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They just, they want to suck you dry and then move on to the next thing.

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And they don't give a shit about you making a living.

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There are artists I've worked for that are just broke and it's wrong.

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It's wrong.

5
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Madonna's people call me and go, you gotta come back.

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She's gonna go out.

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And I went, I'm not coming back.

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I hung up the phone.

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Hello and welcome to the keyboard Chronicles a podcast for keyboard players.

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I'm your host David Holloway and I'm thrilled as always to be here with you.

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I'm also thrilled to introduce Mr.

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Mike McKnight.

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We quite often say on the show about how diverse some of our guests careers are and it
doesn't get any more stark than Mike's career.

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I'm not even going to attempt to mention some of the people he's worked with because we
cover that in some depth.

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And there's also a link in the show notes to

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Mike's website, which gives a much more extensive list again.

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Mike's an amazing guy who's also worked sort of behind the microphone and in the magazine
industry in regards to keyboards, as we'll discuss as well.

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So he has fascinating insights and it was a thrill to speak with him, but I'll shut up for
a minute and let you listen to Mike and I'll see you after the show.

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Mike, sir, it's an absolute pleasure to have you on the show.

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can't begin to tell you, you're someone we've been keen to have on since the get go.

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So lovely to see you.

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Thank you for having me.

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I'm honored.

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Thank you.

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No, and look, in our introduction, which you won't have seen, Mike, I sort of mentioned
the fact that it's going to be hard to encapsulate the breadth of your career, but we're

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going to give it a red hot go and see what rabbit holes we go down.

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So I thought we'll start

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probably quite traditionally and just initially start with your musical upbringing.

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So what your childhood into your early adulthood, what got you into music and got you
passionate about music and technology that ended up in a career for you?

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I'll try and keep it short.

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My dad was in the Marine Corps and it was the sixties, early seventies and I picked up a
guitar.

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I used to stutter so bad I couldn't talk, but playing music was something that I could do.

33
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and I could communicate and I didn't sound like an idiot.

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And of course he said, young man, don't you even fucking think about playing in a band,
which of course was like, yep, that's what I'm going to do, dad.

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That's what I'm doing.

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So, and he said, well, you can't read music.

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And I went, I don't care.

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You know, I'm, I hear it, I play it and you know, so, that was how I started.

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Started off playing guitar and made the mistake of, one of my first bands when I was still
in high school, sitting down at my dad's Lowry, Oregon or some horrible, know, church

40
00:03:08,028 --> 00:03:08,498
organ.

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00:03:08,498 --> 00:03:15,322
And I could play light by fire and stuff and you guys went, hell no, you're not playing
guitar because you can play keyboards.

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00:03:15,322 --> 00:03:16,706
And I said, yeah, but I don't want to play keyboards.

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And they go, well, you suck on guitar, so you're playing keyboards.

44
00:03:19,964 --> 00:03:23,026
And I went, okay, all right, so.

45
00:03:23,714 --> 00:03:35,282
Then I started playing in bar bands and then I got drum machines and Commodore 64s and all
that insanity and people would go, hey, can you do this?

46
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And I would go, yeah, I can do that.

47
00:03:36,593 --> 00:03:39,295
Then I go, how am gonna fucking do that?

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00:03:39,295 --> 00:03:44,868
And then you just figure it out and then before you know it, you're not playing anymore.

49
00:03:44,868 --> 00:03:52,073
You're the technology guy under the stage getting yelled at by the pop star.

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00:03:53,454 --> 00:04:00,054
Now I'm just going to interrupt it there a minute, Mike, because you've mentioned
something I hadn't planned on discussing, but it's very topical at the moment.

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You mentioned the Commodore 64 and you may or not be aware that the Commodore brand is
back and they're actually re-released the Commodore 64 with obviously all the latest USB

52
00:04:11,254 --> 00:04:13,034
ports and it runs.

53
00:04:13,034 --> 00:04:15,894
I think it's a Windows operating system.

54
00:04:15,894 --> 00:04:21,582
So just because I'm interested and I sadly couldn't afford a Commodore 64, I was a big 20
guy.

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Tell us about what you remember doing musically with that.

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I do remember the Commodore 64 was considered ahead of its time at the time.

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Well at the time it was 1983, 84.

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MIDI just came out.

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I got the sequential circuits cartridge as you plugged into the Commodore 64 and I had
Oberheim drum machine that I synced up with FSK, you know, sync on it and then I had a

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Prophet 5 and a DX7 with

61
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both had MIDI on it.

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depending on, and I also had a CP 70 B.

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So I play all the piano parts, program the drum machine, and then had the Commodore
playing all the, you know, the obvious sequence parts from back in the day, know, did it,

64
00:05:09,717 --> 00:05:11,678
you know, that stupid shit.

65
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And, and it was, you know, it cool.

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It was, it was, it was magic.

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And the, the drummer didn't really have a set.

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00:05:20,526 --> 00:05:35,586
We all heard the same hi-hat count in and we all just went for it and and if it went to
shit, we just turned it off, you know and Yeah, so I mean I I used the Commodore 64 I used

69
00:05:35,586 --> 00:05:36,486
dr.

70
00:05:36,486 --> 00:05:49,826
T's KCS and I when I moved to California I got an Atari whoo eight meg of RAM instead of
64 K and Started using that on on tours

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00:05:49,974 --> 00:05:53,637
I did, it killed me.

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00:05:53,637 --> 00:06:05,747
did Madonna 1990, blonde ambition, big stadium tour with an Atari 1040 ST with eight,
eight Meg e max two samplers.

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00:06:05,747 --> 00:06:11,632
Four would be playing and four would be loading from Cyquest 44 megabyte cartridges.

74
00:06:12,253 --> 00:06:15,305
That dude, I mean, it was, it was a miracle.

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This shit worked at all.

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And I had no backups.

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It was no backup.

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mean, I had a

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an Atari laptop that weighed probably a hundred pounds.

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00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:25,439
You know, was insanely heavy.

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00:06:25,439 --> 00:06:27,341
You could kill somebody with it.

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00:06:28,301 --> 00:06:30,442
but there was no way to switch between them.

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00:06:30,442 --> 00:06:33,423
just, you'd have to go, Hey, computer's dead.

84
00:06:33,423 --> 00:06:39,676
And I plug in the other Atari and then plug in the MIDI cape, you know, the MIDI, cause
that's all just had the built in MIDI on it.

85
00:06:39,676 --> 00:06:40,966
It was, it was great.

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00:06:41,070 --> 00:06:43,410
Sure, I'm jumping way ahead of things here, but...

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00:06:43,410 --> 00:06:45,210
No, that's great.

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00:06:45,210 --> 00:06:49,650
And we definitely will be talking about, yeah, sort of the big tours, but no, that's still
fascinating.

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00:06:49,650 --> 00:06:52,010
And thank you for the stuff about the Commodore 64.

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The whole thing with the Commodore is just, what a nerd.

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00:06:54,970 --> 00:06:55,850
I'm sorry.

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00:06:55,890 --> 00:06:58,010
I'm sure there are other nerds watching this.

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Shocking, I know.

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00:06:59,250 --> 00:06:59,350
But...

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00:06:59,350 --> 00:06:59,950
Definitely.

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00:06:59,950 --> 00:07:02,930
It's like we would play five sets a night.

97
00:07:02,930 --> 00:07:09,630
So during the break between sets, I would be loading up the Oberheim from a cassette tape.

98
00:07:09,798 --> 00:07:18,223
And the Commodore with a five and a quarter inch floppy, you know, so my break was spent
doing that instead of chasing girls like the rest of the band.

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So anyway, here we go.

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yeah.

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I'm hearing you again.

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Yes, you're absolutely right.

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So, I mean, it's, I still say you were somewhat unique, even as a teenager, having that
level of technology in bands, because there are a lot of us that obviously didn't.

104
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So I can see why you were snapped up.

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What was your first?

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00:07:39,342 --> 00:07:43,842
What was the juncture at which you realized, look, I may actually end up doing this for a
living.

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00:07:43,842 --> 00:07:56,982
Um, well, I, I did it for a living from the moment I left high school, you know, I, um,
the night I graduated, I'm driving down the road to play at a club.

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00:07:57,102 --> 00:07:59,782
You know, everybody else is going out to graduation parties and shit.

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And I'm just, I'm hauling ass down the freeway, ripping off my road, putting on my stage
clothes and barely made it for the first song, you know?

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So yeah, I.

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I tried on, you know, I was married three times.

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00:08:15,495 --> 00:08:20,109
So, you know, every marriage, they always go, well, do you really have to do this for
living?

113
00:08:20,109 --> 00:08:22,622
And go, yeah, I do actually.

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So I'm good at it.

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I get paid a lot.

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So shut up, you know?

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00:08:29,208 --> 00:08:33,592
Anyway, Yeah, no, absolutely.

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00:08:33,592 --> 00:08:36,474
And so at that stage you were playing.

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cover gigs or original stuff or a bit of mixed...

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00:08:40,937 --> 00:08:43,178
No, it was all cover gigs.

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God.

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00:08:44,098 --> 00:08:46,700
It was horrific show bands.

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00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:58,047
It's kind of like what they're doing now with the tribute bands is we would go up and we
would do four or five tribute bands in one show and call it a show.

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We would do a medley of Toto, we'd do a medley of Beach Boys, medley of Beatles.

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00:09:04,174 --> 00:09:06,494
Everybody go, my God, you sound exactly like them.

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00:09:06,494 --> 00:09:09,154
And I go, well, yeah, you know, that's what we're supposed to do.

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That's what you paid for.

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Right.

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00:09:10,974 --> 00:09:15,394
So, and yeah, so that was cover bands.

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Never really did an original band.

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We always would do a few originals in the bands I was in.

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We'd write stuff and, but no, it's, it was just cover band making a living.

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And then I moved to California in 85 and

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played in a band called the Mod Beats.

135
00:09:36,488 --> 00:09:38,210
And of course it was a 60s band.

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So we did a couple sets dressed up psychedelic, sets dressed up like the Beatles.

137
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It was a gig.

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00:09:46,278 --> 00:09:47,119
It was a gig.

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00:09:47,119 --> 00:09:48,299
It's a gig.

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Absolutely.

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00:09:50,122 --> 00:09:52,744
And so you're in California, Mike.

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What led to you?

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00:09:54,786 --> 00:10:04,672
getting the big break as far as you know, you're now making somewhat of a full-time income
was just really the grind of digging and merging into other stuff or?

144
00:10:05,813 --> 00:10:19,061
The way I got my gig is there was a company back in the eighties called KeyClick and there
was a programmer named Bo Tomlin and Steve Leonard and Bo would program all the DX7 stuff

145
00:10:19,061 --> 00:10:21,802
for Yamaha and then he would get called

146
00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:38,022
by David Foster and all the big studio guys and he'd go in and program these sounds and I
just made myself a complete pest and he made me an intern, brought me on and in 1987 he

147
00:10:38,142 --> 00:10:49,270
got a call from Earthman and Fire and said we need a keyboard tech, a programmer that can
make the sounds and program stuff and both.

148
00:10:49,358 --> 00:10:59,638
taking me under his wing, he taught me how to program synthesizers and I would, we would
have a collection of sounds for the DX7 and he would make me sit in a room and duplicate

149
00:10:59,638 --> 00:11:06,178
it on a, in Sonic ESQ1, which was, it was torture, it was wrong.

150
00:11:06,178 --> 00:11:12,018
It was really wrong for me to have to, cause that thing, it would crash and all my work
was gone.

151
00:11:12,018 --> 00:11:13,718
Anything I'd saved was corrupted.

152
00:11:13,718 --> 00:11:16,838
It was, but you'd have to do it again and you do it again.

153
00:11:16,838 --> 00:11:18,470
And every time you have a,

154
00:11:18,470 --> 00:11:24,315
a situation like that in your life, you just go, okay, all right, I gotta do it all again.

155
00:11:24,315 --> 00:11:25,476
There's a reason for this.

156
00:11:25,476 --> 00:11:26,176
There's a reason.

157
00:11:26,176 --> 00:11:27,978
I'll do it better next time.

158
00:11:27,978 --> 00:11:34,824
So you just suck it up, move on and do it.

159
00:11:34,824 --> 00:11:40,929
Anyway, so he got the call and he said, I can't do it, but this guy might can.

160
00:11:40,929 --> 00:11:47,950
So they threw me in there and I was playing at a bar band making three, $400 a week.

161
00:11:47,950 --> 00:11:55,350
And Earth, Wind and Fire called and said, we're going to pay you 1600 a week and we'll pay
800 a week when you're not working.

162
00:11:55,490 --> 00:11:58,950
I'm like, holy shit, and it's Earth, Wind and Fire.

163
00:11:58,950 --> 00:12:01,610
get paid to be with these guys.

164
00:12:02,530 --> 00:12:03,710
so I got the gig.

165
00:12:03,710 --> 00:12:11,870
was just setting up the keyboards one day and I started playing and they said, hey, can
you play some parts behind the curtain?

166
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You know, because, you know, you're white, so you need to be behind the curtain.

167
00:12:17,324 --> 00:12:18,775
We can't have that out here.

168
00:12:18,775 --> 00:12:19,905
And I went, yeah, that's cool.

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I'm here.

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know?

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00:12:20,976 --> 00:12:34,363
So, and then they brought me to the studio and, just, I just made a real pest of myself
and every chance I had, I would do a hundred times more than I was asked.

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And, that, that, if I can impart any knowledge to anyone is work ethic is the one thing
that you are never taught in school.

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You're never taught.

174
00:12:47,180 --> 00:12:48,651
You either have it or you don't.

175
00:12:48,651 --> 00:12:55,255
So keep your mouth shut and do it a hundred times more than what you're paid for and you
will succeed.

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00:12:55,255 --> 00:12:58,797
You will go a long way in this business and keep your mouth shut.

177
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Don't complain.

178
00:12:59,918 --> 00:13:00,708
Don't bitch.

179
00:13:00,708 --> 00:13:03,500
Don't just do your job.

180
00:13:04,221 --> 00:13:04,951
Absolutely.

181
00:13:04,951 --> 00:13:05,712
That's it.

182
00:13:05,712 --> 00:13:06,542
Yeah.

183
00:13:07,020 --> 00:13:09,602
And it's funny, Mike, we got some questions from viewers later.

184
00:13:09,602 --> 00:13:11,704
I think you've just answered one of them, which is wonderful.

185
00:13:11,704 --> 00:13:15,867
So, mean, Earth, Wind and Fighter call them iconic as an understatement around the world.

186
00:13:15,867 --> 00:13:18,919
So what were the learnings for you with that first big gig?

187
00:13:18,919 --> 00:13:24,143
What did you learn pretty quickly that you hadn't thought of today?

188
00:13:24,143 --> 00:13:34,080
Well, the thing about them at first is that they played everything so fast, you know, for
the live show.

189
00:13:34,208 --> 00:13:38,399
And I kept going, guys, guys, it really worked slower.

190
00:13:38,540 --> 00:13:42,942
And by the nineties, they listened to me and they brought it back.

191
00:13:42,942 --> 00:13:49,004
But anyway, not that I was the reason for it, but it was it.

192
00:13:49,004 --> 00:13:53,516
People feel like you have to play things faster on the live show, makes it more exciting.

193
00:13:53,516 --> 00:13:54,016
It doesn't.

194
00:13:54,016 --> 00:13:54,626
It doesn't.

195
00:13:54,626 --> 00:13:57,527
And but the thing that.

196
00:13:58,928 --> 00:14:03,810
God, again, it's it's back to if you're given an opportunity.

197
00:14:05,647 --> 00:14:07,568
just jump in there and take it.

198
00:14:07,568 --> 00:14:09,629
Maurice used to leave me in the studio.

199
00:14:09,629 --> 00:14:12,631
He would go, okay, here's the song.

200
00:14:12,972 --> 00:14:15,433
Do you think impress me?

201
00:14:15,474 --> 00:14:17,795
Give me something in the morning that I haven't thought of.

202
00:14:17,795 --> 00:14:21,077
And he'd come back in and I hadn't slept, but I was young.

203
00:14:21,077 --> 00:14:22,298
I could do it.

204
00:14:22,298 --> 00:14:24,340
And, he would let me do that.

205
00:14:24,340 --> 00:14:27,364
He actually got, he actually let me do horn arrangements.

206
00:14:27,364 --> 00:14:34,196
I don't even know about a horn arrangements, you know, but I would do like scratch horn
parts that I heard.

207
00:14:34,402 --> 00:14:36,423
And he was like, that's it.

208
00:14:36,423 --> 00:14:37,583
That works.

209
00:14:37,683 --> 00:14:49,068
So again, just if you're given any kind of an opportunity to be creative and if you don't
give it your best shot because you're not getting paid to do it, you're a fucking asshole

210
00:14:49,068 --> 00:14:51,969
and you're not gonna, you're not gonna succeed.

211
00:14:51,969 --> 00:15:03,564
You have to take every opportunity, but then you also have to know when to shut the fuck
up and to back off and go, okay, you're the boss, whatever you want.

212
00:15:03,564 --> 00:15:04,495
That's what you get.

213
00:15:04,495 --> 00:15:07,126
And you don't talk shit about anybody.

214
00:15:07,126 --> 00:15:11,758
You just just do your thing, do your job.

215
00:15:11,939 --> 00:15:15,361
But it was just the whole the whole work ethic.

216
00:15:15,361 --> 00:15:18,722
Those guys rehearsed hours and hours and hours.

217
00:15:18,763 --> 00:15:26,226
And we had to and you had to think ahead and you had to program and you had to stay ahead
of them.

218
00:15:26,307 --> 00:15:31,870
And but again, don't tell them what to do with them.

219
00:15:31,870 --> 00:15:32,590
Think it's

220
00:15:32,590 --> 00:15:35,610
their idea and you go, Hey, great idea.

221
00:15:35,630 --> 00:15:40,490
you know, you raise a good point there, Mike, and this is another rabbit hole.

222
00:15:40,490 --> 00:15:49,750
wasn't planning on exploring, but I mean, uh, in the last few days, I watched the rock and
roll hall of fame inductions for including Kool and the Gang and foreigner.

223
00:15:49,750 --> 00:15:58,370
And what stood out with the Kool and the Gang one, a bit like earth, wind and fire is just
the pure scope of the music they covered and the discipline in the live performance.

224
00:15:58,370 --> 00:16:00,204
Do you think there's something been lost?

225
00:16:00,204 --> 00:16:03,105
Nowadays, there's certainly highly disciplined bands still out there.

226
00:16:03,105 --> 00:16:08,976
But what do you think we've lost over the last 30 or 40 years as far as what they used to
approach playing?

227
00:16:08,976 --> 00:16:14,298
Well, the one thing we've lost as far as songwriting is a decent bridge.

228
00:16:14,298 --> 00:16:16,359
Nobody writes bridges anymore.

229
00:16:16,359 --> 00:16:17,639
It's it's.

230
00:16:18,239 --> 00:16:21,220
That's that's the biggest thing I haven't heard.

231
00:16:21,660 --> 00:16:23,901
You know, I'm not dissing Taylor Swift.

232
00:16:23,901 --> 00:16:28,162
I just I've never listened to her music, but I don't know if she has bridges.

233
00:16:28,162 --> 00:16:28,882
I.

234
00:16:28,928 --> 00:16:30,539
I suspect she does.

235
00:16:30,539 --> 00:16:36,973
I suspect any songwriter that's worth their, you know, that knows what they're doing,
knows how to write a song.

236
00:16:36,973 --> 00:16:38,345
And I just don't hear it.

237
00:16:38,345 --> 00:16:42,007
I can't, maybe it's cause I'm an old fart has been some bitch.

238
00:16:42,007 --> 00:16:42,447
don't know.

239
00:16:42,447 --> 00:16:47,110
But I try to listen just for the production value.

240
00:16:47,110 --> 00:16:50,833
And I try to listen to stay on top of things and to go, okay.

241
00:16:50,833 --> 00:16:55,286
They over-compressed the fuck out of this here and they, yeah, they over, over tune this.

242
00:16:55,286 --> 00:16:55,957
Okay, cool.

243
00:16:55,957 --> 00:16:56,907
That's what they want to hear.

244
00:16:56,907 --> 00:16:57,778
Great.

245
00:16:57,778 --> 00:16:58,486
Cool.

246
00:16:58,486 --> 00:17:04,831
I know how to do this, you know, because if I listen to Steeler Dan all the time, I'm
never going to get a pop gig again.

247
00:17:05,091 --> 00:17:06,102
anyway, you know what I mean?

248
00:17:06,102 --> 00:17:09,414
It's like, I like what I like and.

249
00:17:10,656 --> 00:17:16,761
Yeah, you know, but but she got to, know, so yeah, to me, that's the biggest thing.

250
00:17:16,761 --> 00:17:19,693
Nobody writes great songs anymore.

251
00:17:19,693 --> 00:17:21,224
They just don't.

252
00:17:21,224 --> 00:17:24,296
mean, they're so I'm sorry.

253
00:17:24,296 --> 00:17:25,217
That's that's not fair.

254
00:17:25,217 --> 00:17:28,019
Not nobody, but it's just not.

255
00:17:28,556 --> 00:17:38,013
And the biggest thing is, the biggest reason that's happening is because the record
labels, and I'm sure this has been covered a billion times, don't support new art.

256
00:17:38,013 --> 00:17:42,836
They just, they want to suck you dry and then move on to the next thing.

257
00:17:42,836 --> 00:17:53,364
And they don't give a shit about you making a living or, I mean, there are artists I've
worked for that are just broke and it's wrong.

258
00:17:53,364 --> 00:17:56,046
It's wrong, you know, but.

259
00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:57,510
I couldn't agree more.

260
00:17:57,510 --> 00:17:59,873
No, think extremely valid points.

261
00:17:59,873 --> 00:18:04,136
So, Mike, mean, as much as it kills, we'd even move past Earth, and fire.

262
00:18:04,136 --> 00:18:06,238
will move on.

263
00:18:06,538 --> 00:18:09,781
So, I mean, obviously you've worked with a whole range of artists.

264
00:18:09,781 --> 00:18:12,053
And so I'm going to call out three more obvious ones.

265
00:18:12,053 --> 00:18:18,608
But also after we go through those, I'm really interested to hear what you believe are the
more interesting gigs you've had.

266
00:18:18,608 --> 00:18:19,629
But I'll start with the three.

267
00:18:19,629 --> 00:18:23,843
So I think your longest collaboration is with Mariah Carey.

268
00:18:23,843 --> 00:18:25,836
So tell us how about that came about.

269
00:18:25,836 --> 00:18:33,532
And how you managed the secret, what was the secret to the longevity of that successful
working relationship?

270
00:18:34,493 --> 00:18:48,345
The monitor engineer that was on Madonna in 1990, kind of Keith Carroll, heard that Mariah
was looking for a playback guy and he recommended me.

271
00:18:48,345 --> 00:18:49,716
And Keith and I weren't really buddies.

272
00:18:49,716 --> 00:18:51,147
We didn't hang out.

273
00:18:51,748 --> 00:18:54,760
Probably had a few disagreements about

274
00:18:55,158 --> 00:18:59,390
monitors and stuff, but he was very, very nice.

275
00:18:59,390 --> 00:19:06,164
And he put my name up and Walter Athanasiev called me and got the gig.

276
00:19:06,585 --> 00:19:10,177
And then I just had an instant connection with her.

277
00:19:10,177 --> 00:19:17,811
She's listen, Mariah's a diva, but as a human being, she's a sweetheart.

278
00:19:17,811 --> 00:19:23,034
I love her and I would, and she's been there for me through

279
00:19:23,750 --> 00:19:25,131
so many things.

280
00:19:25,551 --> 00:19:29,083
I mean, yeah, if I hear all I want for Christmas again, I'm to blow my brains out.

281
00:19:29,083 --> 00:19:33,556
But it's a gig, you know, it's a gig, you know, what are you going to do?

282
00:19:33,556 --> 00:19:40,579
You know, I mean, we started I started working on that, like in August, you know, getting
ready for the tour for the Christmas tour.

283
00:19:40,579 --> 00:19:42,771
But that's what we do anyway.

284
00:19:42,771 --> 00:19:47,790
So she she is a very strong person.

285
00:19:47,790 --> 00:19:49,744
She knows what she wants.

286
00:19:49,885 --> 00:19:52,726
And when she split from Tommy,

287
00:19:53,286 --> 00:19:59,108
Even though I was Walter's guy, she kept me and I appreciated that.

288
00:19:59,209 --> 00:20:02,470
And her and Walter had differences at times.

289
00:20:03,190 --> 00:20:08,092
And that was sad because I think they made amazing music together.

290
00:20:08,092 --> 00:20:15,915
mean, some of the stuff he wrote with her is just iconic and vanishing, you know, which is
not a big hit.

291
00:20:19,157 --> 00:20:22,178
So many wonderful, wonderful songs together.

292
00:20:23,116 --> 00:20:25,228
I wish they could heal that.

293
00:20:25,228 --> 00:20:36,017
anyway, so Walter brought me in, but then Walter and her, her head of falling out, but
Mariah and I connected and she's been loyal to me for almost 30 years now.

294
00:20:36,017 --> 00:20:37,037
Started with her in 96.

295
00:20:37,037 --> 00:20:43,482
So, and she's had her ups and downs.

296
00:20:44,503 --> 00:20:47,486
but she's always been really, really good to me.

297
00:20:47,486 --> 00:20:49,568
And, I love, I love the woman.

298
00:20:49,568 --> 00:20:50,948
do, I do.

299
00:20:51,309 --> 00:20:53,100
There are times, you know,

300
00:20:53,196 --> 00:21:03,210
When she has moments when she had this other manager named Stella, that was a nightmare
where she would show up late hour and a half late to start the show.

301
00:21:03,210 --> 00:21:06,652
And that's, that's hard, but that person is gone.

302
00:21:06,652 --> 00:21:07,762
That Mariah is gone.

303
00:21:07,762 --> 00:21:09,493
She's on time now.

304
00:21:09,713 --> 00:21:10,633
She works hard.

305
00:21:10,633 --> 00:21:12,014
She rehearses.

306
00:21:12,014 --> 00:21:15,595
She knows where everybody's supposed to be, what everybody's doing.

307
00:21:15,595 --> 00:21:19,737
She, you know, it's, it's a true pleasure working with her now.

308
00:21:19,837 --> 00:21:20,237
Yeah.

309
00:21:20,237 --> 00:21:21,938
So it sounds like it.

310
00:21:22,220 --> 00:21:28,061
Mike, just for the sake of those, when you say you were doing playback for I'm pretty sure
I understand what you mean by there.

311
00:21:28,061 --> 00:21:31,264
And obviously the scope of Mariah's production is incredible.

312
00:21:31,264 --> 00:21:36,736
So tell us over the years how your role evolved as far as playback and what you actually
did at gigs.

313
00:21:38,057 --> 00:21:50,181
playback these days, when I push play, I'm sending time code that goes to audio, video,
lights.

314
00:21:51,372 --> 00:21:52,963
and anybody else that needs it.

315
00:21:52,963 --> 00:21:59,066
Sometimes set moves happen by time code and it's lot of it's automated.

316
00:21:59,265 --> 00:22:01,908
A lot of it, they just watch the numbers and they go with it.

317
00:22:01,908 --> 00:22:05,269
But it's, I'm kind of like an air traffic controller.

318
00:22:06,590 --> 00:22:19,358
Except nobody gets hurt if, well, they could if just stage moves don't happen, But
basically it's not just the extra audio parts.

319
00:22:19,358 --> 00:22:20,610
It's not just

320
00:22:20,610 --> 00:22:33,113
the click track and the obvious enhancements that we playback guys do these days that
nobody's allowed to talk about in complete detail.

321
00:22:34,814 --> 00:22:36,554
people want to see a show.

322
00:22:36,694 --> 00:22:37,855
They want to go see a show.

323
00:22:37,855 --> 00:22:44,837
When they go see Roger Waters, the video has to be precisely in sync with the music.

324
00:22:44,837 --> 00:22:46,797
And the music has to move.

325
00:22:46,797 --> 00:22:48,458
It can't be at one tempo.

326
00:22:48,458 --> 00:22:49,474
It has to...

327
00:22:49,474 --> 00:22:51,285
breathe like the original music did.

328
00:22:51,285 --> 00:22:59,368
And that is some fucking sorcery right there, making that happen and having a band that
can play with that.

329
00:22:59,368 --> 00:23:12,754
And then if something goes wrong, having a band, cause the hardest thing I do as a
playback guy is when it's like, let's say on, on money, one night Roger decided to put a

330
00:23:12,754 --> 00:23:15,535
bar six four instead of, instead of a bar of seven four.

331
00:23:15,535 --> 00:23:17,396
So he came in a beat early.

332
00:23:18,188 --> 00:23:19,908
And everybody followed him as they should.

333
00:23:19,908 --> 00:23:21,179
It's his fucking show.

334
00:23:21,179 --> 00:23:23,560
Whatever he does, it's right.

335
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:30,361
So I had two bars to punch in the entire computer rig and all the visuals.

336
00:23:32,362 --> 00:23:43,025
Because it's because money, if you listen to the record, it speeds up, it speeds up and it
there's I literally have like seconds to fix it.

337
00:23:43,025 --> 00:23:44,858
And then the rest of the show is running in.

338
00:23:44,858 --> 00:23:46,796
You know, it just runs because it's.

339
00:23:47,502 --> 00:23:55,502
Uh, with it, with the Pink Floyd show, Roger water show, once you hit play, it just runs
for like 45 minutes.

340
00:23:55,502 --> 00:23:57,502
Cause it's just, it's a whole story.

341
00:23:57,502 --> 00:23:59,422
It's a, it's a, it's the wizard of Oz.

342
00:23:59,422 --> 00:24:00,402
I'm just kidding.

343
00:24:00,402 --> 00:24:01,922
It's not the wizard of Oz.

344
00:24:01,922 --> 00:24:05,342
Nobody's nobody's believes that shit anyway.

345
00:24:05,402 --> 00:24:11,882
So, but, so yeah, uh, playback is not just playing back the additional parts.

346
00:24:11,882 --> 00:24:16,102
Playback now is a technical.

347
00:24:16,558 --> 00:24:26,178
air traffic controller situation where you, every other department, sometimes even the
people on stage, I'm changing programs for them.

348
00:24:26,178 --> 00:24:31,858
I'm sending midi clock to their effects unit so everybody stays in sync.

349
00:24:32,238 --> 00:24:34,038
And it's all for the people.

350
00:24:34,038 --> 00:24:42,658
It's also, they get to see and hear what they, you know, they're paying $500 a ticket.

351
00:24:42,658 --> 00:24:46,298
know, they want to see a spectacular show.

352
00:24:46,312 --> 00:24:56,886
And so, and it's, all, it's all centralized, sadly around everybody works does all their
shit.

353
00:24:57,467 --> 00:25:01,188
But I, when I start my shit, all their shit starts.

354
00:25:01,229 --> 00:25:04,890
So if my shit's fucked up, it's dead.

355
00:25:04,890 --> 00:25:05,380
It's dead.

356
00:25:05,380 --> 00:25:06,361
It's a quiet room.

357
00:25:06,361 --> 00:25:10,793
You know, it's not good, but you know, so you just can't screw up.

358
00:25:10,793 --> 00:25:13,313
You just keep it simple and you,

359
00:25:15,246 --> 00:25:18,466
work with everybody, make sure everybody communicates.

360
00:25:18,466 --> 00:25:20,006
So I hope that made sense.

361
00:25:20,626 --> 00:25:22,446
And I know it absolutely makes sense.

362
00:25:22,446 --> 00:25:24,906
And you've raised a really critical point.

363
00:25:24,906 --> 00:25:28,486
This shows you how you engender discussion.

364
00:25:28,486 --> 00:25:32,386
I hadn't thought about covering, but you mentioned about the spectacle of the shows.

365
00:25:32,386 --> 00:25:35,206
And I'm definitely not talking specifically about Roger and Ryan.

366
00:25:35,206 --> 00:25:38,166
We're going to talk about Madonna and you two and all sorts of stuff.

367
00:25:38,166 --> 00:25:41,546
But these shows, as you said, are mega spectacular.

368
00:25:42,496 --> 00:25:53,576
I know there is some criticism about the use of playback and vocal enhancements and I know
there's some great YouTube channels out here that they're devoted to just picking apart

369
00:25:53,576 --> 00:25:54,477
that stuff.

370
00:25:54,477 --> 00:26:02,034
Taylor Swift, it appears in some songs, is miming because of the physicality of what she
needs to do.

371
00:26:02,034 --> 00:26:04,326
It's a bit of a, can't have your cake and eat it too.

372
00:26:04,326 --> 00:26:08,302
You can't expect a mega spectacular show.

373
00:26:08,302 --> 00:26:14,682
and a singer to deliver note perfect and the band to be able to deliver everything 100 %
live on stage.

374
00:26:14,682 --> 00:26:16,622
Yep, that's correct.

375
00:26:16,622 --> 00:26:19,022
mean, how do I put this?

376
00:26:19,022 --> 00:26:27,922
For example, even a band like The Who, I worked with them and they did some tours in 2022
with an orchestra.

377
00:26:28,002 --> 00:26:31,122
But in each city, it was a different orchestra.

378
00:26:32,842 --> 00:26:37,290
you know, some cities were better than others and some cities

379
00:26:37,290 --> 00:26:39,912
It was like, yo, turn that shit off.

380
00:26:40,793 --> 00:26:45,376
So it was coming from me, the pre-recorded orchestral thing to a click.

381
00:26:45,376 --> 00:26:47,518
And that shit's moving all over the place.

382
00:26:47,518 --> 00:26:52,601
I that's the, mean, cause we didn't, we didn't just sit it.

383
00:26:52,702 --> 00:26:54,663
You can't do, won't get fooled again.

384
00:26:54,663 --> 00:26:56,284
You know, just leave it at one tempo.

385
00:26:56,284 --> 00:27:00,527
It just doesn't work, you know, and you can't have the Tommy stuff.

386
00:27:00,888 --> 00:27:03,330
It moves, it breathes.

387
00:27:03,330 --> 00:27:04,230
So

388
00:27:05,836 --> 00:27:08,437
You know, again, people want to hear the orchestra.

389
00:27:08,437 --> 00:27:13,809
They want to see the spectacle and they want to see their people dancing on stage too.

390
00:27:13,946 --> 00:27:15,360
Everybody used to get mad at Madonna.

391
00:27:15,360 --> 00:27:18,648
Madonna sang everything she possibly could.

392
00:27:18,648 --> 00:27:21,442
The only thing she didn't sing, and this is not a secret.

393
00:27:21,442 --> 00:27:23,593
I'm not giving anything away here.

394
00:27:23,974 --> 00:27:27,555
She's dancing up there running around like a crazy person.

395
00:27:28,495 --> 00:27:35,118
Do you want to hear her go, no, no, you want to, you want to hear what you want to hear.

396
00:27:35,294 --> 00:27:41,257
and you want to see a spectacular show with all the visuals perfectly in sync.

397
00:27:41,257 --> 00:27:47,601
Dude, it doesn't happen unless you play to a click and you have the enhancements.

398
00:27:48,081 --> 00:27:51,803
Movies are not made in one shot.

399
00:27:51,803 --> 00:27:52,664
They fix it.

400
00:27:52,664 --> 00:27:55,545
And then they put it on the green screen and they do all this crazy shit.

401
00:27:55,545 --> 00:27:56,646
I'm sorry.

402
00:27:56,646 --> 00:27:57,927
You want to be entertained.

403
00:27:57,927 --> 00:28:00,268
You want to see what you want to see.

404
00:28:00,268 --> 00:28:04,046
You don't want to go, that would have been cool if they had just, you know.

405
00:28:04,046 --> 00:28:04,746
played it right?

406
00:28:04,746 --> 00:28:06,527
No, no, no.

407
00:28:06,527 --> 00:28:15,930
Now, I mean, is it nobody I work for just lip syncs, you know, that's, that's, that's
stupid.

408
00:28:15,930 --> 00:28:28,434
There are times when you have vocal enhancement, you know, when it's needed, but anyway,
yeah, I understand.

409
00:28:28,434 --> 00:28:30,014
It's a hard topic and also

410
00:28:30,092 --> 00:28:36,315
That's why I was very careful not to mention specific artists, because I know it varies
across artists and there's lots of contention around it.

411
00:28:36,315 --> 00:28:37,395
So totally get it.

412
00:28:37,395 --> 00:28:38,866
But couldn't agree with your point more.

413
00:28:38,866 --> 00:28:41,466
I think it's a really important point.

414
00:28:42,587 --> 00:28:47,319
You mentioned Mariah in the true positive sense of the word is a diva.

415
00:28:47,319 --> 00:28:53,221
And you'd already had six years of some involvement with Madonna prior to Mariah.

416
00:28:53,221 --> 00:28:59,054
So I mean, I imagine she's another band leader, creative leader that knows what she wants.

417
00:28:59,054 --> 00:28:59,854
So was that?

418
00:28:59,854 --> 00:29:02,574
Um, what did you learn there?

419
00:29:02,574 --> 00:29:08,334
And, um, sort of, worked with her between 1990 and 2004, which is an eternity in tech
terms.

420
00:29:08,334 --> 00:29:10,954
So how did the show evolve over that time?

421
00:29:11,714 --> 00:29:24,074
Uh, listen, she was always, she was another one that, uh, there, there was moments where
she would walk in and it was like, somebody's getting fucking fired today.

422
00:29:24,074 --> 00:29:28,994
Cause she was in a bad mood and it didn't, it just, just, just.

423
00:29:29,006 --> 00:29:29,906
And that's fine.

424
00:29:29,906 --> 00:29:30,486
It's her show.

425
00:29:30,486 --> 00:29:32,066
She can do her thing.

426
00:29:32,926 --> 00:29:35,586
But, yeah, one story.

427
00:29:36,486 --> 00:29:46,786
Last rehearsal, I think for Blonde Ambition, she walked in and she decided the guitar
player was getting fired.

428
00:29:46,786 --> 00:29:54,546
I don't want to say his name because he's a lovely guy, amazing guitar player, but he, we
would do four run throughs a day.

429
00:29:55,106 --> 00:29:57,286
And he, you know, his back hurt.

430
00:29:57,286 --> 00:29:58,926
So he was sitting on a stool.

431
00:29:59,368 --> 00:30:02,859
And she was dancing all four run throughs and that's like it.

432
00:30:03,100 --> 00:30:04,140
He's fired.

433
00:30:04,140 --> 00:30:07,451
So, just like that.

434
00:30:07,451 --> 00:30:10,553
It's like, yeah, but he plays a lot of cool stuff that we're not going to, I don't care.

435
00:30:10,553 --> 00:30:10,933
Fuck it.

436
00:30:10,933 --> 00:30:11,703
He's gone.

437
00:30:11,703 --> 00:30:13,514
And that was that, you know?

438
00:30:13,514 --> 00:30:18,376
And so, but anyway, she, she also knows what she wants.

439
00:30:18,376 --> 00:30:27,570
And she was the worst thing about her, which is the best thing is that I would, I would
literally have a cut by my computer rig because I couldn't go home.

440
00:30:27,570 --> 00:30:28,686
I couldn't sleep.

441
00:30:28,686 --> 00:30:33,326
except a few hours on the cot and I'd get up and I'd get to work.

442
00:30:33,326 --> 00:30:37,806
She was always the first one there and she was always the last one to leave.

443
00:30:39,326 --> 00:30:49,106
anytime anybody works that hard, I will take immeasurable amounts of shit from them
because they're willing to show up.

444
00:30:49,106 --> 00:30:54,506
The ones that just bitch about it and don't show up can fuck right off.

445
00:30:55,426 --> 00:30:57,798
She's got work ethic.

446
00:30:57,838 --> 00:30:59,358
And I'm a big, I'm a big.

447
00:30:59,358 --> 00:31:05,978
Just on that Mike, so you're saying for rehearsals and I'm not sure how long rehearsals
were before each tour, but four run throughs a day.

448
00:31:05,978 --> 00:31:07,258
That's incredible.

449
00:31:07,678 --> 00:31:10,778
Well, that's, that's the production run throughs once, once you're there.

450
00:31:10,778 --> 00:31:20,958
mean, she, back in the day with Madonna, the way it worked is we always did more shows in
rehearsals than we ever did on the road.

451
00:31:21,178 --> 00:31:26,698
You know, the sound checks were longer than the shows once we were on the road.

452
00:31:30,343 --> 00:31:34,865
It's painful, know, and but when I was there, she was on time.

453
00:31:34,865 --> 00:31:43,099
Now, once I left in 2005 ish, then she got the reputation for showing up hours and hours
late.

454
00:31:43,099 --> 00:31:49,442
So I'm I'm not going to say it's because I wasn't around, but, I'm going to start that
one.

455
00:31:49,442 --> 00:31:51,473
Yeah.

456
00:31:53,326 --> 00:32:00,366
And technologically, I mean, it was, I imagine, again, doing playback, but also a fairly
complex show.

457
00:32:00,366 --> 00:32:02,866
mean, there's so much diversity in music.

458
00:32:02,866 --> 00:32:13,426
Listen, 1990, like I said, I was doing it with eight eight meg samplers, eight meg
samplers and four playing, four loading.

459
00:32:14,026 --> 00:32:21,286
And if anything goes, and it's the 44 megs, like with cartridges, it's like I was making
fire with two rocks with wet wood.

460
00:32:21,286 --> 00:32:22,510
You know, it was like

461
00:32:22,510 --> 00:32:24,330
the fuck am I doing?

462
00:32:24,570 --> 00:32:26,050
And, but I did it.

463
00:32:26,050 --> 00:32:32,450
And then 1993 with her, had a Mac two CI and I had a cup.

464
00:32:32,450 --> 00:32:38,670
had three or four, a Kai 32 Meg samplers, know, it's like, Ooh, look at me go, you know,
I'm rocking.

465
00:32:38,670 --> 00:32:40,950
And it wasn't any of that side quest shit.

466
00:32:40,950 --> 00:32:44,030
was, you know, just regular hard drives.

467
00:32:46,130 --> 00:32:47,070
Man.

468
00:32:47,310 --> 00:32:48,830
You know, it's a show.

469
00:32:48,830 --> 00:32:49,410
Mike.

470
00:32:49,410 --> 00:32:55,670
mean, the reality of that is, you, if not physically sweating, you're, literally working
your ass off.

471
00:32:55,670 --> 00:32:59,650
Oh, and I was playing, you know, I was playing keyboards underneath the stage too.

472
00:32:59,650 --> 00:33:01,230
Well, it's while that shit's going on.

473
00:33:01,230 --> 00:33:05,670
So it's like, I mean, the parts I was covering were parts I was covering.

474
00:33:05,810 --> 00:33:12,390
Actually, I played since bass in 2001 on a couple of songs and I played solos on stuff.

475
00:33:12,390 --> 00:33:16,510
And so my parts were integral, but I wasn't on the stage.

476
00:33:16,966 --> 00:33:30,462
So there was a moment with Mariah in around 2000 or so where I was the MD and which all
that all that really meant was that Mariah wanted to talk to me and I talked to the band.

477
00:33:30,462 --> 00:33:32,853
She didn't want to talk to anybody in band.

478
00:33:32,853 --> 00:33:39,936
So and I would tell the guys, listen, chill on the parts, play the songs like the record.

479
00:33:40,256 --> 00:33:41,677
It's her fucking show.

480
00:33:41,677 --> 00:33:42,677
Come on.

481
00:33:42,857 --> 00:33:43,418
All right.

482
00:33:43,418 --> 00:33:45,158
You know, so.

483
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:47,971
Yeah, that's fair.

484
00:33:48,491 --> 00:33:54,014
And the other, so just briefly, let's explore the under stage thing, because I know,
again, it's common, it's not unusual.

485
00:33:54,014 --> 00:34:01,138
I know on your biography, you mentioned you did a bit of work for you to including four
shows on the tour.

486
00:34:01,138 --> 00:34:03,409
So I'm going back 20 years by self.

487
00:34:03,409 --> 00:34:11,404
I know I used to correspond with Terry Lawless, who was the guy underneath the stage that
did a lot of work for you to for I think about 30, 35 years.

488
00:34:11,404 --> 00:34:15,853
So just tell us how you got involved on that side of things.

489
00:34:15,853 --> 00:34:21,793
Well, what happened with with you too is they called me and they said, you know, would you
like to do the gig?

490
00:34:21,793 --> 00:34:23,333
And I said, yeah, hell yeah.

491
00:34:23,333 --> 00:34:26,773
So then I called Madonna's people and it was 2000.

492
00:34:26,773 --> 00:34:28,833
I said, so are we touring?

493
00:34:28,833 --> 00:34:30,293
And they said, no, absolutely not.

494
00:34:30,293 --> 00:34:30,733
No problem.

495
00:34:30,733 --> 00:34:31,893
I said, great.

496
00:34:31,893 --> 00:34:35,933
So I showed up and they asked me to play keyboards.

497
00:34:35,933 --> 00:34:37,733
So I'm playing keyboards with you too.

498
00:34:37,733 --> 00:34:39,593
was like, oh my God, I can't believe it.

499
00:34:39,593 --> 00:34:41,693
I mean, I did the club dates.

500
00:34:41,693 --> 00:34:43,793
I played on stage with them way in the back.

501
00:34:43,793 --> 00:34:45,350
You know, I mean, I was

502
00:34:45,580 --> 00:34:48,011
You know, I was not the fifth Beatle.

503
00:34:48,011 --> 00:34:50,191
It was just way in the back.

504
00:34:50,291 --> 00:34:59,014
then about six weeks in the rehearsal, Madonna's people call me and go, you got to come
back.

505
00:34:59,014 --> 00:35:00,334
She's going to go out.

506
00:35:00,334 --> 00:35:02,235
And I went, I'm not coming back.

507
00:35:02,235 --> 00:35:03,515
Hung up the phone.

508
00:35:03,915 --> 00:35:04,725
They call me back.

509
00:35:04,725 --> 00:35:05,565
You got to come back.

510
00:35:05,565 --> 00:35:09,256
I said, man, you know, listen, all right, this is what I want.

511
00:35:09,256 --> 00:35:12,657
And I asked for some astronomical amount of money.

512
00:35:12,657 --> 00:35:15,348
And I said, and I want you to put it in my account.

513
00:35:15,884 --> 00:35:23,578
wire it tomorrow in advance, and I want you to fly Terry Lawless out and you're going to
pay for Terry for me to train him.

514
00:35:24,139 --> 00:35:29,281
And it's not going to cost you to a cent to make this change.

515
00:35:30,022 --> 00:35:37,866
you know, brought Terry in and I said, and I left my gear with Terry so he could, so it be
a smooth transition.

516
00:35:38,486 --> 00:35:42,549
their production manager, Jake Berry said, Mike, that's fine.

517
00:35:42,549 --> 00:35:43,539
Everything would be great.

518
00:35:43,539 --> 00:35:44,310
It's wonderful.

519
00:35:44,310 --> 00:35:45,578
It's, it's, it's.

520
00:35:45,578 --> 00:35:47,578
no hard feelings, it'd be wonderful.

521
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:54,030
So I'm in Miami doing the last show and Bono calls me back to the dressing room and I'm
thinking, okay, cool.

522
00:35:54,030 --> 00:35:59,692
He's gonna give me a big hug and he's gonna tell me thank you and he pulls me back there.

523
00:35:59,692 --> 00:36:08,994
Remember when you were a kid and your dad would just look at you and say, I'm so
disappointed in you young man and you just feel like you're gonna cry and you can't even

524
00:36:08,994 --> 00:36:09,985
breathe?

525
00:36:09,985 --> 00:36:12,785
He did that to me for about 20 minutes.

526
00:36:13,466 --> 00:36:14,366
Yeah.

527
00:36:14,998 --> 00:36:22,204
rushed and I walked out of the room and Larry Mowans, the drummer, walked past me and he
looked at me like he was going to kick my ass.

528
00:36:22,364 --> 00:36:28,599
And it was like, and, but, but what Bono said, said, you know, this, this is personal.

529
00:36:28,599 --> 00:36:29,340
We're Irish.

530
00:36:29,340 --> 00:36:29,700
Okay.

531
00:36:29,700 --> 00:36:38,418
We're this is imagine your wife shows up and says, listen, I'm leaving you, but I taught
this bird all the moves you like.

532
00:36:38,418 --> 00:36:39,118
It'll be fine.

533
00:36:39,118 --> 00:36:40,239
It'd be great.

534
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:42,922
You know, we, take this personally, Mike.

535
00:36:42,922 --> 00:36:43,902
And I went,

536
00:36:44,540 --> 00:36:45,130
my God.

537
00:36:45,130 --> 00:36:46,851
You know, I hadn't thought of it.

538
00:36:46,851 --> 00:36:56,337
And then I went to see a show in LA and I was, I was thinking I'd be able to go back and
say, Hey guys, everything's working great.

539
00:36:56,337 --> 00:36:57,017
We're all good.

540
00:36:57,017 --> 00:36:58,208
We're all buddies and pals.

541
00:36:58,208 --> 00:37:01,180
And I was told, no, you are not allowed backstage.

542
00:37:01,180 --> 00:37:02,911
If they see you, will kick your ass.

543
00:37:02,911 --> 00:37:05,210
And I'm going, wow.

544
00:37:05,210 --> 00:37:12,256
You know, so yeah, I, I, if all my regrets in all my careers, all the stuff I've done,

545
00:37:12,558 --> 00:37:14,638
I really, really regret.

546
00:37:14,638 --> 00:37:15,978
I should have never left you two.

547
00:37:15,978 --> 00:37:16,838
I should have stayed.

548
00:37:16,838 --> 00:37:17,358
I should have stayed.

549
00:37:17,358 --> 00:37:19,178
It was the wrong thing to do.

550
00:37:19,418 --> 00:37:24,178
And I should not listen to Jake Berry and I should have done the right thing.

551
00:37:24,398 --> 00:37:35,518
So, excuse my ignorance too, Mike, I'd assumed falsely that Terry had already been there
and you, you'd come in to cover some spots, but you say you'd literally introduce you to

552
00:37:35,518 --> 00:37:36,078
Terry.

553
00:37:36,078 --> 00:37:42,328
yeah, yeah, I, I brought Terry on and he was at first they didn't like Terry and, but

554
00:37:42,328 --> 00:37:46,618
Terry's great and he stepped into it and he's killing it now.

555
00:37:46,618 --> 00:37:48,102
He's doing a great job.

556
00:37:48,202 --> 00:37:49,363
I could be totally wrong.

557
00:37:49,363 --> 00:37:49,974
This might be good.

558
00:37:49,974 --> 00:37:52,665
So I thought he'd retired, but maybe he hasn't.

559
00:37:54,167 --> 00:37:56,488
Well, I'm not sure if U2's retired.

560
00:37:57,449 --> 00:37:58,500
Well, that's hard to know.

561
00:37:58,500 --> 00:37:59,120
Yeah, true.

562
00:37:59,120 --> 00:37:59,671
Yeah.

563
00:37:59,671 --> 00:38:03,904
mean, they haven't done anything since this sphere, right?

564
00:38:03,904 --> 00:38:04,354
Yeah.

565
00:38:04,354 --> 00:38:07,436
No, thank you for that.

566
00:38:07,436 --> 00:38:09,257
That's amazing insights.

567
00:38:10,744 --> 00:38:16,717
Well, probably one last question on you two again, technologically they have some amazing
keyboard parts.

568
00:38:16,717 --> 00:38:21,940
They obviously do some playback and live keyboards underneath the stage.

569
00:38:21,940 --> 00:38:26,222
Anything new you learned the way they worked versus previous gigs?

570
00:38:26,222 --> 00:38:35,948
Well, the thing about you two is that they had like almost a couple of background vocals,
but there wasn't a lot of vocal stuff going on.

571
00:38:35,948 --> 00:38:40,670
There was mainly the click so that all the visuals would be right.

572
00:38:40,672 --> 00:38:43,643
Again, that's the rub.

573
00:38:43,643 --> 00:38:44,263
That's the rub.

574
00:38:44,263 --> 00:38:54,216
If you want to see the visuals the way YouTube wants you to see the visuals, and it's
really important with their show, it's got to be to a click.

575
00:38:54,216 --> 00:38:55,486
There's got to be time code.

576
00:38:55,486 --> 00:38:58,767
And it's a science project.

577
00:38:58,767 --> 00:39:00,868
So that's just the way it is.

578
00:39:01,368 --> 00:39:03,188
Yeah, absolutely.

579
00:39:03,188 --> 00:39:08,652
And I thought the last one before I ask you to identify some of your favorite gigs, a guy
that tends to

580
00:39:08,652 --> 00:39:11,743
really sit back and not have a creative vision is Roger Waters.

581
00:39:11,743 --> 00:39:20,627
So tell us what, tell us, tell us, I mean, you've worked with Roger, you know, three tours
between 2010 and 2023.

582
00:39:20,627 --> 00:39:23,809
He's obviously not backwards in coming forward.

583
00:39:23,809 --> 00:39:25,830
Again, what you learned there in your approach.

584
00:39:25,830 --> 00:39:32,553
And I was lucky enough to see the Us and Them show in Sydney where, so I assume you were
there doing your job.

585
00:39:32,553 --> 00:39:34,143
It was, it was absolutely stunning.

586
00:39:34,143 --> 00:39:35,704
Amazing, amazing show.

587
00:39:35,704 --> 00:39:38,655
So you tell us about what you learned throughout those years.

588
00:39:38,655 --> 00:39:51,261
Well, the first thing I was told when I was hired to do the wall with Roger is his front
of house guy, Tripp, Tripp, Caleb said he basically told me just don't ever lie to him.

589
00:39:51,261 --> 00:40:01,635
This if Roger asks you how long it's going to take to fix something, tell him five minutes
more than it's going to take, you know, and then get it done quicker.

590
00:40:01,635 --> 00:40:04,316
But don't ever lie to him.

591
00:40:04,638 --> 00:40:08,220
And just, don't bullshit them.

592
00:40:08,220 --> 00:40:17,984
And again, it's, it's, it's such common sense, but somebody, see so many guys that are
doing this out here that just step on it, step in it.

593
00:40:17,984 --> 00:40:26,727
And, and, anyway, so Roger, he is the hardest working literally man in show business.

594
00:40:26,727 --> 00:40:29,988
He's there every second of the day.

595
00:40:30,309 --> 00:40:33,030
he, he's all over them with the lights.

596
00:40:33,030 --> 00:40:34,252
He has a vision.

597
00:40:34,252 --> 00:40:36,362
He knows exactly what he wants.

598
00:40:36,483 --> 00:40:52,867
He makes me do these insane vocal cues in his ears telling him what part is coming next
that I just, I can't even fathom how he, how he gets on with it, but it works.

599
00:40:52,867 --> 00:41:01,449
then, now he's listened and he couldn't be an, he couldn't be a nicer man and he couldn't
be a more lovely human being.

600
00:41:01,449 --> 00:41:04,042
during COVID he took care of

601
00:41:04,042 --> 00:41:07,985
most of the crew for most of that whole time.

602
00:41:07,985 --> 00:41:11,627
And that's a lot of people I worked for didn't.

603
00:41:11,627 --> 00:41:16,129
So that was that was unexpected and appreciated.

604
00:41:16,770 --> 00:41:19,322
And he's he's a lovely man.

605
00:41:19,322 --> 00:41:25,506
He he has some political things in his head that I don't always agree with.

606
00:41:25,506 --> 00:41:26,597
But you know what?

607
00:41:26,597 --> 00:41:27,717
We're not going there.

608
00:41:27,717 --> 00:41:28,577
So.

609
00:41:29,132 --> 00:41:33,645
And what I love about him too is that he will engage in those political debates
respectively.

610
00:41:33,645 --> 00:41:36,957
He'll do it forcefully, but he would do it respectively, which I admire.

611
00:41:36,957 --> 00:41:37,368
Yeah.

612
00:41:37,368 --> 00:41:37,788
Yep.

613
00:41:37,788 --> 00:41:38,118
Yep.

614
00:41:38,118 --> 00:41:39,248
Absolutely.

615
00:41:39,349 --> 00:41:41,680
No, I, he's, he's my favorite.

616
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:43,972
And if you were wondering, I mean, I, I love the man.

617
00:41:43,972 --> 00:41:53,779
He's, no, I mean, he's, he's, he's spectacular, man, spectacular artist.

618
00:41:53,779 --> 00:41:57,341
And he has a vision and he's hard.

619
00:41:57,341 --> 00:41:58,860
He's hard, but.

620
00:41:58,860 --> 00:41:59,931
He's fair.

621
00:41:59,931 --> 00:42:01,713
So anybody's hard and fair.

622
00:42:01,713 --> 00:42:02,244
I'm cool.

623
00:42:02,244 --> 00:42:03,955
Absolutely.

624
00:42:03,955 --> 00:42:07,199
It's when you're lazy and don't show up and then you scream at people.

625
00:42:07,199 --> 00:42:17,850
And I won't mention any of those names, but you know, no, I have, I had run across and in
your huge list of credits, Mike, I'm interested aside from Roger.

626
00:42:17,850 --> 00:42:21,003
are some other tours that either for,

627
00:42:21,710 --> 00:42:31,170
you know, creative reasons or technical reasons, whatever it is that you, you found
enjoyable that may not be as well known or as obvious as the ones we've covered.

628
00:42:31,310 --> 00:42:43,350
Well, you know, the one that I really enjoyed and it was just a, I was just getting the
tour set up was, was Motley crew in 1995, the anywhere there's electricity tour.

629
00:42:43,350 --> 00:42:45,230
This is when Vince Neil wasn't there.

630
00:42:45,230 --> 00:42:49,010
The other guy was singing and it was great fucking songs.

631
00:42:49,010 --> 00:42:50,130
It was amazing.

632
00:42:50,130 --> 00:42:51,480
And the, uh,

633
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:55,112
producer's name, something rock.

634
00:42:55,112 --> 00:43:03,690
Anyway, he would sit in there with an Alesis drum machine and he would just generate a
click to Tommy and he'd speed the song up and it felt like he'd slow it back down.

635
00:43:03,690 --> 00:43:06,618
And was very, very weird how he did it.

636
00:43:06,618 --> 00:43:10,780
And I had to recreate all that because they wanted, he had like 18 guitar parts.

637
00:43:10,780 --> 00:43:13,842
So they wanted some of the colors and flavors of that.

638
00:43:14,082 --> 00:43:21,366
And then Tommy wanted me to do his usual crazy sounds for his drum solo.

639
00:43:22,126 --> 00:43:29,326
That guy, that fucking guy, Tommy Lee is the best rock and roll drummer in the world ever.

640
00:43:29,586 --> 00:43:32,666
He's to a quick, he was insanely good.

641
00:43:32,666 --> 00:43:34,126
He was so good.

642
00:43:34,126 --> 00:43:37,166
And he's just a funny guy.

643
00:43:37,446 --> 00:43:38,426
Love the guy.

644
00:43:38,505 --> 00:43:38,926
you know.

645
00:43:38,926 --> 00:43:42,686
Motley Cruiser, yeah, it's not one I was expecting and it's a great one.

646
00:43:42,686 --> 00:43:43,746
yeah, still.

647
00:43:43,746 --> 00:43:48,406
Well, I think they're about to, they're giving it a go, which is amazing.

648
00:43:48,406 --> 00:43:49,976
Yeah, you know, it's...

649
00:43:49,976 --> 00:43:52,647
This is, and anywhere there's electricity, you know?

650
00:43:52,647 --> 00:43:59,270
Anyway, so just, I mean, Tommy's a force of nature, man.

651
00:43:59,270 --> 00:44:01,021
He's such a good drummer.

652
00:44:01,021 --> 00:44:03,391
He certainly is, no, absolutely.

653
00:44:03,552 --> 00:44:07,813
Mike, I've got a couple of viewer or listener questions.

654
00:44:07,813 --> 00:44:12,715
to our Patreon supporters, we let them know that we're gonna be talking to you today.

655
00:44:13,936 --> 00:44:19,362
some of them may be hard to answer as far as just trying to nail down a specific thing,
but.

656
00:44:19,362 --> 00:44:25,414
So the first one I've got is from Tammy in Canada who says, what is the most important
piece of equipment to you nowadays?

657
00:44:25,414 --> 00:44:31,707
If you're doing a tour or in recent tours, what can't you live without as far as a piece
of equipment that you need?

658
00:44:31,867 --> 00:44:32,727
boy.

659
00:44:33,148 --> 00:44:36,849
Well, clearly Mac oriented.

660
00:44:36,849 --> 00:44:40,410
So my computers, I can't do without them.

661
00:44:40,411 --> 00:44:43,091
Motu audio interfaces.

662
00:44:44,632 --> 00:44:48,750
I beat the hell out of them and they support me and they work great.

663
00:44:48,750 --> 00:44:52,370
So that's the two major things, really.

664
00:44:53,730 --> 00:45:02,750
I just got a new Mac Mini Pro 4 that I love, but it won't be going out on the road just
yet.

665
00:45:02,750 --> 00:45:06,790
I'm still the older M1, M2 Mac Minis.

666
00:45:06,910 --> 00:45:09,590
How amazing are those M4 Minis?

667
00:45:09,590 --> 00:45:10,430
just recently bought one.

668
00:45:10,430 --> 00:45:11,650
They're just stunning.

669
00:45:11,650 --> 00:45:13,050
Oh my God.

670
00:45:14,270 --> 00:45:18,650
I'm in the process of rebuilding the studio because

671
00:45:19,022 --> 00:45:20,573
It's a bit of a train wreck in here right now.

672
00:45:20,573 --> 00:45:34,313
yeah, I haven't really had a chance to push it, but I finally have a computer that's just
gonna sit here and I'll do my film scoring and sound editing and all that silly stuff and

673
00:45:34,313 --> 00:45:39,316
not have to bring in laptops and reconfigure and you know, so.

674
00:45:40,097 --> 00:45:42,238
But I have my laptops behind me.

675
00:45:42,399 --> 00:45:46,922
So when I need to work on them for tours, can still, everything's all networked and.

676
00:45:47,256 --> 00:45:54,032
That's a bit of a head scratcher, trying to figure out how to network everything and not
have the world explode.

677
00:45:54,032 --> 00:45:57,424
Yeah, that's right.

678
00:45:57,424 --> 00:45:58,695
Gosh.

679
00:45:58,695 --> 00:45:59,436
It's so hard.

680
00:45:59,436 --> 00:46:01,237
It's so hard for me to get my head around it.

681
00:46:01,237 --> 00:46:11,206
I mean, did MIDI from day one, but all this RTP shit and all this ethernet and all, God.

682
00:46:11,206 --> 00:46:17,330
I'm so afraid I'm going to route the wrong thing somewhere and the core of the earth is
going to just

683
00:46:17,390 --> 00:46:19,590
You so.

684
00:46:19,590 --> 00:46:21,449
I couldn't agree more, Mike.

685
00:46:21,449 --> 00:46:24,670
And so you partially answered, but I'll cover it with.

686
00:46:24,670 --> 00:46:29,850
So, uh, Dewey and Tammy both asked, basically, what is your pre tour regime?

687
00:46:29,850 --> 00:46:35,090
So what, what do you, you need to do to get ready before you even turn up to a production
rehearsal?

688
00:46:35,090 --> 00:46:44,070
Well, I always try to get at least two weeks in, uh, they'll send me the multi tracks for
the new record and I'll get things organized.

689
00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:53,827
And they'll talk to me about edits and talk to me about, want to do kind of a remix of
this song and we want to do a medley of these three or four together.

690
00:46:53,827 --> 00:46:59,822
So, start thinking about how, how you plan on doing that.

691
00:47:01,144 --> 00:47:04,366
talking to the drummers, you know, what kind of click tracks do you want to hear?

692
00:47:04,366 --> 00:47:07,348
What kind of cues are you comfortable with?

693
00:47:07,389 --> 00:47:12,263
how many outputs do we need for the, for an house guy to be comfortable?

694
00:47:12,263 --> 00:47:14,094
How many outputs?

695
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:23,033
you know, because then there's a whole series of outputs that the monitor guy has that the
front of the house guy doesn't have like all the clicks and cues and what does Mariah want

696
00:47:23,033 --> 00:47:24,093
to hear?

697
00:47:24,133 --> 00:47:26,514
What does she need me to say in the ears?

698
00:47:27,294 --> 00:47:35,597
I'm, God I'm not doing it a lot, but I've been learning how to do the teleprompter stuff,
very basic stuff.

699
00:47:35,597 --> 00:47:38,666
know, I don't want to, I don't, that's.

700
00:47:38,666 --> 00:47:40,047
not something I'm going to take on.

701
00:47:40,047 --> 00:47:40,848
That's a valid point.

702
00:47:40,848 --> 00:47:44,620
And also on the teleprompter thing, it's a bit like the spectacle show.

703
00:47:44,620 --> 00:47:50,626
Some people are critical of teleprompters, but I challenge anyone over the age of about
45.

704
00:47:50,715 --> 00:47:57,660
If you've got, you know, a catalog as big as artists like Springsteen and Roger Waters and
David.

705
00:47:57,660 --> 00:48:01,183
Yeah, it's, there's no way you're remembering all those lyrics.

706
00:48:01,183 --> 00:48:04,345
You mentioned, Mike, about your film composition.

707
00:48:04,345 --> 00:48:05,716
was keen to cover that as well.

708
00:48:05,716 --> 00:48:06,166
So

709
00:48:06,166 --> 00:48:08,927
I know you have some great writing and sound design credits.

710
00:48:08,927 --> 00:48:11,197
How did that develop over your career?

711
00:48:11,197 --> 00:48:13,788
So when did you first start getting into that?

712
00:48:13,788 --> 00:48:25,771
Well, like on these tours, the dancers typically have other careers because it's such a
short career when you're a dancer.

713
00:48:26,532 --> 00:48:32,813
And one of the dancers on Madonna is a really good actress, Don Noel.

714
00:48:32,813 --> 00:48:34,914
And she asked me to do her film.

715
00:48:35,014 --> 00:48:36,034
And then

716
00:48:36,408 --> 00:48:49,151
Her boyfriend, Roberto Sanchez, who's a big actor on Apple TV, he was the second guy
Dexter Youngman killed in the last, anyway, so I do films for him.

717
00:48:49,151 --> 00:48:54,963
you know, just nothing, You have to start somewhere.

718
00:48:54,963 --> 00:49:00,935
No one's gonna just throw you a major film score out of the block.

719
00:49:00,935 --> 00:49:06,186
You have to learn how to do it and you have to accept the fact that I'm not gonna get paid
anything for this.

720
00:49:06,808 --> 00:49:19,822
But you get the joy of creating it and you get the joy of working with somebody and their
vision, putting music to it, fixing the lyrics, I'm sorry, fixing the dialogue, which is

721
00:49:19,822 --> 00:49:24,453
that's another science project altogether these days to do it right.

722
00:49:24,453 --> 00:49:29,824
mean, you can just tell it to AI it and it, but it doesn't sound right.

723
00:49:29,884 --> 00:49:32,335
You know, this, this AI thing.

724
00:49:32,335 --> 00:49:33,485
I'm sorry.

725
00:49:33,745 --> 00:49:36,054
Every time AI tries to finish my thought,

726
00:49:36,054 --> 00:49:39,096
It's like, yo, no, no, sorry.

727
00:49:40,017 --> 00:49:40,838
It's not there.

728
00:49:40,838 --> 00:49:42,038
It's not there.

729
00:49:42,479 --> 00:49:44,800
no, anyway.

730
00:49:45,461 --> 00:49:46,051
That's great.

731
00:49:46,051 --> 00:49:48,063
just now that's good to know.

732
00:49:48,063 --> 00:49:54,848
I mean, that can only continue to grow that area that you're working in as far as sound
design and film composition.

733
00:49:54,848 --> 00:49:57,001
Just also just mentioning for our listeners sake.

734
00:49:57,001 --> 00:50:01,993
And I briefly alluded to this introduction as much as we've covered some depth there with
Mike.

735
00:50:01,993 --> 00:50:04,088
mean, I'm just going to rattle off some.

736
00:50:04,088 --> 00:50:11,822
to that we haven't even talked about, which is everyone from Don Henley, Lady Gaga, Selena
Gomez, Fleetwood Mac, Paula Rabbit, George Michael, Shakira.

737
00:50:11,822 --> 00:50:12,723
Springsteen.

738
00:50:12,723 --> 00:50:19,216
I've got to ask about Springsteen because I'm a Rabbit fan, What would I think you helped
with some setups there?

739
00:50:19,216 --> 00:50:25,290
And I know I spoke to David Rosensoll many years ago where he also helped, think, before
your.

740
00:50:25,290 --> 00:50:28,531
Well, actually, I brought I brought David in on that.

741
00:50:28,761 --> 00:50:29,762
there you go.

742
00:50:29,762 --> 00:50:29,942
OK.

743
00:50:29,942 --> 00:50:34,004
I was it was it was an album called The Rising.

744
00:50:34,426 --> 00:50:38,468
And we were doing a tour and then we're trying to modernize things a little bit.

745
00:50:38,669 --> 00:50:40,880
And the keyboard players were not happy about it.

746
00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:42,872
They did not want to do it.

747
00:50:42,872 --> 00:50:55,640
So there was a few samples that they had from the record, an Arabic guy singing some stuff
that the piano player's name is escaping me.

748
00:50:56,441 --> 00:50:57,522
Roy Beaton.

749
00:50:57,522 --> 00:50:58,402
Roy, Roy.

750
00:50:58,402 --> 00:50:58,793
Yep.

751
00:50:58,793 --> 00:51:03,886
Roy and Danny were going to have to play and Danny had nothing to do with Eve.

752
00:51:03,886 --> 00:51:05,287
He didn't want, you know, anything.

753
00:51:05,287 --> 00:51:06,347
That's fine.

754
00:51:06,347 --> 00:51:14,912
But Roy was cool with it, but he had a JL Cooper Synapse and he only got 99 presets for
MIDI on it.

755
00:51:15,012 --> 00:51:16,233
And he was at 99.

756
00:51:16,233 --> 00:51:18,366
So we were trying to figure out what are we going to do?

757
00:51:18,366 --> 00:51:19,655
And it's like, you know what?

758
00:51:19,655 --> 00:51:23,156
I got, I'm going to put David Rosenthal on that.

759
00:51:23,156 --> 00:51:27,589
And I brought David in grossly overqualified gross.

760
00:51:27,589 --> 00:51:29,660
mean, it was like, I looked at them.

761
00:51:29,660 --> 00:51:33,762
So, you know, this guy could play both your gigs in circles around you.

762
00:51:33,762 --> 00:51:36,704
But I didn't, kept my mouth shut.

763
00:51:37,125 --> 00:51:38,886
So Bruce would show up.

764
00:51:40,308 --> 00:51:52,418
If he said, rehearsal start at 11 a.m., he was there at 10.45, and I was ready for all
those samples to have to go down a half step or a whole step or a step and a half, he

765
00:51:52,418 --> 00:51:54,580
walked in and said, you know what?

766
00:51:54,580 --> 00:51:56,302
I'm gonna add up a whole step.

767
00:51:56,302 --> 00:51:58,324
And I'm going, wow, what?

768
00:51:58,324 --> 00:52:01,065
Because yeah, I need the energy, I need the.

769
00:52:01,312 --> 00:52:03,293
And I'm like, well, I'm not ready for that.

770
00:52:03,293 --> 00:52:03,854
Give me a second.

771
00:52:03,854 --> 00:52:05,766
know, I get a race.

772
00:52:05,766 --> 00:52:07,267
Like, wow, I didn't expect that.

773
00:52:07,267 --> 00:52:13,812
But he just, he's another guy that the work ethic is insane.

774
00:52:13,812 --> 00:52:17,969
And, and I thought, okay, these guys are going to have to play to a quick.

775
00:52:17,969 --> 00:52:20,417
They're going to have to, and they just refused.

776
00:52:20,678 --> 00:52:20,990
Nope.

777
00:52:20,990 --> 00:52:22,659
We're not playing to a quick.

778
00:52:22,700 --> 00:52:28,182
And I'm like, all right, well, I'm going to shut up and they'll figure it out.

779
00:52:28,182 --> 00:52:30,836
I'm getting paid whatever they want.

780
00:52:31,142 --> 00:52:32,643
And it worked.

781
00:52:32,643 --> 00:52:35,905
But no, he's, you know, he was great.

782
00:52:36,306 --> 00:52:39,408
and the reason I got that gig was George Travis.

783
00:52:39,488 --> 00:52:43,351
The tour manager was Madonna's tour manager.

784
00:52:43,351 --> 00:52:46,033
So see, that's, that's how all this connects.

785
00:52:46,033 --> 00:52:50,877
You know, you, I haven't sent out a resume hardly ever.

786
00:52:50,877 --> 00:52:53,689
If somebody asked for a resume, it's like, dude, come on, really?

787
00:52:53,689 --> 00:52:56,922
You know, so it's all word of mouth.

788
00:52:56,922 --> 00:52:58,012
That's right.

789
00:52:58,142 --> 00:53:00,994
And you didn't actually, did you go out on that tour, Mike?

790
00:53:00,994 --> 00:53:03,646
The Rising Tour was just really the setup for the tour.

791
00:53:03,646 --> 00:53:04,537
I just set it up.

792
00:53:04,537 --> 00:53:09,250
did the first show in Asbury Park.

793
00:53:09,250 --> 00:53:11,792
They did some, you know, city hall thing.

794
00:53:11,792 --> 00:53:12,522
was, it was cool.

795
00:53:12,522 --> 00:53:14,093
It was, was really cool.

796
00:53:14,093 --> 00:53:14,443
Yeah.

797
00:53:14,443 --> 00:53:21,578
No, just the only reason I ask is I saw that tour and there was the infamous incident in
Sydney where the electricity went out.

798
00:53:21,578 --> 00:53:23,500
the whole show, yeah.

799
00:53:23,500 --> 00:53:26,381
So, no, so I just wanted to interest in whether you were there or not.

800
00:53:26,442 --> 00:53:27,322
So.

801
00:53:27,322 --> 00:53:28,363
No, thank you for that.

802
00:53:28,363 --> 00:53:33,446
So yeah, just that was sort of a bit of a side trip just for our listeners just how
diverse Mike's career has been.

803
00:53:33,446 --> 00:53:40,129
But Mike, I wanted to jump in to also you did some work for Keyboard Magazine.

804
00:53:40,129 --> 00:53:46,813
Now all of our listeners and viewers, I don't think there's anyone out there that is not
aware of how iconic that magazine was for all of us.

805
00:53:47,233 --> 00:53:52,736
So it goes without saying why you got the gig there based on your experience, but how did
you find that?

806
00:53:52,736 --> 00:53:56,488
Did you find that a bit of a fun thing to do or a bit of a chore after a while?

807
00:53:56,560 --> 00:53:58,051
no, I, I, I enjoyed it.

808
00:53:58,051 --> 00:54:07,600
It's just that, because anytime somebody would ask me a question nine times out of 10, I
had no idea how to do it.

809
00:54:07,600 --> 00:54:09,000
So I had to learn.

810
00:54:09,261 --> 00:54:11,363
it's like, ask Mike.

811
00:54:11,363 --> 00:54:16,007
And I was like, and I'm an, don't know, but I'll figure it out and I'll get back to you.

812
00:54:16,007 --> 00:54:17,097
And it was good.

813
00:54:17,097 --> 00:54:17,928
It was good for me.

814
00:54:17,928 --> 00:54:24,534
So, and, no, it was, you know, I'm, I'm a, I'm an eighties guy.

815
00:54:24,534 --> 00:54:25,354
So.

816
00:54:25,806 --> 00:54:31,371
Keyboard magazine was hot shit in the 80s and it was so...

817
00:54:31,371 --> 00:54:34,252
mean, magazines were amazing.

818
00:54:34,473 --> 00:54:39,777
And when they asked me to write, I was like, yeah, hell yeah.

819
00:54:39,777 --> 00:54:40,458
Are you kidding?

820
00:54:40,458 --> 00:54:41,919
That's a bigger...

821
00:54:41,919 --> 00:54:45,132
I never got paid a cent for writing for them.

822
00:54:45,132 --> 00:54:45,866
I didn't care.

823
00:54:45,866 --> 00:54:48,024
I just, I was happy to do it.

824
00:54:50,246 --> 00:54:55,342
And sometimes you gotta do, well, I don't know, maybe not anymore.

825
00:54:55,342 --> 00:55:03,207
in this world, but in the eighties world, anything that you did that got you out there and
people heard your name was a good thing.

826
00:55:03,207 --> 00:55:05,869
And you didn't always get paid for it.

827
00:55:05,869 --> 00:55:07,970
And that was fun.

828
00:55:08,091 --> 00:55:10,092
So, No, absolutely.

829
00:55:10,092 --> 00:55:11,132
No, thank you.

830
00:55:11,132 --> 00:55:18,298
And also, as you've mentioned, you're refurbishing your studio, but it looks amazing to me
from here, but you do run your own studio.

831
00:55:18,298 --> 00:55:23,842
So that's obviously an ongoing concern and you just pick up work here and there between
tours and so on.

832
00:55:24,204 --> 00:55:33,457
Well, it's, I'm pretty much, I'm at the stage of my life where I just do what I want to do
when I want to do it.

833
00:55:33,457 --> 00:55:40,298
And I'm not really looking to find the next Taylor Swift or produce anybody or anything
that stuff.

834
00:55:42,459 --> 00:55:44,900
I just, I just like all these toys.

835
00:55:44,900 --> 00:55:53,612
got an OBX eight and a Prophet 10 and a, you know, a bunch of stage four back there,
Phantom seven, the X and

836
00:55:54,350 --> 00:56:00,155
stage three and a couple, anyway, just way too much shit, you know, just because I can,
you know, I enjoy it.

837
00:56:00,155 --> 00:56:01,696
It makes me feel good.

838
00:56:01,797 --> 00:56:06,761
But no, I'm not looking to, and I, I might play in a bar band.

839
00:56:06,761 --> 00:56:18,371
I don't know, you know, it can be fun, but God damn, it's a lot of work to learn all these
songs and to, I respect the guys that are there doing it and that are actually playing the

840
00:56:18,371 --> 00:56:21,974
right changes and doing their best with it and getting paid.

841
00:56:22,382 --> 00:56:24,562
Maybe $150 a night.

842
00:56:25,242 --> 00:56:27,162
God, it's depressing.

843
00:56:27,222 --> 00:56:29,482
It's but it's fun.

844
00:56:29,842 --> 00:56:31,162
So we'll see.

845
00:56:31,162 --> 00:56:32,242
I don't know what I'm doing.

846
00:56:32,242 --> 00:56:34,962
I keep thinking I'm going to retire.

847
00:56:34,962 --> 00:56:36,722
I'm going to just play.

848
00:56:36,822 --> 00:56:41,302
But as long as Roger is still out there, he's in his eighties and Mariah is still going.

849
00:56:41,302 --> 00:56:42,662
She's in her fifties.

850
00:56:43,182 --> 00:56:44,242
So I don't know.

851
00:56:44,242 --> 00:56:46,782
Maybe when they give up, I'll give up.

852
00:56:47,062 --> 00:56:48,402
I don't know.

853
00:56:48,590 --> 00:56:50,370
I love the idea of you in a bar band, Mike.

854
00:56:50,370 --> 00:56:52,130
I'm a bar band guy and you're right.

855
00:56:52,130 --> 00:56:55,090
It's a lot of hard work for not a lot of money, but it is good fun.

856
00:56:55,090 --> 00:56:56,150
You're absolutely right.

857
00:56:56,150 --> 00:56:56,490
Oh yeah.

858
00:56:56,490 --> 00:57:01,950
mean, I just, just learning all the parts, programming everything, you know, making it
happen.

859
00:57:01,950 --> 00:57:05,750
It's, it's, and then, oh, the singer comes and goes, Oh, I can't do it.

860
00:57:05,750 --> 00:57:06,450
And I keep you at it.

861
00:57:06,450 --> 00:57:07,570
You know, okay.

862
00:57:07,570 --> 00:57:13,090
It's, it's, it's a whole different skillset than it was back when I was playing in bar
bands in the eighties.

863
00:57:13,090 --> 00:57:15,270
It was, cause that's, that's all we did.

864
00:57:15,270 --> 00:57:17,430
You know, we just touring and learning.

865
00:57:17,582 --> 00:57:20,262
three or four songs a week, know, tops.

866
00:57:21,102 --> 00:57:25,522
anyway, it's just someone handing you a 60 song set list.

867
00:57:25,522 --> 00:57:27,222
It's like, whoa.

868
00:57:27,922 --> 00:57:32,122
Oh, and by the way, you're the keyboard player, so you gotta play the horn section on this
song too.

869
00:57:32,122 --> 00:57:34,782
you gotta, oh, okay.

870
00:57:34,922 --> 00:57:35,222
All right.

871
00:57:35,222 --> 00:57:37,142
Yep, I'm hearing you.

872
00:57:37,582 --> 00:57:42,262
I think you've covered this beautifully, Mike, but just in case you want to add anything
to it.

873
00:57:42,262 --> 00:57:44,854
So I was going to ask you what advice you'd give.

874
00:57:44,854 --> 00:57:48,516
aspiring musicians who are just starting out and trying to establish themselves in the
industry.

875
00:57:48,516 --> 00:57:51,838
I think you've covered that beautifully, but unless there's anything you wanted to add.

876
00:57:51,838 --> 00:57:56,921
No, I just, again, I just, whatever you do, give it your best.

877
00:57:56,921 --> 00:57:58,261
It's really that simple.

878
00:57:58,261 --> 00:58:05,825
You know, when you learn the song, even if you're in a bar band, nail the sound, nail the
part.

879
00:58:07,066 --> 00:58:13,089
and you know, just be a fun guy to be around, you know, and don't, don't be a whiner.

880
00:58:13,390 --> 00:58:14,550
don't be a wanker.

881
00:58:14,550 --> 00:58:16,291
You whatever they call it in Australia.

882
00:58:16,291 --> 00:58:17,012
don't know.

883
00:58:17,012 --> 00:58:21,904
But, you know, Absolutely.

884
00:58:21,904 --> 00:58:23,064
Thank you.

885
00:58:23,615 --> 00:58:30,780
and given the complexity of the role you do on tour, I can't imagine there hasn't been a
time where you've had a massive train wreck.

886
00:58:30,780 --> 00:58:37,903
we always ask our guests for an onstage train wreck that you can only look back and laugh
about now or otherwise.

887
00:58:39,204 --> 00:58:42,378
you know, the, hmm.

888
00:58:42,414 --> 00:58:45,214
Maybe I just erased them from my memory.

889
00:58:45,554 --> 00:58:57,554
the, uh, no, mean, most of the train wrecks are ones that I, the band comes in early and I
catch it or, you know, something.

890
00:58:58,014 --> 00:59:08,374
But I, yeah, there was, there was one on national TV where the manager asked me to make an
edit 30 seconds before airtime.

891
00:59:08,394 --> 00:59:09,994
And I went.

892
00:59:10,094 --> 00:59:11,374
I really don't want to do this.

893
00:59:11,374 --> 00:59:12,634
And he goes, well, you need to do it.

894
00:59:12,634 --> 00:59:14,174
And I did it.

895
00:59:14,834 --> 00:59:21,794
And I was thought I was shortening just the intro music and everything else would stay in
sync.

896
00:59:21,794 --> 00:59:27,994
And it turned out that I also shortened where the background vocals were coming in.

897
00:59:27,994 --> 00:59:32,094
So they came in at some awful place that made no sense.

898
00:59:32,094 --> 00:59:33,994
So I had to turn them off.

899
00:59:33,994 --> 00:59:35,014
Yeah.

900
00:59:35,134 --> 00:59:38,382
And it's just, it's one of those things.

901
00:59:38,382 --> 00:59:40,643
Have you ever been in a car accident?

902
00:59:40,723 --> 00:59:44,283
You're driving and you're sliding and you go in, this isn't real.

903
00:59:44,283 --> 00:59:45,664
It's not happening.

904
00:59:45,664 --> 00:59:52,926
And it, yeah, it did, you know, but, one I can tell you about, MTV awards in Ireland.

905
00:59:54,306 --> 00:59:55,137
there was no band.

906
00:59:55,137 --> 00:59:57,927
It was just me and it was Mary J.

907
00:59:57,927 --> 01:00:01,588
Blige, Mariah, a couple other rappers on stage.

908
01:00:02,289 --> 01:00:07,390
And I got my SCSI hard drive on top of my computer rack.

909
01:00:08,238 --> 01:00:14,622
and I'm right by the stairs and I see this stagehand coming down with this thing and I go,
he's gonna hit my hard drive.

910
01:00:14,622 --> 01:00:18,725
He's gonna hit it and he's gonna knock it off and he hit it.

911
01:00:19,246 --> 01:00:25,640
Hard drive flew and the song stopped exactly eight bars early.

912
01:00:25,640 --> 01:00:27,041
Now Mary J.

913
01:00:27,041 --> 01:00:28,512
Blige was cool with it.

914
01:00:28,512 --> 01:00:30,674
The other singers were cool.

915
01:00:30,674 --> 01:00:33,355
Mariah was going, what, what, what?

916
01:00:33,355 --> 01:00:35,197
But it was okay.

917
01:00:35,197 --> 01:00:37,518
was like, live eight.

918
01:00:37,518 --> 01:00:39,388
2005, sorry, you asked me.

919
01:00:39,388 --> 01:00:40,619
This is other.

920
01:00:41,739 --> 01:00:52,712
I was, played with Madonna and then there was an act and then Mariah was coming on and I
told the guys do not tear my down from this riser.

921
01:00:52,712 --> 01:00:53,222
Okay.

922
01:00:53,222 --> 01:00:57,103
I'm going to be back with Mariah and you know, like two acts.

923
01:00:57,123 --> 01:01:00,504
I, I'm Mariah thing went great.

924
01:01:00,504 --> 01:01:03,425
I'm in the back room and I'm going, yeah, that was fun.

925
01:01:03,425 --> 01:01:04,115
Rock and roll.

926
01:01:04,115 --> 01:01:04,635
Arr.

927
01:01:04,635 --> 01:01:07,438
You know, and my tech comes back and

928
01:01:07,438 --> 01:01:11,938
He's got these cables in his hand and he goes, your shit's all torn apart, man.

929
01:01:11,938 --> 01:01:13,798
It's, don't know where it is.

930
01:01:13,798 --> 01:01:18,038
And I'm going, what the, there's 300,000 people in Hyde park.

931
01:01:18,038 --> 01:01:18,498
You know what I mean?

932
01:01:18,498 --> 01:01:20,398
It's like, what the fuck?

933
01:01:20,398 --> 01:01:26,418
So yeah, that, but we, found it and we got through it, but it was, uh, whoo.

934
01:01:26,418 --> 01:01:27,138
Yeah.

935
01:01:27,138 --> 01:01:27,398
Yeah.

936
01:01:27,398 --> 01:01:28,298
That's hard.

937
01:01:28,298 --> 01:01:28,898
Wow.

938
01:01:28,898 --> 01:01:29,838
That was hard.

939
01:01:29,838 --> 01:01:30,358
That was hard.

940
01:01:30,358 --> 01:01:36,654
I, I never went from being so happy to completely soaking wet with sweat.

941
01:01:36,654 --> 01:01:39,414
freaking out trying to make it happen.

942
01:01:39,554 --> 01:01:42,514
yeah, that's a rollercoaster.

943
01:01:42,514 --> 01:01:43,194
But it worked.

944
01:01:43,194 --> 01:01:43,734
It worked.

945
01:01:43,734 --> 01:01:44,114
Yeah.

946
01:01:44,114 --> 01:01:49,754
So, you know, mean, shit's going to happen, but yeah, no, absolutely.

947
01:01:49,954 --> 01:01:53,894
And we also asked all of our guests, Mike, to tag a keyboard player.

948
01:01:53,894 --> 01:01:58,414
Now you've obviously both you play yourself and have worked with a lot of other keyboard
players.

949
01:01:58,414 --> 01:02:04,714
You someone who you'd like to find out more about their life story that you probably don't
know already.

950
01:02:05,214 --> 01:02:06,754
Greg Philanjase.

951
01:02:06,766 --> 01:02:07,306
Yeah.

952
01:02:07,306 --> 01:02:09,306
He's, he's a constant wish.

953
01:02:09,646 --> 01:02:10,666
My God.

954
01:02:10,666 --> 01:02:17,526
That, that the only person I ever got nervous when he was, you know, someone would come,
staying, came to see the show.

955
01:02:17,526 --> 01:02:19,046
It's like, yeah, so what, whatever.

956
01:02:19,346 --> 01:02:21,266
Hey man, throwing games in the audience.

957
01:02:21,266 --> 01:02:23,145
Oh no.

958
01:02:23,145 --> 01:02:26,826
You know, he, he came back and he critiqued the fuck out of me.

959
01:02:26,826 --> 01:02:27,446
And he was right.

960
01:02:27,446 --> 01:02:28,446
He was right.

961
01:02:28,446 --> 01:02:29,546
I was playing devotion.

962
01:02:29,546 --> 01:02:32,686
He said, we got to man chill.

963
01:02:32,826 --> 01:02:35,826
You, you just relax.

964
01:02:38,520 --> 01:02:39,020
yeah.

965
01:02:39,020 --> 01:02:44,104
But he's a guy that is so effortless and so good.

966
01:02:44,965 --> 01:02:53,151
Yeah, I would definitely listen to anything he had to say about anything because he's the
shit.

967
01:02:53,151 --> 01:03:01,617
Our ongoing watchers and viewers will be aware that we would kill to talk with Greg and
it's not that he's said no, we just don't know how to get in touch with him.

968
01:03:01,962 --> 01:03:06,723
our literally our last guest Mike was Rob Gentry who just played with David Gilmore and
Greg.

969
01:03:07,083 --> 01:03:09,714
And was also calling out just how amazing he was.

970
01:03:09,714 --> 01:03:11,625
So yeah, no, I'm hearing you with Greg.

971
01:03:11,625 --> 01:03:12,885
Amazing guy.

972
01:03:12,885 --> 01:03:16,746
If Rob can't hook you up with Greg, don't know who can because Greg was on.

973
01:03:16,746 --> 01:03:18,486
Yeah, I might ask Rob.

974
01:03:18,486 --> 01:03:20,267
I've been too polite so far.

975
01:03:20,267 --> 01:03:22,568
Yeah, you should.

976
01:03:22,568 --> 01:03:24,288
Yeah.

977
01:03:24,288 --> 01:03:27,239
And then the dreaded Desert Island Discs question, Mike.

978
01:03:27,239 --> 01:03:30,790
So if you had to list five albums, what would they be?

979
01:03:31,502 --> 01:03:35,102
Well, see, this is where I'm going to show my age.

980
01:03:35,102 --> 01:03:38,222
Can't Buy a Thrill, Steely Dan, first album.

981
01:03:38,222 --> 01:03:40,582
That one just took me out.

982
01:03:40,822 --> 01:03:47,581
And of all the people I've worked with, Ray of Light, Madonna was a spectacular record.

983
01:03:47,581 --> 01:03:48,922
It's really good.

984
01:03:48,922 --> 01:03:51,742
William Orbit, you should talk to him.

985
01:03:52,302 --> 01:03:53,982
He's bad motherfucker.

986
01:03:54,222 --> 01:03:55,702
He's amazing.

987
01:03:55,702 --> 01:04:01,102
Beyond that, new Peter Gabriel record is insanely good.

988
01:04:01,102 --> 01:04:02,342
Have you heard it?

989
01:04:02,342 --> 01:04:03,422
No, I haven't listened to it before.

990
01:04:03,422 --> 01:04:05,582
This is the I, it's IO, isn't it?

991
01:04:05,582 --> 01:04:06,022
Yeah.

992
01:04:06,022 --> 01:04:07,042
Oh my God.

993
01:04:07,042 --> 01:04:07,822
It is so good.

994
01:04:07,822 --> 01:04:09,042
It is so good.

995
01:04:09,042 --> 01:04:22,682
Now, maybe it's because it sounds like so and his other stuff to me, because when he, went
a different direction and it wasn't, you know, he did a nice version of, um, heroes, uh,

996
01:04:22,702 --> 01:04:26,642
or casserole, but, but this, this new album is great.

997
01:04:26,642 --> 01:04:29,502
Um, uh, got Amanda Marshall.

998
01:04:29,502 --> 01:04:31,162
Have you heard of her?

999
01:04:31,212 --> 01:04:31,942
No.

1000
01:04:31,942 --> 01:04:33,983
Woman from Canada.

1001
01:04:33,983 --> 01:04:38,084
Amazing, amazing singer.

1002
01:04:38,084 --> 01:04:50,227
And just, I think she's one of those people that she would have been huge, but she got a
record deal and then wanted to renegotiate and they buried her.

1003
01:04:50,288 --> 01:04:52,328
So it's just sad.

1004
01:04:52,328 --> 01:04:54,579
else?

1005
01:04:54,579 --> 01:04:56,889
There's four, Mike, you've done four pretty easily.

1006
01:04:56,889 --> 01:04:59,150
Yeah, I'm trying to think.

1007
01:05:00,130 --> 01:05:02,902
Again, well then Asia, Steely Dan, I'm sorry.

1008
01:05:02,902 --> 01:05:07,816
you know, look, I just, I like the way Donald Fagan thinks harmonically.

1009
01:05:07,816 --> 01:05:16,365
It's, and I know that it's, it's funny to have Madonna on the same thing because Madonna
would go out of her way to say, I fucking hate Steely Dan.

1010
01:05:16,365 --> 01:05:17,563
She hated them.

1011
01:05:17,984 --> 01:05:22,467
I never heard her say she hated anything, but she really fucking hated Steely Dan.

1012
01:05:22,707 --> 01:05:25,710
It was just, it was the worst thing ever for her.

1013
01:05:25,710 --> 01:05:26,602
Yeah.

1014
01:05:26,602 --> 01:05:27,363
Understand.

1015
01:05:27,363 --> 01:05:28,153
No, that's great.

1016
01:05:28,153 --> 01:05:28,812
Thanks, Mike.

1017
01:05:28,812 --> 01:05:30,784
They've got five brilliant picks.

1018
01:05:30,984 --> 01:05:37,948
And then we usually finish off with our quick fire 10, so 10 short and sharp questions
with hopefully 10 short and sharp answers.

1019
01:05:37,948 --> 01:05:38,669
OK.

1020
01:05:38,669 --> 01:05:42,050
And the first one being the first album you recall hearing.

1021
01:05:42,510 --> 01:05:43,311
God.

1022
01:05:43,311 --> 01:05:45,222
Well, this is going to age me.

1023
01:05:45,222 --> 01:05:49,905
But first, I didn't hear the entire album.

1024
01:05:49,905 --> 01:05:56,158
The first song I remember hearing was a song by a band called The Circle called Red Rubber
Ball.

1025
01:05:56,422 --> 01:05:57,162
Okay.

1026
01:05:57,162 --> 01:06:00,374
don't know why, but that sticks in there.

1027
01:06:00,374 --> 01:06:01,544
No, great.

1028
01:06:01,644 --> 01:06:07,527
Before each gig, what is a pre-gig ritual to say you know that you set for the night?

1029
01:06:08,908 --> 01:06:11,799
Just, well, this is boring.

1030
01:06:11,799 --> 01:06:13,009
I'll try and keep it short.

1031
01:06:13,009 --> 01:06:24,434
I actually make a point of shutting down my computers and restarting, rebooting, making
absolutely certain, looking at every song, just making sure I didn't miss something.

1032
01:06:24,588 --> 01:06:26,749
making sure I didn't leave something in solo mode.

1033
01:06:26,749 --> 01:06:34,863
So when I start the song, only the quick plays, nothing else, but you know, cause it, it
happens when you get in the soundcheck and you're going fast and then you save and then

1034
01:06:34,863 --> 01:06:36,403
you forget anyway.

1035
01:06:36,403 --> 01:06:38,044
yeah, absolutely.

1036
01:06:38,044 --> 01:06:40,385
Always, always, always triple track.

1037
01:06:40,385 --> 01:06:40,795
Yeah.

1038
01:06:40,795 --> 01:06:42,046
No, great point.

1039
01:06:42,046 --> 01:06:49,329
If you hadn't been a musician and, you know, taken on the career you have, what do you
think your career choice would have been?

1040
01:06:51,048 --> 01:06:53,719
I wanted to be an aeronautical engineer.

1041
01:06:55,579 --> 01:06:59,120
I suck at math, so that doesn't work.

1042
01:07:00,161 --> 01:07:03,342
Favorite tour you've ever done, if that's at all possible?

1043
01:07:04,182 --> 01:07:05,962
Roger Waters' The Wall.

1044
01:07:06,203 --> 01:07:14,765
That was three years of just, it started in little tiny arenas, and by the time we were
done, we were playing stadiums.

1045
01:07:15,045 --> 01:07:17,066
And it just never got old.

1046
01:07:17,550 --> 01:07:21,990
favorite gig you've ever done if that's possible so as far as an individual show?

1047
01:07:22,530 --> 01:07:38,530
Well the one that went horribly to shit the Live 8 2005 yeah that was that was yeah that
was great yeah but any any gig I did when I was playing with Earth, Wind and Fire from 94

1048
01:07:38,530 --> 01:07:44,450
to 97 any of those were amazing it was so cool to be with those guys.

1049
01:07:45,730 --> 01:07:46,270
Absolutely.

1050
01:07:47,576 --> 01:07:50,848
favourite city you've ever played if that stands out for you?

1051
01:07:52,530 --> 01:07:55,166
Well, God, I do love Australia.

1052
01:07:55,166 --> 01:07:59,136
I mean, I would probably live there if I could, you know.

1053
01:07:59,136 --> 01:08:02,308
So, yeah, I think Sydney.

1054
01:08:02,308 --> 01:08:03,029
sponsor you, Mike.

1055
01:08:03,029 --> 01:08:04,320
Yeah, we'll sponsor you, Mike.

1056
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:07,503
Okay.

1057
01:08:07,503 --> 01:08:14,448
Name a song, you sort of alluded to this earlier, but I'll ask it anyway, name a song that
you used to love, but you've played it to death.

1058
01:08:17,079 --> 01:08:17,529
Wow.

1059
01:08:17,529 --> 01:08:24,434
Well, can I change that actually Mike to a non Christmas song that you use to love?

1060
01:08:25,355 --> 01:08:26,586
I, I can't think of any.

1061
01:08:26,586 --> 01:08:27,209
I'm sorry.

1062
01:08:27,209 --> 01:08:29,597
I, I, nothing jumps in my head.

1063
01:08:29,598 --> 01:08:34,241
No, favorite music documentary or movie.

1064
01:08:34,761 --> 01:08:35,882
well spinal tap.

1065
01:08:35,882 --> 01:08:36,843
course.

1066
01:08:37,649 --> 01:08:47,180
I was, I was, I was actually talked to, they, they were in rehearsals and you know, we
need a keyboard player that's like over the top and saying,

1067
01:08:47,224 --> 01:08:49,875
Kind of as it, my God, spinal tap with playback.

1068
01:08:49,875 --> 01:08:51,136
That would be cool.

1069
01:08:51,136 --> 01:08:56,869
You know, they're, they're playing the military club and they got all the extra shit with
the commuters.

1070
01:08:56,869 --> 01:08:57,920
No, I can't do that.

1071
01:08:57,920 --> 01:09:01,762
So, but anyway, it was talked about for a hot second, but.

1072
01:09:01,762 --> 01:09:03,452
there is a sequel coming out.

1073
01:09:03,452 --> 01:09:08,545
So I'd be interesting with the, having incorporated some of that into it wouldn't surprise
me.

1074
01:09:09,946 --> 01:09:16,400
No, one thing that you'd like to see invented that it'd make your life as a keyboard
player easier.

1075
01:09:16,400 --> 01:09:17,250
Wow.

1076
01:09:18,082 --> 01:09:18,722
Blank.

1077
01:09:18,722 --> 01:09:19,663
I got a blank there.

1078
01:09:19,663 --> 01:09:20,523
I'm sorry.

1079
01:09:20,523 --> 01:09:25,707
No, I mean, I mean, there's so much stuff that I need to learn that I have already.

1080
01:09:25,707 --> 01:09:26,968
That's the problem.

1081
01:09:26,988 --> 01:09:28,049
you know what?

1082
01:09:28,229 --> 01:09:29,370
I'll tell you one thing.

1083
01:09:29,370 --> 01:09:32,012
Every time I watch The Matrix, I wish this would happen.

1084
01:09:32,012 --> 01:09:34,164
I go on YouTube and I watch all this shit.

1085
01:09:34,164 --> 01:09:35,935
I'm learning all these things that I listen.

1086
01:09:35,935 --> 01:09:43,621
If I could just plug it in the back of my and go, I know Kung Fu, you know, I know how to
play Giant Steps, you know, anything like that.

1087
01:09:43,621 --> 01:09:45,934
That would be that would be amazing.

1088
01:09:45,934 --> 01:09:49,474
That's what I That's obviously the best one we've ever had.

1089
01:09:49,474 --> 01:09:50,994
I think I love that idea.

1090
01:09:51,374 --> 01:09:52,334
That's brilliant.

1091
01:09:52,334 --> 01:09:54,874
And then what do you do to keep sane outside of music, Mike?

1092
01:09:54,874 --> 01:09:57,774
So what's your favorite non-musical activity slash hobby?

1093
01:09:57,774 --> 01:10:03,214
Oh, I got two beautiful little dogs that just are the best things ever.

1094
01:10:03,214 --> 01:10:06,974
And they're probably crying outside the door right now trying to get in.

1095
01:10:07,234 --> 01:10:07,934
Yeah.

1096
01:10:08,254 --> 01:10:10,534
we better let you get to them.

1097
01:10:10,534 --> 01:10:14,534
I mean, never has the case of not scratching the surface been more

1098
01:10:14,744 --> 01:10:17,174
truthful in, in spending this time with you.

1099
01:10:17,174 --> 01:10:18,115
It's just been amazing.

1100
01:10:18,115 --> 01:10:24,197
I'd to follow up in the future and hopefully we do see you down under again, either with
Roger or someone else.

1101
01:10:24,197 --> 01:10:27,558
We are doing Mariah in, in Australia.

1102
01:10:27,968 --> 01:10:29,699
would love to catch up this year.

1103
01:10:29,699 --> 01:10:34,000
I'll, I'll get you in the show and, love to buy you a beer.

1104
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:35,400
I would love that.

1105
01:10:35,441 --> 01:10:35,761
Yeah.

1106
01:10:35,761 --> 01:10:36,671
Let's it.

1107
01:10:36,671 --> 01:10:37,551
Thank you enough, Mike.

1108
01:10:37,551 --> 01:10:39,242
It's been absolutely amazing.

1109
01:10:39,242 --> 01:10:40,402
Thank you, David.

1110
01:10:49,146 --> 01:10:50,447
And there we have it.

1111
01:10:50,447 --> 01:10:54,429
As I warned you, that was one broad ranging conversation.

1112
01:10:54,429 --> 01:11:04,665
It's so hard to scratch even much beyond the surface with someone as extensively
experienced as Mike, but it was a thrill getting the time with Mike that we did.

1113
01:11:04,665 --> 01:11:07,996
And I can't thank him enough for taking that time with us.

1114
01:11:08,197 --> 01:11:13,770
The other people I need to thank for taking their time is obviously you, our extremely
valued listeners and watchers.

1115
01:11:13,770 --> 01:11:15,321
We couldn't do it without you.

1116
01:11:15,321 --> 01:11:18,314
And also to our gold and silver supporters.

1117
01:11:18,314 --> 01:11:28,939
So in no particular order, Mike from midnightmastering.com, I do recommend checking a
couple of episodes back where we actually had Mike on the show alongside Steve Gregory to

1118
01:11:28,939 --> 01:11:31,380
talk about the world's first virtual band.

1119
01:11:31,380 --> 01:11:39,823
Definitely worth a check out, but Mike basically does brilliant mastering and mixing and I
can't recommend him highly enough.

1120
01:11:39,843 --> 01:11:46,584
Dave and the team from the musicplay.com forums, one of the best places on the internet to
talk keyboards, highly recommend.

1121
01:11:46,584 --> 01:11:49,035
You do check that out as well.

1122
01:11:49,035 --> 01:11:53,428
Tammy Katcher from Tammy's Musical Stew, a long time supporter that we value greatly.

1123
01:11:53,428 --> 01:11:54,958
Thank you, Tammy.

1124
01:11:55,179 --> 01:12:00,101
And last but not least, I want to call out Elk Electronic.

1125
01:12:00,262 --> 01:12:03,783
We've not mentioned them in a while, but it's time to mention them again.

1126
01:12:03,783 --> 01:12:12,168
So Elk do a brilliant job of repairing SINs, but also provide a lot of interesting long
online resources.

1127
01:12:12,168 --> 01:12:13,749
So that's E-L-K-E-L-E-K.

1128
01:12:15,918 --> 01:12:17,859
Anyway, it's electronic with a K.

1129
01:12:17,859 --> 01:12:20,958
If you Google Elkolectronic, it'll be there.

1130
01:12:20,958 --> 01:12:27,286
So yeah, thanks to Ed and the team at Elkolectronic as well for their ongoing support.

1131
01:12:27,286 --> 01:12:29,188
And last but definitely not least, Mr.

1132
01:12:29,188 --> 01:12:31,850
Dewey Evans, who you got to see on the end of year wrap.

1133
01:12:31,850 --> 01:12:38,134
And we look forward to speaking with Dewey again in the future, who's also one of our very
valued supporters.

1134
01:12:38,134 --> 01:12:39,806
So again, thank you for listening.

1135
01:12:39,806 --> 01:12:40,836
We love hearing from you.

1136
01:12:40,836 --> 01:12:43,458
Do reach out via email, Facebook.

1137
01:12:43,512 --> 01:12:48,188
We're on Instagram, we're on Blue Sky, we're on anything you can think of.

1138
01:12:48,188 --> 01:12:50,772
yeah, feel free to reach out anytime.

1139
01:12:50,772 --> 01:12:53,034
And in the meantime, keep on playing.