1 00:00:00,575 --> 00:00:00,615 - 2 00:00:07,045 --> 00:00:09,855 - Welcome to the Landscape, your show about America's parks 3 00:00:09,855 --> 00:00:10,935 and public lands. 4 00:00:10,995 --> 00:00:13,255 I'm Erin Weiss with the Center for Western Priorities 5 00:00:13,795 --> 00:00:14,895 in Denver, Colorado. 6 00:00:15,375 --> 00:00:18,095 Thawing out looking a little less wintry here this week. 7 00:00:19,075 --> 00:00:21,295 - And I'm Kate Retinger in Salt Lake City, 8 00:00:21,295 --> 00:00:22,695 where it is also sunny. 9 00:00:23,185 --> 00:00:25,135 We've got an exciting episode for you today. 10 00:00:25,375 --> 00:00:26,375 I spoke with the new 11 00:00:26,435 --> 00:00:28,815 and inaugural CEO of the foundation 12 00:00:28,875 --> 00:00:30,615 for America's Public Lands. 13 00:00:30,995 --> 00:00:33,495 The foundation is the Congressionally Chartered nonprofit 14 00:00:33,525 --> 00:00:35,575 that will work with the Bureau of Land Management 15 00:00:35,795 --> 00:00:38,175 to leverage the power of private philanthropy 16 00:00:38,195 --> 00:00:40,895 to help the BLM better steward our public lands. 17 00:00:41,225 --> 00:00:42,735 We'll hear all about that in a second, 18 00:00:42,915 --> 00:00:44,335 but first, let's do the news. 19 00:00:45,565 --> 00:00:47,655 - Well, if you listen to our last episode, 20 00:00:47,675 --> 00:00:50,895 you may remember me talking about Natural asset companies 21 00:00:50,895 --> 00:00:52,615 or nacs in our new segment. 22 00:00:52,875 --> 00:00:55,175 That's a, a novel financial tool. 23 00:00:55,675 --> 00:00:58,535 It would essentially allow the value of nature 24 00:00:58,675 --> 00:01:01,175 to be traded on Wall Street, not just land values, 25 00:01:01,635 --> 00:01:05,775 but the whole economic value of ecosystems. 26 00:01:06,315 --> 00:01:09,495 Uh, how all of that works is a bit vague 27 00:01:09,555 --> 00:01:10,695 and also complicated, 28 00:01:10,955 --> 00:01:13,655 but all of it was enough to scare 29 00:01:14,165 --> 00:01:16,855 Anticon conservationists into fighting a proposal 30 00:01:17,165 --> 00:01:19,335 that would allow NACS to be listed 31 00:01:19,475 --> 00:01:21,655 and traded on the New York Stock Exchange. 32 00:01:22,075 --> 00:01:24,615 Uh, I wrote up an explainer on nacs. 33 00:01:24,995 --> 00:01:27,175 Uh, we'll link to that in the show notes. 34 00:01:27,435 --> 00:01:30,175 The short version of all of this is the proposal is dead 35 00:01:30,175 --> 00:01:33,855 for the moment taken down by a right wing conspiracy theory, 36 00:01:34,285 --> 00:01:37,735 that was enough to scare the New York Stock Exchange into 37 00:01:37,805 --> 00:01:39,095 pulling the whole proposal. 38 00:01:40,195 --> 00:01:43,175 The ultimate irony here is that whether 39 00:01:43,315 --> 00:01:45,855 or not NACS ever ultimately worked 40 00:01:45,995 --> 00:01:47,695 or turned a profit for investors, 41 00:01:48,245 --> 00:01:50,055 they were at least a proposal, 42 00:01:50,895 --> 00:01:53,375 a step towards a free market climate solution. 43 00:01:53,915 --> 00:01:57,415 And the f folks who took down this proposal up 44 00:01:57,415 --> 00:01:59,575 until a few minutes ago, they all claim 45 00:01:59,595 --> 00:02:02,135 to support free market climate solutions. 46 00:02:02,675 --> 00:02:03,895 Now, right now, you can't see me. 47 00:02:03,975 --> 00:02:07,215 I am given a big old Jim Halpert stare right now in the 48 00:02:07,215 --> 00:02:09,935 direction of Congressman John Curtis, who is the founder 49 00:02:09,935 --> 00:02:11,935 of the Conservative Climate Caucus. 50 00:02:12,515 --> 00:02:14,975 Curtis has written over and over 51 00:02:15,035 --> 00:02:18,055 and over again about how the free market is the key 52 00:02:18,055 --> 00:02:19,135 to solving climate change. 53 00:02:19,795 --> 00:02:22,255 But the very second Wall Street shows up 54 00:02:22,255 --> 00:02:25,295 and says, Hey, look, here's a free market climate solution. 55 00:02:25,845 --> 00:02:27,455 John Curtis introduced a bill 56 00:02:27,455 --> 00:02:30,335 to block natural asset companies from ever 57 00:02:30,385 --> 00:02:31,735 doing business in Utah. 58 00:02:32,525 --> 00:02:35,095 That is not how the free market works, folks. 59 00:02:35,565 --> 00:02:37,215 That is straight up hypocrisy. 60 00:02:38,265 --> 00:02:40,875 - Next up, the BLM recently proposed a plan 61 00:02:40,875 --> 00:02:43,515 to encourage solar development on public lands. 62 00:02:43,935 --> 00:02:46,835 The M's. Western Solar Plan was first adopted 63 00:02:46,835 --> 00:02:49,275 during the Obama Administration in 2012, 64 00:02:49,855 --> 00:02:52,275 and it basically identified public lands in the West 65 00:02:52,275 --> 00:02:54,435 that are suitable for commercial scale, solar, 66 00:02:54,775 --> 00:02:57,315 and conducted preemptive environmental analysis 67 00:02:57,315 --> 00:02:58,995 to help streamline the permitting process 68 00:02:59,305 --> 00:03:01,245 for developing solar on those lands. 69 00:03:01,795 --> 00:03:05,725 This proposed update would add 5.4 million acres in Idaho, 70 00:03:05,755 --> 00:03:08,965 Montana, Oregon, Washington, and Wyoming to that plan. 71 00:03:09,705 --> 00:03:12,805 In total, the updated plan identifies 22 million acres 72 00:03:12,805 --> 00:03:14,245 that would be open for development. 73 00:03:15,025 --> 00:03:16,125 The BLM estimates 74 00:03:16,125 --> 00:03:19,405 that solar development is likely on about 700,000 acres 75 00:03:19,405 --> 00:03:22,005 of land in the planning area over the next 20 years, 76 00:03:22,505 --> 00:03:24,325 and that these projects could produce up 77 00:03:24,325 --> 00:03:27,165 to 100,000 megawatts of electricity enough 78 00:03:27,165 --> 00:03:28,885 to power tens of millions of homes. 79 00:03:29,465 --> 00:03:31,405 The proposal is currently up for public comment, 80 00:03:31,425 --> 00:03:34,125 and the BLM set it hopes to finalize the plan by December. 81 00:03:34,655 --> 00:03:36,325 We'll have an episode on this topic 82 00:03:36,385 --> 00:03:37,965 for you guys in the next couple of weeks. 83 00:03:41,385 --> 00:03:44,805 Our guest today is Eileen Thompson, CEO at the Foundation 84 00:03:44,805 --> 00:03:46,485 for America's Public Lands. 85 00:03:46,865 --> 00:03:49,005 The Foundation is the official charitable partner 86 00:03:49,065 --> 00:03:50,645 of the Bureau of Land Management. 87 00:03:51,105 --> 00:03:53,205 Its job is to engage with local communities 88 00:03:53,205 --> 00:03:56,965 and the public on behalf of the agency, longtime landscape. 89 00:03:56,965 --> 00:03:59,365 Listeners may remember E's name from our episode 90 00:03:59,385 --> 00:04:00,405 on City Parks. 91 00:04:00,745 --> 00:04:03,365 She previously served as the Vice President of Strategy 92 00:04:03,505 --> 00:04:04,965 and Communications at the Trust 93 00:04:04,985 --> 00:04:07,525 for Public Land. Eing welcome back. 94 00:04:08,425 --> 00:04:10,485 - Hi, Kate. Great to be back. Thanks for having me. 95 00:04:11,705 --> 00:04:14,365 - So let's kick it off with, um, 96 00:04:14,825 --> 00:04:16,205 the most basic question of all. 97 00:04:16,275 --> 00:04:18,685 What is the foundation for America's public lands? 98 00:04:19,475 --> 00:04:21,845 - Well, the foundation for America's Public Lands is the 99 00:04:22,165 --> 00:04:23,605 official charitable partner for the 100 00:04:23,605 --> 00:04:24,805 Bureau of Land Management. 101 00:04:25,385 --> 00:04:29,205 We were chartered by Congress in 2017, uh, 102 00:04:29,385 --> 00:04:32,525 but we didn't get our operations kicked off until 2020. 103 00:04:32,865 --> 00:04:34,325 And since last year, 104 00:04:34,415 --> 00:04:37,325 we've been building out the foundation's leadership, 105 00:04:37,625 --> 00:04:39,445 our infrastructure, our priorities, 106 00:04:39,825 --> 00:04:42,285 and getting our inaugural strategic plan in place 107 00:04:42,385 --> 00:04:45,085 to help really drive the work that we'll we'll do. 108 00:04:45,745 --> 00:04:46,805 Um, you know, 109 00:04:46,805 --> 00:04:48,565 and in short, like our mission is really 110 00:04:48,565 --> 00:04:52,285 to connect all people to America's public lands and waters, 111 00:04:52,285 --> 00:04:56,045 and sustain these incredible places for now 112 00:04:56,065 --> 00:04:57,125 and future generations. 113 00:04:58,055 --> 00:05:00,985 - Awesome. So why does the BLM need a 114 00:05:00,985 --> 00:05:02,025 charitable organization? 115 00:05:02,095 --> 00:05:04,385 What is the sort of drive behind this? 116 00:05:05,985 --> 00:05:08,555 - Well, let me give you a little bit of context 117 00:05:08,695 --> 00:05:10,515 around the Bureau of Land Management. 118 00:05:10,775 --> 00:05:14,555 So the BLM manages the largest amount of land 119 00:05:14,735 --> 00:05:16,155 of any federal agency. 120 00:05:16,855 --> 00:05:21,275 Um, the BLM manages 245 million acres of land 121 00:05:21,935 --> 00:05:25,395 and 2,700 miles of wild and scenic rivers. 122 00:05:26,015 --> 00:05:29,835 And despite the scope and scale of the lands 123 00:05:29,835 --> 00:05:30,955 and waters that they manage, 124 00:05:31,385 --> 00:05:33,595 they have pretty limited resources 125 00:05:33,595 --> 00:05:34,595 to carry out their mission. 126 00:05:35,055 --> 00:05:36,995 Um, agencies like the US Fish 127 00:05:36,995 --> 00:05:38,915 and Wildlife Service, the National Park Service, 128 00:05:39,055 --> 00:05:41,755 the US Forest Service, they've had official charitable 129 00:05:41,755 --> 00:05:43,435 foundations to support 130 00:05:43,535 --> 00:05:46,875 and bring private dollars to their work for many years. 131 00:05:47,155 --> 00:05:50,475 I think the Park Service just, uh, celebrated 60 years 132 00:05:50,535 --> 00:05:54,155 for the National Park Foundation and, uh, the National Fish 133 00:05:54,155 --> 00:05:56,355 and Wildlife Foundation is celebrating its 40th year. 134 00:05:56,455 --> 00:06:00,525 So we have a lot of catching up to do, uh, to get, uh, 135 00:06:00,745 --> 00:06:02,285 to get this partnership in place 136 00:06:02,345 --> 00:06:04,085 and to be able to bring private dollars 137 00:06:04,145 --> 00:06:07,445 to really support the M'S multi-use mission. 138 00:06:08,505 --> 00:06:10,205 - I'm glad you mentioned those other foundations. 139 00:06:10,285 --> 00:06:11,605 I was gonna bring them up. Um, 140 00:06:11,605 --> 00:06:13,605 obviously this is not the first, um, 141 00:06:14,285 --> 00:06:16,725 congressionally Chartered Foundation for a federal agency. 142 00:06:17,345 --> 00:06:18,885 How will this be different 143 00:06:19,185 --> 00:06:21,005 and how will it be the same as, say, 144 00:06:21,005 --> 00:06:23,165 the National Park Foundation, which might be the one 145 00:06:23,165 --> 00:06:24,485 that people are most familiar with? 146 00:06:25,275 --> 00:06:28,645 - Sure, sure. So these Congressionally Chartered foundations 147 00:06:28,865 --> 00:06:32,085 are really important for our federal agencies. 148 00:06:32,155 --> 00:06:36,405 They help bring, uh, create an opportunity for private, 149 00:06:36,545 --> 00:06:39,805 the private sector and philanthropy to really augment 150 00:06:39,905 --> 00:06:42,365 and accelerate work that our agencies 151 00:06:42,985 --> 00:06:44,245 may have some limitations 152 00:06:44,305 --> 00:06:46,405 or not enough resources to accelerate. 153 00:06:46,505 --> 00:06:49,445 So, um, they have been in this business for a long time. 154 00:06:50,045 --> 00:06:51,405 I am very fortunate to be able 155 00:06:51,405 --> 00:06:53,605 to learn from my sister foundations 156 00:06:54,065 --> 00:06:56,285 and how I can really get the foundation 157 00:06:56,395 --> 00:06:57,565 established and built. 158 00:06:58,115 --> 00:07:01,165 What I'm most excited about Kate, is the ability 159 00:07:01,185 --> 00:07:02,365 to build this foundation. 160 00:07:02,785 --> 00:07:06,405 Um, for today, um, we certainly have a lot to, uh, to do 161 00:07:06,425 --> 00:07:07,525 and a lot of catching up to do, 162 00:07:07,905 --> 00:07:11,085 but as we look across the demands on our public lands 163 00:07:11,085 --> 00:07:14,565 and waters, we need to power homes and support communities. 164 00:07:14,865 --> 00:07:18,565 Um, people look to our public lands for jobs, um, 165 00:07:18,905 --> 00:07:20,845 and recreation is pretty important. 166 00:07:20,985 --> 00:07:23,485 And so as we're looking at building a foundation, 167 00:07:23,485 --> 00:07:25,285 we're thinking about the needs that we have today 168 00:07:25,345 --> 00:07:27,205 and how we would build an organization support 169 00:07:27,205 --> 00:07:28,765 that now into the future. 170 00:07:29,065 --> 00:07:32,205 And it's a really incredible opportunity for, um, 171 00:07:32,275 --> 00:07:33,605 private philanthropy 172 00:07:33,905 --> 00:07:36,565 and the private sector to, to really step in 173 00:07:36,585 --> 00:07:38,725 and bring important resources 174 00:07:38,785 --> 00:07:40,485 and partnerships to help us do that. 175 00:07:41,275 --> 00:07:44,565 - Awesome. So I'm really curious about how you're going 176 00:07:44,565 --> 00:07:46,725 to interface with the private sector, but, 177 00:07:46,725 --> 00:07:49,365 but first I wanna ask more about 178 00:07:49,425 --> 00:07:51,085 how you're gonna interface with the BLM. 179 00:07:51,085 --> 00:07:52,765 What does that partnership look like? 180 00:07:52,825 --> 00:07:54,885 How do you guys, do you talk 181 00:07:54,905 --> 00:07:57,085 to Tracy Stone Manning on a daily basis? 182 00:07:57,315 --> 00:07:59,165 Like what's the, what's the vibe there? 183 00:08:00,285 --> 00:08:02,135 - Yeah, you know, there's, one 184 00:08:02,135 --> 00:08:04,255 of the wonderful things about the BLM is, you know, 185 00:08:04,255 --> 00:08:07,935 there a workforce of roughly 10,000 strong doing 186 00:08:08,625 --> 00:08:11,815 great work across the American West in a couple 187 00:08:11,815 --> 00:08:13,615 of locations east of the Mississippi. 188 00:08:14,235 --> 00:08:17,215 Um, there is no shortage of incredible places 189 00:08:17,485 --> 00:08:19,935 that they are working and issues that they're addressing. 190 00:08:20,115 --> 00:08:22,535 So, um, you know, the foundation, we've, um, 191 00:08:22,645 --> 00:08:24,815 I've been in my role since, uh, early October, 192 00:08:25,395 --> 00:08:28,495 so I'm at the early stages now of really working with the, 193 00:08:28,565 --> 00:08:30,095 with the BLM to identify 194 00:08:30,095 --> 00:08:31,815 what their fundraising priorities are. 195 00:08:32,355 --> 00:08:35,775 Um, there's incredible leadership across the BLM 196 00:08:35,915 --> 00:08:37,135 who are career leaders. 197 00:08:37,645 --> 00:08:40,095 They're really working with me to help identify 198 00:08:40,225 --> 00:08:42,255 where they could use private philanthropy, 199 00:08:42,585 --> 00:08:44,615 where they have gaps, what are some 200 00:08:44,615 --> 00:08:45,735 of those challenging issues 201 00:08:45,795 --> 00:08:49,855 and opportunities to really sort of ensure that the lands 202 00:08:49,855 --> 00:08:52,415 and waters that they manage can meet the demands 203 00:08:52,415 --> 00:08:56,685 that we have for, um, a future of, uh, outdoor recreation 204 00:08:56,705 --> 00:08:58,805 and the growing demands that we're experiencing. 205 00:08:59,105 --> 00:09:01,805 Um, places where restoration's gonna be pretty important 206 00:09:01,865 --> 00:09:03,405 to ensure that the health 207 00:09:03,625 --> 00:09:05,525 and sustainability of these lands exist. 208 00:09:05,985 --> 00:09:07,645 And, um, and then down the road, 209 00:09:07,945 --> 00:09:09,925 how the foundation can support the transition 210 00:09:09,925 --> 00:09:10,925 to renewable energy. 211 00:09:11,025 --> 00:09:14,325 So we're, um, I'm, I'm partnering at all levels. 212 00:09:14,745 --> 00:09:17,405 Uh, really with the career staff, it's important 213 00:09:17,505 --> 00:09:19,125 to really understand what the work looks 214 00:09:19,125 --> 00:09:20,285 like and where the needs are. 215 00:09:20,785 --> 00:09:23,005 So it's, it's been a great partnership so far, 216 00:09:23,065 --> 00:09:25,685 and I'm, um, I'm really excited 217 00:09:26,065 --> 00:09:30,165 and in frankly, in awe of what, what the VLM staff do 218 00:09:30,425 --> 00:09:33,405 and how we can bring private partnership and, 219 00:09:33,425 --> 00:09:35,565 and financial resources to really augment 220 00:09:35,565 --> 00:09:36,645 and accelerate what they're doing. 221 00:09:37,355 --> 00:09:40,525 - Awesome. So, um, I said earlier 222 00:09:40,525 --> 00:09:43,205 that we'd circle back on the philanthropy side of things. 223 00:09:43,395 --> 00:09:44,885 Tell me a a little bit about that. 224 00:09:44,985 --> 00:09:48,125 Who are the private partners that you're looking to? 225 00:09:48,725 --> 00:09:49,765 I mean, I know that these, 226 00:09:49,765 --> 00:09:52,925 these partnerships will be more than just fundraising, but, 227 00:09:53,185 --> 00:09:55,285 but on the fundraising side, where, 228 00:09:55,315 --> 00:09:56,405 where's that gonna come from? 229 00:09:57,235 --> 00:09:58,685 - Well, I, you know, it's, 230 00:09:58,755 --> 00:10:01,685 it's interesting when I look across all the ways 231 00:10:01,835 --> 00:10:05,765 that the BLM implements their multi-use mission, um, 232 00:10:06,325 --> 00:10:08,245 a great place to start is saying, 233 00:10:08,385 --> 00:10:10,365 who really depends on these lands? 234 00:10:10,825 --> 00:10:14,765 Who really depends on the waters to, uh, for their business, 235 00:10:14,865 --> 00:10:19,605 for their communities, um, for their recreation, um, 236 00:10:20,465 --> 00:10:24,445 who needs the resources to support the, their livelihoods 237 00:10:24,445 --> 00:10:27,285 and the way of life in western communities? 238 00:10:27,865 --> 00:10:30,365 And so I think that's, that's like the best and, 239 00:10:30,425 --> 00:10:32,205 and first place that I'm focusing. 240 00:10:32,385 --> 00:10:34,165 Um, and I, and I think it's pretty important 241 00:10:34,185 --> 00:10:37,765 for the foundation to understand, you know, what, um, 242 00:10:38,475 --> 00:10:41,485 what are the ways that, uh, these communities 243 00:10:42,025 --> 00:10:43,245 and sectors of 244 00:10:43,665 --> 00:10:46,325 of our business community are really relying on the, on, 245 00:10:46,545 --> 00:10:48,725 on the access and availability 246 00:10:48,745 --> 00:10:50,325 of these lands to support their work. 247 00:10:50,745 --> 00:10:52,685 So I, I think those are some, some starts. 248 00:10:53,065 --> 00:10:57,325 Um, the foundation is also really thinking about 249 00:10:58,405 --> 00:11:00,335 what are some of the demands on public lands 250 00:11:00,395 --> 00:11:04,615 and how we can ensure that, um, you know, 251 00:11:04,755 --> 00:11:07,575 the recreation demands have gone up in recent years, 252 00:11:07,575 --> 00:11:09,095 particularly since the pandemic. 253 00:11:09,675 --> 00:11:13,495 And so there are an, a lot of, um, you know, 254 00:11:13,585 --> 00:11:17,255 folks in the recreation sector, the, um, hunting 255 00:11:17,275 --> 00:11:21,655 and fishing sector, um, that really count on having healthy, 256 00:11:21,655 --> 00:11:26,615 vibrant lands for connectivity, for wildlife, um, for access 257 00:11:26,755 --> 00:11:31,375 for, uh, hiking, camping, biking, ATVing, RVing, 258 00:11:31,835 --> 00:11:35,815 um, as well as thinking about, you know, we're in a, um, 259 00:11:35,875 --> 00:11:37,935 energy transition and really thinking about 260 00:11:37,955 --> 00:11:40,895 how we can produce the energy that our country needs. 261 00:11:40,955 --> 00:11:44,135 And so there's a lot of companies that have long used, 262 00:11:44,315 --> 00:11:45,535 uh, our public lands. 263 00:11:45,915 --> 00:11:49,335 Um, and so I, I think all these are opportunities for, um, 264 00:11:49,335 --> 00:11:52,015 these sectors to really engage and support the foundation 265 00:11:52,555 --> 00:11:54,685 and, um, really bring resources 266 00:11:54,685 --> 00:11:57,005 and partnerships so we can, we can continue 267 00:11:57,005 --> 00:11:58,645 to ensure that these lands exist. 268 00:11:59,905 --> 00:12:02,605 - Um, I'm curious, are, will, 269 00:12:02,715 --> 00:12:05,165 will you be accepting donations from like 270 00:12:05,165 --> 00:12:06,205 the general public as well? 271 00:12:07,625 --> 00:12:10,605 - Oh, absolutely. Um, you know, one thing that's exciting, 272 00:12:10,625 --> 00:12:14,605 you know, I'm, I'm a, I'm a power user of BBL M Land, 273 00:12:14,865 --> 00:12:18,245 and, um, when I think about my ability to sort of pull up 274 00:12:18,245 --> 00:12:21,285 to a trailhead, you can walk out of your car 275 00:12:21,545 --> 00:12:23,885 and step on to many areas 276 00:12:23,935 --> 00:12:26,125 where the BBL m has recreation access 277 00:12:26,345 --> 00:12:28,645 or, um, the ability to go 278 00:12:28,645 --> 00:12:30,525 and enjoy these lands is open to anyone. 279 00:12:30,555 --> 00:12:31,965 It's sort of the people's lands. 280 00:12:32,505 --> 00:12:35,245 And so we absolutely welcome supports. 281 00:12:35,265 --> 00:12:37,165 Um, we've got our website standing up 282 00:12:37,185 --> 00:12:41,005 and, um, welcome, uh, you know, everyone from, you know, 283 00:12:41,075 --> 00:12:44,285 individuals to, uh, you know, private foundations 284 00:12:44,345 --> 00:12:47,125 and philanthropies to, to corporations to support this. 285 00:12:47,605 --> 00:12:49,245 I think it's appropriate, you know, 286 00:12:49,375 --> 00:12:50,885 these are America's lands 287 00:12:51,185 --> 00:12:52,885 and these are places that we all value 288 00:12:52,985 --> 00:12:54,285 for a variety of different reasons. 289 00:12:54,705 --> 00:12:57,485 Um, and so we, we absolutely welcome support from, 290 00:12:57,515 --> 00:12:59,325 from all parts, including individuals. 291 00:12:59,895 --> 00:13:01,505 - Awesome. Um, 292 00:13:01,885 --> 00:13:04,625 so you mentioned the recreation pressures on BLM lands. 293 00:13:04,625 --> 00:13:06,945 This is no secret, it's something we've been seeing for 294 00:13:07,765 --> 00:13:09,665 the past two to three years just 295 00:13:10,245 --> 00:13:13,705 in it just record breaking visitation to BLM lands, 296 00:13:13,765 --> 00:13:17,145 and of course, um, that puts strain on these lands. 297 00:13:17,525 --> 00:13:20,865 Um, your first, the foundation's first public facing report 298 00:13:20,865 --> 00:13:22,865 came out in November, and it did focus on this 299 00:13:23,475 --> 00:13:26,625 recreation pressure on the, on the BLM lands, and, 300 00:13:26,845 --> 00:13:31,145 and it sort of looked at ways to improve recreation access 301 00:13:31,365 --> 00:13:34,505 and, um, manage that pressure. 302 00:13:34,925 --> 00:13:36,145 Can you tell us about that report 303 00:13:36,205 --> 00:13:38,105 and give us the, the sort 304 00:13:38,105 --> 00:13:40,185 of broad level view of what was in that? 305 00:13:40,815 --> 00:13:43,425 - Sure, sure. It's, it's probably helpful just 306 00:13:43,425 --> 00:13:45,985 to paint a little bit of context around this, 307 00:13:46,055 --> 00:13:49,945 this recreation, uh, outdoor recreation on public lands. 308 00:13:50,005 --> 00:13:52,665 So, um, on BLM lands alone, 309 00:13:53,045 --> 00:13:56,625 we have tracked about 80 million visitors who go 310 00:13:57,365 --> 00:13:59,985 to public, you know, visit public lands 311 00:13:59,985 --> 00:14:01,385 and waters managed by the BLM. 312 00:14:01,845 --> 00:14:03,865 Um, as I said a moment ago, like, 313 00:14:04,645 --> 00:14:06,625 we don't necessarily charge a fee 314 00:14:06,725 --> 00:14:08,665 or track access at every location 315 00:14:08,665 --> 00:14:10,225 where someone is able to access that. 316 00:14:10,325 --> 00:14:13,305 So, um, while we've tracked people, that's usually 317 00:14:13,305 --> 00:14:15,705 where you are putting in at a river put in 318 00:14:15,845 --> 00:14:17,105 or camping somewhere, 319 00:14:17,165 --> 00:14:19,385 and there's a mechanism where there's a transaction 320 00:14:19,385 --> 00:14:21,465 between a visitor and that place, 321 00:14:21,805 --> 00:14:23,625 but there's many more, um, places 322 00:14:23,675 --> 00:14:27,105 where people are accessing public lands on a regular basis 323 00:14:27,495 --> 00:14:28,625 that aren't tracked. 324 00:14:28,645 --> 00:14:30,625 And so it's a fairly conservative number. 325 00:14:31,325 --> 00:14:34,345 Um, we've also found just recently the Bureau 326 00:14:34,345 --> 00:14:38,105 of Economic Analysis, uh, released, uh, an update 327 00:14:38,165 --> 00:14:41,545 to the economic output of outdoor recreation in our country. 328 00:14:41,805 --> 00:14:44,945 And it's, uh, estimated at $1.1 trillion, 329 00:14:45,085 --> 00:14:49,065 and it accounts for about 2.2% of the US GDP. 330 00:14:49,645 --> 00:14:52,485 So what we're finding is that the, you know, 331 00:14:52,485 --> 00:14:54,045 we're seeing the trend lines continue 332 00:14:54,045 --> 00:14:55,365 to increase across the board. 333 00:14:55,785 --> 00:14:58,925 Um, there's greater demand than ever to be able to get out 334 00:14:59,065 --> 00:15:03,085 and enjoy, um, quality recreation experiences, um, 335 00:15:03,225 --> 00:15:04,285 on public lands. 336 00:15:05,125 --> 00:15:06,625 And so this has been an area 337 00:15:06,625 --> 00:15:08,985 where the foundation's been very focused 338 00:15:09,245 --> 00:15:12,225 and an area where the BLM really does need support. 339 00:15:12,845 --> 00:15:14,025 Um, it's, uh, 340 00:15:14,025 --> 00:15:16,425 outdoor recreation has been a part of the M'S work. 341 00:15:16,885 --> 00:15:20,825 Um, there was a report that they put out that will continue 342 00:15:20,825 --> 00:15:22,025 to elevate the importance 343 00:15:22,025 --> 00:15:23,905 of outdoor recreation on BLM lands. 344 00:15:24,365 --> 00:15:26,265 Uh, you can find that report. 345 00:15:26,265 --> 00:15:29,985 It's the 21st century blueprint for outdoor recreation. 346 00:15:30,565 --> 00:15:34,785 Um, and its aim is to start to put outdoor recreation on par 347 00:15:35,325 --> 00:15:38,465 as a, uh, for management alongside oil and gas 348 00:15:38,485 --> 00:15:40,105 and grazing within the BLM. 349 00:15:40,525 --> 00:15:43,185 And so that's a, that's a pretty important step and move. 350 00:15:43,245 --> 00:15:46,385 And so the foundation worked with the BLM to find ways 351 00:15:46,465 --> 00:15:49,905 to engage the public on weighing in on 352 00:15:50,125 --> 00:15:51,785 how we can really support 353 00:15:51,805 --> 00:15:55,465 and accelerate that vision for the BLM. 354 00:15:55,645 --> 00:15:59,665 Um, the foundation held three round tables, uh, one in dc, 355 00:15:59,765 --> 00:16:01,065 one in Vegas, and one virtually 356 00:16:01,065 --> 00:16:02,625 where we invited stakeholders come 357 00:16:02,625 --> 00:16:04,785 and were weigh in on that blueprint. 358 00:16:05,525 --> 00:16:07,625 Um, we had about 120 organizations 359 00:16:07,685 --> 00:16:09,225 and individuals provide input, 360 00:16:09,325 --> 00:16:11,745 and they offered a range of ideas 361 00:16:11,925 --> 00:16:16,025 and ways that they recommended, um, focusing our energy. 362 00:16:16,885 --> 00:16:21,065 And so, um, we've used that to really ground, uh, our work, 363 00:16:21,405 --> 00:16:24,545 uh, in the foundation to advance outdoor recreation 364 00:16:24,965 --> 00:16:27,185 and bring more attention and resources for that. 365 00:16:27,365 --> 00:16:31,385 So, um, we released a report, uh, at the end of last year 366 00:16:31,415 --> 00:16:33,625 that sort of culminated that feedback and 367 00:16:33,865 --> 00:16:37,185 provided some direction for where, um, the, 368 00:16:37,285 --> 00:16:40,825 the public recommends that the BLM focuses attention on 369 00:16:40,855 --> 00:16:42,225 through their blueprint. 370 00:16:42,815 --> 00:16:44,905 - Awesome. Yeah, that was a great report, 371 00:16:44,965 --> 00:16:48,025 and you guys even put together a handy one page summary 372 00:16:48,165 --> 00:16:49,745 of it, which I really appreciated. 373 00:16:50,205 --> 00:16:53,025 Um, and the one word that came up over 374 00:16:53,025 --> 00:16:54,425 and over again was partnerships. 375 00:16:54,565 --> 00:16:55,625 And I think, I mean, we've, 376 00:16:55,625 --> 00:16:56,945 we've talked about this a little bit before, 377 00:16:57,165 --> 00:16:59,665 but could you tell us a little bit more about 378 00:17:00,175 --> 00:17:02,425 what those partnerships might look like? 379 00:17:02,455 --> 00:17:06,745 Like what are, what organizations would give us maybe a, 380 00:17:06,805 --> 00:17:08,465 an example partnership, if you would? 381 00:17:08,975 --> 00:17:11,145 - Well, one, one partnership and, 382 00:17:11,165 --> 00:17:15,705 and an example, um, are companies that operate, uh, 383 00:17:15,705 --> 00:17:16,985 outdoor recreation businesses. 384 00:17:17,525 --> 00:17:21,465 Um, one of our board members, uh, Jess, uh, Turner, 385 00:17:21,685 --> 00:17:24,425 Wal Turner, um, is the, uh, 386 00:17:24,425 --> 00:17:26,385 heads up the outdoor recreation roundtable. 387 00:17:26,485 --> 00:17:28,505 And so they have, they're an organization 388 00:17:28,505 --> 00:17:31,985 that represents alto recreation businesses, um, across this, 389 00:17:32,005 --> 00:17:33,665 uh, across the outdoor recreation sector. 390 00:17:33,845 --> 00:17:36,665 And so they've been, uh, a good, um, 391 00:17:37,105 --> 00:17:39,505 a good advisor at this early stages 392 00:17:39,685 --> 00:17:43,385 to help us really tune into the needs of that sector, um, 393 00:17:43,525 --> 00:17:46,145 to create quality outdoor recreation experiences 394 00:17:46,645 --> 00:17:49,105 to really focus, like, where, where are there gaps? 395 00:17:49,295 --> 00:17:51,125 Where do we need to focus our attention? 396 00:17:51,785 --> 00:17:54,685 So, you know, we're sort of looking for a spectrum, um, 397 00:17:54,685 --> 00:17:57,565 helping us really understand what some of the gaps, issues, 398 00:17:57,565 --> 00:17:58,645 and opportunities are 399 00:17:59,065 --> 00:18:01,605 and, um, leaning on some partners like, um, 400 00:18:01,865 --> 00:18:03,325 the Outdoor Recreation Roundtable 401 00:18:03,325 --> 00:18:08,005 and it's, it's members, um, to, to say if we have 402 00:18:08,005 --> 00:18:10,525 to get started, where what's, what's something, um, 403 00:18:10,675 --> 00:18:13,205 that feels high value for lots of folks. 404 00:18:13,825 --> 00:18:18,525 Um, we've also, you know, asked for input, um, on, 405 00:18:18,985 --> 00:18:23,065 uh, understanding where are some of the, um, 406 00:18:23,335 --> 00:18:24,905 near term actions that 407 00:18:25,415 --> 00:18:27,825 different partners would be interested in. 408 00:18:28,005 --> 00:18:31,825 And some of that might be thinking big picture about 409 00:18:31,985 --> 00:18:36,385 connectivity for, um, uh, migration corridors 410 00:18:36,565 --> 00:18:37,705 and the BLM 411 00:18:37,965 --> 00:18:40,625 and, um, how we can make sure that there's access 412 00:18:40,625 --> 00:18:41,945 to land block lands 413 00:18:42,205 --> 00:18:46,505 or how we can kind of partner with communities that, 414 00:18:47,005 --> 00:18:48,505 uh, maybe lack signage 415 00:18:48,805 --> 00:18:51,385 and lack an understanding of the resources 416 00:18:51,385 --> 00:18:52,545 that they have in their community 417 00:18:52,565 --> 00:18:54,625 to make those more accessible 418 00:18:54,805 --> 00:18:57,025 and welcoming for people to understand 419 00:18:57,135 --> 00:18:59,865 what trails are available to their community 420 00:18:59,865 --> 00:19:00,905 or to their visitors. 421 00:19:01,005 --> 00:19:03,905 And so there's sort of a range of, there was a range 422 00:19:03,925 --> 00:19:08,265 of ideas sort of put forward, um, that, uh, go from 423 00:19:08,855 --> 00:19:10,785 some smaller things like, uh, 424 00:19:11,255 --> 00:19:13,545 smaller things like trail signage 425 00:19:13,605 --> 00:19:16,785 and helping people understand the resources they have all 426 00:19:16,785 --> 00:19:21,025 the way to, um, uh, are there, are there, um, 427 00:19:21,025 --> 00:19:22,065 more resources 428 00:19:22,245 --> 00:19:25,425 and awareness around the holistic needs of the found 429 00:19:25,645 --> 00:19:28,665 of the BLM that the foundation can help drive 430 00:19:28,665 --> 00:19:29,945 awareness around that. 431 00:19:30,045 --> 00:19:32,345 Um, the partners really elevated is areas 432 00:19:32,485 --> 00:19:33,505 for us to focus in on. 433 00:19:34,405 --> 00:19:37,985 - So I assume that some of these on the ground changes 434 00:19:38,835 --> 00:19:43,065 might be things like signage, trails, um, parking lots, 435 00:19:43,625 --> 00:19:46,545 bathrooms, I mean, uh, the obvious things. 436 00:19:46,725 --> 00:19:49,105 And then, um, are there also, 437 00:19:49,365 --> 00:19:52,625 are you guys also talking about things like permitting 438 00:19:52,965 --> 00:19:56,425 and, um, gosh, more sort of, uh, 439 00:19:57,225 --> 00:19:59,865 esoteric changes, for lack of a better word, ? 440 00:20:00,775 --> 00:20:03,545 - Yeah. You know, those types of issues arose as well. 441 00:20:03,765 --> 00:20:07,425 And so, you know, I I, those, those are on the table, um, 442 00:20:07,525 --> 00:20:09,145 for us to evaluate 443 00:20:09,145 --> 00:20:12,185 and see how we can really bring, um, bring resources 444 00:20:12,185 --> 00:20:13,665 and awareness to those issues. 445 00:20:14,525 --> 00:20:16,105 You know, I'll, I'll just share a story. 446 00:20:16,405 --> 00:20:19,185 Um, I, I live in Grand Junction 447 00:20:19,565 --> 00:20:23,265 and there's this wonderful, um, place managed 448 00:20:23,265 --> 00:20:25,185 by the BLM called Rattlesnake arches. 449 00:20:25,765 --> 00:20:28,425 Um, people around here who know it are often like, oh, 450 00:20:28,425 --> 00:20:30,745 don't tell people, but it's, it's a wonderful place. 451 00:20:31,205 --> 00:20:33,265 Um, it's the second highest concentration 452 00:20:33,265 --> 00:20:34,985 of natural arches in the country, 453 00:20:35,195 --> 00:20:36,785 aside from Arches National Park. 454 00:20:37,215 --> 00:20:38,585 It's managed by the BLM. 455 00:20:39,245 --> 00:20:41,665 Um, you search for it, you, 456 00:20:41,765 --> 00:20:44,305 you find a little bit about rattlesnake arches you drive. 457 00:20:44,305 --> 00:20:47,685 There's, I've, uh, uh, experienced this myself. 458 00:20:48,155 --> 00:20:50,685 It's little signage to get you there. Once you get there. 459 00:20:50,685 --> 00:20:52,165 There's sort of, not, not a lot 460 00:20:52,165 --> 00:20:54,365 of interpretive information about the site, 461 00:20:54,745 --> 00:20:57,205 but it's an outstanding place to go. 462 00:20:57,425 --> 00:20:59,565 You can walk right to the base of these arches. 463 00:20:59,565 --> 00:21:03,165 There's zero crowds. Um, it can be a bit remote. 464 00:21:03,745 --> 00:21:07,325 Um, but that's part of what's special about BLM lands. 465 00:21:07,425 --> 00:21:10,805 And, and so sometimes I think about rattlesnake arches 466 00:21:10,805 --> 00:21:12,525 where I pull into the parking lot, 467 00:21:12,635 --> 00:21:15,645 it's a single split rail fence that's maybe 10 feet long 468 00:21:15,995 --> 00:21:17,645 with a sign that's a little faded. 469 00:21:17,905 --> 00:21:19,165 And, um, you know, 470 00:21:19,185 --> 00:21:21,965 I'm pretty comfortable navigating my way in the back 471 00:21:21,965 --> 00:21:24,965 country, but that may not necessarily be the case for a lot 472 00:21:24,965 --> 00:21:27,565 of America who, you know, is looking 473 00:21:27,625 --> 00:21:30,645 for some really great quality experiences who are coming 474 00:21:30,705 --> 00:21:34,245 to towns like Grand Junction that want recreation visitors. 475 00:21:34,465 --> 00:21:37,685 And so how can we help support, uh, sort 476 00:21:37,685 --> 00:21:40,005 of better understanding and awareness of these resources? 477 00:21:40,065 --> 00:21:42,565 What's there? And then sort of stepping back 478 00:21:42,565 --> 00:21:45,645 and saying, Hey, BLM doesn't have, um, 479 00:21:46,035 --> 00:21:50,085 they can use more resources to support the, um, 480 00:21:51,075 --> 00:21:54,685 ability to manage these sites well, um, especially 481 00:21:54,685 --> 00:21:56,365 as visitation continues to improve. 482 00:21:56,545 --> 00:21:58,485 So there's a lot to do around this places, 483 00:21:58,545 --> 00:21:59,725 but I'm often inspired 484 00:21:59,725 --> 00:22:03,125 by rattles neck arches when I think about what access 485 00:22:03,465 --> 00:22:05,885 and, um, welcoming means for places 486 00:22:05,885 --> 00:22:09,845 because it's, it's often, um, outstanding experiences, 487 00:22:10,065 --> 00:22:12,645 but just not a lot of people know about them as they do, um, 488 00:22:12,715 --> 00:22:14,765 like the National Park Service sites. 489 00:22:16,025 --> 00:22:20,525 - So you guys sort of built off the bl m's own plan, um, 490 00:22:20,715 --> 00:22:22,805 solicited feedback, which is of course, 491 00:22:22,805 --> 00:22:25,925 something the BLM doesn't really have the capacity to do. 492 00:22:26,305 --> 00:22:29,045 Um, so you step in there, you get all this feedback, 493 00:22:29,065 --> 00:22:30,485 you have all this great information, 494 00:22:30,505 --> 00:22:31,565 and you put out a report. 495 00:22:32,235 --> 00:22:36,165 What comes next when it comes to the foundation partnering 496 00:22:36,165 --> 00:22:38,525 with the BLM to put these things into action? 497 00:22:38,555 --> 00:22:40,405 Like, where does the rubber meet the road here? 498 00:22:41,075 --> 00:22:42,845 - Yeah, that's a, that's a great question, Kate. 499 00:22:42,985 --> 00:22:46,445 Um, I think, you know, we're at the stage now where we're 500 00:22:47,335 --> 00:22:48,525 soliciting ideas 501 00:22:48,985 --> 00:22:52,485 and identifying where the energy is with folks outside 502 00:22:52,485 --> 00:22:54,245 of the foundation, outside of the BLM. 503 00:22:54,825 --> 00:22:59,725 Um, we're now ready to say where can we really put, 504 00:23:00,105 --> 00:23:01,725 um, resources 505 00:23:01,785 --> 00:23:04,285 and partnerships in place to help us move the needle? 506 00:23:04,985 --> 00:23:08,165 Um, I brought up gateway communities a little earlier. 507 00:23:08,735 --> 00:23:12,565 There are communities around the west that would really love 508 00:23:12,565 --> 00:23:16,005 to have, um, build a recreation economy 509 00:23:16,135 --> 00:23:17,525 where they can thrive. 510 00:23:17,555 --> 00:23:20,205 They have access to a lot of public lands. 511 00:23:20,665 --> 00:23:25,255 Um, they would love to position themselves as a destination, 512 00:23:25,635 --> 00:23:28,255 um, for tourism and visitation, 513 00:23:28,995 --> 00:23:30,615 and they need some support 514 00:23:30,715 --> 00:23:32,855 to really bolster the resources that are there. 515 00:23:33,355 --> 00:23:36,695 Um, some BLM sites don't have parking lots. 516 00:23:36,845 --> 00:23:38,375 Some, there's very little signage 517 00:23:38,555 --> 00:23:41,735 or routes that you could take when you're out in a place. 518 00:23:42,315 --> 00:23:44,735 Um, there's also some areas where, uh, 519 00:23:44,735 --> 00:23:49,605 there's outstanding examples of, um, petroglyphs that exist, 520 00:23:49,825 --> 00:23:53,205 but, um, some of those are experiencing, you know, 521 00:23:53,435 --> 00:23:54,525 vandalism and such. 522 00:23:54,525 --> 00:23:58,925 And so some, some areas might need more, um, uh, uh, 523 00:23:59,425 --> 00:24:02,485 you know, sort of law enforcement to help, um, ensure 524 00:24:02,625 --> 00:24:03,845 and preserve what's there. 525 00:24:04,065 --> 00:24:07,045 And so there's a, the one thing I've learned through this is 526 00:24:07,045 --> 00:24:08,765 that there's sort of no one size fits all. 527 00:24:09,265 --> 00:24:10,805 Um, we are ready 528 00:24:11,105 --> 00:24:14,525 and, um, looking for partners who wanna come in 529 00:24:14,525 --> 00:24:16,405 and help us solve some of these challenges 530 00:24:16,785 --> 00:24:19,725 and do some good to support the communities 531 00:24:19,725 --> 00:24:22,245 that depend on these lands, the recreationalists 532 00:24:22,345 --> 00:24:25,965 who wanna come and access them, the communities that have, 533 00:24:26,145 --> 00:24:29,845 uh, really, um, that understand the restoration that needs 534 00:24:29,845 --> 00:24:32,925 to happen and the stewardship of these lands over time. 535 00:24:33,025 --> 00:24:36,445 And so we're, um, we're developing this sort of ready 536 00:24:36,445 --> 00:24:38,805 to go list of places where there can be investment 537 00:24:38,865 --> 00:24:43,325 and, um, open to lots of conversations with, um, 538 00:24:43,595 --> 00:24:46,445 different sectors and companies and individuals 539 00:24:46,445 --> 00:24:49,605 and foundations that are interested in helping us really 540 00:24:49,895 --> 00:24:51,965 bring this, bring this opportunity to life. 541 00:24:52,945 --> 00:24:55,045 - So you did mention this earlier, which is 542 00:24:55,045 --> 00:24:57,925 that the BLM has long been focused on oil and gas 543 00:24:58,105 --> 00:25:00,685 and extraction and recreation is kind 544 00:25:00,685 --> 00:25:02,605 of a newer focus for the agency. 545 00:25:03,385 --> 00:25:04,525 Do you see this as sort 546 00:25:04,525 --> 00:25:06,525 of a paradigm shift within the agency? 547 00:25:06,545 --> 00:25:09,165 Is this bigger than just, um, you know, 548 00:25:09,805 --> 00:25:12,605 shifting a few dollars here and there to recreation? 549 00:25:14,165 --> 00:25:15,565 - I think it's a natural progression. 550 00:25:15,945 --> 00:25:19,445 Um, you know, in some ways this is not, uh, 551 00:25:19,445 --> 00:25:21,965 recreation's not new on BLM lands. 552 00:25:21,965 --> 00:25:23,405 It's always, it's always been there. 553 00:25:23,525 --> 00:25:26,325 I think the emphasis sort of when you get tactical sort 554 00:25:26,325 --> 00:25:29,405 of within its budget, it's, um, you know, and I, 555 00:25:29,405 --> 00:25:31,725 and I think that's the what the 21st Century 556 00:25:32,475 --> 00:25:35,165 Blueprint really represents is saying, okay, we're 557 00:25:35,725 --> 00:25:40,605 experiencing this massive 40% surge in visitors from 2012. 558 00:25:41,425 --> 00:25:44,805 Um, we had more than 80 million visitors last year. 559 00:25:44,825 --> 00:25:46,645 And that visitation continues to grow. 560 00:25:47,145 --> 00:25:51,325 And so the agency is adapting how it's, um, 561 00:25:51,595 --> 00:25:53,765 investing its resources to make sure 562 00:25:53,875 --> 00:25:57,965 that the places people are going, um, are 563 00:25:58,725 --> 00:26:00,565 continue to be sturdy and sound. 564 00:26:01,225 --> 00:26:05,645 Um, that there's, uh, you know, sometimes you'll go 565 00:26:05,645 --> 00:26:08,845 to a BLM place where there's not a lot of, uh, resources 566 00:26:08,905 --> 00:26:10,165 to steward the land, 567 00:26:10,545 --> 00:26:13,645 and there could be, um, mounds of garbage and, 568 00:26:13,785 --> 00:26:17,165 and places where, uh, there's a lot of dumping 569 00:26:17,165 --> 00:26:18,165 of garbage happening. 570 00:26:18,305 --> 00:26:22,005 And so the b LM is just sort of being dynamic 571 00:26:22,225 --> 00:26:24,565 and un understanding how it needs to redirect 572 00:26:24,705 --> 00:26:27,885 to meet the demand that they're experiencing on their land. 573 00:26:28,265 --> 00:26:30,365 And so I, I think the, the blueprint is sort 574 00:26:30,365 --> 00:26:33,285 of this formal recognition that, hey, it's, you know, 575 00:26:33,305 --> 00:26:37,125 it is a, there perhaps the moment is publishing the report, 576 00:26:37,385 --> 00:26:39,765 but it's been something that's been a long time coming. 577 00:26:40,145 --> 00:26:45,005 And, um, and so, you know, I think I, I, I commend the BLM 578 00:26:45,185 --> 00:26:47,325 and some of our partners who've stepped up 579 00:26:47,325 --> 00:26:49,845 to really help us think through how do we start 580 00:26:49,845 --> 00:26:52,685 to prioritize when everywhere's a need, um, 581 00:26:53,065 --> 00:26:56,085 and for us to be able to bring some private philanthropy 582 00:26:56,085 --> 00:26:57,285 to help us start tackling some 583 00:26:57,285 --> 00:26:58,965 of these challenges in real places 584 00:26:59,375 --> 00:27:02,085 where recreation's a really important issue 585 00:27:02,305 --> 00:27:03,325 and a, and a need. 586 00:27:04,225 --> 00:27:06,525 - So we've talked a lot about recreation . 587 00:27:06,525 --> 00:27:09,365 Um, of course this is not the only thing the foundation will 588 00:27:09,365 --> 00:27:11,685 be working on since it is the BLM Foundation 589 00:27:11,685 --> 00:27:14,445 and the BLM is a broad umbrella of issues. 590 00:27:15,185 --> 00:27:16,725 You mentioned renewable energy earlier. 591 00:27:17,025 --> 00:27:20,725 Um, I see the Colorado River Basin restoration work is on 592 00:27:20,725 --> 00:27:22,325 your website as well as wild horses 593 00:27:22,505 --> 00:27:25,845 and burrows, which is another BLM issue. 594 00:27:26,305 --> 00:27:30,405 Um, what, what, tell tell me a little bit about 595 00:27:30,425 --> 00:27:31,605 how the foundation is, 596 00:27:32,455 --> 00:27:33,645 could potentially engage 597 00:27:33,645 --> 00:27:34,765 on those other issues in the future. 598 00:27:35,675 --> 00:27:40,485 - Sure, sure. So, so you know, we have identified sort 599 00:27:40,485 --> 00:27:42,885 of four priority areas with the foundation. 600 00:27:43,225 --> 00:27:44,245 One is around awareness. 601 00:27:45,145 --> 00:27:46,445 Um, the other is 602 00:27:46,445 --> 00:27:49,085 around outdoor recreation, which we've talked about. 603 00:27:49,545 --> 00:27:52,845 The other is around, um, restoration. 604 00:27:53,185 --> 00:27:56,325 And the fourth is around wild horses and Burroughs. 605 00:27:56,785 --> 00:28:00,925 Um, so the awareness is actually a pretty important one 606 00:28:01,225 --> 00:28:03,005 for the foundation. 607 00:28:03,705 --> 00:28:08,125 We have heard resoundingly that there is sort of a lack 608 00:28:08,125 --> 00:28:11,405 of understanding of the multi-use needs 609 00:28:11,625 --> 00:28:13,645 and mission of the, of the BLM, 610 00:28:13,645 --> 00:28:16,485 because most of the BLM land is sort of, uh, 611 00:28:16,505 --> 00:28:17,605 in the western states. 612 00:28:18,315 --> 00:28:22,605 There's, you know, less understanding in DC on 613 00:28:22,605 --> 00:28:26,325 what those needs are, um, what some of those challenges are 614 00:28:26,325 --> 00:28:28,325 that the BLM lands are facing, 615 00:28:28,545 --> 00:28:31,405 and how we can really ensure strong stewardship 616 00:28:31,405 --> 00:28:34,765 and management of those lands so they can continue to, 617 00:28:34,985 --> 00:28:37,525 you know, sustain the communities that are around them. 618 00:28:38,105 --> 00:28:42,005 Um, so that awareness is, uh, you know, sort of twofold in, 619 00:28:42,025 --> 00:28:44,805 in sort of elevating the, the needs and, um, 620 00:28:45,465 --> 00:28:48,085 and challenges that the BLM is addressing 621 00:28:48,145 --> 00:28:50,445 and the value that they bring to the communities. 622 00:28:50,625 --> 00:28:53,485 And it's also about, hey, we've got some outstanding 623 00:28:54,165 --> 00:28:58,085 locations, um, throughout the BLM that could rival, uh, 624 00:28:58,345 --> 00:29:01,125 you know, any, any, um, national park, uh, 625 00:29:01,185 --> 00:29:05,925 and can, um, provide real, uh, great experiences for people 626 00:29:05,925 --> 00:29:07,005 who live there and people who visit. 627 00:29:07,065 --> 00:29:09,125 So there's sort of this one area of awareness 628 00:29:09,125 --> 00:29:10,205 that's pretty important. 629 00:29:10,865 --> 00:29:14,485 Um, the other, um, I mentioned was around restoration. 630 00:29:14,785 --> 00:29:18,845 And there is, uh, you know, particularly in the, 631 00:29:19,025 --> 00:29:22,725 in the west, um, it's, it's no secret that, um, 632 00:29:23,425 --> 00:29:26,245 states in the west are constantly looking 633 00:29:26,305 --> 00:29:27,485 and managing drought. 634 00:29:28,075 --> 00:29:30,925 This is an area the foundation's really paying attention to 635 00:29:30,985 --> 00:29:35,125 and seeing how do we support the energy that's in place 636 00:29:35,345 --> 00:29:39,405 and paying attention to restoration needs, um, dealing 637 00:29:39,435 --> 00:29:41,005 with the issues like drought, 638 00:29:41,765 --> 00:29:43,165 ensuring communities are resilient 639 00:29:43,165 --> 00:29:46,445 to drought addressing wildfires, these issues 640 00:29:46,475 --> 00:29:50,245 that are coming at communities in a very real way 641 00:29:50,425 --> 00:29:52,045 and have significant impacts. 642 00:29:52,585 --> 00:29:54,725 How can the foundation support these groups 643 00:29:54,825 --> 00:29:59,285 to identify solutions to partner across their community, 644 00:29:59,545 --> 00:30:03,405 to tap resources, um, uh, uh, and, 645 00:30:03,405 --> 00:30:06,565 and understand what's available to them to really strengthen 646 00:30:06,745 --> 00:30:08,405 and make their lands resilient. 647 00:30:08,905 --> 00:30:11,085 So that's, that's an important area there. 648 00:30:11,265 --> 00:30:13,965 And the foundation is, uh, really, um, building 649 00:30:14,145 --> 00:30:15,445 and a strategy there 650 00:30:15,465 --> 00:30:17,685 to support communities that are doing that. 651 00:30:18,465 --> 00:30:21,805 Um, the, um, other areas around wild horses and burrows. 652 00:30:21,805 --> 00:30:25,385 And this has been a longstanding issue for the, um, 653 00:30:25,805 --> 00:30:27,785 for the BLM and some of the other agencies 654 00:30:27,785 --> 00:30:28,985 where wild horses exist. 655 00:30:29,045 --> 00:30:32,865 And so it's an area that the foundation will begin to work 656 00:30:32,865 --> 00:30:35,505 with partners to understand what some of those needs are, 657 00:30:35,955 --> 00:30:37,385 where some of the solutions are, 658 00:30:37,445 --> 00:30:39,905 and how we can continue to support the efforts 659 00:30:40,045 --> 00:30:42,385 and bring forward, uh, solutions 660 00:30:42,385 --> 00:30:45,265 that can really help us address some of the challenges 661 00:30:45,265 --> 00:30:48,065 and concerns around, um, around this important issue. 662 00:30:48,375 --> 00:30:51,585 - Awesome. So, so maybe sort of a mediator role, um, 663 00:30:51,765 --> 00:30:52,865 if you will, . 664 00:30:53,815 --> 00:30:56,625 - Yeah. You know, I think, you know, my experiences, 665 00:30:57,005 --> 00:31:00,665 you know, in working in, uh, the nonprofit sector 666 00:31:01,205 --> 00:31:02,225 for the past 20 667 00:31:02,225 --> 00:31:06,785 or so years is sometimes the hardest thing for great ideas. 668 00:31:07,165 --> 00:31:11,465 Uh, the hardest thing is to create space for partnership, 669 00:31:12,305 --> 00:31:13,585 collaboration, relationship building, 670 00:31:13,745 --> 00:31:15,625 and great ideas to get elevated. 671 00:31:16,205 --> 00:31:19,585 And so, um, you know, that's, I, I think that's a real way 672 00:31:19,585 --> 00:31:21,025 where the foundation can make sure 673 00:31:21,055 --> 00:31:23,025 that we're supporting those efforts 674 00:31:23,165 --> 00:31:24,945 and creating, creating space 675 00:31:25,045 --> 00:31:27,625 and resources to help folks who wanna do good 676 00:31:27,625 --> 00:31:29,745 and wanna find solutions to come together and, 677 00:31:29,845 --> 00:31:31,705 and be able to bring those forward and, 678 00:31:31,705 --> 00:31:34,505 and support the, the implementation of those ideas. 679 00:31:35,885 --> 00:31:38,705 - So you brought up restoration as one 680 00:31:38,705 --> 00:31:42,025 of the foundation's sort of guiding, um, principles. 681 00:31:42,525 --> 00:31:44,705 And I, I just feel like I'd be remiss not 682 00:31:44,705 --> 00:31:49,105 to ask about the current BLM public lands rule, which, um, 683 00:31:49,105 --> 00:31:51,665 would create sort of conservation leasing 684 00:31:51,665 --> 00:31:52,985 or restoration leasing. 685 00:31:53,085 --> 00:31:55,305 Um, I've heard it referred to by both terms. 686 00:31:56,005 --> 00:31:59,945 Um, does the, I I know that this rule is not finalized, 687 00:31:59,975 --> 00:32:02,065 it's not, um, a real thing yet. 688 00:32:02,175 --> 00:32:03,825 It's, it's just a idea. 689 00:32:04,205 --> 00:32:06,625 But if it were to be finalized, how would you, 690 00:32:06,645 --> 00:32:10,945 how do you see the foundation interacting with the BLM in 691 00:32:10,945 --> 00:32:12,665 that capacity, if at all? 692 00:32:14,205 --> 00:32:18,665 - The one area that's really important to the health 693 00:32:18,725 --> 00:32:22,265 and sustainability of BLM lands 694 00:32:23,615 --> 00:32:27,475 is that these lands are healthy, they're thriving, 695 00:32:28,025 --> 00:32:32,515 they're capable of providing the multi-use, uh, mission 696 00:32:32,625 --> 00:32:35,835 that the BLM is trying to meet every day. 697 00:32:36,215 --> 00:32:40,925 And so, um, when you have challenges like drought 698 00:32:41,105 --> 00:32:46,085 and wildfires, um, perhaps, uh, you know, 699 00:32:46,215 --> 00:32:49,125 activities that are detrimental to the land 700 00:32:49,145 --> 00:32:53,365 and to the water, it's a really, um, important, it's, 701 00:32:53,365 --> 00:32:56,605 it's a real challenge to, um, for the agency to be able to, 702 00:32:57,345 --> 00:32:59,405 you know, get their arms around those issues, 703 00:32:59,495 --> 00:33:02,045 bring people together to figure out how to, um, 704 00:33:02,545 --> 00:33:04,765 how do we start to reverse some of this and, 705 00:33:04,765 --> 00:33:06,085 and come up with some solutions 706 00:33:06,115 --> 00:33:08,325 that really put us on a different path. 707 00:33:08,425 --> 00:33:11,045 And so, you know, the one thing that's, that's interesting, 708 00:33:11,065 --> 00:33:13,485 you know, when I think about, you know, the, the future, 709 00:33:14,105 --> 00:33:18,225 the, the value of these lands, you know, I, I live outside 710 00:33:18,365 --> 00:33:22,505 of, um, an area where there's, um, BLM lands 711 00:33:22,505 --> 00:33:24,345 that I could step on a BLM land 712 00:33:24,365 --> 00:33:26,665 and walk from, from the parking lot 713 00:33:26,715 --> 00:33:29,745 where I can access it from my neighborhood all the way down 714 00:33:29,745 --> 00:33:33,105 to a town that's about an hour and 15 minutes away. 715 00:33:34,005 --> 00:33:37,105 And I'm on BLM land except for crossing a couple of roads. 716 00:33:37,165 --> 00:33:39,345 I'm on BLM land the entire way. 717 00:33:39,765 --> 00:33:42,785 Um, I can go from my, my garage 718 00:33:42,925 --> 00:33:45,905 to Moab mostly on BLM land. 719 00:33:46,165 --> 00:33:49,465 And there's incredible diversity of these lands. 720 00:33:49,605 --> 00:33:53,585 And the need to make sure that these special places continue 721 00:33:53,585 --> 00:33:57,705 to exist is sort of the idea behind conservation. 722 00:33:58,245 --> 00:34:01,065 Um, in many countries, part of, you know, a big part 723 00:34:01,065 --> 00:34:05,585 of my career has been, um, working to advance, uh, 724 00:34:05,865 --> 00:34:07,865 collaborative solutions to address big challenges 725 00:34:08,485 --> 00:34:10,985 and, um, in other parts of the world, you know, 726 00:34:11,185 --> 00:34:15,425 the ranchers, ranchers work with, um, conservationists 727 00:34:15,425 --> 00:34:17,025 to say, we all need to make sure 728 00:34:17,115 --> 00:34:19,025 where we graze continues to exist. 729 00:34:19,125 --> 00:34:20,985 We need water for our communities. 730 00:34:21,445 --> 00:34:24,225 And that's very much the same thing that we're, um, 731 00:34:24,395 --> 00:34:28,305 we're refining ourselves needing to continue to accelerate 732 00:34:28,325 --> 00:34:31,185 and lift where the BLM is doing that kind of work. 733 00:34:31,405 --> 00:34:33,785 So, um, when I think about the future 734 00:34:33,925 --> 00:34:36,105 and I think about what the opportunities are, 735 00:34:36,945 --> 00:34:38,785 I see more kind of partnerships like that. 736 00:34:39,325 --> 00:34:42,905 Um, uh, and again, having resources and time 737 00:34:43,125 --> 00:34:47,225 and someone to really support bringing together partners 738 00:34:47,405 --> 00:34:50,345 to understand what the tools are, understand 739 00:34:50,365 --> 00:34:51,385 how they can work together 740 00:34:51,565 --> 00:34:54,505 and really support them in moving their ideas forward is 741 00:34:54,505 --> 00:34:55,705 something the foundation can do. 742 00:34:56,135 --> 00:34:58,865 - Awesome. Well, let's bring it back around 743 00:34:58,865 --> 00:35:00,785 to the foundation for a few final questions. 744 00:35:00,965 --> 00:35:04,145 Um, who, who is on the foundation? I know there's a board. 745 00:35:04,765 --> 00:35:06,545 Um, what can you share about that board 746 00:35:06,545 --> 00:35:07,945 and what can you share about your staff? 747 00:35:08,655 --> 00:35:11,305 - Sure, sure. Well, I'll, I'll tackle the first one. 748 00:35:11,325 --> 00:35:15,185 So I just got started, um, in October with the foundation. 749 00:35:15,335 --> 00:35:19,385 It's been an incredibly exciting, um, time so far. 750 00:35:19,885 --> 00:35:23,385 Um, I've received a lot of, um, support 751 00:35:23,485 --> 00:35:27,225 and interest from a variety of, um, a variety of, 752 00:35:27,325 --> 00:35:30,145 of interests across the board who see 753 00:35:30,485 --> 00:35:32,105 how the foundation can bring real value. 754 00:35:32,165 --> 00:35:34,625 So that's exciting. I'm looking to build my team. 755 00:35:34,805 --> 00:35:38,015 I'm, I am a team of one with some great sort 756 00:35:38,015 --> 00:35:39,495 of advisors across the board. 757 00:35:39,995 --> 00:35:43,415 Um, the board itself, my most important advisors, um, 758 00:35:43,755 --> 00:35:48,535 we have a board, um, uh, that is, uh, congressionally, 759 00:35:48,955 --> 00:35:52,815 um, was congressionally created, uh, that comprises 760 00:35:52,815 --> 00:35:54,375 of nine people, nine. 761 00:35:54,395 --> 00:35:55,415 We have nine seats. 762 00:35:55,955 --> 00:35:58,135 We currently have five of those seats filled 763 00:35:58,355 --> 00:36:03,055 and are, um, in the process of, um, identifying, uh, uh, 764 00:36:03,235 --> 00:36:04,935 the additional board members 765 00:36:05,275 --> 00:36:07,055 for the secretary's consideration. 766 00:36:07,635 --> 00:36:11,055 Um, the board is appointed by the Secretary of the Interior. 767 00:36:11,915 --> 00:36:15,575 Um, so our board chair is Governor Steve Bullock. 768 00:36:15,575 --> 00:36:19,655 He was a former, uh, he's a current, uh, native Montanan 769 00:36:19,915 --> 00:36:22,915 and former governor of Montana. 770 00:36:23,615 --> 00:36:26,115 Um, he's been found, uh, fantastic 771 00:36:26,575 --> 00:36:31,355 and, uh, was very, um, intimately involved, um, 772 00:36:31,375 --> 00:36:34,755 in the early days of getting the foundation's structure set 773 00:36:34,755 --> 00:36:36,435 up, uh, before I got here. 774 00:36:36,775 --> 00:36:39,915 We also have Mae Ace, she is the founder 775 00:36:40,375 --> 00:36:43,875 and, um, CEO of the Hispanic Access Foundation. 776 00:36:44,375 --> 00:36:46,675 And so, um, those who know Mae, 777 00:36:46,735 --> 00:36:49,795 she has this incredible record of working with faith 778 00:36:49,855 --> 00:36:54,035 and community driven leaders to help Latinos improve, um, 779 00:36:54,205 --> 00:36:57,795 their financial literacy, the, um, ability 780 00:36:57,815 --> 00:37:00,755 to be environmental stewards to, um, be, have, 781 00:37:00,755 --> 00:37:03,515 find better health, uh, and increase their equity 782 00:37:03,535 --> 00:37:05,555 and access to, um, resources. 783 00:37:05,575 --> 00:37:07,555 And, and she is wonderful. 784 00:37:07,575 --> 00:37:11,795 She is our secretary, um, Stacy Leads is our treasurer. 785 00:37:12,375 --> 00:37:16,155 Um, she is a leader in law and higher education 786 00:37:16,495 --> 00:37:19,515 and governance, um, economic development 787 00:37:19,515 --> 00:37:20,595 and conflict resolution. 788 00:37:20,765 --> 00:37:23,635 She's the dean emeritus at the University 789 00:37:23,635 --> 00:37:24,755 of Arkansas Law School. 790 00:37:25,135 --> 00:37:27,715 Um, and she was, she's the first indigenous woman 791 00:37:27,775 --> 00:37:29,035 to lead a law school. 792 00:37:29,815 --> 00:37:32,395 And we have Jess Jessica Turner. 793 00:37:32,735 --> 00:37:35,355 Um, she is the first president 794 00:37:35,355 --> 00:37:37,075 of the outdoor recreation round table. 795 00:37:37,735 --> 00:37:39,675 Um, she's been in the outdoor recreation 796 00:37:39,675 --> 00:37:40,755 space for a long time. 797 00:37:41,175 --> 00:37:43,835 Um, she leads this coalition to, 798 00:37:44,185 --> 00:37:47,195 that represents associations in businesses, uh, 799 00:37:47,425 --> 00:37:49,115 with an interest in outdoor recreation. 800 00:37:49,335 --> 00:37:53,515 And she really brings the, that sector together to, um, 801 00:37:53,585 --> 00:37:57,795 support legislation that brings funding for public lands, 802 00:37:57,815 --> 00:37:59,515 waters, and positive policies 803 00:37:59,515 --> 00:38:00,875 that help rural gateway communities. 804 00:38:01,495 --> 00:38:04,795 Um, and our last, um, our last director, uh, 805 00:38:05,015 --> 00:38:07,115 we currently have is Kirk DPPs. 806 00:38:07,575 --> 00:38:11,725 Um, he comes from the retail food industry. 807 00:38:11,915 --> 00:38:14,405 He's got 50 years of experience, um, 808 00:38:14,915 --> 00:38:16,725 very widely recognized in retail, 809 00:38:17,025 --> 00:38:21,365 and, um, has been an absolute, uh, uh, wonderful advocate 810 00:38:21,365 --> 00:38:23,725 for us to get the foundation up and running. 811 00:38:23,945 --> 00:38:25,405 So, um, uh, 812 00:38:25,425 --> 00:38:27,565 and then lastly, um, the director 813 00:38:27,905 --> 00:38:31,045 of the BLM is always an officio member. 814 00:38:31,225 --> 00:38:34,845 And so, um, hopefully some of your listeners know, uh, 815 00:38:34,865 --> 00:38:37,605 our director of the BLM is Tracy Stone Manning. 816 00:38:38,025 --> 00:38:41,565 Um, and so she's been very engaged, um, 817 00:38:41,785 --> 00:38:44,445 in helping us at the foundation understand 818 00:38:44,445 --> 00:38:48,165 what the priorities are for the BLM and how, um, 819 00:38:48,305 --> 00:38:50,565 and paving the way for us to understand with, uh, 820 00:38:50,565 --> 00:38:53,165 the career staff, how we can bring private resources 821 00:38:53,465 --> 00:38:55,605 to support the M'S work. 822 00:38:57,265 --> 00:39:00,045 - So I'm sure everyone listening, um, especially 823 00:39:00,045 --> 00:39:03,645 to the recreation part of this podcast, could think 824 00:39:03,645 --> 00:39:06,685 of some area of BLM land that they would like 825 00:39:06,685 --> 00:39:07,765 to see improved . 826 00:39:07,765 --> 00:39:12,245 Um, and I'm curious, are you soliciting public feedback? 827 00:39:12,425 --> 00:39:14,965 How can people sort of interact 828 00:39:14,965 --> 00:39:17,485 with the foundation other than donating money? 829 00:39:19,065 --> 00:39:20,485 - No, that's, that's a great question. 830 00:39:20,705 --> 00:39:25,205 You know, I I, I, I think as, um, folks listening to this 831 00:39:26,285 --> 00:39:28,645 probably understand how special BLM lands are, 832 00:39:28,675 --> 00:39:30,445 they are America's lands. 833 00:39:30,445 --> 00:39:33,085 Those of us in the West recreate on these 834 00:39:33,085 --> 00:39:34,765 sometimes every day. 835 00:39:35,145 --> 00:39:37,685 Um, there's a lot of different uses for 'em. 836 00:39:37,705 --> 00:39:41,165 And so it's, it's, um, quite special for all 837 00:39:41,165 --> 00:39:44,365 of us at the foundation to find ways to engage 838 00:39:44,365 --> 00:39:45,445 with people who wanna support. 839 00:39:45,585 --> 00:39:49,605 So we do have an information, um, uh, a way 840 00:39:49,605 --> 00:39:50,805 to accept information 841 00:39:51,145 --> 00:39:53,605 and, um, engagement with the public, um, 842 00:39:53,945 --> 00:39:58,085 at info@americaslands.org is a great way to start. 843 00:39:58,745 --> 00:40:02,605 Um, there's also, you know, I know, um, many folks, uh, 844 00:40:02,825 --> 00:40:06,085 are involved with other organizations that perhaps work 845 00:40:06,085 --> 00:40:10,205 with the BLM or care about what's happening on BLMA 846 00:40:10,205 --> 00:40:11,685 because they're a part of other groups 847 00:40:11,755 --> 00:40:13,365 that interact with the BLM. 848 00:40:13,465 --> 00:40:16,885 So that's also a great way to just reach out to us, 849 00:40:17,025 --> 00:40:18,165 you know, we're early stages. 850 00:40:18,905 --> 00:40:22,485 Um, things in the, in the areas of our program, priorities 851 00:40:22,505 --> 00:40:24,325 of awareness, access 852 00:40:24,385 --> 00:40:27,805 and stewardship are pretty important, um, to us. 853 00:40:27,945 --> 00:40:31,965 And so I am, I'm very welcoming of ideas in the ways that 854 00:40:32,545 --> 00:40:34,965 the foundation can, um, partner with them 855 00:40:35,065 --> 00:40:37,725 to bring greater resources to the BLM 856 00:40:37,785 --> 00:40:41,245 and, um, like I said, you know, add some, add some, uh, 857 00:40:41,585 --> 00:40:44,085 energy, uh, and support the energy that people have 858 00:40:44,145 --> 00:40:45,845 to really build that together. 859 00:40:46,315 --> 00:40:48,125 - Awesome. Well, we'll be sure 860 00:40:48,125 --> 00:40:50,165 to drop the link you mentioned as well 861 00:40:50,165 --> 00:40:52,125 as any other resources into the show notes 862 00:40:52,145 --> 00:40:54,125 so folks can connect and learn more. 863 00:40:54,585 --> 00:40:57,285 Um, eing Thompson, CEO at the foundation 864 00:40:57,385 --> 00:40:59,205 for America's Public Lands, thank you 865 00:40:59,265 --> 00:41:00,525 so much for being with us today. 866 00:41:01,015 --> 00:41:03,085 - Thank you so much. I appreciate having, 867 00:41:03,305 --> 00:41:04,685 uh, a chance to chat with you. 868 00:41:09,615 --> 00:41:11,365 - Let's go out with a little good news today. 869 00:41:11,915 --> 00:41:14,405 Last week, the US Forest Service withdrew a permit 870 00:41:14,505 --> 00:41:17,005 for a section of the UTA Basin Railway Project, 871 00:41:17,405 --> 00:41:19,045 a proposed 88 mile railroad 872 00:41:19,045 --> 00:41:22,045 that would transport crude oil from Utah to Colorado. 873 00:41:22,705 --> 00:41:25,445 If completed, the project would allow millions of gallons 874 00:41:25,445 --> 00:41:27,645 of crude oil to be transported through wild parts 875 00:41:27,645 --> 00:41:30,245 of the Rocky Mountains and along the Colorado River. 876 00:41:30,795 --> 00:41:33,045 This is the latest nail in the coffin for the project. 877 00:41:33,635 --> 00:41:34,885 Last summer, the US Court 878 00:41:34,885 --> 00:41:38,045 of Appeals overturned the surface transportation board's 879 00:41:38,205 --> 00:41:39,805 approval of the project, sending 880 00:41:39,805 --> 00:41:40,965 it back to the drawing board. 881 00:41:41,585 --> 00:41:44,125 Now, without a forest service permit, proponents 882 00:41:44,125 --> 00:41:46,045 of the railway face an even greater challenge. 883 00:41:55,475 --> 00:41:57,085 - Well, that is something to celebrate. 884 00:41:57,085 --> 00:42:00,125 The oil train is dead, at least for now. 885 00:42:00,665 --> 00:42:02,045 And that does it for us today. 886 00:42:02,045 --> 00:42:03,925 Folks, if you wanna reach us, you can email, 887 00:42:03,925 --> 00:42:06,205 podcast@westernpriorities.org. 888 00:42:06,545 --> 00:42:09,045 We always love getting your recommendations for guests 889 00:42:09,225 --> 00:42:11,925 and for topics, so please send those along. 890 00:42:12,475 --> 00:42:15,285 Also, go check us out on TikTok and Instagram. 891 00:42:15,425 --> 00:42:17,245 We are always looking for new ways 892 00:42:17,745 --> 00:42:18,805 to talk about this podcast 893 00:42:19,025 --> 00:42:22,165 and everything we do at CWP over on those platforms. 894 00:42:22,545 --> 00:42:24,445 - Thanks again to iLink for her time today. 895 00:42:24,465 --> 00:42:26,805 And thank you for listening to the landscape.