. Where we're sort

697
00:24:00,015 --> 00:24:01,295
of like, no. Actually, you live on the

698
00:24:01,295 --> 00:24:02,815
street, so you go to this church. Yeah.

699
00:24:02,815 --> 00:24:03,934
It's like, you have to come to this

700
00:24:03,934 --> 00:24:05,295
church. And I was like, and sometimes you're

701
00:24:05,295 --> 00:24:06,654
like, if you don't come to sacrament meeting,

702
00:24:06,654 --> 00:24:08,169
then you don't get a temple recommend.

703
00:24:08,470 --> 00:24:10,809
And you're supposed to come to sacrament meeting.

704
00:24:11,029 --> 00:24:11,529
So

705
00:24:12,230 --> 00:24:13,910
I guess suck it up. If it's if

706
00:24:13,910 --> 00:24:16,150
it's dumb or bad, then you have to

707
00:24:16,150 --> 00:24:18,470
deal with it. And it's like, what if

708
00:24:18,470 --> 00:24:20,869
we shifted our thinking? And, like, let's actually

709
00:24:20,869 --> 00:24:21,369
create

710
00:24:22,184 --> 00:24:23,565
a meaningful experience

711
00:24:23,944 --> 00:24:26,345
like our jobs depend on it. Let's pretend

712
00:24:26,345 --> 00:24:28,505
like our jobs depend on it here. And

713
00:24:28,505 --> 00:24:30,904
I'm not saying that that's the approach that

714
00:24:30,904 --> 00:24:32,605
other faiths take. I legitimately,

715
00:24:32,984 --> 00:24:33,484
like,

716
00:24:34,049 --> 00:24:36,610
believe and feel and and have seen that

717
00:24:36,610 --> 00:24:38,070
they take the approach of

718
00:24:38,529 --> 00:24:40,690
we gotta give our people an experience with

719
00:24:40,690 --> 00:24:41,190
God.

720
00:24:41,570 --> 00:24:43,090
So so let's do it. Yeah. I wanna

721
00:24:43,090 --> 00:24:44,769
take just a quick time out and just

722
00:24:44,769 --> 00:24:47,110
illustrate what you're talking about because

723
00:24:47,490 --> 00:24:50,095
or or highlight it. Because oftentimes I talk

724
00:24:50,095 --> 00:24:52,815
about the importance of or other people I

725
00:24:52,815 --> 00:24:54,654
interview talk about the importance of establishing a

726
00:24:54,654 --> 00:24:56,335
strong vision in a ward and people are

727
00:24:56,335 --> 00:24:57,454
like, well, I don't know what that look

728
00:24:57,454 --> 00:24:59,214
like. I mean, we just make sure the

729
00:24:59,214 --> 00:25:01,295
doors are unlocked and sacraments pass and we

730
00:25:01,295 --> 00:25:03,109
go home. Right? But this is a perfect

731
00:25:03,109 --> 00:25:05,609
example what a strong vision looks like that

732
00:25:05,750 --> 00:25:07,929
we're gonna focus on this question and sacrament

733
00:25:07,990 --> 00:25:09,829
is gonna be everything. We're the worship team.

734
00:25:09,829 --> 00:25:12,389
Right? I mean, even the simple tactic of

735
00:25:12,389 --> 00:25:14,950
labeling your ward council as a team of

736
00:25:14,950 --> 00:25:17,509
some type worship or what pick whatever name,

737
00:25:17,509 --> 00:25:19,884
like, that's different. That that brings a different

738
00:25:19,884 --> 00:25:22,125
feel, and and people lean in in those

739
00:25:22,125 --> 00:25:22,625
meetings

740
00:25:23,164 --> 00:25:25,005
when that happens. Yeah. Because, like, we did

741
00:25:25,005 --> 00:25:26,144
the same thing with

742
00:25:26,445 --> 00:25:29,105
home teaching and visiting teaching Uh-huh. Where

743
00:25:29,565 --> 00:25:30,545
we sat together.

744
00:25:32,125 --> 00:25:33,025
We honestly

745
00:25:34,289 --> 00:25:36,789
worked on sacrament meeting the whole time

746
00:25:37,169 --> 00:25:38,230
that I was bishop.

747
00:25:38,690 --> 00:25:41,250
We kept coming back to it. We honestly

748
00:25:41,250 --> 00:25:42,529
kept coming back to it. And I was

749
00:25:42,529 --> 00:25:43,429
like, you guys,

750
00:25:43,889 --> 00:25:46,710
we have got to, like, end every sacrament

751
00:25:46,769 --> 00:25:49,845
meeting and feel like, do people love God

752
00:25:50,384 --> 00:25:53,184
more Yeah. After that meeting? Yeah. You know?

753
00:25:53,184 --> 00:25:55,105
Yeah. And do they feel loved by him

754
00:25:55,105 --> 00:25:56,625
more? And if not, like, what do we

755
00:25:56,625 --> 00:25:59,345
do? Yeah. We're missing it. Let's change it.

756
00:25:59,345 --> 00:26:01,700
And then we worked on so many things

757
00:26:01,700 --> 00:26:03,160
so many things through that.

758
00:26:03,460 --> 00:26:05,140
Yeah. So what did you do? I'm just

759
00:26:05,140 --> 00:26:06,820
curious. So what what did that lead to?

760
00:26:06,820 --> 00:26:08,420
What I did? Or It just it led

761
00:26:08,500 --> 00:26:09,960
one of the things that we did,

762
00:26:10,660 --> 00:26:12,920
that I thought ended up so

763
00:26:13,825 --> 00:26:15,045
personally significant,

764
00:26:16,305 --> 00:26:19,025
was we divided up the ward into groups

765
00:26:19,025 --> 00:26:21,045
of 15 to 20 and

766
00:26:21,505 --> 00:26:23,265
assigned for the rest of the year, I

767
00:26:23,265 --> 00:26:24,865
can't remember what month we started, out the

768
00:26:24,865 --> 00:26:26,865
rest of the year, the second and third

769
00:26:26,865 --> 00:26:28,759
hour of church. Like, we gave them a

770
00:26:28,759 --> 00:26:30,539
date. This is your date that you're coming.

771
00:26:30,759 --> 00:26:33,419
And we gathered around the sacrament table,

772
00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:35,720
and we taught for the second and third

773
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:37,640
hour of church, that group. So they came

774
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:39,240
out of whatever classes they were in, and

775
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:40,985
we made arrangements. So this is during three

776
00:26:40,985 --> 00:26:42,985
three hour church. Right? So they back in

777
00:26:42,985 --> 00:26:45,065
those days. Yeah. Right. And and for two

778
00:26:45,065 --> 00:26:46,525
hours, we talked about,

779
00:26:47,065 --> 00:26:49,005
what we called the story of the lamb.

780
00:26:49,384 --> 00:26:51,644
And we went from Adam and Eve

781
00:26:52,025 --> 00:26:52,765
in Genesis

782
00:26:53,470 --> 00:26:55,630
and asking how do we get back and

783
00:26:55,630 --> 00:26:58,029
the sacrifice of the lamb being introduced all

784
00:26:58,029 --> 00:26:58,850
the way through

785
00:26:59,309 --> 00:27:01,390
the Last Supper, and we told the story

786
00:27:01,390 --> 00:27:01,890
of

787
00:27:02,269 --> 00:27:02,769
Jesus

788
00:27:03,309 --> 00:27:06,350
and how that story is retold every single

789
00:27:06,350 --> 00:27:07,330
week in the sacrament.

790
00:27:08,474 --> 00:27:09,615
That it is this

791
00:27:09,994 --> 00:27:10,494
long

792
00:27:11,194 --> 00:27:13,855
these this is the story being retold.

793
00:27:14,315 --> 00:27:15,934
It's the redemption story

794
00:27:16,634 --> 00:27:18,875
being retold every single week so that we

795
00:27:18,875 --> 00:27:21,750
re like, we root ourselves in it. And

796
00:27:21,750 --> 00:27:24,309
it was, like, we had just beautiful and

797
00:27:24,309 --> 00:27:27,190
our word council divided up, and we taught

798
00:27:27,190 --> 00:27:28,890
together, and and

799
00:27:29,430 --> 00:27:31,109
and we used some of, like, the the

800
00:27:31,109 --> 00:27:33,349
training clips, and and we just, like, we

801
00:27:33,349 --> 00:27:34,329
just said, like,

802
00:27:34,950 --> 00:27:36,329
let's teach everybody

803
00:27:37,144 --> 00:27:37,804
the significance

804
00:27:38,744 --> 00:27:40,044
of the sacrament

805
00:27:40,505 --> 00:27:43,784
and how it can be this instrument of

806
00:27:43,784 --> 00:27:45,944
worship and how it can connect us to

807
00:27:45,944 --> 00:27:48,105
God in a really significant way. So we

808
00:27:48,105 --> 00:27:49,244
began with, like,

809
00:27:49,740 --> 00:27:51,200
this really will be

810
00:27:51,660 --> 00:27:53,359
the highlight of the meeting

811
00:27:53,980 --> 00:27:56,059
and not just, like, kind of, like, do

812
00:27:56,140 --> 00:27:57,820
yeah. Do the sacrament real quick and then

813
00:27:57,820 --> 00:27:59,900
get to the speakers. Yeah. That's why everybody's

814
00:27:59,900 --> 00:28:01,660
here is to hear somebody speak. You know?

815
00:28:01,660 --> 00:28:03,714
It's like, let's real so we really, like,

816
00:28:03,714 --> 00:28:05,634
we it took us, like, eight months to

817
00:28:05,634 --> 00:28:07,474
get through the whole ward. Really? And we

818
00:28:07,474 --> 00:28:08,694
did it with the primary

819
00:28:09,634 --> 00:28:13,095
and primary teachers. And we gave people permission,

820
00:28:13,554 --> 00:28:15,875
like I mean, made arrangements permission that sounded

821
00:28:15,875 --> 00:28:17,734
like we were, like, bizarre or something.

822
00:28:18,350 --> 00:28:19,490
We made arrangements

823
00:28:20,029 --> 00:28:21,710
so that if a family wanted to come

824
00:28:21,710 --> 00:28:22,670
in with their kids

825
00:28:23,390 --> 00:28:25,549
Mhmm. Like, just the family alone in the

826
00:28:25,549 --> 00:28:25,950
chapel.

827
00:28:26,350 --> 00:28:28,190
About the sacrament, like, on a, like, on

828
00:28:28,190 --> 00:28:30,509
a Thursday night to, like, help their kids

829
00:28:30,509 --> 00:28:32,850
realize, like, okay. So that's why

830
00:28:33,424 --> 00:28:35,424
we are, you know, gonna come a little

831
00:28:35,424 --> 00:28:38,065
bit early. That's why we're, you know, just

832
00:28:38,065 --> 00:28:38,625
to, like

833
00:28:39,265 --> 00:28:40,785
Yeah. And it makes an impression on those

834
00:28:40,785 --> 00:28:42,065
young minds. Yeah. And it's like, this is

835
00:28:42,065 --> 00:28:44,544
why we're saying, like, you know anyways, to

836
00:28:44,544 --> 00:28:47,509
teach that. And then, yeah, I that was

837
00:28:47,509 --> 00:28:49,429
just and then and then we took, like,

838
00:28:49,429 --> 00:28:50,490
the actual, like,

839
00:28:51,029 --> 00:28:53,910
program itself. You know? Like and we just

840
00:28:53,910 --> 00:28:55,829
said, okay. So okay. How do we what

841
00:28:55,829 --> 00:28:57,609
do we want people to speak on?

842
00:28:57,990 --> 00:29:00,089
And we started, like we changed,

843
00:29:00,605 --> 00:29:02,845
like, what we spoke on. So we would

844
00:29:02,845 --> 00:29:04,545
do these, like, series almost,

845
00:29:05,164 --> 00:29:06,545
where it was like, okay.

846
00:29:07,164 --> 00:29:08,785
We took the names of Christ,

847
00:29:09,644 --> 00:29:11,724
and we brought people in who were gonna

848
00:29:11,724 --> 00:29:13,484
speak, like, a month ahead of time. And

849
00:29:13,484 --> 00:29:14,384
we're just like,

850
00:29:14,690 --> 00:29:15,890
we want you to pick one of the

851
00:29:15,890 --> 00:29:17,829
names of Christ in the scriptures

852
00:29:18,210 --> 00:29:20,529
and tell us, like, what you learned about

853
00:29:20,529 --> 00:29:22,470
that name in the scriptures, but then specifically

854
00:29:22,690 --> 00:29:23,750
how you've seen

855
00:29:24,529 --> 00:29:26,849
him as the shepherd or the advocate in

856
00:29:26,849 --> 00:29:29,325
your own story. Mhmm. You know? And then

857
00:29:29,325 --> 00:29:30,705
we did the book of John,

858
00:29:31,325 --> 00:29:33,484
and, like, we gave someone just a chapter

859
00:29:33,484 --> 00:29:34,845
of the book of John. We moved to

860
00:29:34,845 --> 00:29:36,045
the whole book of John, and we're just

861
00:29:36,045 --> 00:29:37,884
like, what do you find and learn and

862
00:29:37,884 --> 00:29:40,859
feel about the savior in this chapter? Wow.

863
00:29:40,940 --> 00:29:42,700
Like, and we just so we shifted, like,

864
00:29:42,700 --> 00:29:44,940
what we were speaking on, and and we

865
00:29:44,940 --> 00:29:47,679
gave people a new focus on speaking. Like,

866
00:29:47,740 --> 00:29:49,759
we would really bring them in

867
00:29:50,619 --> 00:29:52,380
and, like, talk to them about It's like

868
00:29:52,380 --> 00:29:54,779
an orientation type of meeting. Like This is

869
00:29:54,779 --> 00:29:56,480
our purpose with the sacrament

870
00:29:56,865 --> 00:29:59,345
meeting. This is what we're going for, and

871
00:29:59,345 --> 00:30:00,565
your contribution

872
00:30:01,184 --> 00:30:03,444
is what's going to make it so holy

873
00:30:03,904 --> 00:30:05,505
because of the time that you'll put in.

874
00:30:05,505 --> 00:30:06,005
And,

875
00:30:06,704 --> 00:30:08,005
like, your experience

876
00:30:08,545 --> 00:30:10,005
is what we wanna hear.

877
00:30:10,429 --> 00:30:13,470
Like, your personal journey in in relationship. Like,

878
00:30:13,470 --> 00:30:15,230
don't give us a book report on a

879
00:30:15,230 --> 00:30:16,130
conference talk.

880
00:30:16,509 --> 00:30:17,730
Like, and we specifically

881
00:30:18,109 --> 00:30:20,109
tried to push back on that to just

882
00:30:20,109 --> 00:30:22,509
be like Yeah. And and it can be

883
00:30:22,509 --> 00:30:25,545
raw, and it can be messy, and that

884
00:30:25,545 --> 00:30:28,025
it will actually is what's gonna make it

885
00:30:28,025 --> 00:30:28,525
spectacular.

886
00:30:29,384 --> 00:30:31,865
And so so we pushed on topics and,

887
00:30:31,865 --> 00:30:34,105
like, in the order of things. Like, we

888
00:30:34,105 --> 00:30:36,045
actually put a musical number

889
00:30:36,424 --> 00:30:38,664
in at the beginning of the meeting. Yeah.

890
00:30:38,664 --> 00:30:40,680
I I call that a general conference style.

891
00:30:40,759 --> 00:30:42,039
Yeah. Like I said, we're gonna do this

892
00:30:42,039 --> 00:30:43,960
general conference style, and there people are just

893
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:45,400
gonna be sitting there chatting, and then all

894
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:46,920
of a sudden this choir starts or this

895
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,000
solo begins. It's awesome. Yeah. And then we

896
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:51,880
started, like, doing a mini talk before the

897
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:52,380
sacrament

898
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:55,000
about the sacrament. Uh-huh. Because I always thought

899
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:56,140
to myself, like,

900
00:30:56,494 --> 00:30:58,195
you come into sacrament meeting,

901
00:30:58,975 --> 00:31:02,174
and and you've got four kids, and you

902
00:31:02,174 --> 00:31:05,695
just got done, like, yelling at them because

903
00:31:05,695 --> 00:31:07,775
they couldn't find their shoes for heaven's sake.

904
00:31:07,775 --> 00:31:09,394
Like, our house is not that big.

905
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,119
And we are just a hot mess in

906
00:31:12,119 --> 00:31:12,779
the pew,

907
00:31:13,799 --> 00:31:15,880
so mad, and then all of a sudden,

908
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,039
it's just like, okay. Well, now There's some

909
00:31:18,039 --> 00:31:19,880
water. Yeah. We'll take the water. Sacrament him.

910
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:22,039
And it's like, nobody got a chance to

911
00:31:22,039 --> 00:31:24,305
got to get warmed up Yeah. Like, what

912
00:31:24,305 --> 00:31:26,005
was about to happen. So I was like,

913
00:31:26,144 --> 00:31:26,644
let's

914
00:31:27,345 --> 00:31:28,725
give people a chance

915
00:31:29,424 --> 00:31:32,225
to, like, warm up to it. Mhmm. You

916
00:31:32,225 --> 00:31:34,785
know? Let's, like, open whatever the sacrament hymn

917
00:31:34,785 --> 00:31:37,039
is going to be, Let's open it

918
00:31:37,659 --> 00:31:39,819
up and like teach what the lines are

919
00:31:39,819 --> 00:31:42,299
actually teaching. Wow. So that like people are

920
00:31:42,299 --> 00:31:44,779
thinking like, as they like, anyways, those are

921
00:31:44,779 --> 00:31:46,619
all just ideas. But the point was that,

922
00:31:46,619 --> 00:31:48,319
like, we just started with

923
00:31:49,025 --> 00:31:51,265
what is this meeting actually for? Like, what

924
00:31:51,265 --> 00:31:53,505
are we trying to accomplish? Mhmm. You know?

925
00:31:53,505 --> 00:31:55,284
Yeah. And we legitimately

926
00:31:56,544 --> 00:31:57,044
just

927
00:31:57,744 --> 00:31:59,284
felt really strongly

928
00:31:59,585 --> 00:32:01,605
about I want this to be a meeting

929
00:32:02,490 --> 00:32:03,230
where people,

930
00:32:04,170 --> 00:32:05,470
like, learn to love

931
00:32:06,170 --> 00:32:08,509
God more and and feel connected

932
00:32:09,210 --> 00:32:11,470
to the Father and the Son in significant

933
00:32:11,609 --> 00:32:12,509
ways. So

934
00:32:13,049 --> 00:32:14,490
what do we do Yeah. To make that

935
00:32:14,490 --> 00:32:17,095
happen? And then all these just Yeah. And

936
00:32:17,095 --> 00:32:19,115
other ideas that aren't as

937
00:32:19,494 --> 00:32:21,815
good or didn't work. You know? The concession

938
00:32:21,815 --> 00:32:24,134
stands didn't really fly. Didn't work out as

939
00:32:24,134 --> 00:32:25,654
well. You know? It just was a mess.

940
00:32:25,654 --> 00:32:27,174
And, like, we had to buy vacuums and

941
00:32:27,174 --> 00:32:28,234
didn't have the budget.

942
00:32:28,694 --> 00:32:28,855
But,

943
00:32:29,859 --> 00:32:32,259
anyways, so Nice. So with the with the

944
00:32:32,259 --> 00:32:35,139
speaker, method, I mean, with, like, how high

945
00:32:35,139 --> 00:32:37,619
council speakers or state speakers, did you just

946
00:32:37,619 --> 00:32:39,700
sort of roll them into that that routine

947
00:32:39,700 --> 00:32:41,079
and process? Well,

948
00:32:41,779 --> 00:32:43,380
I I actually just went to the state

949
00:32:43,380 --> 00:32:44,839
president, and I just said,

950
00:32:45,174 --> 00:32:46,934
what is the purpose of the high council

951
00:32:46,934 --> 00:32:48,855
speaker? Woah. Woah. Woah. Woah. Woah. You can't

952
00:32:48,855 --> 00:32:49,515
ask that.

953
00:32:50,695 --> 00:32:52,795
I was like, are they coming with,

954
00:32:53,335 --> 00:32:56,134
what your message? Is that what your intention

955
00:32:56,134 --> 00:32:56,954
is? And

956
00:32:57,430 --> 00:32:59,690
and I had two different state presidents,

957
00:33:00,390 --> 00:33:02,309
both good friends of mine, and I just

958
00:33:02,309 --> 00:33:02,890
was like,

959
00:33:03,910 --> 00:33:05,670
this is what we're trying to do in

960
00:33:05,670 --> 00:33:08,230
our in in our ward. This is what

961
00:33:08,230 --> 00:33:09,815
we're trying to do. And

962
00:33:10,194 --> 00:33:11,794
so that's what that's what we did. So,

963
00:33:11,794 --> 00:33:14,674
like, with sometimes, like, they really came with,

964
00:33:14,674 --> 00:33:16,595
like, this is this is the kind of

965
00:33:16,595 --> 00:33:18,674
state president felt impressed that he wants this

966
00:33:18,674 --> 00:33:20,194
message given to the ward, and it was,

967
00:33:20,194 --> 00:33:21,634
like, perfect. So it kind of was just,

968
00:33:21,634 --> 00:33:23,794
like, a pause from the book of John.

969
00:33:23,794 --> 00:33:26,000
Yeah. You know? And and sometimes I'd ask,

970
00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:28,159
do you want the high council speaker to

971
00:33:28,159 --> 00:33:30,240
come? Uh-huh. Because, like because we're good. If

972
00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:31,460
not Yeah. If you don't

973
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,240
No pressure. Insist on them coming, we have

974
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:34,880
people that we

975
00:33:35,759 --> 00:33:37,200
you know? And if they did, if they

976
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,705
wanted, like, stake representation there or whatever, then

977
00:33:39,705 --> 00:33:42,205
we would give that high council person, like,

978
00:33:42,424 --> 00:33:44,505
our Yeah. Topic. Yeah. And and that this

979
00:33:44,505 --> 00:33:45,785
is another point I need to pause and

980
00:33:45,785 --> 00:33:48,664
underscore because that relationship between the bishop and

981
00:33:48,664 --> 00:33:51,065
the stake presidency like, I remember going from

982
00:33:51,065 --> 00:33:52,664
bishop to the stake presidency, and you sort

983
00:33:52,664 --> 00:33:54,130
of feel like, okay. Now I'm like a

984
00:33:54,130 --> 00:33:56,369
super bishop and I create super programs and

985
00:33:56,369 --> 00:33:58,769
I do super interviews with people. And but

986
00:33:58,769 --> 00:33:59,410
what we

987
00:33:59,890 --> 00:34:01,430
when we get in that mode, you overshadow

988
00:34:01,809 --> 00:34:04,230
the keys of the bishop and their autonomy

989
00:34:04,289 --> 00:34:06,210
and whatnot. And so having some of these

990
00:34:06,210 --> 00:34:08,585
discussions where you go to the stake presidency

991
00:34:08,585 --> 00:34:09,864
and say, okay, why are you doing this?

992
00:34:09,864 --> 00:34:11,785
Like, really sell me on this because I've

993
00:34:11,785 --> 00:34:13,224
got a great program going here or I've

994
00:34:13,224 --> 00:34:15,065
got this idea. So if you wanna do

995
00:34:15,065 --> 00:34:16,664
this, great. But you need to explain to

996
00:34:16,664 --> 00:34:18,184
me why this happened and really sort of

997
00:34:18,184 --> 00:34:19,385
push them on some of those things, you

998
00:34:19,385 --> 00:34:21,465
know, obviously in a friendly, respectful manner. But

999
00:34:21,704 --> 00:34:23,869
Yeah. You're gonna discover further,

1000
00:34:24,969 --> 00:34:26,969
effectiveness in some of these these things we

1001
00:34:26,969 --> 00:34:29,389
do. Right? Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. I

1002
00:34:30,010 --> 00:34:31,690
thought that was great to do that, you

1003
00:34:31,690 --> 00:34:32,969
know, and it's just like, oh, okay. I

1004
00:34:32,969 --> 00:34:35,289
don't I'm not trying to Yeah. Get out

1005
00:34:35,289 --> 00:34:38,065
of line or whatever. That's that's a because

1006
00:34:38,065 --> 00:34:40,304
a lot of state presidents organization. A lot

1007
00:34:40,304 --> 00:34:41,505
of state presidents can see, like, the high

1008
00:34:41,505 --> 00:34:42,785
council week is, like, oh, we're sort of

1009
00:34:42,785 --> 00:34:44,385
helping you out. Hey. Here's a speaker. You

1010
00:34:44,385 --> 00:34:45,664
know, you don't gotta worry about a speaker

1011
00:34:45,664 --> 00:34:47,425
that week. Like, oh, good. Alright. Because I'm

1012
00:34:47,425 --> 00:34:49,025
really not sure. Yeah. People are saying no

1013
00:34:49,025 --> 00:34:50,785
or whatever. Right? So Yeah. And I did

1014
00:34:50,785 --> 00:34:52,400
not think they needed to come for that

1015
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,160
reason. Like, I my thought was that you

1016
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:55,360
do not need to come to give me

1017
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,160
a break. Right. Our preference would be for

1018
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:00,400
our word to hear from our people. Uh-huh.

1019
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:02,240
You know, that's like my that's that would

1020
00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:04,160
be my preference. Mhmm. It's kind of like

1021
00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:06,924
what I went in with. Mhmm. But I

1022
00:35:06,924 --> 00:35:07,424
also,

1023
00:35:07,724 --> 00:35:09,585
like, appreciate and understand

1024
00:35:10,125 --> 00:35:11,585
that a stake president's

1025
00:35:11,885 --> 00:35:14,065
vision and a stake president's, like,

1026
00:35:14,525 --> 00:35:15,505
kind of impressions

1027
00:35:15,885 --> 00:35:17,565
as they put their kind of hand on

1028
00:35:17,565 --> 00:35:19,984
the pulse of the entire stake in area,

1029
00:35:20,329 --> 00:35:22,329
I do not have like, I don't have

1030
00:35:22,329 --> 00:35:22,829
that.

1031
00:35:23,369 --> 00:35:23,869
And

1032
00:35:24,250 --> 00:35:27,289
sometimes it's awesome to get somebody outside of

1033
00:35:27,289 --> 00:35:27,869
our neighborhood,

1034
00:35:28,409 --> 00:35:30,090
you know, who can come in and give

1035
00:35:30,090 --> 00:35:32,994
their, like, thoughts and impressions. And I think

1036
00:35:32,994 --> 00:35:35,655
it's good for people to see, like, oh.

1037
00:35:35,795 --> 00:35:38,594
You know, because, really, in an to divide

1038
00:35:38,594 --> 00:35:39,894
up a ward by neighborhood

1039
00:35:40,675 --> 00:35:43,414
means that you have very, very little, like,

1040
00:35:43,474 --> 00:35:43,974
diversity.

1041
00:35:44,275 --> 00:35:45,329
Right. Because,

1042
00:35:45,710 --> 00:35:48,609
like, similar income status, similar, like, draw.

1043
00:35:48,909 --> 00:35:50,589
You know, like, all these people, like, wanted

1044
00:35:50,589 --> 00:35:52,190
to be close to a freeway, and all

1045
00:35:52,190 --> 00:35:54,989
these people, like, could afford this neighborhood, and

1046
00:35:54,989 --> 00:35:57,414
all these people liked the parks. Or so

1047
00:35:57,414 --> 00:35:57,914
sometimes

1048
00:35:58,375 --> 00:36:00,214
within a stake, you could get a little

1049
00:36:00,214 --> 00:36:02,054
bit more, and it's it's nice. And Utah's

1050
00:36:02,054 --> 00:36:04,054
gonna be harder because Right. In all neighborhoods,

1051
00:36:04,054 --> 00:36:06,154
it's a stake. Exactly. Exactly. So,

1052
00:36:06,454 --> 00:36:08,214
there's so much benefit to it. I just

1053
00:36:08,214 --> 00:36:09,514
wanted to ask.

1054
00:36:09,989 --> 00:36:12,250
Again, we ended up doing the same thing,

1055
00:36:12,389 --> 00:36:14,789
but it was nice to, like, what's the

1056
00:36:14,789 --> 00:36:15,929
purpose of this?

1057
00:36:16,469 --> 00:36:18,309
You know? Yeah. And, like, it just gave

1058
00:36:18,309 --> 00:36:19,610
it a little bit more

1059
00:36:20,150 --> 00:36:22,550
punch and power to, like, begin with, like

1060
00:36:23,255 --> 00:36:25,114
in someone's individual worship,

1061
00:36:26,454 --> 00:36:28,054
if they take this approach, what am I

1062
00:36:28,054 --> 00:36:29,114
supposed to do

1063
00:36:29,815 --> 00:36:31,735
as a member of this church? Well, I'm

1064
00:36:31,735 --> 00:36:33,335
supposed to pray every day, and I'm supposed

1065
00:36:33,335 --> 00:36:34,855
to, and I'm supposed to, and I'm supposed

1066
00:36:34,855 --> 00:36:36,590
to, right, and do that. And what if

1067
00:36:36,590 --> 00:36:38,269
they did it in their own individual worship?

1068
00:36:38,269 --> 00:36:39,630
They scrapped and they said

1069
00:36:40,190 --> 00:36:43,070
started with, I wanna make a connection with

1070
00:36:43,070 --> 00:36:44,210
God every day.

1071
00:36:44,750 --> 00:36:46,690
Mhmm. You know? What could I do?

1072
00:36:46,989 --> 00:36:49,170
I bet the list would look the same.

1073
00:36:50,045 --> 00:36:52,704
They would say, I wanna open his words,

1074
00:36:53,085 --> 00:36:54,785
and I wanna spend time in prayer.

1075
00:36:55,164 --> 00:36:58,305
And but because you started with that question

1076
00:36:58,525 --> 00:36:59,025
first,

1077
00:36:59,325 --> 00:37:00,625
how do I make a connection,

1078
00:37:01,579 --> 00:37:03,900
then all of those that list all of

1079
00:37:03,900 --> 00:37:04,940
a sudden becomes super

1080
00:37:05,579 --> 00:37:06,639
way more meaningful

1081
00:37:06,940 --> 00:37:08,860
Mhmm. Than, like, oh, I'm supposed to do

1082
00:37:08,860 --> 00:37:10,880
it to, you know, fit the mold

1083
00:37:11,500 --> 00:37:14,300
instead of, like, I actually, like I started

1084
00:37:14,300 --> 00:37:15,920
at square one, and I said,

1085
00:37:16,219 --> 00:37:16,719
okay.

1086
00:37:17,675 --> 00:37:19,994
Like, how do I show devotion to God?

1087
00:37:19,994 --> 00:37:21,914
Because I want to. I wanna show my

1088
00:37:21,914 --> 00:37:24,394
love and devotion to him. He has won

1089
00:37:24,394 --> 00:37:25,135
me over.

1090
00:37:25,434 --> 00:37:27,594
He loved me, so I wanna love him

1091
00:37:27,594 --> 00:37:30,089
back. Like, I want to. So I will

1092
00:37:30,089 --> 00:37:30,589
contribute

1093
00:37:31,130 --> 00:37:32,889
my I'll give my heart to him, and

1094
00:37:32,889 --> 00:37:33,710
I will contribute

1095
00:37:34,250 --> 00:37:36,170
my money and my time to him because

1096
00:37:36,170 --> 00:37:38,329
I I want to. Like, I I feel

1097
00:37:38,329 --> 00:37:41,130
passionate about his kingdom and, you know Yeah.

1098
00:37:41,210 --> 00:37:43,724
Different than someone saying, like, oh, we do

1099
00:37:43,724 --> 00:37:45,885
this as a church. Right. You know, we

1100
00:37:45,885 --> 00:37:47,485
pay tithing and we serve and we, you

1101
00:37:47,485 --> 00:37:48,625
know, it's like,

1102
00:37:49,164 --> 00:37:51,485
just turn start over. You know? Yeah. And

1103
00:37:51,485 --> 00:37:53,644
and sometimes it's difficult for leaders to get

1104
00:37:53,644 --> 00:37:55,610
in that mindset because I think there's there

1105
00:37:55,610 --> 00:37:58,250
is a large emphasis on the law of

1106
00:37:58,250 --> 00:38:00,090
obedience. And you feel like if I'm stepping

1107
00:38:00,090 --> 00:38:01,369
out of bounds or out of the box

1108
00:38:01,369 --> 00:38:02,730
here, I feel like I'm sort of the

1109
00:38:02,730 --> 00:38:05,210
rogue here even though, yeah, nobody can point

1110
00:38:05,210 --> 00:38:07,050
to the handbook that I'm supposed to do

1111
00:38:07,050 --> 00:38:09,130
this way. But, man, I don't wanna be

1112
00:38:09,289 --> 00:38:10,269
I don't want to,

1113
00:38:10,664 --> 00:38:12,505
you know, cause a red flag where I'm

1114
00:38:12,505 --> 00:38:14,025
stepping out of line because I just wanna

1115
00:38:14,025 --> 00:38:15,304
be a good boy, you know, and do

1116
00:38:15,304 --> 00:38:17,224
do what's right. You know? Which actually is

1117
00:38:17,304 --> 00:38:19,244
I had lunch with a friend of mine

1118
00:38:19,785 --> 00:38:20,844
couple months ago,

1119
00:38:21,144 --> 00:38:21,644
and,

1120
00:38:21,945 --> 00:38:23,704
he was talking about his experience as a

1121
00:38:23,704 --> 00:38:24,204
missionary.

1122
00:38:24,744 --> 00:38:26,045
And he and I have

1123
00:38:26,420 --> 00:38:27,800
super different personalities,

1124
00:38:29,539 --> 00:38:31,619
and also the same. So it's kinda fun,

1125
00:38:31,619 --> 00:38:32,900
but we see things. And one of them

1126
00:38:32,900 --> 00:38:34,900
is, like, obedience was one of the topics

1127
00:38:34,900 --> 00:38:36,980
that we talked about. And he just talked

1128
00:38:36,980 --> 00:38:38,744
about as a missionary how he was like,

1129
00:38:38,905 --> 00:38:41,785
no. I was in my house at 09:00,

1130
00:38:41,785 --> 00:38:44,105
not a minute later every single day. And

1131
00:38:44,105 --> 00:38:46,345
I do not operate like that, where I'm

1132
00:38:46,345 --> 00:38:48,585
just like, that just seems a little bit

1133
00:38:48,585 --> 00:38:49,085
arbitrary.

1134
00:38:49,545 --> 00:38:50,045
Like,

1135
00:38:50,425 --> 00:38:52,105
I of course, I would try, but if

1136
00:38:52,105 --> 00:38:53,565
something happened, like,

1137
00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:56,719
if if if I stopped somebody and we're

1138
00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:59,519
having a conversation, then a person is gonna

1139
00:38:59,519 --> 00:39:01,280
dominate the clock more. You know what I

1140
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:03,539
mean? Like, I just think differently in that,

1141
00:39:03,679 --> 00:39:04,960
you know, in that way.

1142
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:07,300
But I realized as we were having lunch

1143
00:39:07,644 --> 00:39:08,144
for,

1144
00:39:08,605 --> 00:39:11,164
like, for the first time, like, it was

1145
00:39:11,164 --> 00:39:12,945
significant for me to see, like,

1146
00:39:13,244 --> 00:39:14,945
that's how you show love

1147
00:39:15,405 --> 00:39:16,625
is in your, like,

1148
00:39:17,244 --> 00:39:18,704
your stickler approach,

1149
00:39:19,325 --> 00:39:21,244
which sounds I shouldn't use that word. That's

1150
00:39:21,244 --> 00:39:22,285
all I used to see. I was like,

1151
00:39:22,285 --> 00:39:24,380
you're such a stickler. But I was like,

1152
00:39:24,679 --> 00:39:27,339
oh, that you are showing such a high

1153
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:30,119
value and reverence for God in the way

1154
00:39:30,119 --> 00:39:31,099
that you are

1155
00:39:31,719 --> 00:39:34,519
so strict in in what you're doing. And

1156
00:39:34,519 --> 00:39:35,880
I said to him, I was like, that's

1157
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:36,859
actually admirable.

1158
00:39:37,319 --> 00:39:39,614
Mhmm. That's how someone's showing love.

1159
00:39:40,315 --> 00:39:42,094
If it's their expression of love,

1160
00:39:42,554 --> 00:39:45,275
then I think it's beautiful. If it's, oh,

1161
00:39:45,275 --> 00:39:47,194
God gets mad at you if you don't,

1162
00:39:47,194 --> 00:39:48,795
or I'm scared if I don't. Or an

1163
00:39:48,795 --> 00:39:51,369
expression of judgment on others. Like Yeah. Yeah.

1164
00:39:51,369 --> 00:39:53,449
Or, like, I'll be in trouble if I

1165
00:39:53,449 --> 00:39:55,309
don't do this, or I you know,

1166
00:39:55,690 --> 00:39:57,309
this is what you're supposed to do.

1167
00:39:57,610 --> 00:39:59,530
Or I if I find some sort of,

1168
00:39:59,530 --> 00:40:01,690
like, higher value in myself because I do

1169
00:40:01,690 --> 00:40:03,210
it better than other people, I was like,

1170
00:40:03,210 --> 00:40:04,670
then I think it's dangerous.

1171
00:40:05,214 --> 00:40:06,815
But if you are doing that as an

1172
00:40:06,815 --> 00:40:08,974
expression of, like, this is how I show

1173
00:40:08,974 --> 00:40:11,295
devotion Yeah. Because that's sincerely when he was

1174
00:40:11,295 --> 00:40:13,295
talking. I was like, I used to just

1175
00:40:13,295 --> 00:40:14,815
think people like you were a little bit

1176
00:40:15,454 --> 00:40:17,135
I don't know the nice way to say,

1177
00:40:17,694 --> 00:40:18,480
you know, whatever.

1178
00:40:19,119 --> 00:40:20,320
You We we get it. We get it.

1179
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:22,000
Similar. Yeah. I'm just gonna like, I was

1180
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:22,500
like,

1181
00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:25,920
and now I'm seeing, like, oh, there's love

1182
00:40:26,079 --> 00:40:28,239
Yeah. Underneath that and a lot of it.

1183
00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:30,099
Right. And shame on me for,

1184
00:40:30,559 --> 00:40:31,219
you know,

1185
00:40:31,565 --> 00:40:33,005
thinking I was better than you, and you

1186
00:40:33,005 --> 00:40:34,925
were better than me in our approaches to

1187
00:40:34,925 --> 00:40:36,845
how we worship. And and I think that's

1188
00:40:36,845 --> 00:40:39,164
beautiful about God that he can relate to

1189
00:40:39,164 --> 00:40:41,164
us in so many different ways, and we

1190
00:40:41,164 --> 00:40:43,005
can relate to him in so many different

1191
00:40:43,005 --> 00:40:46,204
ways. And so let us worship how, where,

1192
00:40:46,204 --> 00:40:48,630
or what we may, even within our own

1193
00:40:48,630 --> 00:40:51,369
faith tradition, I think. Yeah. That's powerful.

1194
00:40:52,309 --> 00:40:54,550
So that's maybe a good transition to the,

1195
00:40:54,550 --> 00:40:56,630
you know, come follow me. And you you've

1196
00:40:56,630 --> 00:40:58,949
got a very popular YouTube channel, don't miss

1197
00:40:58,949 --> 00:41:01,485
this, with Emily Bill Freeman that, I think

1198
00:41:01,724 --> 00:41:03,965
every Latter day Saint is aware of, I'm

1199
00:41:03,965 --> 00:41:05,184
sure, and they subscribe.

1200
00:41:05,805 --> 00:41:06,204
But,

1201
00:41:07,565 --> 00:41:09,164
and this concept of Come, Follow Me, and

1202
00:41:09,164 --> 00:41:11,585
this is something I've really wrestled with personally

1203
00:41:11,644 --> 00:41:11,965
and,

1204
00:41:13,644 --> 00:41:15,405
as, you know, Come, Follow Me has been

1205
00:41:15,405 --> 00:41:16,625
more established where

1206
00:41:17,010 --> 00:41:18,769
it went from, you know, obviously, we were

1207
00:41:18,769 --> 00:41:21,010
given the inspiration, which is phenomenal, like, a

1208
00:41:21,010 --> 00:41:23,250
more focus at home, you know, home focused

1209
00:41:23,250 --> 00:41:25,670
church and having these remarkable experiences.

1210
00:41:26,369 --> 00:41:28,530
Us as human beings, we sort of mess

1211
00:41:28,530 --> 00:41:29,989
things up or we we

1212
00:41:30,385 --> 00:41:32,144
we try I don't know how how to

1213
00:41:32,144 --> 00:41:33,664
say it. But us as members of the

1214
00:41:33,664 --> 00:41:34,805
church, we sometimes

1215
00:41:35,425 --> 00:41:37,505
think, well, I I don't know what to

1216
00:41:37,505 --> 00:41:39,925
do. So what I'm gonna do is oh,

1217
00:41:39,985 --> 00:41:42,144
look. There's Dave Butler on YouTube. Hey, kids.

1218
00:41:42,144 --> 00:41:44,809
Sit down. Play. Okay. I'm good. Right. And

1219
00:41:44,809 --> 00:41:46,489
I don't know. And I don't, I know

1220
00:41:46,489 --> 00:41:48,410
this is like some indictment of what you're

1221
00:41:48,410 --> 00:41:50,090
doing, man. I don't think you intended it

1222
00:41:50,090 --> 00:41:51,690
to be like, okay, instead of going to

1223
00:41:51,690 --> 00:41:53,849
Sunday school, watch us. You, you intended it

1224
00:41:53,849 --> 00:41:55,849
more of a supplemental thing, but right now

1225
00:41:55,849 --> 00:41:58,364
there's more of these channels popping up and

1226
00:41:58,364 --> 00:42:00,204
everybody has their their guy or gal or

1227
00:42:00,204 --> 00:42:02,364
whatever that they they watched it, you know,

1228
00:42:02,364 --> 00:42:04,305
quote unquote supplement their their study.

1229
00:42:04,765 --> 00:42:06,525
But it's so easy to be like, I

1230
00:42:06,525 --> 00:42:08,204
don't know how to have these conversations with

1231
00:42:08,204 --> 00:42:08,864
my kids

1232
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:11,159
and Dave Butler, Emily from they're so good

1233
00:42:11,159 --> 00:42:12,840
at what they do. Let's just do that.

1234
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:13,480
Like how

1235
00:42:14,039 --> 00:42:15,800
and and so I've really struggled to fit

1236
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:16,539
try to

1237
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:19,559
establish this without falling into like, well, kids,

1238
00:42:19,559 --> 00:42:20,840
this is what we do. This is the

1239
00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:23,255
program and everybody sit down and open a

1240
00:42:23,255 --> 00:42:24,715
verse or watch this.

1241
00:42:25,095 --> 00:42:26,934
Or what what general guidance would you have

1242
00:42:26,934 --> 00:42:29,335
as far as finding more grace in this

1243
00:42:29,335 --> 00:42:31,035
process of of Come Follow Me?

1244
00:42:31,815 --> 00:42:34,295
Well, actually, for the first time as we're

1245
00:42:34,454 --> 00:42:35,675
as you were just talking,

1246
00:42:36,375 --> 00:42:38,619
this thought occurred to me that,

1247
00:42:39,079 --> 00:42:40,440
first of all, I wanna get rid of

1248
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:41,579
calling it a program.

1249
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:42,280
Uh-huh.

1250
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:44,460
If we called it a resource

1251
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:46,140
instead of a program,

1252
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:47,820
that would be

1253
00:42:48,199 --> 00:42:49,800
step one to making it a lot more

1254
00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:50,300
powerful.

1255
00:42:50,925 --> 00:42:53,885
And the name of it is come follow

1256
00:42:53,885 --> 00:42:54,385
me.

1257
00:42:54,844 --> 00:42:56,844
So the name of it tells you its

1258
00:42:56,844 --> 00:42:57,344
purpose.

1259
00:42:57,965 --> 00:42:58,864
Right? Mhmm.

1260
00:42:59,805 --> 00:43:02,224
This is a one more resource,

1261
00:43:02,525 --> 00:43:03,905
one more on ramp

1262
00:43:05,049 --> 00:43:06,510
to coming unto Christ

1263
00:43:06,889 --> 00:43:09,530
and learning to be a disciple of him.

1264
00:43:09,530 --> 00:43:10,429
And and

1265
00:43:11,049 --> 00:43:13,309
if if somebody just took that approach

1266
00:43:13,849 --> 00:43:16,010
and then and and went from there, I

1267
00:43:16,010 --> 00:43:18,010
think it could instead of being stressed out

1268
00:43:18,010 --> 00:43:19,824
about, am I doing this right? Like, when

1269
00:43:19,824 --> 00:43:22,085
somebody asks, am I doing this right?

1270
00:43:22,385 --> 00:43:24,385
Like, I'm like, I think you're missing Yeah.

1271
00:43:24,385 --> 00:43:26,565
Red flag. Yeah. You're missing Trying to reevaluate.

1272
00:43:26,625 --> 00:43:28,785
Yeah. Yeah. I'm not saying you're do like,

1273
00:43:28,785 --> 00:43:30,864
that you're wrong or there's something wrong with

1274
00:43:30,864 --> 00:43:32,324
you. I'm just saying, like, oh,

1275
00:43:32,809 --> 00:43:34,250
it's a red flag to me because I'm

1276
00:43:34,250 --> 00:43:36,250
like, I bet you're you're so stressed about

1277
00:43:36,250 --> 00:43:38,650
it, and I don't think you ought to

1278
00:43:38,650 --> 00:43:40,489
be. I think you ought to feel like

1279
00:43:40,489 --> 00:43:41,309
it's important.

1280
00:43:42,170 --> 00:43:44,809
Like, stress is an indication of that you

1281
00:43:44,809 --> 00:43:47,864
actually care. Uh-huh. And that's good. Like, I'm

1282
00:43:47,864 --> 00:43:49,625
glad that you're wrestling with it, and I'm

1283
00:43:49,625 --> 00:43:51,385
glad that you care because I think you

1284
00:43:51,545 --> 00:43:52,445
I think that's

1285
00:43:52,905 --> 00:43:53,405
fantastic

1286
00:43:54,184 --> 00:43:55,945
for somebody. And I because I do the

1287
00:43:55,945 --> 00:43:57,644
same. You know? But,

1288
00:43:58,265 --> 00:44:00,505
if you're stressed about, I might be doing

1289
00:44:00,505 --> 00:44:01,804
this wrong or right,

1290
00:44:02,539 --> 00:44:04,059
I think that's the wrong thing to, like,

1291
00:44:04,059 --> 00:44:05,820
care about. Yeah. And I think you ought

1292
00:44:05,820 --> 00:44:07,920
to care about, like, are we meeting

1293
00:44:08,619 --> 00:44:09,359
the mark

1294
00:44:09,739 --> 00:44:10,880
as a family?

1295
00:44:11,420 --> 00:44:13,500
And what's the mark? You know? And it's

1296
00:44:13,500 --> 00:44:15,679
like, oh, we are trying to do something

1297
00:44:16,295 --> 00:44:18,375
to come under Christ, to learn of him

1298
00:44:18,375 --> 00:44:20,775
more, to love him more. And so Jenny

1299
00:44:20,775 --> 00:44:23,255
and I, like and and we keep switching

1300
00:44:23,255 --> 00:44:25,595
and changing, but, like, we have our purpose,

1301
00:44:25,974 --> 00:44:28,535
which is our time together in scripture is

1302
00:44:28,535 --> 00:44:30,855
going to be to love God and love

1303
00:44:30,855 --> 00:44:33,389
each other more. And that's the mark that

1304
00:44:33,389 --> 00:44:35,630
we're going to, like Yeah. That we're gonna

1305
00:44:35,630 --> 00:44:38,369
hit. And so we designed our own, like,

1306
00:44:38,750 --> 00:44:39,969
way of doing it,

1307
00:44:41,469 --> 00:44:44,109
for that meets, like, our family's Yeah. Needs.

1308
00:44:44,109 --> 00:44:45,710
So, for example let me just give an

1309
00:44:45,710 --> 00:44:46,989
example, and then I'll tell you where we've

1310
00:44:46,989 --> 00:44:49,244
changed it. Is we've, like, thought,

1311
00:44:50,105 --> 00:44:51,065
okay. Let's,

1312
00:44:51,704 --> 00:44:53,405
we're gonna take just one verse

1313
00:44:54,344 --> 00:44:55,324
out of the chapter.

1314
00:44:56,105 --> 00:44:58,264
That's all we're gonna do, and we're gonna

1315
00:44:58,264 --> 00:44:59,704
just talk about it. We're just gonna have

1316
00:44:59,704 --> 00:45:01,465
a conversation about that one verse. So I'm

1317
00:45:01,465 --> 00:45:03,449
gonna pick a good one. Mhmm. Because, like,

1318
00:45:03,449 --> 00:45:05,130
you know, it's gotta be one that's can

1319
00:45:05,130 --> 00:45:07,610
create a conversation. Yeah. You know? Because we

1320
00:45:07,610 --> 00:45:09,610
were reading through, like, a whole chapter, and

1321
00:45:09,610 --> 00:45:12,650
everyone left mad and dumber or whatever. You

1322
00:45:12,650 --> 00:45:13,769
know? And it just was like, am I

1323
00:45:13,769 --> 00:45:15,594
gonna I'm not gonna do this? Yeah. It's

1324
00:45:15,594 --> 00:45:17,994
not even it's not we're not loving god

1325
00:45:17,994 --> 00:45:19,434
more at the end, and we don't love

1326
00:45:19,434 --> 00:45:21,515
each other at the end. So it's like

1327
00:45:21,515 --> 00:45:23,755
we're missing our our mark. You know? And

1328
00:45:23,755 --> 00:45:25,275
so for the age of our kids, we

1329
00:45:25,275 --> 00:45:27,594
did that. And then and then it it's

1330
00:45:27,594 --> 00:45:29,275
fantastic. And then we got to notice we

1331
00:45:29,275 --> 00:45:31,369
were doing, like, a big fam family, family

1332
00:45:31,369 --> 00:45:33,769
home evening, like, extended. And our kids didn't

1333
00:45:33,769 --> 00:45:35,230
know any of, like, the stories.

1334
00:45:35,610 --> 00:45:36,829
Uh-huh. And

1335
00:45:37,530 --> 00:45:39,690
I want them to know the stories because,

1336
00:45:39,690 --> 00:45:41,289
like, that's a way that you can remember

1337
00:45:41,289 --> 00:45:44,110
principles. Like, storytelling is so important. So now

1338
00:45:44,170 --> 00:45:45,690
Jenny and I have started, like, oh, we

1339
00:45:45,690 --> 00:45:46,190
better

1340
00:45:46,704 --> 00:45:48,385
adjust it a little bit because I actually

1341
00:45:48,385 --> 00:45:50,304
want them to know the stories because the

1342
00:45:50,304 --> 00:45:52,065
stories are gonna help them love god. Does

1343
00:45:52,065 --> 00:45:54,065
that make sense? Like, it all matches up

1344
00:45:54,065 --> 00:45:56,065
to that to that mark. But I just

1345
00:45:56,065 --> 00:45:57,664
think if some you just gotta start with,

1346
00:45:57,664 --> 00:45:59,105
like, what are we what are we trying

1347
00:45:59,105 --> 00:46:00,804
to do Yeah. You know, and

1348
00:46:01,289 --> 00:46:04,429
implement it. Yeah. And it takes planning.

1349
00:46:05,130 --> 00:46:06,730
Like, it it takes a little bit of

1350
00:46:06,730 --> 00:46:07,949
effort for it to be

1351
00:46:08,730 --> 00:46:10,809
effective. I think, like, we have to sit

1352
00:46:10,809 --> 00:46:12,329
down at the beginning of the week and

1353
00:46:12,329 --> 00:46:13,070
say, like,

1354
00:46:13,684 --> 00:46:14,184
k.

1355
00:46:14,565 --> 00:46:16,164
What are we gonna do on each of

1356
00:46:16,164 --> 00:46:17,385
the days? And, like,

1357
00:46:17,764 --> 00:46:18,585
I can just

1358
00:46:18,965 --> 00:46:19,545
it just

1359
00:46:20,485 --> 00:46:22,244
sure. We can just, like, plop down and,

1360
00:46:22,244 --> 00:46:23,844
like, open the book up and, like, let's

1361
00:46:23,844 --> 00:46:26,164
just see. And and that's great. Like, I'm

1362
00:46:26,164 --> 00:46:27,659
not against that, but but it's just like,

1363
00:46:27,659 --> 00:46:29,579
oh, it just wouldn't be what we were

1364
00:46:29,579 --> 00:46:31,019
trying to do with it. And so we

1365
00:46:31,019 --> 00:46:32,400
wanna be a little bit more

1366
00:46:32,780 --> 00:46:34,219
Yeah. And it goes back to more nice

1367
00:46:34,219 --> 00:46:36,219
with your earlier principle of creating a worship

1368
00:46:36,219 --> 00:46:37,819
team in your ward. We're essentially doing that

1369
00:46:37,819 --> 00:46:39,420
at home, saying, alright, team. You are the

1370
00:46:39,420 --> 00:46:42,535
worship team of of this home. And, what's

1371
00:46:42,535 --> 00:46:44,295
this look like? What's come follow me come

1372
00:46:44,295 --> 00:46:45,655
follow me look like to you? And we

1373
00:46:45,655 --> 00:46:47,255
have this book, these resources, and I love

1374
00:46:47,255 --> 00:46:48,855
that that using that term. We have these

1375
00:46:48,855 --> 00:46:50,375
resources. What do you wanna do? How can

1376
00:46:50,375 --> 00:46:53,255
we come follow Christ? Yeah. Yeah. And and

1377
00:46:53,255 --> 00:46:54,989
and then now we've got this new idea

1378
00:46:54,989 --> 00:46:56,429
where it's like we've got a fifteen year

1379
00:46:56,429 --> 00:46:57,710
old and a 13 year old and 11

1380
00:46:57,710 --> 00:46:58,449
year old,

1381
00:46:58,750 --> 00:47:01,389
you know, who I'm trying to emphasize their

1382
00:47:01,389 --> 00:47:04,050
own personal study of the scriptures right now.

1383
00:47:04,349 --> 00:47:07,150
And so once summer's done, because nobody wants

1384
00:47:07,150 --> 00:47:09,010
to do anything in the summer. Right?

1385
00:47:09,744 --> 00:47:12,464
Second summer. Once second summer's done. Like, we've

1386
00:47:12,625 --> 00:47:14,304
Jenny and I have talked about, like, let's

1387
00:47:14,304 --> 00:47:16,864
give them a day where they are the

1388
00:47:16,864 --> 00:47:18,885
ones who pick the verse and say, like,

1389
00:47:19,184 --> 00:47:21,425
this this was really significant to me when

1390
00:47:21,425 --> 00:47:23,344
I when I read, you know, and it's

1391
00:47:23,344 --> 00:47:25,989
just, anyways, takes more planning and but Yeah.

1392
00:47:25,989 --> 00:47:27,829
For for me personally, like, sometimes I fall

1393
00:47:27,829 --> 00:47:29,349
into this trap where I'd feel like, come

1394
00:47:29,349 --> 00:47:31,030
follow me is, like, homework. You know, it's

1395
00:47:31,030 --> 00:47:32,789
like, okay. This chap this week, we're doing

1396
00:47:32,789 --> 00:47:34,069
these these chapters and,

1397
00:47:34,710 --> 00:47:35,750
I mean, we need to make time for

1398
00:47:35,750 --> 00:47:37,670
homework, you know, and I sit down sometimes

1399
00:47:37,670 --> 00:47:39,545
and I kinda get in that trap of,

1400
00:47:39,545 --> 00:47:41,005
like, going through the motions

1401
00:47:41,464 --> 00:47:43,065
or, and I'm sort of on this kick

1402
00:47:43,065 --> 00:47:43,884
right now where

1403
00:47:44,344 --> 00:47:46,505
I completely refuse to believe that God has

1404
00:47:46,505 --> 00:47:48,505
ever disappointed in me. It just is not

1405
00:47:48,505 --> 00:47:50,605
helpful to my spiritual progress.

1406
00:47:51,289 --> 00:47:52,650
Sure. Maybe if I went and murdered a

1407
00:47:52,650 --> 00:47:53,849
bunch of people, yeah, then maybe there'd be

1408
00:47:53,849 --> 00:47:56,250
some disappointment there. But but when I am

1409
00:47:56,250 --> 00:47:57,949
not doing it the right way,

1410
00:47:58,329 --> 00:48:00,329
there's no disappointment there. It it's helped me

1411
00:48:00,329 --> 00:48:01,449
to sort of step back and be like,

1412
00:48:01,449 --> 00:48:02,670
you know, I'm just here.

1413
00:48:03,025 --> 00:48:04,864
I haven't had, like you know, I've had

1414
00:48:04,864 --> 00:48:06,704
those moments where I sit down with scriptures

1415
00:48:06,704 --> 00:48:09,025
and I'm, like, I'm making connections and hold

1416
00:48:09,025 --> 00:48:10,644
this Hebrew word and all Latin.

1417
00:48:11,025 --> 00:48:13,025
Great. And over in this reference. Right? And

1418
00:48:13,025 --> 00:48:14,909
it's, like, so spiritually, like,

1419
00:48:15,469 --> 00:48:15,969
uplifting

1420
00:48:16,269 --> 00:48:17,409
and yeah. Invigorating.

1421
00:48:17,710 --> 00:48:19,569
And there's other times where it's like

1422
00:48:20,030 --> 00:48:21,549
it's almost like God is just saying, like,

1423
00:48:21,549 --> 00:48:22,909
would you just take your nose out of

1424
00:48:22,909 --> 00:48:24,269
the book for a minute? Just be with

1425
00:48:24,269 --> 00:48:26,349
me for a minute, you know, and and

1426
00:48:26,349 --> 00:48:28,605
just to be okay with that. And and

1427
00:48:28,664 --> 00:48:30,744
and sometimes several weeks go by and people

1428
00:48:30,744 --> 00:48:31,405
are like,

1429
00:48:31,864 --> 00:48:33,465
oh, you know, we're on this story. I'm

1430
00:48:33,465 --> 00:48:34,985
like, wait. What story are we on? Like,

1431
00:48:34,985 --> 00:48:36,425
I I haven't even looked at the book

1432
00:48:36,425 --> 00:48:38,425
for three weeks. But in my heart, I

1433
00:48:38,425 --> 00:48:40,025
feel like, you know, that's okay. Like, I

1434
00:48:40,025 --> 00:48:42,585
just want to hear Amazing connection with God.

1435
00:48:42,585 --> 00:48:43,644
Right. You know? Yeah.

1436
00:48:44,079 --> 00:48:46,559
We have got some sort of bizarre culture,

1437
00:48:46,559 --> 00:48:48,800
and maybe it's a culture that exists in

1438
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,280
other faiths as well. Or I've been thinking

1439
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:54,960
recently about, like, manifest itself really strong in

1440
00:48:54,960 --> 00:48:55,460
missionaries.

1441
00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:58,319
You know? Mhmm. That if a missionary goes

1442
00:48:58,319 --> 00:48:59,059
and serves

1443
00:48:59,635 --> 00:49:02,755
for three months and comes home Mhmm. For

1444
00:49:02,755 --> 00:49:05,954
some reason, that's shameful. Right. Something happened. Like,

1445
00:49:05,954 --> 00:49:08,055
what? Yeah. But I'm like, stop.

1446
00:49:08,515 --> 00:49:10,295
Erase everything you know

1447
00:49:10,835 --> 00:49:11,335
about

1448
00:49:11,849 --> 00:49:13,070
the missionary program.

1449
00:49:13,849 --> 00:49:16,090
And what if you, like, met this kid,

1450
00:49:16,090 --> 00:49:18,970
and you found out that he left for

1451
00:49:18,970 --> 00:49:19,710
three months

1452
00:49:20,489 --> 00:49:21,070
to go

1453
00:49:21,849 --> 00:49:24,644
try and increase faith in God in in

1454
00:49:24,644 --> 00:49:27,385
some other place. Mhmm. Like, be, like,

1455
00:49:27,844 --> 00:49:29,864
so proud of that kid. You'd be like,

1456
00:49:30,244 --> 00:49:31,144
that's awesome.

1457
00:49:31,605 --> 00:49:33,684
You really gave up three months of your

1458
00:49:33,684 --> 00:49:36,005
life. Mhmm. You gave up two weeks of

1459
00:49:36,005 --> 00:49:36,664
your life

1460
00:49:37,039 --> 00:49:39,539
to go do something like that? That's amazing.

1461
00:49:39,679 --> 00:49:41,359
You know? But all but for some reason,

1462
00:49:41,359 --> 00:49:43,119
we've got this bizarre culture of, like, if

1463
00:49:43,119 --> 00:49:45,440
you didn't hit the the standard is supposed

1464
00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:47,059
to be that that's a disappointment.

1465
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:49,679
You know? Yeah. And I love what you're

1466
00:49:49,679 --> 00:49:51,359
saying about that. It's like, I don't think

1467
00:49:51,359 --> 00:49:51,859
God

1468
00:49:52,355 --> 00:49:53,655
ever gets disappointed

1469
00:49:54,194 --> 00:49:56,295
in what we haven't done.

1470
00:49:56,835 --> 00:49:59,234
I think he's just thrilled with anything that

1471
00:49:59,234 --> 00:50:02,034
we are doing. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Like

1472
00:50:02,114 --> 00:50:04,594
and it's it's just weird to think that

1473
00:50:04,594 --> 00:50:06,819
what if somebody serves for a year? For

1474
00:50:06,819 --> 00:50:08,519
the rest of their life, they'll feel like,

1475
00:50:08,900 --> 00:50:11,539
how disappointed it is. Like, erase that. I

1476
00:50:11,539 --> 00:50:13,719
want you to know how thrilled God is

1477
00:50:13,940 --> 00:50:15,639
and the rest of us are

1478
00:50:15,940 --> 00:50:18,039
that you served for a year.

1479
00:50:18,339 --> 00:50:18,839
Like,

1480
00:50:19,224 --> 00:50:19,724
that's

1481
00:50:20,105 --> 00:50:22,364
fantastic. Yeah. That's powerful. You know?

1482
00:50:22,664 --> 00:50:23,625
And this is good,

1483
00:50:24,184 --> 00:50:25,005
segue into

1484
00:50:25,704 --> 00:50:28,344
your style of teaching where you always you're

1485
00:50:28,344 --> 00:50:29,565
always coming from

1486
00:50:29,944 --> 00:50:31,784
the point of grace. And there's even been

1487
00:50:31,784 --> 00:50:33,960
moments where I've been watching you and Emily

1488
00:50:33,960 --> 00:50:35,880
on YouTube and I'll pause it and I'll

1489
00:50:35,880 --> 00:50:37,239
turn my wife and see. I say, do

1490
00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:38,940
you see how he taught that right there?

1491
00:50:39,239 --> 00:50:41,320
Like he taught that from grace where it

1492
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:43,960
so often I hear these, phrases in our

1493
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:45,659
culture and the sacrament meeting of like,

1494
00:50:45,984 --> 00:50:47,445
are we really considering

1495
00:50:47,824 --> 00:50:49,664
the importance of the temple? Are we really

1496
00:50:49,664 --> 00:50:51,824
making it a priority in our life? Are

1497
00:50:51,824 --> 00:50:55,505
we really praying with fervor and, you know,

1498
00:50:55,505 --> 00:50:57,984
where it is projecting this like, oh, yeah.

1499
00:50:57,984 --> 00:51:00,090
That's right. You know, I'm really not. I'm

1500
00:51:00,090 --> 00:51:02,250
not measuring up. Thank you for the reminder.

1501
00:51:02,250 --> 00:51:04,410
You know? But the way you you position

1502
00:51:04,410 --> 00:51:06,090
things, I'm just curious to explore this and

1503
00:51:06,090 --> 00:51:07,710
maybe help us understand where,

1504
00:51:08,489 --> 00:51:10,730
we as leaders can come from this position

1505
00:51:10,730 --> 00:51:11,789
of grace of

1506
00:51:12,375 --> 00:51:15,255
just reminding through any gospel principle, any gospel

1507
00:51:15,255 --> 00:51:17,994
story, look at this grace. Like, he's he's

1508
00:51:18,054 --> 00:51:20,335
a savior after his people, not out of

1509
00:51:20,454 --> 00:51:23,094
after his programs. Any thoughts or instruction you

1510
00:51:23,094 --> 00:51:25,849
could give us there? Oh, thoughts, not instruction.

1511
00:51:26,630 --> 00:51:29,449
Because I just think that there's value in

1512
00:51:30,069 --> 00:51:32,230
again, when somebody stands up at the pulpit

1513
00:51:32,230 --> 00:51:33,049
to do that,

1514
00:51:33,429 --> 00:51:35,829
my assumption is that it's being done from

1515
00:51:35,829 --> 00:51:38,375
a place of Right. Love for God and,

1516
00:51:38,375 --> 00:51:40,234
you know, and it's like, oh, that's fantastic.

1517
00:51:40,295 --> 00:51:41,675
But I just

1518
00:51:41,974 --> 00:51:42,474
don't

1519
00:51:43,175 --> 00:51:44,635
I feel like people

1520
00:51:45,414 --> 00:51:46,635
who feel loved

1521
00:51:47,175 --> 00:51:48,155
love well.

1522
00:51:49,829 --> 00:51:51,690
And I just think the heart and soul

1523
00:51:52,470 --> 00:51:52,970
of

1524
00:51:53,750 --> 00:51:55,610
the gospel of Christ is,

1525
00:51:55,910 --> 00:51:58,070
for God so loved the world that he

1526
00:51:58,070 --> 00:52:00,630
sent his son. Like, I I feel like

1527
00:52:00,630 --> 00:52:03,190
that is I I just don't agree with

1528
00:52:03,190 --> 00:52:05,315
this idea of, like, some,

1529
00:52:05,614 --> 00:52:08,494
like, methods of teaching, like, just seem to

1530
00:52:08,494 --> 00:52:10,114
be based off of fear.

1531
00:52:10,574 --> 00:52:11,855
You know? And I'm just like, I just

1532
00:52:11,855 --> 00:52:13,695
don't think that's a good idea. It's like,

1533
00:52:13,695 --> 00:52:15,474
we better not teach grace

1534
00:52:15,934 --> 00:52:18,755
or the teenagers might send their life away.

1535
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:20,920
And I and I wanna say, when has

1536
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:21,900
that ever worked?

1537
00:52:22,519 --> 00:52:24,860
And I understand that as parents and leaders,

1538
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:28,680
we love, like, our kids so much that

1539
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:30,760
we will go to a place of fear

1540
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:33,094
to protect them. Mhmm. Like, I really will

1541
00:52:33,094 --> 00:52:35,494
scare the hell right out of you. Like,

1542
00:52:35,494 --> 00:52:37,135
I mean that, like, in, like, a like

1543
00:52:37,135 --> 00:52:39,974
a so heaven can come in. Like, because

1544
00:52:39,974 --> 00:52:41,275
I'm so afraid,

1545
00:52:41,655 --> 00:52:44,054
and I'm just like, that place doesn't seem

1546
00:52:44,054 --> 00:52:45,989
to be a place of and I'm saying

1547
00:52:45,989 --> 00:52:47,670
this as a parent of a 15 year

1548
00:52:47,670 --> 00:52:49,429
old Yeah. Where I am tempted on the

1549
00:52:49,429 --> 00:52:51,590
daily. Like You've gone to battle. Right. I

1550
00:52:51,590 --> 00:52:53,750
will scare you. You know? Like, I can

1551
00:52:53,750 --> 00:52:55,349
see how tempting it is to tell you,

1552
00:52:55,349 --> 00:52:57,829
like, there are punishments, and there are you

1553
00:52:57,829 --> 00:53:00,184
know? And I'm just like, that just doesn't

1554
00:53:00,244 --> 00:53:01,864
seem to motivate people

1555
00:53:02,164 --> 00:53:02,664
ever.

1556
00:53:03,125 --> 00:53:03,525
Mhmm.

1557
00:53:03,925 --> 00:53:05,465
Not the way love can.

1558
00:53:06,005 --> 00:53:08,005
Not the way not the way a a

1559
00:53:08,005 --> 00:53:10,005
God that's bigger than that can. Not the

1560
00:53:10,005 --> 00:53:11,785
way that that grace can.

1561
00:53:12,199 --> 00:53:14,759
Like, I love when John says, we love

1562
00:53:14,759 --> 00:53:17,259
him because he first loved us.

1563
00:53:17,559 --> 00:53:19,500
Like, parents that way.

1564
00:53:20,039 --> 00:53:22,779
The 10 commandments start with this. Before

1565
00:53:23,319 --> 00:53:26,619
commandment number one, he says, you remember first,

1566
00:53:27,255 --> 00:53:28,775
I'm the God that brought you out of

1567
00:53:28,775 --> 00:53:29,275
Egypt.

1568
00:53:30,054 --> 00:53:32,315
Remember I delivered you first.

1569
00:53:32,775 --> 00:53:33,275
Now

1570
00:53:33,654 --> 00:53:36,234
do you want to live this fulfilling

1571
00:53:36,614 --> 00:53:37,114
life?

1572
00:53:37,734 --> 00:53:38,954
Let me show you how.

1573
00:53:39,530 --> 00:53:42,010
You know? Yeah. Instead of, you better do

1574
00:53:42,010 --> 00:53:44,329
a, b, and c, or you'll never make

1575
00:53:44,329 --> 00:53:46,570
it. Or it just just that kind of

1576
00:53:46,570 --> 00:53:48,730
approach is and it can be painted all

1577
00:53:48,730 --> 00:53:51,210
sorts of different ways. You know? But I

1578
00:53:51,210 --> 00:53:52,030
just actually

1579
00:53:52,809 --> 00:53:54,730
believe that we are

1580
00:53:55,585 --> 00:53:57,905
like you said, God's not disappointed in us,

1581
00:53:57,905 --> 00:53:59,125
that he loves is it

1582
00:53:59,664 --> 00:54:01,125
there's a place for

1583
00:54:01,664 --> 00:54:03,445
one thing I learned one time is,

1584
00:54:04,304 --> 00:54:04,804
salvation

1585
00:54:05,744 --> 00:54:08,465
was won by the father and the son

1586
00:54:08,465 --> 00:54:09,285
and the cross.

1587
00:54:10,219 --> 00:54:12,880
Like, that was their work. It's discipleship

1588
00:54:13,260 --> 00:54:15,760
that requires my heart, my mind, and strength.

1589
00:54:16,219 --> 00:54:18,079
And when I confuse the two,

1590
00:54:18,380 --> 00:54:19,839
I think it can be frustrating

1591
00:54:20,380 --> 00:54:21,679
and totally burdensome.

1592
00:54:22,255 --> 00:54:24,655
So we're confused too as far as Salvation

1593
00:54:24,655 --> 00:54:27,214
and discipleship. Oh, gotcha. You know? Like

1594
00:54:27,695 --> 00:54:29,534
Like, it's not our job to do the

1595
00:54:29,534 --> 00:54:31,614
salvation. You're right. Just say it myself. Yeah.

1596
00:54:31,614 --> 00:54:33,954
Right. But do I wanna put my hands

1597
00:54:34,175 --> 00:54:36,255
my heart and life into God's hands and

1598
00:54:36,255 --> 00:54:38,690
be his disciple? Yes. Do I want him

1599
00:54:38,690 --> 00:54:43,010
to transform me in into someone better? Yes.

1600
00:54:43,010 --> 00:54:44,609
Then he's like, then I'll show you how.

1601
00:54:44,609 --> 00:54:47,829
And it requires sacrifice, and it requires, like,

1602
00:54:48,369 --> 00:54:50,529
hard things, and it requires trust, and it

1603
00:54:50,529 --> 00:54:53,284
require and it's like, okay. Okay. But that's

1604
00:54:53,284 --> 00:54:54,664
not a journey towards

1605
00:54:54,964 --> 00:54:56,184
winning his favor.

1606
00:54:56,484 --> 00:54:58,324
And if it's a journey to winning his

1607
00:54:58,324 --> 00:54:58,824
favor,

1608
00:54:59,284 --> 00:55:01,385
then I think is when it becomes, like,

1609
00:55:02,404 --> 00:55:04,904
like, oh, like, overwhelming. And impossible.

1610
00:55:05,284 --> 00:55:06,690
Yeah. And it's like, I was like, what

1611
00:55:06,690 --> 00:55:08,570
if you just went into it knowing, like,

1612
00:55:08,570 --> 00:55:10,269
God already loves you?

1613
00:55:11,210 --> 00:55:13,690
You're are like, he already is into you.

1614
00:55:13,690 --> 00:55:16,010
He already, like, has proven his love to

1615
00:55:16,010 --> 00:55:17,450
you. He are like, then all of a

1616
00:55:17,450 --> 00:55:18,430
sudden, I'm like,

1617
00:55:18,735 --> 00:55:19,474
I want

1618
00:55:19,775 --> 00:55:22,494
to follow a God like that. Yeah. Every

1619
00:55:22,494 --> 00:55:24,255
week, I feel like that's what the sacrament

1620
00:55:24,255 --> 00:55:24,755
says.

1621
00:55:25,295 --> 00:55:28,095
Here's the story. The story of redemption is

1622
00:55:28,095 --> 00:55:29,474
being acted out again.

1623
00:55:29,934 --> 00:55:31,875
The crucifixion is being reenacted

1624
00:55:32,414 --> 00:55:33,555
every single week.

1625
00:55:34,230 --> 00:55:36,230
Now I get to go into my week

1626
00:55:36,230 --> 00:55:38,329
knowing that God is for me,

1627
00:55:38,869 --> 00:55:41,269
that he loves me. And and it like,

1628
00:55:41,269 --> 00:55:42,409
now I obey

1629
00:55:43,510 --> 00:55:45,050
because he won me over.

1630
00:55:45,510 --> 00:55:47,835
I wanna follow that God. I wanna put

1631
00:55:47,835 --> 00:55:49,514
my life in two seasons. Fear there. It's

1632
00:55:49,514 --> 00:55:50,894
all love. Yeah. Right?

1633
00:55:51,195 --> 00:55:53,275
That just seems to, like, be a a

1634
00:55:53,434 --> 00:55:55,054
I mean, it's how I see the world,

1635
00:55:55,114 --> 00:55:55,934
number one.

1636
00:55:56,315 --> 00:55:57,594
I don't feel like I wake up in

1637
00:55:57,594 --> 00:55:59,054
the morning and have to readjust,

1638
00:55:59,355 --> 00:56:01,114
you know, my thinking to that. It's just

1639
00:56:01,114 --> 00:56:02,014
kind of how

1640
00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:04,840
I see things. Yeah. And and I feel

1641
00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:07,739
like I see that happening in in scripture

1642
00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:09,400
also. Like, I was like, that seems to

1643
00:56:09,400 --> 00:56:10,300
be how he

1644
00:56:10,760 --> 00:56:13,400
parents. You know? That's how, like And I'm

1645
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:15,105
not I'm not know. Like, as I go

1646
00:56:15,264 --> 00:56:16,784
and I completely agree with you. But as

1647
00:56:16,784 --> 00:56:18,385
I go down this path with some people,

1648
00:56:18,385 --> 00:56:20,065
they turn to me and say, I get

1649
00:56:20,065 --> 00:56:22,065
I get what you're saying. However, let me

1650
00:56:22,065 --> 00:56:23,985
show you a few scriptures. How sore you

1651
00:56:23,985 --> 00:56:26,144
know not of the the punishment that will

1652
00:56:26,144 --> 00:56:28,085
come to you. Right? Like, they can oftentimes

1653
00:56:28,144 --> 00:56:30,059
point out scriptures that seem like God seems

1654
00:56:30,059 --> 00:56:32,140
pretty disappointed there and he seems pretty angry

1655
00:56:32,140 --> 00:56:34,219
there. And so what what about that? So

1656
00:56:34,219 --> 00:56:36,559
then we get in our modes of bishop

1657
00:56:36,619 --> 00:56:39,019
or parent and we think, well, I've got

1658
00:56:39,019 --> 00:56:40,860
to sometimes I have to bring down the

1659
00:56:40,860 --> 00:56:43,494
hammer and I've gotta, you know, inject fear

1660
00:56:43,494 --> 00:56:45,255
into them so that they are back on

1661
00:56:45,255 --> 00:56:46,394
the salvation path.

1662
00:56:47,014 --> 00:56:47,594
You know,

1663
00:56:47,894 --> 00:56:49,335
so how do you balance that or how

1664
00:56:49,335 --> 00:56:49,914
do you

1665
00:56:50,295 --> 00:56:52,795
get through that? Well, I think, like,

1666
00:56:53,094 --> 00:56:55,320
in our come follow me lesson coming up,

1667
00:56:55,400 --> 00:56:57,079
right, or or in the Book of Mormon,

1668
00:56:57,079 --> 00:56:58,920
we're gonna study where Alma talks to his

1669
00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:01,320
son, Corianton, and he says to him in

1670
00:57:01,320 --> 00:57:02,140
in the verse

1671
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:04,920
he says this, I would not dwell upon

1672
00:57:04,920 --> 00:57:07,320
your crimes to harrow up your soul if

1673
00:57:07,320 --> 00:57:08,860
it were not for your good.

1674
00:57:09,234 --> 00:57:11,894
But what he's doing is he is teaching

1675
00:57:11,954 --> 00:57:12,454
him

1676
00:57:12,835 --> 00:57:15,074
it's not a fear of God. It's a

1677
00:57:15,074 --> 00:57:16,054
fear of sin.

1678
00:57:16,434 --> 00:57:17,574
And that's the difference.

1679
00:57:18,275 --> 00:57:20,514
And sometimes we might take an approach of

1680
00:57:20,514 --> 00:57:23,335
teaching someone to be afraid of God's punishment,

1681
00:57:24,059 --> 00:57:25,760
and God's punishment

1682
00:57:26,219 --> 00:57:28,460
is not inflicted by God. That's the way

1683
00:57:28,460 --> 00:57:30,000
it's worded in scripture.

1684
00:57:31,340 --> 00:57:32,960
But it's it's like

1685
00:57:33,340 --> 00:57:34,880
the punishment is inflicted

1686
00:57:35,739 --> 00:57:37,280
naturally by the law.

1687
00:57:38,144 --> 00:57:40,885
Does God want us to fear sin? Yes.

1688
00:57:41,425 --> 00:57:44,304
Should we ever fear God, like, afraid of

1689
00:57:44,304 --> 00:57:45,744
God? Not like the fear the way the

1690
00:57:45,744 --> 00:57:48,144
old testament uses scripture, like respect and love

1691
00:57:48,144 --> 00:57:49,364
and reverence, but,

1692
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:52,719
there is the difference. Like, there is a

1693
00:57:52,719 --> 00:57:54,659
place for understanding the consequence

1694
00:57:55,199 --> 00:57:55,940
of justice,

1695
00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:58,400
you know, just like, meaning, like, that type

1696
00:57:58,400 --> 00:57:59,460
of justice. Like,

1697
00:57:59,760 --> 00:58:01,940
the the law will inflict its

1698
00:58:02,319 --> 00:58:02,819
punishment.

1699
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:05,300
Like but it's not

1700
00:58:05,894 --> 00:58:08,934
God who's doing it. Right. Right? It's just

1701
00:58:08,934 --> 00:58:10,715
people are being turned over

1702
00:58:11,094 --> 00:58:12,554
to the natural consequences

1703
00:58:13,094 --> 00:58:15,114
of sin. Like, the natural

1704
00:58:15,815 --> 00:58:19,494
consequence of sin is entropy. It's chaos. It's

1705
00:58:19,494 --> 00:58:19,994
death.

1706
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:22,699
You should fear those things.

1707
00:58:23,239 --> 00:58:26,440
Right? They are scary. They they they will

1708
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:27,420
bring destruction

1709
00:58:27,719 --> 00:58:28,300
to you,

1710
00:58:28,679 --> 00:58:31,400
but God's not inflicting it. Mhmm. He's the

1711
00:58:31,400 --> 00:58:31,900
rescuer.

1712
00:58:32,534 --> 00:58:35,734
Right from the beginning moment of scripture, the

1713
00:58:35,734 --> 00:58:37,194
beginning story of scripture

1714
00:58:37,734 --> 00:58:39,114
is Adam and Eve

1715
00:58:39,734 --> 00:58:41,974
disobeying God. I'm talking about it the way

1716
00:58:41,974 --> 00:58:44,214
it's told as a metaphor, not like what

1717
00:58:44,214 --> 00:58:46,510
the actual history is. So before someone says

1718
00:58:46,589 --> 00:58:48,589
like, sends an email and says, actually, Eve

1719
00:58:48,589 --> 00:58:50,130
made a wise like, the

1720
00:58:50,829 --> 00:58:53,170
way it's told in Genesis is as a,

1721
00:58:53,389 --> 00:58:54,690
like, a metaphor story.

1722
00:58:56,109 --> 00:58:58,210
They eat the forbidden fruit,

1723
00:58:58,750 --> 00:59:00,690
and they run and they hide.

1724
00:59:01,204 --> 00:59:03,684
And my question is, why are you running

1725
00:59:03,684 --> 00:59:05,144
and hiding? And it's because

1726
00:59:05,605 --> 00:59:07,764
someone has put an idea in their mind

1727
00:59:07,764 --> 00:59:10,405
about God that makes them think He's the

1728
00:59:10,405 --> 00:59:12,085
kind of person they would wanna run and

1729
00:59:12,085 --> 00:59:13,304
hide from. Mhmm.

1730
00:59:13,764 --> 00:59:16,164
So what did the devil teach you about

1731
00:59:16,164 --> 00:59:16,664
Him

1732
00:59:17,219 --> 00:59:18,360
that makes you think

1733
00:59:18,980 --> 00:59:20,820
you would wanna run and hide from the

1734
00:59:20,820 --> 00:59:23,219
only one who can rescue you and the

1735
00:59:23,219 --> 00:59:25,380
only one who can save you? There are

1736
00:59:25,380 --> 00:59:25,880
consequences

1737
00:59:26,340 --> 00:59:27,719
to eating that fruit.

1738
00:59:28,019 --> 00:59:28,920
There are consequences

1739
00:59:29,539 --> 00:59:30,280
to sin.

1740
00:59:30,744 --> 00:59:33,304
But, like, God is a savior and a

1741
00:59:33,304 --> 00:59:33,804
rescuer,

1742
00:59:34,184 --> 00:59:36,744
not an inflictor of those things. And I

1743
00:59:36,744 --> 00:59:38,425
think that would that would be the difference.

1744
00:59:38,425 --> 00:59:40,425
That's powerful. Yeah. And and that I mean,

1745
00:59:40,425 --> 00:59:41,864
sometimes you do have to you know, with

1746
00:59:41,864 --> 00:59:42,599
your son or with

1747
00:59:43,239 --> 00:59:44,680
a youth in the ward or a couple

1748
00:59:44,680 --> 00:59:45,880
in the ward, you you have to have

1749
00:59:45,880 --> 00:59:48,460
a real conversation about sin and there's consequences

1750
00:59:48,680 --> 00:59:50,920
to the path you're going down. And we

1751
00:59:50,920 --> 00:59:52,519
want you to know we always love you

1752
00:59:52,519 --> 00:59:54,460
here and the savior will always be

1753
00:59:54,974 --> 00:59:56,974
battling for your heart. He's always after you.

1754
00:59:56,974 --> 00:59:59,295
But it's it cannot be me versus you

1755
00:59:59,295 --> 01:00:01,934
and God versus you. Right. Yeah. Right? Like,

1756
01:00:01,934 --> 01:00:03,695
if if you have somebody who has a

1757
01:00:03,695 --> 01:00:04,914
problem with pornography,

1758
01:00:06,095 --> 01:00:09,949
that will degrade and destroy their soul. It

1759
01:00:09,949 --> 01:00:12,429
will lead to death. Right. You know? It

1760
01:00:12,429 --> 01:00:12,929
does.

1761
01:00:13,230 --> 01:00:15,250
And it leads to the death of society

1762
01:00:15,789 --> 01:00:17,329
and the death to, like,

1763
01:00:18,349 --> 01:00:19,969
self esteem and respect.

1764
01:00:20,429 --> 01:00:22,684
You know? Like, it leads to that. It

1765
01:00:22,684 --> 01:00:24,144
leads to the death of love.

1766
01:00:24,525 --> 01:00:27,664
Someone should be really nervous and worried

1767
01:00:28,204 --> 01:00:31,184
about where that's gonna lead. Mhmm. But never

1768
01:00:31,405 --> 01:00:33,985
worried and nervous about God.

1769
01:00:34,539 --> 01:00:36,380
Yeah. And and turning to God for help

1770
01:00:36,380 --> 01:00:38,380
from that sin. Right? Yeah. That you can

1771
01:00:38,380 --> 01:00:40,099
go to him with it, and he doesn't

1772
01:00:40,299 --> 01:00:42,219
as, like, elder Renlund said a couple years,

1773
01:00:42,219 --> 01:00:43,119
he doesn't recoil

1774
01:00:43,739 --> 01:00:45,179
when he sees you come to him. Like,

1775
01:00:45,179 --> 01:00:46,480
he doesn't, like, see

1776
01:00:47,704 --> 01:00:49,244
the mess you're in and,

1777
01:00:49,704 --> 01:00:51,625
oh, what have you done? You know? Like,

1778
01:00:51,625 --> 01:00:52,125
never.

1779
01:00:52,425 --> 01:00:55,565
Yeah. But from day one from day one,

1780
01:00:56,105 --> 01:00:59,065
we've been thinking that. And it that's our

1781
01:00:59,065 --> 01:01:01,885
common that's our biggest wedge in our relationship

1782
01:01:01,945 --> 01:01:04,639
with God, I think. Yeah. Is is roots

1783
01:01:04,719 --> 01:01:07,059
it's has its root in that. So Awesome.

1784
01:01:07,199 --> 01:01:09,779
Well, we've covered some good things. And, man,

1785
01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:12,400
any anything we haven't touched on as far

1786
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:14,960
as, you know, the leadership and things that

1787
01:01:14,960 --> 01:01:16,635
you would wanna mention before we wrap up?

1788
01:01:16,795 --> 01:01:18,635
Oh, man. No. I I didn't even have

1789
01:01:18,635 --> 01:01:21,114
anything, you know, that I would I really

1790
01:01:21,114 --> 01:01:22,255
don't feel like I'm,

1791
01:01:23,835 --> 01:01:26,894
I I I just born and and bred

1792
01:01:26,954 --> 01:01:27,454
thinking

1793
01:01:27,835 --> 01:01:28,335
that

1794
01:01:29,889 --> 01:01:31,909
leadership is is just love.

1795
01:01:32,369 --> 01:01:34,869
We've got, like, an organization and a hierarchy

1796
01:01:35,489 --> 01:01:36,949
or whatever in the church,

1797
01:01:37,489 --> 01:01:40,929
and sometimes that is just that can become

1798
01:01:40,929 --> 01:01:42,849
such a stumbling block to people when they,

1799
01:01:42,849 --> 01:01:44,724
you know, when they see it. Like, how

1800
01:01:44,724 --> 01:01:46,964
come that person's in that position or that

1801
01:01:46,964 --> 01:01:49,525
person's in that position, and almost, like, someone

1802
01:01:49,525 --> 01:01:51,284
can think God's got a good old boys

1803
01:01:51,284 --> 01:01:53,204
club or or something like that. And I

1804
01:01:53,204 --> 01:01:56,085
just I I I just wanna, like, remind

1805
01:01:56,085 --> 01:01:57,385
everybody that, like,

1806
01:01:58,420 --> 01:02:00,199
God's government is a family.

1807
01:02:01,219 --> 01:02:04,199
You know? Yeah. Like and for practical reasons,

1808
01:02:04,340 --> 01:02:05,880
sometimes there's organizational,

1809
01:02:07,380 --> 01:02:10,219
you know, structure. Scaffolding is a Scaffolding. Yeah.

1810
01:02:10,260 --> 01:02:12,099
For everything. But it's like it honestly is

1811
01:02:12,099 --> 01:02:13,984
like we are a family.

1812
01:02:14,364 --> 01:02:16,525
Yeah. You know? We are a family that's

1813
01:02:16,525 --> 01:02:17,984
divided into families.

1814
01:02:18,684 --> 01:02:20,045
You know what I mean? Yeah. And it's

1815
01:02:20,045 --> 01:02:22,065
like, if someone can see that vision

1816
01:02:22,525 --> 01:02:23,344
of leadership,

1817
01:02:25,859 --> 01:02:27,859
then I I think that would be so

1818
01:02:27,859 --> 01:02:30,179
valuable Yeah. You know, to people to to

1819
01:02:30,179 --> 01:02:31,699
be able to, you know, to see that.

1820
01:02:31,699 --> 01:02:31,859
And

1821
01:02:33,139 --> 01:02:35,239
but, no, I I think we're all just

1822
01:02:36,099 --> 01:02:38,679
figuring this out together like a family does.

1823
01:02:38,739 --> 01:02:40,764
Yeah. You know? Right. So if people do

1824
01:02:40,764 --> 01:02:41,264
wanna

1825
01:02:41,565 --> 01:02:43,324
learn more about you, your what you're doing

1826
01:02:43,324 --> 01:02:45,164
with Emily Bell Freeman and and your books

1827
01:02:45,164 --> 01:02:46,844
and whatnot, where would they go to find

1828
01:02:46,844 --> 01:02:47,985
more about Dave Butler?

1829
01:02:48,364 --> 01:02:48,864
Oh,

1830
01:02:49,565 --> 01:02:51,164
nowhere. You don't want to. But if you

1831
01:02:51,164 --> 01:02:51,664
did,

1832
01:02:52,800 --> 01:02:54,719
our YouTube channel is called Don't Miss This.

1833
01:02:54,719 --> 01:02:56,239
And I should say something about that, you

1834
01:02:56,239 --> 01:02:58,880
know, where Sure. I hope everybody would realize

1835
01:02:58,880 --> 01:03:01,460
that, like, oh, we see ourselves just as

1836
01:03:01,519 --> 01:03:04,019
another resource. Right. You know? It's like, hey.

1837
01:03:04,239 --> 01:03:06,755
Here are some thoughts. Let's get into the

1838
01:03:06,755 --> 01:03:09,954
scriptures. And what I found is that's been

1839
01:03:09,954 --> 01:03:12,114
the most beneficial thing, I think, with that

1840
01:03:12,114 --> 01:03:13,954
YouTube channel, and it's the reason we keep

1841
01:03:13,954 --> 01:03:15,954
doing it. Yeah. Because it's I just we

1842
01:03:15,954 --> 01:03:17,875
just filmed two more yesterday, and it is

1843
01:03:17,875 --> 01:03:19,349
a pain in the rear. You know, it

1844
01:03:19,349 --> 01:03:21,510
takes so much time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Here

1845
01:03:21,510 --> 01:03:23,670
we are doing the you know? And and

1846
01:03:23,670 --> 01:03:24,970
and it's just, like,

1847
01:03:26,230 --> 01:03:28,869
like, I just think it's fantastic for for

1848
01:03:28,869 --> 01:03:29,750
people to have a,

1849
01:03:30,710 --> 01:03:32,309
have a chance to get in their scriptures

1850
01:03:32,309 --> 01:03:33,750
again. And people will stop us, and they'll

1851
01:03:33,750 --> 01:03:34,485
say, like,

1852
01:03:34,885 --> 01:03:36,985
you have just changed my life.

1853
01:03:37,364 --> 01:03:38,425
And I wanna say,

1854
01:03:38,724 --> 01:03:39,864
oh, no.

1855
01:03:40,405 --> 01:03:41,224
God did.

1856
01:03:41,684 --> 01:03:43,704
And you got into the scriptures

1857
01:03:44,244 --> 01:03:46,805
and started spending time with him, like you

1858
01:03:46,805 --> 01:03:48,805
were saying. And Right. And we just became

1859
01:03:48,805 --> 01:03:49,704
an on ramp

1860
01:03:50,219 --> 01:03:52,539
into that. And that's what the Come Follow

1861
01:03:52,539 --> 01:03:54,460
Me resource can be, is an on ramp.

1862
01:03:54,460 --> 01:03:56,219
And that's what Sunday school can be, is

1863
01:03:56,219 --> 01:03:58,380
an on ramp. And it's just on ramp

1864
01:03:58,380 --> 01:03:59,199
into relationship

1865
01:03:59,500 --> 01:04:01,900
with with God, and and I think that

1866
01:04:01,900 --> 01:04:02,324
that's,

1867
01:04:03,045 --> 01:04:05,125
that's its value and purpose. And people can

1868
01:04:05,125 --> 01:04:06,885
use it however they want. I don't think

1869
01:04:06,885 --> 01:04:07,704
that, you know

1870
01:04:08,005 --> 01:04:10,005
Yeah. They should, you know, just whatever you

1871
01:04:10,085 --> 01:04:12,324
well, great. If it helps? Yeah. Perfect. Yeah.

1872
01:04:12,324 --> 01:04:13,844
Why are we sad? If it makes you

1873
01:04:13,844 --> 01:04:16,005
fall asleep at night, great. Yeah. Exactly. Right?

1874
01:04:16,005 --> 01:04:18,929
Exactly. So that's called Don't Miss This. And,

1875
01:04:19,489 --> 01:04:21,090
Then you have some some great books, a

1876
01:04:21,090 --> 01:04:22,929
Deseret book, that I've I've read, and Oh,

1877
01:04:22,929 --> 01:04:24,769
thank you. And I sent a trilogy coming

1878
01:04:24,769 --> 01:04:26,530
on here. But Yeah. I just got the

1879
01:04:26,530 --> 01:04:27,670
third one just

1880
01:04:27,969 --> 01:04:29,650
in the mail yesterday. And you focused on

1881
01:04:29,650 --> 01:04:31,914
the Trinity. Right? The God the father, the

1882
01:04:31,994 --> 01:04:33,835
The savior. And then now the spirit is

1883
01:04:33,835 --> 01:04:36,474
is coming out. And then Instagram, our Instagram.

1884
01:04:36,474 --> 01:04:38,074
We have a don't miss this Instagram and

1885
01:04:38,074 --> 01:04:40,394
then mister Dave Butler's mine. You're a good

1886
01:04:40,394 --> 01:04:42,074
follow because you're real. It's just like Oh,

1887
01:04:42,074 --> 01:04:43,835
you're nice. Here I am with my kids.

1888
01:04:43,835 --> 01:04:46,414
I'm I'm normal. You know? But so

1889
01:04:46,760 --> 01:04:48,039
last question I have for you as you

1890
01:04:48,039 --> 01:04:50,519
reflect back, particularly in your in your roles

1891
01:04:50,519 --> 01:04:51,960
as a leader at times as as a

1892
01:04:51,960 --> 01:04:53,260
bishop and and others,

1893
01:04:53,960 --> 01:04:55,719
that role as a leader, how has that

1894
01:04:55,719 --> 01:04:57,559
made you a better follower or a disciple

1895
01:04:57,559 --> 01:04:58,460
of Jesus Christ?

1896
01:05:00,784 --> 01:05:03,924
One thing that I did love about

1897
01:05:05,505 --> 01:05:07,585
serving as a as a leader was the

1898
01:05:07,585 --> 01:05:09,525
chance to just spend time with,

1899
01:05:10,304 --> 01:05:10,804
people.

1900
01:05:11,510 --> 01:05:13,849
Right? And and it just emphasized

1901
01:05:14,550 --> 01:05:15,050
even

1902
01:05:15,510 --> 01:05:16,329
more strongly

1903
01:05:17,190 --> 01:05:18,010
that, like,

1904
01:05:18,469 --> 01:05:21,429
love God, love people. Like, that's just that's

1905
01:05:21,429 --> 01:05:22,650
what it's all about.

1906
01:05:23,030 --> 01:05:25,349
Right? Is is that and it is is

1907
01:05:25,349 --> 01:05:26,569
just so inspiring,

1908
01:05:28,445 --> 01:05:29,585
to have a chance

1909
01:05:30,284 --> 01:05:31,025
to, like,

1910
01:05:31,965 --> 01:05:32,704
hear people's

1911
01:05:33,164 --> 01:05:34,065
faith questions,

1912
01:05:34,844 --> 01:05:36,864
to learn more about their faith story,

1913
01:05:37,324 --> 01:05:38,465
to see God,

1914
01:05:39,565 --> 01:05:40,545
rescuing people.

1915
01:05:40,925 --> 01:05:42,530
Like, it just was,

1916
01:05:42,829 --> 01:05:44,530
I I just got more,

1917
01:05:45,309 --> 01:05:45,809
opportunities

1918
01:05:46,110 --> 01:05:47,570
to have a front row seat

1919
01:05:48,030 --> 01:05:49,489
in watching God

1920
01:05:50,110 --> 01:05:50,610
intervene

1921
01:05:50,989 --> 01:05:52,829
and move into people's stories, and,

1922
01:05:53,390 --> 01:05:55,329
that was one of the best parts about

1923
01:05:55,574 --> 01:05:56,315
that particular

1924
01:05:56,934 --> 01:05:59,094
role. But I I just feel like that

1925
01:05:59,094 --> 01:06:01,034
gets to be everybody's experience,

1926
01:06:01,414 --> 01:06:03,675
you know, wherever it is that they're

1927
01:06:04,214 --> 01:06:05,994
serving in the church, and particularly,

1928
01:06:06,775 --> 01:06:08,474
like, I've just always seen,

1929
01:06:08,969 --> 01:06:10,190
I've been called

1930
01:06:10,570 --> 01:06:13,369
to help take the story of redemption to

1931
01:06:13,369 --> 01:06:13,949
the world,

1932
01:06:14,329 --> 01:06:16,889
and to love people really well. Like, that's

1933
01:06:16,889 --> 01:06:18,250
what I feel like I've been called to

1934
01:06:18,250 --> 01:06:20,650
do. I've got different assignments that fall under

1935
01:06:20,650 --> 01:06:22,650
that bigger umbrella, and some of those have

1936
01:06:22,650 --> 01:06:24,494
been, like, within the church, you know, but

1937
01:06:24,974 --> 01:06:26,494
I feel like it can just be everybody's

1938
01:06:26,494 --> 01:06:28,655
experience to take that front row seat. But,

1939
01:06:29,215 --> 01:06:31,695
seeing that has made me love God even

1940
01:06:31,695 --> 01:06:34,015
more. And that's made me a better disciple

1941
01:06:34,015 --> 01:06:36,275
to just see, like, oh, God really is

1942
01:06:36,750 --> 01:06:38,989
bigger than I ever thought he was. And

1943
01:06:38,989 --> 01:06:41,730
he really does love people as deeply

1944
01:06:42,269 --> 01:06:45,230
as I've always thought he did. And those

1945
01:06:45,230 --> 01:06:45,730
experiences,

1946
01:06:46,750 --> 01:06:49,194
you know, seeing that's made me just love

1947
01:06:49,194 --> 01:06:49,694
him

1948
01:06:54,074 --> 01:06:54,824
even more.

1949
01:07:01,849 --> 01:07:04,409
That concludes my interview with Dave Butler. Isn't

1950
01:07:04,409 --> 01:07:06,409
he fun, guys? I mean, get yourself a

1951
01:07:06,409 --> 01:07:09,050
leadership style like Dave Butler has a leadership

1952
01:07:09,050 --> 01:07:11,610
style. He's just such a real person and

1953
01:07:11,610 --> 01:07:13,309
even walking out, like, by the time,

1954
01:07:13,610 --> 01:07:14,809
you know, he showed me out of the

1955
01:07:14,809 --> 01:07:16,724
the building, I just felt like we were

1956
01:07:16,724 --> 01:07:19,224
old friends and I'm looking forward to future,

1957
01:07:20,324 --> 01:07:22,244
future interactions with him. If you have any

1958
01:07:22,244 --> 01:07:23,065
other suggestions

1959
01:07:23,364 --> 01:07:25,364
of individuals I should reach out to, connect

1960
01:07:25,364 --> 01:07:26,184
with, interview,

1961
01:07:26,724 --> 01:07:27,764
I would love to hear it. Go to

1962
01:07:27,764 --> 01:07:29,784
leadingsaints.com/contact.

1963
01:07:29,980 --> 01:07:31,500
And if you don't have a person to

1964
01:07:31,500 --> 01:07:33,420
recommend, would you just go there and tell

1965
01:07:33,420 --> 01:07:35,519
me your favorite episode? Like, I just love

1966
01:07:36,059 --> 01:07:38,219
getting the emails where people say, man, I've

1967
01:07:38,219 --> 01:07:41,260
listened to this particular episode four times and

1968
01:07:41,260 --> 01:07:43,260
I love it. Right? That's good feedback and

1969
01:07:43,260 --> 01:07:44,719
something that helps me realize,

1970
01:07:45,184 --> 01:07:46,784
maybe I should have that person on again

1971
01:07:46,784 --> 01:07:48,784
or maybe we should have that person write

1972
01:07:48,784 --> 01:07:50,304
an article or whatever it is. Like, it

1973
01:07:50,304 --> 01:07:52,945
just good feedback is really awesome and I'm

1974
01:07:52,945 --> 01:07:54,005
addicted to email.

1975
01:07:55,105 --> 01:07:56,304
I know. I need to get over it,

1976
01:07:56,304 --> 01:07:58,144
but I'd love to see your email come

1977
01:07:58,144 --> 01:08:01,519
through. And that concludes this throwback episode of

1978
01:08:01,519 --> 01:08:02,980
the Leading Saints podcast.

1979
01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:03,940
Remember,

1980
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:06,160
up your teaching game by listening to the

1981
01:08:06,160 --> 01:08:10,579
David Farnsworth presentation by visiting leadingsaints.org/fourteen.

1982
01:08:17,125 --> 01:08:19,625
It came as a result of the position

1983
01:08:19,685 --> 01:08:22,744
of leadership which was imposed upon us

1984
01:08:23,284 --> 01:08:25,770
by the God of heaven who brought forth

1985
01:08:25,770 --> 01:08:29,390
a restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ.

1986
01:08:29,850 --> 01:08:30,909
And when the declaration

1987
01:08:31,289 --> 01:08:34,569
was made concerning the only and only true

1988
01:08:34,569 --> 01:08:36,970
and living Church upon the face of the

1989
01:08:36,970 --> 01:08:37,470
earth,

1990
01:08:37,835 --> 01:08:40,574
We were immediately put in a position of

1991
01:08:40,715 --> 01:08:41,215
loneliness,

1992
01:08:41,595 --> 01:08:43,135
the loneliness of leadership

1993
01:08:43,994 --> 01:08:47,135
from which we cannot shrink nor run away,

1994
01:08:48,074 --> 01:08:50,555
and to which we must face up with

1995
01:08:50,555 --> 01:08:52,015
boldness and courage

1996
01:08:52,815 --> 01:08:53,555
and ability.