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You are listening to the a normal cast.

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Man alive did summer ever show up. And

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what's a climber to do when lounging at

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the lake. Slash river slash beach gets mind

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numbing boring after a couple dips and half

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a chapter of that classic you've sworn to

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read for the last 8 years to impress

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your mates.

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A ahab, what's this about whale anatomy again?

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So even though the or is out there

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waiting to suck the life from you like

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an empty snake skin? A climbing we will

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go because well, it's really all we have.

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But black Diamond has your son kissed back

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with apparel to kit the heat.

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Cover up to cool down with the A

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glow hoodie.

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Get a little stone master retro with the

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cord dirt bag shorts.

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Sun's out guns out with the women's project

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muscle t because well, who doesn't like sweaty

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muscles.

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And don't sleep on a cotton hoodie for

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when the sun finally thankfully goes down.

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Black Diamond knows we're not smart enough to

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stay off those skillet hot rocks in summer.

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So help is on the way.

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Check out all the summer climbing apparel at

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black diamond equipment dot com are your favorite

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local shock. And do your best to stay

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cool with bd.

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When it comes to our climbing gear,

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climber, revere stuff that works better than just

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good enough.

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Safety first, but then we also want smooth

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action in our cams,

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a rope that runs just right and shoes

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that don't let us down, and we want

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it all to last. Well, the enormous cast

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and yeti, want you to think about the

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rest of your kit the same way. The

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Yeti tundra cooler has been the best cooler

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on the market for nearly 20 years. You've

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seen them en beat them. Now it's time

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to replace whatever smelly discount hot box you

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have in the back of your truck with

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something that actually works. And will last basically

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forever,

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a tundra cooler from Yeti. And I know,

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I used a promotional cooler from Pb for

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years

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garbage,

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So much foods spoiled. So much money spent

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on ice. So many warm beers refused by

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my friends. I literally used to call it

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the warming chamber,

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Then it blew apart and I threw it

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in the landfill and got a yeti tundra,

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which I will likely need to will to

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my son, after I'm gone.

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You'd never put up with something that barely

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worked in your climbing gear. So don't put

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up with outdoor cargo gear that's only okay

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visit yeti dot com or a yeti dealer

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to see all their durable goods find the

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perfect sized tundra cooler today. Or tonight, or

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next time you get a minute. Just get

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it done, so you can stop worrying if

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that soggy head of broccoli swimming in the

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warm pool at the bottom of your cooler,

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is still terrible.

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We gotta get this.

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Where you're playing in tech.

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The normal whatever it terrific

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Look, you better get up there before you

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panic so tend are loose.

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You're very good.

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I have really enjoyed to I with you

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we'll make...

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I don't think so.

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But share continued with style.

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Weather red.

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No later anything.

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Today's show is brought to you by black

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diamond and equipment, lost Fort.

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And with support from maxim ropes.

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Maxim has been keeping the normal cast off

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the deck since 2012,

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And now, we can also thank the chill

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folks at Yeti,

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and don't forget our charter sponsor,

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bon fired coffee,

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Go to bon fire coffee dot com and

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entry norma at checkout to get a great

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deal on great coffee and to support the

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enormous cast.

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And now back to the show.

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Hello, and welcome normally cast this is your

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host, Chris Cal. It is 07/22/2024,

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about 11AM. You here in Colorado, and this

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is episode 289

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of the enormous cast.

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A conversation with climber and musician

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Smith Curry.

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Have you guys heard a Smith Curry?

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Did you guys order some Smith Curry at

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that little Asian

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American

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fusion bi str downtown this weekend?

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No. Smith Curry is not a dish.

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Unless you really like mustache,

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He is in fact 1 of the most

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sought after Do and pedal steel session musicians

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in Nashville.

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That's hard to say,

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session musicians in Nashville.

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He also has a deep and varied and

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long climbing resume.

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Including first sense in the Us Canada

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as far south as Peru.

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So, yeah, this is 1 of those podcasts

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that's gonna span.

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Away from climbing away.

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If you've been here a while, you know

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I like to do these. Do you remember

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Alexis K, Bradley Carter,

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Chris Parker, our friend Harvey Wright.

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Probably for forgetting some other ones. Did Mason

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play? I can't remember if Mason played on

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his podcast, but He's an amazing musician.

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And, you know, I see the criticisms, not

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just of the enormous cast but of all

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climbing podcasts that they all just sound the

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same.

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It's the same stories, guys sending

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pulling hard.

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And you know, I get that. I understand.

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Right? Podcast we put out content,

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frequently.

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I do twice a month. Some podcast podcasts

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do 1 a week for Christ's sake.

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So, yeah, maybe it kinda runs together. I

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mean, think about it, like, In January, I

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put out a post

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interview with royal Robins, 1 of the great

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climber in America of all time. From the

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golden age and beyond. And then I followed

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it up with Natalia Gross,

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1 of our current Olympia, she's about to

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compete in a couple weeks. I mean, if

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you close your eyes

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You'd had thought there was a same damn

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person talking. I'm sure. Right? I mean, a

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70 something year old guy and a 20

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something year old girl same thing.

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Blah blah blah, climbing climbing climbing.

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And then on the heels of talking to

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tie leggings, a black kid for Memphis,

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I followed it up with a conversation with

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emma t. A white lady from Wales.

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I mean, could that be more similar?

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Tennessee

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Wales,

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black kid, white lady. I mean, talk about

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cookie cutter,

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and then there was that story about Did

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2 disappearing into a monastery for 13 years.

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I mean, if we've heard that story once

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we've heard it a thousand times, Am I

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right.

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So to combat all that same ness that

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I've been putting out. I thought I'd talked

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to Smith Curry.

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A lot about climbing, but also a lot

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about music and about the music industry.

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If you are super into country music,

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or maybe even casually than you've probably heard

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Smith without even knowing it.

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He's played on a lot of music, a

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lot of hits

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Plenty of number ones.

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He's played with or 4 most of the

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country people I've even heard of, not being

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a big country fan myself.

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You know, the giants,

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folks like Willie Nelson, Dolly Part,

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Randy Travis.

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I mean, Dude was on stage with Merle

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Fucking H.

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He's currently all over the radio because there's

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this song

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by someone named Shi,

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He's 1 of these sort of rap country

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crossover guys, a trend that I think really

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took off with little Nas x's Old town

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Road.

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Last year or a couple years ago whenever

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that was.

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Shi song is called the bar song Tip,

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and because I listened to a very, very

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nerdy

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music podcast called Hit parade. I happen to

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know that it is currently

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number 2 on Billboards song of summer list.

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In contention with another kinda crossover

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country song. And Smith plays on that song.

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So, yeah, if you heard it, you heard

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Smith

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Isn't that cool. And you probably did hear

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this song even if you don't know it.

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And I got to talk to Smith online

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because I knew he was a climber, but,

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of course,

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my thing is I was more interested in

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the music stuff, and actually didn't even realize

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how

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experienced

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of a climber he was until we did

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this podcast. And it it goes way deeper

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than I thought. First the sense here and

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there. He's an a. He's a big wall

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climber.

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Deep in it, and he still loves it

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and instill into it even though he worries

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about his hands because of course, they're are

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his money makers.

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Yeah, all here. I love this interview. I

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could've kept talking to Smith for much longer.

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So we'll move on here from my earlier

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pitching. But I think a lot of you

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guys come for. It's kind of my brand.

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It's kind of a brand. I don't think

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most of the other climbing podcast get as

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cranky as I do do they?

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Anyway, this is a super fun interview. I'm

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really excited to present it to you guys.

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So let's get to it.

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Conversation with Climber and musician Smith Curry.

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Hey, guys. It's me again.

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That's right. Your toes,

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and I'll tell you if there's 1 thing

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us toes hate more than ice climate. It's

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crack climate.

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So if you gotta do it, and I

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know you gotta, then Sport has some cool

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choices. Peter climb hard and still give us

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toes a smooth ride.

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Of course, the v Tc pro can't be

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beat on those bigger crack sizes and multi

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pitch tread.

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But what about the thin stuff? Well,

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And I don't even think sp,

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the Cub.

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That's right. It said it. The cub.

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Is Sport ultra comfortable all around her, but

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it also happens to be a thin crack

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ultra tech super shoe.

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More support than a slipper, but just enough

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rubber and all the right places to get

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in and get on with the type of

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jamming you need on the thin stuff.

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Don't believe me. Then buy the Cub

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for its edging, smear and comfort that's like

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a hug from a warm fuzzy puppy. You

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know if a puppy had arms and it

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wasn't 1 of them stupid once at eats

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poop.

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And then give them a fling on your

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thin crack project.

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You'll come around to the Cub, or my

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name isn't, a what? Oh,

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we're late for a pedicure.

273
00:10:28,471 --> 00:10:29,426
Okay. I gotta go.

274
00:10:30,157 --> 00:10:31,906
Check out the Cub and all the other

275
00:10:31,906 --> 00:10:33,894
great shoes at sp dot com or your

276
00:10:33,894 --> 00:10:36,517
local shop, and, of course, tell your toes

277
00:10:36,517 --> 00:10:36,995
sent.

278
00:10:40,111 --> 00:10:42,599
60000 dollar vintage tube microphone

279
00:10:43,133 --> 00:10:44,508
into a 300000

280
00:10:44,565 --> 00:10:47,287
dollar vintage desk and to this into that.

281
00:10:47,447 --> 00:10:48,564
And then finally, at end, it's, like,

282
00:10:49,441 --> 00:10:50,239
into, you know,

283
00:10:51,037 --> 00:10:52,973
99 cent MP3

284
00:10:53,032 --> 00:10:54,481
into 10 dollar earbuds.

285
00:10:55,117 --> 00:10:57,104
Right. It's like we do all this and

286
00:10:57,104 --> 00:10:59,091
then it just gets totally wrecked at the

287
00:10:59,091 --> 00:10:59,489
back end.

288
00:11:00,363 --> 00:11:02,907
Yeah. Isn't that Neil Young jack? Doesn't have

289
00:11:02,907 --> 00:11:05,229
some? For big problem about the way. He

290
00:11:05,229 --> 00:11:06,581
was a big proponent of...

291
00:11:08,251 --> 00:11:10,183
He came out with some kind of hardware

292
00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:12,485
strip. Device like an ipod but like super

293
00:11:12,485 --> 00:11:15,432
high res and bandwidth. Yeah. Yeah. No 1

294
00:11:15,432 --> 00:11:17,821
cared because we're all cheap and this doesn't

295
00:11:17,821 --> 00:11:18,458
really matter.

296
00:11:19,175 --> 00:11:19,309
Gaming

297
00:11:19,987 --> 00:11:22,218
Yeah. Either other anyway. But, yeah. It's funny.

298
00:11:22,536 --> 00:11:24,448
Cool, man. Thanks for doing this. I really

299
00:11:24,448 --> 00:11:27,408
appreciate it. Yeah. Tight. Yeah. I me, too.

300
00:11:27,646 --> 00:11:27,884
I just...

301
00:11:28,757 --> 00:11:30,581
I had kind of this, like, rough night.

302
00:11:30,819 --> 00:11:33,461
I I went climbing yesterday, and

303
00:11:34,008 --> 00:11:36,236
Like, I did a pretty hard kinda go

304
00:11:36,236 --> 00:11:37,510
on this route. And I came down and

305
00:11:37,589 --> 00:11:40,455
I just was, like, sitting there, like, feeling

306
00:11:40,455 --> 00:11:42,622
like I'd gotten run over by a tank,

307
00:11:42,782 --> 00:11:45,416
you know? And these days, it's like not

308
00:11:45,416 --> 00:11:46,853
uncommon to feel that way. But

309
00:11:47,491 --> 00:11:48,848
I was like god, this feels really bad.

310
00:11:49,008 --> 00:11:50,046
And then I just kinda, like,

311
00:11:50,699 --> 00:11:52,049
I had my ear hurt a little bit,

312
00:11:52,367 --> 00:11:54,433
and I think I had, like, a little

313
00:11:54,433 --> 00:11:56,578
minor ear infection because I got home and

314
00:11:56,658 --> 00:11:58,644
I was, like, chilled and and

315
00:11:59,280 --> 00:12:00,651
I Like, I didn't really have a fever,

316
00:12:00,811 --> 00:12:02,567
but I had that feeling of having a

317
00:12:02,567 --> 00:12:04,641
fever, you know, like, I felt cold and

318
00:12:04,641 --> 00:12:06,477
my ear hurt and and went to bed

319
00:12:06,477 --> 00:12:06,876
and

320
00:12:07,848 --> 00:12:09,203
I feel much better this morning though, but

321
00:12:09,282 --> 00:12:10,796
I was little worried. I was like, oh,

322
00:12:10,955 --> 00:12:12,708
man. How old are you doing?

323
00:12:13,904 --> 00:12:16,374
52. I'll be 53 in 10 days though.

324
00:12:16,533 --> 00:12:19,580
So I'm okay. I turned 57 10 days

325
00:12:19,580 --> 00:12:21,894
ago. So... Okay. Right. Yeah. So you know.

326
00:12:22,293 --> 00:12:23,650
You know what I'm talking about about the

327
00:12:23,650 --> 00:12:25,327
being hit by a truck thing, every time

328
00:12:25,327 --> 00:12:26,045
you know I.

329
00:12:26,778 --> 00:12:30,051
I went kinda hard Saturday night. Though Yeah.

330
00:12:30,290 --> 00:12:32,765
Big rock band extreme. Do you know they

331
00:12:32,765 --> 00:12:34,042
have that big hit more than them Yeah.

332
00:12:34,202 --> 00:12:35,493
No? III

333
00:12:35,493 --> 00:12:37,328
just went on a new no Benton court,

334
00:12:37,966 --> 00:12:38,843
like, rabbit hole,

335
00:12:39,561 --> 00:12:41,874
not too long ago, on Youtube. Like, check

336
00:12:41,874 --> 00:12:43,730
it all, you know. Yeah. So

337
00:12:44,108 --> 00:12:46,352
about those guys. Yeah. So Nun was actually

338
00:12:46,352 --> 00:12:48,261
a friend of mine. He reached out about

339
00:12:48,261 --> 00:12:50,273
4 years ago about me

340
00:12:50,727 --> 00:12:53,533
collaborating playing a showcase. For this country artist

341
00:12:53,533 --> 00:12:56,250
that he's producing this girl. And so we

342
00:12:56,250 --> 00:12:58,008
got to do bunch of rehearsal and then

343
00:12:58,008 --> 00:12:59,687
play a big show at the exited in

344
00:12:59,687 --> 00:13:00,885
together, and

345
00:13:01,524 --> 00:13:03,927
he's So I hit him up and was

346
00:13:03,927 --> 00:13:06,315
able, to, see the show Saturday night and

347
00:13:06,315 --> 00:13:07,986
went backstage and hung out with him in

348
00:13:07,986 --> 00:13:09,737
the van and stuff afterwards. So that was

349
00:13:09,737 --> 00:13:12,865
really fun, But he... Is, man, he's a

350
00:13:12,865 --> 00:13:14,625
deep cat too. He's not just a, you

351
00:13:14,625 --> 00:13:17,105
know, shredder. He's he's a really, you know,

352
00:13:17,264 --> 00:13:19,600
he's been Rihanna family. Leader for the last

353
00:13:19,600 --> 00:13:22,480
15 years and so, oh, really? Yeah. And

354
00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:25,440
we've worked collaborate a few other ways to...

355
00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:27,771
He reached data out, there's this guy Owen

356
00:13:27,771 --> 00:13:30,645
that he's producing, who's 1 of Taylor swift

357
00:13:30,645 --> 00:13:31,124
dancers.

358
00:13:31,683 --> 00:13:33,301
And I think he's done some dancing

359
00:13:33,999 --> 00:13:35,970
for Rihanna two's. He's like, a tall about

360
00:13:36,249 --> 00:13:39,206
skinny black guy with a killer voice. And

361
00:13:39,206 --> 00:13:39,525
so

362
00:13:40,324 --> 00:13:42,721
I played on this record for Nun, kinda

363
00:13:42,721 --> 00:13:43,360
long distance,

364
00:13:44,812 --> 00:13:46,007
remotely. And then

365
00:13:46,645 --> 00:13:48,716
it was during pandemic. And so he... For

366
00:13:48,716 --> 00:13:51,425
his single release, he wanted to do a

367
00:13:51,425 --> 00:13:51,925
video

368
00:13:52,302 --> 00:13:54,785
where it's just Nun playing acoustic nick owen

369
00:13:54,785 --> 00:13:56,851
singing and then me playing pedal steel. And

370
00:13:56,851 --> 00:13:59,553
so each filmed ourselves, I filmed myself out

371
00:13:59,553 --> 00:14:02,335
in my side yard of my house, and

372
00:14:02,335 --> 00:14:03,701
he cobb a to together they're for a

373
00:14:03,701 --> 00:14:06,087
cool video that accompanied with the the release

374
00:14:06,087 --> 00:14:07,519
with it, so that was pretty fun.

375
00:14:08,792 --> 00:14:10,717
That's awesome. I mean, Yeah know, I've been

376
00:14:10,717 --> 00:14:12,946
thinking about this thing, you know, I've just

377
00:14:12,946 --> 00:14:14,937
kinda followed you on Instagram, and, you know,

378
00:14:15,017 --> 00:14:17,645
we occasionally exchange comments and stuff like that.

379
00:14:17,804 --> 00:14:19,810
And and, like this, you like that story

380
00:14:19,810 --> 00:14:20,448
you just told,

381
00:14:21,643 --> 00:14:23,714
and and, you know, referencing some of these

382
00:14:23,714 --> 00:14:25,786
people that we've heard of and stuff. It's

383
00:14:25,786 --> 00:14:27,559
like, door I mean, we could do that

384
00:14:27,559 --> 00:14:30,039
for the next, like, 6 days. Straight. I

385
00:14:30,039 --> 00:14:32,120
feel like, Honestly. I mean, you know, like,

386
00:14:32,279 --> 00:14:34,975
looking at your your music resume, it's it's

387
00:14:35,173 --> 00:14:35,810
it's kind of...

388
00:14:37,083 --> 00:14:39,391
I mean, it's staggering. And I think it's,

389
00:14:39,470 --> 00:14:41,619
you know, it's just added up for you

390
00:14:41,619 --> 00:14:44,740
over the years. Like, I Nightly... I read

391
00:14:44,740 --> 00:14:47,159
this thing Like, oh, you played on 20000

392
00:14:47,379 --> 00:14:49,459
country songs or some something like that. I'm,

393
00:14:49,539 --> 00:14:51,953
like, and that... It just, you know, I'm

394
00:14:51,953 --> 00:14:53,867
sure your dreams as a as a, you

395
00:14:53,867 --> 00:14:55,803
know, a a starting musician

396
00:14:56,260 --> 00:14:57,079
never really,

397
00:14:57,536 --> 00:15:00,247
like placed you there. But yeah slowly, but

398
00:15:00,247 --> 00:15:03,536
surely, you've just, this accumulation, it's kinda fantastic.

399
00:15:04,255 --> 00:15:06,652
Yeah. So looking back. It's, like, holy shit.

400
00:15:06,812 --> 00:15:08,705
You know, I've probably worked with over, like

401
00:15:08,825 --> 00:15:09,884
250

402
00:15:10,024 --> 00:15:12,184
signed artists. I mean, that's Mh the people

403
00:15:12,184 --> 00:15:14,524
with deals and stuff instead of just random

404
00:15:14,585 --> 00:15:14,825
dude.

405
00:15:16,105 --> 00:15:17,957
But... Yes. It's like, well, that's you know,

406
00:15:18,036 --> 00:15:20,102
over the last 30 years. So, you know,

407
00:15:20,182 --> 00:15:21,771
if you do a few cool things every

408
00:15:21,771 --> 00:15:24,235
year, it adds up for sure. Yeah. It's

409
00:15:24,235 --> 00:15:26,221
all the same with climbing too. Right? You

410
00:15:26,221 --> 00:15:28,548
know, I mean, you know, you look back

411
00:15:28,548 --> 00:15:30,782
at anybody's climbing resume that's been in the

412
00:15:30,782 --> 00:15:32,217
game a long time and it gets a

413
00:15:32,217 --> 00:15:33,015
lot more impressive.

414
00:15:33,733 --> 00:15:35,727
Yeah. For sure. I mean, I kinda feel

415
00:15:35,727 --> 00:15:36,227
like

416
00:15:36,778 --> 00:15:38,531
you know, there's a part of that and

417
00:15:38,531 --> 00:15:40,523
in this a normal cast thing because that's

418
00:15:40,523 --> 00:15:41,399
when I started it.

419
00:15:42,116 --> 00:15:43,949
I was like, you know, it was like

420
00:15:43,949 --> 00:15:46,154
the dawn of podcasting kind of thing and

421
00:15:46,354 --> 00:15:47,952
I was like, you know what? I I

422
00:15:47,952 --> 00:15:50,748
know enough, like, quote unquote famous climber, you

423
00:15:50,748 --> 00:15:53,145
know, kinda talking about your signed musicians. Like,

424
00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:55,720
I could probably do something like this. And

425
00:15:55,799 --> 00:15:56,840
I've just... And it was the same thing.

426
00:15:57,000 --> 00:15:58,759
I've just been around long enough that I

427
00:15:58,759 --> 00:16:00,919
was lot I've climbed with these people and

428
00:16:00,919 --> 00:16:02,934
talk to him and know, and it's a

429
00:16:02,934 --> 00:16:05,434
different... You know, there's a different wall between

430
00:16:05,735 --> 00:16:07,894
even someone like Hon and someone like Taylor

431
00:16:07,975 --> 00:16:08,615
Swift, but

432
00:16:09,335 --> 00:16:10,868
you But, yeah, you know, it's it's kinda

433
00:16:10,868 --> 00:16:12,465
of the same vibe in a way that

434
00:16:12,625 --> 00:16:14,303
I started this thing on on a very,

435
00:16:14,463 --> 00:16:16,540
you know, minor level compared to what you

436
00:16:16,540 --> 00:16:18,630
do. Yeah. I didn't wanna get Taylor. I

437
00:16:18,630 --> 00:16:20,306
didn't wanna get Twitch kelly swift in here

438
00:16:20,306 --> 00:16:21,743
for for good Seo,

439
00:16:22,860 --> 00:16:24,377
because I did see a video you on

440
00:16:24,377 --> 00:16:24,935
stage with her.

441
00:16:25,909 --> 00:16:27,909
More back when she was not quite the

442
00:16:27,909 --> 00:16:28,809
the gigantic,

443
00:16:29,509 --> 00:16:30,889
you know, astronomical

444
00:16:31,830 --> 00:16:33,269
neutron star that she is now.

445
00:16:34,002 --> 00:16:34,740
But nevertheless.

446
00:16:35,510 --> 00:16:37,732
Yeah. Well, you know, it was funny is

447
00:16:37,732 --> 00:16:39,002
that was when she was first... And that

448
00:16:39,002 --> 00:16:40,589
was her first C fast.

449
00:16:41,319 --> 00:16:44,345
And she's the country artist still. Yeah. And...

450
00:16:44,504 --> 00:16:46,256
But, you know, it was... That she her

451
00:16:46,256 --> 00:16:48,088
first singles out and that really took off

452
00:16:48,088 --> 00:16:49,362
for her and so it went on. And

453
00:16:49,362 --> 00:16:49,442
then...

454
00:16:50,414 --> 00:16:52,971
I played on her speak now album, which

455
00:16:52,971 --> 00:16:56,087
is maybe here for the record. I'm, I

456
00:16:56,087 --> 00:16:58,737
think... But, you know, my climbing french have

457
00:16:58,737 --> 00:17:01,038
a great way of keeping me grounded. This

458
00:17:01,038 --> 00:17:03,339
is a pretty fun story. I had gone

459
00:17:03,339 --> 00:17:05,560
over to Over overdo at the producers homes

460
00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:06,212
since studio.

461
00:17:06,690 --> 00:17:08,545
It was like, on a Sunday randomly.

462
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:09,399
And

463
00:17:10,195 --> 00:17:11,789
I was driving home in 1 of my

464
00:17:11,789 --> 00:17:14,913
long time studio you know, Yosemite friends, Kendra

465
00:17:15,072 --> 00:17:17,305
K called me up randomly just to say,

466
00:17:17,464 --> 00:17:19,298
hi. Like, what do you? I was like,

467
00:17:19,457 --> 00:17:21,132
I was all psyche brag. I was, I

468
00:17:21,132 --> 00:17:23,384
just playing on Swift records, she goes, who's

469
00:17:23,464 --> 00:17:24,105
Taylor Swift?

470
00:17:27,704 --> 00:17:30,116
Yeah. Right. Put me right back. In my

471
00:17:30,116 --> 00:17:31,939
place. You know. Yeah. The climber are sort

472
00:17:31,939 --> 00:17:33,762
of will fully... A lot of times are

473
00:17:33,762 --> 00:17:36,299
will fully, like, you know, blunt to any

474
00:17:36,299 --> 00:17:38,299
sort of pop culture. In like, as as

475
00:17:38,299 --> 00:17:40,368
kind of a sign fire of their, you

476
00:17:40,368 --> 00:17:42,118
know, of their cr kind of the things.

477
00:17:42,277 --> 00:17:44,266
It's like when you... When someone pretends to

478
00:17:44,266 --> 00:17:46,589
not, you know, know who, like, you know,

479
00:17:46,829 --> 00:17:49,545
Steph Curry is because they so, like, in

480
00:17:49,545 --> 00:17:51,163
the mountains that they can't possibly,

481
00:17:51,542 --> 00:17:54,108
you know, pay attention sort of stuff. That's

482
00:17:54,108 --> 00:17:56,252
awesome. Yeah. That's still awesome. I I wanted

483
00:17:56,252 --> 00:17:57,760
to ask you kind of a question. I

484
00:17:57,760 --> 00:17:59,109
mean, we're already kind of into it. But,

485
00:17:59,983 --> 00:18:01,069
I was just like, that

486
00:18:01,909 --> 00:18:03,587
thinking... Like, when was the last time you

487
00:18:03,587 --> 00:18:06,384
rock climbed? Like, literally, like, was it... I

488
00:18:06,384 --> 00:18:07,583
think it was just like weeks ago it

489
00:18:07,583 --> 00:18:09,341
seems like. Yeah. Just like maybe a week

490
00:18:09,341 --> 00:18:10,480
and a half. I was

491
00:18:11,512 --> 00:18:14,218
we're to go. Let's see. Everything's like 2

492
00:18:14,218 --> 00:18:17,004
hours from Nashville. There's nothing good in town.

493
00:18:17,481 --> 00:18:18,755
So I went to the Ob,

494
00:18:19,551 --> 00:18:21,714
like, 3 weeks ago. And then

495
00:18:22,350 --> 00:18:24,258
I went to Denny Cove who just ran

496
00:18:24,258 --> 00:18:26,086
foster falls just like a week and a

497
00:18:26,086 --> 00:18:28,312
half ago. Trying to get out more, you

498
00:18:28,312 --> 00:18:28,471
know,

499
00:18:30,140 --> 00:18:32,538
so stave off the old age. You know

500
00:18:32,538 --> 00:18:34,048
what I mean, part of it's part of

501
00:18:34,048 --> 00:18:35,183
its, you know, definitely

502
00:18:35,557 --> 00:18:36,216
the d

503
00:18:36,590 --> 00:18:38,576
of getting older, but a big part is

504
00:18:38,576 --> 00:18:42,751
just trying to get work, weather. Mh. Partners

505
00:18:43,128 --> 00:18:45,917
and family stuff to all line up, Just

506
00:18:45,917 --> 00:18:48,400
always harder and harder. Yeah. Yeah. Totally So.

507
00:18:48,638 --> 00:18:50,227
Well, let me ask... The my question really

508
00:18:50,227 --> 00:18:52,236
was, like, I kinda wanted you to

509
00:18:52,690 --> 00:18:54,278
recount. So you weren't climbing about week and

510
00:18:54,278 --> 00:18:56,677
a half ago. I kinda wanted just to

511
00:18:56,677 --> 00:18:58,588
get a picture of your life because it's...

512
00:18:58,827 --> 00:19:01,455
I think it's just it's really cool. And

513
00:19:01,455 --> 00:19:02,968
then then we'll get in your climbing in

514
00:19:02,968 --> 00:19:04,694
your... In your in a little bit more

515
00:19:04,814 --> 00:19:07,307
some other stuff, but, anyway, like, recount your

516
00:19:07,365 --> 00:19:09,598
your week since then. Like, because it I...

517
00:19:09,757 --> 00:19:11,352
You know, we've been chatting in the last

518
00:19:11,352 --> 00:19:13,026
week, like, trying to get this thing going

519
00:19:13,026 --> 00:19:14,960
and and there's just been some cool shit.

520
00:19:15,279 --> 00:19:16,880
Besides this thing you just talked about, which

521
00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:19,039
was, like, hanging out with with, you know,

522
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:21,279
Nun and backstage and things like that. But

523
00:19:21,279 --> 00:19:23,283
there's been, like... A red carpet thing, like,

524
00:19:23,442 --> 00:19:25,506
I'm sure you more forgot about that. Yeah.

525
00:19:25,665 --> 00:19:27,491
Yeah. Exactly You forgot about that.

526
00:19:29,317 --> 00:19:31,317
And if we go back 2 weeks. Can

527
00:19:31,317 --> 00:19:33,067
brag and name drop even a little more.

528
00:19:33,386 --> 00:19:35,931
Okay. Go back 2 weeks then today. I

529
00:19:35,931 --> 00:19:37,227
was doing my morning

530
00:19:37,681 --> 00:19:40,249
trail run or hike... Depending on how I'm

531
00:19:40,249 --> 00:19:41,925
feeling and what I'm up for. I go

532
00:19:41,925 --> 00:19:43,761
every morning the last 9 or 10 months,

533
00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:46,155
there's a partner nearby that's great. And I

534
00:19:46,155 --> 00:19:48,479
got a 10 from Terry Clark, who is

535
00:19:48,479 --> 00:19:51,343
a big country artist, especially in the nineties,

536
00:19:51,423 --> 00:19:53,571
but yes, she's been doing cool stuff since

537
00:19:53,571 --> 00:19:55,401
then. And she's like, hey, do you wanna

538
00:19:55,401 --> 00:19:57,332
a text played Do on a song for

539
00:19:57,332 --> 00:19:59,729
me. I said, you know, well, course. And

540
00:19:59,729 --> 00:20:01,326
then she's like, yeah. It's said do that

541
00:20:01,326 --> 00:20:02,386
with Kelly Clark

542
00:20:02,938 --> 00:20:05,007
like, well, talk about Barry the league. You

543
00:20:05,007 --> 00:20:06,439
know, You Kelly Clark is 1 of the

544
00:20:06,439 --> 00:20:08,746
biggest pop stars in the world. And then,

545
00:20:09,383 --> 00:20:11,470
I did that. The next few days after

546
00:20:11,470 --> 00:20:12,826
that, and she's like, yeah, that went, great.

547
00:20:13,065 --> 00:20:14,341
You wanna play on this other 1 I

548
00:20:14,341 --> 00:20:16,176
did with Cody Jaws and who's, like, the

549
00:20:16,176 --> 00:20:18,648
biggest 1 of the top 3 country artists

550
00:20:18,648 --> 00:20:20,894
right now. So that was pretty fun.

551
00:20:21,451 --> 00:20:23,679
But... Yeah, you asked about the red carpet

552
00:20:23,679 --> 00:20:26,327
thing. There's a film called the Neon Highway,

553
00:20:26,623 --> 00:20:29,018
and I it stars Bow bridges, you know,

554
00:20:29,177 --> 00:20:31,793
Jeff Bridges older brother, famous American actor.

555
00:20:32,348 --> 00:20:34,568
And this guy, Rob Maze, who...

556
00:20:35,059 --> 00:20:36,650
Is an actor that I've produced a bunch

557
00:20:36,650 --> 00:20:37,526
of songs for.

558
00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:41,129
So it's a country music movie

559
00:20:41,504 --> 00:20:43,352
about, you know, raw plays up in and

560
00:20:43,352 --> 00:20:45,665
come country star in Bow bridges it's the

561
00:20:45,665 --> 00:20:47,739
g old old veteran who's been out of

562
00:20:47,739 --> 00:20:48,696
the game for a while.

563
00:20:50,371 --> 00:20:52,046
And Rob kind of, you know,

564
00:20:52,698 --> 00:20:55,002
got me involved on the project. We filmed

565
00:20:55,002 --> 00:20:57,386
it, like, 3 years ago and just for

566
00:20:57,386 --> 00:20:59,135
whatever reasons it took this long to come

567
00:20:59,135 --> 00:20:59,373
out.

568
00:21:00,804 --> 00:21:03,070
And it was... At the height of the

569
00:21:03,686 --> 00:21:06,396
height of the pandemic stuff, and it was

570
00:21:06,396 --> 00:21:08,230
crazy. We filmed the scene in a crowded

571
00:21:08,230 --> 00:21:10,559
bar, I'm, like rocket out. On lab steel

572
00:21:10,559 --> 00:21:11,679
on the scene. And so that's pretty fun.

573
00:21:11,839 --> 00:21:13,519
They used the actual audio for when we

574
00:21:13,519 --> 00:21:14,720
were filming, which is rare.

575
00:21:15,279 --> 00:21:17,919
And they had everybody all the extras in

576
00:21:17,919 --> 00:21:21,775
the crowd on wear masks and face shields

577
00:21:21,775 --> 00:21:23,855
for, like, 3 hours straight while we were

578
00:21:23,855 --> 00:21:26,095
setting up the band and getting audio, doing

579
00:21:26,095 --> 00:21:28,255
the film blocking and all that stuff. And

580
00:21:28,255 --> 00:21:29,946
then for the next 5 hours while we're

581
00:21:29,946 --> 00:21:31,701
filming they had them take all that stuff

582
00:21:31,701 --> 00:21:31,940
off.

583
00:21:32,977 --> 00:21:33,775
I was just, like,

584
00:21:34,492 --> 00:21:36,566
you know, with the hell. Yeah. Right? It

585
00:21:36,566 --> 00:21:38,241
was red. I I got to rock out

586
00:21:38,241 --> 00:21:40,165
with Libra rice big country guy

587
00:21:40,562 --> 00:21:42,309
in the film. And then I have a

588
00:21:42,309 --> 00:21:45,249
second scene where I'm playing poker around a

589
00:21:45,249 --> 00:21:48,787
pool table with Libra rice and Bow bridges

590
00:21:49,006 --> 00:21:49,165
and,

591
00:21:49,963 --> 00:21:50,602
Dave Rowe,

592
00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:54,274
legendary country guy, old friend of mine, play

593
00:21:54,274 --> 00:21:56,444
base for Johnny Cash for years. Ice he

594
00:21:56,444 --> 00:21:58,358
sadly passed several months ago.

595
00:21:59,395 --> 00:22:01,469
But I had a few lines in the

596
00:22:01,469 --> 00:22:03,463
movie, like, in a close up scene with

597
00:22:03,463 --> 00:22:05,855
1 of the most iconic actors in American

598
00:22:05,855 --> 00:22:06,015
film,

599
00:22:06,749 --> 00:22:07,707
you know, bow bridges.

600
00:22:08,267 --> 00:22:10,743
I was pretty nervous, fortunately, it didn't look

601
00:22:10,743 --> 00:22:12,740
that way in the film. So it had

602
00:22:12,740 --> 00:22:14,826
its premier and I've walked the red carpet

603
00:22:14,826 --> 00:22:16,419
and stuff just a few days ago. And

604
00:22:16,419 --> 00:22:17,533
I that was pretty fun. I had to

605
00:22:17,533 --> 00:22:20,023
do a few interviews, which is a little

606
00:22:20,081 --> 00:22:22,164
unusual for me. But her Yeah. Is... Yeah.

607
00:22:22,402 --> 00:22:24,149
Saw. You're like, a... You're, like a side

608
00:22:24,149 --> 00:22:26,372
man and and stew in studio guy. You're

609
00:22:26,372 --> 00:22:27,643
supposed to be sort of in the background.

610
00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:30,795
Yeah. Absolutely. So yeah. There's been a couple

611
00:22:30,914 --> 00:22:33,301
times where I'm forced to actually speak or

612
00:22:33,301 --> 00:22:35,371
whatever I got asked by the country music

613
00:22:35,371 --> 00:22:38,338
hall of fame to do the musician spotlight

614
00:22:38,395 --> 00:22:40,955
a couple times. And, times I brought a

615
00:22:40,955 --> 00:22:42,544
couple friends to sing some of these songs,

616
00:22:42,703 --> 00:22:44,927
and I've, you know, had to talk about

617
00:22:44,927 --> 00:22:46,993
my career in Nashville and play some of

618
00:22:46,993 --> 00:22:48,343
the hits that I played on.

619
00:22:48,994 --> 00:22:51,862
Yeah. Little nerve wracking actually having to

620
00:22:52,659 --> 00:22:53,536
speak in public.

621
00:22:54,810 --> 00:22:57,121
Yeah. That's that's that's pretty cool. Yeah. Like

622
00:22:57,121 --> 00:22:58,476
you said, like I said, you're you're used

623
00:22:58,476 --> 00:23:00,089
to you know, being on the on the

624
00:23:00,089 --> 00:23:02,009
album and in the background and stuff. Like,

625
00:23:02,170 --> 00:23:04,250
although, you've you've been on stage in front

626
00:23:04,250 --> 00:23:06,730
of tens of thousands too, so that's that's

627
00:23:06,730 --> 00:23:09,300
pretty heavy. But let let's just keep a

628
00:23:09,300 --> 00:23:11,156
little bit of faith to the climbing podcast

629
00:23:11,694 --> 00:23:13,609
end of this thing because otherwise, I mean,

630
00:23:13,769 --> 00:23:15,859
as people know from listening when I... And

631
00:23:15,859 --> 00:23:17,777
and this is something I do. I'm unlike

632
00:23:17,777 --> 00:23:18,656
a hack musician,

633
00:23:19,375 --> 00:23:21,373
you know, just a just a hobby kinda

634
00:23:21,373 --> 00:23:24,010
dude and but I love having people on

635
00:23:24,010 --> 00:23:25,863
who have... Like, a toe in this world.

636
00:23:26,023 --> 00:23:27,941
And and I mean, you have, like, you

637
00:23:27,941 --> 00:23:29,859
know, you're up to your knees at least,

638
00:23:30,019 --> 00:23:32,096
if not if not thighs in this way.

639
00:23:32,336 --> 00:23:34,348
So... But you... But you're a caught and

640
00:23:34,348 --> 00:23:36,180
you're you're a series climber and you've spent

641
00:23:36,180 --> 00:23:38,092
a lot of time doing that. And it

642
00:23:38,092 --> 00:23:40,983
is kinda sometimes strange to to find someone

643
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,835
Timer who doesn't just dabble, you know, in

644
00:23:43,835 --> 00:23:46,455
in both, and you're committed to both. And,

645
00:23:46,931 --> 00:23:48,519
so tell tell me a little bit about

646
00:23:48,519 --> 00:23:49,948
your climbing as far as

647
00:23:50,598 --> 00:23:52,746
far as your history and kinda prompted you

648
00:23:52,746 --> 00:23:54,894
by thinking about how you think about some

649
00:23:54,894 --> 00:23:57,360
of the sort of big important in your

650
00:23:57,360 --> 00:23:59,110
mind things that that kind of formed you.

651
00:23:59,364 --> 00:24:01,277
As a climber, But, I mean, where did

652
00:24:01,277 --> 00:24:02,791
you grow up? Like, how how did you

653
00:24:02,791 --> 00:24:03,450
end up

654
00:24:03,907 --> 00:24:07,349
being this climber musician? Yeah. So... Was Till

655
00:24:07,429 --> 00:24:09,586
I was 6, we lived in Massachusetts, and

656
00:24:09,586 --> 00:24:11,264
my dad, even when I was really young

657
00:24:11,264 --> 00:24:12,803
took me on pretty

658
00:24:13,261 --> 00:24:15,989
legit backpack packing trips. Like, really having a

659
00:24:15,989 --> 00:24:18,060
hike and camp out in the white Mountains

660
00:24:18,060 --> 00:24:20,450
of New Hampshire and stuff. And for a

661
00:24:20,450 --> 00:24:22,282
year just to test the waters we moved

662
00:24:22,282 --> 00:24:23,658
to Palo alto, California,

663
00:24:24,129 --> 00:24:26,273
to see if that's what my dad wanted

664
00:24:26,273 --> 00:24:28,020
to... He was teaching at Mit,

665
00:24:28,497 --> 00:24:30,959
and he wound up working for Nasa in

666
00:24:30,959 --> 00:24:33,039
the Bay area. But when we were there

667
00:24:33,039 --> 00:24:34,629
when I was 6, we went to Yosemite,

668
00:24:34,788 --> 00:24:36,457
and my head just exploded.

669
00:24:37,093 --> 00:24:38,444
I said, I got a climb. I got

670
00:24:38,444 --> 00:24:40,448
a climb, and my dad went to the

671
00:24:40,688 --> 00:24:42,682
Yosemite Mountain School and said my son wants

672
00:24:42,682 --> 00:24:44,757
to take a climbing lesson and they said,

673
00:24:44,916 --> 00:24:47,390
no, nobody under 18, and I kept pest...

674
00:24:47,724 --> 00:24:50,516
Him and they finally re and Wayne Mary,

675
00:24:50,675 --> 00:24:52,510
who was with Warren harding on the first

676
00:24:52,510 --> 00:24:54,025
descent of the nose gave me and my

677
00:24:54,025 --> 00:24:56,258
dad climbing lesson. And over there on the

678
00:24:56,418 --> 00:24:59,775
Swan slab, you know, care for. And that

679
00:24:59,775 --> 00:25:02,079
definitely, you know, set the hook.

680
00:25:03,033 --> 00:25:04,940
I dabble as a teenager a little bit,

681
00:25:05,114 --> 00:25:07,345
it. And then when I... In my early

682
00:25:07,345 --> 00:25:08,779
twenties, I started climbing harder.

683
00:25:09,416 --> 00:25:11,249
A little before that, I tried to get

684
00:25:11,249 --> 00:25:13,177
back into it it I didn't know how

685
00:25:13,177 --> 00:25:15,011
to train properly and I was just cranking

686
00:25:15,011 --> 00:25:16,926
out pull ups on door jams and stuff

687
00:25:16,926 --> 00:25:19,239
and got pretty bad tendon night, and I

688
00:25:19,239 --> 00:25:22,030
thought, well, I guess I can't climb and

689
00:25:22,030 --> 00:25:24,358
bm musician, but I just didn't know how

690
00:25:24,358 --> 00:25:26,592
to... I mean, there wasn't that information wasn't

691
00:25:26,592 --> 00:25:28,926
available back then. And that's been

692
00:25:29,623 --> 00:25:32,276
obviously a constant source attention in my

693
00:25:32,747 --> 00:25:34,042
you know, for the last

694
00:25:34,577 --> 00:25:37,440
40 years, you know, the a broken finger

695
00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:38,554
is climbing twice,

696
00:25:40,558 --> 00:25:43,424
yeah. On 8 climbing falls, both times randomly.

697
00:25:44,141 --> 00:25:46,689
I broke my ankle sport climbing and as

698
00:25:46,689 --> 00:25:48,612
a pedal steel plan, you know, your feet

699
00:25:48,612 --> 00:25:49,406
are really important.

700
00:25:50,120 --> 00:25:52,423
And just, you know, all of finger tweaks

701
00:25:52,423 --> 00:25:54,726
and stuff, which to an regular person wouldn't

702
00:25:54,726 --> 00:25:56,650
be a big deal or you know, that's

703
00:25:56,650 --> 00:25:57,367
definitely a thing.

704
00:25:58,402 --> 00:26:00,553
But, you know, growing up outside the Bay

705
00:26:00,712 --> 00:26:03,659
Area, I started climbing in the valley in

706
00:26:03,659 --> 00:26:06,468
my twenties, you And you know, kinda each

707
00:26:06,468 --> 00:26:08,865
thing is like a gateway drug, your tread

708
00:26:08,865 --> 00:26:09,265
connie,

709
00:26:09,744 --> 00:26:12,301
then your big wall climbing, and then your

710
00:26:12,301 --> 00:26:16,167
ice icon, then optimism and then feel like

711
00:26:16,942 --> 00:26:18,058
Alpine climbing is both.

712
00:26:18,695 --> 00:26:20,449
I've been able to bring everything I've learned

713
00:26:20,449 --> 00:26:22,616
over the years from these their disciplines to

714
00:26:22,616 --> 00:26:24,929
to climbing. And then it just kinda plays

715
00:26:24,929 --> 00:26:27,401
my natural strengths. I've never been a strong

716
00:26:27,401 --> 00:26:30,112
finger guy. I can train them a bit

717
00:26:30,112 --> 00:26:32,833
and get their better, but it's not great

718
00:26:32,833 --> 00:26:34,685
for my fingers either just to be whale

719
00:26:34,742 --> 00:26:36,571
away at the gym 5 days a week.

720
00:26:36,809 --> 00:26:39,116
But, yeah, It's been cool. It's been, no,

721
00:26:39,687 --> 00:26:41,271
back in the day, when I was a

722
00:26:41,271 --> 00:26:43,648
touring musician, I'm mostly doing recording work these

723
00:26:43,648 --> 00:26:46,634
days. The country tours would wind up, usually

724
00:26:46,753 --> 00:26:48,658
around mid December for the year, and you'd

725
00:26:48,658 --> 00:26:49,927
have, like, a month and a half or

726
00:26:49,927 --> 00:26:50,562
2 months off.

727
00:26:51,196 --> 00:26:53,418
And they would encourage you to collect unemployment.

728
00:26:53,577 --> 00:26:55,418
Your tour manager and say, yeah, Good the

729
00:26:55,418 --> 00:26:57,009
obviously call it redneck retainer.

730
00:26:59,397 --> 00:27:02,421
Right? So the big tours would actually give

731
00:27:02,421 --> 00:27:04,824
you a retainer year round but out you

732
00:27:04,824 --> 00:27:07,138
know, the average tours, you know. So you

733
00:27:07,138 --> 00:27:08,973
go out and collect unemployment and then I

734
00:27:08,973 --> 00:27:10,410
drive out West for a month and a

735
00:27:10,410 --> 00:27:13,135
half, and Ice icon and colorado, auto and

736
00:27:13,135 --> 00:27:14,960
then go to the southwest or wherever,

737
00:27:15,595 --> 00:27:18,690
you know, man do love the desert towers,

738
00:27:18,928 --> 00:27:20,277
you know, done a bunch of that over

739
00:27:20,277 --> 00:27:22,361
the years. Auto it's also led me to

740
00:27:22,361 --> 00:27:23,876
do, like, a lot of stuff in the

741
00:27:23,876 --> 00:27:25,870
winter where normally you wouldn't do it, you

742
00:27:25,870 --> 00:27:26,029
know,

743
00:27:26,827 --> 00:27:28,661
did Devil's tower in the winter 1 year,

744
00:27:28,820 --> 00:27:30,198
like, first week of February.

745
00:27:30,654 --> 00:27:32,102
But definitely off season.

746
00:27:32,580 --> 00:27:33,239
And then

747
00:27:33,933 --> 00:27:36,718
did that for years, and then now married

748
00:27:36,718 --> 00:27:37,514
with a kid.

749
00:27:37,991 --> 00:27:39,503
It's harder to get, like,

750
00:27:40,474 --> 00:27:42,627
Hey, Honey. I'm gonna take 12 days off

751
00:27:42,627 --> 00:27:44,382
and gone a climbing trip and not making

752
00:27:44,382 --> 00:27:46,455
bunch of money we need and risk my

753
00:27:46,455 --> 00:27:48,289
life on a big frozen mountain and while

754
00:27:48,289 --> 00:27:50,399
you're here with a kid by yourself. Off

755
00:27:50,537 --> 00:27:52,850
and my career that makes the money. Yeah.

756
00:27:53,728 --> 00:27:56,200
Exactly. But what's been cool now is I

757
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:58,295
usually get called to fill in for somebody

758
00:27:58,433 --> 00:28:00,840
once a year in the summer for a

759
00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:02,752
few shows out west or suns even just

760
00:28:02,752 --> 00:28:04,743
a show. And then I'll tack on a

761
00:28:04,743 --> 00:28:06,018
bit of a climb onto to the end

762
00:28:06,018 --> 00:28:08,806
of that. So it's been pretty cool like,

763
00:28:09,125 --> 00:28:10,757
summer I went out to do the Ac

764
00:28:10,976 --> 00:28:13,850
awards in Vegas with Rod Atkins 1 year,

765
00:28:14,009 --> 00:28:15,366
And so I got there a couple days

766
00:28:15,366 --> 00:28:17,522
early and did some stuff in Red rock

767
00:28:17,522 --> 00:28:19,768
canyon and, you know, Dark. Shadows and stuff

768
00:28:19,768 --> 00:28:22,313
like that classics like that. I was touring

769
00:28:22,313 --> 00:28:24,699
the the big British since pop Band,

770
00:28:25,670 --> 00:28:27,509
and we were over in England for a

771
00:28:27,509 --> 00:28:29,110
while, and I managed to do some grit

772
00:28:29,110 --> 00:28:31,590
stone climbing with somebody I've, like, connected with.

773
00:28:31,990 --> 00:28:34,243
People have always been super cool, Like, kinda

774
00:28:34,243 --> 00:28:36,312
go into the local climbing shop and ask

775
00:28:36,312 --> 00:28:36,551
around,

776
00:28:37,188 --> 00:28:38,939
and people will take you out. I was

777
00:28:38,939 --> 00:28:39,758
in Stockholm,

778
00:28:40,372 --> 00:28:41,248
with Pam Till,

779
00:28:41,805 --> 00:28:43,966
just and went into the climbing shop and

780
00:28:43,966 --> 00:28:45,158
somebody took me boulder.

781
00:28:45,635 --> 00:28:47,463
It's been like that, you know, over the

782
00:28:47,463 --> 00:28:49,505
years more recently. I was out West this

783
00:28:49,624 --> 00:28:52,014
last summer filling in with this guy, Stephen

784
00:28:52,094 --> 00:28:53,688
Wilson Junior. Who's amazing.

785
00:28:54,405 --> 00:28:54,644
And,

786
00:28:55,759 --> 00:28:56,636
went and solo

787
00:28:57,034 --> 00:28:59,345
El dorado peak in the North Cascade in

788
00:28:59,345 --> 00:29:01,348
slack just kind of a fun, you know,

789
00:29:01,587 --> 00:29:02,382
non technical,

790
00:29:02,860 --> 00:29:03,598
mountain near

791
00:29:04,053 --> 00:29:04,371
John,

792
00:29:06,614 --> 00:29:09,012
year before did Lizard head with my... 1

793
00:29:09,012 --> 00:29:11,009
of my oldest client partners. I was out,

794
00:29:12,288 --> 00:29:14,685
doing some shows with this girl Jesse James

795
00:29:14,845 --> 00:29:18,311
Decker. And my buddy, Rob H and Duran

796
00:29:19,166 --> 00:29:21,239
met up with him. And I was just

797
00:29:21,239 --> 00:29:23,232
been... Went from sea level the day before

798
00:29:23,232 --> 00:29:25,555
to 13000 feet that day. That's always been

799
00:29:25,555 --> 00:29:27,623
a challenge too. You're, like, in the middle

800
00:29:27,623 --> 00:29:28,260
of a tour,

801
00:29:29,294 --> 00:29:30,169
not in shape.

802
00:29:30,805 --> 00:29:32,819
Else hungover over and still try to get

803
00:29:32,819 --> 00:29:34,099
up something good. You know?

804
00:29:35,940 --> 00:29:36,179
Yeah.

805
00:29:37,220 --> 00:29:38,440
Yeah. I mean, it's it's

806
00:29:38,753 --> 00:29:40,425
think it's pretty cool and not and and

807
00:29:40,425 --> 00:29:42,119
again, I sort of follow your

808
00:29:42,893 --> 00:29:46,315
your socials and and interact and I don't

809
00:29:46,315 --> 00:29:48,717
know. I was kinda wondering about... I this

810
00:29:48,717 --> 00:29:50,226
sort of side man thing,

811
00:29:51,020 --> 00:29:53,085
you know, this this person who's on every...

812
00:29:53,244 --> 00:29:55,230
It seems like you're on everybody's speed dial,

813
00:29:55,865 --> 00:29:56,603
to have

814
00:29:56,993 --> 00:29:59,387
to to bring in to to to play

815
00:29:59,387 --> 00:30:02,099
on their album. So that speaks to 2

816
00:30:02,099 --> 00:30:03,716
things in my mind talent

817
00:30:04,186 --> 00:30:05,932
because they can count on you to to

818
00:30:05,932 --> 00:30:08,153
do a good spot on whatever they're recording,

819
00:30:09,184 --> 00:30:10,770
and also your... You know, you have these

820
00:30:10,770 --> 00:30:12,776
per... Do chops, so they can count on

821
00:30:12,776 --> 00:30:14,290
that. And you know what you're doing. You...

822
00:30:14,529 --> 00:30:16,361
I'm sure you walk in, get it done

823
00:30:16,361 --> 00:30:18,272
and walk out, like, you know, Eddie van

824
00:30:18,432 --> 00:30:19,706
Hale un beat it or whatever.

825
00:30:20,199 --> 00:30:22,421
But then there's gotta be this, like,

826
00:30:23,612 --> 00:30:25,914
you seem like... Yeah. You're all good. You're

827
00:30:25,914 --> 00:30:27,580
you're, like, yeah I'll do it, and and

828
00:30:27,660 --> 00:30:28,612
I'll I'll I'll...

829
00:30:29,342 --> 00:30:31,410
You know, promote you, and I'll... You know,

830
00:30:31,569 --> 00:30:33,318
you're always like, yeah, This guy's amazing and

831
00:30:33,318 --> 00:30:35,067
this guy's amazing. So you you bring this,

832
00:30:35,146 --> 00:30:37,867
like, really good positive energy. I started to

833
00:30:37,867 --> 00:30:40,259
think about how that probably plays into your

834
00:30:40,259 --> 00:30:42,252
being a good climbing partner as well? Like,

835
00:30:42,491 --> 00:30:43,767
do you ever think of sort of the

836
00:30:43,767 --> 00:30:45,521
crossover of, like, who you are as a...

837
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:47,872
And as a person and why you bring

838
00:30:48,251 --> 00:30:50,009
these certain things to the table that have

839
00:30:50,009 --> 00:30:52,086
made you successful kind of on both ends

840
00:30:52,086 --> 00:30:52,565
of things.

841
00:30:53,138 --> 00:30:55,046
Well, I think the common thread there would

842
00:30:55,046 --> 00:30:56,818
be just grit and

843
00:30:57,272 --> 00:30:57,908
determination. Like,

844
00:30:58,782 --> 00:31:00,849
I've never been that strong of a free

845
00:31:00,849 --> 00:31:03,328
climber, but I've gotten up... A lot of

846
00:31:03,328 --> 00:31:05,395
pretty cool stuff over the years. You know?

847
00:31:05,633 --> 00:31:07,143
Right. And it's the same thing. I feel

848
00:31:07,143 --> 00:31:08,971
like some of the people I work with

849
00:31:08,971 --> 00:31:10,719
musically have more natural,

850
00:31:11,769 --> 00:31:13,525
gifts, more natural talent,

851
00:31:14,164 --> 00:31:16,181
but, just, you know, just

852
00:31:17,198 --> 00:31:20,630
busting your ass and paying attention and never

853
00:31:20,630 --> 00:31:22,241
giving up up, you know, go a long

854
00:31:22,241 --> 00:31:24,234
way for both these pursuits. You know?

855
00:31:25,989 --> 00:31:28,084
You know, there's tension between the 2 Ira

856
00:31:28,142 --> 00:31:30,710
out touring with kid rock and up I

857
00:31:30,710 --> 00:31:33,269
mean, I think you can imagine what that

858
00:31:33,269 --> 00:31:35,029
tour would be like. And I was trying

859
00:31:35,029 --> 00:31:37,109
to trade because I had an opportunity we

860
00:31:37,109 --> 00:31:38,549
had, like, 2 weeks off, and I was

861
00:31:38,549 --> 00:31:39,509
gonna go to peru.

862
00:31:40,085 --> 00:31:41,838
To the Court Blanca and try to climb

863
00:31:41,838 --> 00:31:44,469
him there. And I remember we're playing the

864
00:31:44,549 --> 00:31:46,144
Big Jones Beach Amp theater,

865
00:31:46,702 --> 00:31:48,536
and I like I'm out, like, you know,

866
00:31:48,775 --> 00:31:50,784
to all day trying to run as far

867
00:31:50,784 --> 00:31:52,299
as I can just to get in shape,

868
00:31:52,459 --> 00:31:53,517
you know, And

869
00:31:54,293 --> 00:31:56,526
I headed to prove. Actually, I... Just as

870
00:31:56,526 --> 00:31:58,281
a traveling partner, I grabbed the guy who

871
00:31:58,281 --> 00:31:58,815
shot the

872
00:31:59,253 --> 00:32:00,690
For us on that tour because there was

873
00:32:00,690 --> 00:32:01,328
a lot of, you know,

874
00:32:02,126 --> 00:32:05,079
huge p on that tour. That was 2003

875
00:32:05,079 --> 00:32:06,196
2004

876
00:32:06,196 --> 00:32:07,800
kind of I kid rocks Heyday.

877
00:32:08,514 --> 00:32:10,418
He had had that single with Cheryl Crow

878
00:32:10,418 --> 00:32:12,084
just a year or 2 before, and he

879
00:32:12,084 --> 00:32:12,560
was, like,

880
00:32:13,924 --> 00:32:15,282
Hitting it. He was 1 of the world's

881
00:32:15,282 --> 00:32:16,721
biggest rock bands at the time.

882
00:32:17,359 --> 00:32:17,519
And,

883
00:32:18,877 --> 00:32:20,315
yeah. I mean, I probably I can't tell

884
00:32:20,315 --> 00:32:22,086
some of those have to take those to

885
00:32:22,086 --> 00:32:24,321
the grave, but, you know, he's definitely holding

886
00:32:24,321 --> 00:32:26,316
the torch for this, you know, big rock

887
00:32:26,316 --> 00:32:27,513
tours, booze blow,

888
00:32:28,151 --> 00:32:30,481
pills, Bro porn star stripper. I mean, all

889
00:32:30,481 --> 00:32:32,956
that shit. So trying to train for, you

890
00:32:32,956 --> 00:32:35,670
know, a mountain nearing an Alpine trip. But

891
00:32:35,670 --> 00:32:37,666
sure, shit. We got down there and

892
00:32:38,545 --> 00:32:40,234
4 It was cool. I noticed that the

893
00:32:40,234 --> 00:32:41,988
duty free shop. They had 2 for 1

894
00:32:41,988 --> 00:32:43,822
with Jack Daniels and I thought, you know,

895
00:32:44,061 --> 00:32:44,699
this would be good.

896
00:32:45,417 --> 00:32:46,932
But it was just these big jugs. I

897
00:32:46,932 --> 00:32:48,699
was like, god, that's too much, but whatever

898
00:32:48,778 --> 00:32:50,449
I can't pass up the deal, But I

899
00:32:50,449 --> 00:32:52,120
got to high camp and that stuff is

900
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,269
worth it's weighing gold. I mean, they don't

901
00:32:54,269 --> 00:32:55,940
have that peru. You know? So I was

902
00:32:55,940 --> 00:32:57,785
able to trade it for not am and

903
00:32:57,785 --> 00:33:00,194
for other stuff like that. Really And

904
00:33:01,842 --> 00:33:02,002
Yeah.

905
00:33:03,434 --> 00:33:06,076
I mean, word After leaving Nashville. I was,

906
00:33:06,236 --> 00:33:06,475
you know,

907
00:33:07,271 --> 00:33:09,422
on top of a 19000 foot peak, so

908
00:33:09,422 --> 00:33:10,458
that was amazing.

909
00:33:11,414 --> 00:33:13,619
Who are you climbing with just the deposit

910
00:33:13,739 --> 00:33:14,137
Ir guy.

911
00:33:15,330 --> 00:33:17,716
He actually made it near the top of

912
00:33:17,716 --> 00:33:19,546
1 of the mountains, but it got a

913
00:33:19,546 --> 00:33:21,376
little technical and he waited for me while.

914
00:33:21,614 --> 00:33:23,694
So like... Ir I saw it an easy

915
00:33:23,694 --> 00:33:25,598
1 and then climbed that another 1 with

916
00:33:25,598 --> 00:33:27,265
him, and then... There was a a rage

917
00:33:27,265 --> 00:33:29,193
that I was pretty sure was un climbed

918
00:33:29,962 --> 00:33:32,366
on Ur as Day. I think it's, like,

919
00:33:32,845 --> 00:33:35,160
18000 in change. And I found a guy

920
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:37,315
who wanted to decline it. And that morning,

921
00:33:37,475 --> 00:33:38,513
I went to go get him to go

922
00:33:38,513 --> 00:33:40,520
up there, and he was gust the left

923
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:42,584
a notes, hey he was gonna solo something

924
00:33:42,584 --> 00:33:45,044
else. I was super pissed. I was walking

925
00:33:45,044 --> 00:33:46,789
back to my 10. I ran 3 guys

926
00:33:46,789 --> 00:33:48,670
from Salt Lake City. I was, like, on

927
00:33:49,028 --> 00:33:50,782
wanna go up and try this thing, and

928
00:33:50,782 --> 00:33:53,573
this guy Jason foot, strong climb too, man

929
00:33:53,573 --> 00:33:55,110
it's good because it wound up being

930
00:33:55,567 --> 00:33:57,321
pretty in your face and pretty good.

931
00:33:58,213 --> 00:34:01,504
Serious mixed, you know, steep mix con at

932
00:34:01,642 --> 00:34:02,838
18000 and plus,

933
00:34:03,795 --> 00:34:05,151
and he had been in country for a

934
00:34:05,151 --> 00:34:06,028
while, and

935
00:34:06,586 --> 00:34:08,197
we did the first descent just right off

936
00:34:08,197 --> 00:34:09,074
the bat like that.

937
00:34:11,068 --> 00:34:12,902
I've been something on my website about it.

938
00:34:13,062 --> 00:34:14,976
In, like, 2 or 3 years later. I

939
00:34:14,976 --> 00:34:17,804
felt bad. Some climber from the north used

940
00:34:17,940 --> 00:34:18,735
ain't gonna... He,

941
00:34:19,452 --> 00:34:21,463
him and his partner had scoped the line

942
00:34:21,759 --> 00:34:23,588
and gotten money from their client in club.

943
00:34:23,827 --> 00:34:26,157
And what down there, and they had climbed

944
00:34:26,157 --> 00:34:27,835
it, and they got packet. And he saw

945
00:34:27,835 --> 00:34:30,152
this, like, several year old account of it

946
00:34:30,152 --> 00:34:31,030
on my website.

947
00:34:32,404 --> 00:34:32,564
Alright.

948
00:34:33,283 --> 00:34:34,082
Oops sorry.

949
00:34:35,041 --> 00:34:36,480
I should written it up in the American

950
00:34:36,799 --> 00:34:37,439
Alpine journal.

951
00:34:38,717 --> 00:34:40,795
That... Yeah. That's that's pretty funny. Yes.

952
00:34:42,407 --> 00:34:44,163
Especially too It's like, yeah, You're big your

953
00:34:44,163 --> 00:34:46,398
big thing. I just like, you know, took

954
00:34:46,398 --> 00:34:48,632
a few days off from this giant tour

955
00:34:48,632 --> 00:34:51,199
and set set your pledge project. That's cool.

956
00:34:52,076 --> 00:34:52,554
Awkward.

957
00:34:54,625 --> 00:34:56,617
You know, the 2 world's colliding kind of

958
00:34:56,617 --> 00:34:59,269
thing that it's kinda interesting to me too

959
00:34:59,269 --> 00:35:00,869
because, you know, us climber,

960
00:35:01,589 --> 00:35:03,269
you know, the more you dip into kinda

961
00:35:03,269 --> 00:35:04,764
quote unquote real life, you

962
00:35:05,284 --> 00:35:07,125
I mean, with me, I decide I decide

963
00:35:07,125 --> 00:35:08,964
not to really talk about it too much

964
00:35:08,964 --> 00:35:10,885
with people who don't climb, like, I have

965
00:35:10,885 --> 00:35:12,324
to because they're like, oh, I heard you

966
00:35:12,324 --> 00:35:14,576
a climber like, have you seen free solo,

967
00:35:14,735 --> 00:35:16,410
you know, that that whole conversation.

968
00:35:17,127 --> 00:35:18,961
I tended like just kinda stay away from

969
00:35:18,961 --> 00:35:21,593
it as much as I can. And I

970
00:35:21,593 --> 00:35:22,571
think it'd be pretty

971
00:35:22,964 --> 00:35:25,520
interesting like, you know, you resumed to that

972
00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:27,757
tour, presumably right? Because you said he had

973
00:35:27,757 --> 00:35:29,435
2 weeks off. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, like,

974
00:35:29,769 --> 00:35:31,367
I mean, do you ever... Do you talk

975
00:35:31,367 --> 00:35:33,445
to the folks that you run into in

976
00:35:33,445 --> 00:35:35,522
in your world in the music world about

977
00:35:35,522 --> 00:35:36,960
this thing or do they know?

978
00:35:37,694 --> 00:35:39,210
Or is it like, kind of... Is it

979
00:35:39,210 --> 00:35:40,269
kinda like a parts

980
00:35:40,806 --> 00:35:42,641
situation where you you... You know, you put

981
00:35:42,641 --> 00:35:45,195
your glasses back on and and your you

982
00:35:45,195 --> 00:35:45,355
know,

983
00:35:46,007 --> 00:35:47,678
kinda slip back into the other world.

984
00:35:48,315 --> 00:35:48,951
I... You know,

985
00:35:49,746 --> 00:35:51,497
obviously, something Probably thought I was just, like,

986
00:35:51,894 --> 00:35:53,905
hiking or o you go to Machu p

987
00:35:53,905 --> 00:35:55,025
picchu, you know Right.

988
00:35:57,344 --> 00:35:59,744
I've I've been friends for many years with

989
00:35:59,905 --> 00:36:02,790
Mary Brock. On and, you know, yosemite Fame

990
00:36:02,869 --> 00:36:05,021
And Sure. She told me if she sent

991
00:36:05,021 --> 00:36:07,411
some climbing pictures of her to her mom

992
00:36:07,411 --> 00:36:09,802
of his elderly Japanese woman. And she would

993
00:36:09,802 --> 00:36:11,114
hold them sideways.

994
00:36:14,449 --> 00:36:15,109
She didn't

995
00:36:15,488 --> 00:36:18,125
believe or understand somebody could be, you know,

996
00:36:18,539 --> 00:36:20,929
cleaning up like that. Right. But I think

997
00:36:20,929 --> 00:36:23,161
it was shortly after peru, was playing,

998
00:36:23,957 --> 00:36:26,702
red rocks, you know, the icon Venue

999
00:36:27,154 --> 00:36:29,612
with Kid rock. And, 1 of my climber

1000
00:36:29,612 --> 00:36:31,833
buddies who lives in Lead came out to

1001
00:36:31,833 --> 00:36:32,333
hang

1002
00:36:32,704 --> 00:36:32,943
and

1003
00:36:33,735 --> 00:36:36,293
Sonic There's boulders all around outside the venue,

1004
00:36:36,690 --> 00:36:39,471
and there signs everywhere saying 10000 dollar fine

1005
00:36:39,471 --> 00:36:41,617
for climbing on the rocks. So, of course,

1006
00:36:41,775 --> 00:36:42,331
we climb on.

1007
00:36:43,063 --> 00:36:44,578
Many of the boulders as we find.

1008
00:36:46,333 --> 00:36:48,806
You're yeah. I'm a Vip. But yeah. Holding

1009
00:36:48,806 --> 00:36:50,560
me a alone. Show my Ama. You know,

1010
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:51,756
if they try to arrest me.

1011
00:36:52,729 --> 00:36:53,687
I'm I'm with the band.

1012
00:36:54,884 --> 00:36:56,800
Yeah. That's that's cool. So let me ask

1013
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:58,875
about the the, you know, the early days

1014
00:36:58,875 --> 00:37:00,951
of B musician. You mentioned something a moment

1015
00:37:00,951 --> 00:37:03,520
ago about. Like that... Even when you started

1016
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,394
climbing, you were already a musician. And did

1017
00:37:06,394 --> 00:37:08,869
you already have sort of dreams of that

1018
00:37:08,869 --> 00:37:10,840
as a career as something that you would

1019
00:37:10,959 --> 00:37:13,498
you would pursue pursue at that level. Because

1020
00:37:13,498 --> 00:37:15,403
plenty of climber, you know, like myself, we

1021
00:37:15,403 --> 00:37:17,387
play guitar. We str around the fire and

1022
00:37:17,387 --> 00:37:19,789
everything else, and It sounds like you were

1023
00:37:20,028 --> 00:37:21,860
pretty serious about it even in your early

1024
00:37:21,860 --> 00:37:24,250
twenties about pursuing it as a professional. But...

1025
00:37:24,410 --> 00:37:27,198
Yeah, Tell me about that path. Yeah. I

1026
00:37:27,198 --> 00:37:29,996
kinda dabble it. A teenager, and they got

1027
00:37:29,996 --> 00:37:31,369
serious when I was 20

1028
00:37:31,744 --> 00:37:34,047
or so. But I I think kinda what

1029
00:37:34,047 --> 00:37:37,320
you alluded to before. It's, with also with

1030
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:40,184
climbing just kind of never even believing that

1031
00:37:40,343 --> 00:37:41,854
I could achieve any of the stuff that

1032
00:37:42,014 --> 00:37:44,175
I've achieved both, you know, I never thought

1033
00:37:44,175 --> 00:37:46,475
a cl Capita, you know, when I was

1034
00:37:46,475 --> 00:37:47,530
in youngster.

1035
00:37:48,061 --> 00:37:49,648
And, you know, I never thought... I just...

1036
00:37:49,886 --> 00:37:51,971
I thought, Man Could make a living playing

1037
00:37:51,971 --> 00:37:54,123
music just playing shitty bars or whatever. That

1038
00:37:54,123 --> 00:37:56,038
would be incredible. You know? I mean, that

1039
00:37:56,038 --> 00:37:58,271
was kind of my first goal. And then

1040
00:37:58,350 --> 00:38:00,517
I could think kind of, like, with... Climbing,

1041
00:38:00,597 --> 00:38:02,369
you keep achieving goals and

1042
00:38:02,823 --> 00:38:03,323
either

1043
00:38:03,936 --> 00:38:05,606
they aren't as great as you thought they

1044
00:38:05,606 --> 00:38:07,434
were gonna be or you just kind of

1045
00:38:07,434 --> 00:38:08,865
naturally want the next thing. So,

1046
00:38:10,074 --> 00:38:12,974
I started playing Blue grass hearing Jerry Douglas

1047
00:38:13,034 --> 00:38:13,275
at

1048
00:38:13,914 --> 00:38:16,875
strawberry music festival is a music festival right

1049
00:38:16,875 --> 00:38:17,755
outside Yosemite.

1050
00:38:18,407 --> 00:38:20,076
And I was there when I was maybe

1051
00:38:20,076 --> 00:38:22,380
21 or something. And I have been playing

1052
00:38:22,380 --> 00:38:24,606
a lot of Robert Johnson style Delta blues,

1053
00:38:24,765 --> 00:38:26,605
you know, with a slide on my finger.

1054
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:27,318
And,

1055
00:38:28,348 --> 00:38:29,616
I was there at my girlfriend at the

1056
00:38:29,616 --> 00:38:31,834
time when we heard in the campground, and

1057
00:38:31,834 --> 00:38:32,413
we heard

1058
00:38:33,119 --> 00:38:34,316
coming from the stage. And we're were like,

1059
00:38:34,396 --> 00:38:35,992
whoa, what is that? We got down there,

1060
00:38:36,471 --> 00:38:38,706
and it was Jerry Douglas Playing Do, and

1061
00:38:38,706 --> 00:38:40,941
that just... My head just exploded. You know,

1062
00:38:41,100 --> 00:38:42,710
I was like, that's what I wanna do.

1063
00:38:43,745 --> 00:38:45,418
So I spent the next few years trying

1064
00:38:45,418 --> 00:38:46,613
to be Jerry Douglas,

1065
00:38:47,648 --> 00:38:50,053
then stop realistically holistically, I spend the next

1066
00:38:50,053 --> 00:38:51,806
few years trying to really get away from

1067
00:38:51,806 --> 00:38:54,514
that because there's already somebody that's, you know,

1068
00:38:54,673 --> 00:38:56,505
nobody's gonna be him at his own game.

1069
00:38:56,983 --> 00:38:58,984
But moved to a few years later to

1070
00:38:58,984 --> 00:39:01,681
play Blue grass do. That was my goal.

1071
00:39:02,078 --> 00:39:04,616
And the first person I met upon moving

1072
00:39:04,616 --> 00:39:06,618
to Nashville Nashville. That was June 94. So

1073
00:39:06,698 --> 00:39:08,844
I'm coming up on 30 years now. Hard

1074
00:39:08,844 --> 00:39:11,150
to believe. It's been that long. It was

1075
00:39:11,150 --> 00:39:13,472
a steel guitar player named Steve Hatch super

1076
00:39:13,472 --> 00:39:14,668
cool guy. He's still around.

1077
00:39:16,103 --> 00:39:17,698
And he talked me into getting a pedal

1078
00:39:17,698 --> 00:39:17,937
deal.

1079
00:39:18,735 --> 00:39:21,206
So I don't know if how many people

1080
00:39:21,206 --> 00:39:22,897
out there Knicks the nomenclature,

1081
00:39:23,695 --> 00:39:25,531
sometimes people even in the industry, you get

1082
00:39:25,531 --> 00:39:28,165
the nomenclature kinda bundled. The difference between a

1083
00:39:28,165 --> 00:39:30,855
dough... Do is basically like a guitar, oh

1084
00:39:30,974 --> 00:39:32,034
with a metal res,

1085
00:39:32,812 --> 00:39:33,952
but you play it

1086
00:39:34,330 --> 00:39:36,728
flat on your lap with a bar on

1087
00:39:36,728 --> 00:39:39,145
the strings instead of your left hand fingers

1088
00:39:39,460 --> 00:39:41,057
and then usually picks on your right hand.

1089
00:39:41,297 --> 00:39:44,094
It has that cool twang sliding sound. Maybe

1090
00:39:44,174 --> 00:39:46,731
I can demonstrate? Yeah. Demonstrate. Let's see what

1091
00:39:46,731 --> 00:39:49,324
it sounds like dude this mike, and And

1092
00:39:49,541 --> 00:39:52,094
we did we did for for that behind

1093
00:39:52,094 --> 00:39:53,450
the scenes, we did try to set up,

1094
00:39:53,530 --> 00:39:56,161
like, really special mic and stuff here, but...

1095
00:39:56,321 --> 00:39:58,177
Yeah. Then it didn't work because apparently

1096
00:39:58,649 --> 00:40:00,583
Smith doesn't know how to deal with Mike

1097
00:40:00,959 --> 00:40:02,654
for 30 years and but been.

1098
00:40:03,348 --> 00:40:04,384
A lot. That sounds great.

1099
00:40:21,005 --> 00:40:21,884
I'm not warmed out.

1100
00:40:26,767 --> 00:40:29,875
And then has contrast. Good. Everyone loves the

1101
00:40:29,875 --> 00:40:31,787
sound of a dover. Like everyone. I'm getting

1102
00:40:31,787 --> 00:40:34,655
this insurance free too it's a amazing part.

1103
00:40:35,228 --> 00:40:35,944
And then

1104
00:40:37,137 --> 00:40:38,115
pedal steel

1105
00:40:38,729 --> 00:40:39,206
definitely...

1106
00:40:39,604 --> 00:40:40,104
It's

1107
00:40:40,480 --> 00:40:41,992
more of a love, hey. I think most

1108
00:40:41,992 --> 00:40:44,402
people look of it. But pedal steel oh,

1109
00:40:44,562 --> 00:40:46,960
yeah. So, I'm wrong with you. People... Just...

1110
00:40:47,199 --> 00:40:48,398
I think it sounds too country.

1111
00:40:49,996 --> 00:40:50,396
You know,

1112
00:40:51,275 --> 00:40:51,329
love

1113
00:41:03,298 --> 00:41:04,037
But then

1114
00:41:04,493 --> 00:41:07,384
to stay modern and current in Nashville,

1115
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:09,527
there's so much of it's really pop you

1116
00:41:09,527 --> 00:41:09,686
know,

1117
00:41:17,319 --> 00:41:18,693
kinda crazier as

1118
00:41:22,670 --> 00:41:24,423
And then, you know, more raw stuff.

1119
00:41:37,557 --> 00:41:38,057
So

1120
00:41:38,672 --> 00:41:40,423
hunter like some old dudes that would like,

1121
00:41:40,981 --> 00:41:42,150
shoot you for putting to

1122
00:41:43,938 --> 00:41:46,641
For sure. It's, you know. Yeah. Totally.

1123
00:41:47,198 --> 00:41:49,583
Yeah. And, you know, I'm working and those

1124
00:41:49,583 --> 00:41:50,061
guys aren't.

1125
00:41:51,911 --> 00:41:55,264
So, yeah. It's, you know, gotta adapt. So,

1126
00:41:55,423 --> 00:41:57,420
yeah. It takes a certain kind of person

1127
00:41:57,420 --> 00:41:59,176
that can, you know, I guess years of

1128
00:41:59,176 --> 00:42:01,502
big wall climb kind of has helped me

1129
00:42:01,502 --> 00:42:04,368
with the kinda of suffering and patience needed

1130
00:42:04,368 --> 00:42:06,995
to, you, learn pedal steel because... I mean,

1131
00:42:07,154 --> 00:42:09,241
it's a year or setting sitting down every

1132
00:42:09,241 --> 00:42:11,633
day for a few hours before anything sounding

1133
00:42:11,633 --> 00:42:12,989
like music comes out of it.

1134
00:42:13,866 --> 00:42:16,418
So like, the perseverance thing is is well

1135
00:42:16,418 --> 00:42:18,506
because you're pretty sitting I mean, you're pretty

1136
00:42:18,506 --> 00:42:21,297
casually talking about, you know, going to Nashville,

1137
00:42:21,376 --> 00:42:22,731
and I met this guy and then I

1138
00:42:22,731 --> 00:42:25,282
started playing on stuff. And and and obviously,

1139
00:42:25,601 --> 00:42:27,766
you know, to get to a point in

1140
00:42:27,766 --> 00:42:29,539
your career that you are

1141
00:42:30,153 --> 00:42:32,938
is like a... It's like Hollywood. Right? A

1142
00:42:32,938 --> 00:42:35,460
thousand musicians a day show up to to

1143
00:42:35,579 --> 00:42:38,439
to Nashville and and hoping to have happened

1144
00:42:38,439 --> 00:42:40,425
to them what's happened to you. So tell

1145
00:42:40,425 --> 00:42:42,356
me a little bit more about that

1146
00:42:42,809 --> 00:42:45,390
progression, I mean, to luck perseverance

1147
00:42:45,844 --> 00:42:48,069
grit, Like, what were some of the other,

1148
00:42:48,148 --> 00:42:51,407
like, milestones and and moving your career along

1149
00:42:51,407 --> 00:42:52,916
when you're just, you know,

1150
00:42:53,568 --> 00:42:56,440
dragging your your do around Nashville when you

1151
00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:58,274
first got there and and your abs a

1152
00:42:58,274 --> 00:43:01,624
thing. You're absolutely right. Luck perseverance in grit

1153
00:43:01,624 --> 00:43:04,352
totally because... So you know, I just wanted

1154
00:43:04,352 --> 00:43:05,710
to make a living at it when I

1155
00:43:05,710 --> 00:43:07,226
got here. I was like, I don't care

1156
00:43:07,226 --> 00:43:08,983
if I play bars. I would be so

1157
00:43:08,983 --> 00:43:11,218
freaking cool. And then I saw some of

1158
00:43:11,218 --> 00:43:13,628
my friends starting to get some who big

1159
00:43:13,628 --> 00:43:16,019
country gigs with touring gigs with big country

1160
00:43:16,019 --> 00:43:18,809
artists. And I had really just started pedal

1161
00:43:18,809 --> 00:43:19,128
steel,

1162
00:43:19,766 --> 00:43:21,222
maybe a year before

1163
00:43:21,854 --> 00:43:23,453
I got the job with Doug stone, who

1164
00:43:23,453 --> 00:43:25,770
was a really big nineties country star. I

1165
00:43:25,770 --> 00:43:27,848
think his first 15 singles all in the

1166
00:43:27,848 --> 00:43:29,846
top 4. But most of his stuff is

1167
00:43:29,846 --> 00:43:31,619
valid. So I could get a good own.

1168
00:43:31,859 --> 00:43:33,697
I wasn't really a great player by any

1169
00:43:33,697 --> 00:43:36,174
means at all yet. I was terrible, but

1170
00:43:36,334 --> 00:43:38,012
I could get a good tone and playing

1171
00:43:38,012 --> 00:43:38,332
tune.

1172
00:43:38,891 --> 00:43:40,824
And the last guy they had kind of

1173
00:43:40,824 --> 00:43:42,340
a dick, and they thought I seemed like

1174
00:43:42,340 --> 00:43:44,096
a fun guy. I can fool people for

1175
00:43:44,096 --> 00:43:44,814
a little bit. You know.

1176
00:43:46,011 --> 00:43:48,086
So I got a tour with a big

1177
00:43:48,086 --> 00:43:50,497
country artist. And did that for a couple

1178
00:43:50,497 --> 00:43:52,036
years, and then I saw friends

1179
00:43:52,495 --> 00:43:52,995
getting

1180
00:43:53,374 --> 00:43:54,972
few of my friends getting big rock gigs,

1181
00:43:55,132 --> 00:43:57,780
and I was like, you know, after I

1182
00:43:57,780 --> 00:43:59,606
done a bunch country touring, I was like,

1183
00:43:59,765 --> 00:44:01,274
man, that would be so cool. You know,

1184
00:44:01,433 --> 00:44:03,260
and then I got the gig with kid

1185
00:44:03,260 --> 00:44:05,245
rock. You know, kind of in his heyday.

1186
00:44:05,404 --> 00:44:07,565
And I was like, this... Is amazing. You

1187
00:44:07,565 --> 00:44:09,951
know, the fun, kinda check that bucket list.

1188
00:44:10,429 --> 00:44:12,417
And then, some of my friends were getting

1189
00:44:12,417 --> 00:44:14,183
more recording work. This is and,

1190
00:44:14,981 --> 00:44:16,496
man that'd be so cool to play on,

1191
00:44:16,576 --> 00:44:19,288
you know, big country hits or big, you

1192
00:44:19,288 --> 00:44:19,447
know,

1193
00:44:20,245 --> 00:44:22,638
and, managed to play on. I guess, my

1194
00:44:22,638 --> 00:44:23,730
first 1 was

1195
00:44:24,408 --> 00:44:26,004
well, I played on the acoustic version of

1196
00:44:26,004 --> 00:44:28,079
3 wooden crosses for Randy Travis, which was

1197
00:44:28,079 --> 00:44:29,436
a huge huge song.

1198
00:44:30,074 --> 00:44:32,560
But the other 1 was Jason Now the

1199
00:44:32,560 --> 00:44:34,308
first number 1. I had a pretty cool

1200
00:44:34,308 --> 00:44:36,294
lapse deal cell on that. It's called why.

1201
00:44:36,850 --> 00:44:38,837
So, yeah, I was like, okay. Now I'm

1202
00:44:38,837 --> 00:44:40,028
getting more recording work.

1203
00:44:40,759 --> 00:44:42,531
And recording works kind of

1204
00:44:42,985 --> 00:44:45,053
especially later on, you know, your twenties touring

1205
00:44:45,053 --> 00:44:47,359
fun. You're on a bus, having fun, getting

1206
00:44:47,359 --> 00:44:47,836
crazy.

1207
00:44:48,472 --> 00:44:50,324
But musically, it's not very

1208
00:44:51,906 --> 00:44:54,926
rewarding. And, you know, further your musicians ship,

1209
00:44:55,324 --> 00:44:58,239
playing the same 15 songs every night help

1210
00:44:58,359 --> 00:45:00,351
I was on the opening act and the

1211
00:45:00,430 --> 00:45:02,342
Tim mcgraw tour where we played 19 minutes

1212
00:45:02,342 --> 00:45:04,971
a day, and then just sit around 23

1213
00:45:04,971 --> 00:45:06,423
and a half. Half hours a day on

1214
00:45:06,423 --> 00:45:09,220
the tour bus. They drove me crazy. So,

1215
00:45:09,300 --> 00:45:11,617
you know, staying in town, playing on recordings,

1216
00:45:12,016 --> 00:45:14,505
playing all the time, half way better for

1217
00:45:14,505 --> 00:45:16,732
your musicians ship and probably your health to,

1218
00:45:16,811 --> 00:45:18,959
you know, that touring lifestyle. I think,

1219
00:45:19,993 --> 00:45:22,399
you know, The stories are all true. I

1220
00:45:22,399 --> 00:45:23,994
guess I would go there and insane.

1221
00:45:24,952 --> 00:45:26,786
Well, Yeah. Let me ask you about that

1222
00:45:26,786 --> 00:45:28,461
because it... You know, was something I talked

1223
00:45:28,461 --> 00:45:30,157
to Alexis K about

1224
00:45:30,789 --> 00:45:32,860
same kind of interview about, you know, climbing,

1225
00:45:32,940 --> 00:45:34,215
but I wanted to just talk to her

1226
00:45:34,215 --> 00:45:35,489
about about music,

1227
00:45:36,127 --> 00:45:38,692
Lexus from sleigh bells and And you know,

1228
00:45:38,852 --> 00:45:40,128
we talk a little bit about that, like,

1229
00:45:40,208 --> 00:45:42,521
the not the clash of the lifestyle too

1230
00:45:42,521 --> 00:45:44,914
and, oh, it sounds like, you know And

1231
00:45:44,914 --> 00:45:46,907
but but also, like, you know, some people

1232
00:45:46,907 --> 00:45:49,396
can go in get into that world and

1233
00:45:49,396 --> 00:45:51,632
and have it swallow them whole, You know,

1234
00:45:51,871 --> 00:45:53,388
if they if they don't have any sort

1235
00:45:53,388 --> 00:45:55,463
of governor on on their ability. Yeah. And

1236
00:45:55,463 --> 00:45:57,514
absolutely I on the ball, as far as

1237
00:45:57,634 --> 00:45:57,871
you know,

1238
00:45:58,586 --> 00:46:00,253
playing, but also as far as, you know,

1239
00:46:00,332 --> 00:46:02,158
if you wanna... Like I said, you're training

1240
00:46:02,158 --> 00:46:03,983
for Peru with on the kid rock tour.

1241
00:46:04,222 --> 00:46:05,889
So tell me a little bit about your

1242
00:46:05,889 --> 00:46:08,844
thoughts about, that and maybe your personality is

1243
00:46:08,844 --> 00:46:10,831
just such that you can you can keep

1244
00:46:10,831 --> 00:46:12,262
it, you know, you can keep it a

1245
00:46:12,262 --> 00:46:14,488
little bit under control or or what. And

1246
00:46:14,727 --> 00:46:16,173
I'm sure you've seen plenty of people will

1247
00:46:16,173 --> 00:46:17,608
flame out on that stuff as well.

1248
00:46:18,245 --> 00:46:20,715
Yeah. It's... I mean, it's terrible. And, you

1249
00:46:20,715 --> 00:46:21,932
know, seeing

1250
00:46:22,548 --> 00:46:24,718
climber as well lose control as far as,

1251
00:46:24,798 --> 00:46:26,636
you know, substance abuse. But... Yeah, in the

1252
00:46:26,636 --> 00:46:28,314
music industry, of course, it's brutal.

1253
00:46:29,513 --> 00:46:30,013
I

1254
00:46:30,392 --> 00:46:33,123
absolutely do feel like climbing keeps me and

1255
00:46:33,123 --> 00:46:35,757
check as far as tendencies to... You know,

1256
00:46:35,917 --> 00:46:37,514
these days it'll gonna probably just be drinking

1257
00:46:37,514 --> 00:46:38,631
too much. And

1258
00:46:39,270 --> 00:46:40,867
you know, but in the past, all kinds

1259
00:46:40,867 --> 00:46:41,585
of other stuff.

1260
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:44,739
I remember, we were on tour

1261
00:46:45,360 --> 00:46:47,039
with this artist and we played... There was

1262
00:46:47,039 --> 00:46:49,440
a big country music festival on Copper Mountain.

1263
00:46:49,853 --> 00:46:50,330
Colorado.

1264
00:46:50,807 --> 00:46:52,952
And we stayed up that night, Jamming and

1265
00:46:52,952 --> 00:46:55,335
partying with this cool with a bunch of

1266
00:46:55,335 --> 00:46:57,640
friends, and I had a date set up

1267
00:46:57,640 --> 00:46:59,883
to climb Just the easy route on the

1268
00:46:59,883 --> 00:47:01,636
third flat iron in the next day. And

1269
00:47:01,795 --> 00:47:04,822
I was so hungover over. I could barely

1270
00:47:04,822 --> 00:47:06,415
stand. It was a relief getting onto the

1271
00:47:06,415 --> 00:47:08,500
route because I could actually you know, hang

1272
00:47:08,500 --> 00:47:09,214
on to something.

1273
00:47:11,914 --> 00:47:14,003
You can use all for all 4 append

1274
00:47:14,615 --> 00:47:15,989
instead of just too. Exactly

1275
00:47:17,157 --> 00:47:18,126
but, Yeah. I mean,

1276
00:47:19,478 --> 00:47:21,467
even partying aside, I would say that it

1277
00:47:21,467 --> 00:47:23,614
probably... There's a chance I would be...

1278
00:47:24,410 --> 00:47:26,259
Yeah a better musician if I hadn't spent

1279
00:47:26,259 --> 00:47:27,956
all the time climbing, and,

1280
00:47:28,333 --> 00:47:29,848
obviously, it'd be a much better climber if

1281
00:47:29,928 --> 00:47:32,161
I had wasted all the time playing music.

1282
00:47:33,438 --> 00:47:35,769
But I think each has helped to keep

1283
00:47:35,769 --> 00:47:38,329
me sane and healthy too. I feel like

1284
00:47:38,329 --> 00:47:40,089
a lot of my friends in music have

1285
00:47:40,089 --> 00:47:43,449
had tendon issues, carpal tunnel problems and stuff

1286
00:47:43,449 --> 00:47:46,901
like that. And then climbing, obviously, 10 stuff

1287
00:47:46,901 --> 00:47:48,919
is a big deal, but I feel like

1288
00:47:49,617 --> 00:47:52,663
they're so different. They actually... Have helped prevent

1289
00:47:52,663 --> 00:47:54,254
me from having problems with a lot of

1290
00:47:54,254 --> 00:47:55,947
that. The way I did it early on

1291
00:47:56,083 --> 00:47:57,277
when I wasn't training. Right?

1292
00:47:58,881 --> 00:48:00,862
But... Yeah, there's... Man, there's so much give

1293
00:48:00,862 --> 00:48:01,655
and take. You know,

1294
00:48:03,081 --> 00:48:05,618
I remember when I broke my foot.

1295
00:48:06,269 --> 00:48:08,269
Sport climbing brought mike Ti and F just

1296
00:48:08,269 --> 00:48:10,670
on a routine fall, just totally regular. Mh.

1297
00:48:10,909 --> 00:48:12,289
I had them leave enough tow

1298
00:48:12,670 --> 00:48:14,121
sticking out of the cap so I could

1299
00:48:14,121 --> 00:48:15,869
press on the pedals on my stealing tire,

1300
00:48:16,028 --> 00:48:16,846
so I wouldn't

1301
00:48:17,696 --> 00:48:18,729
miss any work.

1302
00:48:19,444 --> 00:48:20,001
Right. And man,

1303
00:48:20,875 --> 00:48:21,851
I broke a finger

1304
00:48:22,639 --> 00:48:24,877
just traversing under a roof on a simple

1305
00:48:24,877 --> 00:48:25,596
aid pitch

1306
00:48:26,076 --> 00:48:27,055
in North Carolina.

1307
00:48:27,594 --> 00:48:29,193
I popped a piece trying to go quickly,

1308
00:48:29,352 --> 00:48:31,371
and my other hand was through a cara,

1309
00:48:32,164 --> 00:48:34,972
and it broke my peak, like, badly.

1310
00:48:35,586 --> 00:48:36,064
And

1311
00:48:36,780 --> 00:48:39,168
I had them make the cast kind of

1312
00:48:39,168 --> 00:48:40,853
thing to wear... Was sticking up a bit

1313
00:48:40,853 --> 00:48:42,763
so I could still play steel guitar.

1314
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,070
I wouldn't miss any dates on my tour,

1315
00:48:45,309 --> 00:48:45,468
but,

1316
00:48:46,900 --> 00:48:49,536
or Yeah. Those kind of things really kinda

1317
00:48:49,536 --> 00:48:50,966
put the fear of God into you and

1318
00:48:50,966 --> 00:48:53,190
make... It's made me, you know, question whether

1319
00:48:53,190 --> 00:48:55,572
it's being an idiot climbing, you know, over

1320
00:48:55,572 --> 00:48:58,295
the years since... You know, music is, of

1321
00:48:58,295 --> 00:48:59,491
course, my passion,

1322
00:49:00,129 --> 00:49:02,362
but also my bread and butter. I was

1323
00:49:02,362 --> 00:49:04,197
up in Canada doing the show with Pam

1324
00:49:04,277 --> 00:49:06,031
Till us about 4 or 5 years ago.

1325
00:49:06,764 --> 00:49:07,083
And

1326
00:49:07,722 --> 00:49:10,275
went and climb the East ridge Mount temple,

1327
00:49:10,514 --> 00:49:12,030
the Canadian classic.

1328
00:49:12,508 --> 00:49:14,594
It's a really long out. And by the

1329
00:49:14,594 --> 00:49:16,343
time we got up and into the black

1330
00:49:16,343 --> 00:49:18,409
towers near the top, a storm had come

1331
00:49:18,409 --> 00:49:19,521
in. And

1332
00:49:20,474 --> 00:49:22,161
I was at a hang be delay. My

1333
00:49:22,161 --> 00:49:23,834
partner was around the corner, and I got

1334
00:49:23,834 --> 00:49:24,630
hit by lightning,

1335
00:49:25,427 --> 00:49:27,976
and just wall. I I don't know if

1336
00:49:27,976 --> 00:49:29,739
his drain or not, but I got wall

1337
00:49:29,898 --> 00:49:32,200
I was days out of my mind. And

1338
00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:34,900
then for another 45 minutes or so, had

1339
00:49:34,900 --> 00:49:36,884
it just kinda sit there at this exposed

1340
00:49:36,884 --> 00:49:37,695
hanging b they,

1341
00:49:38,575 --> 00:49:40,815
well lying and kept crashing down all around

1342
00:49:40,815 --> 00:49:41,615
me and

1343
00:49:42,255 --> 00:49:44,414
kinda of mentally apologize and into my...

1344
00:49:45,055 --> 00:49:47,542
They sons for not being around for them

1345
00:49:47,542 --> 00:49:49,776
the rest of their lives, you know, we

1346
00:49:49,776 --> 00:49:51,530
managed to hit the summit and the dis

1347
00:49:51,530 --> 00:49:54,003
sandwich is normally just a couple hour john

1348
00:49:54,003 --> 00:49:56,493
down, and why out conditions took a lot

1349
00:49:56,493 --> 00:49:58,831
longer. And I woke up the next morning

1350
00:49:58,890 --> 00:50:00,829
and my fingertips were

1351
00:50:01,607 --> 00:50:04,735
painful and ting and it really bad not

1352
00:50:04,735 --> 00:50:06,724
great way. I guess they were frost and

1353
00:50:06,724 --> 00:50:08,235
for about a month or 2, it's really

1354
00:50:08,235 --> 00:50:09,110
hard to play guitar.

1355
00:50:09,906 --> 00:50:11,992
Most of my work these days basis on

1356
00:50:11,992 --> 00:50:14,407
steel guitar and no and lapse deal. So

1357
00:50:14,545 --> 00:50:16,380
it didn't affect me too much, but that

1358
00:50:16,380 --> 00:50:17,279
was a real

1359
00:50:18,454 --> 00:50:21,657
basis between almost dying and, freezing my fingers.

1360
00:50:21,896 --> 00:50:22,295
It was like,

1361
00:50:24,526 --> 00:50:25,026
so

1362
00:50:25,482 --> 00:50:27,643
maybe not going... Quite as hard in Alpine

1363
00:50:27,643 --> 00:50:29,788
endeavors as Used to. Yeah. But I mean,

1364
00:50:29,947 --> 00:50:32,329
the thing that's interesting I think about, you

1365
00:50:32,329 --> 00:50:34,570
know, your career and climbing and I... You

1366
00:50:34,570 --> 00:50:36,090
know, we parallel each other you're a little

1367
00:50:36,090 --> 00:50:36,730
older than me.

1368
00:50:37,610 --> 00:50:40,010
You started earlier. But nevertheless I mean, climbing,

1369
00:50:40,170 --> 00:50:43,003
you know, for all of its... You old

1370
00:50:43,139 --> 00:50:45,125
adventure, things, like, it's become so much more

1371
00:50:45,125 --> 00:50:47,112
accessible and, like, a person like yourself with

1372
00:50:47,112 --> 00:50:49,018
a career and a and in a family

1373
00:50:49,018 --> 00:50:49,630
and a

1374
00:50:50,069 --> 00:50:52,069
all the things that go with being older

1375
00:50:52,069 --> 00:50:54,309
and having a a proper life with all

1376
00:50:54,309 --> 00:50:56,549
the pressures and things. Like, climbing is more

1377
00:50:56,549 --> 00:50:59,121
accessible for us now. Like, you know, you're

1378
00:50:59,121 --> 00:51:00,956
in the age too or there was no

1379
00:51:00,956 --> 00:51:03,189
sport climbing when you start climbing. There were

1380
00:51:03,189 --> 00:51:05,263
no climbing gyms. Yeah. And so it's like,

1381
00:51:05,502 --> 00:51:07,815
you can, like, you can't you can have

1382
00:51:07,815 --> 00:51:09,743
time I'm now to go and dabble and

1383
00:51:09,743 --> 00:51:11,098
you don't have to risk your life because

1384
00:51:11,098 --> 00:51:13,250
that's the other thing about pre sport climbing

1385
00:51:13,250 --> 00:51:15,402
is, like, not all tread climbing is dangerous,

1386
00:51:15,641 --> 00:51:17,407
but If you're an ab... If you're an

1387
00:51:17,407 --> 00:51:19,475
avid climber in the late seventies and and

1388
00:51:19,475 --> 00:51:19,793
eighties,

1389
00:51:20,510 --> 00:51:22,658
you know, danger was sort of part of

1390
00:51:22,658 --> 00:51:24,670
the game. And it doesn't really have to

1391
00:51:24,670 --> 00:51:26,110
be, I mean, I know you broke your

1392
00:51:26,110 --> 00:51:29,469
your your foot and leg, sport climbing, but,

1393
00:51:29,630 --> 00:51:32,202
you know, it's interesting how we... We've... You

1394
00:51:32,202 --> 00:51:33,550
know, it fits into our lives a little

1395
00:51:33,550 --> 00:51:34,820
bit better because I'm the same way. I

1396
00:51:34,820 --> 00:51:36,804
mean, Don't have this, like, massive music career,

1397
00:51:36,963 --> 00:51:38,311
but I got the family and the whole

1398
00:51:38,311 --> 00:51:39,129
thing. So

1399
00:51:39,597 --> 00:51:41,028
is just kinda cool that we can still

1400
00:51:41,028 --> 00:51:41,766
be climber

1401
00:51:42,300 --> 00:51:44,231
without, you know, these temple

1402
00:51:44,765 --> 00:51:46,832
kind of adventures and stuff, stuff like that.

1403
00:51:47,403 --> 00:51:48,909
Yeah. And when you're younger and you have

1404
00:51:48,909 --> 00:51:49,623
a close call,

1405
00:51:50,574 --> 00:51:53,030
solo or ice climbing or in the mountains,

1406
00:51:53,189 --> 00:51:55,030
You know, it's all stuff that I... Used

1407
00:51:55,030 --> 00:51:56,170
to do lots of

1408
00:51:56,550 --> 00:51:57,829
when you're younger and you have a close

1409
00:51:57,829 --> 00:51:59,510
call. You're like, oh, shit. That was an

1410
00:51:59,510 --> 00:52:02,309
gnarly man. Got fucked up and kinda laughing

1411
00:52:02,309 --> 00:52:03,269
about this kind of, like,

1412
00:52:04,084 --> 00:52:06,641
into the spice of the adventure. Your older,

1413
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:08,638
like, shit, man. I've already used up 10

1414
00:52:08,638 --> 00:52:11,135
of my non lives, you know, this is

1415
00:52:11,275 --> 00:52:14,078
added kinda not great. But Man, it's hard

1416
00:52:14,078 --> 00:52:15,751
to it's hard to put it down. You

1417
00:52:15,751 --> 00:52:15,831
know,

1418
00:52:17,026 --> 00:52:18,794
you have, you know, I was out you

1419
00:52:18,794 --> 00:52:20,700
know, like I said, 2 2 years ago

1420
00:52:20,700 --> 00:52:22,686
I was out West playing some guitar for

1421
00:52:22,765 --> 00:52:24,989
Jesse James Decker and went did lizard head

1422
00:52:24,989 --> 00:52:27,624
with my buddy. I mean, that's probably. Good

1423
00:52:27,624 --> 00:52:29,925
level of adventure for me right now. You

1424
00:52:29,925 --> 00:52:32,226
know, this shit loads a loose rock and

1425
00:52:32,226 --> 00:52:35,204
exposure, but, you know, pretty. A greasy.

1426
00:52:36,144 --> 00:52:38,964
Yeah. It's totally that's... It's... Yeah. Yeah. That's

1427
00:52:39,184 --> 00:52:40,944
is that thing is kinda wild. It's like,

1428
00:52:41,344 --> 00:52:43,079
just poking up out of that ridge and

1429
00:52:43,119 --> 00:52:44,630
it's not even that tall, but it looks

1430
00:52:44,630 --> 00:52:46,938
like like gigantic from a distance. So... Yeah.

1431
00:52:47,097 --> 00:52:49,005
I'm that summit exposure is pretty rad. You're

1432
00:52:49,005 --> 00:52:50,533
like, well yeah. Son.

1433
00:52:52,208 --> 00:52:54,122
Well, a couple of other line of questioning.

1434
00:52:54,282 --> 00:52:56,356
So you... You know, you... You were this

1435
00:52:56,675 --> 00:52:59,807
this West Coast climber to begin with Yosemite

1436
00:53:00,680 --> 00:53:01,800
all the other things out there.

1437
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:03,719
And then you... You know, not only did

1438
00:53:03,719 --> 00:53:05,340
you want a new music scene

1439
00:53:05,640 --> 00:53:07,160
because you wanted to move to Nashville where

1440
00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:09,079
it was all happening and where you could

1441
00:53:09,079 --> 00:53:11,480
pursue the blue grass style and then got

1442
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:12,751
into country and all that sort of thing.

1443
00:53:12,909 --> 00:53:13,409
But

1444
00:53:14,021 --> 00:53:16,029
you also, you moved into a different climbing

1445
00:53:16,085 --> 00:53:18,070
community in a different climbing vibe, and and

1446
00:53:18,149 --> 00:53:20,231
I think just like everything else, it feels

1447
00:53:20,231 --> 00:53:23,015
sort of global now. Right? Climbing. But but

1448
00:53:23,015 --> 00:53:25,083
there were like, the further back you go,

1449
00:53:25,242 --> 00:53:26,833
the more click scene,

1450
00:53:27,563 --> 00:53:30,423
kinda different, you know, gunk boulder,

1451
00:53:30,821 --> 00:53:32,569
you know, the Southeast. We're all...

1452
00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:35,985
In Yosemite in Southeast were kind of, like,

1453
00:53:36,477 --> 00:53:38,702
miles apart as as far as thought process

1454
00:53:38,702 --> 00:53:40,689
and also finding climber to climb with. I

1455
00:53:40,689 --> 00:53:43,232
think, you know, it was definitely more in

1456
00:53:43,232 --> 00:53:44,765
these how how haul

1457
00:53:45,553 --> 00:53:47,568
you know, guys creeping around in these haul

1458
00:53:47,626 --> 00:53:49,300
without really telling anything about it. So tell

1459
00:53:49,300 --> 00:53:50,655
me a little bit about moving there as

1460
00:53:50,655 --> 00:53:53,047
a climber and, you know, you're pursuing this

1461
00:53:53,047 --> 00:53:53,547
this

1462
00:53:54,017 --> 00:53:56,720
music things super hard, but also wanting to

1463
00:53:56,720 --> 00:53:59,208
climb. So did the did did it... The

1464
00:53:59,423 --> 00:54:02,205
integration go well and and found people to

1465
00:54:02,205 --> 00:54:02,841
climb. Well.

1466
00:54:03,492 --> 00:54:05,800
Actually, I stopped climbing for a year and

1467
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:07,550
a half when I first moved to Nashville.

1468
00:54:07,789 --> 00:54:08,664
It was 94.

1469
00:54:09,221 --> 00:54:11,130
I had had... I got caught by a

1470
00:54:11,130 --> 00:54:12,165
storm solo.

1471
00:54:12,817 --> 00:54:14,889
Leading tower in Yosemite,

1472
00:54:15,527 --> 00:54:17,360
and it was pretty grim. I, you know,

1473
00:54:17,679 --> 00:54:19,193
obviously made it, but it was not great.

1474
00:54:19,352 --> 00:54:20,800
A bunch of bling people had to get

1475
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:22,789
rescued off walls in that storm,

1476
00:54:23,584 --> 00:54:25,413
but I made it down. And there was,

1477
00:54:25,493 --> 00:54:27,083
like, a couple of other things like that

1478
00:54:27,083 --> 00:54:29,087
that made me just kinda like, I don't

1479
00:54:29,087 --> 00:54:29,326
know.

1480
00:54:30,041 --> 00:54:31,235
So when I got to town, I thought,

1481
00:54:31,394 --> 00:54:32,905
you know, look, I should be more serious

1482
00:54:32,905 --> 00:54:33,223
about it,

1483
00:54:34,416 --> 00:54:35,132
about music.

1484
00:54:35,944 --> 00:54:37,939
I'll take, like, a... I'll just stop. And

1485
00:54:38,099 --> 00:54:39,456
I made it like a year year and

1486
00:54:39,456 --> 00:54:41,291
a half, and I was, like, I'm miserable.

1487
00:54:41,531 --> 00:54:43,447
So started getting back on it,

1488
00:54:44,244 --> 00:54:45,238
and There was a

1489
00:54:45,614 --> 00:54:47,765
rock gym down in Franklin, and the classic

1490
00:54:47,765 --> 00:54:49,757
rock jim, Bruce Hi was the owner and

1491
00:54:49,757 --> 00:54:51,431
there was kind of a cool bunch of

1492
00:54:51,431 --> 00:54:53,833
guy. And and a girl, his daughter who

1493
00:54:53,833 --> 00:54:55,983
would climbed there, the regulars. And it was

1494
00:54:55,983 --> 00:54:57,336
fun to hang out with those folks.

1495
00:54:58,211 --> 00:54:59,619
Kirk G, he was 1 of the guys

1496
00:54:59,739 --> 00:55:00,929
he's wound up putting a lot of the

1497
00:55:00,929 --> 00:55:02,993
hard first to sense up at Tennessee wall

1498
00:55:02,993 --> 00:55:05,136
and stuff over the last 15 years, and

1499
00:55:05,215 --> 00:55:06,565
I wound up doing a bunch of trips

1500
00:55:06,565 --> 00:55:07,517
out west with him.

1501
00:55:08,470 --> 00:55:10,231
He's hitting a lot of the 50 classics.

1502
00:55:10,469 --> 00:55:12,318
We even did, like, Ship rock and

1503
00:55:13,247 --> 00:55:15,152
but also some more adventurous stuff. We did

1504
00:55:15,152 --> 00:55:16,898
a first to sentence zion and stuff,

1505
00:55:17,629 --> 00:55:20,840
yeah, there... There was no a basically in

1506
00:55:21,457 --> 00:55:23,452
Nashville that at least none that I knew

1507
00:55:23,452 --> 00:55:25,206
of Mark Kart wright had done some good

1508
00:55:25,206 --> 00:55:28,652
stuff and maybe Jamie Dial, our Il is

1509
00:55:28,652 --> 00:55:30,828
kind of a legendary guy in the Southeast

1510
00:55:30,886 --> 00:55:31,786
and super

1511
00:55:32,163 --> 00:55:34,478
great guy. It's been an awesome friend for

1512
00:55:34,478 --> 00:55:34,717
years.

1513
00:55:35,755 --> 00:55:38,001
Ar you know, he dabble, but he's just

1514
00:55:38,001 --> 00:55:40,153
a wicked and strong rock climber and still

1515
00:55:40,153 --> 00:55:41,190
it is in his sixties.

1516
00:55:42,306 --> 00:55:44,313
But... Yeah. It was different. I mean, My

1517
00:55:44,313 --> 00:55:46,385
I love is the long the long climbs,

1518
00:55:46,545 --> 00:55:48,537
you know, kind of yosemite stuff,

1519
00:55:49,573 --> 00:55:51,940
Alpine stuff, big wall stuff. And so Now

1520
00:55:52,059 --> 00:55:53,980
the cl in the southeast is amazing, but,

1521
00:55:54,059 --> 00:55:56,319
you know, a hundred feet less basically.

1522
00:55:56,619 --> 00:55:58,699
Yeah. I don't know. There's again. There's... You

1523
00:55:58,699 --> 00:56:01,273
may be dismissing it. Is luck or whatever.

1524
00:56:01,353 --> 00:56:03,271
But there's... Again, I think there's something about

1525
00:56:03,271 --> 00:56:05,928
you as as a person that probably

1526
00:56:06,307 --> 00:56:08,635
draws people to you again as someone they

1527
00:56:08,635 --> 00:56:09,984
want in their band or or they want

1528
00:56:09,984 --> 00:56:11,492
on their album, but also as a partner.

1529
00:56:12,762 --> 00:56:14,509
And let's focus on the climbing part of

1530
00:56:14,509 --> 00:56:16,175
it, Like, what is it do you think?

1531
00:56:16,414 --> 00:56:19,054
I mean, You've ever thought about, like, what

1532
00:56:19,054 --> 00:56:20,566
do you bring to the team so to

1533
00:56:20,566 --> 00:56:22,317
speak. As a question I ask a lot

1534
00:56:22,317 --> 00:56:22,794
of people.

1535
00:56:23,510 --> 00:56:23,909
Well,

1536
00:56:25,515 --> 00:56:27,822
yeah. It gotta have fun, man. Gotta have

1537
00:56:27,822 --> 00:56:30,288
fun. Always. I can be prone and things

1538
00:56:30,288 --> 00:56:31,958
get a little grim to whine a little

1539
00:56:31,958 --> 00:56:33,254
bit, and I've tried to

1540
00:56:33,882 --> 00:56:35,394
my music career and my...

1541
00:56:38,100 --> 00:56:40,248
So I, you know, always try to keep

1542
00:56:40,248 --> 00:56:41,840
an eye out for that. I remember

1543
00:56:42,715 --> 00:56:45,696
both maybe 10 years ago climbed Mount Watkins

1544
00:56:46,389 --> 00:56:46,628
with

1545
00:56:47,264 --> 00:56:50,223
Keith Robinson, and this young girl, Anna, bath,

1546
00:56:50,382 --> 00:56:52,397
who you probably, you know, She's went down.

1547
00:56:53,093 --> 00:56:55,086
She was pretty green man. Right? And he's,

1548
00:56:55,165 --> 00:56:56,680
like, did my friend come, Should we go

1549
00:56:56,680 --> 00:56:59,084
awesome and she I she led 1 page,

1550
00:56:59,244 --> 00:57:01,152
but it was just kinda a little... Too

1551
00:57:01,152 --> 00:57:03,619
much too soon for her. And I'm telling

1552
00:57:03,619 --> 00:57:04,971
this because it's a good story, but I'll

1553
00:57:04,971 --> 00:57:06,505
get... The lining part in a second.

1554
00:57:07,144 --> 00:57:09,625
The third day, I lead off from the

1555
00:57:09,625 --> 00:57:12,505
be from the vi, and, she ours up,

1556
00:57:12,664 --> 00:57:14,824
and we're both at this hanging blade 3

1557
00:57:14,824 --> 00:57:16,032
out and feet off the ground,

1558
00:57:16,667 --> 00:57:19,288
and, Keith is taking down camp, and he's

1559
00:57:19,288 --> 00:57:20,876
gonna have to clean my aid pitch. So

1560
00:57:20,876 --> 00:57:22,703
it's it's gonna take a minute. And I

1561
00:57:22,703 --> 00:57:25,026
felt my myself stomach grow. And, I mean,

1562
00:57:25,105 --> 00:57:26,936
we're just, like, hanging off these bolts hip

1563
00:57:26,936 --> 00:57:29,881
to hip with this, you know, sweet little

1564
00:57:29,881 --> 00:57:31,018
20 year old girl

1565
00:57:31,409 --> 00:57:32,603
I looked at her as was, like, hi.

1566
00:57:32,922 --> 00:57:34,595
I'm sorry. She's like, what? And I just

1567
00:57:34,595 --> 00:57:36,608
had to, like, drop trial

1568
00:57:36,984 --> 00:57:37,723
and just

1569
00:57:38,259 --> 00:57:40,824
exploded and, like, coded 80. And need to

1570
00:57:40,824 --> 00:57:41,783
rock below us.

1571
00:57:42,422 --> 00:57:45,079
Fortunately, the pitch was pretty diagonal,

1572
00:57:45,699 --> 00:57:47,936
so Keith didn't get any of it. But

1573
00:57:47,936 --> 00:57:49,110
then, you know, we just had to hate

1574
00:57:49,309 --> 00:57:51,540
out there for another 45 minutes. While the

1575
00:57:51,540 --> 00:57:54,408
sun started baking in. I remember were she

1576
00:57:54,408 --> 00:57:56,161
tore open 1 of her Lara bars and

1577
00:57:56,161 --> 00:57:58,153
was, like, sniffing it, you know,

1578
00:57:58,870 --> 00:57:59,005
I

1579
00:58:00,724 --> 00:58:02,724
But like everybody does on watkins ins, we

1580
00:58:02,724 --> 00:58:04,884
ran out of water, and we got to

1581
00:58:04,884 --> 00:58:07,525
the top that night in very dry.

1582
00:58:08,019 --> 00:58:10,257
Par in the next day, next morning had

1583
00:58:10,257 --> 00:58:12,434
to hike out, and I probably said something

1584
00:58:12,654 --> 00:58:14,891
1 too many times it has. Like, Smith,

1585
00:58:15,051 --> 00:58:15,930
we're all Thirsty.

1586
00:58:20,945 --> 00:58:22,533
That reminded me just shut the hell up.

1587
00:58:24,216 --> 00:58:25,012
That's a good 1.

1588
00:58:25,807 --> 00:58:25,966
Yeah.

1589
00:58:26,762 --> 00:58:28,989
So... But so, yeah. I mean, know, in

1590
00:58:28,989 --> 00:58:30,912
the 30 years I've been in Nashville of

1591
00:58:30,912 --> 00:58:33,055
it's just been finding excuses to go out

1592
00:58:33,055 --> 00:58:35,539
west or to Canada or wherever

1593
00:58:36,229 --> 00:58:38,372
and climb. I went 1 time This is

1594
00:58:38,372 --> 00:58:39,739
pretty good And I went thought down to

1595
00:58:39,900 --> 00:58:42,219
Mexico to climb those big volcanoes down there,

1596
00:58:42,699 --> 00:58:43,199
and

1597
00:58:43,980 --> 00:58:44,619
came back...

1598
00:58:45,099 --> 00:58:47,752
This is, you know, pre down cell phone

1599
00:58:47,752 --> 00:58:50,147
era, and I got back and my answering...

1600
00:58:50,467 --> 00:58:52,702
I phoned into my answering machine. That's how

1601
00:58:52,702 --> 00:58:54,219
old this is to get my messages.

1602
00:58:54,777 --> 00:58:57,027
And the manager of this artist I was

1603
00:58:57,027 --> 00:58:59,021
playing with this is freaking out. We're playing

1604
00:58:59,021 --> 00:59:01,653
the Rosie O'donnell show tomorrow morning. Where are

1605
00:59:01,653 --> 00:59:03,328
you? And that was, like a huge talk

1606
00:59:03,328 --> 00:59:05,880
show back then in the late nineties. And,

1607
00:59:07,009 --> 00:59:08,677
they bought a ticket for me, like that

1608
00:59:08,677 --> 00:59:10,584
minute for me to fly in New York.

1609
00:59:11,061 --> 00:59:13,699
All I had to wear was this whether

1610
00:59:13,859 --> 00:59:16,177
I bought on in Mexico city for 2

1611
00:59:16,177 --> 00:59:16,576
dollars.

1612
00:59:17,455 --> 00:59:19,213
Worn on this big Tv show,

1613
00:59:20,172 --> 00:59:21,771
because it was literally like the day after

1614
00:59:21,771 --> 00:59:22,570
getting back. So...

1615
00:59:24,020 --> 00:59:26,251
Yeah. It's always been kinda of fun like

1616
00:59:26,251 --> 00:59:26,410
that.

1617
00:59:27,685 --> 00:59:29,039
I got a chance to play out in

1618
00:59:29,119 --> 00:59:31,530
Switzerland on with this wellington Danny Lee, like,

1619
00:59:31,609 --> 00:59:33,769
right around in the late nineties. And the

1620
00:59:33,769 --> 00:59:35,210
band was all friends of mine. They took

1621
00:59:35,210 --> 00:59:36,809
all my gear back home with them, and

1622
00:59:36,889 --> 00:59:39,623
I went up to Grindelwald and The root

1623
00:59:39,623 --> 00:59:42,095
on the munch next to the Ig and

1624
00:59:42,095 --> 00:59:44,967
then went to mont blanc, down to Cha

1625
00:59:44,967 --> 00:59:46,322
and saw that a root on the north

1626
00:59:46,322 --> 00:59:47,040
face triangle.

1627
00:59:47,439 --> 00:59:49,010
So it's been a lot of just use

1628
00:59:49,288 --> 00:59:51,038
music to get out to wherever the cool

1629
00:59:51,038 --> 00:59:52,867
climbing is and then do something fun.

1630
00:59:53,981 --> 00:59:55,572
Yeah. That's a mate... I mean it's like

1631
00:59:55,572 --> 00:59:57,822
sounded. A lot, like, when I started, and

1632
00:59:57,902 --> 00:59:59,820
I said, oh yeah, he's, like, slowly, but

1633
00:59:59,820 --> 01:00:02,637
surely, you know, played on 20000

1634
01:00:03,576 --> 01:00:05,750
country songs, and it's, like, Yeah. The... It

1635
01:00:05,750 --> 01:00:07,510
sounds like your climbing career is the same.

1636
01:00:07,750 --> 01:00:10,250
Like you've just slowly, but surely kinda climbed

1637
01:00:10,309 --> 01:00:11,349
everywhere. It's Yeah.

1638
01:00:12,070 --> 01:00:13,349
Yes. It's they're good. You know,

1639
01:00:14,243 --> 01:00:15,538
first to set in Alaska,

1640
01:00:16,230 --> 01:00:17,979
some other stuff like that. And, you know,

1641
01:00:18,138 --> 01:00:19,648
with you, let's say, just when you look

1642
01:00:19,648 --> 01:00:21,817
back on it, you know, you've had Andre

1643
01:00:22,192 --> 01:00:25,074
Sharma, you know, I love the mark twice

1644
01:00:25,074 --> 01:00:27,387
stuff, you know. Yeah. Of course. Yeah. He's

1645
01:00:27,387 --> 01:00:30,018
a big fan of his. That era. Yeah.

1646
01:00:30,577 --> 01:00:30,816
Yeah.

1647
01:00:32,012 --> 01:00:32,251
Of course.

1648
01:00:33,143 --> 01:00:35,217
Climbing for... You don't go climbing for fun.

1649
01:00:35,377 --> 01:00:37,131
You go climbing to, like, you know,

1650
01:00:38,248 --> 01:00:40,322
destroy your inner world or whatever all.

1651
01:00:41,199 --> 01:00:43,918
But it's very, you know, why affirming when

1652
01:00:43,918 --> 01:00:46,716
you... You, when you go hard. So mh.

1653
01:00:47,246 --> 01:00:48,989
So let me ask you then about your

1654
01:00:48,989 --> 01:00:51,152
own creativity. It's know, I've been talking about

1655
01:00:51,152 --> 01:00:52,909
you as a side man as this as

1656
01:00:52,909 --> 01:00:54,904
this guy who, you know, is this ace

1657
01:00:54,904 --> 01:00:57,139
in the hole to get get some some

1658
01:00:57,139 --> 01:00:59,135
do bro or some laps steel on there.

1659
01:00:59,295 --> 01:01:01,146
You or some pedal steel rather on their

1660
01:01:01,465 --> 01:01:03,381
album and stuff like that. Where do you

1661
01:01:03,381 --> 01:01:06,096
express your own creativity as far as, are

1662
01:01:06,096 --> 01:01:07,772
you a Song as well? I know you're...

1663
01:01:08,171 --> 01:01:08,730
You probably...

1664
01:01:09,223 --> 01:01:10,896
Do it a lot in your own production,

1665
01:01:11,773 --> 01:01:13,844
because you've been producing bands as well. So

1666
01:01:13,844 --> 01:01:15,597
tell me a little bit about expressing that,

1667
01:01:16,410 --> 01:01:17,929
and, obviously, I mean you play a solo

1668
01:01:17,929 --> 01:01:19,530
on a on a on an album that's

1669
01:01:19,530 --> 01:01:21,530
yours. You know, you... That came out of

1670
01:01:21,530 --> 01:01:23,690
you. So, talk a little bit about that.

1671
01:01:24,103 --> 01:01:24,817
I think it's like,

1672
01:01:25,611 --> 01:01:27,754
you know, there's those people who wanna be

1673
01:01:27,754 --> 01:01:30,532
the front man super famous guy and and

1674
01:01:30,532 --> 01:01:30,929
those that...

1675
01:01:31,819 --> 01:01:33,815
Really don't you know, and wanna express their

1676
01:01:33,815 --> 01:01:36,369
creativity elsewhere. So tell me about your own

1677
01:01:36,369 --> 01:01:39,084
creativity. Well, it's... How you express it? It's

1678
01:01:39,084 --> 01:01:40,840
a bit h by the fact that I'm

1679
01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:42,370
in. Awful singer.

1680
01:01:44,283 --> 01:01:47,072
Yeah. Me. But 2 of my favorite artists

1681
01:01:47,072 --> 01:01:49,559
are awful singers, Neil Young and bob dylan

1682
01:01:49,559 --> 01:01:52,119
are terrible singers. But they're also amazing singers.

1683
01:01:52,360 --> 01:01:54,360
Right? Because they were able to find their

1684
01:01:54,360 --> 01:01:56,599
voice and just really sing from the heart.

1685
01:01:57,160 --> 01:01:57,640
I

1686
01:01:58,134 --> 01:02:00,049
Man, I've just been so busy doing other

1687
01:02:00,049 --> 01:02:02,523
people's music. I was working on some solace

1688
01:02:02,523 --> 01:02:03,582
stuff about

1689
01:02:04,040 --> 01:02:05,876
10 years ago, and I guess I had

1690
01:02:05,876 --> 01:02:09,813
about 8 songs in various stages of completion

1691
01:02:10,109 --> 01:02:11,302
when my house burned down.

1692
01:02:12,336 --> 01:02:15,414
And I lost it all. And I had

1693
01:02:15,534 --> 01:02:17,125
same... Like, backed up to a couple different

1694
01:02:17,125 --> 01:02:18,875
hard drives, but they're all in that. They

1695
01:02:18,875 --> 01:02:20,227
melted it. Yeah. Right.

1696
01:02:21,579 --> 01:02:23,983
And same both the music community and the

1697
01:02:23,983 --> 01:02:26,533
climate community were amazing when that happened. I

1698
01:02:26,533 --> 01:02:29,003
mean, especially the music world where I just

1699
01:02:29,003 --> 01:02:31,481
know so many. People over the last bunch

1700
01:02:31,481 --> 01:02:32,275
of years, but

1701
01:02:33,069 --> 01:02:35,530
my phone didn't stop ringing, you know, any

1702
01:02:35,530 --> 01:02:37,277
rates you wanna borrow, because, I mean, I

1703
01:02:37,277 --> 01:02:38,968
was at a recording section, so I had

1704
01:02:38,968 --> 01:02:40,326
a few my day to day things, but

1705
01:02:40,486 --> 01:02:41,365
I lost, like, you know,

1706
01:02:42,244 --> 01:02:43,383
20 instruments

1707
01:02:44,001 --> 01:02:46,811
bunch probably 15 Tires, tons of recording gear.

1708
01:02:47,050 --> 01:02:49,443
I mean, the do played my do, I

1709
01:02:49,443 --> 01:02:51,277
played on my first number 1 with, I

1710
01:02:51,277 --> 01:02:53,452
mean, stuff like that. It was really heartbreaking.

1711
01:02:54,388 --> 01:02:56,719
10 and tons of climb mean slides and

1712
01:02:56,719 --> 01:02:59,440
pictures that I didn't have digitized. I really

1713
01:02:59,440 --> 01:03:01,599
bummed about a lot of that too from

1714
01:03:01,599 --> 01:03:03,853
all over the world. You know I But

1715
01:03:03,853 --> 01:03:05,289
the music community is amazing.

1716
01:03:05,847 --> 01:03:08,660
They was, like, go fund me, couple benefit

1717
01:03:08,719 --> 01:03:09,219
concerts,

1718
01:03:10,633 --> 01:03:12,068
even the companies, you know,

1719
01:03:13,106 --> 01:03:13,265
Bmi,

1720
01:03:14,000 --> 01:03:15,299
the musician Union,

1721
01:03:15,599 --> 01:03:16,799
the Grand Aubrey,

1722
01:03:17,279 --> 01:03:19,059
Music care, which is an amazing

1723
01:03:19,519 --> 01:03:22,159
organization, all contributed, like, 5000 dollars.

1724
01:03:22,814 --> 01:03:24,965
Stephen King has a foundation. He doesn't like

1725
01:03:24,965 --> 01:03:27,196
to talk about it or anything, but for

1726
01:03:27,196 --> 01:03:29,347
artists lose their tools. I thought that was

1727
01:03:29,347 --> 01:03:32,385
pretty cool. Yeah. So... And the music... I

1728
01:03:32,385 --> 01:03:34,055
mean, the climb community helped too, you know,

1729
01:03:34,213 --> 01:03:36,758
the local climbing shop Cumberland transit. So, like,

1730
01:03:36,838 --> 01:03:38,587
just come in and buy anything you want

1731
01:03:38,587 --> 01:03:40,430
for half off, just I mean, I lost,

1732
01:03:40,589 --> 01:03:42,575
like, fuck. I don't know. 10000 dollars worth

1733
01:03:42,575 --> 01:03:45,674
of climbing gear, so many, like, extensive aid

1734
01:03:45,674 --> 01:03:48,555
gear, you know, because So many offset cams,

1735
01:03:48,795 --> 01:03:51,506
p pee toms, you know, I mean, tents,

1736
01:03:51,745 --> 01:03:53,819
all the stuff portal alleges everything, you know.

1737
01:03:54,138 --> 01:03:55,813
And Black Diamond helped too. They let me

1738
01:03:55,813 --> 01:03:56,530
do a big order.

1739
01:03:57,264 --> 01:03:57,764
So

1740
01:03:58,383 --> 01:04:00,780
that's awesome. Yeah. Outdoor research, I used to

1741
01:04:00,780 --> 01:04:02,378
do gear testing for them. They send me

1742
01:04:02,378 --> 01:04:04,696
a bunch of stuff. Yep. Yeah. Both amazing

1743
01:04:04,696 --> 01:04:07,265
communities. You know, I told my dad with

1744
01:04:07,265 --> 01:04:08,860
all the help I got, you know, it's

1745
01:04:08,860 --> 01:04:10,695
was like, seeing my funeral without having to

1746
01:04:10,695 --> 01:04:10,934
die.

1747
01:04:11,732 --> 01:04:12,312
You know

1748
01:04:13,088 --> 01:04:14,683
people that you had no idea knew who

1749
01:04:14,683 --> 01:04:16,773
you were or cared or whatever. You know.

1750
01:04:17,013 --> 01:04:19,251
Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah. Nashville is amazing like

1751
01:04:19,251 --> 01:04:21,088
that. I mean, really. It's it's pretty cool.

1752
01:04:21,728 --> 01:04:23,726
Well, that's interesting because, I mean, you then

1753
01:04:23,726 --> 01:04:24,820
you have this whole or

1754
01:04:25,659 --> 01:04:27,357
you have this whole image of it being

1755
01:04:27,735 --> 01:04:29,573
music in general being sort of cut, you

1756
01:04:29,573 --> 01:04:31,171
know? And, like, that... That that's... I mean,

1757
01:04:31,331 --> 01:04:32,864
I'm sure that's probably part of that movie

1758
01:04:32,864 --> 01:04:34,304
you just made or we're just in,

1759
01:04:35,025 --> 01:04:36,065
not you just made it, but you were

1760
01:04:36,065 --> 01:04:38,465
in. I mean, there's probably some theme in

1761
01:04:38,465 --> 01:04:40,545
there about, like, just how cut throat it

1762
01:04:40,545 --> 01:04:41,400
can be. So

1763
01:04:41,838 --> 01:04:43,910
It's goal to hear that deep the trenches,

1764
01:04:44,228 --> 01:04:46,721
maybe it's not, you, among the working kinda

1765
01:04:46,938 --> 01:04:48,771
musicians, it's not it's not so much like

1766
01:04:48,771 --> 01:04:50,785
that. I Absolutely. You hit the nail on

1767
01:04:50,785 --> 01:04:52,465
the head. And I think Nashville is very

1768
01:04:52,465 --> 01:04:53,605
different from La

1769
01:04:53,905 --> 01:04:54,305
also.

1770
01:04:54,704 --> 01:04:56,879
But, yeah, The players usually really try to

1771
01:04:56,879 --> 01:04:58,557
support each time. I mean there's some competition

1772
01:04:58,557 --> 01:04:58,956
for sure.

1773
01:04:59,755 --> 01:05:02,073
Yeah. I mean, definitely so much pie to

1774
01:05:02,073 --> 01:05:02,552
go around.

1775
01:05:03,431 --> 01:05:05,202
Absolutely. You know, and the pot if it

1776
01:05:05,202 --> 01:05:08,150
keeps kinda getting smaller every year. Right. You

1777
01:05:08,150 --> 01:05:09,902
know, there's been, you know,

1778
01:05:11,097 --> 01:05:13,897
new... I keyboard programs and also plug in

1779
01:05:13,897 --> 01:05:16,284
the emulate steel guitar and that's kinda of,

1780
01:05:16,442 --> 01:05:18,034
taking a chunk out of it and then

1781
01:05:18,034 --> 01:05:20,194
has some the music gotten more pop, you

1782
01:05:20,194 --> 01:05:22,737
know, steel guitar over are being feature less.

1783
01:05:23,054 --> 01:05:25,597
And then live band sometimes they run tracks

1784
01:05:25,597 --> 01:05:27,604
instead it's using a guy and that's become

1785
01:05:27,604 --> 01:05:29,678
pretty commonplace in place. But the players here

1786
01:05:29,678 --> 01:05:31,273
are really good to each other, Man. I

1787
01:05:31,273 --> 01:05:32,629
feel like there's a sense that we're all

1788
01:05:32,629 --> 01:05:35,181
kinda in it together and kinda us against

1789
01:05:35,181 --> 01:05:35,681
the

1790
01:05:35,994 --> 01:05:38,795
establishment or the industry that probably helps as

1791
01:05:38,795 --> 01:05:41,114
well. So tell me then, you know, back

1792
01:05:41,114 --> 01:05:43,054
to this creativity thing about this little

1793
01:05:43,529 --> 01:05:45,527
or, I don't know what size it is,

1794
01:05:45,687 --> 01:05:46,007
but

1795
01:05:46,566 --> 01:05:48,564
you know, this... It seems like you have

1796
01:05:48,564 --> 01:05:49,543
some sort of program

1797
01:05:50,242 --> 01:05:52,320
where you you do production, like,

1798
01:05:53,451 --> 01:05:54,641
online and, like, kind of,

1799
01:05:55,355 --> 01:05:57,363
or how how it works. You know, for

1800
01:05:57,419 --> 01:05:59,165
sounds like for up and coming people or

1801
01:05:59,165 --> 01:06:01,641
people who wanna get a good... Court. So

1802
01:06:01,641 --> 01:06:02,911
tell me a little bit about that because

1803
01:06:02,911 --> 01:06:04,737
that sounds like like, kind of a little

1804
01:06:04,737 --> 01:06:05,054
bit of,

1805
01:06:05,769 --> 01:06:07,516
kind of given back to the community so

1806
01:06:07,516 --> 01:06:09,603
to speak and trying to help people

1807
01:06:09,914 --> 01:06:11,752
get their own foot in the door. Yeah.

1808
01:06:11,992 --> 01:06:13,930
Well, so, first of all, people

1809
01:06:14,309 --> 01:06:16,466
started sending me stuff to play on, you

1810
01:06:16,466 --> 01:06:18,554
know, over the inner internet at, email, whatever,

1811
01:06:19,032 --> 01:06:21,341
to play my instruments on. So people from

1812
01:06:21,341 --> 01:06:23,253
around the world that don't have good do

1813
01:06:23,253 --> 01:06:25,402
players or steel guitar players could get a

1814
01:06:25,402 --> 01:06:27,565
national that pro to play on their project.

1815
01:06:28,042 --> 01:06:29,949
And then I started putting together what they

1816
01:06:29,949 --> 01:06:32,652
call a slam session and doing the Smith

1817
01:06:32,652 --> 01:06:32,890
slam,

1818
01:06:34,003 --> 01:06:35,766
doing it pretty much every Friday,

1819
01:06:36,560 --> 01:06:38,545
and I just get a studio. There's, you

1820
01:06:38,545 --> 01:06:39,815
know, 1 or 2 of my favorites that

1821
01:06:39,894 --> 01:06:41,744
I use all the time, and

1822
01:06:42,276 --> 01:06:45,150
hire 5 the other, like, Friday top, you

1823
01:06:45,150 --> 01:06:48,328
know, session players in town, and it'll be

1824
01:06:48,328 --> 01:06:50,632
a... It's, like it's like forrest gum said,

1825
01:06:50,791 --> 01:06:52,301
it's like a box of chocolates. You know,

1826
01:06:52,460 --> 01:06:55,501
we'll have 2 songs that somebody emailed me

1827
01:06:55,501 --> 01:06:57,413
that we just run through, and we record

1828
01:06:57,413 --> 01:06:59,087
them in 30 minutes each.

1829
01:06:59,804 --> 01:07:00,304
And

1830
01:07:01,254 --> 01:07:03,411
any 1 of those could be on the

1831
01:07:03,411 --> 01:07:05,728
radio the next day they also sound because

1832
01:07:05,728 --> 01:07:07,086
it's all the guys playing on the huge

1833
01:07:07,086 --> 01:07:09,256
hits that are in there. Right And like

1834
01:07:09,256 --> 01:07:11,170
the old Moto town, saw many of our

1835
01:07:11,170 --> 01:07:13,723
moto town favorites were recording 15 or 20

1836
01:07:13,723 --> 01:07:15,159
minutes, you know? Right. Yeah.

1837
01:07:16,036 --> 01:07:18,525
You know, I mean, the music's pretty formulaic,

1838
01:07:18,605 --> 01:07:20,125
a lot of time, these players are just

1839
01:07:20,125 --> 01:07:22,284
that good. And most of those guys are

1840
01:07:22,284 --> 01:07:24,764
putting down 2 separate parts, 2 different electric

1841
01:07:24,764 --> 01:07:25,324
guitar parts.

1842
01:07:25,964 --> 01:07:27,811
Acoustic guy might do acoustic guitar and then

1843
01:07:27,971 --> 01:07:30,834
Ban joe or then man in. And, we'll

1844
01:07:30,834 --> 01:07:32,346
run through. Then maybe an artist that I'm

1845
01:07:32,346 --> 01:07:34,353
probably will come in. We might slow things

1846
01:07:34,353 --> 01:07:35,792
down a bit for them and do a

1847
01:07:35,792 --> 01:07:38,509
song or 2, and then, maybe a song

1848
01:07:38,509 --> 01:07:40,268
writer will come in a local song writer

1849
01:07:40,268 --> 01:07:41,866
that wants a good demo of a recording.

1850
01:07:42,346 --> 01:07:44,915
And so just coming knock out anywhere from

1851
01:07:44,915 --> 01:07:47,789
6 to 15 songs in a day. And

1852
01:07:47,789 --> 01:07:49,385
it's been great and people from anywhere in

1853
01:07:49,385 --> 01:07:50,901
the world can just send me a guitar

1854
01:07:50,901 --> 01:07:53,394
vocal, kinda work tape and we'll knock out,

1855
01:07:53,554 --> 01:07:55,474
you know, a big production of it. And

1856
01:07:55,474 --> 01:07:56,994
it doesn't have to be country. We love

1857
01:07:56,994 --> 01:07:59,795
doing another stuff. You know? A very few

1858
01:07:59,795 --> 01:08:03,006
of national musicians grew up listening to in

1859
01:08:03,006 --> 01:08:05,484
playing country music ago. Yeah. What were you

1860
01:08:05,484 --> 01:08:05,643
into?

1861
01:08:06,682 --> 01:08:06,922
Well,

1862
01:08:07,641 --> 01:08:10,688
growing Jimmy Hendrix, some sled evelyn. You know,

1863
01:08:11,007 --> 01:08:11,666
because I

1864
01:08:12,043 --> 01:08:14,273
the first Van Hale record came out right

1865
01:08:14,273 --> 01:08:15,548
before I started playing Guitar.

1866
01:08:16,519 --> 01:08:17,871
Yeah. Me too. Well, I didn't come out,

1867
01:08:17,951 --> 01:08:19,621
but I started playing Guitar because of Van

1868
01:08:19,621 --> 01:08:22,326
hale. Yeah. You you quickly realized is probably

1869
01:08:22,326 --> 01:08:22,882
a mistake.

1870
01:08:23,534 --> 01:08:25,612
Ain't never gonna... You ain't no. Yeah. I'll

1871
01:08:25,612 --> 01:08:28,009
be able to do it. And so I

1872
01:08:28,009 --> 01:08:30,645
was, like, 13 and the second concert I

1873
01:08:30,645 --> 01:08:32,810
see saw, my parents dropped me and my

1874
01:08:32,810 --> 01:08:35,860
buddy, Henry Holiday off at Oakland Coli and,

1875
01:08:36,395 --> 01:08:38,307
Van Hale Fair warning tour.

1876
01:08:38,945 --> 01:08:41,513
And it was like, saw so loud, and

1877
01:08:41,513 --> 01:08:43,510
people are throwing M eighties in the crowd.

1878
01:08:43,750 --> 01:08:45,827
Girls are taking the shirts off. It me

1879
01:08:45,827 --> 01:08:47,426
and my buddy were, like, equal parts just,

1880
01:08:47,506 --> 01:08:50,069
like, verified and, like, fuck is this fucking

1881
01:08:50,069 --> 01:08:51,024
amazing. You know,

1882
01:08:51,819 --> 01:08:53,729
it was a life changing. I mean, they...

1883
01:08:53,889 --> 01:08:55,560
That was done at their prime too. There

1884
01:08:55,560 --> 01:08:58,203
was I was sick, 6 8. Air But

1885
01:08:58,363 --> 01:08:59,239
I did have a cool,

1886
01:09:00,037 --> 01:09:01,871
full circle moment in My first show, Greg

1887
01:09:01,871 --> 01:09:03,466
up in the Bay area, this is like

1888
01:09:03,466 --> 01:09:05,779
an embarrassment of riches for concerts. Right?

1889
01:09:06,736 --> 01:09:09,467
My first show was rolling stones with Jay

1890
01:09:09,627 --> 01:09:11,704
Gil and George T opening.

1891
01:09:12,184 --> 01:09:13,782
And then later when I was out on

1892
01:09:13,782 --> 01:09:15,541
tour with Kid rock Peter Wolf from Jay

1893
01:09:15,620 --> 01:09:17,626
Gil. So saturday with us. We did a

1894
01:09:17,626 --> 01:09:19,612
couple of this giant hits, so that was

1895
01:09:19,612 --> 01:09:22,414
pretty fun full circle moment for me. But

1896
01:09:22,867 --> 01:09:25,329
yeah. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah. So you're you're into

1897
01:09:25,329 --> 01:09:27,016
rock and roll. That hardcore in then. Yeah.

1898
01:09:27,336 --> 01:09:29,887
Part that moment, seeing that that lab still

1899
01:09:29,887 --> 01:09:30,685
you're a guitar player.

1900
01:09:31,962 --> 01:09:34,833
Guitar player there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So switched

1901
01:09:34,833 --> 01:09:35,790
it up to Do.

1902
01:09:36,284 --> 01:09:38,604
Yeah. Exactly. And then pedals. You get called

1903
01:09:38,604 --> 01:09:41,324
to play guitar anymore? Yeah. It's pretty fun.

1904
01:09:42,125 --> 01:09:44,204
And, you know, I mean, call the guys

1905
01:09:44,204 --> 01:09:46,938
who doing 24 cylinders. So un unbelievable. So...

1906
01:09:47,657 --> 01:09:49,574
But... Yeah. I... Yeah. Yeah. It's been fun.

1907
01:09:49,894 --> 01:09:51,412
I tried to keep it up. I was

1908
01:09:51,412 --> 01:09:53,330
working a bunch with this, young,

1909
01:09:54,144 --> 01:09:57,253
incredibly talented a girl, Mia Morris. She plays

1910
01:09:57,253 --> 01:09:59,565
every instrument, but she would have me... She

1911
01:09:59,565 --> 01:10:02,277
would like... We'd write songs, and then she

1912
01:10:02,277 --> 01:10:02,777
would

1913
01:10:03,090 --> 01:10:04,850
a bunch of time in her studio, putting

1914
01:10:04,850 --> 01:10:06,609
down all this drinks herself, and then she

1915
01:10:06,609 --> 01:10:08,050
would have me do a big rock solo

1916
01:10:08,050 --> 01:10:09,409
on some of those. So that was pretty

1917
01:10:09,409 --> 01:10:10,543
cool. Been But

1918
01:10:11,261 --> 01:10:12,536
it was cool. She... I had a good

1919
01:10:12,536 --> 01:10:14,608
day on Nbc, like, maybe a year and

1920
01:10:14,608 --> 01:10:17,158
a half ago. This guy Brian Ruby, who

1921
01:10:17,238 --> 01:10:17,876
I'm producing.

1922
01:10:18,369 --> 01:10:19,970
He was on the today show in the

1923
01:10:19,970 --> 01:10:22,210
morning talking about his song that I produced

1924
01:10:22,210 --> 01:10:24,369
with him. And then Mia was on, Em

1925
01:10:24,369 --> 01:10:26,930
america's because... America's got talent that evening doing.

1926
01:10:27,184 --> 01:10:29,247
Song that I wrote with her. Sick. He.

1927
01:10:29,485 --> 01:10:30,541
It's a pretty good

1928
01:10:31,072 --> 01:10:32,579
Nbc day for Old Smith.

1929
01:10:33,532 --> 01:10:36,090
Nice. Yeah. And so in the finance natural

1930
01:10:36,090 --> 01:10:37,130
part of it. You know,

1931
01:10:38,170 --> 01:10:40,569
probably in the beginning, it was more of

1932
01:10:40,569 --> 01:10:42,729
a feast and famine type of thing. But,

1933
01:10:42,810 --> 01:10:43,449
you know, it's like,

1934
01:10:44,343 --> 01:10:47,127
how does the finances work with, like, okay.

1935
01:10:47,365 --> 01:10:48,718
So you play on the song? You don't

1936
01:10:48,718 --> 01:10:50,070
know what's gonna happen to it and then

1937
01:10:50,070 --> 01:10:50,786
it goes huge.

1938
01:10:51,279 --> 01:10:53,430
But you... Did you get paid the 1

1939
01:10:53,430 --> 01:10:55,262
time or do you get royalties? Like, how

1940
01:10:55,262 --> 01:10:57,653
does it work for a session musician? Okay.

1941
01:10:57,891 --> 01:10:59,963
Well, to unpack that like, early on. Yeah.

1942
01:11:00,202 --> 01:11:02,215
I made. Lot less, but I needed a

1943
01:11:02,215 --> 01:11:03,975
lot less. I mean, when I first moved

1944
01:11:03,975 --> 01:11:05,494
to town, I lived kind of in the

1945
01:11:05,494 --> 01:11:07,654
hood, and I had half a duplex for

1946
01:11:07,654 --> 01:11:08,534
200 a month,

1947
01:11:09,189 --> 01:11:11,663
which rents in Nashville are obscene now. I

1948
01:11:11,663 --> 01:11:13,658
mean, 2000 a month is, you know, the

1949
01:11:13,658 --> 01:11:15,814
thing now. Right. It's terrible. I feel so

1950
01:11:15,814 --> 01:11:18,243
bad for the young kids coming up. So

1951
01:11:18,302 --> 01:11:19,899
the other to address the other,

1952
01:11:21,973 --> 01:11:24,367
yeah. The Us is 1 of the only

1953
01:11:24,367 --> 01:11:26,876
countries in the world that doesn't. Pay performance

1954
01:11:26,934 --> 01:11:28,071
royalties for

1955
01:11:28,527 --> 01:11:29,561
stuff that's on the radio.

1956
01:11:30,438 --> 01:11:33,065
So everywhere else, they'll pay the musicians if

1957
01:11:33,065 --> 01:11:35,233
something's a big hit, I get stuff on

1958
01:11:35,233 --> 01:11:37,786
the back end. We are finally starting to

1959
01:11:37,786 --> 01:11:40,260
get that. It's the sag after fund, the

1960
01:11:40,340 --> 01:11:43,789
A and, the musicians union, A sag after

1961
01:11:43,789 --> 01:11:47,470
a fund, and it's derived from the streaming

1962
01:11:47,470 --> 01:11:49,949
companies and Sirius x m all contribute to

1963
01:11:49,949 --> 01:11:51,045
this fund. So if you play on a

1964
01:11:51,164 --> 01:11:53,713
can't... Yeah. It's it's getting better. There's something

1965
01:11:53,713 --> 01:11:55,488
there for sure. Spotify

1966
01:11:56,023 --> 01:11:57,137
declines to contribute.

1967
01:11:58,173 --> 01:11:58,810
Of of course.

1968
01:12:00,085 --> 01:12:02,407
They Yeah. But but, yeah. So at least

1969
01:12:02,407 --> 01:12:03,838
there's that. It's a bit of a silver

1970
01:12:03,838 --> 01:12:06,064
lining as kind of a lot of the

1971
01:12:06,064 --> 01:12:08,689
industry contracts. There's at least something that's kinda

1972
01:12:08,689 --> 01:12:09,722
gotten better. Yeah.

1973
01:12:10,372 --> 01:12:11,961
That's really wild because I mean, isn't that

1974
01:12:11,961 --> 01:12:12,698
the story

1975
01:12:13,389 --> 01:12:16,009
you know, for, like, 56 years because, like,

1976
01:12:16,088 --> 01:12:17,755
the Fun brothers and those guys, they all

1977
01:12:17,755 --> 01:12:19,596
got the shaft, you know? Well, back in

1978
01:12:19,596 --> 01:12:21,503
the day on all those hits. Like, then

1979
01:12:21,503 --> 01:12:22,615
it's just now changing.

1980
01:12:23,489 --> 01:12:24,284
There's been

1981
01:12:25,238 --> 01:12:27,720
something called the sound recording... Special payments fund

1982
01:12:27,720 --> 01:12:29,417
that they started in the 19 thirties

1983
01:12:29,795 --> 01:12:32,746
when recorded music started taking off. The musicians

1984
01:12:32,746 --> 01:12:34,501
got together, and said we're not just gonna

1985
01:12:34,501 --> 01:12:36,829
play once and get paid once. So it's...

1986
01:12:37,788 --> 01:12:40,185
The fun shrunk as recorded music has shrunk,

1987
01:12:40,426 --> 01:12:43,162
but it's just a percentage of every master

1988
01:12:43,221 --> 01:12:45,154
recording you play. Gets mh. You get. A

1989
01:12:45,154 --> 01:12:47,307
little extra for that. But it's not dependent

1990
01:12:47,307 --> 01:12:49,721
on something's a big hit. You don't do

1991
01:12:49,780 --> 01:12:51,296
extra l or anything like that.

1992
01:12:51,934 --> 01:12:53,768
So do you have any sense? I mean,

1993
01:12:53,927 --> 01:12:54,939
this is kind of like

1994
01:12:55,859 --> 01:12:58,496
you know, I guess, the magic producers are

1995
01:12:58,496 --> 01:13:00,174
the ones that really have this. But, like,

1996
01:13:00,334 --> 01:13:02,332
when when you play on something and and

1997
01:13:02,332 --> 01:13:03,930
you're like, that was really great and then

1998
01:13:03,930 --> 01:13:07,125
it, like, doesn't go anywhere versus, like, something

1999
01:13:07,125 --> 01:13:08,949
that gets big. Is there just too many

2000
01:13:08,949 --> 01:13:11,727
moving parts to know what what was really

2001
01:13:11,727 --> 01:13:12,997
special and what we'll like hit.

2002
01:13:14,601 --> 01:13:17,542
You know, Like... It's it's, yeah. A lot

2003
01:13:17,542 --> 01:13:20,007
of stuff has to line up for to

2004
01:13:20,007 --> 01:13:21,756
do well. If it's a really hot artist,

2005
01:13:21,915 --> 01:13:23,765
you know that's stands a better chance.

2006
01:13:24,324 --> 01:13:28,104
I mean, and it's a strangely in equitable

2007
01:13:28,725 --> 01:13:31,364
industry, like, I remember the same week that

2008
01:13:31,445 --> 01:13:33,855
I played on that 3 wooden crosses for

2009
01:13:34,015 --> 01:13:36,168
Randy Travis. That was, you know, the biggest

2010
01:13:36,168 --> 01:13:37,604
song of the year C song of the

2011
01:13:37,604 --> 01:13:39,279
year Ac song in year. And I was

2012
01:13:39,279 --> 01:13:41,614
filed low budget because it was a Christian

2013
01:13:41,672 --> 01:13:41,991
recording.

2014
01:13:42,802 --> 01:13:43,198
Good. Yeah.

2015
01:13:43,990 --> 01:13:46,210
I won't comment on that. So I made

2016
01:13:46,210 --> 01:13:48,350
a hundred dollars to play on... Arguably the

2017
01:13:48,350 --> 01:13:50,349
biggest song of the year. Later that that

2018
01:13:50,349 --> 01:13:53,618
week, I pretended to play acoustic guitar with

2019
01:13:53,698 --> 01:13:56,113
Ras flats on the C awards

2020
01:13:56,570 --> 01:13:59,362
for 4 minutes and got paid 1500 dollars.

2021
01:14:00,731 --> 01:14:02,086
What do you mean you pretended the play?

2022
01:14:02,564 --> 01:14:04,636
So there's award shows a lot of time

2023
01:14:04,636 --> 01:14:06,309
they don't have fans. The fans that just

2024
01:14:06,309 --> 01:14:08,556
monitor that. Because if you have, like, 15

2025
01:14:08,556 --> 01:14:09,913
bands, they're throughout the course of that. I

2026
01:14:09,913 --> 01:14:12,068
mean, each band has, like, 30 inputs, it's

2027
01:14:12,068 --> 01:14:14,143
just brutal for the sound guys to try

2028
01:14:14,143 --> 01:14:16,551
to keep track of all that. Suddenly you're

2029
01:14:16,551 --> 01:14:19,581
just throw smiling and smiling and str away.

2030
01:14:19,979 --> 01:14:22,132
Yeah. He. You're up there playing like all

2031
01:14:22,132 --> 01:14:23,886
along the watch hour because why the hell.

2032
01:14:25,735 --> 01:14:27,729
Yeah. The day before the run through at

2033
01:14:27,729 --> 01:14:29,722
the rehearsal me and the fiddle player played

2034
01:14:29,722 --> 01:14:31,478
into opposite ends of the same chord.

2035
01:14:32,993 --> 01:14:34,051
And the crew goes

2036
01:14:34,683 --> 01:14:37,076
Good. That's funny. Don't do that tomorrow. I

2037
01:14:37,076 --> 01:14:37,794
don't that. Right.

2038
01:14:39,868 --> 01:14:42,101
That's cool. I mean, is there any, like,

2039
01:14:42,739 --> 01:14:44,589
is there any cy in you? Like when

2040
01:14:44,589 --> 01:14:46,666
you... When... Like, what what are the parts

2041
01:14:46,666 --> 01:14:48,344
that make a little bit cynical? Oh, yeah.

2042
01:14:48,583 --> 01:14:50,661
I mean, it's it's very part of the?

2043
01:14:50,900 --> 01:14:52,430
All have to work very very hard to

2044
01:14:52,430 --> 01:14:54,658
not be jade in the music industry. I

2045
01:14:54,658 --> 01:14:56,590
mean, Mh. And, you know, you see

2046
01:14:57,044 --> 01:14:58,635
some of the most talented people come a

2047
01:14:58,635 --> 01:15:01,037
lot and nothing ever happens for them, and

2048
01:15:01,037 --> 01:15:02,947
then some other folks that are just ab

2049
01:15:02,947 --> 01:15:04,778
invisible wind up doing really well.

2050
01:15:07,244 --> 01:15:09,802
He it's I mean, it's it's hard. You

2051
01:15:09,802 --> 01:15:09,962
know,

2052
01:15:11,233 --> 01:15:13,615
I mean, people hated Taylor Swift when she

2053
01:15:13,615 --> 01:15:15,546
was out because she wasn't a strong singer

2054
01:15:15,919 --> 01:15:17,428
and her father had money.

2055
01:15:18,399 --> 01:15:20,957
But she was, like, an incredibly hard worker,

2056
01:15:21,836 --> 01:15:24,712
super motivated, and then a good song that

2057
01:15:24,712 --> 01:15:26,950
spoke to her generation, You know? Mh.

2058
01:15:27,844 --> 01:15:29,678
I mean, so there are a lot of

2059
01:15:29,678 --> 01:15:31,512
ways, and she's, you know, she's gotten way

2060
01:15:31,512 --> 01:15:33,188
better as a singer, you know, you can,

2061
01:15:33,268 --> 01:15:33,587
you know.

2062
01:15:34,305 --> 01:15:36,001
And, of course, with modern technology

2063
01:15:36,378 --> 01:15:37,436
to to vocal.

2064
01:15:37,909 --> 01:15:39,907
And just beating somebody up in the studio.

2065
01:15:40,067 --> 01:15:41,905
You can get anybody sounding pretty good.

2066
01:15:42,545 --> 01:15:43,583
But, yeah, I mean,

2067
01:15:44,302 --> 01:15:45,741
it's hard to know what's gonna do well.

2068
01:15:45,901 --> 01:15:47,672
I played on this record for billing current

2069
01:15:47,672 --> 01:15:49,422
and I played on half the album,

2070
01:15:50,138 --> 01:15:52,207
and this 1 song called good directions.

2071
01:15:53,161 --> 01:15:54,449
I had a big Do of heart it.

2072
01:15:54,609 --> 01:15:56,998
But it's just a fun song. Right? And

2073
01:15:57,078 --> 01:15:59,309
I randomly... He's a pretty big country star,

2074
01:15:59,469 --> 01:16:01,221
Randomly ran to him a couple times.

2075
01:16:02,427 --> 01:16:04,728
Like, in the months that followed that. And

2076
01:16:04,807 --> 01:16:06,314
I was like, dude, That's the song. And

2077
01:16:06,314 --> 01:16:07,663
he's was like, I know I know I

2078
01:16:07,663 --> 01:16:09,646
love that song that the label hates it.

2079
01:16:09,979 --> 01:16:12,202
And they won't release it. And finally, he

2080
01:16:12,202 --> 01:16:14,743
said you have to release the song. And

2081
01:16:14,743 --> 01:16:16,809
so they gru put it out, and then

2082
01:16:16,809 --> 01:16:18,953
they did not promote it, and it lang

2083
01:16:18,953 --> 01:16:20,794
in it and fifties on the charts at

2084
01:16:20,794 --> 01:16:22,779
the bottom of the charts, and they were

2085
01:16:22,779 --> 01:16:24,048
about to pull it and all of a

2086
01:16:24,048 --> 01:16:25,795
sudden it caught fire, and it wound up

2087
01:16:25,795 --> 01:16:27,779
being the biggest country song of 2008,

2088
01:16:28,909 --> 01:16:29,149
nice.

2089
01:16:30,110 --> 01:16:32,430
So me and Billy were right. The labels

2090
01:16:32,430 --> 01:16:32,829
are on,

2091
01:16:33,789 --> 01:16:35,390
lot of being, you know, ask caps song

2092
01:16:35,390 --> 01:16:37,149
of the year and and the biggest song.

2093
01:16:37,390 --> 01:16:38,442
And it was fine I have a picked

2094
01:16:38,521 --> 01:16:40,271
Do part on it and miss solo alone.

2095
01:16:41,225 --> 01:16:43,214
It doesn't always... Yep it's a fun song,

2096
01:16:43,453 --> 01:16:45,934
son by a great singer. I my... My

2097
01:16:45,934 --> 01:16:47,525
my super super hot in the mix, and

2098
01:16:47,604 --> 01:16:49,434
I have, like, the central part of the

2099
01:16:49,434 --> 01:16:51,525
whole, you know, thing. So

2100
01:16:52,154 --> 01:16:54,547
Let's just say those kind of things are

2101
01:16:54,547 --> 01:16:56,381
few and far between where it all lines

2102
01:16:56,381 --> 01:16:58,854
something like that. That's super cool. So let

2103
01:16:58,854 --> 01:17:00,210
me ask you 1 more question, then we'll

2104
01:17:00,210 --> 01:17:01,247
go out on some music.

2105
01:17:02,378 --> 01:17:04,052
But let me... What about a story? You

2106
01:17:04,052 --> 01:17:04,850
know, you just actually...

2107
01:17:05,648 --> 01:17:07,242
It's a good segue. You just said they,

2108
01:17:07,322 --> 01:17:09,315
this song lined it all up, and it

2109
01:17:09,315 --> 01:17:10,910
turned out really great and everything else So...

2110
01:17:11,324 --> 01:17:12,758
You know, I asked you I think in

2111
01:17:12,758 --> 01:17:14,828
an email to to think about some of

2112
01:17:14,828 --> 01:17:16,979
these seminal climbing, what's the story we haven't

2113
01:17:16,979 --> 01:17:19,050
heard that that you go to in your

2114
01:17:19,050 --> 01:17:21,373
mind as far as... Is rock climbing as

2115
01:17:21,373 --> 01:17:22,965
far as an adventure that you've had that

2116
01:17:22,965 --> 01:17:25,272
we haven't covered yet that maybe jumps forward

2117
01:17:25,272 --> 01:17:27,914
even even recently if if it is Well,

2118
01:17:28,074 --> 01:17:30,074
let me tell a couple more music stories

2119
01:17:30,074 --> 01:17:31,594
real quick. I have a couple that I

2120
01:17:31,594 --> 01:17:32,234
thought would be fun.

2121
01:17:32,954 --> 01:17:35,354
When I was... So I got hired by

2122
01:17:35,434 --> 01:17:37,365
Kid rock. Talked to play in his band.

2123
01:17:38,004 --> 01:17:39,360
He had me up. He has this big

2124
01:17:39,360 --> 01:17:42,154
compound next to his house in the suburbs

2125
01:17:42,154 --> 01:17:45,143
of Detroit, and he have me sleep downstairs

2126
01:17:45,203 --> 01:17:46,560
in the rug this room in this big

2127
01:17:46,560 --> 01:17:49,037
studio. And 1 morning, I woke up, and

2128
01:17:49,197 --> 01:17:50,795
I was I was tired, and I went

2129
01:17:50,795 --> 01:17:52,324
upstairs and my boss or shorts to make

2130
01:17:52,324 --> 01:17:53,518
some coffee, you know, because I was the

2131
01:17:53,518 --> 01:17:54,791
only 1 in there. And,

2132
01:17:55,666 --> 01:17:58,131
Bob, Kid rock. He goes by Bob, if

2133
01:17:58,131 --> 01:18:00,215
any says, yeah. I'm good buddies with kids,

2134
01:18:00,374 --> 01:18:01,568
you know, they're full of shape because he's

2135
01:18:01,568 --> 01:18:04,274
just always bob. Bob came walking in. Was

2136
01:18:04,274 --> 01:18:05,012
this sp

2137
01:18:05,547 --> 01:18:07,218
sp old black guy, and he's like, hey,

2138
01:18:07,457 --> 01:18:09,618
Smith. Whenever This is d from Run Dmc,

2139
01:18:09,778 --> 01:18:11,525
and I'm like, am I underwear holding like

2140
01:18:11,525 --> 01:18:13,511
a coffee pot shaking his hand.

2141
01:18:16,703 --> 01:18:18,769
So, you know, hanging out on that tour.

2142
01:18:18,927 --> 01:18:20,834
There was... It was kinda always something crazy

2143
01:18:20,834 --> 01:18:22,899
like that. You know, we played the Iowa

2144
01:18:22,899 --> 01:18:24,979
state fair and talk I'm Arnold introduced us.

2145
01:18:25,218 --> 01:18:26,806
I was like, man, That seen in Austin

2146
01:18:26,965 --> 01:18:29,029
Powers in the bathroom, I was, like, 1

2147
01:18:29,029 --> 01:18:31,253
of the great moments of American cinema.

2148
01:18:33,000 --> 01:18:35,006
I'm And, like, you know, I did Let

2149
01:18:35,006 --> 01:18:36,359
and letterman them in a bunch of times,

2150
01:18:36,518 --> 01:18:38,509
so those Tv shows, and it was always

2151
01:18:38,509 --> 01:18:40,181
fun. You'd always run into different people.

2152
01:18:40,818 --> 01:18:42,583
We were there this... Same day doing letter

2153
01:18:42,583 --> 01:18:44,890
in that Christopher Walk was. And

2154
01:18:45,765 --> 01:18:48,072
I was running up stage tune my man

2155
01:18:48,072 --> 01:18:50,220
at the last minute, and I almost ran

2156
01:18:50,220 --> 01:18:51,903
smack into Christopher Walker. I was like, god,

2157
01:18:52,140 --> 01:18:52,776
It would hurt me.

2158
01:18:54,284 --> 01:18:54,523
And,

2159
01:18:55,237 --> 01:18:57,539
always fun stuff like that. And I got

2160
01:18:57,539 --> 01:18:59,863
asked to play on the Roger Miller tribute

2161
01:18:59,863 --> 01:19:02,014
record a few years ago. And so once

2162
01:19:02,014 --> 01:19:04,086
on was Kent roller skate a Buffalo herd

2163
01:19:04,086 --> 01:19:05,440
and they just brought in, like, a ton

2164
01:19:05,440 --> 01:19:07,113
of old op stars to sing on it.

2165
01:19:07,431 --> 01:19:09,118
And then last on wearing lone as me.

2166
01:19:09,357 --> 01:19:11,505
They brought Allison K and Dolly Part.

2167
01:19:12,220 --> 01:19:13,811
And none of the those were there that

2168
01:19:13,811 --> 01:19:15,658
day sadly, They just had a un vocalist

2169
01:19:15,658 --> 01:19:17,813
and doing a placeholder for us. Right. And

2170
01:19:17,813 --> 01:19:20,127
then the last 1, I felt back as

2171
01:19:20,127 --> 01:19:21,723
they sent the guys the rest of the

2172
01:19:21,723 --> 01:19:23,080
band home. They're like we already have the

2173
01:19:23,080 --> 01:19:24,611
try back for this, but we need Smith

2174
01:19:24,611 --> 01:19:27,323
the to his old friends, and it was

2175
01:19:28,122 --> 01:19:30,856
Willie Nelson Chris Kristoff Robertson and Merle H

2176
01:19:31,074 --> 01:19:32,929
back Hell, yes. 1 of the last things

2177
01:19:32,929 --> 01:19:35,969
mer man. I was like, I was driving

2178
01:19:35,969 --> 01:19:37,329
home. I was like, fuck, I could get

2179
01:19:37,329 --> 01:19:39,090
hip by a bus, and that'll Be totally

2180
01:19:39,090 --> 01:19:40,860
cool with it. I just... Quit music right

2181
01:19:40,860 --> 01:19:43,170
now, you know. Yeah. I was actually that's

2182
01:19:43,170 --> 01:19:45,001
funny because I just thought right before you

2183
01:19:45,001 --> 01:19:47,014
said it I just thought about Willie because

2184
01:19:47,072 --> 01:19:48,640
let me ask you and I you got

2185
01:19:48,840 --> 01:19:50,840
time I hope but well, you know, I

2186
01:19:50,840 --> 01:19:52,199
would love for you like to dish on,

2187
01:19:52,280 --> 01:19:53,960
like, all the assholes, but that's not a

2188
01:19:53,960 --> 01:19:55,020
good professional

2189
01:19:56,039 --> 01:19:58,288
professional stance. But who's who's like the... Who's

2190
01:19:58,288 --> 01:20:00,282
like the coolest? Like, who... We were talking

2191
01:20:00,282 --> 01:20:02,755
about Dolly dolly Look. Yeah. Yeah. Who's we're

2192
01:20:02,755 --> 01:20:04,430
talking about Dolly. I mean, she's been in

2193
01:20:04,430 --> 01:20:05,967
the industry for

2194
01:20:06,360 --> 01:20:08,440
I don't know. Was it 70 years, 60

2195
01:20:08,440 --> 01:20:09,720
year. I don't fuck... I don't know, at

2196
01:20:09,720 --> 01:20:13,020
least 50 or so. And, you don't, hear

2197
01:20:13,400 --> 01:20:15,732
anybody. I've never heard 1. Person say anything

2198
01:20:15,732 --> 01:20:18,844
bad about her. That's Right. Insane. Right? I

2199
01:20:18,844 --> 01:20:20,679
mean, yeah. And she's, like, done all kinds

2200
01:20:20,679 --> 01:20:23,243
of crazy stuff. She, like, s this foundation

2201
01:20:23,243 --> 01:20:24,676
that sends books to kids,

2202
01:20:25,551 --> 01:20:27,381
done all his dad is a litter, you

2203
01:20:27,381 --> 01:20:29,131
know, all kinds of crazy stuff. So, I

2204
01:20:29,131 --> 01:20:31,784
mean, she's, like, beyond ledge. She hasn't had

2205
01:20:31,784 --> 01:20:33,545
anything on the radio in 30 years and

2206
01:20:33,545 --> 01:20:35,225
she's bigger than she ever has been.

2207
01:20:35,864 --> 01:20:38,195
Right. Yeah. So it's cool played on a

2208
01:20:38,195 --> 01:20:40,030
couple things for her. And then, you know,

2209
01:20:40,189 --> 01:20:41,945
Willie is a legend. I mean, look at

2210
01:20:41,945 --> 01:20:42,184
him.

2211
01:20:43,541 --> 01:20:44,988
You know, what was a kid. They would

2212
01:20:44,988 --> 01:20:46,814
tell you in school, like, if you smoke

2213
01:20:46,814 --> 01:20:48,640
pot, you'll never amount to anything. I was

2214
01:20:48,640 --> 01:20:51,339
like, well, I could, you know, the most

2215
01:20:51,339 --> 01:20:54,212
successful country singer saw. I all time it's

2216
01:20:54,212 --> 01:20:56,511
still crushing it at 90 years old, you

2217
01:20:56,511 --> 01:20:58,098
know Right. But, yeah. I mean,

2218
01:20:58,891 --> 01:20:59,051
man,

2219
01:20:59,923 --> 01:21:02,006
yeah. Our don't wanna dish... There's a couple

2220
01:21:02,006 --> 01:21:02,506
really

2221
01:21:02,881 --> 01:21:04,074
well known assholes.

2222
01:21:04,711 --> 01:21:06,700
Friend of mine was tour managing 1 of

2223
01:21:06,700 --> 01:21:08,548
them, and this gotta I threw a fit,

2224
01:21:08,708 --> 01:21:10,306
the artists threw a fit and said you're

2225
01:21:10,306 --> 01:21:11,984
fired and they happen to be in the

2226
01:21:11,984 --> 01:21:14,301
town in North Carolina where my buddy's sister

2227
01:21:14,301 --> 01:21:16,312
lived. So you like Texted center her. She's

2228
01:21:16,312 --> 01:21:17,427
like, yeah. I'll be there in 10 minutes.

2229
01:21:17,826 --> 01:21:19,500
The tour just walked off the bus in

2230
01:21:19,500 --> 01:21:20,935
the middle of the tour with all of

2231
01:21:20,935 --> 01:21:22,609
the stuff for the next 2 weeks of

2232
01:21:22,609 --> 01:21:22,927
shows.

2233
01:21:23,485 --> 01:21:25,569
In orders of the no Serious of Ser.

2234
01:21:25,728 --> 01:21:28,114
Like... Sorry. See you later. So... Wow. It

2235
01:21:28,114 --> 01:21:30,182
has its... You know, being a dick has

2236
01:21:30,182 --> 01:21:32,465
its price sometimes and never totally. The notice

2237
01:21:32,903 --> 01:21:33,062
Man,

2238
01:21:34,657 --> 01:21:36,809
there's been so many great moments, you know,

2239
01:21:37,048 --> 01:21:38,882
both in cla and music.

2240
01:21:39,918 --> 01:21:40,317
I went,

2241
01:21:41,208 --> 01:21:44,860
had climbed zion before, and, my buddy Kirk

2242
01:21:44,860 --> 01:21:47,560
was living there for a period of time.

2243
01:21:47,719 --> 01:21:49,045
So I said, why don't you try to

2244
01:21:49,163 --> 01:21:50,672
us out a first descent for us to

2245
01:21:50,672 --> 01:21:53,213
work on. And he found this possible root

2246
01:21:53,213 --> 01:21:53,927
in the narrows,

2247
01:21:54,404 --> 01:21:56,310
so you like had to kinda wait 20

2248
01:21:56,310 --> 01:21:58,790
minutes us the Creek, the river,

2249
01:21:59,346 --> 01:21:59,744
and

2250
01:22:00,381 --> 01:22:02,767
we started working on it. Kinda... He couldn't

2251
01:22:02,767 --> 01:22:05,010
get the start high opened that up, and

2252
01:22:05,010 --> 01:22:06,362
then it got to some harder free con.

2253
01:22:06,600 --> 01:22:07,793
So I let him get on that.

2254
01:22:08,510 --> 01:22:10,260
It was kind of the summer so there

2255
01:22:10,260 --> 01:22:12,268
were tons of tour watching us at this

2256
01:22:12,268 --> 01:22:14,185
point. And he got up, and there were

2257
01:22:14,185 --> 01:22:16,903
2 coleman cooler sized blocks stacked on top

2258
01:22:16,903 --> 01:22:19,114
of each other. It was, like, pro. First

2259
01:22:19,393 --> 01:22:20,746
try to find a way around them. He's

2260
01:22:20,746 --> 01:22:21,939
like, man, there's no other way.

2261
01:22:23,052 --> 01:22:24,564
I was like, okay. And I got off

2262
01:22:24,564 --> 01:22:25,200
to the side,

2263
01:22:26,155 --> 01:22:26,552
and

2264
01:22:27,030 --> 01:22:28,874
he, like, hammered them with his hands. He's

2265
01:22:28,874 --> 01:22:30,943
like, okay. I'm going for it. He goes

2266
01:22:30,943 --> 01:22:33,170
up and pulls off these 2 blocks, and

2267
01:22:33,328 --> 01:22:34,975
I hear him go shit. And he's on

2268
01:22:35,094 --> 01:22:37,008
coming down and the blocks are coming down,

2269
01:22:37,486 --> 01:22:39,160
and then couple them... 1 of them hits

2270
01:22:39,160 --> 01:22:40,914
the wall on shatter into a bunch of

2271
01:22:40,914 --> 01:22:43,386
pieces, all the stuff comes thunder down. It

2272
01:22:43,386 --> 01:22:45,159
takes like a 30 or 40 footer,

2273
01:22:45,960 --> 01:22:49,319
and he's like, fine. And the crowd is

2274
01:22:49,319 --> 01:22:52,219
just, like shell shocked. They're just, like, gaping.

2275
01:22:52,760 --> 01:22:54,203
Like And he just goes back up there

2276
01:22:54,203 --> 01:22:55,791
and finish She's like, well, clean now.

2277
01:22:56,585 --> 01:22:56,823
Right.

2278
01:22:58,410 --> 01:23:00,649
But, yeah. Rock falls a thing, man. Had

2279
01:23:00,649 --> 01:23:02,409
a couple problems early on. I was on

2280
01:23:02,409 --> 01:23:05,610
middle cathedral really early on, and we were

2281
01:23:05,610 --> 01:23:07,289
on central Pillar frenzy. I was still on

2282
01:23:07,289 --> 01:23:07,770
the ground.

2283
01:23:08,409 --> 01:23:10,416
I This Japanese climber came up with us.

2284
01:23:10,576 --> 01:23:12,248
I mean, Japanese tourist came up with us.

2285
01:23:12,408 --> 01:23:13,922
And he looks at all the shattered rock

2286
01:23:13,922 --> 01:23:16,551
on the ground he says, do ro fall,

2287
01:23:17,109 --> 01:23:17,427
and

2288
01:23:18,064 --> 01:23:20,079
this My buddy goes, nah. Just the same,

2289
01:23:20,239 --> 01:23:23,119
Like, oh, yeah. He was halfway at the

2290
01:23:23,119 --> 01:23:25,119
pitch, and I heard just a huge rumbling.

2291
01:23:25,854 --> 01:23:27,534
And a bunch of stuff was coming down.

2292
01:23:27,935 --> 01:23:30,255
I managed to try to dodge, but stuff

2293
01:23:30,255 --> 01:23:32,255
is just s down stuff the size of

2294
01:23:32,255 --> 01:23:32,755
basketball,

2295
01:23:33,135 --> 01:23:34,747
you know, turning to power. When it hit

2296
01:23:34,747 --> 01:23:36,822
next to me. And it stopped. I was

2297
01:23:36,822 --> 01:23:38,417
like, fuck we made it. And I look

2298
01:23:38,417 --> 01:23:40,252
up, and he's hanging upside down from the

2299
01:23:40,252 --> 01:23:41,784
end of the rope blood just gutter pushing

2300
01:23:41,784 --> 01:23:43,304
out of his head about 50 feet off

2301
01:23:43,304 --> 01:23:45,625
the ground. I managed to lower him but

2302
01:23:45,625 --> 01:23:47,944
he was totally disoriented and his neck looked

2303
01:23:47,944 --> 01:23:50,439
fucked up too, washing and he's saying, I

2304
01:23:50,439 --> 01:23:52,679
can't see I can't see... I had to

2305
01:23:52,679 --> 01:23:54,920
make a decision whether to carry him out

2306
01:23:54,920 --> 01:23:55,960
with the neck injury.

2307
01:23:56,694 --> 01:23:59,874
Or to wait. While he's bleeding, and I

2308
01:23:59,874 --> 01:24:01,305
kinda fire and carried him to the car,

2309
01:24:01,465 --> 01:24:03,157
and we made it to the medical center

2310
01:24:03,930 --> 01:24:05,759
in the valley. They chewed me out for,

2311
01:24:07,046 --> 01:24:09,350
moving and neck injured person, but I was

2312
01:24:09,350 --> 01:24:10,145
like, yeah. You know.

2313
01:24:11,576 --> 01:24:13,984
And they helicopter him to Modest.

2314
01:24:14,835 --> 01:24:14,994
And,

2315
01:24:15,963 --> 01:24:18,110
I drove and stop by. Was gonna stop

2316
01:24:18,110 --> 01:24:19,621
by the hospital on the way home to

2317
01:24:19,621 --> 01:24:20,893
the Bay area. And

2318
01:24:21,847 --> 01:24:24,313
that highway 99, I guess is 3 lanes

2319
01:24:24,313 --> 01:24:25,289
each direction

2320
01:24:25,998 --> 01:24:28,471
and shit. A car comes flipping over the

2321
01:24:28,471 --> 01:24:30,784
divider of the freeway at me, and I

2322
01:24:30,784 --> 01:24:32,618
have to sw and it comes so close

2323
01:24:32,618 --> 01:24:33,656
to hitting me head on.

2324
01:24:36,222 --> 01:24:38,056
So I come that close to dying twice

2325
01:24:38,056 --> 01:24:39,651
in a day. I get to the hospital,

2326
01:24:39,890 --> 01:24:41,905
and they're gonna release him. He has 80

2327
01:24:41,963 --> 01:24:42,463
stitches

2328
01:24:42,841 --> 01:24:44,355
and a huge trump on his back.

2329
01:24:45,087 --> 01:24:46,521
And I see the medic that flew with

2330
01:24:46,521 --> 01:24:48,354
him and the helicopter. Was like, fuck, man.

2331
01:24:48,513 --> 01:24:49,867
You wouldn't believe just what happened to me,

2332
01:24:50,823 --> 01:24:52,018
just out ta here. He's was like, oh,

2333
01:24:52,177 --> 01:24:53,612
we went and got that guide. You see

2334
01:24:53,612 --> 01:24:54,823
him fly out of the car.

2335
01:24:56,182 --> 01:24:56,662
Oh, man.

2336
01:24:57,381 --> 01:24:57,881
So,

2337
01:24:58,260 --> 01:25:00,177
I mean, I don't know what happened with

2338
01:25:00,177 --> 01:25:00,577
the guy.

2339
01:25:01,216 --> 01:25:02,355
My buddy hugh

2340
01:25:02,827 --> 01:25:04,574
did some climbing after that and not the

2341
01:25:04,574 --> 01:25:07,194
same, you know. Right. But he was physically.

2342
01:25:07,354 --> 01:25:09,974
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Good. Yeah. Yeah. This is

2343
01:25:09,974 --> 01:25:12,702
gonna be... Thought we're gonna know bummer. When

2344
01:25:12,702 --> 01:25:14,140
you're getting when you're getting there, I was

2345
01:25:14,140 --> 01:25:15,819
like, okay. So then what happened?

2346
01:25:16,858 --> 01:25:17,097
Yeah.

2347
01:25:18,056 --> 01:25:18,855
I don't know.

2348
01:25:19,814 --> 01:25:21,263
Yeah. I guess I could I editor with

2349
01:25:21,263 --> 01:25:22,775
a little more upbeat story.

2350
01:25:24,208 --> 01:25:27,233
No. That's cool. But yeah. It it... Yeah.

2351
01:25:27,471 --> 01:25:29,715
Go ahead. So So any great times, you

2352
01:25:29,715 --> 01:25:29,794
know,

2353
01:25:30,828 --> 01:25:32,738
a bunch of trips out to the northwest

2354
01:25:32,738 --> 01:25:34,090
run I'm out there for music over the

2355
01:25:34,090 --> 01:25:36,094
last 10 years. Brad, Carter, who I think

2356
01:25:36,094 --> 01:25:36,890
you had on your,

2357
01:25:37,686 --> 01:25:38,585
on the podcast.

2358
01:25:39,040 --> 01:25:40,552
Done a bunch with him out there. We

2359
01:25:40,552 --> 01:25:43,100
did s you on year. Almost got the

2360
01:25:43,100 --> 01:25:45,663
chop on that crossing underneath that glacier to

2361
01:25:45,663 --> 01:25:47,654
get on to the butt the way I

2362
01:25:47,654 --> 01:25:48,769
guess some people have gotten.

2363
01:25:49,804 --> 01:25:51,930
I remember 1 time was out there up

2364
01:25:52,050 --> 01:25:54,603
and between the flights being delayed and then

2365
01:25:54,603 --> 01:25:56,039
playing the show, I think I had slept

2366
01:25:56,039 --> 01:25:57,874
3 hours and 2 nights and we went

2367
01:25:57,874 --> 01:25:58,991
and did Forbidden peak.

2368
01:25:59,884 --> 01:26:01,238
So much fun and get to the summit,

2369
01:26:01,397 --> 01:26:03,310
it was so still you could match and

2370
01:26:03,310 --> 01:26:05,381
let it burn down, just beautiful.

2371
01:26:05,939 --> 01:26:06,257
You,

2372
01:26:07,389 --> 01:26:10,102
Canadian Rockies, so many great experiences up there.

2373
01:26:10,502 --> 01:26:12,576
I remember leaving National 1 morning,

2374
01:26:13,055 --> 01:26:14,652
and then so long the east ridge of

2375
01:26:14,811 --> 01:26:17,527
Edith The next morning being on top by

2376
01:26:17,527 --> 01:26:19,510
noon the next day, came back and did

2377
01:26:19,510 --> 01:26:21,413
the north face of it with a partner

2378
01:26:21,413 --> 01:26:24,140
the next year. All love that mountain. Canadian

2379
01:26:24,140 --> 01:26:26,859
eat rockies what I'm just like some of

2380
01:26:26,859 --> 01:26:28,079
the best seeds

2381
01:26:28,539 --> 01:26:30,951
the east ridge of temple saw hide you

2382
01:26:30,951 --> 01:26:33,422
know, so many fun experiences up there. Wow.

2383
01:26:33,582 --> 01:26:35,336
It's like, I don't know. You just keep

2384
01:26:35,336 --> 01:26:37,727
coming at it with all these different stories.

2385
01:26:38,539 --> 01:26:39,898
From both sides of thing, but you also

2386
01:26:39,898 --> 01:26:41,495
have a family. I mean, you have... Is

2387
01:26:41,495 --> 01:26:44,132
it 2 boys? Yeah. An older son, Evan

2388
01:26:44,132 --> 01:26:46,484
who's a strong climber. He don. Sites

2389
01:26:46,860 --> 01:26:48,693
picture of them on your Instagram. Yeah. Yeah.

2390
01:26:48,931 --> 01:26:49,967
He's 35.

2391
01:26:50,286 --> 01:26:52,756
U. It lives out Nashville, North Carolina. And

2392
01:26:52,756 --> 01:26:55,279
he is great too. Of them. And and

2393
01:26:55,399 --> 01:26:57,399
echo is 9, and it's fun to see

2394
01:26:57,399 --> 01:26:59,159
them together. I think we're gonna actually go

2395
01:26:59,159 --> 01:27:00,859
meet out the Ob this weekend

2396
01:27:01,239 --> 01:27:04,202
and do a little father sons camping and

2397
01:27:04,202 --> 01:27:07,618
climbing. That's awesome. Yeah. Well, cool, dude. I

2398
01:27:07,618 --> 01:27:09,127
mean, I think I've taken plenty of your

2399
01:27:09,127 --> 01:27:10,557
time and I appreciate it. Like I said,

2400
01:27:10,716 --> 01:27:12,007
I... Getting this for free.

2401
01:27:12,965 --> 01:27:15,118
And I actually... I think I did mention

2402
01:27:15,118 --> 01:27:16,475
that. Like, hey, I'd love to have you

2403
01:27:16,475 --> 01:27:18,310
play some music, but I also don't like

2404
01:27:18,310 --> 01:27:20,703
up to ask working musicians to to give

2405
01:27:20,703 --> 01:27:23,027
their shit away for free. So I really

2406
01:27:23,082 --> 01:27:25,064
appreciate it. But, if you if you have

2407
01:27:25,064 --> 01:27:27,617
a feeling about to playing us out. Yeah.

2408
01:27:27,855 --> 01:27:30,260
I would I would love it. And, and

2409
01:27:30,315 --> 01:27:32,935
again, I totally appreciate it, man. Yeah. Yeah.

2410
01:27:33,173 --> 01:27:33,332
No.

2411
01:27:33,983 --> 01:27:36,448
Man, gotta keep music fun. Like, a lot

2412
01:27:36,448 --> 01:27:38,516
of the time I'll work 60 hours during

2413
01:27:38,516 --> 01:27:40,108
the week and then go play Blue grass

2414
01:27:40,108 --> 01:27:41,793
on the week. Is for fun, you know,

2415
01:27:42,032 --> 01:27:42,747
just because Right.

2416
01:27:43,543 --> 01:27:45,554
If you... If it just only becomes work

2417
01:27:46,725 --> 01:27:48,250
then that kind of resonates it's the whole

2418
01:27:48,250 --> 01:27:50,237
point of it. You know? Yeah. That's like,

2419
01:27:50,316 --> 01:27:52,619
the guide problem. Right? Like, oh, yeah. Right

2420
01:27:52,619 --> 01:27:54,819
right? Just makes your hate climb and people

2421
01:28:17,019 --> 01:28:17,416
About that.

2422
01:28:42,475 --> 01:28:44,071
There's a good Hawaiian ending england.

2423
01:28:51,805 --> 01:28:52,305
Perfect.

2424
01:29:02,479 --> 01:29:04,556
Alright folks. Thanks for listening, and thanks to

2425
01:29:04,796 --> 01:29:06,475
Smith for sitting down.

2426
01:29:07,034 --> 01:29:08,472
And 1 of the other things I like

2427
01:29:08,472 --> 01:29:11,110
about these off pieced quote unquote climbing interviews.

2428
01:29:11,270 --> 01:29:13,677
Is that people like Smith don't have any

2429
01:29:13,677 --> 01:29:14,815
real incentive

2430
01:29:15,272 --> 01:29:16,489
to do a podcast,

2431
01:29:16,947 --> 01:29:19,099
a climbing podcast anyway. He's not a pro

2432
01:29:19,099 --> 01:29:22,069
climber, and Frankly, this will do little or

2433
01:29:22,069 --> 01:29:22,569
nothing

2434
01:29:22,949 --> 01:29:23,909
for his music career.

2435
01:29:24,390 --> 01:29:26,470
People like Smith do the enormous cast because

2436
01:29:26,470 --> 01:29:28,170
they wanna connect with me

2437
01:29:28,722 --> 01:29:30,867
They wanna connect with you guys, they wanna

2438
01:29:30,867 --> 01:29:32,932
connect with the climbing community, and that has

2439
01:29:32,932 --> 01:29:34,783
its own special value. So

2440
01:29:35,316 --> 01:29:38,033
if you do wanna follow. Smith, and I

2441
01:29:38,033 --> 01:29:39,783
recommend that you do because it'll break up

2442
01:29:39,783 --> 01:29:42,091
that climbing content you're so bored with on

2443
01:29:42,091 --> 01:29:44,135
your Instagram. You can check them out at

2444
01:29:44,334 --> 01:29:45,793
Smith underscore curry

2445
01:29:46,172 --> 01:29:46,992
underscore rocks

2446
01:29:47,610 --> 01:29:50,407
on Instagram, and I've been actually holding onto

2447
01:29:50,407 --> 01:29:53,479
to this interview because supposedly Smith, has been

2448
01:29:53,619 --> 01:29:55,140
revamp his website, and you wanted me to

2449
01:29:55,140 --> 01:29:57,699
wait. I think he did that. I'm gonna

2450
01:29:57,699 --> 01:29:58,579
go check right now.

2451
01:29:59,860 --> 01:30:01,300
Yes, he did do that.

2452
01:30:01,953 --> 01:30:04,418
Looks great. Go for the mustache. Stay for

2453
01:30:04,418 --> 01:30:05,157
the music

2454
01:30:05,692 --> 01:30:06,748
at smith

2455
01:30:07,123 --> 01:30:08,237
curry dot com.

2456
01:30:08,889 --> 01:30:11,367
Yeah. And try connecting with Smith because I

2457
01:30:11,367 --> 01:30:13,684
think recording is a lot of sitting around.

2458
01:30:14,323 --> 01:30:16,082
While, things get set up and other people

2459
01:30:16,082 --> 01:30:18,569
do their takes and whatnot. So He's always

2460
01:30:18,569 --> 01:30:19,441
been super responsive.

2461
01:30:20,313 --> 01:30:21,899
He loves to talk climbing. Loves to talk

2462
01:30:21,899 --> 01:30:22,216
music.

2463
01:30:23,089 --> 01:30:25,072
Okay. A small bit of news is I

2464
01:30:25,072 --> 01:30:26,996
am likely. Going to be up at the

2465
01:30:27,076 --> 01:30:28,831
Art Academy in Sq,

2466
01:30:29,549 --> 01:30:32,022
not a thousand percent confirmed, but it's looking

2467
01:30:32,022 --> 01:30:32,341
like it.

2468
01:30:33,235 --> 01:30:34,595
I'll let you know more on the next

2469
01:30:34,595 --> 01:30:34,835
episode.

2470
01:30:35,475 --> 01:30:36,275
But in the meantime,

2471
01:30:37,074 --> 01:30:37,635
of course,

2472
01:30:38,275 --> 01:30:40,435
check your knots. And tune in your instruments,

2473
01:30:40,755 --> 01:30:42,275
you are your instruments in tune.

2474
01:30:42,928 --> 01:30:44,444
Just like they are on this track that

2475
01:30:44,603 --> 01:30:45,081
Smith scent.

2476
01:30:46,357 --> 01:30:47,872
So we're going out on a little Smith

2477
01:30:48,032 --> 01:30:48,271
Curry.

2478
01:30:49,069 --> 01:30:51,620
On Do bro, pedal steel laps steel, I

2479
01:30:51,620 --> 01:30:54,099
think, maybe the guitar, it's all in here.

2480
01:30:54,814 --> 01:30:55,132
Enjoy.

2481
01:32:20,815 --> 01:32:22,409
Get out of here Dewey. What are you

2482
01:32:22,409 --> 01:32:24,881
y'all doing in here? We're smoking reef refer.

2483
01:32:25,533 --> 01:32:26,889
And you don't want no part of this

2484
01:32:26,889 --> 01:32:29,521
shit. You're smoking reef reverse? Yeah. Of course,

2485
01:32:29,680 --> 01:32:31,116
we are Can't you smell it? Come on,

2486
01:32:31,356 --> 01:32:33,589
Dewey we? Join the party. No. Dewey we.

2487
01:32:33,828 --> 01:32:36,233
You don't want this. Get out of here.

2488
01:32:36,788 --> 01:32:38,140
You know what? I don't want no hangover,

2489
01:32:38,378 --> 01:32:40,364
I can't get no hangover. It doesn't give

2490
01:32:40,364 --> 01:32:41,182
you a hangover.

2491
01:32:43,081 --> 01:32:45,306
I'll get addicted to it or something? It's

2492
01:32:45,306 --> 01:32:46,499
not habit forming.

2493
01:32:47,135 --> 01:32:48,088
Oh, okay. Well,

2494
01:32:49,678 --> 01:32:51,609
I don't know. I don't wanna

2495
01:32:52,396 --> 01:32:54,466
overdose on it. You can't o d on

2496
01:32:54,466 --> 01:32:54,704
it.

2497
01:32:55,659 --> 01:32:57,171
It's not gonna make me wanna have sex.

2498
01:32:57,331 --> 01:32:59,320
Is it? It makes sex even better.

2499
01:33:00,295 --> 01:33:03,255
Sounds kinda expensive. Is the cheapest drug there

2500
01:33:03,255 --> 01:33:03,574
it is.

2501
01:33:06,534 --> 01:33:07,414
You don't want it.

2502
01:33:08,457 --> 01:33:09,650
I think I kinda wanted.

2503
01:33:10,685 --> 01:33:12,197
Okay. But just this once. Come in.