1 00:00:01,995 --> 00:00:04,045 - Anthony Sweat has easily become one 2 00:00:04,045 --> 00:00:06,285 of my favorite BYU professors to interview. 3 00:00:06,515 --> 00:00:08,045 He's been on the podcast several times, 4 00:00:08,265 --> 00:00:11,565 and he also has a remarkable presentation about ambiguity 5 00:00:11,565 --> 00:00:14,485 of doctrine in our Questioning Saints virtual library, 6 00:00:14,825 --> 00:00:17,525 he discusses healthy and unhealthy ways we approach 7 00:00:17,885 --> 00:00:20,525 doctrine, how to help others reconcile doctrine they find 8 00:00:20,525 --> 00:00:21,565 difficult to believe, 9 00:00:21,575 --> 00:00:23,925 especially when we don't know much about it. 10 00:00:24,185 --> 00:00:26,805 You can watch Professor Sweat's entire interview in the 11 00:00:27,005 --> 00:00:29,085 Questioning Saints Library by going 12 00:00:29,085 --> 00:00:31,325 to leading saints.org/fourteen. 13 00:00:31,555 --> 00:00:34,125 This will give you access for 14 days at no cost 14 00:00:34,305 --> 00:00:35,485 to watch this presentation. 15 00:00:35,705 --> 00:00:38,445 You'll be better prepared as a leader when you do. 16 00:00:42,405 --> 00:00:45,165 I got an email the other day from an individual, I forget 17 00:00:45,165 --> 00:00:46,885 where he is in the world, but he says, Kurt, 18 00:00:47,045 --> 00:00:48,125 I love Leading Saints, 19 00:00:48,125 --> 00:00:51,405 and I listen to it every time I'm on the treadmill. 20 00:00:51,705 --> 00:00:53,925 And then one time during an interview, he heard 21 00:00:54,275 --> 00:00:56,525 that Leading Saints has a YouTube channel, 22 00:00:56,905 --> 00:00:59,805 and like all the interviews, at least the vast majority 23 00:00:59,805 --> 00:01:01,885 of them are video recorded. 24 00:01:01,945 --> 00:01:04,165 And you can watch the video recording 25 00:01:04,185 --> 00:01:05,845 of the podcast episodes. 26 00:01:05,845 --> 00:01:07,765 And I'm like, yeah, man, get on there. 27 00:01:07,785 --> 00:01:10,125 Go subscribe on YouTube's Leading Saints, 28 00:01:10,125 --> 00:01:12,365 and you can get a visual of the interview 29 00:01:12,465 --> 00:01:14,765 and not just an audio experience. 30 00:01:15,145 --> 00:01:17,205 And even if you're not a big YouTube 31 00:01:17,355 --> 00:01:18,725 user, uh, do us a favor. 32 00:01:18,965 --> 00:01:20,965 'cause this actually helps us gain more reach 33 00:01:21,105 --> 00:01:24,525 and, uh, expose our content to individuals 34 00:01:24,525 --> 00:01:26,925 who could really benefit from IT leaders around the world. 35 00:01:27,025 --> 00:01:29,565 So regardless if you are on YouTube a lot 36 00:01:29,565 --> 00:01:32,125 or not, go to YouTube and search for Leading Saints. 37 00:01:32,125 --> 00:01:33,605 Find the Familiar Red logo 38 00:01:33,785 --> 00:01:35,845 and just subscribe even if you don't plan 39 00:01:35,945 --> 00:01:37,845 to view every episode there. 40 00:01:37,845 --> 00:01:40,245 That's gonna help us, uh, gain a larger audience, 41 00:01:40,285 --> 00:01:42,405 a more reach dial in the algorithm. 42 00:01:42,945 --> 00:01:46,245 And, uh, we'll start showing up on Leaders feeds 43 00:01:46,245 --> 00:01:48,365 that they didn't know how much they're missing 44 00:01:48,395 --> 00:01:49,605 here at Leading Saints. 45 00:01:49,825 --> 00:01:52,325 So head on over to YouTube, search for Leading Saints 46 00:01:52,425 --> 00:01:54,605 and subscribe to our channel 47 00:01:54,825 --> 00:01:57,245 and leave a comment every once in a while, but be nice. 48 00:02:01,665 --> 00:02:03,925 So this is an episode that's really applicable. 49 00:02:03,925 --> 00:02:05,085 At least I feel that way. I, 50 00:02:05,165 --> 00:02:07,965 I walked away feeling like I feel more empowered 51 00:02:08,305 --> 00:02:12,365 as a leader, as a parent, as a husband is as a ward member. 52 00:02:13,025 --> 00:02:15,485 And I talk with Jared Olson and Matt Brown. 53 00:02:15,485 --> 00:02:18,485 In this episode, we talk about a coaching system, 54 00:02:19,165 --> 00:02:20,885 a framework called Respect. 55 00:02:21,065 --> 00:02:24,205 And it, uh, is built up of seven different coaching styles. 56 00:02:24,465 --> 00:02:25,605 And I've really liked this approach. 57 00:02:25,605 --> 00:02:28,725 It really gives you a fresh look about maybe 58 00:02:28,745 --> 00:02:32,565 how you're approaching the relationships that you, uh, 59 00:02:32,715 --> 00:02:35,765 have in, in, in leadership, uh, the meetings you run 60 00:02:35,785 --> 00:02:36,805 and how you run them. 61 00:02:36,955 --> 00:02:39,685 Because I remember as a leader, there's just sort of 62 00:02:39,685 --> 00:02:43,085 that awkwardness at times of like, how we've met before. 63 00:02:43,455 --> 00:02:46,365 We've done this ministering interview just a few months ago. 64 00:02:46,825 --> 00:02:48,965 Or weren't you just in my bishop's office? 65 00:02:49,035 --> 00:02:51,165 What am I supposed to say to you? How can I help you? 66 00:02:51,605 --> 00:02:54,325 I feel like I've given everything I've got to help you. 67 00:02:54,745 --> 00:02:55,885 So what do I say? Well, 68 00:02:56,185 --> 00:02:58,245 we talk about these seven coaching styles 69 00:02:58,245 --> 00:02:59,645 and how you can maybe mix it up 70 00:02:59,645 --> 00:03:02,885 and find deeper, more profound ways 71 00:03:03,465 --> 00:03:06,125 of approaching problems or issues that people face 72 00:03:06,185 --> 00:03:08,565 and they turn to church leaders for that. 73 00:03:08,665 --> 00:03:10,845 Or even with ministering interviews, right? 74 00:03:10,845 --> 00:03:12,845 Like sometimes you don't know what to say, , 75 00:03:12,985 --> 00:03:14,405 you know, how are your family's doing? 76 00:03:14,535 --> 00:03:18,205 Great. Check this one off as done and move on. Right? 77 00:03:18,225 --> 00:03:22,445 But maybe there's more we can discover both for you as the, 78 00:03:22,505 --> 00:03:26,405 the coach or the interviewer, and also for the coachee 79 00:03:26,405 --> 00:03:30,405 or the interviewee of just of ways we ask questions 80 00:03:30,425 --> 00:03:31,805 and approach different conversations. 81 00:03:31,805 --> 00:03:34,685 And so we go through these seven styles of coaching 82 00:03:34,715 --> 00:03:37,845 that are all part of the respect coaching framework 83 00:03:38,185 --> 00:03:40,085 and, uh, really applicable, I think for leaders. 84 00:03:40,305 --> 00:03:42,685 You'll enjoy it. Take notes, listen to this. 85 00:03:42,685 --> 00:03:46,165 Again, share it with a leader that you love and respect 86 00:03:46,465 --> 00:03:47,965 and who could possibly use this. 87 00:03:47,985 --> 00:03:51,125 So here's my interview with Jared Olson and Matt Brown. 88 00:04:01,905 --> 00:04:03,325 All right, welcome back to another episode 89 00:04:03,325 --> 00:04:04,725 of the Leading Saints podcast. 90 00:04:04,975 --> 00:04:09,085 Today I'm welcoming in Jared Olson and Matt Brown. Welcome. 91 00:04:09,195 --> 00:04:10,845 Well, thank you very much. Yeah, it's great. 92 00:04:10,845 --> 00:04:13,445 It's great to be here. You guys are like a dynamic duo at 93 00:04:13,445 --> 00:04:15,685 the job, Nimbus, so that's the company you work for. 94 00:04:15,795 --> 00:04:17,605 That absolutely is. We'll give 'em a little plug, right? 95 00:04:17,635 --> 00:04:19,405 Heck yeah. They're awesome. That's great. 96 00:04:19,405 --> 00:04:22,165 We love Job Nimbus . So, and that's it based in Utah. 97 00:04:22,195 --> 00:04:24,925 Utah County. I mean, the world revolves around Utah County, 98 00:04:25,025 --> 00:04:26,685 you know, one of those software companies 99 00:04:26,785 --> 00:04:28,845 and Lehigh Utah, heart of the Silicon Slopes. 100 00:04:29,225 --> 00:04:31,045 That's nice. And how would you, 101 00:04:31,715 --> 00:04:32,845 Matt will let you answer this. 102 00:04:32,845 --> 00:04:35,045 Okay. How would you describe your positions there? 103 00:04:35,075 --> 00:04:36,445 Like what, what do you try to accomplish? 104 00:04:37,315 --> 00:04:38,805 - Well, we're on the people team, 105 00:04:38,945 --> 00:04:40,765 so our job is to take care of the people. 106 00:04:41,225 --> 00:04:43,965 - So is that just like a, a modern way of saying HR or 107 00:04:44,105 --> 00:04:45,105 - Oh yeah. 108 00:04:45,105 --> 00:04:45,965 Don't say hr. That's bad. Yeah. 109 00:04:45,965 --> 00:04:49,045 Because humans are not resources. They're people. That's 110 00:04:49,045 --> 00:04:50,045 - Right. 111 00:04:50,045 --> 00:04:50,605 Yeah. So the people team, yeah, 112 00:04:50,605 --> 00:04:51,605 - Cool. 113 00:04:51,605 --> 00:04:53,885 People experience px, you know, because X's are cool. 114 00:04:54,545 --> 00:04:56,885 Ask Ilan, he'll tell you . But yeah. 115 00:04:56,885 --> 00:05:00,525 That, that's our job. So, uh, Jared's the, he leads our team 116 00:05:00,585 --> 00:05:03,485 and, and my role is I'm the people success coach. Nice. 117 00:05:04,005 --> 00:05:07,605 - Anything you'd add to that, Jared? We just love helping 118 00:05:07,605 --> 00:05:09,205 people wherever they're at 119 00:05:09,265 --> 00:05:10,565 and become the best version of themself. 120 00:05:10,565 --> 00:05:12,285 Like culture is everything to us, 121 00:05:12,625 --> 00:05:13,925 and it starts with leaders. 122 00:05:14,265 --> 00:05:16,845 So we spend a lot of time doing leadership development 123 00:05:16,945 --> 00:05:19,325 and trying to help people achieve their full potential. 124 00:05:19,325 --> 00:05:20,925 Yeah. And culture. That's really at the 125 00:05:20,925 --> 00:05:22,045 core of what we wanna talk about. 126 00:05:22,045 --> 00:05:23,525 We, when you're talking about coaching, 127 00:05:23,815 --> 00:05:25,925 we're really talking about how do we develop a culture? 128 00:05:26,625 --> 00:05:28,845 You know, you're coaching the culture through people, right? 129 00:05:28,845 --> 00:05:30,685 Yeah, exactly. And the, the culture, when 130 00:05:30,685 --> 00:05:33,125 that's established in a healthy way, then a lot 131 00:05:33,125 --> 00:05:34,285 of the hard work is already done. 132 00:05:34,545 --> 00:05:36,165 So I'll tell you my favorite definition of culture. 133 00:05:36,225 --> 00:05:38,565 Oh, let's hear it. So culture is actually, 134 00:05:38,625 --> 00:05:41,365 if you cha chase back to the origins of the word, it's Latin 135 00:05:41,625 --> 00:05:43,885 for the word cultus, C-U-L-T-U-S. 136 00:05:43,915 --> 00:05:47,165 Okay. If you translate cultus back into English, 137 00:05:47,265 --> 00:05:48,565 it translates into care. 138 00:05:48,945 --> 00:05:50,365 So when you talk about building a culture, 139 00:05:50,425 --> 00:05:51,685 you're really talking about caring 140 00:05:51,735 --> 00:05:52,965 about people that work with you. 141 00:05:52,965 --> 00:05:54,845 Yeah. Nice. Pretty good, right? There you go. 142 00:05:55,085 --> 00:05:58,965 I love a good, uh, root translation, . Awesome. 143 00:05:59,115 --> 00:06:01,805 Well, uh, and we were connected through a mutual friend, 144 00:06:01,825 --> 00:06:04,885 and, and I was first connected to you, Jared, about just 145 00:06:04,885 --> 00:06:06,685 how your, just some thoughts you have 146 00:06:06,685 --> 00:06:08,445 around coaching and how you approach it. 147 00:06:08,465 --> 00:06:10,885 And it's got a lot of, I think, helpful tips 148 00:06:10,905 --> 00:06:13,525 and tricks that maybe church leaders would appreciate, 149 00:06:13,525 --> 00:06:16,405 because in church leadership, you find yourself in 150 00:06:16,405 --> 00:06:18,365 that coaching position or you're avoiding 151 00:06:18,365 --> 00:06:19,685 those coaching interactions. 152 00:06:20,145 --> 00:06:22,285 And then it's not like, I think we think of coaching, like, 153 00:06:22,345 --> 00:06:23,725 you know, obviously in a sports context, 154 00:06:23,865 --> 00:06:25,365 but also like, okay, we're sitting down, 155 00:06:25,465 --> 00:06:27,725 I'm now coaching you, but it can happen in the 156 00:06:27,725 --> 00:06:29,245 most nuanced ways, right? 157 00:06:29,355 --> 00:06:31,165 Yeah. Any, like, like 158 00:06:31,165 --> 00:06:33,605 how would you maybe define coaching in general? 159 00:06:33,745 --> 00:06:34,805 Or what are we talking about? 160 00:06:35,525 --> 00:06:37,565 - I think every conversation has the potential 161 00:06:37,565 --> 00:06:40,605 to be a coaching conversation, really, just depending on 162 00:06:41,305 --> 00:06:43,005 how you interact with the other person. 163 00:06:43,145 --> 00:06:45,565 Mm-Hmm. to me, coaching is about asking a lot 164 00:06:45,565 --> 00:06:47,045 of questions and helping the person 165 00:06:47,045 --> 00:06:48,605 through a self-discovery process. 166 00:06:48,905 --> 00:06:52,445 And, and that really can be any conversation. Yeah. 167 00:06:52,485 --> 00:06:54,285 Every conversation can be a coaching, 168 00:06:54,665 --> 00:06:56,005 an opportunity for coaching goals. 169 00:06:56,325 --> 00:06:57,885 - I think a big myth is that it's only 170 00:06:57,885 --> 00:07:01,565 between like a manager and a direct report or a bishop 171 00:07:01,745 --> 00:07:03,125 and a member of the congregation. 172 00:07:03,125 --> 00:07:04,805 Mm-Hmm. . And it's not true. Like when you talk 173 00:07:04,805 --> 00:07:06,365 to your kids, when you talk to your spouse, when you talk 174 00:07:06,365 --> 00:07:07,365 to your best friend, your neighbor, 175 00:07:07,865 --> 00:07:09,965 anyone is a coaching opportunity. Yeah. 176 00:07:10,035 --> 00:07:13,165 - Awesome. So give us a launching point here. 177 00:07:13,165 --> 00:07:14,925 Like what, what do we need to, what Yeah. 178 00:07:14,925 --> 00:07:16,005 Groundwork do we need to lay 179 00:07:16,005 --> 00:07:17,645 before we really jump into the conversation? 180 00:07:17,785 --> 00:07:20,805 - So Matt and I are both certified in respect coaching 181 00:07:20,805 --> 00:07:23,445 styles, respect coaching styles is actually something 182 00:07:23,445 --> 00:07:26,405 that is the brainchild of Dr. David Morelli. 183 00:07:26,945 --> 00:07:30,165 Dr. Morelli, uh, got his doctorate, uh, in Colorado, 184 00:07:30,235 --> 00:07:32,445 then went on to, did a little bit at, at Harvard 185 00:07:33,145 --> 00:07:35,845 and created a company that does executive coaching. 186 00:07:36,225 --> 00:07:38,765 And his dissertation for his doctorate was 187 00:07:38,765 --> 00:07:41,245 to really identify what he calls the cloud 188 00:07:41,245 --> 00:07:42,325 of confidentiality. 189 00:07:42,865 --> 00:07:44,725 So if you think in like a church context, imagine 190 00:07:44,725 --> 00:07:48,005 that you are a relief society president going into 191 00:07:48,165 --> 00:07:49,165 somebody's house to meet with them. 192 00:07:49,165 --> 00:07:50,165 One-on-one, right? 193 00:07:50,225 --> 00:07:52,365 To provide an opportunity to give some coaching. 194 00:07:52,465 --> 00:07:53,965 Or you're a bishop, somebody comes into the 195 00:07:53,965 --> 00:07:55,085 office and wants to talk to you. 196 00:07:56,005 --> 00:07:59,525 A lot of people leave those conversations better, right? 197 00:07:59,585 --> 00:08:02,565 And they're feeling rejuvenated and excited. And what Dr. 198 00:08:02,565 --> 00:08:05,005 Marelli wanted to figure out is what happens in 199 00:08:05,005 --> 00:08:06,365 that cloud of confidentiality? 200 00:08:06,715 --> 00:08:08,285 What is actually discussed? 201 00:08:08,505 --> 00:08:10,205 How does that help the person level up? 202 00:08:10,665 --> 00:08:12,645 And so he did a lot of research 203 00:08:12,945 --> 00:08:15,605 and the result of what he figured out is 204 00:08:15,605 --> 00:08:17,405 that there's seven different coaching styles, 205 00:08:18,265 --> 00:08:20,205 and it all comes from this framework. 206 00:08:20,385 --> 00:08:22,925 And the framework begins with, um, kind 207 00:08:22,925 --> 00:08:25,765 of big term aggregating contextual considerations. 208 00:08:26,345 --> 00:08:27,725 The other way that I think about that is just 209 00:08:27,725 --> 00:08:28,805 emotional intelligence. 210 00:08:28,805 --> 00:08:30,685 Mm-Hmm. . So if you are a bishop 211 00:08:31,145 --> 00:08:34,445 and a youth comes in to meet with you, one-on-one 212 00:08:34,865 --> 00:08:36,005 for a scheduled appointment 213 00:08:36,005 --> 00:08:38,245 that you maybe weren't planning on, Kurt, 214 00:08:38,245 --> 00:08:39,245 what's something you think maybe 215 00:08:39,245 --> 00:08:41,485 that youth might want to talk to the bishop about? Maybe 216 00:08:41,515 --> 00:08:45,565 - Some struggles with school or his, their friends. Yeah. 217 00:08:45,595 --> 00:08:47,485 - Perfect. Right. So very quickly, 218 00:08:47,715 --> 00:08:48,765 what do I know about this person? 219 00:08:48,915 --> 00:08:50,725 They're in school, they've got friends, 220 00:08:50,725 --> 00:08:51,765 that's their life right now. 221 00:08:52,025 --> 00:08:53,645 So you were in that amount of time able 222 00:08:53,645 --> 00:08:55,365 to say they probably wanna talk about their friends. 223 00:08:55,945 --> 00:08:58,805 So you start with that, and then you pick a coaching style 224 00:08:58,905 --> 00:09:01,045 and we'll kind of run through those coaching styles are, 225 00:09:01,465 --> 00:09:04,005 but then you see how does the coachee respond? 226 00:09:04,425 --> 00:09:05,885 And then you loop back to the beginning 227 00:09:05,985 --> 00:09:09,045 and say, how can I adjust my coaching style by the questions 228 00:09:09,045 --> 00:09:11,885 that I asked or which format that I'm actually using to help 229 00:09:11,885 --> 00:09:12,965 that coachee along. 230 00:09:13,315 --> 00:09:14,885 There's a lot of frameworks out there. 231 00:09:14,885 --> 00:09:17,645 Like Matt is certified in Clifton Strength Finders. Mm-Hmm. 232 00:09:17,685 --> 00:09:20,805 . And, uh, there is, uh, Myers-Briggs 233 00:09:20,805 --> 00:09:22,845 and disc analysis, and there's all these things out there 234 00:09:22,915 --> 00:09:25,325 that help you as a coach know who you are. 235 00:09:25,865 --> 00:09:28,045 But this is the first framework that we've ever heard of 236 00:09:28,045 --> 00:09:30,405 that actually helps guide you through the course 237 00:09:30,425 --> 00:09:31,445 of the conversation. 238 00:09:31,745 --> 00:09:34,485 Gotcha. Um, and so you tailor the needs 239 00:09:34,705 --> 00:09:35,885 to what the coachee needs. 240 00:09:36,265 --> 00:09:38,725 - Gotcha. So, and this is, so it's not necessarily, 241 00:09:39,025 --> 00:09:41,645 you know, you mentioned these like personality assessments, 242 00:09:41,945 --> 00:09:44,685 that's a part of it, but like, I've always struggled 243 00:09:44,685 --> 00:09:45,925 with personality assessments and, 244 00:09:46,025 --> 00:09:47,365 and there's some people, like, I think, 245 00:09:47,425 --> 00:09:48,565 and it's probably a majority of people, 246 00:09:48,565 --> 00:09:51,125 they just love a good personality assessment. 247 00:09:51,445 --> 00:09:52,845 , you know, they'll talk about where they're at 248 00:09:52,845 --> 00:09:54,485 and they'll do the test and they'll do the things. 249 00:09:54,945 --> 00:09:56,965 But I'm always like, I get it. 250 00:09:57,025 --> 00:09:59,525 But what, it's hard, like the application of like, 251 00:09:59,525 --> 00:10:01,005 what am I supposed to do that with 252 00:10:01,005 --> 00:10:02,845 that in the context of a conversation. 253 00:10:02,865 --> 00:10:04,885 And so what you, what it sounds like you're saying is this 254 00:10:04,885 --> 00:10:07,645 sort of moves you to that of like, regardless of 255 00:10:07,645 --> 00:10:09,885 where they are on those personality assessments, 256 00:10:10,145 --> 00:10:12,285 here's some things to do in conversation 257 00:10:12,285 --> 00:10:14,485 or in that coaching interaction to Yeah. 258 00:10:14,665 --> 00:10:16,925 To move things along, right? Yeah. Yeah. 259 00:10:17,185 --> 00:10:19,125 - And there is an assessment portion, you know, 260 00:10:19,125 --> 00:10:20,605 we can assess where people are at, 261 00:10:21,225 --> 00:10:23,525 but what I will typically tell people was I'm reviewing 262 00:10:23,525 --> 00:10:25,965 their assessment is from this moment on, 263 00:10:26,115 --> 00:10:28,965 this assessment is really not, not valid anymore 264 00:10:29,155 --> 00:10:31,565 because let's say they were low in a particular style. 265 00:10:32,145 --> 00:10:35,085 If I then coach 'em in that style, then they're better. Mm. 266 00:10:35,505 --> 00:10:37,805 And then their assessment the next day 267 00:10:37,805 --> 00:10:39,525 would be completely different. Yeah. So, 268 00:10:39,785 --> 00:10:40,925 - And these coaching styles, 269 00:10:40,925 --> 00:10:43,765 and you gimme a cheat sheet here, so there's seven of them. 270 00:10:43,905 --> 00:10:46,245 Yep. Right? And these aren't necessarily like 271 00:10:46,245 --> 00:10:47,405 personalities, no. 272 00:10:47,405 --> 00:10:49,805 Things where it's like you are a red personality 273 00:10:49,865 --> 00:10:51,845 and that's just who you are and deal with it. 274 00:10:51,865 --> 00:10:53,645 And when I talk with you, I need 275 00:10:53,645 --> 00:10:55,045 to talk to you as a red person. 276 00:10:55,045 --> 00:10:59,445 Right. But this is more for the, this is just depending on 277 00:10:59,445 --> 00:11:00,765 where they're at the circumstances. 278 00:11:00,875 --> 00:11:03,085 Yeah. You may bounce around to the different styles Yeah. 279 00:11:03,085 --> 00:11:05,685 Where personality can't suddenly change your personality. 280 00:11:06,065 --> 00:11:07,085 - And, and you know, one of the things 281 00:11:07,085 --> 00:11:08,645 that we love about the savior is 282 00:11:08,645 --> 00:11:09,685 that he was the master coach. 283 00:11:09,715 --> 00:11:11,405 Yeah. He was the one that used all 284 00:11:11,405 --> 00:11:13,645 of these styles when the coachee needed 285 00:11:13,645 --> 00:11:14,845 it, how they needed it. 286 00:11:15,345 --> 00:11:17,805 And so I think there's a lot to kind of unpack in 287 00:11:17,805 --> 00:11:19,605 how are we becoming better coaches. Mm-Hmm. , 288 00:11:20,205 --> 00:11:21,045 - Anything else as far as the 289 00:11:21,045 --> 00:11:22,405 foundation of where this came from? 290 00:11:22,795 --> 00:11:24,205 What we need to understand, 291 00:11:24,905 --> 00:11:29,285 and this is like the, so respect is that's the, like one. 292 00:11:29,905 --> 00:11:32,365 How would you, you frame it? Like one style 293 00:11:32,625 --> 00:11:34,565 or one program or what, how would you frame 294 00:11:34,565 --> 00:11:35,565 - It? 295 00:11:35,565 --> 00:11:36,325 I'd say it's a framework, right? It's a framework. 296 00:11:36,435 --> 00:11:37,925 It's the framework that will help make sure 297 00:11:37,925 --> 00:11:40,005 that you're using the different coaching styles 298 00:11:40,005 --> 00:11:42,045 that the coaching needs at that time. Yeah. And 299 00:11:42,105 --> 00:11:43,925 - Thi this framework isn't necessarily, 300 00:11:44,305 --> 00:11:46,525 or maybe it is like as far as like this is, 301 00:11:46,725 --> 00:11:48,485 'cause I think of like CBT, right? 302 00:11:48,485 --> 00:11:51,365 Like cognitive behavioral therapy, therapy coaching. Yeah. 303 00:11:51,365 --> 00:11:54,125 Yeah. Like there's sort of this, this framework you go 304 00:11:54,125 --> 00:11:55,645 through regardless of the, the issue. 305 00:11:55,645 --> 00:11:57,765 Mm-Hmm. . And this isn't necessarily a 306 00:11:57,765 --> 00:12:01,045 framework of go to step A, step B, step C, right? Correct. 307 00:12:01,045 --> 00:12:03,285 - Right. So, so maybe we should like jump into the styles. 308 00:12:03,285 --> 00:12:04,205 Let's do it and then we can tell, 309 00:12:04,265 --> 00:12:05,485 and then, uh, we can give you some 310 00:12:05,725 --> 00:12:06,365 - Coaching. All right. 311 00:12:06,585 --> 00:12:07,885 - All right. It - Always happens to me. 312 00:12:08,085 --> 00:12:09,365 I guess I'm the host. Alright. 313 00:12:09,365 --> 00:12:11,445 - Yeah. You are price, you pay. 314 00:12:12,105 --> 00:12:13,525 - Uh, so where do we begin? 315 00:12:13,855 --> 00:12:15,965 - Let's start with rally here. Let's, okay, 316 00:12:16,105 --> 00:12:18,965 so rally's the first r there's only one R in 317 00:12:18,965 --> 00:12:20,325 respect. So I should 318 00:12:20,465 --> 00:12:22,965 - The one, and - I should have known that already, , 319 00:12:23,745 --> 00:12:25,565 but the rally style is the driver. 320 00:12:25,825 --> 00:12:29,005 So I like to always think about rally is like someone's in a 321 00:12:29,005 --> 00:12:30,965 rally car, what pushes them forward. 322 00:12:31,155 --> 00:12:35,565 Okay. So rally or is setting goals, setting measurables. 323 00:12:36,075 --> 00:12:38,645 It's what puts gas in the tank to move the coachee forward. 324 00:12:39,185 --> 00:12:41,045 So a lot of times I'll use rally 325 00:12:41,065 --> 00:12:42,685 or kind of towards the end of a conversation, 326 00:12:43,005 --> 00:12:44,965 somebody comes in with a problem and we set, 327 00:12:44,985 --> 00:12:47,245 we talk about it and figure out the plan. 328 00:12:47,305 --> 00:12:50,045 And then we set these, we set a a goal, right? Mm-Hmm. 329 00:12:50,085 --> 00:12:52,045 . So rally your type questions would be, 330 00:12:52,625 --> 00:12:54,965 what's the first step you need to do to accomplish this? 331 00:12:55,665 --> 00:12:56,925 You know, when do you wanna have this 332 00:12:56,925 --> 00:12:58,165 particular thing done by? 333 00:12:58,705 --> 00:12:59,725 What's the metric? 334 00:12:59,725 --> 00:13:01,765 What, what do you wanna measure based on this, 335 00:13:02,115 --> 00:13:03,165 this plan that you have? 336 00:13:03,785 --> 00:13:05,765 And the rally is, is kind of the motivator, 337 00:13:05,765 --> 00:13:06,805 the driver, right. 338 00:13:07,625 --> 00:13:09,805 To keep people, keep the coaching moving forward. 339 00:13:09,805 --> 00:13:12,765 - Gotcha. And so this isn't, uh, necessarily 340 00:13:12,835 --> 00:13:15,085 that you're speaking overly positive about things. 341 00:13:15,085 --> 00:13:17,085 Like you can do it like don't down. It can be 342 00:13:17,085 --> 00:13:18,085 - Don't get down. 343 00:13:18,085 --> 00:13:19,045 Okay. It certainly can be. Yeah. 344 00:13:19,625 --> 00:13:22,605 And that it, those would be rally or type statements, 345 00:13:23,425 --> 00:13:25,605 but it's really about that driving force, right? 346 00:13:25,985 --> 00:13:29,245 So like rally is, uh, you know, I like 347 00:13:29,245 --> 00:13:31,525 to think about the race car side of it and it's, 348 00:13:31,725 --> 00:13:32,885 'cause I like race cars. 349 00:13:32,965 --> 00:13:34,085 I think they're, you know, but, 350 00:13:34,305 --> 00:13:35,765 but it could be the cheerleader, right? 351 00:13:36,025 --> 00:13:38,285 Hey, I'm rallying you up. Hey, it's okay. Yeah. 352 00:13:38,285 --> 00:13:40,565 You got this, let's go. Yeah. Right. And 353 00:13:40,565 --> 00:13:41,525 - Would you almost say that's almost 354 00:13:41,525 --> 00:13:42,405 like a default position? 355 00:13:42,405 --> 00:13:44,245 Like when someone comes to you and they're down 356 00:13:44,265 --> 00:13:45,525 or they're frustrated, it's like, 357 00:13:45,695 --> 00:13:46,925 cheer up there, you like, you 358 00:13:47,225 --> 00:13:48,225 - Do great. 359 00:13:48,225 --> 00:13:49,525 Totally. You know what, that totally depends. Right? 360 00:13:49,745 --> 00:13:52,765 So I like the idea of the, the bishop speaking to a youth. 361 00:13:52,785 --> 00:13:56,045 If the youth comes in and sit sits down and is fine Right. 362 00:13:56,065 --> 00:13:58,165 Or appears to be fine. Right. 363 00:13:58,905 --> 00:14:02,485 You might not pick rally or, or you know, if they come in 364 00:14:02,485 --> 00:14:05,485 and then they start talking about transgression Mm-Hmm. 365 00:14:05,525 --> 00:14:07,285 , you're not necessarily gonna say, Hey, 366 00:14:07,285 --> 00:14:09,485 you got this, you're gonna, you can overcome this. 367 00:14:09,705 --> 00:14:12,405 It might be the understanding part, right? 368 00:14:12,475 --> 00:14:15,605 Like, Hey, you're, you're right. You are imperfect. 369 00:14:15,605 --> 00:14:17,045 That's part of the plan. Mm-Hmm. . 370 00:14:17,065 --> 00:14:20,405 But the savior's perfect and he'll, he'll help you. Right? 371 00:14:20,585 --> 00:14:22,125 Mm-Hmm. . So yeah, it just, 372 00:14:22,225 --> 00:14:23,845 it really just depends on 373 00:14:24,315 --> 00:14:25,765 what the coaching needs in the moment. 374 00:14:26,085 --> 00:14:28,045 - I think like FSY to kind of your point though, 375 00:14:28,075 --> 00:14:30,045 like if you were to go to that, those are probably very 376 00:14:30,055 --> 00:14:32,045 rally presentations, right? 377 00:14:32,425 --> 00:14:34,165 You got this, you'd be a great youth. 378 00:14:34,385 --> 00:14:37,725 Go and deliver what you can. Nephi said, I will go and do. 379 00:14:37,935 --> 00:14:41,525 Right. That's a very rally your comment about like moving 380 00:14:41,555 --> 00:14:43,365 forward and making progress. 381 00:14:43,365 --> 00:14:44,365 - Yeah. And you, you mentioned something 382 00:14:44,365 --> 00:14:45,165 that's really interesting. 383 00:14:45,165 --> 00:14:49,085 So it's not necessarily like a person is coaching style 384 00:14:49,085 --> 00:14:51,565 for a person, but it could be an event like FSY Yeah. 385 00:14:51,565 --> 00:14:54,245 Or even how sacrament meetings run or elders quo, right? 386 00:14:54,245 --> 00:14:56,405 Like even these, and obviously people 387 00:14:56,585 --> 00:14:57,605 create these events, right? 388 00:14:57,605 --> 00:14:59,765 Yeah. So they're, they sort of pass on this, 389 00:15:00,265 --> 00:15:03,405 the certain coaching style through these events. Well, and 390 00:15:03,405 --> 00:15:05,005 - It kind of depends on the coach, right? 391 00:15:05,005 --> 00:15:06,325 Yeah. Because if you go to FSY, 392 00:15:06,325 --> 00:15:07,565 you might have somebody who's gonna, 393 00:15:07,565 --> 00:15:09,445 you're gonna sob, right? 394 00:15:09,445 --> 00:15:10,885 Yeah. Goes, I, this is amazing. 395 00:15:11,045 --> 00:15:12,725 I feel the spirit and all of that. Right. 396 00:15:13,075 --> 00:15:15,365 That might be more of a confidant, like hearing 397 00:15:15,625 --> 00:15:16,845 how you were feeling at that time. 398 00:15:16,995 --> 00:15:19,565 Were the rally is the one that gets you like stoked. 399 00:15:19,565 --> 00:15:20,845 Like, oh, I can do this. 400 00:15:21,055 --> 00:15:22,765 Let's, I'm gonna go give out 10 book 401 00:15:22,765 --> 00:15:23,845 of Mormons this week at school. 402 00:15:23,855 --> 00:15:25,365 Right. Or whatever it might be. Yeah. 403 00:15:25,475 --> 00:15:27,645 - Yeah. And I'm just thinking all the ministering interviews 404 00:15:27,785 --> 00:15:30,565 or, uh, the award mission leader, uh, 405 00:15:30,565 --> 00:15:32,645 sometimes he comes in hard with the rally or Right. 406 00:15:32,645 --> 00:15:33,725 Like, come on, you got 407 00:15:33,725 --> 00:15:34,725 - This. 408 00:15:34,725 --> 00:15:36,645 And, and the coach's like, I don't need that right now. 409 00:15:36,965 --> 00:15:38,685 I need something else. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. 410 00:15:39,145 --> 00:15:40,885 The next one is the educator. 411 00:15:41,505 --> 00:15:43,325 So when I think about general conference, 412 00:15:43,515 --> 00:15:46,725 general conference is like a hundred percent educator. 413 00:15:46,785 --> 00:15:49,005 Mm. Educator is kind of a lecture. 414 00:15:49,715 --> 00:15:52,645 It's, I'm gonna teach you something or fill a skill 415 00:15:52,785 --> 00:15:53,805 or knowledge gap. 416 00:15:54,065 --> 00:15:55,845 So there's some knowledge you don't currently have. 417 00:15:56,025 --> 00:15:58,205 Let me teach that knowledge to you. Right. 418 00:15:58,825 --> 00:16:02,125 And that's what general conferences, Hey, we went as, uh, 419 00:16:02,315 --> 00:16:04,085 general authorities, we prayed about this. 420 00:16:04,185 --> 00:16:06,285 We asked the lord, here's the inspiration we received, 421 00:16:06,425 --> 00:16:09,205 and we want to teach you what his will is today. 422 00:16:09,665 --> 00:16:11,005 And it's about teaching people. 423 00:16:11,665 --> 00:16:15,805 So educators, really helpful for people who, for a coachee 424 00:16:15,905 --> 00:16:17,045 who doesn't have knowledge 425 00:16:17,065 --> 00:16:18,965 and is looking for that knowledge from somebody else. 426 00:16:19,075 --> 00:16:23,045 Yeah. So like in parenting, great examples of, Hey, I, 427 00:16:23,235 --> 00:16:25,605 your kid comes and says, I was put in this situation 428 00:16:25,605 --> 00:16:27,405 or scenario, the parent then comes 429 00:16:27,405 --> 00:16:28,765 and says, well, let me teach you about 430 00:16:28,765 --> 00:16:30,285 how I have dealt with that in the past. 431 00:16:31,025 --> 00:16:33,125 Or what have you learned from your friends 432 00:16:33,235 --> 00:16:35,325 that maybe you don't wanna continue to do. 433 00:16:35,695 --> 00:16:38,245 Right. And it's allowing them to go through self-learning. 434 00:16:38,625 --> 00:16:39,725 So it's not just teaching, 435 00:16:39,785 --> 00:16:41,085 but it's ensuring that there is 436 00:16:41,445 --> 00:16:42,525 learning that's taking place. 437 00:16:42,875 --> 00:16:45,325 - Cool. And I'm thinking of like, uh, individuals who are 438 00:16:45,885 --> 00:16:47,405 learning who wanna be baptized. 439 00:16:47,415 --> 00:16:49,365 Right. And yeah, you're, 440 00:16:49,385 --> 00:16:50,685 it wouldn't be good to just rally them. 441 00:16:50,705 --> 00:16:53,405 You gotta Yeah. They need some substance there. Right. 442 00:16:53,405 --> 00:16:55,205 - They need to know about the first vision. Yeah. Right. 443 00:16:55,265 --> 00:16:56,925 And they need to like, have questions asked to them. 444 00:16:56,945 --> 00:17:00,005 So yeah. Missionary work is very educator cool. 445 00:17:00,095 --> 00:17:02,365 We're gonna sit down and teach you these lessons. 446 00:17:03,025 --> 00:17:05,365 - Now. It, and like you said, as we go through these styles, 447 00:17:05,365 --> 00:17:08,125 like there's some styles that they feel like they're the one 448 00:17:08,205 --> 00:17:11,125 I should do, but in reality, it lands flat 449 00:17:11,225 --> 00:17:12,565 or isn't helpful because 450 00:17:12,675 --> 00:17:14,965 - It's all about that aggregated contextual considerations. 451 00:17:15,305 --> 00:17:18,365 If you're a missionary sitting down with, uh, investigators 452 00:17:19,185 --> 00:17:20,725 and you're, you're educating, 453 00:17:20,785 --> 00:17:22,165 let me tell you about Joseph Smith. 454 00:17:22,185 --> 00:17:24,045 And you can see that they're looking to the side, 455 00:17:24,185 --> 00:17:25,685 or they're like getting distracted 456 00:17:25,825 --> 00:17:28,525 or they're looking at their phone, whatever it is, you know, 457 00:17:28,805 --> 00:17:30,045 educator's probably not working 458 00:17:30,465 --> 00:17:32,125 and you need to switch to a different style 459 00:17:32,235 --> 00:17:33,965 that will then engage them at that time. 460 00:17:34,345 --> 00:17:36,965 Gotcha. Right. Like, educator is really bad if you're 461 00:17:37,125 --> 00:17:38,165 teaching youth Sunday school. 462 00:17:38,165 --> 00:17:40,205 Mm-Hmm. , let me teach you from the scriptures 463 00:17:40,265 --> 00:17:41,725 and read to you these scriptures. 464 00:17:41,835 --> 00:17:43,885 Yeah. Youth are like, not into that. 465 00:17:43,915 --> 00:17:45,365 They wanna have healthy discussion 466 00:17:45,365 --> 00:17:46,605 and dialogue going back and forth. 467 00:17:47,045 --> 00:17:48,845 - A common dynamic I hear a lot about, 468 00:17:48,965 --> 00:17:51,845 and I was this leader too, that, you know, you're a bishop 469 00:17:51,985 --> 00:17:53,765 and you keep seeing, you know, maybe, 470 00:17:53,905 --> 00:17:56,165 so all these people are struggling with pornography 471 00:17:56,265 --> 00:17:57,725 and I just get one interview 472 00:17:57,745 --> 00:17:59,925 or one appointment out the other about pornography. 473 00:18:00,345 --> 00:18:03,325 If they just understood that the negativity 474 00:18:03,465 --> 00:18:06,565 or the, you know, why this is so important to avoid. 475 00:18:06,745 --> 00:18:08,445 So fifth Sunday's coming up, 476 00:18:08,505 --> 00:18:10,085 I'm gonna do a fifth Sunday lesson 477 00:18:10,185 --> 00:18:12,125 and we're gonna really hit this hard. 478 00:18:12,225 --> 00:18:14,925 And so you sort of shift in that we're gonna educate them 479 00:18:15,305 --> 00:18:17,125 and like you said, sometimes it's appropriate. 480 00:18:17,125 --> 00:18:20,085 Other times it may, may not be. So yeah. 481 00:18:20,085 --> 00:18:21,485 Something to consider. All right. 482 00:18:21,485 --> 00:18:23,125 Should we go to the next one? Let's do it. Yeah. 483 00:18:23,665 --> 00:18:25,005 - So the next one is strategist. 484 00:18:25,005 --> 00:18:27,725 Strategist is about finding solutions 485 00:18:27,745 --> 00:18:29,685 to problems strategizing. Right? 486 00:18:29,735 --> 00:18:31,285 - Every husband loves this one 487 00:18:32,005 --> 00:18:33,005 - . 488 00:18:33,005 --> 00:18:35,365 And now, so one single wife does. Yes. 489 00:18:35,495 --> 00:18:38,205 - Lemme I I'll - Fix this. They want confidant. Yeah, 490 00:18:38,235 --> 00:18:39,285 - Yeah, yeah. Okay. Alright. 491 00:18:39,945 --> 00:18:43,165 - But, uh, yeah. So strategist is addressing a problem. 492 00:18:43,235 --> 00:18:45,765 What are the op, what options do we have to solve this? 493 00:18:46,155 --> 00:18:47,765 What are the steps we need to take? 494 00:18:48,385 --> 00:18:50,005 How are you gonna solve, 495 00:18:50,345 --> 00:18:51,965 what's the strategy you're gonna use? 496 00:18:52,025 --> 00:18:53,085 Mm-Hmm. , you know, 497 00:18:53,085 --> 00:18:55,605 strategist is the fixing motion. Gotcha. 498 00:18:55,945 --> 00:18:57,325 - And I know it's like coaching. I get a lot 499 00:18:57,325 --> 00:18:58,685 of people approach me about podcasting. 500 00:18:58,685 --> 00:19:01,565 Obviously I've established a successful 501 00:19:01,595 --> 00:19:03,005 - Podcast. I'm a good podcast. Thank 502 00:19:03,005 --> 00:19:03,925 - You. It's 503 00:19:03,925 --> 00:19:04,965 - A very episode. 504 00:19:05,095 --> 00:19:07,165 - Great. Yeah. Great - Guest their 505 00:19:07,165 --> 00:19:08,165 - Best. 506 00:19:08,165 --> 00:19:08,645 And, and so they'll come to me 507 00:19:08,705 --> 00:19:11,645 and usually what they're looking for is, is the strategy. 508 00:19:11,675 --> 00:19:12,685 Like, how'd you do it? Like, 509 00:19:12,685 --> 00:19:14,645 gimme three things I could do next. 510 00:19:14,645 --> 00:19:16,205 Right. So then I shift into a 511 00:19:16,205 --> 00:19:18,325 strategist coaching style. Right? Yeah. 512 00:19:18,555 --> 00:19:20,645 - Cool. Yeah. - Anything else with strategist 513 00:19:20,645 --> 00:19:22,285 that we need to lay out? 514 00:19:22,285 --> 00:19:23,405 But it seems pretty straightforward. 515 00:19:23,405 --> 00:19:24,485 - Yeah. Strategist is pretty, 516 00:19:24,485 --> 00:19:25,845 pretty straightforward, pretty easy. 517 00:19:26,075 --> 00:19:28,125 It's identifying steps in, 518 00:19:28,465 --> 00:19:30,525 in fixing the problem or, awesome. 519 00:19:30,715 --> 00:19:33,405 - Yeah. I think one, one clarification between strategist 520 00:19:33,405 --> 00:19:37,445 and rally, or rally is the next step strategist is solving 521 00:19:37,705 --> 00:19:38,725 the long term issue. 522 00:19:39,025 --> 00:19:40,325 So let's say you were like trying 523 00:19:40,325 --> 00:19:42,165 to get a temple recommend back, right? 524 00:19:42,505 --> 00:19:44,125 You might meet with a state president 525 00:19:44,185 --> 00:19:46,085 and working on a series of things 526 00:19:46,085 --> 00:19:47,205 that will allow you to get there. 527 00:19:47,425 --> 00:19:49,845 The rally is what's the first thing that you're gonna do? 528 00:19:50,145 --> 00:19:51,685 The strategist is what's this? 529 00:19:51,865 --> 00:19:54,325 How are we going to get you long-term to where you wanna be? 530 00:19:54,635 --> 00:19:56,125 - Yeah. Someone interested in a podcast, 531 00:19:56,185 --> 00:19:59,445 you can give 'em a list of things and then ask the question. 532 00:19:59,705 --> 00:20:01,245 So what do you wanna do a podcast about? 533 00:20:01,245 --> 00:20:04,565 And they're like, uh, okay. That's the first thing. Yeah. 534 00:20:04,795 --> 00:20:06,485 - Awesome. - When are you gonna decide 535 00:20:06,485 --> 00:20:07,965 what your podcast is gonna be about? 536 00:20:08,105 --> 00:20:09,285 That's a rally or question. 537 00:20:09,285 --> 00:20:10,805 - Yeah. Awesome. Jared, what's next? 538 00:20:11,185 --> 00:20:13,165 - The next one up is the provocateur. 539 00:20:13,945 --> 00:20:15,205 So the provocateur is the one 540 00:20:15,205 --> 00:20:17,085 that makes people squirm the most. 541 00:20:17,325 --> 00:20:20,565 Right. because it's poking a hole in somebody's 542 00:20:20,565 --> 00:20:23,685 logic and it's often speaking the unspeakable truth. 543 00:20:23,905 --> 00:20:27,245 Mm. And so when a coachee goes to a coach saying, Hey, 544 00:20:27,285 --> 00:20:29,005 I have this question, the coach will 545 00:20:29,005 --> 00:20:30,245 say, are you the problem? 546 00:20:30,705 --> 00:20:32,525 And often people are like, oh my gosh, 547 00:20:32,605 --> 00:20:33,645 I feel so uncomfortable with this. 548 00:20:33,825 --> 00:20:37,685 But it it's because it, it needs to happen at certain times. 549 00:20:38,545 --> 00:20:41,285 - My mind just goes to so many stories of Christ. Right? 550 00:20:41,665 --> 00:20:42,925 Oh man. Amen. He, he 551 00:20:42,925 --> 00:20:43,885 - Was so good, really knew how to 552 00:20:43,965 --> 00:20:45,445 provoke. He it's the best for 553 00:20:45,445 --> 00:20:46,445 - Bucket score. 554 00:20:46,445 --> 00:20:48,005 Yeah. Think about like the parable of the 10 versions. 555 00:20:48,005 --> 00:20:50,205 Mm-Hmm. . Right. The takeaway for me, 556 00:20:50,305 --> 00:20:52,965 so on my mission, we had a visiting general authority come 557 00:20:52,965 --> 00:20:56,445 and he talked, he spoke about how the different, um, aspects 558 00:20:56,445 --> 00:20:59,165 of the parable and what you don't have right. 559 00:20:59,225 --> 00:21:00,885 Is your oil and your oil kind 560 00:21:00,885 --> 00:21:02,085 of represents the temple recommend. 561 00:21:02,425 --> 00:21:03,765 So you go to the temple without a temple 562 00:21:04,045 --> 00:21:05,085 recommend, you can't get in. 563 00:21:05,705 --> 00:21:07,245 So the takeaway from the parable 564 00:21:07,245 --> 00:21:09,685 of the 10 virgins is if you don't have a recommend, 565 00:21:09,905 --> 00:21:12,765 you can't get in, which is a very provocateur thing. 566 00:21:12,905 --> 00:21:14,485 Why would you wanna take somebody else's 567 00:21:14,865 --> 00:21:16,845 if you can't get your own? Yeah. Right. 568 00:21:17,355 --> 00:21:20,285 - Yeah. So he's was telling that parable as like, 569 00:21:20,545 --> 00:21:23,805 you may be one of the 10 virgins and that really, he 570 00:21:23,925 --> 00:21:24,925 - Can't Yeah. 571 00:21:24,925 --> 00:21:25,805 - You can't really reconcile that. 572 00:21:25,905 --> 00:21:27,725 You know, it's hard to sit with. Right. 573 00:21:28,005 --> 00:21:29,085 - I think the savior was really good 574 00:21:29,085 --> 00:21:30,245 at be in Afr with Peter. 575 00:21:30,425 --> 00:21:32,325 You know, do you love me? Do you love me? 576 00:21:32,505 --> 00:21:35,005 Do you, and Peter's, you know, he's, he's like, 577 00:21:35,355 --> 00:21:36,645 he's really thinking about it. 578 00:21:36,755 --> 00:21:38,045 He's thinking deeply about it. Right. 579 00:21:38,045 --> 00:21:41,125 Because the savior really wanted him to 580 00:21:41,715 --> 00:21:42,965 embrace this concept. 581 00:21:43,305 --> 00:21:46,245 And I also love the story of the, when they're at sea 582 00:21:46,305 --> 00:21:48,245 and the, the storm is raging and, 583 00:21:48,545 --> 00:21:49,805 and they wake the savior up 584 00:21:49,805 --> 00:21:51,485 and he's, he says, where's your faith? 585 00:21:51,485 --> 00:21:52,925 Mm-Hmm. , why have you lost your faith? 586 00:21:53,185 --> 00:21:56,965 And yeah, he is masterful provocateur. Awesome. 587 00:21:57,205 --> 00:21:59,325 - I think there's a lot of people in the church today, 588 00:21:59,325 --> 00:22:01,085 they're asking provocateur questions 589 00:22:01,465 --> 00:22:03,485 and that, that's where some holdup comes for them. 590 00:22:03,575 --> 00:22:06,685 Right. Of like, what's the answer? Why did this happen? 591 00:22:06,825 --> 00:22:08,645 And they, they're asking the tough questions 592 00:22:08,875 --> 00:22:11,605 because they need provocateur in their lives. 593 00:22:11,735 --> 00:22:14,285 Right. And, uh, uh, example that Matt 594 00:22:14,285 --> 00:22:16,605 and I have talked about in the past is, did Adam 595 00:22:16,625 --> 00:22:18,245 and Eve actually exist 596 00:22:19,025 --> 00:22:20,805 or were they the first people on earth? 597 00:22:21,065 --> 00:22:22,125 Or was there evolution? 598 00:22:22,145 --> 00:22:23,445 And did it actually get to a point 599 00:22:23,445 --> 00:22:24,485 where then there were people here? 600 00:22:24,485 --> 00:22:26,685 And like, that's a very provocateur question. Mm-Hmm. 601 00:22:26,725 --> 00:22:28,125 of, is it just a story 602 00:22:28,125 --> 00:22:29,565 that will help us understand it? 603 00:22:29,905 --> 00:22:31,565 And if so, why? Right. Yeah. 604 00:22:31,585 --> 00:22:33,805 Poking a hole in that logic, trying 605 00:22:33,805 --> 00:22:36,005 to figure out what's really going on here. 606 00:22:36,005 --> 00:22:37,125 Yeah. It's happening a lot. 607 00:22:37,725 --> 00:22:40,645 - I truly believe that we worship a god of, of paradox. 608 00:22:40,655 --> 00:22:43,645 Right. That he'll often put things out there that are, 609 00:22:43,645 --> 00:22:45,245 they seem like contrary 610 00:22:45,265 --> 00:22:47,125 and you can't, you can't sit with it. 611 00:22:47,345 --> 00:22:48,645 You know, it's almost like, no, you gotta, 612 00:22:48,835 --> 00:22:49,885 it's got one or the other. 613 00:22:49,885 --> 00:22:52,165 Right. How can we have prophets on earth 614 00:22:52,165 --> 00:22:53,685 when, but they're imperfect. 615 00:22:53,685 --> 00:22:55,125 Like, are they speaking for you? 616 00:22:55,265 --> 00:22:57,405 And, and so it's hard to sit with, right? Right. 617 00:22:57,405 --> 00:22:59,245 But it's almost like God's like Yeah, exactly. 618 00:22:59,245 --> 00:23:02,925 Like he's in, it's an invitation to step into it. Yes. Yes. 619 00:23:02,945 --> 00:23:04,405 And, and trust in him. Right? Yeah. 620 00:23:04,405 --> 00:23:06,365 And, and so I can see how that could be, 621 00:23:06,365 --> 00:23:08,365 the provocateur could be such a powerful 622 00:23:08,365 --> 00:23:09,605 Yeah. Coaching style. Right? 623 00:23:09,785 --> 00:23:11,005 - And it really can be, you know, 624 00:23:11,425 --> 00:23:14,925 the name provocateur has this kind of a negative connotation 625 00:23:14,925 --> 00:23:19,125 to it, but it really comes from a, a place of love, right? 626 00:23:19,505 --> 00:23:21,205 You're thinking this particular way 627 00:23:22,065 --> 00:23:23,845 and is that the right way? 628 00:23:24,425 --> 00:23:26,605 Is that the way you should be thinking about this? Mm-Hmm. 629 00:23:26,605 --> 00:23:28,765 You know, a lot of times when I'm coaching people, 630 00:23:28,875 --> 00:23:31,445 I'll say they'll come up with a solution 631 00:23:31,945 --> 00:23:33,805 and my provocateur question will be, well, 632 00:23:33,965 --> 00:23:35,285 what if that doesn't work? 633 00:23:35,385 --> 00:23:37,365 Mm-Hmm. what if that's not the solution? 634 00:23:37,395 --> 00:23:40,085 Just to get them to open up a little bit, 635 00:23:40,155 --> 00:23:42,885 broaden their perspective a little bit. Hmm. 636 00:23:43,325 --> 00:23:45,925 - I think for those that are volunteering in church roles 637 00:23:46,145 --> 00:23:48,525 are saying, I can't make someone uncomfortable 638 00:23:48,625 --> 00:23:50,165 and squirm by asking this question. 639 00:23:50,585 --> 00:23:52,725 And where I would challenge you is if you're 640 00:23:52,725 --> 00:23:54,045 parents, you do this all the time. 641 00:23:54,045 --> 00:23:55,525 Mm-Hmm. , why did you think it was 642 00:23:55,525 --> 00:23:56,565 okay to hit your little brother? 643 00:23:56,665 --> 00:23:57,845 Mm-Hmm. . Why aren't you 644 00:23:57,845 --> 00:23:58,925 getting ready for bed in time? 645 00:23:59,015 --> 00:24:01,165 Right. These are provocateur questions 646 00:24:01,165 --> 00:24:02,965 that are poking a hole in logic. 647 00:24:03,155 --> 00:24:05,845 Yeah. And so why do we do that to our kids? 648 00:24:05,875 --> 00:24:08,365 Because we love them, we care about them 649 00:24:08,505 --> 00:24:09,805 and they need it at that time. 650 00:24:10,065 --> 00:24:11,525 The same is true as Matt mentioned, 651 00:24:11,585 --> 00:24:13,405 for other people that we work with. Yeah. 652 00:24:13,625 --> 00:24:16,045 - And I'm just thinking like the typical elders quo 653 00:24:16,045 --> 00:24:17,125 where we almost wanna just, 654 00:24:17,135 --> 00:24:19,205 let's just stay in the educator column, you know, 655 00:24:19,205 --> 00:24:20,565 let's just talk about doctrine. 656 00:24:20,665 --> 00:24:21,845 Yep. Okay. 657 00:24:21,925 --> 00:24:23,125 That guy said that comment, 658 00:24:23,225 --> 00:24:25,285 and that's sort of very provocative comment. 659 00:24:25,485 --> 00:24:26,965 I don't know, let's de diffuse it. 660 00:24:26,965 --> 00:24:28,365 - Right? We're gonna gonna deflect that, right? Yeah. 661 00:24:28,365 --> 00:24:29,685 De instead of like leaning into it 662 00:24:29,685 --> 00:24:31,725 because what does that, what does that Edwards quo need? 663 00:24:31,775 --> 00:24:34,725 Maybe they need to go into it more because Matt 664 00:24:34,725 --> 00:24:35,885 and I are those type of people we love 665 00:24:35,885 --> 00:24:37,005 good provocateur in our life. 666 00:24:37,005 --> 00:24:39,205 Mm-Hmm. . Right? Let's ask a hard question 667 00:24:39,265 --> 00:24:41,045 and have some real discussion 668 00:24:41,045 --> 00:24:43,525 and dialogue in an elders quo instead of me, 669 00:24:43,525 --> 00:24:45,205 like almost falling asleep. Uhhuh, 670 00:24:45,245 --> 00:24:46,245 - , . 671 00:24:46,475 --> 00:24:48,485 Love it. Matt. Should we go to the next one? Yeah. 672 00:24:48,505 --> 00:24:51,565 - So the second E is explore. There there's two letters. 673 00:24:51,755 --> 00:24:53,205 Yeah. So that's, yeah. 674 00:24:53,205 --> 00:24:57,325 Anyways, uh, , so the explorer is the, 675 00:24:57,325 --> 00:24:59,565 the simple way I like to look at this is asking the question 676 00:24:59,565 --> 00:25:02,325 that you don't even know the answer to as the coach, right? 677 00:25:02,325 --> 00:25:05,365 There's a lot of situations when you're counseling someone 678 00:25:05,425 --> 00:25:08,045 and you kind of have a, a rhythm to it, right? 679 00:25:08,555 --> 00:25:09,965 Well, explorers asking the questions 680 00:25:09,965 --> 00:25:11,325 that you dunno an answer to. 681 00:25:11,785 --> 00:25:13,285 And it's just to dive a little deeper. 682 00:25:14,005 --> 00:25:16,325 I think about when people will come to me, 683 00:25:16,395 --> 00:25:19,165 they'll say something that's very, uh, cliche 684 00:25:19,305 --> 00:25:21,765 or, you know, something that people often say, 685 00:25:22,225 --> 00:25:23,725 and I'll just ask 'em to define it. 686 00:25:24,035 --> 00:25:26,485 What does that mean to you? Mm-Hmm. You feel overwhelmed. 687 00:25:26,485 --> 00:25:27,765 You, you feel like you're drowning. 688 00:25:27,995 --> 00:25:29,045 What does that mean to you? 689 00:25:29,235 --> 00:25:31,525 Because there could be varying degrees of 690 00:25:32,075 --> 00:25:34,285 what they're feeling to make them say 691 00:25:34,285 --> 00:25:35,805 that particular thing, right? 692 00:25:36,395 --> 00:25:39,765 This is one where I like to focus a lot on my intuition. 693 00:25:40,035 --> 00:25:41,405 Like, what is my gut saying 694 00:25:41,955 --> 00:25:43,485 that this person needs right now? 695 00:25:44,105 --> 00:25:47,085 Hey, for some reason I'm thinking about navy blue. 696 00:25:47,235 --> 00:25:48,405 Does that mean anything to you? 697 00:25:48,905 --> 00:25:52,645 And they'll be like, oh my gosh, yes. Cougars got, Hey, 698 00:25:53,955 --> 00:25:55,045 - Yeah, - Too soon. 699 00:25:55,825 --> 00:25:58,245 - God, uh, they tra I dunno. Yeah. 700 00:25:58,245 --> 00:26:01,645 Anyways, but just being able to, you know, in, in a, 701 00:26:01,665 --> 00:26:04,645 in a bishop situation, uhhuh, it's 702 00:26:04,645 --> 00:26:06,405 what is the spirit telling you to ask about? 703 00:26:06,595 --> 00:26:08,525 Yeah. Let's explore that. Let's talk about that. 704 00:26:08,765 --> 00:26:12,405 I love the question of, tell me more about this 705 00:26:12,705 --> 00:26:14,605 or define this to me. 706 00:26:14,605 --> 00:26:16,965 Those are like my favorite go-to explorer questions. 707 00:26:16,965 --> 00:26:19,125 Just let's, let's go a little deeper. Hmm. 708 00:26:19,395 --> 00:26:21,205 - Love that. Explorer also is saying, 709 00:26:21,475 --> 00:26:22,965 what else have we not considered? 710 00:26:23,115 --> 00:26:24,525 It's a possibility, right? 711 00:26:24,585 --> 00:26:26,805 So I imagine like ward council getting together 712 00:26:26,985 --> 00:26:29,045 and discussing how to get more out of that. 713 00:26:29,435 --> 00:26:31,445 They might come to a conclusion of here's 714 00:26:31,445 --> 00:26:32,605 how we can improve word council. 715 00:26:32,865 --> 00:26:34,325 And then the explorer would say, 716 00:26:34,545 --> 00:26:36,765 but is there another idea we haven't explored yet? 717 00:26:36,765 --> 00:26:39,325 Mm-Hmm. or maybe word council's going great. 718 00:26:39,505 --> 00:26:40,805 And then an explorer comes and says, 719 00:26:40,825 --> 00:26:43,645 is there a way we can improve our time management? 720 00:26:43,815 --> 00:26:45,365 Right? We've talked about stuff, 721 00:26:45,365 --> 00:26:47,285 but what else have we not discovered? 722 00:26:47,315 --> 00:26:49,885 It's innovation, it's creativity, it's figuring out 723 00:26:50,195 --> 00:26:51,525 what other people haven't seen. 724 00:26:51,755 --> 00:26:54,325 - Yeah. Yeah. I'm just thinking of that revelatory process. 725 00:26:54,455 --> 00:26:55,965 Often it requires that moment 726 00:26:56,065 --> 00:26:57,065 - Of exploration, right? 727 00:26:57,115 --> 00:26:59,605 Yeah. Joseph Smith, like, it's a perfect example, right? 728 00:26:59,605 --> 00:27:00,885 - Yeah. Usually was a question he 729 00:27:00,905 --> 00:27:01,925 was exploring. Oh, I should, 730 00:27:02,285 --> 00:27:03,285 - I should go ask. 731 00:27:03,285 --> 00:27:04,125 Yeah, I'm gonna go have a little 732 00:27:04,125 --> 00:27:05,365 prayer in the, in the woods. 733 00:27:05,705 --> 00:27:07,565 - See what happens. Another strategy that comes to mind 734 00:27:07,565 --> 00:27:09,725 with ex Explorer that I think's really effective 735 00:27:09,725 --> 00:27:11,885 for church leaders, especially, you know, the bishop 736 00:27:11,985 --> 00:27:13,645 or in that context where you're, you know, 737 00:27:13,885 --> 00:27:15,845 somebody's really wrestling with a problem, they brought it 738 00:27:15,845 --> 00:27:20,365 to you like Rob Ferrell has done this, where he'll take a, 739 00:27:20,765 --> 00:27:22,605 a scripture story and say, I want you 740 00:27:22,605 --> 00:27:25,085 to go study this story about the savior. 741 00:27:25,085 --> 00:27:27,365 Right? No one, he uses the man with palsy 742 00:27:27,365 --> 00:27:29,285 that's lifted down from the, the ceiling. 743 00:27:29,285 --> 00:27:32,325 Right? That, and he, he would give that to somebody 744 00:27:32,325 --> 00:27:33,565 and be like, we're gonna meet next week, 745 00:27:33,565 --> 00:27:35,965 but I just want you to like, just jump into this 746 00:27:35,965 --> 00:27:37,245 story and see what comes. 747 00:27:37,345 --> 00:27:39,285 And then, so he's not the man that's like, 748 00:27:39,285 --> 00:27:41,125 I've got all the answers do A, B, and C. 749 00:27:41,125 --> 00:27:42,885 But it was more of like, what did you find? 750 00:27:42,995 --> 00:27:45,645 Like how did God show up for you? What was he teaching you? 751 00:27:45,865 --> 00:27:48,125 And then from there it was beautiful, the Yeah. 752 00:27:48,475 --> 00:27:51,205 What came out of that. Yeah. So, Jared, what's next? 753 00:27:51,505 --> 00:27:53,245 - The C is confidant. 754 00:27:53,665 --> 00:27:56,325 The confidant is the opposite of the provocateur. 755 00:27:56,625 --> 00:27:58,445 The provocateur pokes a hole in logic 756 00:27:58,695 --> 00:28:01,325 where the confidant is asking about your feelings 757 00:28:01,985 --> 00:28:03,485 and how you interpret something. 758 00:28:03,485 --> 00:28:06,205 Mm-Hmm. . So it's often that warm blanket, 759 00:28:06,465 --> 00:28:09,165 it makes you feel really great about your life 760 00:28:09,185 --> 00:28:10,485 and your situation and everything else. 761 00:28:10,665 --> 00:28:12,285 It can feel like validation a lot of the time 762 00:28:12,595 --> 00:28:16,245 because the coachee often will like meet with the coach 763 00:28:16,425 --> 00:28:18,085 and then when they have a confidant conversation 764 00:28:18,635 --> 00:28:21,325 walk away saying, I feel so much better about life. 765 00:28:21,425 --> 00:28:24,405 And the coach will say, we didn't solve a single thing. 766 00:28:24,405 --> 00:28:25,565 Mm-Hmm. , right? Yeah. 767 00:28:25,795 --> 00:28:27,725 Because all they did was express the 768 00:28:27,725 --> 00:28:28,965 emotions that they were dealing with. 769 00:28:29,415 --> 00:28:32,925 Elder Bednar was at a Silicon Slopes tech summit recently, 770 00:28:32,925 --> 00:28:35,165 which is a big tech conference in Utah that happened. 771 00:28:35,165 --> 00:28:39,045 And, and he said that quote, God works from the inside out. 772 00:28:39,625 --> 00:28:41,165 Oh, I'm sorry, I read the wrong one. 773 00:28:41,465 --> 00:28:44,605 It was, if we can stop yelling long enough to listen, 774 00:28:44,985 --> 00:28:46,325 we can work things out. 775 00:28:46,905 --> 00:28:50,445 And listening to work things out is a confidant. 776 00:28:50,785 --> 00:28:53,085 How do you feel about this? Where are you coming from? 777 00:28:53,645 --> 00:28:55,765 I think about, if you go back to like missionary work, 778 00:28:55,825 --> 00:28:57,525 you might like bible bash, right? 779 00:28:57,655 --> 00:28:59,765 Let's compare this scripture versus this one. 780 00:28:59,915 --> 00:29:02,085 What if instead of competing against each other, 781 00:29:02,265 --> 00:29:04,405 you were just to say, what does the scripture mean to you? 782 00:29:04,705 --> 00:29:06,445 How do you feel, you know, Jesus, 783 00:29:06,945 --> 00:29:08,645 how is Jesus represented in your life? 784 00:29:09,105 --> 00:29:11,005 And hearing those people out without trying 785 00:29:11,125 --> 00:29:13,365 to prove anything is what the confidant would do. 786 00:29:13,365 --> 00:29:15,285 - Yeah. And imagine there's this sense of like, 787 00:29:15,505 --> 00:29:17,565 not just listening, but just being okay with 788 00:29:17,565 --> 00:29:19,405 what they're saying and just sitting with it. 789 00:29:19,435 --> 00:29:21,805 Like, you may interact with somebody and they're just like, 790 00:29:21,985 --> 00:29:23,965 and that's why I think Joseph Smith was a fraud. 791 00:29:24,105 --> 00:29:25,165 Now naturally you wanna be, wait, 792 00:29:25,165 --> 00:29:26,205 wait a minute, he wasn't a fraud. 793 00:29:26,205 --> 00:29:28,325 Right? You wanna jump in there and defend him, 794 00:29:28,385 --> 00:29:29,685 but just be like, wow. 795 00:29:29,685 --> 00:29:30,925 Like I can see how 796 00:29:31,265 --> 00:29:32,285 - That's your perspective, 797 00:29:32,465 --> 00:29:34,125 - How you can be led to that, that place. 798 00:29:34,145 --> 00:29:35,365 - How does that make you feel? Yeah. 799 00:29:35,515 --> 00:29:37,325 - Tell me more about that. Yeah. Yeah. 800 00:29:37,505 --> 00:29:40,645 So, and then they're feeling this is a safer place 801 00:29:40,665 --> 00:29:41,925 to lean in and, 802 00:29:42,265 --> 00:29:44,885 and go out, maybe go on an exploration, right? Yeah. 803 00:29:45,545 --> 00:29:47,285 - What's that? And that really is the crux 804 00:29:47,285 --> 00:29:51,325 of the confidant is creating trust in a safe place, right? 805 00:29:51,325 --> 00:29:54,365 Because I'm not gonna tell you my deep dark secrets. 806 00:29:54,505 --> 00:29:57,565 If I don't think that you'll keep that confidence 807 00:29:57,565 --> 00:30:00,965 that I trust you enough to share that information with you. 808 00:30:01,545 --> 00:30:03,445 - And once that trust is established, that's 809 00:30:03,445 --> 00:30:06,125 where you can get into the meat of what could seem 810 00:30:06,125 --> 00:30:07,605 as really challenging questions. 811 00:30:08,075 --> 00:30:09,885 Like I think about a member of the church 812 00:30:09,985 --> 00:30:12,525 who is in lt LGBTQ community Mm-Hmm. 813 00:30:12,825 --> 00:30:15,445 How do you identify, how is it for you when you come 814 00:30:15,445 --> 00:30:16,565 to church each week? 815 00:30:17,035 --> 00:30:20,125 Like those things most people would probably step far away 816 00:30:20,125 --> 00:30:22,285 from, but when that trust is, is established, 817 00:30:22,595 --> 00:30:25,405 confidant is a great question to pull them in 818 00:30:25,405 --> 00:30:28,245 because they feel seen and cared about. Yeah. 819 00:30:28,415 --> 00:30:31,085 - Where, again, sort of contrasting that with, if you shift 820 00:30:31,085 --> 00:30:32,245 to educator and being like, let me 821 00:30:32,245 --> 00:30:33,325 tell you about the doctrine of the church. 822 00:30:33,425 --> 00:30:34,765 Yes, exactly. Let's be clear. 823 00:30:35,525 --> 00:30:37,965 Suddenly they're like, I am never coming back here. Right. 824 00:30:37,965 --> 00:30:40,645 Like, and so I think in, you know, there's a time 825 00:30:40,645 --> 00:30:42,765 and a place for all these, but Yes, exactly. 826 00:30:42,875 --> 00:30:45,205 That may not be what they need in that moment. Right? Yeah. 827 00:30:45,715 --> 00:30:47,405 - Yeah. Great point. Yeah. 828 00:30:47,925 --> 00:30:49,125 - Anything else with, uh, go ahead, Matt. 829 00:30:49,185 --> 00:30:50,685 - No, I just, I was gonna segue us 830 00:30:50,685 --> 00:30:51,845 into transformers, so let's do it. 831 00:30:51,955 --> 00:30:56,125 Yeah. So transformer is the turning point, turning. 832 00:30:56,145 --> 00:30:59,525 So I like to use transformer when someone's gone 833 00:30:59,525 --> 00:31:00,605 through something difficult 834 00:31:01,105 --> 00:31:03,365 and I, I have them reflect on that, right? 835 00:31:03,585 --> 00:31:06,405 So tell me how this experience made you better. 836 00:31:06,865 --> 00:31:09,645 What's the gift in you going through this trial? 837 00:31:10,225 --> 00:31:11,965 It can also, it can be reflective that way, 838 00:31:12,025 --> 00:31:15,165 but it also can be a forecast, right? 839 00:31:15,165 --> 00:31:18,085 Someone comes in and says, I'm really having a hard time 840 00:31:18,085 --> 00:31:20,445 with, you know, you, you mentioned pornography before. 841 00:31:20,705 --> 00:31:22,165 I'm really struggling with pornography. 842 00:31:22,555 --> 00:31:23,645 Well, I can help you. 843 00:31:23,745 --> 00:31:26,325 And, and let's think about six months from now, 844 00:31:26,785 --> 00:31:28,925 six months from now, who will you be 845 00:31:29,505 --> 00:31:30,605 if you can overcome this? 846 00:31:31,145 --> 00:31:33,565 And it helps them to, to see that future 847 00:31:33,945 --> 00:31:35,165 and then to work towards it. 848 00:31:36,085 --> 00:31:39,325 Transformer typically, uh, is used when it's post a trial. 849 00:31:39,905 --> 00:31:41,725 I'm coaching someone who lost their job, 850 00:31:41,865 --> 00:31:43,125 and it was very emotional. 851 00:31:43,265 --> 00:31:45,005 And, you know, after three 852 00:31:45,005 --> 00:31:47,285 or four sessions, I said, think about who you were 853 00:31:47,285 --> 00:31:49,765 that first day and think about who you are now. 854 00:31:50,435 --> 00:31:52,085 What have you gained in that? 855 00:31:52,505 --> 00:31:54,605 How have you become a better person because of that? 856 00:31:54,745 --> 00:31:58,125 And it's really just helping them to see that the change 857 00:31:58,125 --> 00:32:00,885 that comes about because of the trials and the, 858 00:32:00,905 --> 00:32:04,045 and the hard times and even through an, uh, you know, 859 00:32:04,045 --> 00:32:05,805 an education process, right? 860 00:32:05,945 --> 00:32:07,045 Uh, you just finished school, 861 00:32:07,105 --> 00:32:08,405 you just graduated from college. 862 00:32:09,345 --> 00:32:10,685 How has that made you a better person? 863 00:32:11,385 --> 00:32:13,765 You know, it's just that you're identifying the 864 00:32:13,765 --> 00:32:15,045 transformation that's taken place. 865 00:32:15,145 --> 00:32:18,085 - Gotcha. So, and maybe a little more reflective of like, 866 00:32:18,085 --> 00:32:20,885 yeah, let's just take a moment, pause and look back. 867 00:32:21,115 --> 00:32:22,405 - Yeah. - Interesting. 868 00:32:22,545 --> 00:32:24,565 - So you think about like the prodigal sun. Mm-Hmm. 869 00:32:24,605 --> 00:32:27,685 , right? Very transformer style in a couple 870 00:32:27,725 --> 00:32:29,365 of ways for each person, right? 871 00:32:29,825 --> 00:32:31,125 The one son who remained 872 00:32:31,355 --> 00:32:34,405 that was choosing all the right things had a transformation 873 00:32:34,475 --> 00:32:36,205 that they went through when their brother came back. 874 00:32:36,205 --> 00:32:38,445 Mm-Hmm. . But so is the brother who sinned 875 00:32:38,445 --> 00:32:40,060 and repented and came back to the father. 876 00:32:40,135 --> 00:32:42,125 Right? They transformed and became better. 877 00:32:42,705 --> 00:32:46,005 And so that transformer is acknowledging 878 00:32:46,025 --> 00:32:49,365 and transmuting the pain to then allow us 879 00:32:49,365 --> 00:32:50,965 to see our future potential. 880 00:32:51,225 --> 00:32:53,725 And so the brother who remained in the prodigal son had 881 00:32:53,725 --> 00:32:56,125 to swallow his pride and realized that he, you know, 882 00:32:56,625 --> 00:32:58,325 had somebody else in the picture now. 883 00:32:58,665 --> 00:33:01,125 And while he had made better choices, he still had 884 00:33:01,125 --> 00:33:02,845 to overcome some pride that he was dealing with. 885 00:33:02,875 --> 00:33:04,405 Yeah. And after he did that, 886 00:33:04,635 --> 00:33:06,885 then he saw a better version of himself. 887 00:33:06,885 --> 00:33:08,405 Yeah. And who he was becoming 888 00:33:09,065 --> 00:33:11,525 - My mind goes to just the power of, of reflection. 889 00:33:11,525 --> 00:33:13,885 Even like in a, like an activity, for instance, sort 890 00:33:13,885 --> 00:33:15,365 of like a youth activity, right? 891 00:33:15,635 --> 00:33:18,565 That those, by the time the youth get to the end of 892 00:33:18,565 --> 00:33:19,885 that Wednesday night activity, 893 00:33:19,915 --> 00:33:22,405 they may not recognize the transformation that happened. 894 00:33:22,405 --> 00:33:24,565 And so by you sort of pausing 895 00:33:24,565 --> 00:33:27,365 and taking a moment to reflect on that transformation, 896 00:33:27,365 --> 00:33:29,885 they may have this epiphany of like, oh yeah, you know, 897 00:33:29,925 --> 00:33:32,325 I got here, I was quiet, cold, my arms were fold, 898 00:33:32,365 --> 00:33:33,405 I was leaning against the wall, 899 00:33:33,785 --> 00:33:34,885 and now I'm in this group 900 00:33:34,885 --> 00:33:36,845 of friends laughing like, something happened there. 901 00:33:36,995 --> 00:33:38,525 Yeah. And for them to see that, like, 902 00:33:39,365 --> 00:33:41,365 actually maybe youth activity isn't all that bad. 903 00:33:41,365 --> 00:33:42,525 Maybe I should come next week, 904 00:33:42,625 --> 00:33:44,725 or maybe I can come on Sunday, or, you know. 905 00:33:44,795 --> 00:33:47,365 Yeah. They're suddenly realizing something's happening here. 906 00:33:47,445 --> 00:33:50,685 I can lean in. This is cool. Yeah. Cool. All right. 907 00:33:50,685 --> 00:33:54,525 So we got these seven transfer, or no, that's one of 'em. 908 00:33:54,525 --> 00:33:56,765 We got these seven coaching styles. Yeah, 909 00:33:56,765 --> 00:33:57,205 - That's right. Yep. 910 00:33:57,785 --> 00:33:59,165 - So what's the next step? 911 00:33:59,205 --> 00:34:00,125 I mean, I've got some questions, 912 00:34:00,125 --> 00:34:01,045 but where do you want to take it next? 913 00:34:01,105 --> 00:34:04,165 - So the next thing that you gotta keep in mind that's hard 914 00:34:04,165 --> 00:34:07,645 to do is you have to ask questions instead of statements. 915 00:34:08,515 --> 00:34:10,325 When you are in that coach seat 916 00:34:10,505 --> 00:34:14,005 and somebody is coming to talk to you, if you use statements 917 00:34:14,105 --> 00:34:16,445 and you go to like more educator, you can use a statement 918 00:34:16,445 --> 00:34:17,565 or question in any style. 919 00:34:17,785 --> 00:34:19,925 But if you think of like that educator mindset of, 920 00:34:19,925 --> 00:34:21,725 let me teach you something, people, 921 00:34:21,905 --> 00:34:23,245 it might go in one ear out the other, 922 00:34:23,245 --> 00:34:24,405 they might not retain it. 923 00:34:24,545 --> 00:34:28,045 But when you ask a question, it allows the coachee to have 924 00:34:28,045 --> 00:34:30,245 to formulate it a statement of their own, 925 00:34:30,655 --> 00:34:32,205 which deepens the knowledge 926 00:34:32,305 --> 00:34:33,845 and their personal conversion 927 00:34:33,845 --> 00:34:35,405 to what's being discussed as well. 928 00:34:36,225 --> 00:34:39,685 So I would recommend everybody uses questions. 929 00:34:39,935 --> 00:34:42,325 We've also sat in those really bad Sunday school lessons 930 00:34:42,415 --> 00:34:45,485 where it's just, what's the correct answer in my head? 931 00:34:45,505 --> 00:34:47,285 Mm-Hmm. , that's not what this is. 932 00:34:47,435 --> 00:34:50,605 This is a discussion to allow the coachee to come up 933 00:34:50,605 --> 00:34:51,925 with their own solution. 934 00:34:52,185 --> 00:34:53,805 And there is no right or wrong answer. 935 00:34:53,995 --> 00:34:56,325 It's whatever conclusion the coachee decides to come to. 936 00:34:56,845 --> 00:34:58,285 - I really liked what you shared about the bishop 937 00:34:58,435 --> 00:35:01,285 that sends the, the person back with a story. 938 00:35:01,305 --> 00:35:02,525 Mm-Hmm. , right? Here's, 939 00:35:02,675 --> 00:35:05,445 read these two chapters and then let's meet again next week. 940 00:35:05,835 --> 00:35:09,285 Because that could be the person could come in and, 941 00:35:09,505 --> 00:35:14,005 and depending on their, what they look like, what the sense, 942 00:35:14,065 --> 00:35:15,645 the feeling that the bishop gets. 943 00:35:16,305 --> 00:35:18,165 It could be any number of questions, right? 944 00:35:18,665 --> 00:35:21,485 But it is a, tell me how studying this made you feel. 945 00:35:21,715 --> 00:35:24,325 What did you gain from that? How has it changed you? 946 00:35:25,065 --> 00:35:26,805 You know, really diving into this story, 947 00:35:26,865 --> 00:35:28,565 how have you become better because of it? 948 00:35:28,785 --> 00:35:30,565 You know, you can use all those different styles, 949 00:35:31,065 --> 00:35:33,085 number one, based on what the coaching needs, 950 00:35:33,185 --> 00:35:36,365 but then instead of turning that into, okay, well 951 00:35:36,365 --> 00:35:38,325 what this is about is X, Y, z 952 00:35:38,425 --> 00:35:39,525 and you shoulda have learned this 953 00:35:39,665 --> 00:35:40,885 and you need to be more this, 954 00:35:41,155 --> 00:35:42,925 it's just how did that make you feel? 955 00:35:43,445 --> 00:35:45,485 Hmm. How did this experience of 956 00:35:46,365 --> 00:35:48,125 focusing on one story in the 957 00:35:48,205 --> 00:35:49,365 scriptures, how did that change you? 958 00:35:49,795 --> 00:35:51,325 - Yeah. It's powerful. Well, 959 00:35:51,325 --> 00:35:52,285 - Kurt, would you like to receive 960 00:35:52,285 --> 00:35:53,365 some coaching? All right. That's 961 00:35:53,365 --> 00:35:54,365 - It. 962 00:35:54,365 --> 00:35:54,685 Do you want, do you have questions that you wanna 963 00:35:54,685 --> 00:35:56,045 ask about the styles first? 964 00:35:56,185 --> 00:35:58,245 - Um, so I guess what my main question, 965 00:35:58,245 --> 00:36:00,245 we can either do the coaching verse or get to it later, 966 00:36:00,305 --> 00:36:01,365 but I'm always, I, 967 00:36:01,505 --> 00:36:03,565 I'm just thinking about the leader who's like, overwhelmed. 968 00:36:03,565 --> 00:36:05,045 They're on the treadmill hearing all this, 969 00:36:05,065 --> 00:36:07,845 and they're like, okay, so like next time, like I'm supposed 970 00:36:07,845 --> 00:36:09,405 to like suddenly shift into this one. 971 00:36:09,405 --> 00:36:10,645 Like, what if, like, what do I do? 972 00:36:10,645 --> 00:36:13,605 Or how do I even prepare and use these things? 973 00:36:13,665 --> 00:36:15,965 Or do I have to go through some extensive training 974 00:36:15,965 --> 00:36:17,485 program to really use these? 975 00:36:17,645 --> 00:36:18,885 I mean, what would you say to that person 976 00:36:18,905 --> 00:36:20,765 who feels a little bit overwhelmed by it all? 977 00:36:21,285 --> 00:36:22,605 - I would say if, if it's something 978 00:36:22,605 --> 00:36:23,885 that you're really interested in doing, 979 00:36:24,095 --> 00:36:27,805 write the styles down somewhere, have each one written down, 980 00:36:28,345 --> 00:36:30,405 and then just think about those in, in different, 981 00:36:30,405 --> 00:36:31,685 those different situations. 982 00:36:32,345 --> 00:36:33,845 You don't have to be an expert. 983 00:36:33,945 --> 00:36:35,445 You don't have to be a professional coach 984 00:36:35,465 --> 00:36:36,805 to be able to use these styles. 985 00:36:37,185 --> 00:36:39,645 Really, it's just when you're sitting down with somebody, 986 00:36:40,035 --> 00:36:42,125 what are the aggregated contextual considerations? 987 00:36:42,155 --> 00:36:43,685 What are the things that you, what, 988 00:36:43,685 --> 00:36:45,845 what is everything bringing us together 989 00:36:45,905 --> 00:36:47,605 to this point at Mm-Hmm. 990 00:36:47,645 --> 00:36:48,925 . And what does this person need? 991 00:36:49,625 --> 00:36:51,925 Do they need me to bring them in? 992 00:36:52,225 --> 00:36:53,405 Do they need me to drive 'em? 993 00:36:53,405 --> 00:36:54,605 Do they need me to help them 994 00:36:55,305 --> 00:36:57,045 see the transformation that's taken place? 995 00:36:57,105 --> 00:36:58,485 Do I need to explore a little bit? 996 00:36:58,785 --> 00:37:01,125 And it just based on that, then you ask a question 997 00:37:01,705 --> 00:37:04,405 and it can be as easy as, you know, I wanna explore 998 00:37:04,405 --> 00:37:05,525 that more, right? 999 00:37:05,755 --> 00:37:08,285 Yeah. Or what do you think I could do to, to help you to, 1000 00:37:08,505 --> 00:37:10,405 to rally forward, right? 1001 00:37:10,465 --> 00:37:14,085 It doesn't have to be a, you know, professional respect, 1002 00:37:14,195 --> 00:37:16,485 certified coaching style question. 1003 00:37:17,105 --> 00:37:19,725 The idea is just what does the coaching need 1004 00:37:20,105 --> 00:37:21,845 and ask a question that's, that's in 1005 00:37:21,845 --> 00:37:23,605 that style that you think is appropriate. Love 1006 00:37:23,605 --> 00:37:24,605 - It. 1007 00:37:24,605 --> 00:37:25,445 I, I think I would say, um, one, 1008 00:37:25,445 --> 00:37:27,285 you're doing a great job running on that treadmill. 1009 00:37:27,355 --> 00:37:28,565 Like keep it going , 1010 00:37:28,565 --> 00:37:30,285 maybe turn it up just a little bit, a little faster. 1011 00:37:30,425 --> 00:37:31,845 You can do this, I believe in you very 1012 00:37:31,845 --> 00:37:32,965 rallier comment, right? 1013 00:37:33,745 --> 00:37:37,605 Um, but the, the savior was the perfect coach. 1014 00:37:38,265 --> 00:37:40,525 And if you study the savior's life 1015 00:37:40,705 --> 00:37:43,285 and the way that he did things, you'll see how he adjusted 1016 00:37:43,715 --> 00:37:46,645 what he was doing for the needs of who he was talking to. 1017 00:37:47,465 --> 00:37:51,125 And for you that's listening, you are already doing this. 1018 00:37:51,515 --> 00:37:54,445 Like, I promise that you are, when you talk to your kids, 1019 00:37:54,445 --> 00:37:56,045 you have a different approach than when you talk 1020 00:37:56,045 --> 00:37:57,685 to somebody else and to their friends, 1021 00:37:57,995 --> 00:37:59,365 because you already know how 1022 00:37:59,365 --> 00:38:00,885 to have emotional intelligence and adjust. 1023 00:38:01,425 --> 00:38:03,205 And I imagine as you're listening to this podcast, 1024 00:38:03,265 --> 00:38:06,285 you're thinking, you know, that provocateur sounds scary, 1025 00:38:06,465 --> 00:38:08,965 poking a hole in somebody's logic, I don't wanna do that. 1026 00:38:09,425 --> 00:38:12,045 To which I would say, um, you can totally do it 1027 00:38:12,385 --> 00:38:13,605 and do it once. 1028 00:38:14,485 --> 00:38:17,005 I was lowest in all my coaching styles and provocateur, 1029 00:38:17,225 --> 00:38:19,565 and I psyched myself up, right. 1030 00:38:19,565 --> 00:38:21,445 Ready to have that first provocateur question. 1031 00:38:21,945 --> 00:38:24,685 And when I asked that question, the coach I was talking 1032 00:38:24,685 --> 00:38:26,165 to said that was a really great 1033 00:38:26,445 --> 00:38:27,645 question, and they answered it. 1034 00:38:27,645 --> 00:38:30,525 And the world did not end. Right. It continued forward. 1035 00:38:30,945 --> 00:38:32,685 And so if there's something you're thinking, I don't know 1036 00:38:32,685 --> 00:38:34,845 how to do that, test it out, give it a shot. 1037 00:38:35,075 --> 00:38:37,525 Yeah. You probably know that you're really good with one. 1038 00:38:37,525 --> 00:38:38,685 You might be a great confidant 1039 00:38:38,745 --> 00:38:41,125 and everybody spills their guts to you all the time. 1040 00:38:42,005 --> 00:38:44,605 Continue to do that. Try one different style 1041 00:38:44,825 --> 00:38:45,885 and just adjust it a little 1042 00:38:45,885 --> 00:38:47,405 bit to see what are the outcomes. Yeah. 1043 00:38:47,745 --> 00:38:49,525 - I'm just thinking like, uh, like you said, write 'em down 1044 00:38:49,525 --> 00:38:53,885 or, or, because many times it was like, you know, I default 1045 00:38:53,885 --> 00:38:56,125 to that bishop experience of like, ah, yeah, man, that, 1046 00:38:56,125 --> 00:38:57,365 that guy's coming in again. 1047 00:38:57,365 --> 00:38:59,805 Like I've shared those four scriptures with him, 1048 00:38:59,925 --> 00:39:02,845 I always share, and I told him, do A, B, C, and he did that. 1049 00:39:02,865 --> 00:39:04,365 And somewhat, and I don't know 1050 00:39:04,365 --> 00:39:05,605 what, I don't know what to say to him. 1051 00:39:05,605 --> 00:39:07,125 Like, what are we gonna talk about and to sort 1052 00:39:07,125 --> 00:39:09,645 of reflect on these and being like, you know, I've, 1053 00:39:09,685 --> 00:39:11,845 I think I've approached this as a rally for a while. 1054 00:39:11,875 --> 00:39:14,045 Like, what are a couple questions of being 1055 00:39:14,045 --> 00:39:15,405 that provocateur Yeah. 1056 00:39:15,715 --> 00:39:17,685 That I could, that I could start with? 1057 00:39:17,705 --> 00:39:19,925 Or how can I help him explore Yeah. A little bit more. 1058 00:39:19,935 --> 00:39:21,205 Right? So it sort 1059 00:39:21,205 --> 00:39:23,645 of helps you reset maybe those interactions 1060 00:39:23,645 --> 00:39:25,605 that keep come back to you, right? 1061 00:39:25,605 --> 00:39:28,445 Yeah. And, and try it differently, right? Yeah. Um, 1062 00:39:28,825 --> 00:39:31,245 - So maybe we can give some example questions to everybody. 1063 00:39:31,245 --> 00:39:32,805 Yeah, let's do it. Let's, let's do it through, 1064 00:39:32,805 --> 00:39:34,165 uh, let's give you some coaching. Okay. 1065 00:39:34,175 --> 00:39:37,125 - Let's do it. - Um, so man, I'll just kind of tag to you 1066 00:39:37,125 --> 00:39:38,725 and here, and this is the game, okay? 1067 00:39:38,795 --> 00:39:41,325 Okay. Uh, we're gonna ask you a question and 1068 00:39:41,325 --> 00:39:43,805 before you respond, we're gonna do a quick timeout. 1069 00:39:43,945 --> 00:39:46,725 And you have to guess which coaching style is it. 1070 00:39:46,875 --> 00:39:49,005 - Okay? - Okay. And we'll help you along the way, way. 1071 00:39:49,045 --> 00:39:50,085 - So my brain's gonna do 10 different 1072 00:39:50,085 --> 00:39:51,125 things. Okay? Got it all. Yeah. 1073 00:39:51,405 --> 00:39:54,165 - well like it, we'll make it clearer, clearer. 1074 00:39:54,165 --> 00:39:55,245 Like we ask the question 1075 00:39:55,245 --> 00:39:56,245 and if it wasn't clear enough, 1076 00:39:56,245 --> 00:39:57,445 we'll, we'll clarify. Love it. 1077 00:39:57,445 --> 00:39:58,805 - Yeah. Okay. So Kurt, 1078 00:39:58,915 --> 00:40:01,445 what is something you would like some coaching on today? 1079 00:40:01,875 --> 00:40:03,925 Timeout. So what style is that? What style is that? 1080 00:40:03,925 --> 00:40:05,245 What is something? Where are you? 1081 00:40:05,265 --> 00:40:06,325 You would like Yeah, we're in it. 1082 00:40:06,325 --> 00:40:07,925 Oh, we're doing what? Is something you mind 1083 00:40:08,085 --> 00:40:09,165 - Coaching on explore? Yeah. 1084 00:40:09,165 --> 00:40:10,725 - Because yeah, you could say, right now 1085 00:40:10,865 --> 00:40:12,285 how do I play video games better? 1086 00:40:12,625 --> 00:40:15,005 You could say, how do I do my calling better? 1087 00:40:15,005 --> 00:40:16,005 You could say how to be a better parent. 1088 00:40:16,025 --> 00:40:18,605 We have literally no idea. You can direct us anyway. 1089 00:40:18,605 --> 00:40:19,965 That's an explorer question. 1090 00:40:20,315 --> 00:40:22,285 - Yeah. Or it would be a provocate you may say. 1091 00:40:22,345 --> 00:40:24,885 So I knows you haven't been very engaged in church, right? 1092 00:40:25,165 --> 00:40:27,085 - . Yeah, exactly. - May be true or not. 1093 00:40:27,085 --> 00:40:28,525 It'd be like, Hey, wait a minute here. Yeah. 1094 00:40:28,725 --> 00:40:33,005 engaged in church, so, okay, cool. So where 1095 00:40:33,005 --> 00:40:33,925 - Are we at? What's something you wanna 1096 00:40:34,315 --> 00:40:35,315 - Something? 1097 00:40:35,565 --> 00:40:38,605 I would, uh, let's talk about my relationship 1098 00:40:38,605 --> 00:40:41,085 with my 8-year-old em, who I love deeply, 1099 00:40:42,025 --> 00:40:44,405 but as much too, like 8-year-old Kurt. 1100 00:40:44,705 --> 00:40:46,645 And so we clash a little bit, you know, 1101 00:40:46,745 --> 00:40:49,005 and, uh, it's, it's a tough road at times. 1102 00:40:49,065 --> 00:40:50,205 Is that a fair place to go? 1103 00:40:50,205 --> 00:40:51,405 - Perfect. Sure. Okay. 1104 00:40:51,865 --> 00:40:53,325 - You're looking at me like I'm supposed 1105 00:40:53,325 --> 00:40:54,365 to pass the next question, 1106 00:40:54,645 --> 00:40:55,645 - . 1107 00:40:55,645 --> 00:40:57,765 So what have you learned about TAs teem? Tsum? 1108 00:40:57,765 --> 00:40:59,765 What have you learned about Tasso recently, uh, 1109 00:40:59,795 --> 00:41:01,005 that has taught you a 1110 00:41:01,005 --> 00:41:01,965 few things about what he's going 1111 00:41:01,965 --> 00:41:03,485 through? Timeout. What's the, 1112 00:41:03,645 --> 00:41:04,765 - What's the style? Oh, sorry. 1113 00:41:05,005 --> 00:41:08,005 - . - What have you learned about Tasso recently? 1114 00:41:08,225 --> 00:41:10,205 - Is it explore because you're, I guess any, 1115 00:41:10,415 --> 00:41:11,725 - We're gonna do different style time. 1116 00:41:11,725 --> 00:41:13,325 - Okay. So this's educational - Educator. Okay. 1117 00:41:13,395 --> 00:41:14,605 This is the educator. Yeah. 1118 00:41:14,905 --> 00:41:16,885 - And so now you've, - What have you learned about Tasso? 1119 00:41:16,885 --> 00:41:19,525 - Um, so I've learned that, I've noticed he's been very 1120 00:41:20,475 --> 00:41:23,285 engaged in like, drawing, which I loved as a kid, right? 1121 00:41:23,425 --> 00:41:26,085 And so I love seeing him, like walking in his room 1122 00:41:26,085 --> 00:41:28,845 and catching him like deep in different drawings 1123 00:41:28,845 --> 00:41:31,485 and just getting at it, you know? So That's cool. 1124 00:41:31,945 --> 00:41:34,285 - How do you think learning more about 1125 00:41:35,105 --> 00:41:37,125 art together would help deepen your 1126 00:41:37,125 --> 00:41:38,525 relationship with sem? Oh man. 1127 00:41:38,885 --> 00:41:40,845 - I - Mean, time out. Okay. What type of question is that? 1128 00:41:41,385 --> 00:41:43,725 How would your relation, how would art help 1129 00:41:43,725 --> 00:41:44,885 improve your relationship? 1130 00:41:45,395 --> 00:41:47,725 - That is that rower, - Not a rally. Not close. 1131 00:41:47,945 --> 00:41:49,805 - You're close. It's the sister to rower. 1132 00:41:50,105 --> 00:41:54,485 - Uh, the educator? Nope. The, um, strategist. 1133 00:41:55,185 --> 00:41:56,685 I'm almost through the list now. . 1134 00:41:56,685 --> 00:41:59,245 - I, I was going for transformer. Okay. Transformer. 1135 00:41:59,505 --> 00:42:00,645 And maybe I'd say it a little different way. 1136 00:42:00,945 --> 00:42:02,005 How would art you 1137 00:42:02,025 --> 00:42:04,605 and art together with Teim improve your relationship? 1138 00:42:05,035 --> 00:42:06,565 Okay. Right? Like, how would it become 1139 00:42:06,565 --> 00:42:08,285 better through that medium? Like 1140 00:42:08,385 --> 00:42:10,285 - How would a transformation through art? 1141 00:42:10,355 --> 00:42:12,525 Yeah. That's where you're, you're going. Okay. Yeah. Okay. 1142 00:42:12,785 --> 00:42:15,245 So I would say that obviously we would, you know, 1143 00:42:15,285 --> 00:42:18,485 I have a love for art and I have a skill set in art, so, 1144 00:42:19,105 --> 00:42:21,285 you know, I can definitely be a mentor role and, 1145 00:42:21,345 --> 00:42:23,445 and really draw with him, you know? Yeah. 1146 00:42:23,705 --> 00:42:25,405 - So if you're his mentor father figure, 1147 00:42:25,585 --> 00:42:28,165 why have you not used art thus far? Provocateur. 1148 00:42:28,525 --> 00:42:30,725 - . Oh, you feel that Carry . 1149 00:42:30,945 --> 00:42:32,045 How about flip this table, 1150 00:42:32,685 --> 00:42:33,685 - . 1151 00:42:34,385 --> 00:42:35,925 - Um, what was the question again? The, 1152 00:42:36,225 --> 00:42:38,605 - Um, if you know art 1153 00:42:38,905 --> 00:42:40,885 and you're the mentor figure, why haven't you used art 1154 00:42:40,955 --> 00:42:42,605 with him up to this point? You 1155 00:42:42,605 --> 00:42:45,045 - Know, I just get busy with just long af end 1156 00:42:45,045 --> 00:42:46,965 of the long day, and I probably should, 1157 00:42:47,225 --> 00:42:48,925 but I don't, you know, that's 1158 00:42:49,045 --> 00:42:49,325 - Frustrating. So 1159 00:42:49,325 --> 00:42:50,805 - When you crawl into bed at the end of the night 1160 00:42:51,145 --> 00:42:53,125 and you realize that you didn't do anything to make 1161 00:42:53,125 --> 00:42:54,325 that connection, how does that make you feel? 1162 00:42:54,905 --> 00:42:56,685 - Uh, timeout. What was that? That is, uh, 1163 00:42:57,155 --> 00:42:58,155 - That was the question. 1164 00:42:58,155 --> 00:42:59,325 When you crawl in bed, I wanna 1165 00:42:59,325 --> 00:43:01,085 - See transformer, but now you're bouncing around. 1166 00:43:01,085 --> 00:43:02,085 - How, how does it make you feel? Oh, 1167 00:43:02,085 --> 00:43:04,045 - The feeling rally here. 1168 00:43:04,355 --> 00:43:06,285 - Confidant - Horrible at this 1169 00:43:06,285 --> 00:43:07,285 - Case. 1170 00:43:07,285 --> 00:43:08,765 Con . This is doing great. No, you're 1171 00:43:08,765 --> 00:43:09,645 - Doing great. That's a little bit 1172 00:43:09,645 --> 00:43:10,645 - Vague. 1173 00:43:10,645 --> 00:43:12,485 It's two on one. So confidant, confidant 1174 00:43:12,485 --> 00:43:13,325 - Is about - Feeling. Yeah. 1175 00:43:13,325 --> 00:43:15,525 - You just want, like, you're checking in on my feelings. 1176 00:43:15,875 --> 00:43:17,005 - Yeah, exactly. - So 1177 00:43:17,005 --> 00:43:18,565 how does it feel when I crawl into bed at night 1178 00:43:18,665 --> 00:43:21,805 and I like, ah, I feel like some ambivalence. 1179 00:43:21,805 --> 00:43:22,845 So man, he's grown up 1180 00:43:22,905 --> 00:43:25,205 and I'm gonna miss it if I don't engage there 1181 00:43:25,225 --> 00:43:26,525 and Right. So, 1182 00:43:26,585 --> 00:43:28,165 - So - What can you do to fix it? What 1183 00:43:28,165 --> 00:43:29,165 - Type of question is that? 1184 00:43:29,165 --> 00:43:31,085 Oh, I fix it. What, what kind of strategy would 1185 00:43:31,085 --> 00:43:32,085 - You employ? 1186 00:43:32,085 --> 00:43:33,765 That's the, uh, the strategist. Strategist, right? 1187 00:43:34,385 --> 00:43:36,565 And, uh, so what can I do to fix it? 1188 00:43:36,725 --> 00:43:38,405 I mean, obviously let's like, 1189 00:43:38,915 --> 00:43:40,765 just make it like part of our bedtime routine. 1190 00:43:40,795 --> 00:43:42,445 Like every night we're gonna That's a great idea. 1191 00:43:42,695 --> 00:43:45,445 Spend 10 minutes, 15 minutes, let's draw right? 1192 00:43:45,445 --> 00:43:46,525 Yeah. Wind down that way. 1193 00:43:46,955 --> 00:43:49,005 - What if you did it too, and I'm stepping 1194 00:43:49,005 --> 00:43:51,725 outside just a little bit, but why you did it, do it 1195 00:43:51,725 --> 00:43:53,445 as like, you know, you draw a square 1196 00:43:53,705 --> 00:43:55,165 and he fills in another part, 1197 00:43:55,225 --> 00:43:56,325 and then you fill in another part, 1198 00:43:56,385 --> 00:43:58,645 and then it's the two of you creating oh, 1199 00:43:58,645 --> 00:43:59,725 one one piece of art 1200 00:44:00,205 --> 00:44:01,205 - Together. 1201 00:44:01,205 --> 00:44:03,045 So Kurt, when will you do your first art with him? 1202 00:44:03,225 --> 00:44:06,165 - The rower. Rower? - Yeah, buddy. Next step. I'll 1203 00:44:06,165 --> 00:44:07,525 - Do tonight. Jar. Yeah, 1204 00:44:07,895 --> 00:44:08,895 - Let's go. 1205 00:44:09,555 --> 00:44:10,565 Okay. Awesome. So right there, 1206 00:44:10,665 --> 00:44:13,405 you received a question in each coaching style. 1207 00:44:13,755 --> 00:44:16,045 From your experience as a coachee, what were kind 1208 00:44:16,045 --> 00:44:17,205 of the emotions that you went through 1209 00:44:17,265 --> 00:44:18,765 as you experienced different styles? 1210 00:44:18,945 --> 00:44:21,485 - You know, it really, it really helps me kind 1211 00:44:21,485 --> 00:44:22,885 of get a well-rounded look. 1212 00:44:23,085 --> 00:44:26,565 I felt like I, you know, I was looking at all angles of the, 1213 00:44:26,565 --> 00:44:27,645 of the situation, right? 1214 00:44:27,705 --> 00:44:29,725 And where it's like, 'cause I think the, 1215 00:44:29,865 --> 00:44:32,245 and correct me if I'm wrong, but the temptation is, 1216 00:44:32,825 --> 00:44:35,045 you know, you you wanna just, just go 1217 00:44:35,925 --> 00:44:37,765 straight down the wormhole of strategist. 1218 00:44:37,765 --> 00:44:39,605 Yep. And we're just gonna, Hey, you know 1219 00:44:39,605 --> 00:44:40,605 - What? 1220 00:44:40,605 --> 00:44:40,765 You should do strateg tonight 1221 00:44:40,765 --> 00:44:42,245 before you, he taste him goes to bed, 1222 00:44:42,705 --> 00:44:43,805 you should draw with him 1223 00:44:44,305 --> 00:44:45,305 - And yeah. 1224 00:44:45,305 --> 00:44:46,165 So go do that. Go do that. 1225 00:44:46,165 --> 00:44:47,685 And then it's sort of like, we're done here, I guess. Yeah. 1226 00:44:47,785 --> 00:44:49,285 Uh, all right, , thanks. 1227 00:44:49,325 --> 00:44:51,165 - That'll be, that'll be $200. Yeah, 1228 00:44:51,305 --> 00:44:54,165 - But that's because you are in a strategist mode, right? 1229 00:44:54,165 --> 00:44:56,125 Right. And so if you're always in the 1230 00:44:56,125 --> 00:44:57,565 strategist and always trying to fix it. 1231 00:44:57,585 --> 00:44:58,845 You mentioned earlier that 1232 00:44:58,845 --> 00:45:00,285 like, have, have you seen the video? 1233 00:45:00,285 --> 00:45:01,685 It's not about the nail. Yeah. Oh, yes. 1234 00:45:01,795 --> 00:45:02,795 - Okay. - Right 1235 00:45:02,875 --> 00:45:04,085 - Into it. It's phenomenal. You gotta watch 1236 00:45:04,085 --> 00:45:05,085 - It. 1237 00:45:05,085 --> 00:45:07,605 But like in there, the husband is being a strategist, trying 1238 00:45:07,605 --> 00:45:08,725 to solve the nail in the head, 1239 00:45:09,105 --> 00:45:11,525 and the wife wants a confidant, she wants somebody to listen 1240 00:45:11,665 --> 00:45:12,725 and not solve anything. 1241 00:45:12,745 --> 00:45:15,885 Mm-Hmm. And that's why you have to tailor it to the coachee. 1242 00:45:15,885 --> 00:45:17,605 Mm-Hmm. Because the ee may not wanna 1243 00:45:17,605 --> 00:45:18,645 remove the nail from the head. 1244 00:45:18,835 --> 00:45:22,125 They may wanna just let you hear what's going on. So tell 1245 00:45:22,125 --> 00:45:23,845 - Me about that dynamic of like, in those, 1246 00:45:24,235 --> 00:45:27,365 when you're interacting with that coachee, like, like 1247 00:45:27,505 --> 00:45:29,645 how can you tell like, oh, I'm, 1248 00:45:29,705 --> 00:45:31,965 I'm going down the wrong path here, let's regroup 1249 00:45:32,065 --> 00:45:33,365 and go down a different path. 1250 00:45:33,465 --> 00:45:36,365 Or is that okay? You just sort of regroup anyways. 1251 00:45:37,025 --> 00:45:38,725 - So I'll give maybe an extreme 1252 00:45:38,725 --> 00:45:39,805 example that comes to my mind. 1253 00:45:39,805 --> 00:45:41,085 Bishop is talking to a youth, 1254 00:45:41,345 --> 00:45:44,925 and the youth comes in for an unscheduled appointment 1255 00:45:44,945 --> 00:45:46,165 and the bishop leads with, 1256 00:45:46,265 --> 00:45:47,885 so you're looking at pornography, aren't you? 1257 00:45:48,355 --> 00:45:50,165 - Provocateur, - Provocateur, . 1258 00:45:50,305 --> 00:45:52,365 And the youth says, no, I'm not. 1259 00:45:52,545 --> 00:45:54,365 I'm actually having a hard time with my relationship 1260 00:45:54,365 --> 00:45:57,685 with my parents that Bishop would not follow up with. 1261 00:45:57,945 --> 00:45:59,645 Why are you having problems with your parents? 1262 00:45:59,745 --> 00:46:00,645 Is it 'cause you're not looking 1263 00:46:00,825 --> 00:46:01,965 or you, I don't know what it is. 1264 00:46:01,965 --> 00:46:03,845 Right? I don't know. I don't what I'm 1265 00:46:03,885 --> 00:46:04,885 - Supposed to say. 1266 00:46:04,885 --> 00:46:06,205 - I was trying to go provocate. What's a good follow 1267 00:46:06,205 --> 00:46:07,205 - Up to that? 1268 00:46:07,205 --> 00:46:08,245 Yeah, no, it's good. We're not bishops, so Yeah, 1269 00:46:08,245 --> 00:46:09,445 - We're - Not obviously . 1270 00:46:09,985 --> 00:46:14,245 - Um, but like, if you continue in that provocateur thing 1271 00:46:14,465 --> 00:46:16,405 of Yeah, well, why aren't you improving 1272 00:46:16,405 --> 00:46:17,485 your relationship with your parents? 1273 00:46:18,245 --> 00:46:19,245 - Probably 'cause you're secretly looking at 1274 00:46:19,245 --> 00:46:20,205 pornography. Yeah. Boom. 1275 00:46:20,345 --> 00:46:21,965 - See, that was so much better. You nailed it. 1276 00:46:22,225 --> 00:46:23,325 - That's why you're the host. Yeah. 1277 00:46:23,325 --> 00:46:25,365 - Yeah. So, um, that's not good, right? 1278 00:46:25,435 --> 00:46:28,365 When that youth says No, I'm actually here to talk 1279 00:46:28,365 --> 00:46:30,685 to you about how my parents and my relationship with them. 1280 00:46:31,155 --> 00:46:32,965 What do you think that Bishop would switch to 1281 00:46:33,665 --> 00:46:35,205 - The, uh, confidant, right? The confidant, 1282 00:46:35,205 --> 00:46:36,205 - Yeah. 1283 00:46:36,205 --> 00:46:37,565 Oh, how are you feeling? What's going hard? Right. 1284 00:46:37,565 --> 00:46:39,765 That sounds really hard. Yeah. And then it really 1285 00:46:39,765 --> 00:46:42,285 - Could be a transition to, into almost any style. 1286 00:46:42,315 --> 00:46:43,325 Yeah. Right? Mm-Hmm. 1287 00:46:43,365 --> 00:46:44,485 because it could be, oh, 1288 00:46:44,515 --> 00:46:45,965 tell me, tell me how that feels. 1289 00:46:46,035 --> 00:46:47,805 Tell me what you're feeling or 1290 00:46:48,355 --> 00:46:49,725 what have you learned about your parents? 1291 00:46:50,215 --> 00:46:53,045 Right. Help me understand what that means. 1292 00:46:53,045 --> 00:46:54,725 That you're having a hard time with your parent. Right. 1293 00:46:54,725 --> 00:46:56,605 That's three different styles off top of my head 1294 00:46:56,605 --> 00:46:59,005 that just are different than provocateur. 1295 00:47:00,035 --> 00:47:01,245 It's really, you're, you're kind 1296 00:47:01,245 --> 00:47:02,365 of asking the same question, 1297 00:47:02,585 --> 00:47:03,725 but it's with this different, 1298 00:47:04,035 --> 00:47:05,525 with a different style, different tone. 1299 00:47:05,705 --> 00:47:07,365 - And there are times where you need 1300 00:47:07,365 --> 00:47:08,525 to stick in the same style 1301 00:47:08,865 --> 00:47:09,805 and you should just have an 1302 00:47:09,805 --> 00:47:11,165 entire coaching session that way. 1303 00:47:11,225 --> 00:47:13,405 And you should never pivot. Right? And that's okay. 1304 00:47:13,475 --> 00:47:15,845 It's all about knowing the needs of the coachee. 1305 00:47:15,845 --> 00:47:17,485 So that's why the framework is 1306 00:47:17,675 --> 00:47:19,685 what do I know about the person right 1307 00:47:19,685 --> 00:47:20,765 now in the circumstance? 1308 00:47:20,825 --> 00:47:23,485 And ev all my aggregated contextual considerations. 1309 00:47:23,955 --> 00:47:27,165 Pick a coaching style. I'm gonna start with provocateur. 1310 00:47:27,785 --> 00:47:28,885 I'm gonna ask a question 1311 00:47:29,545 --> 00:47:30,925 and then I'm gonna see the response. 1312 00:47:31,145 --> 00:47:33,165 The response was not what I expected. 1313 00:47:33,665 --> 00:47:35,805 I'm now gonna go back to the beginning of the framework 1314 00:47:35,945 --> 00:47:38,085 and say, okay, now that I know that didn't work, 1315 00:47:38,095 --> 00:47:39,685 which coaching style now? 1316 00:47:39,785 --> 00:47:41,805 Mm-Hmm. . Try it out. See how it goes. 1317 00:47:41,945 --> 00:47:44,485 You may stay in it, you may pivot Two different style. Yeah. 1318 00:47:44,875 --> 00:47:47,645 - Yeah. It's two questions come to mind, 1319 00:47:47,645 --> 00:47:49,645 which aren't necessarily later, but let's go with this one. 1320 00:47:49,645 --> 00:47:52,045 Like, like if you had like a, like when someone 1321 00:47:52,515 --> 00:47:54,565 that you've never coached with, I'm just thinking of 1322 00:47:54,565 --> 00:47:55,765 that appointment that walks in 1323 00:47:55,765 --> 00:47:57,485 or you're having that ministering interview with a, 1324 00:47:57,545 --> 00:47:58,845 the brother you don't necessarily know. 1325 00:47:58,865 --> 00:48:02,285 Is there a, a good question or two to like, just start with 1326 00:48:03,205 --> 00:48:04,885 - I default to explore? Yeah. 1327 00:48:04,885 --> 00:48:06,325 - That's where - I usually start. 1328 00:48:07,045 --> 00:48:08,725 - I usually, if someone reaches out to me 1329 00:48:08,725 --> 00:48:10,765 and says, Hey, I wanna come in and I wanna, I wanna sit down 1330 00:48:10,765 --> 00:48:13,205 with you and talk to you, I'll usually just sit there 1331 00:48:13,625 --> 00:48:15,125 and like, wait for them. Right. 1332 00:48:15,765 --> 00:48:17,005 - A good grin on your face. - Yeah. 1333 00:48:17,005 --> 00:48:20,125 Just like you schedule this meeting, so Yeah. Yeah. 1334 00:48:20,125 --> 00:48:22,205 But yeah, I think explores a great, 1335 00:48:22,515 --> 00:48:24,325 - What would you like to talk about about today? Mm-Hmm. 1336 00:48:24,365 --> 00:48:25,365 - to start with. Yeah. 1337 00:48:25,365 --> 00:48:26,805 - Yeah. And then from there you may pivot 1338 00:48:26,825 --> 00:48:28,165 to a different one and For sure, because you'll see 1339 00:48:28,165 --> 00:48:29,165 - What they say. 1340 00:48:29,165 --> 00:48:30,845 Yeah. Yeah. It could lead you a lot of different directions. 1341 00:48:30,845 --> 00:48:33,085 You may continue and explore for a long time. Yeah. 1342 00:48:33,625 --> 00:48:34,965 - And then the other question is, uh, 1343 00:48:35,105 --> 00:48:37,805 around the provocateur one that seems, I mean, again, 1344 00:48:37,805 --> 00:48:39,965 it's the uncomfortable place even for the coach, right? 1345 00:48:39,965 --> 00:48:41,565 Mm-Hmm. . And for the leaders, like, yeah, 1346 00:48:41,695 --> 00:48:43,805 let's just, let's start with every other one. 1347 00:48:44,025 --> 00:48:45,725 And if we have to go there, we will. 1348 00:48:45,725 --> 00:48:48,005 - But if we have time, - Because like there's such, this, 1349 00:48:48,205 --> 00:48:52,045 I think naturally this may be the case for all leadership 1350 00:48:52,045 --> 00:48:53,605 or whatnot, but as a church leader, 1351 00:48:53,665 --> 00:48:54,805 you wanna be like the rally, 1352 00:48:54,805 --> 00:48:57,725 or you wanna be the guy that promotes faith, you know, 1353 00:48:58,305 --> 00:49:00,405 you just gotta reinvest in the church. 1354 00:49:00,535 --> 00:49:02,005 It'll be great. But, 1355 00:49:02,005 --> 00:49:04,925 and so going to the provocateurs, sometimes there's 1356 00:49:04,925 --> 00:49:06,965 that resistance where I kind of think, you know, 1357 00:49:07,145 --> 00:49:09,445 the person maybe is coming in 1358 00:49:09,445 --> 00:49:11,605 and struggling with, with doubt, you know, in the gospel. 1359 00:49:11,905 --> 00:49:14,765 And they're expecting you to sort of shift in that rally, 1360 00:49:14,785 --> 00:49:17,085 or well just read your scriptures, pray. 1361 00:49:17,705 --> 00:49:20,845 And so what, what would the, I guess I wanna make it more 1362 00:49:21,355 --> 00:49:23,085 realistic for leaders. 1363 00:49:23,085 --> 00:49:24,165 Like what were the provocateur? 1364 00:49:24,285 --> 00:49:26,365 - I think a good provocateur question in that situation, 1365 00:49:26,365 --> 00:49:27,965 at least the one that came to my mind was, 1366 00:49:28,275 --> 00:49:30,965 when was the last time that you had a sincere, 1367 00:49:31,105 --> 00:49:33,365 honest conversation with your father in heaven? 1368 00:49:34,065 --> 00:49:36,325 When's the last time you really prayed? Mm-Hmm. 1369 00:49:36,785 --> 00:49:39,885 - And when they say, I haven't for a while, why not? Mm-Hmm. 1370 00:49:39,925 --> 00:49:41,605 . What's holding you back from 1371 00:49:41,605 --> 00:49:43,605 conversing with your own father. Gotcha. Yeah. 1372 00:49:43,605 --> 00:49:46,245 - Yeah. And this is a, I took a, 1373 00:49:46,285 --> 00:49:48,765 a sales training years ago when I was working in sales 1374 00:49:48,765 --> 00:49:50,685 and there was this, uh, strategy that you talked about, 1375 00:49:50,685 --> 00:49:52,565 and it was a little bit in this column of provocateur 1376 00:49:52,565 --> 00:49:55,925 where if a person says, well, I'm thinking about going 1377 00:49:55,925 --> 00:49:57,845 with this, the competitor, you know, he is like, 1378 00:49:57,845 --> 00:49:59,045 great, they're fantastic. 1379 00:49:59,425 --> 00:50:00,645 Why don't you do that? You know? 1380 00:50:00,645 --> 00:50:01,885 And then sort of they're like, well, 1381 00:50:01,965 --> 00:50:03,005 I thought you were gonna Yeah. 1382 00:50:03,365 --> 00:50:04,365 Convince me not to. Right? 1383 00:50:04,505 --> 00:50:06,445 And so, almost being like, in the end, 1384 00:50:06,445 --> 00:50:08,245 there's this resistance, I wanna be the bishops. 1385 00:50:08,245 --> 00:50:10,125 Like, maybe you should go inactive. Yeah. 1386 00:50:10,145 --> 00:50:11,525 Why don't you, you know, but then 1387 00:50:11,525 --> 00:50:14,485 nonetheless, you're not, you're not saying going provocateur 1388 00:50:14,545 --> 00:50:15,805 to push them a certain direction. 1389 00:50:15,945 --> 00:50:18,045 You're just saying, let's just see where this goes. Right. 1390 00:50:18,475 --> 00:50:21,085 - Have you, Kurt, received hard feedback in your life? 1391 00:50:21,545 --> 00:50:24,285 - Yes. - How has that shaped you into who you're today? 1392 00:50:24,305 --> 00:50:25,605 - Oh, it's crucial. 1393 00:50:25,795 --> 00:50:27,485 - It's transform, by the way. Yeah. It's crucial. 1394 00:50:27,545 --> 00:50:28,845 Why is it crucial? Because, 1395 00:50:29,105 --> 00:50:31,245 - Uh, it helps me gain self-awareness, 1396 00:50:31,495 --> 00:50:34,125 which I only can look this way outta my eyeballs. 1397 00:50:34,125 --> 00:50:36,485 You know, I can't , I rarely see myself for 1398 00:50:37,025 --> 00:50:38,205 how other people perceive 1399 00:50:38,205 --> 00:50:39,205 - Me. 1400 00:50:39,205 --> 00:50:41,085 So if you were the bishop in your ward, wouldn't you want 1401 00:50:41,085 --> 00:50:42,645 that same thing for the people in your ward? 1402 00:50:42,645 --> 00:50:44,605 Yeah, absolutely. That's why you have 1403 00:50:44,605 --> 00:50:46,165 to embrace provocateur. 1404 00:50:46,225 --> 00:50:48,765 That's why you have to lean into it and ask those questions. 1405 00:50:49,045 --> 00:50:50,205 'cause it creates that self-awareness 1406 00:50:50,305 --> 00:50:53,525 and it lets you see things that you were unaware of before. 1407 00:50:53,715 --> 00:50:55,725 Yeah. It's identifying the 1408 00:50:55,725 --> 00:50:56,845 blind spot. Mm-Hmm. . 1409 00:50:57,185 --> 00:51:01,205 - And it doesn't have to be a nasty, it doesn't have 1410 00:51:01,205 --> 00:51:02,245 to be uncomfortable 1411 00:51:02,385 --> 00:51:05,325 and finger in somebody's chest provocateur. 1412 00:51:05,555 --> 00:51:08,405 Yeah. In my mind, provocateur is just about getting someone 1413 00:51:08,505 --> 00:51:10,565 to think of something from a different perspective. 1414 00:51:10,785 --> 00:51:13,045 Mm-Hmm. . Right. Seeing a different path, 1415 00:51:13,425 --> 00:51:14,565 seeing a pothole. 1416 00:51:14,975 --> 00:51:18,285 Right. It's not, oh, why are you such a jerk all the time? 1417 00:51:18,675 --> 00:51:22,085 It's just, Hey, when you, it doesn't have to be that. 1418 00:51:22,265 --> 00:51:24,565 - So if we go back to that example of the youth going 1419 00:51:24,565 --> 00:51:26,565 to the bishop saying, I wanna talk to you about my parents. 1420 00:51:26,925 --> 00:51:30,045 A provocateur question that's not harmful is talk to them. 1421 00:51:30,265 --> 00:51:32,885 Mm-Hmm. , how are they doing? Right? Yeah. 1422 00:51:32,885 --> 00:51:35,125 Like, what have you learned from their experience? 1423 00:51:35,285 --> 00:51:36,525 I mean, that's not rude or harmful, 1424 00:51:36,625 --> 00:51:38,805 but it's just saying, have you even had the conversation? 1425 00:51:38,835 --> 00:51:41,245 Yeah. Because if you haven't, it's a great place to start. 1426 00:51:41,245 --> 00:51:42,765 - Right, strategist. Yeah. 1427 00:51:42,765 --> 00:51:44,765 Because I think there's this, maybe this feeling of 1428 00:51:44,765 --> 00:51:46,005 with Proctor, you almost have 1429 00:51:46,005 --> 00:51:47,365 to like punch him in the gut while you do it. 1430 00:51:47,365 --> 00:51:49,125 Yeah. Like almost an insult. Like not at all. 1431 00:51:49,125 --> 00:51:50,005 Well, maybe it's 'cause you're stupid. 1432 00:51:50,005 --> 00:51:51,125 Have you considered ? 1433 00:51:51,125 --> 00:51:52,525 Exactly. Exactly. Like, 1434 00:51:52,705 --> 00:51:54,925 that's very provocative, a provocative question. 1435 00:51:54,985 --> 00:51:57,565 But again, you're not like trying to attack him or, 1436 00:51:58,145 --> 00:52:00,765 but to really, you want him just really look at it like, 1437 00:52:00,765 --> 00:52:02,485 well, haven't you talked to your parents? 1438 00:52:02,485 --> 00:52:05,045 Like, why not? Like, that seems like something you should 1439 00:52:05,205 --> 00:52:06,205 - Consider. 1440 00:52:06,205 --> 00:52:07,245 Yeah. And the other thing to kinda keep in mind, 1441 00:52:07,365 --> 00:52:10,005 I think why provocateur is important is coaching, 1442 00:52:10,005 --> 00:52:12,125 once again, is not top down. 1443 00:52:12,395 --> 00:52:14,765 It's side to side, it's bottom up. It's every direction. 1444 00:52:15,305 --> 00:52:18,125 And I think that leaders in the church today are getting a 1445 00:52:18,285 --> 00:52:21,325 lot of questions that are bottom up provocateur questions. 1446 00:52:21,945 --> 00:52:23,445 Why can't we do this? 1447 00:52:23,775 --> 00:52:26,805 Where in the doctrine does it say that this is not allowed? 1448 00:52:27,585 --> 00:52:32,085 And that's where Jesus was so good at using provocateur 1449 00:52:32,105 --> 00:52:34,405 and teaching us that you can coach any direction 1450 00:52:34,405 --> 00:52:37,645 that you need to and create that safe place. 1451 00:52:37,645 --> 00:52:40,445 Because provocateur comes from a place of love. 1452 00:52:40,745 --> 00:52:42,045 I'm asking this hard question 1453 00:52:42,505 --> 00:52:45,325 and instead of saying, how dare you ask if we can drink 1454 00:52:45,385 --> 00:52:47,965 coffee, why not say, I'm 1455 00:52:47,965 --> 00:52:50,685 so glad you're here feeling safe enough to ask. 1456 00:52:50,785 --> 00:52:52,525 Mm-Hmm. , let's have a discussion about it. 1457 00:52:52,535 --> 00:52:56,005 Right? Like, look for the good, the provocateur is, 1458 00:52:56,005 --> 00:52:57,885 this isn't a hard question, I should run the other way. 1459 00:52:58,475 --> 00:53:00,725 It's what's the gift in this moment to be able 1460 00:53:00,725 --> 00:53:02,325 to have that dialogue? Yeah. 1461 00:53:02,625 --> 00:53:03,805 - And I appreciate this, you know, 1462 00:53:03,805 --> 00:53:05,245 you say coaching side to side. 1463 00:53:05,245 --> 00:53:07,165 Yeah. I mean that alone, regardless of the different 1464 00:53:07,685 --> 00:53:09,605 coaching styles, like just starting from 1465 00:53:09,605 --> 00:53:10,965 that cadence is Yeah. 1466 00:53:11,065 --> 00:53:12,445 Is crucial. Because it sometimes, 1467 00:53:12,505 --> 00:53:15,725 and I even, I struggle with even the setup 1468 00:53:15,905 --> 00:53:17,245 of like a bishop's office. 1469 00:53:17,275 --> 00:53:20,445 Like I'm behind this Cadillac desk . Yeah. 1470 00:53:20,745 --> 00:53:22,085 And here's my, you know, I'm like, 1471 00:53:22,185 --> 00:53:23,925 I'm in the Oval Office, welcome. 1472 00:53:24,115 --> 00:53:26,205 Like suddenly you're, it's up down. 1473 00:53:26,205 --> 00:53:27,765 Like I am the authority in the room. 1474 00:53:27,825 --> 00:53:29,805 And we obviously believe in authority and whatnot, 1475 00:53:29,825 --> 00:53:33,085 but for them to really go on this journey 1476 00:53:33,225 --> 00:53:35,965 of understanding their situation, finding solutions 1477 00:53:35,985 --> 00:53:38,565 or whatever it is, it has to be that side to side. 1478 00:53:38,565 --> 00:53:40,405 So really for a leader to think, 1479 00:53:40,425 --> 00:53:41,725 how can I make this more side 1480 00:53:41,725 --> 00:53:43,925 to side rather than, you know, top down. 1481 00:53:43,975 --> 00:53:46,405 - Which also makes you think if you are in a leadership 1482 00:53:46,605 --> 00:53:48,765 position in the church, how can you empower those that, 1483 00:53:48,835 --> 00:53:50,805 that are also called in your presidency 1484 00:53:50,905 --> 00:53:52,005 or in other positions 1485 00:53:52,005 --> 00:53:53,605 to help carry out some of that workload. 1486 00:53:53,605 --> 00:53:55,845 Yeah. And go have some of these conversations. Mm-Hmm. 1487 00:53:55,885 --> 00:53:57,045 , we shouldn't keep 1488 00:53:57,045 --> 00:53:58,405 everything so close to the chest. 1489 00:53:58,545 --> 00:54:00,845 We should be delegating that amongst others 1490 00:54:00,845 --> 00:54:03,765 because we're all capable of being great coaches. 1491 00:54:03,985 --> 00:54:06,045 Mm-Hmm. . We just need to empower the people 1492 00:54:06,045 --> 00:54:07,605 around us to have the discussion. 1493 00:54:07,635 --> 00:54:11,965 - Yeah. Love it. Anything else we're missing? Concept, idea. 1494 00:54:12,645 --> 00:54:16,405 - I think the only other thing to address is just, uh, one 1495 00:54:16,405 --> 00:54:17,965 of the things that you can do with a question is you can 1496 00:54:17,965 --> 00:54:19,605 make it either direct or indirect. 1497 00:54:20,065 --> 00:54:22,965 So a direct question is, why did you do that? 1498 00:54:23,505 --> 00:54:26,525 An indirect is why could you have done that? Mm-Hmm. 1499 00:54:26,525 --> 00:54:27,885 Or why might you have done that? 1500 00:54:28,465 --> 00:54:32,485 And I think about these as where the focus is, right? 1501 00:54:32,995 --> 00:54:34,165 When we, the first question 1502 00:54:34,165 --> 00:54:35,725 that we asked in the coaching conversation, 1503 00:54:35,725 --> 00:54:37,245 what's something you'd like to talk about 1504 00:54:37,625 --> 00:54:39,285 that's very indirect. 1505 00:54:39,595 --> 00:54:42,005 Something, anything, whatever. 1506 00:54:42,495 --> 00:54:43,885 Where we could have gone direct 1507 00:54:43,945 --> 00:54:46,365 and said, what's something about the podcast 1508 00:54:46,635 --> 00:54:48,325 that we could give you some coaching on? 1509 00:54:48,325 --> 00:54:49,965 Mm-Hmm. . That's a little bit more narrow. 1510 00:54:50,295 --> 00:54:52,405 Right? What coaching do you need 1511 00:54:52,405 --> 00:54:53,765 to help your son taste some Hill? 1512 00:54:53,985 --> 00:54:55,365 Is his middle name Hill ? It's 1513 00:54:55,365 --> 00:54:58,085 - Not, it's actually, it's been name as Kurt, actually. Oh 1514 00:54:58,085 --> 00:54:59,085 - Wow. 1515 00:54:59,085 --> 00:54:59,165 That's not great. His named 1516 00:54:59,165 --> 00:55:01,325 - After Te a Mills. I'm that guy. Okay. 1517 00:55:01,525 --> 00:55:03,485 - . - And there's no reason not to be 1518 00:55:03,485 --> 00:55:04,885 that guy. Yeah. Because he's 1519 00:55:04,935 --> 00:55:06,525 - Right. Yes. Just amazing. 1520 00:55:06,595 --> 00:55:07,925 - Very, uh, that that was a 1521 00:55:08,075 --> 00:55:09,845 confidant. Yes. You just said there. That 1522 00:55:09,845 --> 00:55:10,845 - Was great. 1523 00:55:10,845 --> 00:55:11,075 Boom. 1524 00:55:12,275 --> 00:55:13,965 - Love it. Is there any, you know, 1525 00:55:13,965 --> 00:55:15,085 we talk about provocateur. 1526 00:55:15,185 --> 00:55:18,085 Is there any other style that you find people resist 1527 00:55:18,145 --> 00:55:20,365 or that's like the last place they want to go or? 1528 00:55:20,925 --> 00:55:23,005 - I think that transformer's hard for a lot of people 1529 00:55:23,075 --> 00:55:25,605 because transformer is two parted. 1530 00:55:25,865 --> 00:55:27,765 The first part is you see the potential 1531 00:55:27,875 --> 00:55:29,325 that light at the end of the tunnel. 1532 00:55:29,665 --> 00:55:31,485 How much better will your relationship with taste 1533 00:55:31,485 --> 00:55:32,965 and be as you infuse art? 1534 00:55:33,275 --> 00:55:35,525 Fast forward six months, you're doing art every night. 1535 00:55:35,525 --> 00:55:36,685 What's your relationship look like? 1536 00:55:36,795 --> 00:55:38,525 Your potential's high, right? Mm-Hmm. . 1537 00:55:38,525 --> 00:55:40,845 Oh, I can see that. But the other part 1538 00:55:40,845 --> 00:55:42,885 of the transformer is transmuting it. 1539 00:55:43,195 --> 00:55:45,765 It's pushing through the discomfort and the pain 1540 00:55:45,985 --> 00:55:47,925 and acknowledging that it exists. 1541 00:55:48,885 --> 00:55:51,845 A great coach will help you when you are transmuting pain 1542 00:55:51,905 --> 00:55:54,845 and transformer realize that it is, 1543 00:55:55,245 --> 00:55:56,325 I think about it like the force. 1544 00:55:56,995 --> 00:55:58,765 It's just part of the force. It's over there. 1545 00:55:58,765 --> 00:56:01,085 It's over here. It doesn't control you, 1546 00:56:01,265 --> 00:56:02,285 you don't control it. 1547 00:56:02,315 --> 00:56:04,485 It's just part of what God created for us. 1548 00:56:04,945 --> 00:56:06,005 And you kinda mentioned earlier, 1549 00:56:06,025 --> 00:56:07,325 we have those conversations with someone. 1550 00:56:07,345 --> 00:56:08,685 We can go provocateur and they say, 1551 00:56:08,685 --> 00:56:09,725 I don't believe in Joseph Smith. 1552 00:56:10,305 --> 00:56:15,045 Or the transmuting of that is, there are people, this plan 1553 00:56:15,045 --> 00:56:17,445 that God created gave us choice. 1554 00:56:18,025 --> 00:56:20,565 And there are people who choose to see things different. 1555 00:56:21,105 --> 00:56:23,660 And that's beautiful. Isn't that beautiful? Right. 1556 00:56:23,705 --> 00:56:25,525 And you kind of like live in that moment. 1557 00:56:25,715 --> 00:56:28,525 Instead of going to like the knee jerk, oh, I'm gonna fight 1558 00:56:28,525 --> 00:56:30,365 or flight go provocateur on you. 1559 00:56:30,385 --> 00:56:32,565 Mm-Hmm. . You just say, I'm gonna see 1560 00:56:32,565 --> 00:56:34,205 that I've got some things I'm working through. 1561 00:56:34,465 --> 00:56:35,685 I'm gonna live with those things 1562 00:56:35,985 --> 00:56:38,645 and I'm gonna work it out as part of the force, know 1563 00:56:38,645 --> 00:56:40,045 that it's there and then I'm gonna be able 1564 00:56:40,045 --> 00:56:41,885 to see the future potential that I have. 1565 00:56:42,625 --> 00:56:45,205 And so often in transformer as coaches, 1566 00:56:45,825 --> 00:56:47,965 we go really hard on the, the potential. 1567 00:56:48,065 --> 00:56:51,005 And we go really fast on the transmuting of that pain, 1568 00:56:51,145 --> 00:56:52,645 and we need to go deep into that. 1569 00:56:52,645 --> 00:56:54,445 Mm-Hmm. like, why do you feel this way? 1570 00:56:54,475 --> 00:56:55,965 It's a lot of confidant questions Yeah. 1571 00:56:55,965 --> 00:56:58,045 About helping you see what's going on 1572 00:56:58,225 --> 00:57:00,005 and creating that doubt in your mind 1573 00:57:00,585 --> 00:57:03,805 to then help you unlock your future potential. Yeah. 1574 00:57:04,225 --> 00:57:05,605 - Wow. That's powerful. Really helpful. 1575 00:57:05,755 --> 00:57:07,765 - I'll give you an example of that if I can. Mm-Hmm. 1576 00:57:08,065 --> 00:57:10,005 So my oldest son has cerebral palsy. 1577 00:57:10,385 --> 00:57:11,605 And when he was first born 1578 00:57:11,625 --> 00:57:14,445 and got that diagnosis, it was really hard, right. 1579 00:57:14,465 --> 00:57:16,725 We thought about all the negative things to it, 1580 00:57:17,225 --> 00:57:19,445 but then there came this point where we had this 1581 00:57:19,965 --> 00:57:21,805 transformer moment, my wife and I, 1582 00:57:22,305 --> 00:57:23,685 and we gotta, this, you know, 1583 00:57:24,075 --> 00:57:25,485 when I present on the Gallup Strength 1584 00:57:25,485 --> 00:57:26,765 Finders, I talk about weakness. 1585 00:57:26,785 --> 00:57:28,925 And I show a picture of of my son Max, 1586 00:57:29,705 --> 00:57:31,045 who loves podcasts by the way. 1587 00:57:31,045 --> 00:57:32,805 He wants to, he wants to be a podcaster. 1588 00:57:32,805 --> 00:57:34,885 So maybe I'll have to connect you too. That's right. Yeah. 1589 00:57:35,305 --> 00:57:38,325 But I talk about, you know, I ask the question, 1590 00:57:38,325 --> 00:57:39,685 is cerebral palsy a weakness? 1591 00:57:40,225 --> 00:57:41,525 And funny enough, 1592 00:57:41,525 --> 00:57:43,485 nobody really ever says, oh yeah, it's terrible. 1593 00:57:43,825 --> 00:57:45,325 But you know, I, I go through 1594 00:57:45,345 --> 00:57:48,125 and I show some of the things that he's done in his life, 1595 00:57:48,625 --> 00:57:50,085 and I'm like, that's not a weakness. 1596 00:57:50,085 --> 00:57:51,765 That's his superpower. You know? 1597 00:57:51,765 --> 00:57:54,605 And I remember one of the, a coaching I had 1598 00:57:54,605 --> 00:57:57,485 with Jared when I talked to him about a difficult situation 1599 00:57:58,025 --> 00:58:00,525 and something that I felt like, you know, like a diagnosis. 1600 00:58:00,545 --> 00:58:02,245 And he said, gosh, what a great superpower. 1601 00:58:02,585 --> 00:58:03,685 And now you know what it's, 1602 00:58:04,185 --> 00:58:06,365 and at first I was like, what whatcha talking about? 1603 00:58:06,865 --> 00:58:09,125 And then as I embrace that, I was like, yeah, 1604 00:58:09,125 --> 00:58:10,165 it is a superpower. 1605 00:58:10,735 --> 00:58:13,365 Right? And it's, that's what I love about the transformer, 1606 00:58:13,365 --> 00:58:15,805 is it's taking those things that are hard in our life 1607 00:58:16,425 --> 00:58:18,285 and turning them into, into a blessing. 1608 00:58:18,965 --> 00:58:21,245 I like to think about, uh, stoicism and, 1609 00:58:21,305 --> 00:58:24,365 and the obstacle is the way, and, and nothing is good 1610 00:58:24,365 --> 00:58:27,045 or bad until thinking makes it so is what Shakespeare said. 1611 00:58:27,065 --> 00:58:29,365 And I love being able for people, you know, 1612 00:58:29,365 --> 00:58:32,605 this person I'm coaching who lost their job now being able 1613 00:58:32,605 --> 00:58:34,045 to say, would you be 1614 00:58:34,045 --> 00:58:36,125 where you are today if you hadn't got fired? 1615 00:58:36,585 --> 00:58:39,965 And they're like, no. And this place is amazing. Awesome. 1616 00:58:40,425 --> 00:58:43,325 - So I wanna ask you in terms of, we talked early about this 1617 00:58:43,875 --> 00:58:45,045 even, you know, there it is. 1618 00:58:45,045 --> 00:58:46,405 Not just these one-to-one interactions. 1619 00:58:46,405 --> 00:58:47,885 It's really, it's a cultural thing. Yes. 1620 00:58:47,885 --> 00:58:49,805 You're building a culture of these different styles, right? 1621 00:58:50,305 --> 00:58:51,885 I'm just thinking like different meetings, 1622 00:58:51,885 --> 00:58:54,445 like even in ward council, if you're the bishop 1623 00:58:54,585 --> 00:58:57,565 or bishop member, you're leading ward council, you can go 1624 00:58:57,565 --> 00:58:59,485 to these different styles at different points 1625 00:59:00,185 --> 00:59:01,965 to stimulate revelation really. 1626 00:59:01,965 --> 00:59:04,365 Right. And really get the thoughts out 1627 00:59:04,365 --> 00:59:05,925 of their head into the meeting to consider. 1628 00:59:05,935 --> 00:59:08,405 Right. Anything you would add to that or 1629 00:59:08,895 --> 00:59:10,565 - Every single conversation is an 1630 00:59:10,565 --> 00:59:11,605 opportunity to provide coaching. 1631 00:59:11,605 --> 00:59:13,445 Mm-Hmm. . And to be thoughtful about it. Right. 1632 00:59:13,505 --> 00:59:15,645 And how you can help those people, those coaches, 1633 00:59:15,755 --> 00:59:17,685 whoever they are, advance where they need to be. 1634 00:59:17,685 --> 00:59:19,725 Yeah. This podcast today is a great example of that. 1635 00:59:19,735 --> 00:59:22,085 We've used every style multiple times. Yeah. 1636 00:59:22,225 --> 00:59:23,765 And we've had a lot of different emotions 1637 00:59:23,865 --> 00:59:26,205 and a lot of, like, it's led the dialogue a lot 1638 00:59:26,205 --> 00:59:27,685 of interesting ways that like Matt 1639 00:59:27,685 --> 00:59:28,885 and I weren't prepared for Mm-Hmm. 1640 00:59:28,905 --> 00:59:30,045 Nor were you, but it's 1641 00:59:30,045 --> 00:59:31,605 because we followed the needs of 1642 00:59:31,605 --> 00:59:32,925 where we needed to go together. 1643 00:59:33,075 --> 00:59:35,645 Yeah. So yeah, definitely embrace those things. 1644 00:59:36,225 --> 00:59:40,285 And I think a common pitfall that leaders make is 1645 00:59:40,285 --> 00:59:41,845 that they feel they have to educate. 1646 00:59:42,425 --> 00:59:44,325 And the opposite of the educator is, 1647 00:59:44,345 --> 00:59:45,525 is kind of that explorer. 1648 00:59:45,625 --> 00:59:47,325 Mm-Hmm. . It's what could be. 1649 00:59:47,785 --> 00:59:49,005 And you don't have to have answers. 1650 00:59:49,305 --> 00:59:51,965 As leaders, we so often think we have to have the answer. 1651 00:59:52,165 --> 00:59:53,605 I have to be the smartest person, the root, 1652 00:59:53,665 --> 00:59:54,765 I'm the presiding authority. 1653 00:59:54,965 --> 00:59:56,805 I better as well know the answer to this 1654 00:59:57,395 --> 00:59:59,125 when the truth is that's not right. 1655 00:59:59,335 --> 01:00:01,925 Right? Mm-Hmm. like, we can say, I don't know 1656 01:00:02,035 --> 01:00:03,325 what, what else could we do? 1657 01:00:03,345 --> 01:00:06,165 And empower those people around us, especially 1658 01:00:06,185 --> 01:00:08,725 as volunteer ministers, right. 1659 01:00:09,305 --> 01:00:11,725 We are not paid professionals in the church, 1660 01:00:12,225 --> 01:00:13,365 and we don't have to have answers. 1661 01:00:13,585 --> 01:00:15,685 We can just be authentic and real to who we are 1662 01:00:15,865 --> 01:00:17,365 and who we're talking with. Yeah. 1663 01:00:17,725 --> 01:00:20,725 - I also just think like, uh, even like is a Bishop Rick or 1664 01:00:21,265 --> 01:00:23,085 or council's preparing sacrament meeting 1665 01:00:23,145 --> 01:00:24,485 for the next few weeks, right. 1666 01:00:24,545 --> 01:00:27,485 Of being like, how can we, what does the word need? 1667 01:00:27,585 --> 01:00:29,645 You know? Yeah. As, as a, do they need more, 1668 01:00:29,725 --> 01:00:32,125 a more provocative, you know, experience there? 1669 01:00:32,145 --> 01:00:34,325 Do they need more educational, like do we need 1670 01:00:34,325 --> 01:00:35,925 to bring the stake patriarch in 1671 01:00:35,925 --> 01:00:37,605 to talk about patriarchal blessings? 1672 01:00:37,605 --> 01:00:39,925 Yeah. Or do we need to maybe have a, 1673 01:00:40,155 --> 01:00:41,965 some diverse views talked about? 1674 01:00:41,965 --> 01:00:45,245 Yeah. You know, to, so we're sort of in a wrestle, or, 1675 01:00:45,665 --> 01:00:48,085 or we just need the, the confidant, right? 1676 01:00:48,185 --> 01:00:51,325 We just, I just want to like put my arms around the ward 1677 01:00:51,325 --> 01:00:54,325 and sacrament means say everything's gonna be okay. 1678 01:00:54,325 --> 01:00:56,285 Right? Yeah. Yeah. And, and to really be intentional 1679 01:00:56,285 --> 01:00:57,725 about even meetings. Yeah. Because 1680 01:00:57,725 --> 01:00:58,725 - Those questions are helpful. 1681 01:00:58,895 --> 01:01:01,005 Right. And if you were in that situation saying, 1682 01:01:01,025 --> 01:01:04,445 we need more diverse opinions, then you, you may have to go 1683 01:01:04,445 --> 01:01:06,125 to your state president or whoever it is 1684 01:01:06,125 --> 01:01:08,765 and say, Hey, I wanna put the Relief Society president 1685 01:01:08,765 --> 01:01:09,885 on the stand for this meeting. 1686 01:01:10,355 --> 01:01:12,685 What are the regulations around that? Right. 1687 01:01:12,865 --> 01:01:15,685 And like, why not like great explorer question, 1688 01:01:16,425 --> 01:01:18,405 how do we get more female presence 1689 01:01:18,405 --> 01:01:20,605 and voice heard when over 50% 1690 01:01:20,605 --> 01:01:23,085 of our demographic in our church are, are women? 1691 01:01:23,745 --> 01:01:27,245 And asking those questions are not a bad thing they've hit 1692 01:01:27,245 --> 01:01:29,765 in every single coaching category. Awesome. 1693 01:01:30,225 --> 01:01:32,605 - If there's like, if people wanna wade deeper into these 1694 01:01:32,605 --> 01:01:34,845 waters of this, of the respect coaching styles, 1695 01:01:34,915 --> 01:01:37,805 what resources or where would you point them to learn more? 1696 01:01:38,065 --> 01:01:42,605 - Uh, Dr. David Morelli, um, is the creator of this, uh, 1697 01:01:42,665 --> 01:01:44,245 his company is called Owl Hub. 1698 01:01:44,385 --> 01:01:46,725 And so I'd recommend you go take a look@owlhub.com 1699 01:01:46,725 --> 01:01:50,085 or you can connect with Matt Ryan, LinkedIn, LinkedIn, 1700 01:01:50,495 --> 01:01:53,085 we're those LinkedIn business nerds that are out there. 1701 01:01:53,185 --> 01:01:54,365 But we'd love to connect with everybody. 1702 01:01:54,615 --> 01:01:55,725 - We'll link to your profile. 1703 01:01:55,825 --> 01:01:59,485 So Matt, as you been on this journey of coaching 1704 01:01:59,745 --> 01:02:01,645 and learning especially about Christ 1705 01:02:01,665 --> 01:02:03,845 and this coaching, how has this journey helped you become 1706 01:02:04,405 --> 01:02:06,445 a better follower of Jesus Christ? That's 1707 01:02:06,445 --> 01:02:07,445 - A great question. 1708 01:02:07,705 --> 01:02:10,925 And I think, you know, for me it's after learning this 1709 01:02:10,925 --> 01:02:13,365 and then being able to go through this savior's life 1710 01:02:13,425 --> 01:02:16,005 and study the questions that he asks, 1711 01:02:16,585 --> 01:02:20,605 and understanding that when he asks a provocateur question 1712 01:02:21,035 --> 01:02:22,845 that he is doing it out of love 1713 01:02:23,665 --> 01:02:25,485 and he's doing it so we can 1714 01:02:26,035 --> 01:02:27,765 explore our own feelings about it. 1715 01:02:28,055 --> 01:02:31,165 Right? He doesn't ask a question, you know, with the, 1716 01:02:31,485 --> 01:02:33,605 a simple answer, it's almost always something 1717 01:02:33,605 --> 01:02:35,205 that you really have to go deep on. 1718 01:02:35,465 --> 01:02:37,925 And to me, it just makes me realize 1719 01:02:37,945 --> 01:02:41,005 how much the savior cared about, cares about us and, 1720 01:02:41,345 --> 01:02:42,765 and how much he wanted us 1721 01:02:42,825 --> 01:02:45,205 to learn from the example that he showed. 1722 01:02:45,345 --> 01:02:48,365 And he's just super cool. Great coach. 1723 01:02:48,855 --> 01:02:50,885 - Jared, how about you? How's this journey brought you 1724 01:02:50,885 --> 01:02:52,685 closer as a helped you become a better 1725 01:02:52,685 --> 01:02:53,725 follower of Jesus Christ? 1726 01:02:54,535 --> 01:02:56,205 - Jesus was perfect. 1727 01:02:56,865 --> 01:02:58,725 And Jesus, when we look at leadership 1728 01:02:58,865 --> 01:03:00,365 and how we can become better leaders 1729 01:03:00,625 --> 01:03:04,365 and individuals right in our own path, we look to him 1730 01:03:04,825 --> 01:03:09,365 and he used these styles and he did 'em flawlessly, 1731 01:03:10,105 --> 01:03:11,605 and he did 'em for the one. 1732 01:03:11,945 --> 01:03:13,165 And so I feel like the way 1733 01:03:13,165 --> 01:03:16,645 that we can be better is reaching out to the one is 1734 01:03:16,645 --> 01:03:19,925 by coaching them for what they need, just like he would. 1735 01:03:20,265 --> 01:03:22,325 And that will make us not perfect, 1736 01:03:22,625 --> 01:03:25,645 but it'll make us really good leaders that people will want 1737 01:03:25,645 --> 01:03:27,245 to not only follow, but be around. 1738 01:03:27,545 --> 01:03:29,485 And it's because when they're around us, 1739 01:03:29,505 --> 01:03:31,405 we will lead them back to the Savior 1740 01:03:31,825 --> 01:03:33,125 as we do what he would do. 1741 01:03:40,625 --> 01:03:42,485 - Hey, you made it to the end of the episode. 1742 01:03:42,865 --> 01:03:45,405 Wasn't that so good? You know, I tend to pinch myself 1743 01:03:45,405 --> 01:03:46,525 that this is what I get to do. 1744 01:03:46,565 --> 01:03:49,845 I get to sit down with some remarkable people across the 1745 01:03:49,845 --> 01:03:53,725 world, experts, everyday leaders, PhDs, therapists, 1746 01:03:53,925 --> 01:03:56,965 whatever it be, and have such an impactful conversation. 1747 01:03:57,045 --> 01:03:59,845 I hope you'll share it, drop it into text, message an email, 1748 01:04:00,105 --> 01:04:02,085 and share it to someone who maybe came to mind 1749 01:04:02,265 --> 01:04:03,365 during this episode. 1750 01:04:03,665 --> 01:04:04,845 And if you go to the show notes 1751 01:04:04,845 --> 01:04:06,845 and scroll to the bottom, there's actually a list of some 1752 01:04:06,845 --> 01:04:08,845 of our most popular episodes. 1753 01:04:08,845 --> 01:04:10,285 So don't stop with this episode. 1754 01:04:10,565 --> 01:04:11,685 I mean, you're not done with the dishes 1755 01:04:11,705 --> 01:04:13,365 or mowing the lawn or working out. 1756 01:04:13,385 --> 01:04:15,365 So you might as well keep it going at 1757 01:04:15,365 --> 01:04:16,405 the bottom of those show notes. 1758 01:04:16,665 --> 01:04:18,765 And, uh, make sure you, you listen to each one, 1759 01:04:18,765 --> 01:04:20,525 maybe a couple times on a few of 'em. 1760 01:04:21,245 --> 01:04:23,445 Remember, go to leading saints.org/fourteen 1761 01:04:23,505 --> 01:04:25,165 to access the remarkable presentation 1762 01:04:25,165 --> 01:04:28,285 by Anthony Sweat about ambiguity and doctrine. 1763 01:04:37,865 --> 01:04:41,125 - It came as a result of the position of leadership, 1764 01:04:41,135 --> 01:04:44,685 which was imposed upon us by the God of heaven, 1765 01:04:44,785 --> 01:04:48,405 who brought forth a restoration of the gospel 1766 01:04:48,625 --> 01:04:49,925 of Jesus Christ. 1767 01:04:50,625 --> 01:04:54,205 And when the declaration was made concerning, the only, 1768 01:04:54,675 --> 01:04:57,965 only true and living church upon the face of the earth, 1769 01:04:58,745 --> 01:05:02,005 we were immediately put in a position of loneliness. 1770 01:05:02,185 --> 01:05:05,885 The loneliness of leadership from which we cannot 1771 01:05:06,065 --> 01:05:07,485 shrink nor run away. 1772 01:05:08,425 --> 01:05:12,285 And to which we must face up with boldness and courage 1773 01:05:12,985 --> 01:05:13,605 and ability.