WEBVTT 00:00:00.020 --> 00:00:08.060 Hello listeners, with this special presentation of Fusion Patrol, I wanted to give you a brief 00:00:08.540 --> 00:00:15.160 word of, warning is probably not quite the right word for it, but introduction, let's say 00:00:15.820 --> 00:00:24.460 explanatory introduction. When we recorded this episode, I had just had a cracked tooth 00:00:25.120 --> 00:00:34.940 and a crown installed. And that tooth had gotten infected. And the morning I got up to record this, 00:00:35.420 --> 00:00:42.580 it was pretty bad. It was really bad. And it was getting worse all the time. 00:00:43.460 --> 00:00:49.319 Three hours after we finished this podcast, my wife came home from work and found me 00:00:49.340 --> 00:00:57.040 lying in sunset on the floor, just in agony. I couldn't, I could barely move. I was in such pain. 00:00:57.370 --> 00:01:01.300 It was terrible. And I had to be hauled off for an emergency root canal. 00:01:02.740 --> 00:01:09.900 Now, I kind of vainly thought, you know, the show must go on. But in listening to this podcast 00:01:09.980 --> 00:01:19.320 while I was editing it, I can tell I'm not entirely 100% on game or in the right frame 00:01:19.320 --> 00:01:19.960 of mind here. 00:01:20.520 --> 00:01:28.740 So if I seem distracted, if I seem like I'm completely forgetting things, or just remember, 00:01:29.380 --> 00:01:33.780 I am in such, such pain while recording this episode. 00:01:34.260 --> 00:01:37.100 But you know what they say, the show must go on. 00:01:48.100 --> 00:01:54.120 We take a single episode of a science fiction TV series and overanalyze it to within an inch 00:01:54.170 --> 00:01:58.920 of its life. This is the Fusion Patrol podcast. Welcome to the discussion. 00:02:07.440 --> 00:02:11.640 Hello and welcome to another episode of Fusion Patrol. I'm Eugene. 00:02:12.360 --> 00:02:13.060 And I'm Simon. 00:02:13.560 --> 00:02:18.860 And tonight we're going to be looking at the 1970-something... 00:02:19.380 --> 00:02:20.680 It's just not right in front of me here. 00:02:20.820 --> 00:02:22.240 Six, seven, something like that. 00:02:22.520 --> 00:02:23.460 76, 77, okay. 00:02:24.960 --> 00:02:29.000 ITV production, Children of the Stones. 00:02:30.460 --> 00:02:33.580 And I'm just going to tell you right now, it's seven parts long, 00:02:34.040 --> 00:02:39.700 and I'm not going to synopsize, if synopsize is a world, 00:02:40.040 --> 00:02:43.980 the entire every twist and turn in this story. 00:02:44.680 --> 00:02:46.060 So it's sort of an expagated version. 00:02:46.060 --> 00:02:48.560 Well, there goes any hope of me understanding what was going on. 00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:53.200 Maybe that's why I didn't summarize the whole thing. 00:02:53.920 --> 00:03:00.960 Professor Adam Brake and his son Matthew arrive in the small village of Milbury to conduct a three-month research project. 00:03:01.620 --> 00:03:05.200 Milbury is built inside a Neolithic stone circle, 00:03:05.880 --> 00:03:11.340 and Adam has come to conduct measurements on the magnetic properties of the stones and the general area. 00:03:12.040 --> 00:03:16.820 As they learn about their new home, they discover that things are stranger than they could imagine. 00:03:17.140 --> 00:03:23.860 Most, but not all of the people in the village are happy and seem a bit trance-like. 00:03:24.480 --> 00:03:27.900 Their children in school demonstrate prodigious mathematical skills. 00:03:28.380 --> 00:03:31.540 Only the recent arrivals in the village seem normal. 00:03:32.200 --> 00:03:35.060 Matt and Adams make friends with Sandra and Margaret. 00:03:35.480 --> 00:03:38.820 Margaret is the recently arrived museum curator, and Sandra is her daughter. 00:03:39.200 --> 00:03:41.900 At the head of it all is the village leader, Mr. Hendricks, 00:03:42.180 --> 00:03:45.680 a famous astronomer and discoverer of the Hendricks supernova. 00:03:46.100 --> 00:03:48.860 He seems to have a sinister agenda. 00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:51.200 Strange events begin to pile up. 00:03:51.410 --> 00:03:55.600 The stones can impart electropsychic shocks to Adam and Matt. 00:03:56.220 --> 00:03:59.700 Matt begins to be able to get psychic visions and perform psychometry, 00:04:00.070 --> 00:04:04.200 the ability to remote sense activities while touching an object associated with a target. 00:04:05.120 --> 00:04:10.640 A year before their arrival, Matt found and bought a painting that appears to depict Milbury's stone circle 00:04:10.870 --> 00:04:13.580 during some form of supernatural event. 00:04:13.980 --> 00:04:19.519 A beam of light emitting skywards from the center of the circle while people stand in awe, circling the light. 00:04:20.040 --> 00:04:22.720 In the distance, a man and a boy run away from the light. 00:04:22.910 --> 00:04:28.160 The picture appears to be a key to an event that has happened before, and might be happening again. 00:04:29.120 --> 00:04:34.800 Each day, it seems, more and more of the normal people show up transformed into the happy ones. 00:04:35.300 --> 00:04:39.840 One day, Dr. Lyle, the semi-retired local doctor, has to leave town to visit an old patient. 00:04:40.460 --> 00:04:44.360 Matt inadvertently psychically reads the events from Dr. Lyle's gloves. 00:04:44.880 --> 00:04:48.180 As he attempts to leave town, something stops him. 00:04:48.780 --> 00:04:52.580 The next day, he and his son have joined the happy ones, 00:04:53.000 --> 00:04:55.400 leaving only Adam, Matt, Margaret, and Sandra. 00:04:56.120 --> 00:04:59.960 The transformation seems to coincide with a dinner invitation from Mr. Hendricks, 00:05:00.420 --> 00:05:04.600 who has an extensive computer system and atomic clock in the disused church, 00:05:05.060 --> 00:05:11.580 which he and his butler, Mr. Link, use for precise astronomical calculations of his supernova. 00:05:12.180 --> 00:05:16.520 When Margaret and Sandra are next and turn up the next day as happy ones, 00:05:16.950 --> 00:05:19.920 Adam and Matt decide to abandon his research and leave. 00:05:20.400 --> 00:05:24.060 They are stopped at the edge of the circle and find themselves trapped in Hendrick's house, 00:05:24.380 --> 00:05:29.220 awaiting their fateful dinner appointment time with the next conjunction with the supernova. 00:05:29.860 --> 00:05:31.700 With some clever use of an oscilloscope, 00:05:31.720 --> 00:05:36.280 they manage to throw off the timing of the event and leave pretending to be happy ones. 00:05:36.920 --> 00:05:42.520 Unaware that the timing is off, Hendrix is caught in the beam instead, and chaos ensues. 00:05:42.960 --> 00:05:47.720 The villagers are transformed into the stones as Adam and Matt escape to Sanctuary. 00:05:48.300 --> 00:05:51.180 The next day, the village has been reset. 00:05:51.490 --> 00:05:52.500 The villagers are normal. 00:05:53.200 --> 00:05:56.600 They know Adam and Matt, but they are no longer happy ones 00:05:56.900 --> 00:05:59.560 and seem to have no recollection of any of the events. 00:06:00.240 --> 00:06:03.120 Adam and Matt still decide to hightail it out of town. 00:06:03.520 --> 00:06:05.680 As they leave, a new person arrives. 00:06:06.000 --> 00:06:09.180 Sir Joshua Lytton, looking very much like a young Mr. Hendricks. 00:06:09.480 --> 00:06:12.520 He is greeted at the manor house by a young-looking Mr. Link. 00:06:12.980 --> 00:06:18.360 Not only is the village in a circle of stone, it is in a circle of time, too. 00:06:19.260 --> 00:06:24.680 Oh, Children of the Stones by Jeremy Burnham and Trevor Ray. 00:06:24.980 --> 00:06:26.180 Two writers I've never heard of. 00:06:28.960 --> 00:06:34.020 A couple of things I'll say for American viewers. 00:06:34.540 --> 00:06:40.540 This did appear in the United States on a show on the network Nickelodeon called The Third Eye, 00:06:40.910 --> 00:06:47.640 which was like an anthology of various short, psychically themed adventures for kids. 00:06:48.440 --> 00:06:52.820 So some of you actually may have seen this, listeners, in the U.S. 00:06:52.820 --> 00:06:54.100 And of course it was on ITV. 00:06:54.180 --> 00:06:59.220 and I'm sure it's been syndicated to other English-speaking countries around the world. 00:07:00.400 --> 00:07:05.340 Some people claim this is the scariest thing ever produced for children's television in Britain. 00:07:05.760 --> 00:07:06.220 I don't know. 00:07:06.900 --> 00:07:09.840 Have you seen or heard of this before, Simon? 00:07:11.240 --> 00:07:12.200 Well, no. 00:07:13.060 --> 00:07:15.640 No, not prior to you telling me about it. 00:07:16.660 --> 00:07:18.880 I mean, it's a bit older than me. 00:07:19.660 --> 00:07:19.860 Right. 00:07:20.300 --> 00:07:27.400 I didn't have an opportunity to watch it on first broadcast, and it's ITV, so ITV don't tend to repeat stuff. 00:07:27.960 --> 00:07:32.320 But it does seem to have a bit of a cult following, as far as I can tell. 00:07:33.840 --> 00:07:33.940 Yes. 00:07:35.500 --> 00:07:42.880 Although it hasn't been repeated, as far as I can tell, it has been available, though it does seem to have gone out of print again on DVD. 00:07:42.980 --> 00:07:49.220 And there do seem to have been programmes made about it and books written about it and so forth. 00:07:49.800 --> 00:07:54.000 Yeah, yeah. It has a reputation. 00:07:55.740 --> 00:07:58.600 Well, I'll give you first shot at it. Does it deserve a reputation? 00:07:59.160 --> 00:07:59.980 Oh, yeah, absolutely. 00:08:00.740 --> 00:08:14.060 Yes. No, I mean, in a way, I watched it and clearly, I mean, for 19, for something that was produced in 1976, I can see it would have been very effective. 00:08:14.480 --> 00:08:37.460 There are some effects where obviously now it's kind of stretching the limits and you have to sort of switch back into a certain headspace for a kind of title sequence where the visuals are just these sort of rocks zooming in on static stones or whatever. 00:08:37.560 --> 00:08:42.479 while the music, which in itself is quite extraordinary, 00:08:43.479 --> 00:08:44.540 not necessarily in a bad way, 00:08:44.540 --> 00:08:48.260 but again, it takes getting used to plays over it. 00:08:49.260 --> 00:08:54.380 But if I think back to, you know, if I had been a little bit older, 00:08:54.540 --> 00:08:56.860 if I watched this when I was 10 or something, 00:08:57.380 --> 00:08:59.800 this is absolutely the kind of thing 00:08:59.870 --> 00:09:02.900 that I would have been completely and utterly gripped by. 00:09:03.720 --> 00:09:12.520 I, even as an old man, I find this to be a very well put together show. 00:09:12.640 --> 00:09:18.120 I mean, it does have a bit of a sapphire and steel look to it when it comes to the special effects and the sets. 00:09:18.660 --> 00:09:19.100 Oh, yes. 00:09:19.810 --> 00:09:21.600 Did you see this on Nickelodeon? 00:09:22.020 --> 00:09:23.700 I did not. 00:09:24.040 --> 00:09:27.540 How long ago did you first watch this? 00:09:29.160 --> 00:09:31.260 Probably four or five years, maybe. 00:09:32.619 --> 00:09:33.660 from now 00:09:34.480 --> 00:09:35.600 oh I see right 00:09:36.130 --> 00:09:36.980 so still an old man 00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:39.680 well obviously 00:09:39.880 --> 00:09:41.140 not even an old man yet 00:09:42.480 --> 00:09:44.600 even if I'd seen it on Nickelodeon 00:09:44.690 --> 00:09:46.600 I would have been in my 00:09:47.540 --> 00:09:48.680 20s or 30s 00:09:49.190 --> 00:09:49.320 so 00:09:50.839 --> 00:09:52.520 what I guess I was wondering was 00:09:52.840 --> 00:09:54.480 whether when you had seen it 00:09:54.860 --> 00:09:55.380 it was 00:09:57.540 --> 00:09:58.380 it's just the 00:09:58.680 --> 00:10:00.019 comparators the kind of 00:10:00.040 --> 00:10:07.260 the kind of television that I'm comparing it now to in in 2019 would be very different if I had 00:10:07.680 --> 00:10:13.180 watched something like this because it you know even 10 years later in the in the late 80s this 00:10:13.300 --> 00:10:19.260 would have still looked kind of par for the course in terms of what kind of if you were telling a 00:10:19.380 --> 00:10:26.259 story like this which is you know essentially a fantasy story this is probably what you could 00:10:26.460 --> 00:10:32.100 feel you you you'd make you've done well with your money on a children's show budget let me put it 00:10:32.100 --> 00:10:37.800 that way okay they did for sure well i mean they didn't need a whole lot of special effects in this 00:10:38.120 --> 00:10:46.380 program um it's it well i'm i think that helps actually no i agree and it's not big it's not 00:10:46.720 --> 00:10:54.879 big showcasing special effects but it is the language of um conveying psychic ability and 00:10:55.200 --> 00:11:02.180 trying to put across what's happening when you know someone is getting sensations from the stone or 00:11:03.680 --> 00:11:09.860 when you know effects are happening simultaneously by and large i thought they were done in this 00:11:10.220 --> 00:11:16.200 very effectively because they were simple but we would regard them as being very simple now you 00:11:16.200 --> 00:11:22.079 know when the effect is literally just jump cutting back and forth back and forth back and 00:11:22.100 --> 00:11:30.700 forth every second or so it looks a bit vintage yeah i like to think i'm despite the fact that i 00:11:30.840 --> 00:11:34.840 might be known as a very critical person i like to think i'm very forgiving of that it doesn't 00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:42.120 really absolutely it doesn't really bother me you know if no if no that but it's getting used to it 00:11:42.260 --> 00:11:47.399 it's just you know stepping back in because it's the reality is a lot of those choices are not 00:11:47.420 --> 00:11:52.720 choices you would make now with what's available to you now but as soon as you stop thinking about 00:11:52.880 --> 00:11:58.160 it from a from a production point of view and you lose yourself in the story it no longer matters 00:11:58.740 --> 00:12:09.020 right um it's very atmospheric um it's got an an amazing uh village backdrop there uh which is 00:12:09.120 --> 00:12:09.420 Avebury. 00:12:09.480 --> 00:12:10.340 Avebury, yeah. 00:12:11.600 --> 00:12:12.800 Which I have been to Avebury, 00:12:13.400 --> 00:12:17.560 and it's a lot smaller than that town. 00:12:19.920 --> 00:12:22.900 You know, I think there's like maybe... 00:12:22.900 --> 00:12:24.080 You can see it in those pictures, 00:12:24.680 --> 00:12:26.060 the aerial shots at the beginning. 00:12:26.560 --> 00:12:29.140 There's really not a whole lot inside that stone circle. 00:12:29.560 --> 00:12:32.700 There's maybe a pub and like two other buildings, 00:12:33.040 --> 00:12:33.460 maybe three. 00:12:34.020 --> 00:12:36.620 It's very small in that inside the stone circle. 00:12:36.880 --> 00:12:38.160 Isn't that all there is in the show? 00:12:38.540 --> 00:12:39.300 I don't know. 00:12:39.700 --> 00:12:41.220 It feels to me like it's a lot bigger. 00:12:41.590 --> 00:12:42.240 It feels bigger. 00:12:42.350 --> 00:12:46.560 I mean, I assume that the house that Adam is in is inside the circle. 00:12:47.380 --> 00:12:48.900 And it just, I don't know. 00:12:49.160 --> 00:12:53.100 It just feels like it's, it feels like it's, you know, 00:12:53.470 --> 00:12:56.300 a room for 53 people living with inside that thing. 00:12:56.400 --> 00:12:59.100 And I don't think there's room for 53 people inside Avery. 00:12:59.180 --> 00:13:01.740 Maybe my recollection is wrong of that. 00:13:03.340 --> 00:13:06.040 That's a very small number of people, though, isn't it? 00:13:06.240 --> 00:13:08.580 I mean, it's half a dozen households. 00:13:09.460 --> 00:13:12.600 Okay, well, that at least requires a half dozen houses 00:13:13.200 --> 00:13:14.840 and a pub and a shop. 00:13:15.480 --> 00:13:17.200 No, not like a dozen. 00:13:17.540 --> 00:13:18.920 A dozen households. 00:13:19.490 --> 00:13:23.460 But, well, I mean, I haven't been to A3. 00:13:23.640 --> 00:13:26.240 I cannot make the comparison, 00:13:26.580 --> 00:13:30.740 but from the point of view of just watching the show 00:13:31.000 --> 00:13:34.760 and seeing the size of it in the title sequence, 00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:37.260 I get the sense of it being very, very small. 00:13:37.880 --> 00:13:37.940 Yes. 00:13:38.450 --> 00:13:38.580 Yeah. 00:13:38.940 --> 00:13:40.240 And I will say, but I like that. 00:13:40.760 --> 00:13:44.540 I mean, it contributes to the claustrophobia of it. 00:13:44.920 --> 00:13:45.100 Yes. 00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:50.780 And the only kind of thing where it did leave me with a bit of a question mark 00:13:50.930 --> 00:13:54.040 was if you lived in a habitation of 55 people 00:13:55.180 --> 00:14:00.720 and quite a bit of time passes during the course of this story being told. 00:14:01.120 --> 00:14:01.400 Yes. 00:14:01.580 --> 00:14:04.740 It seemed surprising to me that you would never leave. 00:14:05.380 --> 00:14:08.680 I mean, you would never try to leave and discover that you couldn't leave. 00:14:09.240 --> 00:14:12.160 Not, you know, purely just in the routine of things. 00:14:12.380 --> 00:14:15.460 Wouldn't at some point you want to go to a bigger town? 00:14:15.780 --> 00:14:22.880 Wouldn't you want to go out for a meal or, I don't know, go to a department store or something? 00:14:23.300 --> 00:14:25.700 Well, in the 1970s, though, maybe not. 00:14:26.400 --> 00:14:26.720 I don't know. 00:14:28.100 --> 00:14:29.720 Didn't people go out in the 70s? 00:14:29.800 --> 00:14:38.020 I'm going to express what is regrettably probably a gross mischaracterization. 00:14:39.140 --> 00:14:43.340 But one of the things I noticed, and if I didn't just say this, I meant to. 00:14:43.640 --> 00:14:46.160 Apri was one of the coolest places we went to in England. 00:14:46.230 --> 00:14:52.220 It was just like it was, you know, Stonehenge, maybe a neater looking circle, for example. 00:14:52.640 --> 00:14:54.080 But you can't get up to it. 00:14:54.140 --> 00:15:00.160 But Avebury, you can walk up to those stones just like those kids were and wander around the field. 00:15:00.380 --> 00:15:03.160 I mean, it's really cool. 00:15:03.650 --> 00:15:05.220 So if you're ever there, you should go see it. 00:15:05.680 --> 00:15:19.900 But when we toured around the country and we would stay in bed and breakfasts, so you'd get a chance to talk with the local people in the various towns, although we didn't stay in Avebury. 00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:24.660 I noticed a very strange to me thing. 00:15:25.190 --> 00:15:33.360 And that was they would be talking about, you know, like what would sound like an excursion, right? 00:15:33.680 --> 00:15:38.620 Like, oh, yeah, we're thinking of going up to the to go making a trip next week. 00:15:38.720 --> 00:15:41.040 And we're going to take the day and go up to the next town. 00:15:41.260 --> 00:15:43.620 And you'd look on the map and the town would be 25 miles away. 00:15:44.160 --> 00:15:46.800 And, yeah, you know, Phoenix is 60 across. 00:15:47.580 --> 00:15:49.620 So 25 miles I'll drive for a hamburger. 00:15:50.300 --> 00:15:55.980 and well i just you just made the point that needs to be made there which is that 00:15:56.720 --> 00:16:02.400 for you guys i mean think what 25 miles is relative to the width of your country right 00:16:02.620 --> 00:16:08.800 and now think about what 25 miles is relative to the width of our and and that's why 25 miles is 00:16:08.800 --> 00:16:15.919 a long way okay but but that makes the point that that that distance makes it seem more like 00:16:16.180 --> 00:16:23.920 a barrier so maybe maybe you don't go as often maybe it's not as it i i could i could i could 00:16:23.930 --> 00:16:30.220 very much get behind the the idea that you wouldn't for a week or two but i'm not sure how 00:16:30.380 --> 00:16:35.700 long they were there that's why i well we know that it's less than three months right because 00:16:36.280 --> 00:16:41.279 that would have been he would have finished his research at that point and we know he left before 00:16:41.300 --> 00:16:47.280 they'd finished but on the other hand that towards the end we know it took about four days yes yes 00:16:47.980 --> 00:16:55.520 so well i don't know but even even then you've got to think about where did their food come from 00:16:55.840 --> 00:17:02.360 um you know what about vegetables and things or or even like fresh milk how was that brought in 00:17:02.380 --> 00:17:08.959 to the circle can you can can you was everything farmed within the circle i don't i didn't have 00:17:08.980 --> 00:17:15.160 the sense it was large enough for that but if some you know if if uh someone were delivering 00:17:15.620 --> 00:17:21.480 stuff would they be able to enter and leave the circle um we don't know if it's true but 00:17:21.980 --> 00:17:27.020 hendrix did say link left town to bring in provisions but he might have been lying that 00:17:27.420 --> 00:17:32.179 wasn't that wasn't true but it i guess the i guess the answer i mean i think the 00:17:33.740 --> 00:17:40.140 this this series is very clever at deflecting you from that question it's it's not the kind 00:17:40.150 --> 00:17:46.200 of thing that you think about straight away it's when you start getting into sort of critical mode 00:17:46.320 --> 00:17:54.540 but um yeah if if there were if there were no way of getting stuff into the village or no regular 00:17:54.540 --> 00:18:00.419 way of doing it then perhaps whatever that you know link was somehow supplying everyone with 00:18:00.440 --> 00:18:04.820 produce because by the time everyone's happy day they're not going to ask any questions about it 00:18:05.060 --> 00:18:11.740 so yes i don't know but like i say it wasn't it wasn't a wasn't a big issue yeah and it you know 00:18:11.840 --> 00:18:17.700 there are a couple again i was trying to keep that mindset in my head that says okay going going to 00:18:17.700 --> 00:18:24.160 the next town is a little bit bigger in mind than than it is to me because there are several points 00:18:24.400 --> 00:18:29.779 during the course of this story where if i had been adam i would have said you know something 00:18:29.800 --> 00:18:33.760 I think I'm just going to test a little theory and I'm going to drive out of here. 00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:38.280 And I'm not going to tell anybody or everybody that I'm going to drive out of town. 00:18:38.720 --> 00:18:46.100 I'm just going to head on down to the next town and, you know, have a meal out or something and not tell anybody and make sure I can go. 00:18:46.660 --> 00:18:47.880 But they never do that. 00:18:47.880 --> 00:18:49.900 Because the thing is, it wasn't anything like 25 miles. 00:18:50.539 --> 00:19:05.320 At least, you know, the appearance in the sequences where either Dr. Lyle or at the point where Brake did try to drive out, it seemed as if they were driving for, what, a couple of minutes? 00:19:06.419 --> 00:19:09.900 So, yeah, you know, it might be a mile at a stretch. 00:19:10.280 --> 00:19:11.320 It certainly wasn't 25. 00:19:11.820 --> 00:19:12.380 Oh, no, no. 00:19:12.380 --> 00:19:13.360 I meant like the next town. 00:19:13.919 --> 00:19:16.360 I'm just going to drive to the next town to see if I can do it. 00:19:16.620 --> 00:19:22.840 No, no, but what I'm saying is they could, I don't think they drove more than a mile away from Millbury. 00:19:23.160 --> 00:19:23.540 Exactly. 00:19:23.800 --> 00:19:24.560 I agree. 00:19:24.790 --> 00:19:25.160 I agree. 00:19:25.420 --> 00:19:26.020 At any point. 00:19:26.340 --> 00:19:32.260 I was just thinking in terms of if I was in the character, I would go, okay, I need to get out of the town. 00:19:32.550 --> 00:19:33.880 I need to get past the stones. 00:19:34.440 --> 00:19:39.240 I don't know whether I would just drive out to get past the stones and then go, okay, I can leave. 00:19:39.420 --> 00:19:45.460 So then I'd come back or whether I would just, you know, try to make it plausible and say, I think I'm going to, I'm going to pop over to. 00:19:45.880 --> 00:19:52.840 hatebury and eat at the horse and lion or something and go down do that route that that 00:19:52.840 --> 00:19:56.620 was i guess that was what i was getting at i would somewhere during the course of the story 00:19:57.160 --> 00:20:03.460 i would i was curious enough to go can i leave these stones and they kept talking about it here 00:20:03.460 --> 00:20:08.340 and there maybe you can't leave this it's like well why don't you go you're a scientist why 00:20:08.380 --> 00:20:09.600 Why don't you go find out? 00:20:10.860 --> 00:20:11.980 Experiment with it a little bit. 00:20:13.880 --> 00:20:17.400 But nonetheless, it's seven parts. 00:20:17.840 --> 00:20:20.480 It's quite long, but... 00:20:20.500 --> 00:20:22.540 Seven 25-minute parts. 00:20:22.820 --> 00:20:25.280 I found it goes by pretty quickly. 00:20:25.940 --> 00:20:27.400 The pacing is superb. 00:20:27.900 --> 00:20:30.600 I mean, I made that note straight after the first episode. 00:20:31.400 --> 00:20:35.920 There's something new happening in every episode that keeps you hooked in. 00:20:36.240 --> 00:20:36.420 Yeah. 00:20:37.420 --> 00:20:46.540 I actually, in a way, think that the end of part one, end of start of part two, helps make it feel like it's going faster. 00:20:46.900 --> 00:20:50.120 I don't know if it helps the flow of the story, but it did make it. 00:20:50.680 --> 00:20:53.240 I'd be watching an episode and then it would go, end of part one. 00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:54.080 I go, wow, that was quick. 00:20:54.720 --> 00:20:57.900 Oh, you mean the bumpers into the ads? 00:20:58.540 --> 00:20:58.680 Yeah. 00:20:59.100 --> 00:21:00.160 Yeah, yeah, it could be. 00:21:00.460 --> 00:21:03.159 I must say I liked that. 00:21:03.180 --> 00:21:07.940 liked that i mean i thought i thought the cliffhangers themselves were pretty entertaining 00:21:08.260 --> 00:21:13.120 especially as one of them what has got to be just about the only cliffhanger i've seen that 00:21:13.320 --> 00:21:20.940 involves morris dancing but they're they're good so in terms of the structure of the story that 00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:25.160 but i but i think you're right actually the little kind of mini cliffhangers into the 00:21:25.540 --> 00:21:31.099 ad breaks worked very well and again the the the way in which they used the music 00:21:31.440 --> 00:21:35.540 over the bumpers was really effective 00:21:35.860 --> 00:21:37.880 in bringing it to a kind of dramatic climax. 00:21:38.300 --> 00:21:38.540 Yeah. 00:21:39.460 --> 00:21:40.860 We should mention the music then. 00:21:41.860 --> 00:21:43.980 It could drive my family out of the room. 00:21:45.420 --> 00:21:45.940 It's very... 00:21:45.940 --> 00:21:46.340 It's very... 00:21:47.220 --> 00:21:50.180 It's very discordantly... 00:21:50.180 --> 00:21:52.400 I mean, it's effective for this story, 00:21:52.940 --> 00:21:54.520 but it's unpleasant. 00:21:55.980 --> 00:21:57.060 I find it unpleasant. 00:21:57.820 --> 00:21:59.820 I wouldn't want to be, you know, 00:21:59.920 --> 00:22:04.600 putting it on the record player just to sort of kick back and relax of an evening. 00:22:05.090 --> 00:22:07.440 I thought you weren't old enough to have watched this show live, 00:22:07.760 --> 00:22:08.860 but you just said record player. 00:22:10.340 --> 00:22:12.500 Yeah, yeah, I'm old enough to have a record player. 00:22:13.200 --> 00:22:14.960 I've still got a record player, in fact. 00:22:15.560 --> 00:22:16.160 Oh, that's right. 00:22:16.240 --> 00:22:17.720 That's very popular with the hipsters these days. 00:22:18.000 --> 00:22:18.580 It's kids, too. 00:22:19.180 --> 00:22:20.220 They're making a... 00:22:20.380 --> 00:22:21.660 How dare you say that? 00:22:21.670 --> 00:22:22.460 How dare you? 00:22:24.160 --> 00:22:24.920 I've never... 00:22:25.040 --> 00:22:26.360 Well, that's probably not true, 00:22:26.500 --> 00:22:30.260 but I've certainly had a record player for most of my life. 00:22:31.920 --> 00:22:34.180 I may have not had a record player briefly, 00:22:34.210 --> 00:22:35.200 but I've always had the record. 00:22:37.880 --> 00:22:39.740 I don't think this soundtrack's been released. 00:22:40.150 --> 00:22:43.960 No, well, given that they let the DVD go out of print, 00:22:44.060 --> 00:22:45.600 I suppose that's not surprising. 00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:48.800 But I did think I heard, maybe it was in the interviews 00:22:48.850 --> 00:22:50.060 or maybe I read it somewhere, 00:22:50.190 --> 00:22:54.640 that the music, which is especially composed for the show, 00:22:54.880 --> 00:23:00.400 was based on some kind of folky, druidistic kind of thing. 00:23:00.800 --> 00:23:03.260 That I can believe. That I can completely believe. 00:23:03.400 --> 00:23:07.160 I assumed that that was supposed to be some sort of faux druidic chanting. 00:23:08.400 --> 00:23:10.660 And I'm going to raise the question here. 00:23:11.030 --> 00:23:19.100 My understanding of our knowledge of druids is that what everybody thinks they know about druids 00:23:19.260 --> 00:23:23.100 is basically not true because we don't really know anything about the druids? 00:23:23.460 --> 00:23:25.700 Is that basically right? 00:23:26.020 --> 00:23:27.960 Well, I don't know anything about the Druids, so I don't know. 00:23:28.580 --> 00:23:31.820 I thought, well, you know, all the popular stuff about the... 00:23:33.000 --> 00:23:35.520 Based on all the popular stuff that you hear about Druids, 00:23:36.000 --> 00:23:37.720 and that's all just sort of made up, 00:23:38.640 --> 00:23:41.539 that what we know of the Druids are from Roman writings, 00:23:42.540 --> 00:23:45.340 and, you know, third person and not very reliable. 00:23:46.320 --> 00:23:47.880 So everything you see is somebody goes, 00:23:47.940 --> 00:23:49.500 oh, this is an ancient Druidic custom. 00:23:49.680 --> 00:23:51.380 It's like, it probably is not. 00:23:52.160 --> 00:23:58.260 so this is based on druidic chanting how would they know what what did you know all the people 00:23:58.320 --> 00:24:03.140 that go out and do this stuff at stonehenge every year and claim to be druids no they're not you 00:24:03.240 --> 00:24:10.660 know i mean it's it's all it's all just speculation so well all right then if i mean i can't answer 00:24:10.680 --> 00:24:16.179 the question about the music because i i can't like i said i can't remember precisely where i 00:24:16.200 --> 00:24:23.600 picked up that small piece of possibly apocryphal information but there's obviously the whole kind 00:24:23.600 --> 00:24:32.840 of folklore thing running through this and some um science stuff so what do we think overall about 00:24:32.840 --> 00:24:43.919 the accuracy well the accuracy of the psychic stuff is uh zero because psychic stuff's not real 00:24:43.940 --> 00:24:59.560 But I actually kind of appreciated, it's not perfect, but I kind of appreciated the way Adam and Matthew went about their exploration. 00:25:00.380 --> 00:25:06.080 I appreciated the fact that, because here's the position that I, and I did want to mention this so this seems like it fits. 00:25:07.080 --> 00:25:08.060 Here's the position I'm in. 00:25:08.160 --> 00:25:20.500 If I went into a town like that with my mindset and experience and somebody started going on about psychic phenomena, I would be 99.999% certain that there's another explanation. 00:25:21.740 --> 00:25:23.920 And because that's the world we live in. 00:25:24.120 --> 00:25:43.120 And in fiction, this is always a bit of a line, because if you're going to write a story in which psychicky stuff is real, then you have to be able to convince the people that, you know, even the scientists in the end, you have to be able to convince them that the psychicky stuff is real. 00:25:43.200 --> 00:25:53.760 So I appreciated the way that Adam didn't buy it, but at the same time, you know, he's collecting data along the way, and he's got a bit of an open mind about it. 00:25:54.120 --> 00:25:59.480 But he's requiring a higher level of proof than just, oh yeah, that must be what this is. 00:26:00.620 --> 00:26:08.640 And he maintains that throughout most of the story until it's just overwhelmingly certain something is going on in this town. 00:26:09.000 --> 00:26:13.060 Is that what you were going for on the science and the stuff? 00:26:13.220 --> 00:26:16.260 or did you have something else you were thinking of when you asked that question? 00:26:16.390 --> 00:26:20.520 Well, yeah, I mean, I guess, I don't know. 00:26:21.060 --> 00:26:24.280 I sort of liked the hard science-y stuff, 00:26:24.680 --> 00:26:28.580 but on the other hand, some of it was perhaps a bit iffy. 00:26:29.820 --> 00:26:31.240 But I appreciate the effort. 00:26:31.660 --> 00:26:35.620 And I remember, I can't even remember what the story was now, 00:26:35.620 --> 00:26:39.340 but it was some kind of exciting children's thriller book, 00:26:39.600 --> 00:26:45.700 which involved some kind of super power source thing. 00:26:46.110 --> 00:26:50.460 And it was like this silver egg, and it got stolen from it. 00:26:50.620 --> 00:26:52.220 The children nicked it. 00:26:52.450 --> 00:26:59.460 But because of its properties, it was sort of suspended in some kind of fluid. 00:27:00.020 --> 00:27:02.540 And so they needed to replace it. 00:27:02.540 --> 00:27:06.360 And in order to do this, it's so contrived, but it's the kind of thing I love. 00:27:07.160 --> 00:27:13.380 They took an egg and a candle covered the egg in sooty wax, 00:27:13.980 --> 00:27:20.240 half filled the tank in which the device had been suspended with strong brine, 00:27:20.680 --> 00:27:25.360 and then topped it up with water and dropped the egg into it. 00:27:25.360 --> 00:27:28.880 And of course, the egg being less dense than the brine, 00:27:29.300 --> 00:27:32.520 but more dense than the water, just hung in the middle. 00:27:33.000 --> 00:27:35.240 And I loved it because I was like, 00:27:35.400 --> 00:27:39.020 oh wow, I'm learning all things about different densities 00:27:39.280 --> 00:27:42.560 and reflection of light and all this kind of stuff. 00:27:43.200 --> 00:27:50.260 And so the bits that involved things like a set of clocks 00:27:50.880 --> 00:27:56.580 that are all fed by electronic pulses from the same atomic clock 00:27:59.419 --> 00:28:03.739 and quickly working out how many extra pulses you would have to feed in 00:28:03.760 --> 00:28:11.200 to advance it five minutes and so that stuff i just you know i would have loved it i i i agree 00:28:11.300 --> 00:28:15.380 that's probably uh strong i thought it was very interesting when they walk into the house 00:28:15.920 --> 00:28:20.960 and they go oh look at this digital clock and they're all like oh amazed a digital clock 00:28:21.500 --> 00:28:30.659 like it's a digital clock in 1977 right so i mean that some of the go ahead well i'm just 00:28:30.680 --> 00:28:38.600 going to say some some of the stuff that um was maybe a bit less uh didn't sit quite right was 00:28:38.800 --> 00:28:44.320 to do with the like magnetism of the stones and all that yeah i didn't think you could magnetize 00:28:44.320 --> 00:28:52.000 a stone and not that not that level sort of horseshoe yeah just hugely powerful um but yeah 00:28:52.840 --> 00:28:57.679 that that would have been a problem i mean his equipment all sorts of stuff would have been 00:28:57.700 --> 00:29:02.480 stuck to those stones yeah that that's not yeah that was not good yeah i you know i think that 00:29:03.120 --> 00:29:10.880 go ahead well not just i mean the other the other stuff i mentioned is folklore stuff and and the 00:29:11.020 --> 00:29:17.300 stuff that's more kind of margaret's department than adam's that i i i guess i don't know anything 00:29:17.480 --> 00:29:24.959 about it so i'm quite happy to you know if you say this this was some particular ritual belief 00:29:24.980 --> 00:29:27.620 and such and such, then okay, whatever. 00:29:27.860 --> 00:29:29.880 Yeah, you have to kind of just buy off on it, yeah. 00:29:30.920 --> 00:29:34.740 What I was going to say about the clocks was my... 00:29:35.160 --> 00:29:40.580 In 1976-ish, I had a digital clock, I was going to say. 00:29:41.360 --> 00:29:44.420 And it was very novel, 00:29:45.300 --> 00:29:47.100 but it was basically rotating wheels 00:29:48.040 --> 00:29:52.660 that had flat sides like cogs, 00:29:52.840 --> 00:29:54.940 So they would turn with a number facing. 00:29:55.580 --> 00:29:58.320 And of course, that's driven by the electrical frequency. 00:30:00.060 --> 00:30:05.780 So that's exactly the kind of thing that, like, and on VCRs of the day, where you would 00:30:06.260 --> 00:30:06.800 unplug that. 00:30:06.870 --> 00:30:11.400 And if you took it to the United Kingdom and you put it into an adapter, you could power 00:30:11.540 --> 00:30:15.080 it, but the clocks would never run at the right speed because they were running at 50 00:30:15.220 --> 00:30:16.880 and 60 hertz instead. 00:30:17.520 --> 00:30:18.520 So you would throw the time off. 00:30:19.220 --> 00:30:31.440 And when he started that with the oscilloscope, and he's like, oh, I bet you one of the writers traveled to America and his clock was off because of that. 00:30:31.960 --> 00:30:33.820 And that stuck with him. 00:30:34.200 --> 00:30:35.380 And he thought, oh, that's what I do. 00:30:35.380 --> 00:30:37.980 I can just change the frequency and do that. 00:30:38.620 --> 00:30:44.360 Either that or he actually had some verse in that area. 00:30:44.620 --> 00:30:52.280 Although I'm not entirely sure you could smell ammonia coming from an atomic clock using ammonia atoms. 00:30:52.440 --> 00:30:55.000 I didn't think that's what they used. 00:30:57.020 --> 00:31:05.900 I think my kind of feeling about it is that although it might have been somewhat ham-fistedly executed in some cases, 00:31:08.020 --> 00:31:13.320 I guess what they lacked in dexterity they made up for in commitment. 00:31:14.800 --> 00:31:19.560 I liked the fact that Matthew was 00:31:20.380 --> 00:31:23.580 I liked all of the relationships 00:31:24.100 --> 00:31:26.780 I mean the father-son relationship 00:31:26.890 --> 00:31:28.060 the mother-daughter relationship 00:31:28.150 --> 00:31:31.140 and then the relationship between all four of them 00:31:31.840 --> 00:31:34.020 but in terms of that father-son relationship 00:31:34.180 --> 00:31:36.000 there was something terribly refreshing 00:31:36.560 --> 00:31:38.920 about the way in which Matthew was 00:31:39.300 --> 00:31:41.919 although he wasn't in the same league 00:31:41.940 --> 00:31:44.460 as the happy day kids in class. 00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:50.180 He was extremely bright and extremely, well, you know, 00:31:50.880 --> 00:31:57.160 that he and Adam obviously discussed all of these things. 00:31:57.480 --> 00:32:04.500 So he was portrayed as being this incredibly scientifically literate kid, 00:32:04.560 --> 00:32:06.340 at least for someone of his age, 00:32:06.800 --> 00:32:10.380 without it being in any way a kind of nerdy thing. 00:32:11.220 --> 00:32:13.720 Yeah, and he's not an obnoxious know-it-all. 00:32:15.820 --> 00:32:19.400 10 or 15 years later, if you portrayed a kid like that on TV, 00:32:19.970 --> 00:32:22.000 yeah, he might have been an obnoxious know-it-all. 00:32:22.800 --> 00:32:24.600 It would have been the specky kid. 00:32:25.380 --> 00:32:31.020 There would have been some kind of, you'd have to hint at the social ostracism or whatever. 00:32:31.540 --> 00:32:32.460 And there was none of that. 00:32:32.640 --> 00:32:36.060 He wasn't like a super confident jock or anything, 00:32:36.360 --> 00:32:39.440 but he was extremely sociable. 00:32:39.920 --> 00:32:56.860 And he had a degree of self-confidence and just general comfort in, you know, both a confidence in his knowledge and the relationship he had with his dad, but also just the ability to kind of head out on bikes with his new friend. 00:32:57.120 --> 00:33:01.320 And I just thought it was done very, very well. 00:33:01.420 --> 00:33:12.960 It feels so... I didn't look up the actor, but if this was made in about 76, then that kid is about my age. 00:33:13.860 --> 00:33:16.940 So I'd have been 10 to 12 in that range. 00:33:17.840 --> 00:33:20.440 He was about 17 when it was made. 00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:23.460 Oh, he's much older than he's playing, I think. 00:33:23.540 --> 00:33:23.820 Yes. 00:33:24.120 --> 00:33:27.320 Yeah, okay. Then he's older than me. 00:33:27.940 --> 00:33:37.400 But looking back at about 1976, I can say that that had a very authentic feel. 00:33:37.770 --> 00:33:45.540 I mean, you would go into a new town or, like in my case, we'd be camping a lot. 00:33:46.030 --> 00:33:51.960 In the summers, we'd travel around the United States and we'd move from campground to campground. 00:33:52.200 --> 00:33:57.460 And you'd hit a campground, and if there was another kid in the campground, the two of you would just, hey! 00:33:57.860 --> 00:33:59.680 And you'd get on your bikes, and you'd start going. 00:33:59.880 --> 00:34:06.000 I mean, that was just completely and absolutely authentically what it was like in that age. 00:34:06.140 --> 00:34:09.480 So there was nothing, oh, new kid in town, I'm going to go over and look at him. 00:34:09.960 --> 00:34:10.440 You know, hey! 00:34:11.500 --> 00:34:14.179 You know, it felt very real. 00:34:15.440 --> 00:34:22.139 And also, as you say, he's not portrayed as a nerd, but he is portrayed as the acorn that doesn't fall far from the tree. 00:34:22.580 --> 00:34:22.720 Yes. 00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:23.100 Right? 00:34:23.600 --> 00:34:26.060 And that's generally real too. 00:34:26.230 --> 00:34:26.500 But not in a problematic way. 00:34:27.120 --> 00:34:27.240 No. 00:34:27.520 --> 00:34:27.780 Yeah, yeah. 00:34:28.500 --> 00:34:31.000 It's not like he's been hothoused. 00:34:31.200 --> 00:34:33.919 It's not like dad is super protective or anything. 00:34:34.860 --> 00:34:45.240 It's a very kind of, you know, there's a mutual respect between them, but also they let each other get on with their own lives. 00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:52.020 and the dad doesn't dismiss his kid when he no which has which is which is interesting because 00:34:52.280 --> 00:34:58.880 as you say the whole the whole point about adam break is that he is supposed to be the sciencey 00:34:58.980 --> 00:35:07.380 one and yet when he witnesses matt you know having these these psychic visions he he doesn't he 00:35:07.540 --> 00:35:13.999 doesn't disregard what although he doesn't try to know what's the explanation he doesn't disregard 00:35:14.020 --> 00:35:21.520 hard what matt's experiencing right all of that very very good i mean i just um this is of course 00:35:22.020 --> 00:35:29.640 um gareth thomas playing adam break who uh obviously is very soon to go off into the 00:35:30.260 --> 00:35:35.700 federation and blake seven um as he says in the interviews i went home to do a show called blake 00:35:35.880 --> 00:35:43.359 seven you may have heard of it yeah i you know i watched the interviews years ago when i got the 00:35:43.380 --> 00:35:47.400 when I got the discs and I didn't have a chance to review them before this 00:35:48.040 --> 00:35:51.440 before we did the podcast this time but I remember they sat down and 00:35:51.490 --> 00:35:55.680 and he talked about it but I don't remember all 00:35:55.830 --> 00:35:59.920 of the but I thought he was very good in it he's got an unusual 00:36:00.660 --> 00:36:03.620 he has an unusual delivery he has it in Blake 7 00:36:04.060 --> 00:36:07.720 and he has it here and I don't even know how to describe it 00:36:07.800 --> 00:36:11.619 but it's just kind of the way he lines but it 00:36:11.640 --> 00:36:13.760 it comes off, it works fine. 00:36:14.000 --> 00:36:16.180 Even though it echoes Blake to me 00:36:16.680 --> 00:36:17.460 because of that, 00:36:17.880 --> 00:36:19.200 because of the uniqueness of him, 00:36:19.760 --> 00:36:23.280 I don't get this as being the same character at all. 00:36:23.520 --> 00:36:25.100 This is not Roger Moore 00:36:25.580 --> 00:36:28.360 who's always playing the same character 00:36:28.640 --> 00:36:30.100 from one show to the next, 00:36:30.240 --> 00:36:31.360 even if they've got a different name. 00:36:32.640 --> 00:36:34.320 This is a different guy. 00:36:34.480 --> 00:36:35.720 It's just very interesting 00:36:36.020 --> 00:36:37.940 that he has some of that same diction 00:36:38.540 --> 00:36:40.740 and delivery that Blake does in it. 00:36:41.580 --> 00:36:49.900 I mean, I probably mentioned on the podcast that I'm not a huge fan of Gareth Thomas as Blake. 00:36:51.080 --> 00:36:58.400 And part of that is, I think, to do with his performance, which whether intentional or not conveys a kind of, 00:36:59.300 --> 00:37:03.380 I don't really know what the hell I'm doing here and I'd rather be somewhere else. 00:37:04.680 --> 00:37:06.760 I think there's a... 00:37:06.850 --> 00:37:08.120 I think there are days like that, yeah. 00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:13.480 Yeah, but there's a naturalistic style 00:37:13.590 --> 00:37:16.540 that comes from being actually quite low-key 00:37:17.100 --> 00:37:18.180 in the performance. 00:37:18.960 --> 00:37:21.860 And, I mean, obviously, this is a different show, 00:37:22.030 --> 00:37:23.340 a different director, 00:37:24.050 --> 00:37:25.980 who, incidentally, I was interested to discover, 00:37:26.160 --> 00:37:28.100 was editor on both Brighton Rock, 00:37:28.180 --> 00:37:29.260 which is one of my favourite films, 00:37:29.520 --> 00:37:30.440 and The Avengers. 00:37:31.380 --> 00:37:33.600 No, you're talking about proper Avengers, not... 00:37:33.780 --> 00:37:36.760 Yes, The Avengers, you know, 00:37:37.240 --> 00:37:44.340 mrs peele and all that and you don't mean uma thurman you mean diana rick no no no no no i don't 00:37:44.340 --> 00:37:48.880 mean uma thurman um i don't know where i don't know i don't know which series he was editor 00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:54.580 on actually but uh he yeah so he may have got a different performance out of gareth thomas but i 00:37:54.760 --> 00:38:01.159 also think there is just a sense in which the style of style of performance that he gives might 00:38:01.180 --> 00:38:09.280 might be better suited to a show that you know Blake Seven is very kind of by concept and 00:38:09.680 --> 00:38:16.620 everyone around him is just being enormously camp whereas this this is playing off the fact 00:38:16.920 --> 00:38:23.360 that weird things are happening to what is supposed to be a normal village and so it is 00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:31.140 very much the kind of contrast of these spooky events with these very kind of normal normal 00:38:31.160 --> 00:38:33.180 people who are doing normal things, 00:38:33.570 --> 00:38:35.400 going to sort of normal dinner parties 00:38:35.980 --> 00:38:38.460 and wearing normal tweed jackets. 00:38:38.690 --> 00:38:40.760 Although in the interviews, Gareth Thomas says, 00:38:41.060 --> 00:38:43.480 you know, one thing that's changed between then and now, 00:38:43.600 --> 00:38:45.440 no way I would wear that stuff 00:38:46.400 --> 00:38:47.780 or get away with wearing that stuff. 00:38:48.380 --> 00:38:53.280 So, well, you know, I really haven't got any, 00:38:53.820 --> 00:38:55.520 much of anything but praise for the show. 00:38:55.660 --> 00:38:59.520 There's just a couple of points along the way that, 00:38:59.960 --> 00:39:06.700 Like I said, there's a point, there's at least two points along the way where I think if I were a Gareth Thomas character, I would go, I'm going to see if I can drive out of town. 00:39:06.890 --> 00:39:15.100 That just feels like what any sane person would do to make sure there isn't something bizarro going on there. 00:39:15.660 --> 00:39:16.200 I agree. 00:39:16.680 --> 00:39:21.160 And I also think we need to know that from a storytelling point of view. 00:39:21.760 --> 00:39:31.520 Because where I made a note of that was in episode four, where you wonder, Dr. Lyle has tried and failed to leave the village. 00:39:32.619 --> 00:39:37.740 And so as a viewer, you wonder, well, is it possible to leave the village? 00:39:37.810 --> 00:39:42.400 And if you're thinking that, why are Adam and Matthew not thinking that? 00:39:42.490 --> 00:39:44.860 And if they're thinking that, why aren't they trying it? 00:39:45.140 --> 00:39:45.640 Yeah, yeah. 00:39:46.010 --> 00:39:47.060 So that's one. 00:39:47.620 --> 00:39:53.220 And the other one that made me scream, there are two places that made me scream at the TV. 00:39:54.060 --> 00:39:56.640 One was, well, I guess we'll find out tonight. 00:39:57.140 --> 00:39:58.760 Sandra and I have been invited for dinner. 00:39:59.260 --> 00:39:59.800 Don't go. 00:40:00.460 --> 00:40:03.280 Oh, but I want to see the house so much. 00:40:04.220 --> 00:40:08.040 I know he does, but she's like, but I've always wanted to see inside the house. 00:40:08.140 --> 00:40:19.340 I mean, surely it's just a coincidence that everything we've been talking about and fearing about and agonizing about always culminates with the people going to dinner at the house. 00:40:19.540 --> 00:40:21.020 But I'll be okay. 00:40:23.300 --> 00:40:25.460 And I would be all right with that. 00:40:25.720 --> 00:40:26.840 I wouldn't be all right with that. 00:40:27.420 --> 00:40:31.960 If they had acknowledged the fact that we'll be on our guard. 00:40:32.380 --> 00:40:33.600 We'll be looking out. 00:40:34.040 --> 00:40:36.440 We'll, you know, we'll be really careful. 00:40:37.140 --> 00:40:41.480 but you don't get that they just get like i'm gonna go you know we're gonna have dinner and 00:40:41.700 --> 00:40:46.980 see what happens and then when they're sitting at the table and he uses the phrase it is time 00:40:47.420 --> 00:40:54.680 i would be out of that chair so fast it's not even funny i mean surely they have to realize that this 00:40:55.200 --> 00:41:01.420 this i mean you're taking the big freaking drittic stone and the chairs and and the top of the roof 00:41:01.520 --> 00:41:06.040 and the people all chanting and the and doing all this incantation stuff you get out of that 00:41:06.060 --> 00:41:11.060 chair i understand once the light hit them they couldn't get out of the chair but at that point 00:41:11.260 --> 00:41:15.460 you stand up and you'll walk to the other side of the room and see what happens you go you know 00:41:16.440 --> 00:41:23.900 i'll agree in part i mean i i i did get the sense that they were on their guard but they they 00:41:24.120 --> 00:41:30.420 obviously weren't sufficiently on their guard and i i guess i had a bit of a problem with the fact 00:41:30.440 --> 00:41:39.700 that they got happy people because i didn't want them to you know i i i wanted i wanted a an ending 00:41:39.750 --> 00:41:47.260 in which they survive and i and no more than that actually i wanted i wanted them to to to carry on 00:41:47.700 --> 00:41:53.340 as protagonists within the story but of course in the last couple of episodes they they can't really 00:41:53.760 --> 00:41:55.440 because they've been 00:41:56.120 --> 00:41:57.060 they appear. But that's 00:41:57.280 --> 00:41:58.900 the ever decreasing 00:41:59.800 --> 00:42:00.560 support group. Sure. 00:42:01.620 --> 00:42:03.320 Part of the claustrophobia. But also 00:42:03.600 --> 00:42:05.480 we know from the picture that only a man 00:42:05.560 --> 00:42:07.100 and a boy get away. 00:42:07.900 --> 00:42:09.400 It's foretold from the very beginning 00:42:09.440 --> 00:42:11.020 of the show. You could have had a different picture. 00:42:11.340 --> 00:42:12.720 You could have had a different picture. 00:42:13.560 --> 00:42:15.500 Down to the number of stones in the 00:42:15.700 --> 00:42:17.400 town to everything's pointing to it's like 00:42:17.480 --> 00:42:19.020 well 53 minus 2 00:42:19.440 --> 00:42:20.160 two guys running. 00:42:21.220 --> 00:42:27.100 I mean, yes, I don't know that you would necessarily put it together, but from the audience standpoint, you go, yeah, they're not going to make it. 00:42:28.240 --> 00:42:29.080 Here's my question. 00:42:29.460 --> 00:42:34.380 Because, you know, I think you're also supposed to think that not only should they carry on as protagonists of the story, 00:42:34.500 --> 00:42:42.440 I think you're supposed to think that they should sort of carry on, you know, like Margaret perhaps becoming a love interest for Adam. 00:42:43.000 --> 00:42:45.480 You know, that they might have had a future together, right? 00:42:45.940 --> 00:42:46.520 Well, yes. 00:42:46.760 --> 00:42:47.100 Long term. 00:42:47.340 --> 00:42:48.400 Yes, but I mean, absolutely. 00:42:49.000 --> 00:42:49.600 Yeah, there is. 00:42:50.020 --> 00:42:52.180 Nonetheless, they abandoned them in the town. 00:42:52.270 --> 00:42:53.120 Like, yep, no, bye. 00:42:53.520 --> 00:42:54.000 We're out of here. 00:42:54.500 --> 00:42:55.880 Now that they've all been returned to normal. 00:42:56.500 --> 00:42:57.740 How'd you feel about that ending? 00:42:58.200 --> 00:43:00.000 Surely, it's like, why don't you come with us? 00:43:00.980 --> 00:43:01.480 I can't. 00:43:01.480 --> 00:43:02.100 I need this job. 00:43:03.439 --> 00:43:06.480 And why, where was Sandra? 00:43:06.780 --> 00:43:08.860 Why don't we see her at the end? 00:43:09.120 --> 00:43:10.320 That is a good question. 00:43:10.720 --> 00:43:12.400 I didn't understand the significance of that. 00:43:12.490 --> 00:43:14.920 But then, I mean, my mind was fairly reeling at this point. 00:43:15.250 --> 00:43:18.420 I certainly felt, because, like I say, 00:43:18.540 --> 00:43:22.980 of liked the relationships that were going on there and the fact that this is a this is a kids 00:43:23.120 --> 00:43:29.980 show and that they therefore although they you know they had these kind of relationships very 00:43:30.380 --> 00:43:36.700 obvious for us watching to see what's going on they never show anything very explicit and i you 00:43:36.700 --> 00:43:43.860 know i appreciate that i think it i think it adds to it so i was certainly disappointed about that 00:43:43.880 --> 00:43:49.380 aspect of the ending i can see i can see why it happens for the same reasons you've just said 00:43:49.520 --> 00:43:54.840 about the painting which is once you've established that that you know it's just the two of them that 00:43:54.960 --> 00:44:00.540 escape and the circle is beginning again then they're part of that and so the only ending you 00:44:00.620 --> 00:44:07.360 can have is that they are the two that got away this time so they have to get away and be two 00:44:07.640 --> 00:44:15.580 right i i yeah and you i have my if i were adam or matthew for that matter i would have 00:44:16.640 --> 00:44:22.460 felt the need to ask some questions because obviously everyone's been returned to quote 00:44:22.460 --> 00:44:29.640 unquote normal even people they've never met as normal like miss crabtree and those people know 00:44:29.840 --> 00:44:35.480 them clearly they've been living there and they know that they've been living there what do they 00:44:35.500 --> 00:44:41.480 think's been going on yeah except for die well no he knew them too he just he knew them as people 00:44:41.600 --> 00:44:46.100 who never come to him to get their knives sharpened yeah i for at first i thought die didn't know him 00:44:46.160 --> 00:44:50.180 but then he said don't you know i know you you were the don't come never to come here to get 00:44:50.240 --> 00:44:54.820 their knives sharpened or whatever he he said to him well all right but but i mean they obviously 00:44:54.860 --> 00:45:01.200 had a completely different relationship is what i'm getting at and but i i don't think i agree 00:45:01.220 --> 00:45:06.140 with you that I would have stayed around to ask questions. I'm not even sure, to be honest, that I 00:45:06.260 --> 00:45:10.540 would have gone to the museum to see Margaret. I might have just got the hell out of there. 00:45:11.160 --> 00:45:14.180 I think I probably wouldn't have even gone back to get the painting. 00:45:15.120 --> 00:45:15.560 Well, quite. 00:45:16.080 --> 00:45:19.620 You know, when they were really genuinely trying to leave the scary version of the town. 00:45:20.400 --> 00:45:25.780 But since they did go back to see Margaret, I don't know. I think at least one question or 00:45:25.800 --> 00:45:32.460 something and just like uh well what about mr hendrix or anything because obviously hendrix is 00:45:32.540 --> 00:45:39.820 not there he's gone because he comes in a new so you know who lives in the house oh it's been 00:45:39.980 --> 00:45:46.300 empty for years uh or i you know i don't know i would i would just i would have i couldn't resist 00:45:46.560 --> 00:45:52.180 asking at least a question or two just to try to figure out who these people were how they know 00:45:52.500 --> 00:45:58.580 me what did was since there was no mystery going on when adam was there maybe he got in two or 00:45:58.680 --> 00:46:03.160 three full weeks of research that we didn't that's in his paperwork now and he does he'll find when 00:46:03.160 --> 00:46:09.700 he gets back to the university i but i think the problem is that that if you start asking 00:46:10.280 --> 00:46:15.820 questions i mean i agree with you the the scene the scene lacks a sense of urgency of trying to 00:46:15.840 --> 00:46:20.560 get away and therefore that's why there are no questions being asked so you do wonder why there 00:46:20.580 --> 00:46:24.080 no questions being asked but the reason you can't have questions being asked is because 00:46:24.610 --> 00:46:31.140 they couldn't answer them that well the what what what actually was you know the the explanation 00:46:31.350 --> 00:46:37.880 that we've got is that the the this the circle the dish or whatever it is has been transmitting 00:46:38.490 --> 00:46:47.420 evil to a supernova extracted from the people in and it's and it's like what i yes how does that 00:46:47.440 --> 00:46:51.880 even all fit together i mean this comes back to the question about the folklore stuff and the 00:46:52.000 --> 00:46:57.980 science stuff i mean it's it's all a bit at some point in episode six adam starts coming up with 00:46:57.980 --> 00:47:02.880 this stuff about a time shift and you think well where on earth is he getting this from 00:47:03.740 --> 00:47:09.920 i mean obviously it's it it goes on to feed the stuff about the circular circular nature of it 00:47:10.400 --> 00:47:15.280 in the ending and it sort of ties up some of the things that you get earlier on about previous 00:47:15.300 --> 00:47:23.140 cycles but where is that how is adam reaching this extremely implausible explanation for what's 00:47:23.210 --> 00:47:29.740 going on how how has he leapt to that and i i mean i think that that's why you can't have the 00:47:29.870 --> 00:47:33.400 question because if you start asking questions isn't all of this just going to fall apart 00:47:34.200 --> 00:47:38.760 well that's entirely true of every timey wimey story steven mofford ever wrote uh 00:47:39.300 --> 00:47:46.980 if you start asking questions they fall apart um same problem i mean time loops are hard to 00:47:47.420 --> 00:47:54.580 to do yeah yeah and the whole notion of a parallel universe and it's a rough one one thing i do think 00:47:54.680 --> 00:48:00.640 is in but i like i like good i like that i like the stuff about about recurrence i like the way 00:48:00.740 --> 00:48:06.100 in which the the same pattern is being played out again and again i didn't quite understand why that 00:48:06.120 --> 00:48:12.480 actually had to involve others other than the barrier why that had to involve the whole village 00:48:12.780 --> 00:48:20.200 being in a separate time time bubble psychic thing but there you go yeah that that that a little 00:48:20.440 --> 00:48:29.120 problematic um one of the things i do like is first off ian cuthbertson who i guess is i've 00:48:29.260 --> 00:48:34.600 seen him in a bunch of other stuff but not you know not nothing really like a major role this 00:48:34.620 --> 00:48:42.960 is probably the biggest role i've ever seen him in um is suitably weird uh in this part but what i 00:48:43.260 --> 00:48:49.380 i do like about it is and and i know this is a bit of a cliche to say but i think it really comes 00:48:49.620 --> 00:48:57.080 across very well in this episode that villains don't see themselves as villains and he is trying 00:48:57.180 --> 00:49:05.460 to do good to the village. He is trying to remove evil from them. He's trying to make them better. 00:49:06.300 --> 00:49:11.840 And it's just, it's Adam's comment about, you know, well, it's his version. It's his version 00:49:11.980 --> 00:49:18.020 of evil that he's removing from these people. And also he's lying about, you know, there can be no 00:49:18.640 --> 00:49:25.180 happiness without free will. But, you know, clearly those two don't agree on that point of view. 00:49:25.760 --> 00:49:36.320 And I do actually think it's about, it's a benevolence, not entirely, a little bit, but not entirely a power trip on his part. 00:49:36.500 --> 00:49:39.800 I think he thinks he's doing, he's doing good. 00:49:41.400 --> 00:49:41.540 Yeah. 00:49:42.540 --> 00:49:48.320 Whereas, you know, you can have a show where the villain is absolutely over the top, horrifically bad. 00:49:48.700 --> 00:49:51.720 And then, I mean, a comic book cartoon bad. 00:49:52.480 --> 00:50:00.800 And then, you know, later on, the actor will be giving an interview and go, well, you know, I like to think of, you know, a character as baddies don't think they're baddies. 00:50:01.040 --> 00:50:03.040 They think they're doing the right thing. 00:50:03.420 --> 00:50:14.740 And, you know, you can look at some of these and go, there's no way that that guy ever thought he was doing anything other than just working for his own benefit, that he was not doing good in the world. 00:50:15.070 --> 00:50:17.460 But in this case, I think it shows. 00:50:17.860 --> 00:50:19.820 In the end, it doesn't show throughout the course. 00:50:20.260 --> 00:50:22.180 Throughout the course of the thing, he's creepy. 00:50:23.120 --> 00:50:25.260 He's clearly up to something sinister. 00:50:25.880 --> 00:50:30.980 And it really is just towards the end where you finally get a framing of what it is he actually thinks he's doing. 00:50:31.620 --> 00:50:38.160 And suddenly he just, I wouldn't say becomes sympathetic, but just a little bit more sympathetic than he was. 00:50:38.560 --> 00:50:40.820 It's like he's not doing this out of malice. 00:50:40.960 --> 00:50:44.060 He's doing this out of misplaced sense of goodness. 00:50:44.580 --> 00:50:44.760 Yeah. 00:50:46.060 --> 00:50:47.980 I think it's a terrific performance. 00:50:48.320 --> 00:50:51.820 Because, I mean, apart from the fact there's a massive spoiler in the credits 00:50:52.160 --> 00:50:54.220 where it says this starring Ian Cuthbertson, 00:50:54.400 --> 00:50:58.880 and so you know he's going to play some slightly more major role 00:50:59.020 --> 00:51:00.560 than just sort of the landlord. 00:51:01.160 --> 00:51:06.020 But when he first appears, he's creepy, that's a good word, 00:51:06.180 --> 00:51:10.340 but as in a bit of a slightly creepy guy, 00:51:11.340 --> 00:51:14.180 slightly too fond of himself, you know? 00:51:14.600 --> 00:51:26.180 But you kind of think, well, they're strangers in this village and, you know, he's come along to be friendly and welcome them and you make allowances and all the rest of it. 00:51:26.400 --> 00:51:30.940 And it doesn't feel necessarily out of the ordinary. 00:51:31.340 --> 00:51:40.840 And what's nice about his performance is that it then it does grow to the point where by episode five, there's no kind of pretense. 00:51:41.080 --> 00:51:46.960 You see all the scheming going on and we get the double act with Link and all the rest of it. 00:51:47.840 --> 00:51:47.940 Yeah. 00:51:48.220 --> 00:51:54.400 But it still feels part of the same kind of progression through. 00:51:56.180 --> 00:51:57.420 It's not a different character. 00:51:57.620 --> 00:51:59.940 It's not like suddenly the mask falls and it's, 00:52:01.080 --> 00:52:03.320 now I can show you my evil plans. 00:52:03.920 --> 00:52:09.080 He's still the same guy and it's still the same slightly creepy vibe. 00:52:09.360 --> 00:52:11.920 It's just now toward a slightly different end. 00:52:11.990 --> 00:52:24.800 And yet in the end, as you say, you can still see beneath all that what it is that he thinks he's doing and why he's doing it and why he thinks that it is in everyone's interest, even though it's not. 00:52:25.180 --> 00:52:28.200 Yeah. Mentioning the credits, it is weird. 00:52:28.530 --> 00:52:33.940 There are four people listed in the credits, including Gareth Thomas, at the front. 00:52:34.080 --> 00:52:38.540 So Gareth Thomas is listed front with Gareth Thomas, Freddie Jones, which is Di. 00:52:39.060 --> 00:52:42.560 And then they list two other people who I can't remember the names off the top of my head. 00:52:42.900 --> 00:52:45.320 I'm guessing it's Matthew and Margaret. 00:52:45.710 --> 00:52:46.920 I'm not 100% sure there. 00:52:48.259 --> 00:52:50.480 It's Margaret and Mrs. Crabtree. 00:52:50.680 --> 00:52:51.740 Oh, it's Margaret and Mrs. Crabtree. 00:52:51.840 --> 00:52:53.420 So the kids don't even get credit in the opening. 00:52:54.700 --> 00:52:55.540 No, because they're kids. 00:52:55.600 --> 00:52:55.960 Because they're kids. 00:52:56.110 --> 00:52:56.900 Okay, well, I don't know. 00:52:57.000 --> 00:52:57.980 I mean, it's a major part. 00:52:58.280 --> 00:52:58.780 Matthew is... 00:52:59.120 --> 00:53:00.640 Well, because they don't have this... 00:53:00.820 --> 00:53:03.520 I guess they don't have the same kind of track record. 00:53:03.650 --> 00:53:03.760 Okay. 00:53:03.860 --> 00:53:10.160 But it's weird that it's with Gareth Thomas, Freddie Jones, and then starring Ian Cuthbertson. 00:53:10.700 --> 00:53:15.100 He comes after them with starring, which, you know, to our... 00:53:15.200 --> 00:53:19.840 Yeah, which is unusual, but maybe it's to balance the fact that the others are top of the bill. 00:53:20.020 --> 00:53:20.760 I don't know. 00:53:21.060 --> 00:53:27.300 I mean, Gareth Thomas is in, you know, 45 to 75% of all the scenes in the story. 00:53:27.800 --> 00:53:36.100 And you would obviously now, I mean, he's clearly the star of the show along with the boy, but I hope to not. 00:53:38.240 --> 00:53:43.680 I don't know that I have anything else with regards to it. 00:53:44.200 --> 00:53:50.340 I thought, like I said, they had very effective, create a very effective claustrophobia in the town. 00:53:51.320 --> 00:53:53.900 The stones are, they're just cool. 00:53:55.300 --> 00:53:57.060 The stones are just cool, right? 00:53:57.240 --> 00:54:06.080 I mean, even as just a prop when they're walking along and they're in the background, it's just like that is just that really. 00:54:06.700 --> 00:54:10.300 And the fact that most of the stones, not all of them, but most of those stones are real. 00:54:10.580 --> 00:54:14.800 So they don't look like paper mache, except when it's a person turning into one. 00:54:15.240 --> 00:54:16.180 Those look like paper mache. 00:54:16.660 --> 00:54:26.040 But there is there's there's an anecdote from the Gareth Thomas interview that I probably do need to relate because it's just so good. 00:54:26.140 --> 00:54:30.100 He said, I mean, like you say, most of the stones are real, but not all of them are. 00:54:30.500 --> 00:54:31.620 Some of them are polystyrene. 00:54:32.140 --> 00:54:36.680 And because they were filming in Averbury, they had tourists around. 00:54:37.360 --> 00:54:46.540 And so one woman was coming, you know, they were on their lunch break and just sitting around back to one of the real stones leaning up against it. 00:54:46.740 --> 00:54:48.440 And these tourists came along. 00:54:48.920 --> 00:54:54.840 And one woman was just admiring the stones and she just put her hand out to touch it. 00:54:55.040 --> 00:54:57.440 And it was one of the, because they look so good, 00:54:57.640 --> 00:54:59.340 it was one of the polystyrene stones. 00:54:59.820 --> 00:55:00.720 And she knocked it over. 00:55:01.300 --> 00:55:04.760 And she was apparently just completely distraught. 00:55:05.060 --> 00:55:06.360 She was thinking, you know, 00:55:06.640 --> 00:55:09.780 this stone has stood here for thousands and thousands of years, 00:55:09.960 --> 00:55:11.800 and then she's come along and knocked it over. 00:55:12.480 --> 00:55:14.780 And apparently it took them ages to convince her 00:55:14.920 --> 00:55:15.780 that that wasn't the case. 00:55:16.100 --> 00:55:17.640 They were in fits of laughter. 00:55:20.480 --> 00:55:22.000 That's very mean of them. 00:55:23.200 --> 00:55:23.940 Like, no, no, it's fake. 00:55:24.100 --> 00:55:24.720 Here, try this one. 00:55:24.820 --> 00:55:25.020 It's real. 00:55:25.070 --> 00:55:25.860 I thought it was great. 00:55:28.280 --> 00:55:32.700 Yeah, I was going somewhere, but that story was probably better anyway. 00:55:33.000 --> 00:55:34.240 But it was... 00:55:34.320 --> 00:55:34.620 Sorry. 00:55:34.700 --> 00:55:35.560 No, no, no, it's all right. 00:55:36.220 --> 00:55:36.980 It was all right. 00:55:36.980 --> 00:55:42.420 I was just commenting on the feel and the action and the setting, I think. 00:55:42.680 --> 00:55:42.920 Anyway. 00:55:43.140 --> 00:55:48.360 I think a couple of things on feel which are period things. 00:55:48.820 --> 00:55:54.240 I mean, one thing is about some of the female characters in this. 00:55:54.920 --> 00:55:55.020 OK. 00:55:55.360 --> 00:55:57.320 Like Mrs Crabtree, for example. 00:55:57.600 --> 00:55:58.240 Well, I never. 00:55:58.680 --> 00:55:58.780 Yes. 00:56:00.300 --> 00:56:02.460 Tea for three, Mrs Crabtree. 00:56:02.760 --> 00:56:04.980 And I'd rather think you could do with a cup yourself 00:56:05.660 --> 00:56:09.440 after she's just collapsed on the floor for no apparent reason. 00:56:10.160 --> 00:56:15.000 And it's like, surely wouldn't you say, you know, I mean... 00:56:15.360 --> 00:56:16.160 I'll get the tea. 00:56:16.520 --> 00:56:17.020 For a start. 00:56:17.860 --> 00:56:21.320 Yes, I'll get the tea and I'll make you a cup of tea. 00:56:21.580 --> 00:56:28.960 So, yeah, there are certain kind of 70s attitudes going on there. 00:56:29.160 --> 00:56:34.340 And because there are various things that this had, you know, kind of reminded me of. 00:56:34.360 --> 00:56:37.900 And I don't know whether, I mean, it's probably as much influencing other things. 00:56:39.600 --> 00:56:47.180 But just the way in which people were turned into, I mean, it's not a terribly obvious parallel, but the happy day people. 00:56:47.940 --> 00:56:53.260 reminded me a bit of the Stepford Wives because it's got that kind of small small community thing 00:56:53.560 --> 00:57:02.340 and this and and the kind of this the dehumanizing effect of taking away what are considered to be 00:57:03.000 --> 00:57:10.260 undesirable thoughts or whatever you know right um not not perhaps in that case done in in quite 00:57:11.279 --> 00:57:13.900 even as a misguided act of altruism 00:57:14.040 --> 00:57:15.680 not quite the same 00:57:15.840 --> 00:57:18.740 but there's a line 00:57:19.240 --> 00:57:21.520 in case you weren't sure that Hendrik is the villain 00:57:21.800 --> 00:57:24.440 women, punctuality is not among their virtues 00:57:25.279 --> 00:57:26.500 and Link says 00:57:26.920 --> 00:57:30.320 yes sir, there is much to be said for the celibate life 00:57:31.020 --> 00:57:33.120 oh yeah, I remember that line 00:57:35.000 --> 00:57:35.840 that was 00:57:36.860 --> 00:57:39.620 yeah, I'm not entirely sure what that 00:57:39.940 --> 00:57:46.780 you know if they said it now i would assume that they were making a statement no if they said it 00:57:46.860 --> 00:57:51.620 now i'm not if they said that in the 90s i would be sure that they were making a statement that 00:57:51.740 --> 00:57:56.300 hendrix was a homosexual because that would be the the progression as in celibate life is 00:57:56.720 --> 00:58:02.180 euphemistically used euphemistically used to mean yeah i mean women are well it could it could well 00:58:02.180 --> 00:58:08.880 be i mean that could well be the intention i mean the the other thing that and i guess i say this 00:58:08.900 --> 00:58:10.860 Well, no, there's two things, actually. 00:58:11.140 --> 00:58:12.740 One, it reminds me of kind of, 00:58:12.940 --> 00:58:15.700 this goes back to why I think I would have really liked it, 00:58:15.800 --> 00:58:19.760 because there were certain kind of fantasy books of this ilk 00:58:20.640 --> 00:58:21.900 by authors like Alan Garner, 00:58:22.520 --> 00:58:24.780 who managed to make very, 00:58:25.300 --> 00:58:30.280 to create these kind of very sinister extensions of reality, I guess. 00:58:31.660 --> 00:58:34.080 But the other thing this made me think of, 00:58:34.320 --> 00:58:37.080 nothing to do with an association from the time or anything, 00:58:37.320 --> 00:58:44.300 But just everything, I guess, makes me think of, or many of the things we've discussed recently make me think of the X-Files. 00:58:44.720 --> 00:58:50.160 Partly, I guess, because the X-Files draws so widely for its inspirations. 00:58:50.460 --> 00:59:03.120 But nevertheless, this idea you have here of there being a kind of whole mythology to do with something essentially supernatural going on. 00:59:03.600 --> 00:59:09.800 And Adam Brake coming in as a scientist and observing it through a very sort of scientific point of view. 00:59:10.440 --> 00:59:17.860 And I have no idea whether it made a big enough splash across the pond for someone like Chris Carter to ever have seen it. 00:59:18.020 --> 00:59:30.800 But it still seemed to me notable that it was, it's of that, if you like, tradition now of the supernatural show with a scientific, a sort of scientific approach. 00:59:31.140 --> 00:59:31.980 Well, stone tape. 00:59:32.780 --> 00:59:39.340 Yes, absolutely. And Quatermass 2, as we have also discussed, assuming we've discussed this. 00:59:39.560 --> 00:59:40.060 Quatermass 3. 00:59:40.440 --> 00:59:41.100 After that. 00:59:41.940 --> 00:59:42.900 Quatermass in the pit, right? 00:59:43.280 --> 00:59:43.440 Indeed. 00:59:43.760 --> 00:59:44.080 Pit, yeah. 00:59:44.500 --> 00:59:52.280 Indeed. Yes. So, yes, I guess maybe the correct, and if one were viewing it in 1977, 00:59:53.100 --> 00:59:59.160 this would be what you would think, would be the Neil influence rather than the influence 00:59:59.180 --> 01:00:01.240 on what was yet to come 01:00:01.390 --> 01:00:04.080 unless you happened to be so incredibly psychic 01:00:04.320 --> 01:00:06.380 you were able to tell what would be on TV 01:00:06.620 --> 01:00:07.540 15 years in the future. 01:00:08.840 --> 01:00:11.180 Well, maybe if you had the socks or something 01:00:11.400 --> 01:00:13.540 of somebody who was going to be a future TV producer, 01:00:13.740 --> 01:00:16.040 you might be able to use psychometry on that. 01:00:17.280 --> 01:00:18.260 Absolutely, yes. 01:00:19.580 --> 01:00:21.300 I don't think I have anything else. 01:00:21.960 --> 01:00:22.300 Me neither. 01:00:22.820 --> 01:00:25.040 But I do suggest that if you get a chance 01:00:25.040 --> 01:00:27.000 to get hold of this, this is worth... 01:00:27.140 --> 01:00:27.840 Which isn't easy. 01:00:28.040 --> 01:00:31.500 No, worth taking a look if you can find it. 01:00:32.119 --> 01:00:34.340 Anyway, Simon, thank you for joining me. 01:00:34.620 --> 01:00:35.520 It's a pleasure, as always. 01:00:36.320 --> 01:00:39.920 And listeners, I do hope you'll join us all again next time on Fusion Patrol. 01:00:46.040 --> 01:00:49.460 You've been listening to Fusion Patrol, a listener-supported podcast. 01:00:50.200 --> 01:00:57.580 Find out how you can be a sponsor and get early access to all episodes and more at patreon.com slash fusion patrol. 01:00:58.860 --> 01:01:02.200 Come join the conversation on Facebook or Twitter. 01:01:04.280 --> 01:01:07.000 All episodes are available at FusionPatrol.com 01:01:07.760 --> 01:01:11.400 Our music is Fight the Future by Amber Wolf. 01:01:12.740 --> 01:01:15.260 This has been a Lone Locust production.