1 00:00:00,735 --> 00:00:00,775 - 2 00:00:07,645 --> 00:00:10,335 - Welcome to the Landscape, your show about America's parks 3 00:00:10,335 --> 00:00:11,415 and public lands. 4 00:00:11,795 --> 00:00:14,095 I'm Erin Weiss with the Center for Western Priorities, 5 00:00:14,095 --> 00:00:15,295 usually based in Denver, 6 00:00:15,435 --> 00:00:17,855 but coming to you today from the National Mall in 7 00:00:17,855 --> 00:00:19,455 Washington, DC actually 8 00:00:20,115 --> 00:00:23,855 inside the Smithsonian Natural History Museum, along 9 00:00:23,855 --> 00:00:26,575 with a whole bunch of Colorado eighth graders this week. 10 00:00:27,395 --> 00:00:28,895 - And I'm Kate Resinger, coming 11 00:00:28,895 --> 00:00:31,255 to you from a partially sunny Salt Lake City. 12 00:00:31,785 --> 00:00:33,655 Today on the podcast, we're talking to folks 13 00:00:33,655 --> 00:00:36,735 with the Bears Ears Intertribal Coalition about the Bears 14 00:00:36,735 --> 00:00:38,815 Ears Draft Monument Management Plan. 15 00:00:39,275 --> 00:00:42,015 The Bureau of Land Management is taking public feedback on 16 00:00:42,015 --> 00:00:43,935 that plan right now, so keep listening 17 00:00:43,935 --> 00:00:45,255 and we'll tell you how to get involved. 18 00:00:45,475 --> 00:00:46,535 But first, the news. 19 00:00:46,955 --> 00:00:49,175 - Our big news this week comes out of California 20 00:00:49,225 --> 00:00:51,415 where President Biden expanded, not one, 21 00:00:51,435 --> 00:00:53,135 but two national monuments. 22 00:00:53,595 --> 00:00:56,095 The president added over a hundred thousand acres 23 00:00:56,095 --> 00:00:57,135 of public land 24 00:00:57,275 --> 00:01:00,055 to San Gabriel Mountains National Monument just 25 00:01:00,055 --> 00:01:01,135 outside of Los Angeles. 26 00:01:01,795 --> 00:01:05,415 He also added nearly 14,000 acres known as Mooch Laak, 27 00:01:05,515 --> 00:01:06,615 or Condor Ridge, 28 00:01:06,875 --> 00:01:09,215 to Berryessa Snow Mountain National Monument. 29 00:01:09,275 --> 00:01:10,575 In the northern part of the state, 30 00:01:11,045 --> 00:01:13,215 both monuments were originally protected 31 00:01:13,215 --> 00:01:14,655 by President Barack Obama. 32 00:01:14,945 --> 00:01:18,375 These expansions are the result of years of campaigning 33 00:01:18,375 --> 00:01:20,095 by organizers in both areas. 34 00:01:20,795 --> 00:01:23,695 The San Gabriel Mountains expansion will increase access 35 00:01:23,695 --> 00:01:26,655 to nature for underserved communities in the LA area. 36 00:01:27,235 --> 00:01:29,215 The Angeles National Forest, by the way, 37 00:01:29,215 --> 00:01:31,335 where this is located already sees more than four 38 00:01:31,335 --> 00:01:33,695 and a half million visits every year 39 00:01:34,045 --> 00:01:36,815 that is more than the Grand Canyon or Yosemite. 40 00:01:36,835 --> 00:01:39,895 So this is really about increasing access to nature, 41 00:01:39,925 --> 00:01:41,295 that it's a wonderful thing to see. 42 00:01:41,795 --> 00:01:44,535 And Malik Laak, uh, is the ancestral home 43 00:01:44,535 --> 00:01:45,535 of the Patwin people. 44 00:01:45,835 --> 00:01:47,375 It served as an important trade 45 00:01:47,375 --> 00:01:49,095 and travel route for indigenous groups. 46 00:01:49,725 --> 00:01:53,135 With this expansion, the area's name will officially change 47 00:01:53,475 --> 00:01:55,615 to honor the area's original inhabitants. 48 00:01:56,195 --> 00:01:59,015 Now, these monument expansions are President Biden's first 49 00:01:59,075 --> 00:02:01,335 use of the Antiquities Act in more than six months. 50 00:02:01,875 --> 00:02:04,335 So that has leaders of other locally driven monument 51 00:02:04,695 --> 00:02:05,775 campaigns, both in California 52 00:02:05,915 --> 00:02:08,655 and across the west, hoping that the warm reception 53 00:02:08,655 --> 00:02:09,815 that President Biden got 54 00:02:09,815 --> 00:02:12,255 with these expansions means he'll be eager 55 00:02:12,275 --> 00:02:15,055 to protect more public land in the coming weeks and months. 56 00:02:18,745 --> 00:02:20,575 - Today we are joined by Davina Smith, 57 00:02:20,595 --> 00:02:22,935 who represents the Navajo Nation on the Bears Ears 58 00:02:22,935 --> 00:02:24,215 Intertribal Coalition. 59 00:02:24,465 --> 00:02:25,775 Thank you for being here, Davina. 60 00:02:26,905 --> 00:02:29,455 - Hello. Good afternoon. So glad to be on the show. 61 00:02:30,555 --> 00:02:32,335 - And we're also joined by Lauren Hinson, 62 00:02:32,355 --> 00:02:34,015 who is the Collaborative Management 63 00:02:34,035 --> 00:02:35,455 and Tribal support specialist 64 00:02:35,455 --> 00:02:37,575 for the Bears Ears Intertribal Coalition. 65 00:02:37,725 --> 00:02:39,335 Welcome to the landscape, Lauren. 66 00:02:40,335 --> 00:02:41,755 - Thanks so much for having me. 67 00:02:42,865 --> 00:02:44,875 - Alright, so let's start off with the basics. 68 00:02:45,105 --> 00:02:48,475 What is a Monument management plan and why is it important? 69 00:02:48,975 --> 00:02:50,355 Lauren, why don't you take this one? 70 00:02:50,985 --> 00:02:54,115 - Sure. Our Monument Management plan is sort 71 00:02:54,115 --> 00:02:57,755 of an overarching decision making document that's intended 72 00:02:57,775 --> 00:03:01,045 to protect everything within the landscape of a monument. 73 00:03:02,265 --> 00:03:05,005 So from a western planning perspective, this kind 74 00:03:05,005 --> 00:03:07,885 of covers all of the resources included in a monument. 75 00:03:08,705 --> 00:03:11,925 And from an indigenous perspective, a plan, uh, 76 00:03:12,065 --> 00:03:14,565 should protect all the landscape holistically. 77 00:03:14,785 --> 00:03:17,605 So from earth to sky, uh, for those that came 78 00:03:17,765 --> 00:03:19,365 before, those that are here now 79 00:03:19,785 --> 00:03:21,245 and those that have yet to come. 80 00:03:22,145 --> 00:03:25,485 And having a plan is important as it will guide 81 00:03:25,865 --> 00:03:28,565 how the monument is managed for many years, um, 82 00:03:28,565 --> 00:03:30,085 protecting the sacred landscape, 83 00:03:30,585 --> 00:03:31,685 and then hopefully adapting 84 00:03:31,825 --> 00:03:33,725 to new challenges as they come up. 85 00:03:33,745 --> 00:03:36,805 So we're hoping to have a really adaptive plan 86 00:03:36,805 --> 00:03:38,765 that can change as we need it to. 87 00:03:39,755 --> 00:03:42,405 - Awesome. So this is kind of a long-term plan 88 00:03:42,405 --> 00:03:45,165 that's gonna direct the overall management 89 00:03:45,165 --> 00:03:46,485 of the monument for a long time. 90 00:03:47,105 --> 00:03:49,085 Um, my understanding of this process is 91 00:03:49,085 --> 00:03:53,165 that the BLM provides a few alternative plans, um, 92 00:03:53,165 --> 00:03:55,725 to the public, and then they, they ask the public 93 00:03:55,785 --> 00:03:57,005 to to weigh in on them. 94 00:03:57,585 --> 00:03:59,525 Um, can you just, can you sort of explain 95 00:03:59,545 --> 00:04:00,925 how those alternatives work and, 96 00:04:00,925 --> 00:04:02,885 and which one the BLM picked as it 97 00:04:02,885 --> 00:04:04,285 as its preferred alternative? 98 00:04:05,755 --> 00:04:09,645 - Sure. So this planning process is somewhat unique in 99 00:04:09,645 --> 00:04:14,005 that it's a collaboration between two federal agencies, 100 00:04:14,065 --> 00:04:16,165 the Bureau of Land Management and the Forest Service, 101 00:04:16,545 --> 00:04:19,405 and then also the five commission tribes. 102 00:04:20,105 --> 00:04:23,885 Um, so this planning process all, we're all kind 103 00:04:23,885 --> 00:04:26,445 of coming together to identify, um, 104 00:04:26,835 --> 00:04:30,165 what alternatives might be best for, for the monument. 105 00:04:30,945 --> 00:04:33,725 And alternatives to plan really just represent a range 106 00:04:33,725 --> 00:04:36,245 of options for management for the public to consider. 107 00:04:37,025 --> 00:04:38,885 So we could think about maybe an example 108 00:04:39,385 --> 00:04:40,685 of a range of alternatives. 109 00:04:40,745 --> 00:04:43,205 We think about access to fishing in a river. 110 00:04:43,985 --> 00:04:46,845 So a ra a management plan might consider a range 111 00:04:46,845 --> 00:04:50,725 of alternatives that include all the way from, you know, 112 00:04:50,725 --> 00:04:53,125 completely restricting any fishing access 113 00:04:53,625 --> 00:04:56,885 to something in the middle, like only restricting access 114 00:04:56,885 --> 00:04:58,685 to fishing during certain seasons, 115 00:04:58,825 --> 00:05:02,365 or, you know, key life history time periods like spawning, 116 00:05:03,065 --> 00:05:05,605 or there might be a, you know, a, a alternative 117 00:05:05,605 --> 00:05:07,685 that allows any type of fishing to happen. 118 00:05:07,945 --> 00:05:11,965 So this range of alternatives, um, allows the public to sort 119 00:05:11,965 --> 00:05:15,325 of interact and identify, um, you know, which one 120 00:05:15,975 --> 00:05:17,285 makes the most sense to them. 121 00:05:17,985 --> 00:05:20,125 Um, but in the management plan, the agencies, 122 00:05:20,585 --> 00:05:22,325 so in this case, the Bureau of Land Management 123 00:05:22,325 --> 00:05:25,165 and the Forest Service and the tribes, uh, 124 00:05:25,165 --> 00:05:26,845 and this particular planning case 125 00:05:27,775 --> 00:05:29,625 will indicate the alternative that they think 126 00:05:30,135 --> 00:05:31,985 will best protect and manage the monument. 127 00:05:32,405 --> 00:05:34,225 Um, and then this plan that, 128 00:05:34,325 --> 00:05:37,665 or alternative, the preferred alternative is alternative e 129 00:05:39,525 --> 00:05:42,225 - Davina, if you could walk us through the process 130 00:05:42,295 --> 00:05:44,225 that happened with tribal engagement here. 131 00:05:44,605 --> 00:05:47,865 Uh, bears Ears obviously was a tribally driven 132 00:05:48,425 --> 00:05:50,185 monument proposal, but, uh, 133 00:05:50,335 --> 00:05:51,865 what is the Bears Ears Commission 134 00:05:51,865 --> 00:05:54,265 and how is that different from the Bears Ears 135 00:05:54,495 --> 00:05:55,745 Intertribal Coalition? 136 00:05:57,065 --> 00:06:01,875 - Yeah. Um, so back in October of 2021, 137 00:06:01,905 --> 00:06:06,275 president Biden, um, issued Proclamation, uh, 138 00:06:06,535 --> 00:06:10,035 1 0 2 85, um, which as we know, 139 00:06:10,315 --> 00:06:11,595 restored Bears National Monument. 140 00:06:12,175 --> 00:06:16,075 And then recognized, um, also the importance of knowledge 141 00:06:16,075 --> 00:06:19,995 of tribal nations in managing the monument by, um, 142 00:06:20,515 --> 00:06:22,275 reconstituting the Bearers Commission. 143 00:06:23,375 --> 00:06:26,675 Um, and that was, um, established 144 00:06:26,675 --> 00:06:29,155 by President O Obama back in 2016. 145 00:06:29,735 --> 00:06:33,075 So with the Bearers Commission that consisted 146 00:06:33,075 --> 00:06:37,475 of one elected tribal leader from each of the five tribes, 147 00:06:38,015 --> 00:06:41,595 um, for the, but for the Navajo Nation that I represent, um, 148 00:06:42,335 --> 00:06:46,875 it, we also have a coalition representative, which I am 149 00:06:46,875 --> 00:06:48,075 that coalition representative. 150 00:06:48,655 --> 00:06:52,275 We do have a Navajo commissioner who is actually a council 151 00:06:52,875 --> 00:06:54,835 delegate for the Utah Navajo Nation. 152 00:06:55,375 --> 00:06:57,755 - Um, Davina, can you describe the Bayer's 153 00:06:57,755 --> 00:06:59,075 Intertribal Coalition? 154 00:06:59,075 --> 00:07:00,475 Because that's, that's what you're on 155 00:07:00,495 --> 00:07:02,595 and I think that sometimes it gets confusing 156 00:07:02,595 --> 00:07:04,715 with the commission and the coalition. 157 00:07:05,135 --> 00:07:06,635 Um, so what is the coalition? 158 00:07:07,535 --> 00:07:11,715 - So the coalition is, um, I basically the boss 159 00:07:11,715 --> 00:07:14,155 of the Bears Ears, our Tribal Coalition staff. 160 00:07:14,775 --> 00:07:17,995 Um, and it, it's basically collaborating 161 00:07:18,105 --> 00:07:20,635 with the commission Tribal leaders, um, and, 162 00:07:20,695 --> 00:07:24,195 and offering support as, as we have Lauren on the show 163 00:07:24,295 --> 00:07:27,555 who specifically her focus is on the alternative ease. 164 00:07:27,575 --> 00:07:31,515 And we have two co-directors, Hillary Hoffman 165 00:07:31,515 --> 00:07:36,195 and Charissa, um, that both, um, delegate in terms of, um, 166 00:07:36,465 --> 00:07:39,355 looking at the lens of, you know, um, 167 00:07:39,615 --> 00:07:41,635 our resource management plan and EIS, 168 00:07:41,635 --> 00:07:44,235 but also looking at day-to-Day operations. 169 00:07:44,375 --> 00:07:46,995 And we have also other, a number of other staff 170 00:07:47,065 --> 00:07:51,555 that look at, you know, community engagement, um, uh, 171 00:07:52,555 --> 00:07:55,835 ethnographic and also, um, plants and medicine. 172 00:07:56,015 --> 00:07:59,235 So all of that combines with the coalition 173 00:07:59,255 --> 00:08:00,995 to support the Tribal Commission 174 00:08:01,215 --> 00:08:02,715 and then also the commission, 175 00:08:02,735 --> 00:08:05,355 the Bergers Commission at the time when it was established, 176 00:08:05,935 --> 00:08:07,835 um, didn't really have a home. 177 00:08:08,215 --> 00:08:11,875 So it just made perfect sense to be, um, collaborated 178 00:08:11,945 --> 00:08:13,995 with the Bears Ears Intertribal Coalition. 179 00:08:14,575 --> 00:08:17,155 - Got it. Alright. So that then brings us 180 00:08:17,295 --> 00:08:20,155 to this alternative e that Lauren mentioned. 181 00:08:20,155 --> 00:08:24,315 The M's preferred alternative, uh, was 182 00:08:24,315 --> 00:08:27,915 that in fact the alternative that had the most tribal input? 183 00:08:27,975 --> 00:08:30,635 And, and what was that, uh, what was that like when 184 00:08:30,635 --> 00:08:33,115 that document finally came down to see 185 00:08:33,115 --> 00:08:35,115 that this was the direction BLM was going? 186 00:08:36,495 --> 00:08:40,075 - It was about about 18 months of us coming together, 187 00:08:40,185 --> 00:08:41,235 each of the tribes. 188 00:08:41,295 --> 00:08:44,595 And it wasn't just only the commission, it was also our, 189 00:08:45,295 --> 00:08:46,555 um, subcommittees. 190 00:08:46,555 --> 00:08:51,515 So that consists of, um, each tribe bringing in their, um, 191 00:08:52,605 --> 00:08:56,245 their representatives with a, uh, extensive background in, 192 00:08:56,825 --> 00:09:00,165 um, cultural understandings from, from 193 00:09:00,915 --> 00:09:02,205 land management plants, 194 00:09:02,385 --> 00:09:06,805 but also our indigenous knowledges, um, that could pertain 195 00:09:06,825 --> 00:09:09,885 to ceremonies and what it meant for that, utilizing plants, 196 00:09:09,985 --> 00:09:13,725 and also the importance of water and wildlife. 197 00:09:13,945 --> 00:09:18,605 So everything that consists from our, um, traditional, um, 198 00:09:19,035 --> 00:09:22,885 integration of each of our tribes that we, you know, 199 00:09:23,135 --> 00:09:26,205 every day would, um, coordinate with Lauren in terms 200 00:09:26,225 --> 00:09:28,845 of our knowledges that was implemented in Alterna e 201 00:09:30,345 --> 00:09:31,345 - Davina. 202 00:09:31,345 --> 00:09:33,565 Let's talk about what's in the preferred alternative now. 203 00:09:33,565 --> 00:09:35,925 What are some of the most important aspects of the plan 204 00:09:36,065 --> 00:09:37,445 to the Navajo tribe 205 00:09:37,465 --> 00:09:39,325 and to the other tribes in the commission? 206 00:09:41,025 --> 00:09:43,925 - So I can only speak for the Navajo Nation, um, 207 00:09:43,925 --> 00:09:47,645 because that's, that is who I was, um, specifically 208 00:09:47,705 --> 00:09:49,365 to advocate on behalf of. 209 00:09:49,505 --> 00:09:54,285 So example would be firewood, you know, firewood from, 210 00:09:54,385 --> 00:09:56,845 for us is, um, as I've expressed 211 00:09:56,865 --> 00:10:00,365 before, it's a living, it's, it's a living fire. 212 00:10:00,745 --> 00:10:01,925 And what does that mean? 213 00:10:01,985 --> 00:10:06,205 It means our traditional knowledges of what the story 214 00:10:06,225 --> 00:10:10,525 of Fire meant for our Navajo people in terms of, 215 00:10:11,225 --> 00:10:12,685 of course, ultimately warmth, 216 00:10:12,865 --> 00:10:16,125 but also it firewood was used for many reasons. 217 00:10:16,345 --> 00:10:20,165 Um, we used it for our homes, our Hogans, the Cedar Post 218 00:10:20,195 --> 00:10:22,565 that was harvested from Bears Ears was, 219 00:10:22,945 --> 00:10:24,445 was harvested from that area. 220 00:10:24,745 --> 00:10:27,085 But also it was, it, you know, there's, 221 00:10:27,305 --> 00:10:29,085 and I can't go into great detail 222 00:10:29,085 --> 00:10:32,005 because the sum of that is also protected in terms 223 00:10:32,005 --> 00:10:33,125 of our ceremonies, 224 00:10:33,585 --> 00:10:37,005 but every part of the, the wood was utilized for 225 00:10:37,545 --> 00:10:39,965 not only home, but also for ceremonies. 226 00:10:40,905 --> 00:10:44,485 - So Lauren, what was that process like working with BLM, 227 00:10:44,985 --> 00:10:46,605 giving them information on, 228 00:10:46,705 --> 00:10:49,965 on things like firewood gathering, why that's so important? 229 00:10:50,385 --> 00:10:52,085 Uh, what was the, 230 00:10:52,185 --> 00:10:54,005 the working process like over those 231 00:10:54,205 --> 00:10:55,285 18 months that you talked about? 232 00:10:56,225 --> 00:10:59,725 - It consisted of many meetings, um, many meetings 233 00:10:59,905 --> 00:11:01,845 of our cultural resources subcommittee 234 00:11:01,875 --> 00:11:05,565 that Divina mentioned, um, that consists 235 00:11:05,565 --> 00:11:07,005 of traditional knowledge holders 236 00:11:07,585 --> 00:11:11,445 of natural resource professionals, um, you know, 237 00:11:11,445 --> 00:11:14,845 basically tribal representatives that are designated 238 00:11:14,985 --> 00:11:18,405 to help inform their commissioner about kinda specific 239 00:11:18,645 --> 00:11:19,925 resource issues in the monument. 240 00:11:21,185 --> 00:11:22,325 And then coming together 241 00:11:22,325 --> 00:11:25,245 and really sharing all of their expertise, uh, 242 00:11:25,305 --> 00:11:27,085 and then meeting with the commission as well 243 00:11:27,185 --> 00:11:29,845 to share the cultural resources subcommittee's, um, 244 00:11:30,525 --> 00:11:32,085 feedback on these documents. 245 00:11:32,305 --> 00:11:34,205 And then the commission, you know, meeting 246 00:11:34,205 --> 00:11:37,165 with the agencies many, many times to share, um, 247 00:11:37,165 --> 00:11:38,885 this expertise, to share feedback. 248 00:11:39,825 --> 00:11:43,405 Uh, so there's a combination of both, um, you know, 249 00:11:43,405 --> 00:11:45,725 working together through meetings, through documents, 250 00:11:45,725 --> 00:11:49,325 through calls, through landscape visits, through, uh, 251 00:11:49,325 --> 00:11:52,205 we have a youth, um, an elder Conservation Corps 252 00:11:52,235 --> 00:11:53,645 that goes out in the landscape 253 00:11:53,645 --> 00:11:56,205 and also talked about these types of issues 254 00:11:56,305 --> 00:11:58,805 and these, uh, types of considerations in the plan. 255 00:11:59,835 --> 00:12:02,135 And additionally, prior to the planning process, 256 00:12:02,955 --> 00:12:05,895 the coalition and some of the, some of the biggest work 257 00:12:05,895 --> 00:12:08,255 of the coalition prior to the print planning process was 258 00:12:08,755 --> 00:12:12,495 to create, uh, tribally led, uh, land management plan. 259 00:12:12,995 --> 00:12:15,615 Um, and that was something that was delivered 260 00:12:15,615 --> 00:12:18,815 to the agencies in the summer of 2022. 261 00:12:19,435 --> 00:12:22,255 So this tribal land management plan was kind of used as a, 262 00:12:22,755 --> 00:12:24,895 as a scaffold and as a guiding document 263 00:12:25,075 --> 00:12:27,455 for this new monument management plan. 264 00:12:28,195 --> 00:12:31,935 Uh, so there's been a lot of extensive collaboration, uh, 265 00:12:31,935 --> 00:12:34,735 throughout this, this process with, with the agencies, 266 00:12:34,755 --> 00:12:36,815 the commission cultural resources subcommittee, 267 00:12:36,815 --> 00:12:40,815 and we've also been out, um, in communities to, you know, 268 00:12:40,815 --> 00:12:42,375 make sure that their voices are heard 269 00:12:42,375 --> 00:12:43,975 by elected leadership and the commission. 270 00:12:44,835 --> 00:12:48,415 - Lauren, um, I know that there was some planning going on 271 00:12:48,575 --> 00:12:50,735 for the monument before Trump attempted 272 00:12:50,735 --> 00:12:51,895 to shrink the boundaries. 273 00:12:52,515 --> 00:12:54,215 How did that action, um, 274 00:12:54,315 --> 00:12:56,295 set back the planning process, if at all? 275 00:12:56,805 --> 00:13:01,495 - Sure. So, um, one of the, one of the things 276 00:13:01,495 --> 00:13:04,775 that actually ne necessitated this, um, new 277 00:13:05,655 --> 00:13:07,855 monument management plan was the reinstatement 278 00:13:07,915 --> 00:13:10,415 of the original boundaries of the monument. 279 00:13:10,675 --> 00:13:13,855 So the same plan that applied to kind 280 00:13:13,855 --> 00:13:17,095 of the shrunken boundaries from Trump, um, you know, 281 00:13:17,095 --> 00:13:20,335 wouldn't necessarily cover, uh, the entirety of the monument 282 00:13:20,515 --> 00:13:23,575 as it, as it now stands under the, the Biden proclamations. 283 00:13:23,575 --> 00:13:26,455 So I think that was a big planning change, um, 284 00:13:26,755 --> 00:13:29,975 and there is some interest in making sure that this plan, 285 00:13:30,115 --> 00:13:31,415 um, comes out this year. 286 00:13:31,905 --> 00:13:33,975 - Makes sense. Davina, 287 00:13:34,195 --> 00:13:37,335 as we're into this public comment period in BLM, 288 00:13:37,405 --> 00:13:39,615 looking now at the, the feedback 289 00:13:39,615 --> 00:13:43,015 that's coming in on the alternatives, is there anything, uh, 290 00:13:43,125 --> 00:13:44,935 left out of alternative e 291 00:13:44,955 --> 00:13:47,415 or that the, uh, that you'd like 292 00:13:47,415 --> 00:13:49,215 to see strengthened in the final 293 00:13:49,215 --> 00:13:50,575 management plan when that gets done? 294 00:13:52,015 --> 00:13:54,615 - I think the most important thing, as Lauren mentioned, 295 00:13:54,615 --> 00:13:56,855 and I had mentioned, you know, 18 months of, uh, 296 00:13:57,205 --> 00:14:00,295 coal commission and subcommittees, um, from each 297 00:14:00,295 --> 00:14:04,015 of the tribes coming together, I feel that, uh, 298 00:14:04,795 --> 00:14:07,375 we definitely intertwined 299 00:14:07,555 --> 00:14:09,055 or woven in a lot 300 00:14:09,055 --> 00:14:11,655 of our indigenous knowledges in terms of strengthening. 301 00:14:11,895 --> 00:14:15,775 I think that is as, as this is just a draft right now. 302 00:14:16,075 --> 00:14:19,175 And that is why input public input is really important 303 00:14:19,175 --> 00:14:21,335 because that's, as tribes, 304 00:14:21,335 --> 00:14:23,335 that's the most important thing we want, is 305 00:14:23,355 --> 00:14:25,895 to work collaboratively, not only with agencies, 306 00:14:25,915 --> 00:14:28,535 but with also the public as well. 307 00:14:28,795 --> 00:14:31,975 And so to hear what their public comments are, 308 00:14:32,275 --> 00:14:34,775 we definitely wanna take that into consideration. 309 00:14:35,435 --> 00:14:38,135 Um, but the most important thing is that, um, 310 00:14:38,845 --> 00:14:42,535 that indigenous knowledges is implemented in this, 311 00:14:42,555 --> 00:14:43,655 uh, management plan. 312 00:14:44,235 --> 00:14:46,215 - Davina, I have a follow up question for you. 313 00:14:46,315 --> 00:14:48,215 If people are reading through the plan 314 00:14:48,235 --> 00:14:49,295 and they notice things 315 00:14:49,725 --> 00:14:52,325 that they think maybe don't protect wildlife enough 316 00:14:52,425 --> 00:14:56,525 or are, are not protecting cultural sites should, 317 00:14:56,585 --> 00:14:59,005 can they reach out to the coalition about that? 318 00:14:59,265 --> 00:15:00,925 Um, before submitting comments? 319 00:15:00,985 --> 00:15:02,525 What's the best way to go about that? 320 00:15:02,625 --> 00:15:04,205 If people are really, you know, 321 00:15:04,205 --> 00:15:05,565 interested in providing their feedback, 322 00:15:05,565 --> 00:15:08,125 but they don't wanna accidentally, um, 323 00:15:08,765 --> 00:15:10,405 undercut the tribal knowledge? 324 00:15:12,215 --> 00:15:16,135 - Absolutely. I, right now, uh, we are, we've had a couple, 325 00:15:16,455 --> 00:15:18,415 a number of public hearing comments, 326 00:15:19,405 --> 00:15:21,215 some we just completed last night, 327 00:15:21,275 --> 00:15:23,615 our second virtual public hearing comment. 328 00:15:24,315 --> 00:15:27,215 Um, but we still have three more in person 329 00:15:27,715 --> 00:15:29,975 and I really encourage those to 330 00:15:30,595 --> 00:15:32,255 attend those public hearing comments 331 00:15:32,435 --> 00:15:34,775 and engage with, um, the commission 332 00:15:35,195 --> 00:15:37,015 and coalition, uh, leadership. 333 00:15:37,375 --> 00:15:40,055 'cause we definitely want to hear if there's something 334 00:15:40,055 --> 00:15:43,375 that you're unsure of or you need more, um, explanation 335 00:15:43,435 --> 00:15:45,695 or clarification on, definitely come 336 00:15:46,035 --> 00:15:48,095 and, you know, engage with us as well. 337 00:15:48,335 --> 00:15:51,255 'cause we are there alongside with the, um, agencies. 338 00:15:51,565 --> 00:15:53,415 - Cool. We'll make sure to drop the links 339 00:15:53,415 --> 00:15:54,415 to those in our show notes. 340 00:15:55,275 --> 00:15:56,575 - Lauren, I wanna ask about 341 00:15:57,035 --> 00:15:59,895 how this plan balances the preservation 342 00:15:59,955 --> 00:16:03,135 and protection of cultural sites with the increased 343 00:16:03,705 --> 00:16:07,615 recreation and visitation that we know comes along 344 00:16:07,725 --> 00:16:09,895 with a national monument designation. 345 00:16:10,755 --> 00:16:13,255 Did BLM manage to, to thread that needle here? 346 00:16:14,775 --> 00:16:18,015 - I think in the preferred alternative, um, there is a, 347 00:16:18,335 --> 00:16:19,775 a recognition that, 348 00:16:20,555 --> 00:16:24,175 and a kind of hearkening back to the proclamation that says, 349 00:16:24,295 --> 00:16:27,255 well, rec recreation is an allowed use of the monument. 350 00:16:27,955 --> 00:16:31,135 Um, the, the proclamation requires 351 00:16:31,165 --> 00:16:33,175 that the management plan protects 352 00:16:33,405 --> 00:16:35,255 what it calls monument objects. 353 00:16:35,395 --> 00:16:38,415 So monument objects can be, you know, 354 00:16:38,415 --> 00:16:39,775 many important things in the monument 355 00:16:39,775 --> 00:16:41,495 that are listed in the proclamation. 356 00:16:42,035 --> 00:16:45,095 Uh, so cultural resources, plants, animals. 357 00:16:46,235 --> 00:16:49,335 And with this in mind, I think the plan intends to, 358 00:16:49,335 --> 00:16:51,455 you know, make sure that there is still public access 359 00:16:51,475 --> 00:16:53,095 to the monument, um, 360 00:16:53,155 --> 00:16:55,695 and make sure that people are still able to, you know, 361 00:16:55,695 --> 00:16:58,695 recreate, but that there's monitoring of the impacts of 362 00:16:58,695 --> 00:17:01,135 that access, that there's, you know, 363 00:17:01,575 --> 00:17:04,895 adaptive management practices, so things like closures 364 00:17:04,895 --> 00:17:07,135 to areas that we're seeing a lot of impacts. 365 00:17:07,135 --> 00:17:08,695 Things like seasonal closures 366 00:17:08,715 --> 00:17:12,215 or closures for ceremony, closures for, um, 367 00:17:12,555 --> 00:17:13,815 the land to be able to rest. 368 00:17:14,555 --> 00:17:17,135 Um, but also, you know, making sure that people are able to, 369 00:17:17,355 --> 00:17:20,015 you know, recreate in these landscapes in a way 370 00:17:20,015 --> 00:17:22,935 that's respectful of the sacred nature of this landscape, 371 00:17:23,075 --> 00:17:25,855 but kind of also respectful of, of, um, 372 00:17:26,045 --> 00:17:27,335 that access for folks. 373 00:17:28,115 --> 00:17:30,255 - And I suppose all of that gets multiplied when you're 374 00:17:30,255 --> 00:17:32,655 talking about off-roading, OHV use. 375 00:17:33,275 --> 00:17:36,775 Uh, how did the, the plan do in terms of identifying areas 376 00:17:36,775 --> 00:17:38,775 where it is safe 377 00:17:38,775 --> 00:17:40,775 or appropriate to do that versus areas that 378 00:17:40,775 --> 00:17:42,015 that need to be closed off? 379 00:17:42,845 --> 00:17:46,495 - Sure. So under the per alternative, currently, uh, 380 00:17:46,495 --> 00:17:49,965 the majority of the monument is classified as OHP limited. 381 00:17:50,185 --> 00:17:53,005 And this classification really, uh, means 382 00:17:53,115 --> 00:17:55,365 that there's a little bit, gives the commission 383 00:17:55,385 --> 00:17:58,125 and the agency's a little more time to determine how, 384 00:17:58,185 --> 00:18:00,925 you know, folks are using these OHP areas. 385 00:18:01,265 --> 00:18:02,845 Um, and it's, it's a little more adaptive, 386 00:18:02,875 --> 00:18:04,325 it's a little bit more malleable. 387 00:18:04,665 --> 00:18:05,805 Um, instead of, you know, saying 388 00:18:05,805 --> 00:18:08,525 that this is areas either completely open 389 00:18:08,625 --> 00:18:11,045 or completely closed, um, it allows 390 00:18:11,065 --> 00:18:14,365 for a little bit more flexibility, um, to identify, oh, 391 00:18:14,395 --> 00:18:16,725 well perhaps folks from the Navajo nation are, 392 00:18:16,785 --> 00:18:20,085 are using these roads to, um, access 393 00:18:20,795 --> 00:18:22,005 wood harvest areas. 394 00:18:22,505 --> 00:18:24,805 Um, and making sure that, you know, 395 00:18:24,805 --> 00:18:26,365 we're not cutting off that type of access. 396 00:18:26,425 --> 00:18:28,205 But also making sure that there's areas 397 00:18:28,235 --> 00:18:31,165 that are seeing impacts to cultural resources 398 00:18:31,165 --> 00:18:32,845 that are seeing impacts to wildlife 399 00:18:32,845 --> 00:18:34,245 or plants from OHB use, 400 00:18:34,245 --> 00:18:37,485 that those areas can be closed either, you know, seasonally 401 00:18:37,705 --> 00:18:40,285 or can be closed, um, for periods 402 00:18:40,285 --> 00:18:41,325 of time for landscape rest. 403 00:18:42,465 --> 00:18:45,125 - Um, Davina, I know you mentioned that you guys, 404 00:18:45,385 --> 00:18:48,925 the coalition are hold is holding, um, public hearings 405 00:18:49,105 --> 00:18:52,165 for the public to, to provide feedback on the plan 406 00:18:52,165 --> 00:18:53,165 and to learn about the plan. 407 00:18:53,665 --> 00:18:56,045 Um, are those happening in tribal communities 408 00:18:56,145 --> 00:18:59,045 and are you doing any other tribal, um, 409 00:18:59,405 --> 00:19:02,645 outreach about the plan in communities on reservations 410 00:19:02,785 --> 00:19:04,125 and tribal areas? 411 00:19:05,265 --> 00:19:06,845 - So the outreach, um, 412 00:19:07,325 --> 00:19:10,365 I mean it is under the BLM website in terms of 413 00:19:10,365 --> 00:19:11,725 where the public hearing comm is, 414 00:19:11,745 --> 00:19:15,125 but we wanted to go further in terms of engaging 415 00:19:15,155 --> 00:19:16,565 with our tribal community. 416 00:19:16,585 --> 00:19:18,965 So our coalition staff, um, 417 00:19:19,685 --> 00:19:21,805 Harrison Gorman is a community director 418 00:19:21,985 --> 00:19:25,805 and he has, um, engaged with each of the commission 419 00:19:26,265 --> 00:19:29,685 and coalition leaders, um, in their communities 420 00:19:30,465 --> 00:19:32,245 to ha set up. 421 00:19:32,385 --> 00:19:35,805 Um, we have a public, uh, screening that's been, um, 422 00:19:35,805 --> 00:19:40,765 conducted also, um, just background about the, the Bearers, 423 00:19:40,825 --> 00:19:43,205 our tribal coalition, the resource management plan. 424 00:19:43,955 --> 00:19:45,805 Also, another area that, um, 425 00:19:45,985 --> 00:19:48,605 our comms director is utilizing is radio 426 00:19:48,605 --> 00:19:50,725 because a number of these tribal communities, 427 00:19:50,725 --> 00:19:54,205 their main access is radio, so utilizing radio, 428 00:19:54,305 --> 00:19:56,685 but also newspaper in the Navajo Times. 429 00:19:57,385 --> 00:19:58,805 Um, commissioner Uni to 430 00:19:58,965 --> 00:20:00,605 and I, um, with the support 431 00:20:00,605 --> 00:20:04,245 of the comms director implemented an op-ed about the Bears 432 00:20:04,245 --> 00:20:05,605 Ears Resource Management plan. 433 00:20:05,745 --> 00:20:09,525 So, um, definitely have the staff that's collaborating 434 00:20:09,525 --> 00:20:11,845 with the agencies in terms of getting that word out 435 00:20:11,845 --> 00:20:12,925 to our tribal communities. 436 00:20:13,505 --> 00:20:14,685 - And then what comes next? 437 00:20:14,685 --> 00:20:16,805 What kind of timeframe are we on? 438 00:20:16,965 --> 00:20:19,005 You mentioned hopefully BLM getting this 439 00:20:19,035 --> 00:20:20,365 done by the end of the year. 440 00:20:20,945 --> 00:20:24,685 Um, how long is the public comment process and then, uh, 441 00:20:24,785 --> 00:20:27,805 and then what comes between point A and point B 442 00:20:27,805 --> 00:20:29,205 and hopefully having this management 443 00:20:29,235 --> 00:20:31,045 plan, uh, locked in place? 444 00:20:31,875 --> 00:20:35,365 - Sure. Um, so the end of the public comment period 445 00:20:35,945 --> 00:20:37,245 is June 11th. 446 00:20:38,145 --> 00:20:39,725 So that's important for folks to know 447 00:20:39,825 --> 00:20:41,565 for submitting public comments, um, 448 00:20:41,565 --> 00:20:44,085 and for also attending these, these public comment hearings. 449 00:20:44,825 --> 00:20:49,525 And then following that, there's sort of a, a, um, set 450 00:20:49,525 --> 00:20:52,485 of review periods that lead up to kind 451 00:20:52,485 --> 00:20:55,405 of the final release date of the plan, which we are hoping, 452 00:20:55,745 --> 00:21:00,045 uh, in sort of late, um, fall, uh, 453 00:21:00,095 --> 00:21:01,725 early spring next year. 454 00:21:02,305 --> 00:21:04,685 That's kind of the, the, uh, deadline 455 00:21:05,225 --> 00:21:06,325 for releasing the plan. 456 00:21:06,425 --> 00:21:09,125 Uh, but there's a series of, uh, government review periods 457 00:21:09,125 --> 00:21:11,685 and then also some review periods by the commission, uh, 458 00:21:11,685 --> 00:21:14,125 where the plan will sort of be, uh, reviewed, 459 00:21:14,125 --> 00:21:15,805 public comments will be reviewed 460 00:21:15,945 --> 00:21:18,885 and then incorporated into the plan, uh, responded to. 461 00:21:18,985 --> 00:21:21,285 So any substantive public comments that are received, 462 00:21:22,145 --> 00:21:25,045 any comments that include new information, any comments 463 00:21:25,115 --> 00:21:28,005 that have, um, you know, specific questions, 464 00:21:28,405 --> 00:21:30,805 specific information that could be, uh, responded 465 00:21:30,805 --> 00:21:33,125 to in the plan will be, will be responded to 466 00:21:33,185 --> 00:21:34,525 by the agencies, um, 467 00:21:34,915 --> 00:21:36,405 also in collaboration with the commission. 468 00:21:36,915 --> 00:21:39,685 - Awesome. Well, I wanna just open the floor really quick 469 00:21:39,685 --> 00:21:40,725 and ask both of you. 470 00:21:40,725 --> 00:21:42,365 Is there anything else you want people 471 00:21:42,365 --> 00:21:43,605 to know about this plan? 472 00:21:43,825 --> 00:21:47,045 Um, either it's historic significance 473 00:21:47,265 --> 00:21:49,565 or, um, what's actually in it? 474 00:21:51,385 --> 00:21:52,765 - For me, it's a bit of both 475 00:21:52,795 --> 00:21:55,805 because it is historic in terms of tribal input. 476 00:21:55,965 --> 00:21:59,365 I think that's the one thing I, as I've, I I'll share, 477 00:21:59,635 --> 00:22:01,325 attending some of the public hearing. 478 00:22:01,805 --> 00:22:05,925 I think there's this hesitancy from non-natives to engage. 479 00:22:06,185 --> 00:22:09,685 And that is why we felt this is the time to definitely, 480 00:22:09,685 --> 00:22:11,205 this is what collaboration looks like. 481 00:22:11,905 --> 00:22:16,525 And, um, I know also that change is hard 482 00:22:16,945 --> 00:22:21,085 and so we're, you know, it's, it's, it's gonna be difficult, 483 00:22:21,145 --> 00:22:23,085 but that's why we as commission 484 00:22:23,105 --> 00:22:26,165 and coalition felt this would be a perfect time at these 485 00:22:26,165 --> 00:22:29,325 public hearing, public comment hearings to engage with us 486 00:22:29,425 --> 00:22:31,365 and to get that clarification. 487 00:22:31,625 --> 00:22:34,405 And, and rather than this assumption 488 00:22:34,745 --> 00:22:37,205 of whether it's gonna be like, oh, everything's gonna close, 489 00:22:37,205 --> 00:22:39,925 there's gonna be no access, which is not the case. 490 00:22:40,665 --> 00:22:44,365 Um, so I encourage, you know, with the remaining of the, 491 00:22:44,505 --> 00:22:48,285 the in-person public comment hearings, um, to attend 492 00:22:48,345 --> 00:22:49,565 and to engage with us. 493 00:22:49,705 --> 00:22:50,845 And so I, 494 00:22:50,845 --> 00:22:53,965 and I hope, you know, we can continue to move forward in 495 00:22:53,965 --> 00:22:56,445 that, um, that, that aspect. So. 496 00:22:57,195 --> 00:22:58,845 - Awesome. Anything from you, Lauren? 497 00:23:00,155 --> 00:23:03,325 - Sure. Yeah, I think I'll just echo Dina's, um, comments 498 00:23:03,515 --> 00:23:05,885 that I think the commission is really excited to hear 499 00:23:05,995 --> 00:23:08,165 what the public has to say about this plan, 500 00:23:08,865 --> 00:23:12,165 and that this plan does really reflect extensive tribal 501 00:23:12,295 --> 00:23:16,085 input collaboration, um, also compromise in some areas, 502 00:23:16,865 --> 00:23:21,025 but that it's really innovative and it's new and exciting. 503 00:23:21,405 --> 00:23:23,345 Um, if you read through the plan, 504 00:23:23,345 --> 00:23:26,945 you'll see almost every section includes traditional 505 00:23:26,945 --> 00:23:28,465 indigenous knowledge, um, 506 00:23:28,565 --> 00:23:32,265 and includes, uh, many other aspects of tribal expertise 507 00:23:32,265 --> 00:23:36,265 that are pretty foreign to monument management plans 508 00:23:36,405 --> 00:23:37,705 and resource management plans. 509 00:23:37,765 --> 00:23:40,625 So this is a new type of plan, um, 510 00:23:40,625 --> 00:23:41,905 and it's exciting to see 511 00:23:42,215 --> 00:23:44,865 that it might potentially get implemented, um, 512 00:23:44,865 --> 00:23:46,245 that it's getting out to the public. 513 00:23:46,745 --> 00:23:48,765 And we're excited for the next steps. 514 00:23:49,505 --> 00:23:51,045 - All right. Well, we'll leave it there. 515 00:23:51,585 --> 00:23:54,885 Davina Smith, Navajo Nation representative on the Bears Ears 516 00:23:54,885 --> 00:23:56,045 Intertribal Coalition, 517 00:23:56,505 --> 00:23:59,965 and Lauren Henson, collaboration, collaborative Management 518 00:23:59,965 --> 00:24:01,285 and Tribal Support Specialist 519 00:24:01,545 --> 00:24:03,525 for the Bears Ears Intertribal Coalition. 520 00:24:03,735 --> 00:24:05,245 Thank you both for being here today. 521 00:24:05,895 --> 00:24:07,445 - Thank you so much. Thank you. 522 00:24:13,245 --> 00:24:14,345 - In good news this week, 523 00:24:14,705 --> 00:24:16,665 Democrats in the House are asking the government 524 00:24:16,665 --> 00:24:19,825 accountability office to investigate foreign owned companies 525 00:24:19,825 --> 00:24:21,625 that mine on US public lands. 526 00:24:22,125 --> 00:24:24,545 And a letter to the GAO the lawmakers wrote 527 00:24:24,545 --> 00:24:26,745 that there is evidence that companies seeking federal 528 00:24:26,745 --> 00:24:29,945 mineral leases may be subsidiaries of foreign companies, 529 00:24:30,055 --> 00:24:32,425 including adversarial countries accused 530 00:24:32,425 --> 00:24:34,985 of serious human rights and environmental violations. 531 00:24:35,645 --> 00:24:37,505 Now, maybe I'm getting ahead of my skis here, 532 00:24:37,645 --> 00:24:39,825 but I could see a world in which the same lawmakers 533 00:24:39,825 --> 00:24:42,905 introduce legislation barring these companies from operating 534 00:24:42,905 --> 00:24:44,585 on public lands in the United States, 535 00:24:44,795 --> 00:24:45,905 which would be pretty awesome. 536 00:24:46,405 --> 00:24:48,865 But first, let's see what the GAO report finds, 537 00:24:58,565 --> 00:25:00,025 - And that'll do it for us today. 538 00:25:00,405 --> 00:25:02,505 Be sure to check out the links in the show notes 539 00:25:02,565 --> 00:25:04,945 to learn more about submitting public comments on 540 00:25:04,945 --> 00:25:06,505 that Bears Ears Management Plan. 541 00:25:06,965 --> 00:25:09,625 You can submit a comment just broadly in support 542 00:25:09,645 --> 00:25:12,105 of the tribal plan if you don't have anything specific 543 00:25:12,125 --> 00:25:14,385 to add, but of course, specific feedback 544 00:25:14,385 --> 00:25:15,425 always goes even farther. 545 00:25:16,085 --> 00:25:17,665 And always feel free to reach out 546 00:25:17,665 --> 00:25:19,065 to us here at the landscape 547 00:25:19,185 --> 00:25:22,505 that email is podcast@westernpriorities.org. 548 00:25:23,005 --> 00:25:25,505 - Thanks again to Davina and Lauren for their time today. 549 00:25:25,805 --> 00:25:27,825 And thank you for listening to the Landscape.