WEBVTT 00:00:00.020 --> 00:00:02.320 Fusion Patrol is a listener-supported podcast. 00:00:03.220 --> 00:00:08.300 Find out how you can help support us at patreon.com slash fusion patrol. 00:00:18.640 --> 00:00:20.460 This is the Fusion Patrol podcast. 00:00:21.340 --> 00:00:25.280 Each week, we look at a different science fiction TV episode or movie 00:00:25.840 --> 00:00:29.280 and overanalyze it to within an inch of its life. 00:00:31.280 --> 00:00:32.500 Welcome to the discussion. 00:00:59.480 --> 00:01:05.519 jadun okay all right i think they were going for that whole victory of the examination of the 00:01:05.780 --> 00:01:12.520 daleks except it's jadun okay well we start off with a synopsis of this segment of doctor who 00:01:13.620 --> 00:01:19.360 in gloucester modern day in what is not at all a contrived coincidence or metaphor 00:01:19.840 --> 00:01:25.560 it's ruth clayton's birthday but apart from an anticipated birthday cake from her husband lee 00:01:25.640 --> 00:01:29.240 It's just a typical day flogging walking tours of Gloucester. 00:01:30.020 --> 00:01:33.640 Little does she know, uninvited guests are coming to crash the party. 00:01:34.340 --> 00:01:37.300 She stops by her local coffee shop where the creepy proprietor, Alan, 00:01:37.740 --> 00:01:42.780 tries once again to convince Ruth that her husband is a dangerous man. 00:01:43.220 --> 00:01:46.680 He has no family and checks out weird books from the library. 00:01:47.460 --> 00:01:49.580 He's even compiled a dossier on Lee Clayton. 00:01:50.020 --> 00:01:51.880 Of course, Alan's just jealous. 00:01:52.480 --> 00:01:56.880 In the vortex, the Doctor is in a mood, and her companions try to tease it out of her. 00:01:57.540 --> 00:02:03.340 But they only get so far before the TARDIS picks up a containment warning from a Jadoon platoon near the moon. 00:02:04.000 --> 00:02:08.660 And when I say near the moon, I mean on the Earth, where the Jadoon do not have jurisdiction. 00:02:09.259 --> 00:02:13.280 They have erected a containment field around Gloucester and are searching for a fugitive. 00:02:13.860 --> 00:02:20.360 The Doctor reverses the polarity of the neutron flow, or something not nearly as cool, and lands the TARDIS within the field. 00:02:21.400 --> 00:02:24.680 The Dejun are cataloging all people within the area in search of the fugitive, 00:02:25.000 --> 00:02:27.860 and just generally terrifying the fine folks of Gloucester, 00:02:28.060 --> 00:02:31.040 because they are, after all, space rhinoceroses. 00:02:31.820 --> 00:02:34.640 When they confront Alan, he suggests they go after Lee Clayton. 00:02:35.360 --> 00:02:38.560 Unobserved to the TARDIS team, Graham is scooped up by a teleport, 00:02:38.710 --> 00:02:43.080 where he meets Captain Jack Harkness, who is trying to grab the Doctor in a stolen spaceship. 00:02:43.840 --> 00:02:47.220 Back on Earth, the Doctor bluffs past the Dejun and starts talking to Lee, 00:02:47.380 --> 00:02:54.100 who behaves very suspiciously, and Ruth, who is clearly clueless. Lee's concern seems to be 00:02:54.260 --> 00:02:59.480 keeping his secret and getting Ruth to safety. The Doctor sends Yaz and Ryan out to stall the 00:02:59.600 --> 00:03:03.460 Jadun further, but they are scooped up by a teleport where they meet Captain Jack Harkness, 00:03:03.560 --> 00:03:08.520 who was trying to grab the Doctor in a stolen spaceship. Wow, failed to get the Doctor twice 00:03:08.660 --> 00:03:13.400 in a row? Is there some form of Jadun level 7 containment field in the area? There is? Oh, 00:03:13.480 --> 00:03:14.320 Well, that explains it. 00:03:14.710 --> 00:03:19.880 The doctor takes Ruth to a nearby cathedral, while Lee confronts the Jadoon and Gat, the 00:03:20.100 --> 00:03:21.100 controller of the operation. 00:03:21.820 --> 00:03:26.940 Gat and Lee are old friends, and she kills him, but not before he sends a cryptic text 00:03:27.260 --> 00:03:27.980 message to Ruth. 00:03:28.340 --> 00:03:29.140 Follow the light. 00:03:29.600 --> 00:03:30.060 Break the glass. 00:03:30.980 --> 00:03:35.160 The Jadoons surround Ruth and the doctor, but suddenly Ruth, as if acting on instinct, 00:03:35.380 --> 00:03:38.540 kung fu's the entire Jadoon squad and sends them packing. 00:03:39.320 --> 00:03:41.460 She is confused by what just happened. 00:03:42.040 --> 00:03:45.760 The message from Lee leads Ruth and the doctor to the lighthouse where she grew up. 00:03:46.220 --> 00:03:51.660 While the doctor pokes around, Ruth is drawn to an emergency break-the-glass thingy, and she does. 00:03:52.240 --> 00:03:57.620 On the grounds, at Ruth's parents' grave, the doctor finds not bodies, but a buried police box. 00:03:57.960 --> 00:03:59.460 What? says the doctor. 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:02.880 Ruth arrives, now wearing an uninspired cosplay outfit. 00:04:03.300 --> 00:04:05.400 I'm the doctor, and this is my TARDIS. 00:04:05.760 --> 00:04:07.020 What? says the doctor. 00:04:07.860 --> 00:04:14.560 Back on the stolen spaceship, instead of explaining, Captain Jack gives a cryptic warning about the lone Cyberman for the companions to take back to the Doctor. 00:04:14.980 --> 00:04:16.600 In a rush, he sends them on their way. 00:04:17.140 --> 00:04:24.820 Inside the buried TARDIS control room, which I might add is cooler than any TARDIS we've seen since the reboot, the Doctor explains. 00:04:25.420 --> 00:04:26.620 No, she doesn't. 00:04:27.120 --> 00:04:29.820 They don't know what's going on and they argue, of course. 00:04:30.360 --> 00:04:37.140 Then Gat arrives, who is from Gallifrey, and used to work with the Doctor, despite the fact that the Doctor doesn't know her and now needs to kill her. 00:04:37.440 --> 00:04:40.300 but the Doctor gives her a rifle that backfires, killing her. 00:04:40.860 --> 00:04:43.600 The Jadoon are sent away due to a contract technicality, 00:04:43.750 --> 00:04:46.960 and the Doctor uses the TARDIS to drop off the Doctor near the TARDIS. 00:04:47.160 --> 00:04:48.560 What? says the audience. 00:04:49.320 --> 00:04:51.180 The Doctor is dazed and confused, 00:04:51.650 --> 00:04:52.760 but her team are supportive, 00:04:53.090 --> 00:04:54.180 and then alarms go off, 00:04:54.390 --> 00:04:57.280 end of Act 2 of an unknown number of acts. 00:04:59.060 --> 00:05:00.520 Fugitive of the Jadoon. 00:05:00.760 --> 00:05:02.580 Surprises galore in this episode. 00:05:03.800 --> 00:05:04.080 Oh yeah. 00:05:04.140 --> 00:05:04.500 I suppose. 00:05:05.420 --> 00:05:08.120 What did you think of Fugitive of the Jadoon? 00:05:08.920 --> 00:05:12.600 Well, yeah, I mean, I had a pretty good time with this. 00:05:13.060 --> 00:05:16.780 I've got to say, I like these kind of, I mean, 00:05:17.960 --> 00:05:22.860 it's quite difficult for them to pull them off on this scale, I think, anymore. 00:05:23.540 --> 00:05:30.360 But it sort of put me in mind of Utopia with the master reveal in that. 00:05:30.660 --> 00:05:32.979 And obviously there's all the chameleon arc stuff 00:05:33.000 --> 00:05:37.160 and Captain Jack's back and, oh, glimey. 00:05:37.820 --> 00:05:37.900 Yeah. 00:05:39.400 --> 00:05:40.600 Yeah, quite a lot of fun. 00:05:40.600 --> 00:05:42.280 You could actually say it's derivative of that. 00:05:43.760 --> 00:05:50.280 I, you know, this is a show that didn't hold well for second viewing, 00:05:50.660 --> 00:05:57.120 I thought, because then it sort of, it's about the surprises, I think. 00:05:57.180 --> 00:06:03.220 and I don't really consider it to be a story. 00:06:03.940 --> 00:06:05.760 I mean, it's a scene. 00:06:06.300 --> 00:06:07.340 It's an act of a play. 00:06:07.900 --> 00:06:09.120 It's clearly the middle of something. 00:06:09.180 --> 00:06:10.060 It's an arc story. 00:06:10.640 --> 00:06:12.080 It's an arc story for sure. 00:06:12.240 --> 00:06:13.120 It's barely a story. 00:06:13.320 --> 00:06:14.300 It's definitely an arc thing. 00:06:14.460 --> 00:06:14.540 Yeah. 00:06:15.140 --> 00:06:15.280 Yeah. 00:06:15.380 --> 00:06:19.400 I mean, I liked watching it the second time 00:06:19.540 --> 00:06:22.780 because I was very interested in watching Joe Martin 00:06:23.979 --> 00:06:25.400 knowing what I knew. 00:06:26.740 --> 00:06:30.960 And so I think that's, in particular, that's why it repays a second viewing. 00:06:31.020 --> 00:06:37.580 But this has a title that literally screams mid-season filler at you. 00:06:37.680 --> 00:07:06.820 This is going to be a monster of the week where they dig up a unremarkable sort of semi-baddie from the show's past in order to provide some kind of something basically to plug a gap in between episodes of either original stuff or actual, you know, 00:07:06.860 --> 00:07:09.100 the season arc bookends 00:07:09.260 --> 00:07:12.120 that's what I'm expecting, I'm expecting season arc bookends 00:07:12.240 --> 00:07:13.860 because in Skyfall 00:07:14.020 --> 00:07:15.880 you've got the master 00:07:16.140 --> 00:07:17.100 reappearing and saying 00:07:17.170 --> 00:07:18.920 oh I've destroyed Galifrae and you think 00:07:19.090 --> 00:07:19.840 oh god right 00:07:21.080 --> 00:07:23.500 clearly we're going to have to come back to that in the finale 00:07:23.800 --> 00:07:25.360 but at least in between we can have 00:07:25.840 --> 00:07:26.300 a few 00:07:28.540 --> 00:07:29.380 standalone episodes 00:07:29.960 --> 00:07:31.180 and you know, don't get me wrong 00:07:31.360 --> 00:07:32.840 I like standalone episodes 00:07:33.260 --> 00:07:35.859 but when arc stories can do something as surprising 00:07:35.880 --> 00:07:42.120 as this and they can do it in a way that when you go into the episode you just think this is 00:07:42.500 --> 00:07:50.400 definitely monster of the week i quite like being thrown off balance uh i you know i'll give them 00:07:50.590 --> 00:07:58.580 i'll give them credit um for the surprise um i think they must have sacrificed a few things 00:07:59.220 --> 00:08:08.880 for the benefit of surprise. But when I look at shows like The X-Files, which is the closest 00:08:09.030 --> 00:08:17.100 thing I can think of to the way Doctor Who exists in modern television now, because a lot of shows 00:08:18.590 --> 00:08:26.379 are really very, very heavy on the arc now. And in many cases, they are just simply chapters in a 00:08:26.340 --> 00:08:27.900 book as you go along. 00:08:28.670 --> 00:08:34.400 Whereas the X-Files still existed in that era where, you know, 70%, 80% of the stories 00:08:34.700 --> 00:08:37.560 were monster of the week, creature of the week. 00:08:38.070 --> 00:08:41.760 And then you would have a couple along the way that were arc stories. 00:08:42.110 --> 00:08:44.340 And they were usually bigger stories, two-parters. 00:08:47.020 --> 00:08:52.300 they had a story that was at least sort of there 00:08:53.920 --> 00:08:55.160 that had to be solved, 00:08:55.910 --> 00:08:58.940 if not completely resolved 00:08:59.110 --> 00:09:00.620 because of the questions that were raised 00:09:00.730 --> 00:09:01.660 during the course of the story. 00:09:02.100 --> 00:09:04.260 This one with the Jadoon is just, 00:09:05.080 --> 00:09:06.340 you know, they came down, 00:09:06.920 --> 00:09:08.360 took their horn, Kung-Fu'd them, 00:09:08.880 --> 00:09:10.020 said, oh, by the way, you know, 00:09:10.200 --> 00:09:11.560 you're out of jurisdiction, go away. 00:09:12.160 --> 00:09:13.340 Jadoon, there you go. 00:09:13.500 --> 00:09:15.119 I mean, the Jadoon are a terrible villain 00:09:15.480 --> 00:09:18.920 or whatever they are antagonists. 00:09:20.040 --> 00:09:22.120 I thought they were bad when they started them. 00:09:23.400 --> 00:09:25.300 They were one-off when they started them. 00:09:26.980 --> 00:09:29.120 They served a purpose in that story. 00:09:29.420 --> 00:09:31.040 And then, of course, when you build, 00:09:31.310 --> 00:09:35.280 this is always the problem with the kind of the sequels. 00:09:35.290 --> 00:09:38.260 When you try and build a new story 00:09:39.100 --> 00:09:41.140 around one-off villains like that, 00:09:41.640 --> 00:09:44.379 then you've either got to add some previously 00:09:45.100 --> 00:09:52.420 unseen dimension to their nature that gives you that story but in fact seems quite kind of 00:09:52.680 --> 00:10:00.260 contrived or you basically end up with a with a retread and so it's quite a clever villain when 00:10:00.270 --> 00:10:08.680 you want some window dressing for the story that's actually coming and it and it and it was 00:10:08.720 --> 00:10:14.220 it was a story that suited them because it was a if it was about a fugitive it was effectively 00:10:15.600 --> 00:10:22.480 something that put them in you know into then into their natural that's their purpose really 00:10:22.680 --> 00:10:29.340 isn't it um and i like that and also i think i think they were just really seriously well 00:10:29.740 --> 00:10:37.239 realized because the animatronics were better than ever i mean lovely lovely faces and great hair 00:10:38.720 --> 00:10:42.440 they didn't have hair before did they i think they might have done but i don't know if it was 00:10:42.680 --> 00:10:52.320 shot as in a way that made them look quite as cute well um anyway i i you know i think 00:10:53.040 --> 00:11:00.540 it's as you say it's mid-season filler and they were you know doing it to to present something 00:11:01.220 --> 00:11:05.219 to two things obviously they were trying to sneak captain jack in there and and get his 00:11:05.240 --> 00:11:12.120 his long realized desire to return to the show um and i'll ask do you think we'll see him again 00:11:12.340 --> 00:11:16.700 before the year's over i think that's it i think we're not going to see him again he will not be 00:11:16.860 --> 00:11:25.740 part of the finale i would be quite surprised if we don't see him again oh okay but i i i i i i 00:11:25.840 --> 00:11:31.399 really i really really don't know i mean i've read a couple of interviews with him he said he 00:11:31.420 --> 00:11:37.500 says he doesn't know whether he's coming back obviously he also says in those interviews that 00:11:37.520 --> 00:11:43.120 he lied about coming back this time therefore right you know that okay let's let's look at 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:49.500 his coming back this time in this story he says you know i will be back maybe not soon which says 00:11:49.580 --> 00:11:54.600 to me maybe not this season but oh well i'm talking about this season i don't think we'll 00:11:54.640 --> 00:12:00.199 see him as part of this season again i think there is a planned return for captain jack 00:12:00.740 --> 00:12:01.880 I mean I would be astonished 00:12:02.450 --> 00:12:02.760 because I 00:12:03.470 --> 00:12:05.760 I mean one thing is fabulous 00:12:06.340 --> 00:12:08.040 fabulous secret to have 00:12:08.180 --> 00:12:09.760 kept in such a way I did 00:12:10.260 --> 00:12:12.020 and it's entirely my own fault I did 00:12:12.180 --> 00:12:13.740 get slightly spoiled on this 00:12:14.980 --> 00:12:15.420 but 00:12:16.279 --> 00:12:18.080 even then even when I knew 00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:19.800 Captain Jack was going to be in it 00:12:20.040 --> 00:12:21.900 I was like oh my god I can't 00:12:22.100 --> 00:12:23.940 wait to see John Barrowman and Jodie 00:12:24.120 --> 00:12:25.660 Whittaker together and 00:12:26.100 --> 00:12:28.040 there is no way they would have 00:12:28.220 --> 00:12:30.180 brought Captain Jack back 00:12:30.200 --> 00:12:36.120 and not had him up against Jodie Whittaker unless they were saving it. 00:12:36.200 --> 00:12:37.880 Then they filmed it at the same time, 00:12:38.580 --> 00:12:41.660 and it'll be a room scene somewhere. 00:12:41.880 --> 00:12:44.200 Because this is what I get out of this. 00:12:44.280 --> 00:12:45.620 No, because they can bring him back now, 00:12:45.680 --> 00:12:46.820 and it doesn't have to be top secret. 00:12:48.020 --> 00:12:49.420 But they've already finished filming it. 00:12:49.920 --> 00:12:50.560 Oh, sure. 00:12:50.770 --> 00:12:52.340 They finished filming this season, 00:12:53.660 --> 00:12:57.100 so it's probably going to be the Christmas special he's back in. 00:12:57.280 --> 00:12:58.520 That's my guess. 00:12:59.080 --> 00:12:59.800 New Year's special? 00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:07.920 whatever you know the see this the seasonal special my you want my guess i reckon the finale 00:13:08.060 --> 00:13:11.800 is going to end on the cliffhanger we're going to have a seasonal special that resolves that 00:13:11.940 --> 00:13:16.880 cliffhanger is going to have captain jack in it but this may be wishful filming i don't know 00:13:17.860 --> 00:13:22.560 but if you look at the structure of way this episode this was filmed and i don't mean filmed 00:13:22.700 --> 00:13:29.780 as in the logistics of the filming captain jack is isolated on a small barren set for a scene or 00:13:29.800 --> 00:13:36.540 big baron set well okay a big baron set it might be bristol cathedral i can say it's it's obviously 00:13:36.720 --> 00:13:44.720 just a building that they slapped a console in and uh brought the the three supporting characters in 00:13:45.360 --> 00:13:51.560 so easily could have been shot in a day captain jack or or john barrowman did a remarkable job 00:13:51.800 --> 00:13:59.760 of faking people out on his social media why he's in cardiff renovating his house but you know he 00:13:59.780 --> 00:14:06.800 He was never out on location filming anywhere with Jodie Whittaker or anything like that. 00:14:06.830 --> 00:14:09.880 So that's why I think this is it. 00:14:10.100 --> 00:14:10.700 This is the piece. 00:14:11.010 --> 00:14:23.780 And if we do, by some weird bit, see him again, it'll be on a television screen or it'll be again in a one-off spot like this where the doctor gets pulled out to have a couple words and then sent back. 00:14:23.780 --> 00:14:26.720 It will not be Captain Jack as an integral part of the story. 00:14:27.520 --> 00:14:32.840 I think it's perfectly possible there is more Captain Jack footage in this season shot on a closed set 00:14:34.120 --> 00:14:38.780 because all of the stuff on his social media channel was about renovating a property in Cardiff. 00:14:38.880 --> 00:14:40.060 This wasn't shot in Cardiff. 00:14:40.760 --> 00:14:43.420 So, and he did actually renovate a property. 00:14:43.780 --> 00:14:47.700 So you wonder, I mean, maybe he actually did want to renovate the property. 00:14:47.800 --> 00:14:48.260 I don't know. 00:14:49.120 --> 00:14:55.480 But, or maybe he was, it was more elaborate cover because there's more to cover. 00:14:55.600 --> 00:14:56.140 I don't know. 00:14:56.660 --> 00:14:56.780 Yeah. 00:14:57.300 --> 00:15:01.500 So, but I just feel like he, and he was, well, frankly, unimportant. 00:15:01.800 --> 00:15:04.000 He was the bad wolf moment in the episode. 00:15:04.120 --> 00:15:05.000 Beware the lone siren. 00:15:05.070 --> 00:15:11.180 He couldn't explain, couldn't give him anything better than, yeah, I know, nanogenes. 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:16.280 But if he'd spent less time flirting and more time explaining. 00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:20.180 Captain Jack we're talking about, we don't want him to turn up and then not flirt. 00:15:21.400 --> 00:15:29.980 I would rather Captain Jack, who has a purpose, obviously quite an amazing purpose, is a very important thing that he has to explain to the doctor. 00:15:30.180 --> 00:15:34.740 And then he doesn't actually give them the information they need to pass on to the doctor. 00:15:35.240 --> 00:15:40.140 First and foremost rule of passing on a message to someone, do not start off with the flirting. 00:15:40.620 --> 00:15:42.660 Go straight to the message, flirt second. 00:15:43.100 --> 00:15:45.320 It's just, you know, it's just polite. 00:15:46.120 --> 00:15:53.440 like why wait until why wait until he brought yaz and ryan i know he was trying to get the doctor 00:15:53.580 --> 00:15:59.740 again but he was for starters he was trying to give a direct the direct message he was it wasn't 00:15:59.800 --> 00:16:06.440 until he gave up on the doctor that he decided to send the message via the companions more routes 00:16:06.520 --> 00:16:16.240 better attempt anyway um the lone cyberman um yeah we've seen pictures of a cyberman 00:16:17.000 --> 00:16:23.240 beat up cyberman i think um so we know that's coming we also know from that he said something 00:16:23.340 --> 00:16:29.500 about it was sent back through time and space actually he said there was no no he said a thing 00:16:29.510 --> 00:16:33.439 or something like that was sent back through time and space and it was the alliance who sent 00:16:33.780 --> 00:16:38.920 something back through time and space not the cyber well we don't know who the alliance is so 00:16:39.540 --> 00:16:46.320 no we don't yeah so i i think we got you know just stuff trying to make this mystery interesting 00:16:46.880 --> 00:16:50.920 well i'm interested whether i think definitely wasn't interested after spyfall 00:16:51.839 --> 00:17:02.899 now okay let's um talk about uh good alan the cafe proprietor got killed good he deserved it 00:17:03.999 --> 00:17:04.439 Harsh 00:17:05.399 --> 00:17:05.839 Harsh 00:17:06.329 --> 00:17:07.560 He pushed a Jadoon 00:17:09.500 --> 00:17:12.040 I mean how stupid do you have to be 00:17:12.329 --> 00:17:13.480 I mean the next thing he's going to be 00:17:13.520 --> 00:17:14.660 He's going to be an old lady shouting 00:17:15.220 --> 00:17:15.880 Where's my Benny 00:17:16.459 --> 00:17:18.579 Oh wait no she was in this episode wasn't she 00:17:19.620 --> 00:17:21.060 No she wasn't 00:17:21.240 --> 00:17:23.319 I know it just reminded me of her 00:17:23.640 --> 00:17:25.699 Marcia was awesome I thought 00:17:26.540 --> 00:17:27.520 Well not for long 00:17:28.500 --> 00:17:29.520 No not for long 00:17:30.060 --> 00:17:31.020 Not for long 00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:35.300 did they shoot her or did she run into the barrier 00:17:36.000 --> 00:17:36.700 no they shot her 00:17:37.180 --> 00:17:39.100 they shot her okay I didn't see the gunfire 00:17:39.680 --> 00:17:40.840 I just saw it when he hit it 00:17:40.900 --> 00:17:41.980 and he goes oh the barrier is in 00:17:43.180 --> 00:17:43.980 operational or something 00:17:45.039 --> 00:17:46.960 that barrier better not be right there 00:17:48.020 --> 00:17:48.420 okay 00:17:49.679 --> 00:17:50.080 yeah 00:17:50.900 --> 00:17:52.520 she reminded me of the woman shouting 00:17:52.720 --> 00:17:54.420 Benny, Benny, Benny, Bungie 00:17:54.600 --> 00:17:56.220 whatever it was in the previous one 00:17:57.440 --> 00:17:58.680 I don't know if she was just 00:17:58.960 --> 00:18:01.000 better or because the director 00:18:01.020 --> 00:18:05.440 This one and the last one was so much, so much better. 00:18:10.240 --> 00:18:11.460 So, the real... 00:18:12.120 --> 00:18:12.940 Ruth is the Doctor. 00:18:13.560 --> 00:18:13.940 A Doctor. 00:18:13.990 --> 00:18:14.860 We don't know which Doctor. 00:18:15.920 --> 00:18:16.780 The Doctor. 00:18:17.660 --> 00:18:19.400 Frickin', I mean, which version of the Doctor? 00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:25.380 And for some ridiculously opaque reason, 00:18:26.260 --> 00:18:28.560 they didn't go, which one are you? 00:18:29.180 --> 00:18:30.720 Well, they did that a bit. 00:18:30.920 --> 00:18:32.360 They did that a bit because... 00:18:32.520 --> 00:18:33.180 Not a bit. 00:18:33.320 --> 00:18:33.660 Not a bit. 00:18:33.690 --> 00:18:34.260 They did not. 00:18:34.340 --> 00:18:36.660 They did not go, which doctor are you? 00:18:36.980 --> 00:18:37.460 Which one? 00:18:37.600 --> 00:18:38.440 What number are you? 00:18:38.720 --> 00:18:41.480 One, two, three, four, five, six, seven. 00:18:41.920 --> 00:18:42.900 Give me a number. 00:18:43.260 --> 00:18:45.040 Which doctor came before you? 00:18:45.040 --> 00:18:51.620 I don't think there is the slightest indication in any episode I can think of that the doctor 00:18:52.160 --> 00:18:54.380 thinks of herself in terms of numbers. 00:18:56.220 --> 00:18:56.400 Okay. 00:18:56.690 --> 00:18:58.220 They don't think of themselves. 00:18:58.460 --> 00:18:59.140 Yes, they do. 00:18:59.720 --> 00:19:00.380 No, they don't. 00:19:00.460 --> 00:19:05.400 they do because they think of themselves in the terms of regenerations well okay occasionally 00:19:05.890 --> 00:19:11.260 although okay i think that the doctor is smart enough to if the doctor remembers how many people 00:19:11.460 --> 00:19:16.020 they were the very least they could sit there and work on their fingers and figure out because i 00:19:16.030 --> 00:19:21.880 think the doctor's smart enough to work out on the fingers or go which one came before you oh before 00:19:21.970 --> 00:19:26.720 me i was the big eyebrows and the gray hair which one came before me oh it was the guy in the horrible 00:19:26.740 --> 00:19:33.520 multi-coloured outfit oh no i know i'm i think that's a much that's a much more that's a much 00:19:33.520 --> 00:19:39.720 more plausible approach i mean first of all i hate i hate the terminology the 13th doctor 00:19:40.020 --> 00:19:46.040 jodie whittaker is not the 13th doctor there is only one doctor well unless you count peter 00:19:46.130 --> 00:19:53.220 cushing the she is the whatever it is the doctor after the 12th regeneration although i don't know 00:19:53.100 --> 00:19:57.020 whether we're counting Metacrisis, Doctor, as a regeneration. So that gets complicated. 00:19:57.760 --> 00:20:03.180 And thank goodness, the Doctor doesn't go around referring to herself by numbers and has not done 00:20:03.360 --> 00:20:08.740 so. Or there would have been all sorts of trouble after the ninth, the so-called ninth Doctor, 00:20:08.830 --> 00:20:14.040 the ninth incarnation, or in fact, tenth incarnation because of the War Doctor, 00:20:14.230 --> 00:20:18.220 which suddenly turns up. So no, no, no, no, no, no to numbers. 00:20:18.440 --> 00:20:23.060 It doesn't matter whether they use a number or how they use, they count their regenerations 00:20:23.080 --> 00:20:29.800 whatever it is the point is is that they have a much easier mechanism for trying to orient themselves 00:20:30.420 --> 00:20:37.100 in when they don't know who each others are that they are they have they have a they have a mechanism 00:20:37.500 --> 00:20:42.900 for trying to orient themselves but they didn't try any of them they they start they started out 00:20:42.970 --> 00:20:48.320 well no they have several and and i'm interested in why they didn't but i but i don't contact i 00:20:48.340 --> 00:20:55.060 don't think it's entirely inexplicable that they didn't they started out with i you're in my future 00:20:55.180 --> 00:21:00.940 you're obviously in my future because that's the natural instinct they both go you're in my future 00:21:01.360 --> 00:21:05.660 because they can't remember the other one so that right that so then you're level naturally natural 00:21:06.160 --> 00:21:12.900 but then the the the second thing about what so what i want to know is okay why did they not start 00:21:13.040 --> 00:21:21.080 comparing how many whether whether there were any past regenerations assuming they both well 00:21:21.300 --> 00:21:24.540 assuming the joe martin doctor has past regenerations we know the jodie whittaker 00:21:24.700 --> 00:21:30.340 doctor has past regenerations but why did they not why did they not start comparing notes on 00:21:30.450 --> 00:21:35.080 whether there was any commonality in that so yes i'd be i'd be kind of starting off with 00:21:35.450 --> 00:21:41.580 you know the grumpy old man who ran away from gallifrey you know the reason the reason that 00:21:41.580 --> 00:21:49.820 they didn't do that is because they are not trying to process this logically they're trying 00:21:49.840 --> 00:21:55.340 to process it in terms of a secret to the audience but it's you know that the doctors 00:21:55.380 --> 00:22:00.540 would absolutely try to orient themselves they're not trying to process it logically because 00:22:01.220 --> 00:22:06.580 there are there's a there's an emotional reaction to this which i thought came across from jodie 00:22:06.600 --> 00:22:13.060 particularly strongly but also because they do not trust each other and i and that and so the 00:22:13.210 --> 00:22:19.860 other thing that i was wondering about um apart from the fact that it's a it's just a a really 00:22:20.660 --> 00:22:27.740 really really really really naff device contact thing yeah which i would rather they just forgot 00:22:28.020 --> 00:22:33.940 about you know okay so they did it in the three doctors or whatever but just and the five except 00:22:34.280 --> 00:22:35.820 that she bloody does it with Gat. 00:22:36.640 --> 00:22:37.220 And Gat. 00:22:37.600 --> 00:22:37.720 Right. 00:22:38.380 --> 00:22:40.360 So, okay, you do it in this episode, 00:22:41.080 --> 00:22:45.020 then you do start to wonder why did the two doctors not do it. 00:22:45.020 --> 00:22:51.280 But I genuinely think things are moving so fast in this, 00:22:51.320 --> 00:22:56.020 they didn't have time to build up that sense of trust. 00:22:56.800 --> 00:22:57.400 But, you know. 00:22:57.440 --> 00:23:00.040 What exactly Jodie Whittaker was thinking 00:23:00.710 --> 00:23:03.820 and revealing whatever she revealed to Gat, I don't know. 00:23:04.080 --> 00:23:10.820 because yeah she had a sense of trust there um i mean she had already determined that that that 00:23:11.300 --> 00:23:18.960 ruth was her so and the other doctors are are literally they'll run into the room and they'll 00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:24.980 say i didn't have time to explain here contact blap uh in three and five doctors so which is 00:23:25.020 --> 00:23:28.800 which is naff and annoying but but at least they they know each other and have a reason to do it 00:23:28.800 --> 00:23:36.360 I mean, if you wanted to, you could, the Sonic could have the ability to tell how many times a time launch has regenerated. 00:23:36.510 --> 00:23:47.500 Because if it can tell that you're the same person and all that kind of thing when, you know, it's in its complete molecular, dobbly dobbly, then you could do that. 00:23:47.840 --> 00:23:55.280 Or you could, because the Doctor always seems to have trouble working out her age, the Sonic could be, could have the ability to age a time launch. 00:23:55.500 --> 00:23:59.740 oh, right, you're now 3005 or whatever it is that she is at this point. 00:24:00.320 --> 00:24:03.640 But, you know, that's because the Sonic's a magic wand 00:24:03.860 --> 00:24:05.980 and Contact is a magic wand. 00:24:06.050 --> 00:24:07.760 And yeah, no thanks. 00:24:08.380 --> 00:24:08.660 Yeah. 00:24:08.870 --> 00:24:11.740 So, but because they're using all that stuff in the episode, 00:24:11.970 --> 00:24:14.900 you can't say, well, you know, it's a good thing they didn't use it. 00:24:14.960 --> 00:24:15.800 It's because they should have, 00:24:15.970 --> 00:24:18.280 because it was at their disposal and it was in their hands. 00:24:18.960 --> 00:24:21.680 And it's because the whole thing is nothing but a contrivance. 00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:23.200 An in-story reason. 00:24:23.760 --> 00:24:23.920 Yeah. 00:24:24.020 --> 00:24:30.860 and and there there clearly wasn't so no no i think that i think there was you think there 00:24:30.860 --> 00:24:36.180 was an in-story reason you just didn't tell us why they didn't i i i think i think that the the 00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:41.300 level of distrust and the and the pacing of it was was sufficient because we just cannot 00:24:41.830 --> 00:24:45.620 the time i think you might need that explanation is when they're traveling 00:24:46.220 --> 00:24:52.060 back to earth in the joe martin doctor's tardis which incidentally you are entirely correct about 00:24:52.840 --> 00:24:57.640 that would have been the point to actually say okay who are you can we work this out but even 00:24:57.840 --> 00:25:03.360 then you know joe martin is pretty grumpy and she's saying i'd like you to get off my ship now 00:25:04.960 --> 00:25:11.300 yeah um which seems to be in character for her doctor i i didn't get any character i thought 00:25:11.310 --> 00:25:20.040 she was terrible no i really like she was terrible um i think that stunt casting a disposable doctor 00:25:20.580 --> 00:25:27.520 was a stupid idea and oh but we don't know hiring someone who is you know and and then not spending 00:25:27.680 --> 00:25:34.740 the time anyway that's john hurt put in his play yeah i'm not crazy about the john hurt uh no 00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:40.700 process but at least they hired an actor who was good and they gave him a personality and here 00:25:41.380 --> 00:25:47.140 i yeah no this just doesn't because name name of the name of the doctor i thought this is this is 00:25:47.100 --> 00:25:53.260 just this is the worst idea ever but well and at the name of the doctor it was the worst idea ever 00:25:54.060 --> 00:26:03.080 um and it's still really a kluge brought on by chris eccleston being i don't think dave the 00:26:03.180 --> 00:26:06.860 doctor would have worked with christopher eccleston i think i think i think it works 00:26:07.320 --> 00:26:12.960 so well with john hurt i have it i have the greatest difficulty even imagining it was 00:26:12.860 --> 00:26:18.940 christopher eckleton and it would have screwed up rose well yeah there is that problem with rose 00:26:19.320 --> 00:26:24.040 um you could have done day of the doctor with paul mcgann yes you could have done paul mcgann 00:26:24.040 --> 00:26:29.980 and i think even that probably would have been a better uh a better option uh i'd have watched 00:26:30.100 --> 00:26:36.180 from a canon standpoint but but i like i like but here's the thing i'm glad you know what but but 00:26:36.280 --> 00:26:41.820 you're assuming joe martin is a disposable doctor but i don't think that's been established yet 00:26:42.480 --> 00:26:48.480 well okay i'm i'm i'm desperately hoping joe martin the worthless doctor is a disposable doctor 00:26:49.540 --> 00:26:56.740 um and if that would be the end of doctor who if that's the next um i'm done i think not i'm done 00:26:57.400 --> 00:27:05.760 yeah um i mean i she's about as miscast as i've ever done i have criticized the the the kind of 00:27:06.200 --> 00:27:13.860 when we when we um when we had time of the doctor and we all knew what was happening because capaldi 00:27:13.860 --> 00:27:20.040 had even appeared in day of the doctor and so there was the opportunity to do something a little 00:27:20.240 --> 00:27:26.960 bit more interesting in terms of the the sequence in which you introduced the the new doctor and it 00:27:27.140 --> 00:27:35.740 it being it involving time travel and being timey-wimey and yet what they do is just this 00:27:36.000 --> 00:27:45.760 kind of endless um emo angst about being about to quote die because they're not about to die 00:27:45.760 --> 00:27:54.740 they're about to regenerate and and and i can kind of understand why because when they introduce 00:27:54.760 --> 00:28:01.180 the new doctor they need the old doctor out of the way so the audience from a from a marketing 00:28:01.250 --> 00:28:07.920 the show point of view so the audience can bond with the new doctor without the old doctor being 00:28:08.140 --> 00:28:14.000 around for them to cling on to so i kind of get that but if this were the introduction of a new 00:28:14.260 --> 00:28:22.260 doctor then i'd be quite impressed with the audacity of the way in which they've structured it 00:28:22.280 --> 00:28:29.860 um well um it would be audacious still a bad idea but it would be audacious um 00:28:32.179 --> 00:28:39.500 here's the thing i i said it at the beginning at sky at spyfall uh the gallifrey thing with 00:28:39.600 --> 00:28:46.580 the timeless child and the master destroying it and all that stuff doesn't interest me no they 00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:52.920 haven't made it interest me yet no this is this i i am i am absolutely convinced that this is a 00:28:53.020 --> 00:29:00.080 disposable chunk of the doctor's history or an alternate universe what's what's your what's your 00:29:00.280 --> 00:29:05.260 theory then because i because i've i've been puzzling i've been puzzling this out if if this 00:29:05.340 --> 00:29:16.660 doctor is not a traditional doctor if you like so this is this is a this is a a doctor that we 00:29:16.860 --> 00:29:22.360 haven't seen from the doctor's past like john hurt or this is a doctor from the doctor's future that 00:29:22.360 --> 00:29:31.480 we haven't seen like michael jayston or this is a an a doctor from another universe like david 00:29:31.500 --> 00:29:39.200 warner or or from this universe but an alternate timeline but that probably is another universe 00:29:39.720 --> 00:29:46.620 um which is it i i i don't think that they're going to provide us with a satisfactory explanation 00:29:46.980 --> 00:29:51.160 that's going to make sense so we'll start with i mean they'll they'll have an explanation but it 00:29:51.300 --> 00:29:57.160 will ultimately fall apart um if you start thinking about it but let's let's review a 00:29:57.180 --> 00:30:02.340 couple of possibilities that that have occurred to me one as you say the simplest one is it's an 00:30:02.640 --> 00:30:12.080 alternate universe somehow and that is a parallel doctor and after this crisis is over uh the 00:30:12.140 --> 00:30:19.120 universes will be unparalleled and then that will be that will be the end of it um there's also the 00:30:19.180 --> 00:30:25.300 very real possibility that although again it does not fit with the whole doctor's counted number of 00:30:25.320 --> 00:30:31.020 regenerations, but that could theoretically be, that can easily be retconned with a stroke of a 00:30:31.180 --> 00:30:42.380 pen and a callous writer. That at some point the doctor was regenerated, taken out, made a CIA 00:30:42.740 --> 00:30:50.300 operative, functioned as a CIA operative for Gallifrey for a period of time, escaped, 00:30:51.040 --> 00:30:52.280 used the Chameleon Arch, 00:30:52.620 --> 00:30:53.480 ended up doing this. 00:30:53.720 --> 00:30:53.940 Who knows? 00:30:54.200 --> 00:30:55.740 May have regenerated more than once 00:30:56.280 --> 00:30:57.300 somewhere along the way, 00:30:57.700 --> 00:30:58.980 obviously before the Chameleon Arch, 00:30:59.420 --> 00:31:01.040 and then will be wiped 00:31:01.660 --> 00:31:04.600 and then put back to whatever doctor 00:31:04.760 --> 00:31:05.760 they were at the end of that. 00:31:06.260 --> 00:31:07.760 So you're saying it's the same timeline. 00:31:07.980 --> 00:31:09.740 So it comes between regenerations. 00:31:10.300 --> 00:31:11.240 It could have been a... 00:31:11.620 --> 00:31:12.560 Yeah, we know that Time Lords 00:31:12.640 --> 00:31:14.640 can make a regeneration do what you want. 00:31:15.200 --> 00:31:16.940 So, I mean, they could have... 00:31:17.340 --> 00:31:19.360 This could be between Colin and Sylvester. 00:31:20.100 --> 00:31:26.300 No, because we saw someone with Colin Baker's hair regenerate into Sylvester McCoy. 00:31:26.500 --> 00:31:27.440 So that's not possible. 00:31:28.160 --> 00:31:28.540 I don't know. 00:31:28.620 --> 00:31:29.580 There's a similarity there. 00:31:29.580 --> 00:31:34.700 If she were wearing a wig, look as close as the person on the floor in the TARDIS. 00:31:34.700 --> 00:31:41.500 But in other words, the Time Lords can put you back, I feel like. 00:31:42.840 --> 00:31:46.640 Well, the problem with that is I don't think you can fit it in. 00:31:47.080 --> 00:31:48.520 I don't think you can fit it in. 00:31:49.060 --> 00:32:00.820 So either way, whether you go for an alternative universe or that this is somehow a prior to Jodie Whittaker incarnation of the Doctor who we haven't seen, 00:32:02.719 --> 00:32:13.740 we can do what the Doctors didn't do in the show and we can work back to where there is some commonality. 00:32:14.660 --> 00:32:23.820 And very simply, we can straight away say that if she's an alternative universe doctor, they diverged at or pre-Troughton. 00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:25.680 Because of no sonic screwdriver. 00:32:26.060 --> 00:32:27.440 Because of no sonic screwdriver. 00:32:27.830 --> 00:32:33.400 And there is no way that this regeneration comes between Hartnell and Troughton. 00:32:34.060 --> 00:32:42.400 Well, it is possible that Troughton, since that was a Time Lord regeneration, and we did not see the transition between Troughton and Pertwee. 00:32:42.840 --> 00:32:50.520 No, but that's post-Sonic. So I'm going with the... If it's an alternative universe thing, 00:32:50.680 --> 00:32:56.680 you don't have this problem. At some point, something happened to the Doctor's timeline 00:32:57.120 --> 00:33:04.860 when she was either William Hartnell or Patrick Droughton. And this created an alternative branch 00:33:05.280 --> 00:33:12.700 of her timeline. And at some point after that, she regenerated into the Joe Martin Doctor. I'm 00:33:13.380 --> 00:33:20.320 regeneration because there's got to be some echo of of uh colin baker's testing tasting clothing 00:33:20.390 --> 00:33:27.580 for her to be wearing that shirt let's let's go with what we know um we know that the master 00:33:27.740 --> 00:33:36.300 discovered something that was a huge lie from the time lords yes this has got to be a part of this 00:33:36.840 --> 00:33:41.520 This is, I mean, see how it's impacting the current Doctor. 00:33:42.240 --> 00:33:53.520 Think how something like this would happen if the Master found out that there was some, again, still not knowing what it is, but that there's like another Master running around, which we'll come back to in a minute. 00:33:54.240 --> 00:34:02.980 But, you know, if our Doctor is floored by this, the Master could be floored by it. 00:34:03.700 --> 00:34:08.159 And if he blamed our Time Lords, then he might destroy them. 00:34:09.010 --> 00:34:26.280 And since they sent something back through time, the Alliance, to do something, could it be that this is a thing that the Time Lords were going to do or did do in order to stop the Cybermen thing, which created an alternate timeline? 00:34:27.960 --> 00:34:31.860 It's going to be a convoluted mess and it's going to get undone. 00:34:32.419 --> 00:34:32.919 Could be that. 00:34:32.960 --> 00:34:44.179 I mean, the questions that immediately occur to me are, I'm now thinking because of what happened to the master in The Doctor Falls, 00:34:44.919 --> 00:34:55.440 that the master, the O master that we're seeing here is from the same timeline as the Joe Martin Doctor. 00:34:56.879 --> 00:34:57.580 It's possible. 00:34:57.920 --> 00:35:11.200 Except that the timeline that Joe Martin Doctor is from seems to have a, either the time or the timeline seems to have a Gallifrey that isn't destroyed. 00:35:13.200 --> 00:35:17.900 So if the O Master is from the alternative timeline. 00:35:18.540 --> 00:35:19.820 He destroyed the wrong Gallifrey. 00:35:19.960 --> 00:35:22.700 Did he destroy? Yes. Did he destroy the wrong Gallifrey? Yeah. 00:35:23.700 --> 00:35:25.940 Okay. So here's my, this is honestly. 00:35:26.910 --> 00:35:27.240 Go on. 00:35:27.720 --> 00:35:33.620 What I was going to say is that this mystery doesn't really, it really does not make me care any more about this mystery. 00:35:33.990 --> 00:35:40.080 There is only one thing that I came out of this episode going, hmm, that's interesting. 00:35:40.860 --> 00:35:45.880 All the rest of it seems completely disposable to me and at every level. 00:35:47.360 --> 00:35:48.820 I just want to know one thing. 00:35:49.310 --> 00:35:50.220 Who the heck is Lee? 00:35:50.700 --> 00:35:56.880 Lee is, he's a Gallifreyan who is the equivalent of... 00:35:56.800 --> 00:36:02.520 faithful companion of the doctor john smith no no no no no no no no no no no i don't mean it that 00:36:02.600 --> 00:36:12.080 way i mean if this is an alternate timeline who is lee the master romana oh i see the way to call 00:36:12.080 --> 00:36:20.460 a faithful companion why but if if they if i can see okay so you're you're taking the fact that 00:36:20.700 --> 00:36:28.980 lee is gallifreyan and you want there to be a parallel so you want the doctor in this alternate 00:36:29.200 --> 00:36:36.140 timeline if indeed this doctor is from an alternate timeline to still be traveling with one of the 00:36:36.280 --> 00:36:42.640 same people she travels with in this timeline even though the divergence of the timeline is 00:36:42.720 --> 00:36:48.420 sufficient that she's ended up regenerating into someone else yeah but then you did just postulate 00:36:48.440 --> 00:36:53.440 that with that closed sense it must be the sixth doctor so there are you're you know you're saying 00:36:53.540 --> 00:37:00.640 they're parallels or you think there's parallels or you're looking for parallels so i'm only i'm 00:37:00.780 --> 00:37:07.240 yes yes i was more i was more going for the joke there but okay but i suppose the thing that 00:37:07.500 --> 00:37:14.240 suggests that this doctor is earlier is because the tardis has changed less than yes jodie wick 00:37:14.260 --> 00:37:19.180 sonic but even but even then it's an alternate timeline she could have regenerated a couple of 00:37:19.300 --> 00:37:27.520 dozen times and just not done as much redecorating correct um but so let's carry this one step 00:37:27.820 --> 00:37:36.080 further if it's an earlier doctor it's a divergent version of some earlier doctor prior to terror of 00:37:36.080 --> 00:37:44.220 the autons has the master gone bad remember the master was the doctor's friend but in gallifrey 00:37:44.440 --> 00:37:49.880 Are you saying the master went bad in or immediately prior to Terror of the Autums? 00:37:50.740 --> 00:37:52.680 Not in necessarily or immediately. 00:37:53.060 --> 00:37:54.740 I'm just saying somewhere along the line. 00:37:55.440 --> 00:37:56.840 We don't know where that happened. 00:37:57.340 --> 00:38:02.120 If this is an earlier version going back as possibly as far as the first or second doctor. 00:38:02.690 --> 00:38:09.120 Yes, it could be the master who did not, you know, something happened. 00:38:09.360 --> 00:38:10.440 Gallifrey went to war. 00:38:10.860 --> 00:38:12.500 Obviously, they were fighting something. 00:38:13.220 --> 00:38:18.440 He's carrying a medal, a war medal that he's sentimental about. 00:38:18.980 --> 00:38:20.040 Yes, good point. 00:38:20.040 --> 00:38:20.560 So there's something. 00:38:20.920 --> 00:38:21.900 They worked for Gat. 00:38:22.040 --> 00:38:25.400 Gat's obviously military for the honor of Gallifrey and stuff. 00:38:25.420 --> 00:38:31.420 So it all feels like they were in the Secret Service spy thing. 00:38:32.240 --> 00:38:34.680 And not that there's any parallel there. 00:38:35.660 --> 00:38:46.160 And that maybe at the end of this, that gets wiped from the Doctor's memory as payment for saving Gallifrey again or something. 00:38:46.540 --> 00:38:55.480 I don't know, but it's possible that in that scenario, the Master may have been part of the Time War. 00:38:55.580 --> 00:38:59.720 In some sort of old timeline Season 6B theory nonsense. 00:38:59.980 --> 00:39:02.520 Necessarily as antagonistic to one another. 00:39:03.820 --> 00:39:15.000 And, of course, in the modern series, we get that clear sort of romance, romance thing going there that, you know, in this alternate. 00:39:15.780 --> 00:39:21.680 Yeah, well, in this alternate universe, Ruth doesn't know, although presumably Lee does. 00:39:22.910 --> 00:39:25.440 So, yes, I feel like he's taking advantage of her. 00:39:25.710 --> 00:39:30.640 I also want to point one thing out when you say you think it's an earlier doctor. 00:39:31.280 --> 00:39:33.060 And I agree with those two points. 00:39:33.240 --> 00:39:35.580 It's definitely an old TARDIS console room. 00:39:35.760 --> 00:39:36.760 God, it looks so good. 00:39:37.200 --> 00:39:42.340 It even looks so much better than the one they did in Capali's era with the stolen TARDIS. 00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:45.400 It's presumably some evolution of that, but yeah, it does. 00:39:45.580 --> 00:39:49.900 Well, but it's got some of the stuff from way, way back in the Hartnell era. 00:39:50.780 --> 00:39:54.200 I think there's a couple shots where you've got those kind of booth-like things. 00:39:54.360 --> 00:39:55.760 And oh, yeah, no, it's a beauty. 00:39:57.700 --> 00:40:01.040 It's just absolutely, you know, just trash the darn. 00:40:01.120 --> 00:40:01.520 It's gorgeous. 00:40:01.900 --> 00:40:02.640 That's what it could do. 00:40:02.760 --> 00:40:06.220 Swap the TARDISes before you wipe out the other doctor. 00:40:07.760 --> 00:40:10.520 But there's another clue that you missed. 00:40:10.650 --> 00:40:11.640 Well, maybe you didn't miss it. 00:40:12.160 --> 00:40:14.560 But I thought it was very interesting. 00:40:15.940 --> 00:40:17.680 When did this happen? 00:40:18.380 --> 00:40:27.700 When did the doctor, when did the Ruth doctor come into existence as Ruth Clayton, not as the doctor? 00:40:28.280 --> 00:40:29.140 Because we have a clue. 00:40:29.380 --> 00:40:30.700 she actually said when it was, 00:40:31.230 --> 00:40:32.740 although when it probably was, 00:40:33.220 --> 00:40:34.280 when she moved to Gloucester. 00:40:34.280 --> 00:40:38.300 You mean when she activated the chameleon arc? 00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:40.200 When she moved to Gloucester. 00:40:40.430 --> 00:40:41.000 So in other words, 00:40:41.070 --> 00:40:42.400 when she moved to Gloucester in 1999? 00:40:43.540 --> 00:40:44.580 No, December. 00:40:45.180 --> 00:40:45.960 December 1999. 00:40:46.640 --> 00:40:48.080 Mid-December 1999. 00:40:49.400 --> 00:40:50.980 Do we know any stories that took place 00:40:50.990 --> 00:40:52.140 in December of 1999? 00:40:53.060 --> 00:40:54.320 Oh, I like it. 00:40:54.940 --> 00:40:56.080 I like it. 00:40:56.780 --> 00:40:57.700 How interesting. 00:40:58.440 --> 00:41:01.680 I thought that was true on the nose. 00:41:01.750 --> 00:41:04.680 If it had been at the end of December 1999, it would have been perfect. 00:41:04.790 --> 00:41:08.460 It was oddly specific, giving it a date like that. 00:41:08.940 --> 00:41:10.120 So, yeah. 00:41:10.720 --> 00:41:12.340 It's got to have a purpose. 00:41:13.580 --> 00:41:14.680 Or just a red herring. 00:41:15.300 --> 00:41:16.740 No, no, no, no, no, no. 00:41:17.740 --> 00:41:19.860 Although I would have said end of December 1999. 00:41:20.530 --> 00:41:27.820 You know, that would have been because we know that the Doctor Who movie occurred December 31st, 1999. 00:41:28.060 --> 00:41:30.600 and I think maybe as early as the 30th, 00:41:30.780 --> 00:41:34.360 but wouldn't have been mid on the other side of the planet. 00:41:34.510 --> 00:41:34.840 In fact, 00:41:35.240 --> 00:41:35.380 but, 00:41:35.870 --> 00:41:35.960 but, 00:41:35.980 --> 00:41:37.280 but yeah. 00:41:38.680 --> 00:41:38.840 Yeah. 00:41:38.910 --> 00:41:39.340 I can't, 00:41:39.350 --> 00:41:39.800 I can't, 00:41:39.900 --> 00:41:40.600 I can't see what, 00:41:40.600 --> 00:41:42.620 I can't see what the significance of it is, 00:41:43.939 --> 00:41:45.600 but it must be significant. 00:41:46.360 --> 00:41:47.400 It feels like a clue. 00:41:47.920 --> 00:41:49.120 It definitely feels like a clue. 00:41:49.120 --> 00:41:51.100 And there might well be a connection there. 00:41:51.580 --> 00:41:51.700 I mean, 00:41:51.760 --> 00:41:51.940 the other, 00:41:52.060 --> 00:41:55.080 the other thing is she's quite a kick-ass doctor. 00:41:55.470 --> 00:41:57.040 I don't know if that's Venusian Aikido, 00:41:57.740 --> 00:42:03.220 But I can't imagine Jodie Whittaker knocking out six rhinos. 00:42:03.220 --> 00:42:08.780 I can't imagine any of them except Pertwee. 00:42:09.280 --> 00:42:09.440 Yeah. 00:42:09.870 --> 00:42:12.280 So that's more sort of alt three. 00:42:14.420 --> 00:42:20.420 I also have a hard time with the I handed you a gun that's going to blow up in your face. 00:42:21.060 --> 00:42:25.600 I can sort of didn't Tenon do something like that in the Poison Sky. 00:42:30.799 --> 00:42:38.880 it's possible i i can imagine it but it's it's definitely it's definitely more harsh than um 00:42:39.980 --> 00:42:44.760 than miss all rainbows and trousers that don't reach would uh would do and then there's that 00:42:44.960 --> 00:42:52.360 scene the doctor doesn't use guns i know that don't tell them come on it's like um like they 00:42:52.280 --> 00:42:59.160 couldn't hear that um the doctor as we know does use guns so it's nonsense right that's a lie right 00:42:59.700 --> 00:43:09.300 that's that's completely false but still yeah yeah it's just so much so much for me not to like in 00:43:09.400 --> 00:43:17.680 this honestly um i i i just i didn't dislike that i thought you remember remember what we said during 00:43:17.660 --> 00:43:23.340 spyfall when i when i said that i felt like chibbers was having a temper tantrum yet he didn't 00:43:23.520 --> 00:43:30.460 like what moffat had done bringing gallifrey back and whatnot this still feels like that this feels 00:43:30.580 --> 00:43:37.880 like vandalism not creative no no i i i disagree because because because this time around he's 00:43:38.140 --> 00:43:45.359 he's he's following moffat's lead in if if he is adding in a doctor that we didn't previously know 00:43:45.380 --> 00:43:52.660 about that's homage to moffat moffat did that i think more than that it's it there's a lot of 00:43:52.800 --> 00:43:59.580 rtd stuff in here because you know the jadoons rtd captain jack's rtd chameleon arcs well actually 00:43:59.600 --> 00:44:05.440 i don't know why paul cornell didn't get a credit um because he wrote both of the versions of human 00:44:05.600 --> 00:44:12.319 nature i think and that's where it comes from but i don't think they mentioned it in uh uh utopia 00:44:13.000 --> 00:44:14.520 either. Well, the chameleon arc that 00:44:14.940 --> 00:44:15.820 the master uses. 00:44:16.460 --> 00:44:17.840 Cornell didn't get a credit for that. 00:44:18.300 --> 00:44:20.320 No, but I mean, why didn't he get a credit 00:44:20.620 --> 00:44:21.960 in this episode? 00:44:22.540 --> 00:44:24.360 But I'm saying they used the chameleon art in 00:44:24.520 --> 00:44:26.120 Utopia, or whichever one that was, 00:44:26.540 --> 00:44:28.400 or The Last of the Time Lords, and he didn't get 00:44:28.400 --> 00:44:30.340 a credit there either. Oh, I see. 00:44:30.360 --> 00:44:32.460 So why would he get a credit here? Oh, yeah. 00:44:32.700 --> 00:44:34.360 Well, I guess because they 00:44:34.540 --> 00:44:35.840 specifically mentioned it 00:44:36.460 --> 00:44:38.300 in this one. They specifically 00:44:38.660 --> 00:44:39.780 mentioned it in that one, too. 00:44:40.360 --> 00:44:41.920 Too long ago. I'd have to re-watch it. 00:44:42.120 --> 00:44:43.940 I could rewatch it. I like that episode. 00:44:44.160 --> 00:44:45.080 I might rewatch it. 00:44:46.080 --> 00:44:47.760 Although I need to rewatch 00:44:48.360 --> 00:44:50.340 Curse of Fenric because of the sad 00:44:50.680 --> 00:44:52.280 passing of Nicholas Parsons. 00:44:53.700 --> 00:44:54.660 Is there... 00:44:56.080 --> 00:44:58.520 Are we supposed to treat this as a two-part episode? 00:44:59.180 --> 00:44:59.940 I think it's a... 00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:01.779 I think it's a 00:45:02.440 --> 00:45:04.380 set-up episode, but I don't 00:45:04.380 --> 00:45:05.760 think we're getting part two next week. 00:45:06.300 --> 00:45:08.520 Okay. You think that's just a complete coincidence? 00:45:08.540 --> 00:45:09.100 That's my feeling. 00:45:09.520 --> 00:45:12.700 that they led one episode into the next, 00:45:12.760 --> 00:45:15.160 which is very rare in this age of Doctor Who. 00:45:15.180 --> 00:45:19.560 It is rare, but there's got to be some explanation 00:45:19.940 --> 00:45:25.340 of why they will now have spent, what, six stories on Soul 3? 00:45:25.940 --> 00:45:26.540 It's cheap. 00:45:29.620 --> 00:45:32.240 Well, they've obviously spent a lot of time traveling around. 00:45:33.440 --> 00:45:34.680 Well, I don't know whether... 00:45:34.680 --> 00:45:38.640 Yeah, how cheap is it when the part of Soul 3 00:45:38.660 --> 00:45:41.000 you do all your filming on is in South Africa. 00:45:41.940 --> 00:45:47.580 Well, they went to somewhere in Bosnia or Czechoslovakia 00:45:47.860 --> 00:45:52.300 or something for the, well, where was that one? 00:45:52.860 --> 00:45:54.720 Didn't they go to the Canaries for Orphan 55? 00:45:55.460 --> 00:45:56.460 I think they did. 00:45:57.020 --> 00:45:59.420 I think they've gone to several places. 00:46:00.000 --> 00:46:02.020 I think space travel is a lot cheaper, actually. 00:46:02.980 --> 00:46:04.980 Well, I think they're making up for elsewhere, though. 00:46:04.980 --> 00:46:06.240 Space travel mostly happens in Aquarium Wales, 00:46:06.420 --> 00:46:07.780 and that's dead cheap. 00:46:07.880 --> 00:46:08.020 Yeah. 00:46:08.660 --> 00:46:10.360 I think they're making up for it elsewhere though 00:46:10.460 --> 00:46:10.880 because I just 00:46:12.200 --> 00:46:14.300 every episode I keep 00:46:14.860 --> 00:46:15.000 thinking 00:46:16.440 --> 00:46:18.240 they've cut a little corners here and there 00:46:18.980 --> 00:46:19.380 and 00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:22.120 this one too, I mean the Captain Jack stuff 00:46:22.220 --> 00:46:23.500 I mean I get why they did it 00:46:24.300 --> 00:46:25.960 because of the secret and not letting it know 00:46:26.060 --> 00:46:27.660 but at the same time those scenes 00:46:28.240 --> 00:46:29.560 feel like they were done on the cheap 00:46:30.860 --> 00:46:31.800 Oh no I like 00:46:32.820 --> 00:46:34.360 I do want to mention one thing about that 00:46:34.620 --> 00:46:36.080 on the Captain Jack 00:46:37.620 --> 00:46:38.020 cameo 00:46:38.100 --> 00:46:43.700 the surprise like i say the scene was written to be a surprise they did it to be a surprise chibnall 00:46:43.780 --> 00:46:52.860 has been working his little butt off to keep everything secret yeah this year i mean the the 00:46:52.980 --> 00:46:57.860 the next time trailers aren't interesting because there's nothing in them to make you want to watch 00:46:57.860 --> 00:47:03.700 them the the the teasers aren't very interesting because there's nothing to make you want to watch 00:47:03.720 --> 00:47:12.320 them they're so they're so penurious with their with what they give out that they're disinteresting 00:47:12.860 --> 00:47:18.560 and this is why and this is why because he's working on these secrets but if nobody watches 00:47:18.880 --> 00:47:24.240 because nobody cares and and we'll mention we'll mention the doctor who's social media here in a 00:47:24.310 --> 00:47:32.579 second when graham plops down in the middle of that empty set and you hear the voice and it goes 00:47:32.680 --> 00:47:33.660 Hey, I'll just hold on there. 00:47:33.660 --> 00:47:34.560 I got laser spikes. 00:47:34.560 --> 00:47:35.500 You got to keep the thing going. 00:47:35.700 --> 00:47:37.560 Things lasery, spiky thingies. 00:47:37.880 --> 00:47:40.260 And I'm going, that sounds like Captain Jack. 00:47:41.340 --> 00:47:46.580 There is no actual reason for them, for him to be hidden away. 00:47:47.340 --> 00:47:51.520 It's literally there so that the audience will be listening to it going, 00:47:51.980 --> 00:47:54.120 Hey, that sounds like Captain Jack. 00:47:54.740 --> 00:47:56.180 And then the reveal. 00:47:56.740 --> 00:47:57.080 Yeah. 00:47:58.400 --> 00:47:59.740 And wasn't it good? 00:48:00.460 --> 00:48:00.680 Eh. 00:48:03.820 --> 00:48:09.020 he could have he could have literally had his back yeah he could have had his back to the console 00:48:09.360 --> 00:48:13.500 and graham pops up and lands on the floor and what's going on there i think it's me captain 00:48:13.580 --> 00:48:17.100 jack how would that been any different than giving us a couple lines where you kind of 00:48:17.400 --> 00:48:22.780 go and watch out for the laser spikes and stuff i i don't know it just i liked it okay one so one 00:48:22.800 --> 00:48:28.359 thing um because i saw man did i see a lot of complaints about this i will i will you know 00:48:28.340 --> 00:48:37.980 admit that I may have, through some means, managed to watch a BBC version of this episode. 00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:48.020 And so that's talking about noon, where I live on Saturday. And it does not air in the United 00:48:48.280 --> 00:48:56.980 States till I think 8pm on BBC America, I believe, in the United States. And if you don't have BBC 00:48:57.000 --> 00:49:02.960 America, which I don't, it doesn't come out on iTunes until midnight or possibly even 1am, 00:49:03.240 --> 00:49:08.200 depending, I think it's California time. So, uh, you know, quite late. I watched it 00:49:10.140 --> 00:49:16.400 in a two hour window of when it, it aired. So basically immediately after it aired, 00:49:18.119 --> 00:49:24.960 probably 15 minutes after I watched that. Well, one, I got a, I got a text message from Ben saying 00:49:25.020 --> 00:49:35.100 WTF. And, uh, and then I, uh, and then I, uh, I popped on my Facebook and the literally the first 00:49:35.300 --> 00:49:41.460 post there was from Dr. Who going, well, now that Captain Jack's back in Dr. Who, find out 00:49:41.770 --> 00:49:47.560 the amazing stuff about Captain Jack. And I'm looking at that and there's just like 50 to a 00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:54.940 hundred comments following that up going, thank you so much. This hasn't aired yet. Dr. Who's 00:49:54.960 --> 00:50:04.100 who account and i mean very very mad very very mad people and and rightly so kind of rightly so 00:50:04.380 --> 00:50:09.220 because a mistake they made but i mean that's terribly ill-mannered i think and and it was 00:50:09.860 --> 00:50:15.780 like i said there's nothing to it except the surprise there's no value to that scene except 00:50:15.940 --> 00:50:21.680 for the surprise and captain in terms of the story but he's not really back i mean he's just 00:50:21.760 --> 00:50:27.160 like it's a cameo it's a captain jack cameo it's like oh yeah all right fine but the the whole 00:50:27.170 --> 00:50:32.660 thing is the whole point of it is the surprise and they absolutely ruined it for everybody outside 00:50:32.750 --> 00:50:38.080 of britain and they ought to know that social media doesn't work that way and and yeah shame 00:50:38.190 --> 00:50:46.079 on the bbc for that really really bad uh handling of that but especially considering how hard chibbers 00:50:46.100 --> 00:50:52.320 worked to keep it a secret yeah yeah clearly clearly that wasn't that wasn't his intention 00:50:52.430 --> 00:50:59.740 that was some marketing muppet well you know something if we and here's the thing i i would 00:50:59.740 --> 00:51:06.200 be willing to bet because i i don't see the i i've really gotten 100 official ratings but 00:51:06.440 --> 00:51:14.340 they aren't great at least on the first view on the bbc um this year and last um you know they've 00:51:14.320 --> 00:51:15.420 They've been trailing. 00:51:16.020 --> 00:51:18.200 And I don't know what's happening on BBC America, 00:51:18.720 --> 00:51:22.620 but I can totally see them being higher 00:51:23.380 --> 00:51:26.820 for this episode in the United States because of that. 00:51:27.300 --> 00:51:28.340 Oh, Captain Jack's back. 00:51:28.420 --> 00:51:29.140 I'm tuning in. 00:51:29.640 --> 00:51:30.840 I can absolutely see that. 00:51:31.420 --> 00:51:34.040 And, you know, now we're talking about the question 00:51:34.140 --> 00:51:37.180 between what is the balance between not having spoilers 00:51:37.300 --> 00:51:38.840 and actually getting people to watch 00:51:39.460 --> 00:51:45.320 and getting what needs to be done to keep a show going. 00:51:45.860 --> 00:51:47.040 Well, I'll tell you what I want. 00:51:47.180 --> 00:51:47.920 I want no spoilers. 00:51:48.640 --> 00:51:49.500 I'm going to watch it anyway. 00:51:50.140 --> 00:51:53.800 Yes, but we're probably an exception. 00:51:54.380 --> 00:51:56.540 A lot of people are casual viewers 00:51:56.790 --> 00:51:58.240 and a lot of people are, 00:51:58.620 --> 00:51:59.800 oh, watch it if it's convenient. 00:52:00.280 --> 00:52:02.540 It's not must-see TV for most people. 00:52:03.480 --> 00:52:05.800 And these sorts of things make it, 00:52:06.020 --> 00:52:08.120 oh, great, the Daleks are back next week. 00:52:08.300 --> 00:52:09.860 I'll make an effort to watch this. 00:52:10.340 --> 00:52:16.120 Which is why all these Dalek episodes get called Exorcism of the Daleks or something. 00:52:16.850 --> 00:52:16.940 Right. 00:52:18.640 --> 00:52:25.200 And any surprise appearance by a Dalek is never a surprise appearance because they never, never managed to keep those ones secret. 00:52:25.350 --> 00:52:26.760 And wouldn't it be nice if they did? 00:52:27.579 --> 00:52:31.760 I personally felt that there was a sidecar in this, but, you know, this discussion. 00:52:31.940 --> 00:52:36.180 But anyway, have you got anything else on Fugitive of the Jadoon? 00:52:36.840 --> 00:52:37.140 Oh, yeah. 00:52:37.410 --> 00:52:37.780 Oh, yeah. 00:52:38.420 --> 00:52:44.600 so um you mentioned lee and and one thing that just uh i've got a few things badly but one thing 00:52:44.790 --> 00:52:48.800 just occurred to me while you were while you were talking literally while you were talking you know 00:52:48.880 --> 00:52:55.260 that um so you weren't listening you were just okay no go ahead i well i was multitasking my 00:52:55.400 --> 00:53:02.220 good man i was multitasking i i know that men aren't supposed to be able to do that um and so 00:53:02.240 --> 00:53:04.180 I was probably doing everything I was doing badly. 00:53:04.400 --> 00:53:09.540 But there was a sort of super fan, 00:53:10.700 --> 00:53:11.980 apparently, I don't know much about him, 00:53:12.260 --> 00:53:14.820 a chap called Paul Condon, who died last year. 00:53:15.800 --> 00:53:18.620 And after whom the Jadoon captain was named, 00:53:18.880 --> 00:53:20.880 who is Captain Paul Condon. 00:53:22.920 --> 00:53:25.860 Probably not connected, quite possibly a coincidence. 00:53:26.020 --> 00:53:28.000 But tell me, if you can, 00:53:28.620 --> 00:53:30.800 the names of anyone you can think of 00:53:30.800 --> 00:53:38.180 connected with designing the dvd covers for doctor who releases think of any no no i can't 00:53:38.940 --> 00:53:44.580 you heard of lee binding uh now that you mentioned the name i have heard the name lee binding he didn't 00:53:44.580 --> 00:53:50.940 he do some of the early steelbooks didn't he do some of the early steelbooks yeah quite possibly 00:53:51.120 --> 00:53:56.480 he's doing all the time i remember the big blue box podcast was having a strop about the fact that 00:53:56.540 --> 00:54:00.220 they'd replaced and i think it was lee binding that got kicked out and replaced by somebody 00:54:00.240 --> 00:54:04.840 did some really awful ones or something but oh no i think i think that was clayton hickman on the 00:54:04.940 --> 00:54:10.160 sharder possibly i think well no there definitely was somebody complaining on on big blue blocks 00:54:10.560 --> 00:54:16.960 big blue i think i think there was a lovely cover that clayton hickman did with a knitted scarf for 00:54:17.020 --> 00:54:23.280 sharder and they and i think that was the steel book and they junked it and replaced it with a 00:54:24.000 --> 00:54:27.900 lee binding drawing which is you know a pretty nice cover too but it was a shame because 00:54:28.520 --> 00:54:30.180 I saw Clayton Hickman posted 00:54:30.260 --> 00:54:31.280 what he'd done on Twitter 00:54:32.440 --> 00:54:34.160 and I thought it was pretty 00:54:34.320 --> 00:54:35.940 nice and the fact that I've now mentioned 00:54:36.140 --> 00:54:38.200 these two names, does that give you a clue 00:54:38.200 --> 00:54:40.140 where I'm going with this? Lee Clayton 00:54:40.560 --> 00:54:41.680 Is that a coincidence? 00:54:44.460 --> 00:54:45.260 Probably not 00:54:45.880 --> 00:54:47.340 It just struck me 00:54:48.500 --> 00:54:50.240 Let's face it, the name Lee Clayton 00:54:50.300 --> 00:54:50.840 is a cover 00:54:52.180 --> 00:54:53.660 See, it's a cover name 00:54:54.020 --> 00:54:54.720 Ha ha 00:54:57.240 --> 00:55:01.760 if it's a tribute in any way i know clayton hickman won't appreciate it because he wasn't 00:55:01.910 --> 00:55:09.800 watching it because he stopped watching doctor who um i just got this cover off no no no no i 00:55:09.980 --> 00:55:14.640 just i don't think he i don't think he's that into the current uh current past few series 00:55:15.700 --> 00:55:24.140 i i just i i thing on the re-watching with lee is is how cleverly they've written 00:55:24.160 --> 00:55:36.540 everything about the Ruth Lee relationship and the way in which he appears to be acting out of 00:55:36.700 --> 00:55:43.500 one motivation. And then when you rewatch it, it all works again. Now you know what his actual 00:55:44.480 --> 00:55:49.280 motivation is. Oh, there is one other thing. Everything that interests me about this story, 00:55:49.480 --> 00:55:55.040 everything that interests me about this story is lee i don't know who lee is and more importantly 00:55:55.360 --> 00:56:02.700 i want to know what weird books he checks out of the library yes also also weird books and he 00:56:02.860 --> 00:56:10.860 cuts his own hair yes it is like describing me basically it's like are you i'm not gonna ask 00:56:11.780 --> 00:56:21.080 the the the puzzling thing for me about lee was actually um the the bio shield bit i could have 00:56:21.080 --> 00:56:28.640 done with an explanation of that i understand how it was that when she scanned ruth the doctor 00:56:29.740 --> 00:56:36.240 identified her as being 100 human in human nature the person looking after the doctor 00:56:36.580 --> 00:56:45.440 is well benny slash martha who are 100% human not that it matters but had she scanned them both 00:56:45.440 --> 00:56:50.800 they would have been human in this one it's pretty clear that lee is gallifreyan because 00:56:51.130 --> 00:56:58.500 yep she and gap both received identical training service medal etc etc so there's some mechanism 00:56:58.700 --> 00:57:04.180 that's not a chameleon arc but which has the equivalent biological shielding to a chameleon 00:57:04.200 --> 00:57:10.220 arc and it's not a chameleon arc because he still has all of his proper memories genuine bona fide 00:57:10.300 --> 00:57:17.220 memories and that so that was a that was the that was the one thing that i thought it it it was 00:57:17.400 --> 00:57:22.740 probably confusing in a way that was unintentional um it just needed i think they were trying to make 00:57:22.780 --> 00:57:27.140 it less confusing by just making it consistent that there's a bio encryption on there but 00:57:27.540 --> 00:57:33.140 if you look back at the actual history of that mechanism it should have you're right it should 00:57:33.140 --> 00:57:38.840 have been completely different i i'm gonna say also by the way that that i can forgive ryan but 00:57:38.840 --> 00:57:45.840 i don't forgive yas um what are you what are we forgetting them for for how rubbish they are at 00:57:46.060 --> 00:57:54.060 searching a house which by the way they have four minutes to do and in that four minutes 00:57:54.880 --> 00:58:00.980 yas manages to find a box hidden at the back of a cupboard or something and ryan figures out that 00:58:00.920 --> 00:58:07.560 they've got cash flow problems right but neither in four minutes in less than four minutes but 00:58:07.860 --> 00:58:15.220 neither of them spots the gun that lee goes for in the dresser in the side table drawer 00:58:16.180 --> 00:58:21.920 right he reaches for it and cat goes oh sit we had the same training it's like 00:58:22.520 --> 00:58:30.880 how did they miss the alien gun how does ruth not see the alien gun sitting in the living room 00:58:30.900 --> 00:58:31.160 drawer. 00:58:34.580 --> 00:58:35.100 Problem. 00:58:35.600 --> 00:58:36.460 Problem with that. 00:58:39.180 --> 00:58:44.020 I mean, in a way, it should have been Yaz who found out the cash flow problems, because 00:58:44.140 --> 00:58:45.860 that's a much more copper thing to do. 00:58:46.900 --> 00:58:52.260 But you're mentioning that does tie me into one of the things that I wanted to complain 00:58:52.560 --> 00:59:00.860 about about this episode, which is my standing complaint about Yaz, which is that she's a 00:59:00.860 --> 00:59:06.700 officer and in fairness after about 20 minutes in this episode she does remember that she's a 00:59:06.740 --> 00:59:12.860 police officer and says i'm a police officer and goes out and tries to talk police to the jadun 00:59:13.300 --> 00:59:20.260 but there's other language human police she's human police but the whole thing about bringing 00:59:20.460 --> 00:59:26.860 back the jadun is that the jadun are police and all of the commentary about the jadun 00:59:26.860 --> 00:59:36.020 has to do with excessive police brutality and it's not that far-fetched some of it I'm thinking 00:59:36.720 --> 00:59:42.180 and so there's an interesting thing about the portrayal of the police in the show here because 00:59:42.340 --> 00:59:49.580 on the one hand we have I think for the first time in the tv series someone who is a police person 00:59:50.060 --> 00:59:56.840 as one of our heroes so we're putting some faith in someone who has some faith in the 00:59:57.220 --> 01:00:03.340 the police service so when when the doctor says you know the judoom is space police or whatever 01:00:03.540 --> 01:00:10.320 and they're terrible and graham says but i thought you said they were the police we need to see yas's 01:00:10.380 --> 01:00:15.320 reaction at that point i want to see what her expression is when she said that in fact why 01:00:15.340 --> 01:00:22.180 doesn't she have the line about them being the police i i i don't i don't get the sense 01:00:23.260 --> 01:00:30.220 that and you know this this is this is written by um uh vishnay patel but with 01:00:30.710 --> 01:00:37.540 chris chibnall this new tell wrote um ah the one about partition last last season 01:00:38.090 --> 01:00:45.300 uh i've forgotten its name anyway it was also very good um but chibnall chibnall even if patel 01:00:45.500 --> 01:00:50.380 doesn't pick these things up chibnall blinking well or two because yaz is his character 01:00:51.140 --> 01:00:56.400 they don't seem to remember that she's a police officer and probably has thoughts about the 01:00:56.640 --> 01:01:07.020 police and and you know we have a certain amount of if if he did in right if did if he did indeed 01:01:07.600 --> 01:01:14.380 write the episode last year about the partition of india that was kind of you could argue that 01:01:14.380 --> 01:01:16.980 that's a Yaz-centric story. 01:01:17.960 --> 01:01:18.120 Yes. 01:01:18.940 --> 01:01:24.960 So, and could be forgiven in thinking, write what you know, or write what interests you. 01:01:26.920 --> 01:01:31.460 I'm surprised that Yaz wasn't important in this story, except let's face it, the whole 01:01:32.360 --> 01:01:36.800 companions all had to get written out so they could be off doing a cameo with Captain Jack. 01:01:38.220 --> 01:01:40.180 But, yeah, yeah. 01:01:40.500 --> 01:01:44.720 And I was going to ask, actually, do you feel that Yaz's accent is getting thicker? 01:01:45.280 --> 01:01:46.340 No, I hadn't noticed that. 01:01:46.940 --> 01:01:48.960 It felt it that way to me this time. 01:01:51.060 --> 01:01:53.460 It may just be her natural, her natural. 01:01:53.940 --> 01:01:58.860 I haven't, I'm not, I haven't heard how her accent has changed. 01:01:58.940 --> 01:02:01.260 And I haven't actually seen her interviewed all that much. 01:02:01.880 --> 01:02:05.160 So I don't know how her accent differs from the characters. 01:02:05.500 --> 01:02:08.260 But is she, is she getting closer to her natural accent? 01:02:09.320 --> 01:02:12.240 Because I could understand that if she's just relaxing a bit in the part. 01:02:12.620 --> 01:02:13.020 Could be. 01:02:13.200 --> 01:02:17.320 It just felt a little stronger than usual this week. 01:02:19.080 --> 01:02:19.740 Anything else? 01:02:21.180 --> 01:02:25.680 It's a tiny nitpick, and I feel bad ending on a tiny nitpick. 01:02:26.880 --> 01:02:31.500 But so, I mean, we've got the Mardi Doctor at the beginning again. 01:02:32.120 --> 01:02:37.140 And thankfully, you know, we appear to have blown that away a bit 01:02:37.160 --> 01:02:38.920 with the whole don't lie to us. 01:02:39.180 --> 01:02:44.580 thing but during that exchange Yaz says was that you know is that where you're going he's saying 01:02:44.700 --> 01:02:53.180 you'll be back in now but you never are and I'm thinking blimey it's a time she she could go and 01:02:53.360 --> 01:03:01.860 spend weeks being Mardi and wandering around the ruins of Gallifrey and still be back in 59 minutes 01:03:02.280 --> 01:03:09.000 if she if she chose to because how long she spends on something has no has no relevance if she's 01:03:09.020 --> 01:03:16.680 going off in the time machine and equally this i'm not sure i managed to get this far down on 01:03:16.760 --> 01:03:22.940 my list of complaints about spyfall but equally in spyfall when they're when they're making their 01:03:23.100 --> 01:03:27.700 excuses about oh why ryan can't be playing basketball and why graham is telling the doctor 01:03:27.860 --> 01:03:32.900 that he's got to you know have all his jabs because he's going away for a bit and why 01:03:33.820 --> 01:03:40.760 Yaz has to have this explanation about being about going off on secondment is absolute nonsense 01:03:41.060 --> 01:03:48.020 because every time Clara went off with the doctor he brought her back 20 minutes after she left or 01:03:48.160 --> 01:03:55.320 whatever it is why why is it the doctor keeps bringing them back after all this time to their 01:03:55.380 --> 01:04:05.840 obvious inconvenience it makes no sense yeah i yeah they're not consistent are they they're not 01:04:05.960 --> 01:04:11.640 consistent um i kind of i mean i'm just like i'd like a far line about how the how maybe the doctor 01:04:11.800 --> 01:04:18.360 has has oh the tardis has got more erratic in that so the doctor's trying to get them back 20 minutes 01:04:18.600 --> 01:04:22.980 later but accidentally gets them back two months later and that's why you mean like a year later 01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:28.760 and rose yeah well yeah because that was that was super duper storytelling i mean that just it was a 01:04:29.320 --> 01:04:36.480 it wasn't rose it was um well it took for three or seven but um but that yeah you know that got 01:04:36.500 --> 01:04:42.460 me right in the feels when the doctor kind of suddenly realizes what he's done and you you get 01:04:42.800 --> 01:04:48.940 kind of jackie's reaction to seeing rose after her being missing for 12 months i mean i just thought 01:04:48.940 --> 01:04:55.320 wow you know there's a there's a dimension to to being torn away from your family to go time 01:04:55.520 --> 01:05:01.020 traveling around the universe you don't don't think about yeah then that was that was excellently 01:05:01.820 --> 01:05:06.180 planned out that was excellently planned and and that's also one of the reasons why 01:05:06.700 --> 01:05:14.920 you know the doctor's tardis has never been that reliable the fact that the 11th could drop or in 01:05:14.800 --> 01:05:16.740 12th, well, the 12th, could drop 01:05:16.960 --> 01:05:18.100 Clara off with precision. 01:05:18.860 --> 01:05:20.740 Well, they did it with Amy and Rory, too, because they 01:05:20.740 --> 01:05:22.660 were getting older and everybody else was not. 01:05:22.840 --> 01:05:24.360 So, I mean, yeah, Eleven could do it, too. 01:05:24.600 --> 01:05:25.900 So, I... 01:05:26.800 --> 01:05:28.660 It totally makes sense that if you were going to 01:05:28.740 --> 01:05:30.620 write a story about time travel, you would sit down 01:05:30.660 --> 01:05:32.580 and you would go, yep, you would just return 01:05:32.700 --> 01:05:34.480 them to the exact same moment in time and everything 01:05:34.580 --> 01:05:36.560 would be fine, but it 01:05:36.680 --> 01:05:38.580 doesn't kind of fit in the way Doctor Who has 01:05:38.880 --> 01:05:40.400 always worked, and it 01:05:40.700 --> 01:05:42.260 is a problematic 01:05:44.119 --> 01:05:44.760 issue when 01:05:44.780 --> 01:05:53.800 You need, and when I say need, I mean you're using a contrivance to make the TARDIS arrive somewhere so that you have a story to tell. 01:05:53.800 --> 01:05:54.600 About being in the wrong place. 01:05:54.880 --> 01:05:54.960 Yeah. 01:05:55.240 --> 01:05:55.400 Yeah. 01:05:56.740 --> 01:05:57.460 Wrong time. 01:05:57.960 --> 01:05:58.140 Yep. 01:05:58.660 --> 01:05:59.520 Wrong place, wrong time. 01:05:59.680 --> 01:06:01.080 That's where the TARDIS is supposed to be. 01:06:01.560 --> 01:06:01.800 Always. 01:06:02.860 --> 01:06:03.660 I'm done. 01:06:04.960 --> 01:06:05.160 Okay. 01:06:07.040 --> 01:06:07.540 I got nothing. 01:06:08.080 --> 01:06:08.360 I'm done. 01:06:08.400 --> 01:06:08.700 I got nothing else. 01:06:09.220 --> 01:06:11.580 So, Simon, thank you for joining me. 01:06:12.200 --> 01:06:13.020 It's a pleasure, as always. 01:06:13.860 --> 01:06:18.120 And listeners, I do hope you'll join us all again next time on Fusion Patrol. 01:06:19.960 --> 01:06:22.740 You've been listening to Fusion Patrol, a listener-supported podcast. 01:06:23.680 --> 01:06:30.360 Find out how you can be a sponsor and get early access to all episodes and more at patreon.com slash fusion patrol. 01:06:33.960 --> 01:06:36.320 Come join the conversation on Facebook or Twitter. 01:06:38.620 --> 01:06:41.640 All episodes are available at fusionpatrol.com. 01:06:44.560 --> 01:06:47.020 Our music is Fight the Future by Amber Wolf. 01:06:50.000 --> 01:06:52.560 This has been a Lone Locust production.