I think we need a few more rival,
but like, that's just, you know, like, it
would be nice to have, like,
a few more villains in the sport. We
don't really have enough villains the back shots
kind of cool, but you also don't wanna
have
your favorite shot of Steve Paid winning world
Champs as a butt shot like,
Like, that's just good to very winning shot,
you know?
Hey, everyone. I'm Chris hall, and this is
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Alright. Today, we're joined by the biggest name
in Mountain bike photography. Sv Martin.
Sv shares his thoughts on what makes a
good mountain bike image as well as giving
us the story behind some of his favorite
shots.
His friends take on the changing face of
In endure and downhill racing and his thoughts
on whether the video is taken over from
photography on the hill.
Sv lives and breathe this sports. So you
know that he's gonna have some well thought
out points of view and plenty of great
stories too. So without further ado, here's
Sv martin.
Sv martin. Welcome back to the downtime podcast
it's been a little worse 20 19 in
Le, and we're here again. Yeah. It's...
Wow, yeah. That's 1 was 5 years, and
a hell of lot has changed and hell
of a lot stayed the same in in
those 5 years.
Yeah. Still riding bikes and still taking photos,
but other than that, quite a lot of
changing. Yeah.
The sports changed, but also not changed, But
we have a kid now that's yeah. That's
been a huge. The biggest change our lives,
but
is still here. We still have momentous racing,
and I'm sure we're gonna get another...
Well, you're probably listening to this
after this day, and,
yeah, I hope they just storm the finish
well again basically.
At, yeah. Always it's a good after pie.
Yeah. I wanted to ask a bit. So
first of congratulations on comment a further. I
think the last time we sat down was
I think
my wife was pregnant with our daughter,
and then we talked a little bit about
that. And I think you were still maybe
not sure whether the kids was the thing
or not, and and now, obviously, you've got
Lil zig. In your life. Like, how have
you found it becoming a father because it
is a is a big change. Right? Well,
it's a big change. It's always something we
wanted to do, but we've kind of been
un and myself have been
I'd say, but I would say
once say selfish, but we've been... We've kind
of
lived our lives, how we've wanted to live
lives and and
has raced and I've kind of put work
as a priority and and
and with just... A stolen, there was never
a good time as with probably never have
a good time to have. Yeah. But
and then just as you get older, you
know, there's big meaning of life, and
and we we, you know, we'd kind tried
and had a couple of close calls, shall
we say.
And then we just
just was a bit more... We a bit
more proactive and and,
Yeah. So went through that whole journey, and
now she's, like, 1. She's been... She was
here last year. Mh. And now she can
starting to talk and running around everywhere. So
she's 1 an almost 1 and a half.
And
she knows
everyone from the circuit. She hands out with
uncle phone, actually, like every everyone them...
Yeah. So from Boris cigarettes. She sits in
the porch,
down up window of boris,
and hangs out with all the riders and
then, you know, we generally don't... Doesn't go
to the finish areas it's but too.
Yeah. But she loves bikes, so and it's
just like part of her life and routine.
So you can see how these kids these
days like the Jackson's and
and asses grow up round bikes when they're
growing up in the villages or towns, you
know, be at Whistler or wherever that it's
sort of part of their lives and normal
that, you know, it's... They pick it up
so quick and it's just how how how
it is these days. Definitely. Have you got
her own a bounce, but, yeah, she got...
She's on like then. But before a balance
bike, it's got 2 wheels, but they 2
kind of wide wheels. So yeah. You can
kind of balance, but you don't fall over
as much. Yeah. And she's about
tall enough to pretty much start getting on
the smallest balance bike.
Yeah. But she's gone the handlebars riding up
with us in the woods and on single
track and, well, mostly with mom. But
and she just loves
going like... She wants to go faster
and
and she loves taking her hands off for
when she gets on a shotgun seat, then
it'll be harder. Yeah. But
yeah, it's just
Yeah. You can see how there's a whole
industry built up run kids because literally every,
like,
2 months you're getting them a new thing
when they it can do more or the
grow our growth stuff will and especially, like,
we just wanna keep her into skateboarding and
surfing, like, 2 cheap sports buy to you...
Even the kids stuff, you just like
And then next thing they're gonna have eb
bikes and 05:10 bikes like we all have
and
and get out of hand. So
strictly
Bm skateboarding and surfing for zig, but firstly,
Sure she ain't at Motorbike. As it changed
your perspective or anything having a kid because
for a lot of people that gives them,
I almost a different lens to look at
life through that and often people change how
they feel about stuff. We
we we'd kind of bring up the same
things that were important to us, like,
especially she's traveling to love the races that
we can drive to. So
We just want to to make sure she
has, like, outdoor space and and grass and
trees and nature. So
it's essentially like all the things we've looked
for.
And already because always been the healthier type
and the more mindful type. So, like, all
of those things
go without say, but it
you know, obviously, it's it's
it's
tricky when we work on a schedule,
luckily Un is flexible enough where she can
put, like Zig first all times, but we've
worked it out pretty good where I'm
still get to spend a lot of time
with her. Otherwise, if she didn't come to
events, I wouldn't see her for 345 weeks
at a time because yeah, this trip is
6, 7 weeks back to back job. So...
Yeah. So she doesn't come to the once
he fly to in Fort William and and
the Us and Poland, but I'm pretty much
in and out most of them. Very cool.
Yeah. And Leah Gangs go like, million parks
and
slides and and nature stuff and up on
the mountain is, like... So it's
these mountain towns and and in Europe specifically
is pretty
kit out for kids. Yeah. I'm sure I
saw a clip there, like hanging out with
Flattered little girl or, on a tram or
saint maybe that was the. Exactly. And I
got on that same tram lane thinking
once he give us off and I bounced
And it's 1 those pit tram. Yeah. And
when bouncing a zig wasn't bouncing hard. And
as soon as he got off, I did
a full bounce on my back. And I
went underwater because the pit was actually full
water.
I got completely swamped like head to toe,
like, I had to go home and change,
but
Yeah. It was pretty cool. We... I mean,
shit... I've met Rachel, you know, early 2
thousands and then worked with them from, like,
2007
onwards and
that's cool a we got or a year
or 2 behind Ar, but again honor, good
good friends already, and
And Tom
as think he's got a couple of friends
on the circuit already. Yeah. Her age and
or nearby,
Yeah. That's amazing. Nice, man. We should talk
a little bit about but people really be
like, I'm on the rad podcast club. A
dad cast. But, yeah. I wanted to ask
you what in your mind, like, what makes
a good
mountain bike image? What are you striving to
find in, like, the perfect shot?
Oh, she's... There's a big question,
right off the bat.
There's... Like, I wear many different hats, I
would say.
Obviously,
the... Without say that, there's a few elements
that you wanna have good the composition the
lighting the action.
But,
you want
essentially you want a bit of storytelling in
a shot, which is not which might be
hard to capture in one's once 1 shot
and it's maybe better capturing a series of
shots.
But
you wanna maybe put the viewer there, but
you wanna, like,
like I said, because I'm wearing many hats,
there's your editorial type shots or your
daniel action shot, you know, is it race
aid? Do you want the winning tight
in, like, gritty,
white survivors,
we'll words to the eyes eyeballs. But or
is it in endure or someone like s
king really where it's more about the scenery
and location. So it's... You basically
having
a multitude of thoughts
and adjustments.
And sometimes you're taking... You can capture it
all in 1 shot, But sometimes you're gonna,
in 1 moment you might capture 3 shots.
A touch shot a white shot,
and behind the scenes shot
But essentially, like, I want all of it
to have some kind of storytelling.
Yeah. I like to have a story, which
has comes more from my sort of journalist
standpoint or or editorial standpoint.
But, you know, in the reality years, you
also got a think
you know, does it work on Instagram because
there's 80 percent of the usage from your
clients on Instagram. So
so
is there a perfect shot like yeah. There
is, but it's, like, you need to take
a perfect shot for every usage instance. So,
I'd love to do
go
you know, Scott a location for a week
and take...
You know the client needs 2 or 3
epic sun, sunrise shots and you camp out
there and you get... Literally take
10 shots, and you know 1 of them
versus taking 10000 shots a day and using,
you know, like, 500 in them a midday.
So
was it easy short question but this. I
Adam Just talked in circles here. But,
you know,
everything to be getting correct and the style,
everything's gotta just work, you know, the timing,
the
if you're a proper hardcore mountain by biker,
okay, you also can tell very quickly if
the ride has got bad style or shots
as ty or
So that's not gonna speak to you or
you're just gonna flip it or you're not
gonna click it You can slide it. So
there's a lot of things that you will
need to, you know, without thinking about they
just got to be right.
And, I guess,
we don't really think about it anymore. You...
It's kind of just second nature that's, you
know, Yeah. But you want some kind of
connection. Wants having to reach out and grab
the view and stop them really? Yeah. It's
like that's like what cover shots of magazines
used to do. You know, they need to
create sales and grab your attention and stand
out from the others. So... Yeah. When you
think about, like, this is a shot successful
to you. Like, how do you measure that
these days? And has that changed? Like, are
you looking for a shot to go on
Instagram and get a certain amount of views
or like? Or would you be more
interested in seeing it in print or up
on a wall somewhere like, what?
What for you feels like a really successful
Okay. It's... It's... I guess it comes down
to k. You you know... You know, you
you have your client deliverables which you need
to deliver a certain amount of good shots.
It well, I'd like to deliver
amount of good shots and options for them,
they're riders, their c sponsors,
the teams, the brands to use in different
ways,
both in
through social media and and other. But really,
what is... It boils down to
who won the race or what was the
story of the race and did I capture
that shot? Like, it's always like we always
have our own little
I wouldn't say contest, but we always...
You know, as the pressure is elevated, come
race day, D finals or world champs is
like, okay.
This slope b 1. He's not a client
to mine. I don't sheet for specialized or
Oli or anything,
but
I'm myself
I don't actually need to have a shot
of brood? But 100 percent I need to
Otherwise, like, why would Be doing this I
didn't care about the sport. You know, I
wanna have that shot for me. And if
they've got nothing to do with it, obviously,
it'll be nice if to used in the
must spin summers books or your downtime books.
But
at the end of the day, I wanna
have the shot that
that best captures his race winning moment.
But alongside that, I also want him to
have a shot of him tying his she
lasers that morning that he won the race.
Mh. Or folding his Jersey the night before
he won the race. Or pinning the number.
His mechanic pinning the number on. So
and you don't know who's gonna win the
race. So you're literally going around and and
and kind of collecting those shots. You're floating
in and out of different people's pits and
and clients are not client.
You know, and just because some winds are
more momentous than others. And
even looking at Alm
from Val Sol,
I mean, I a shot of him lying
on his back
surrounded by other riders in and
where did he have his big crash we
broke his neck?
Lens hide. Lens.
So so I have this image? I have
this different shots of Emery like, literally, at
the lowest of lows,
and they weren't sort of right to use
then
and
but now that I have him gone the
whole journey
and having...
I did
was weird because and Val sole, sometimes a
way that works out and your timing of
going into the pits and and and not
in the pits or the training,
schedules and, you know, sometimes you see a
rider a lot or sometimes you don't... And
somehow kept bumping in and out of Emery
a lot
at Val soul and then inside, A lot
more sort of
b roll or behind the scenes some all
more intimate stuff really.
And
and then it, you know, get gets the
wind and followed through a bit of past
and and the rest of the stuff, and
and then let's he just walked into the
truck, and he was sitting completely alone. And
this as he's come back from doping and
his...
He hadn't had time to
process his weren't yet, like he went from
finish on all the interviews, the podium,
craziness,
the doping, and then And then obviously, when
he get back to the pits everyone in
the team that hasn't seen him has been
waiting for more than an hour. And
Got the big chair and some stuff sprayed
in him, but then he slipped off into
the truck, and I'm actually just wanting to
get home and stop my work This is,
like, I need to get working.
And there he was in in their lounge
in their truck and and just kind of
reliving the moment, and it only sunk then
where he's coming from and it's from, like,
the the bottom or the bottom
and not leaving him him himself even in
even this year when he healthy and back
racing,
to, you know, to
not just
being back on the podium or or taking
a win, but
how he won by this type of margin
on the conditions and the track. You know,
it's the hardest track and the hardest conditions.
Yet somehow, he still did it, and he
did it in in his fashion in in
the way he
he does do it.
So the question was,
what was the
the
how are you thinking
of what shot works or what?
It's we're taking a lot of shots so
they can use in all different ways. You
know?
I wanna still get a cover of a
magazine,
a cover on the Instagram carousel.
But I also wanna have a book. I
wanna have... If I wanna write a book
in 10 years about the greatest moments in
the last 30 years of our sport. I
wanna have that shot and that for sure
would be would be 1 of them as
similar to Jackson winning in
once ann,
last year. But so
I just wanna to be proud of and
have a body of work that sort of
does the sport justice and
lost over time.
And to do that, you gotta take a
ton of shots that you'll never use it
because you... He did the same thing with
Benoit or Men or Jackson and they didn't
wear you know? So usually,
all those things you did with Armor. You've
actually also done some of it with a
lot of other riders. You're not just rolling
the dyson choosing 1 ride and hoping they
went, you know.
At least me anyway. So... Yeah. Yeah. And
sometimes working as a photographer the team you
get more access, and and you spend more
time around the ride so you get some
cool stuff and
Yeah. Are there particular
images then in your back catalog that are
favorites that stand out, Like, I'd love to
hear maybe 1 1 or 2 stories around
a couple of pictures that really
resonate with you. It's so hard on the
spot, but
when Steve Pete,
so I was racing when he was racing
Ken Sonya, in fact, I was at Le
racing 2004,
when he up 2 seconds on Fabian. I'd
finished my race run before him because I
qualified...
This is World Champs.
So I qualified worse. I had a mass
of over the bars and that
there's like a...
Anyway,
not about my run.
Steve, and my parents and parents were actually
on the grass right near the finish line
and he he went way too fast and
just got ejected.
So I'd been there here when he'd missed
a lot of his wins or he's close
seconds. Yeah. I wasn't there for all his
battles with Nico.
Camera fast forward. He wins,
he had a pretty trick bike set up,
everyone was making lights stuff. He had a
full Daniel bike, but just had a little
road red cassette. There was the only, like,
custom week for tech camera that they did
to their bike.
But as it turned out, I didn't have
the best
race run shot. Because I... I think he
qualified, like, I don't know. 6 or 7,
but he didn't come down last.
So I was making my way to the
finish ball didn't 1 should be kent out
there
and I was kind of in no man's
land when he came by. So I do
have 2 shots of front shot and a
back shot and the the back shots kind
of cool, but you also don't wanna have
your favorite shot of Steve Paid Winning World
Champs as a butt shot. Like,
like, that's just not your race winning shot.
You know?
So I kind of got 2 shots that
I remember,
I got
they're late...
Either which way,
I got there's big scrum of people around
him. I got their late and Isaac, and
everyone's just cameras and this is media friends
family, every single person in the world 1
in Steve 1 and and any win in
1.
And I'd know... I couldn't get in, literally.
So I just literally
lay on the ground, crawled leopard crawl. Under
2 people's legs
looked up, and I just saw this like
vision... There was just this crowd of people
around him. We can pop this image up.
I can give it you. Nice. And
and Kinda having done a shot like that
before, And then
A sword wasn't gonna be a silhouette so
I just snapped a frame and then I
quickly spun the exposure dial to get it
exposed because shooting up to the sky, and
1 of the frames of the way the
people parted and moved, he
was became, like, it was pretty obvious that
he was the center of attention.
But then
more important, and then I got him
specifically
at the podium
I was like, okay. I wonders to be
about Steve
will challenge no 1 else matters. I put
a tilt shift lens on, which keeps him
in focus and Mick and
I know Mick was second. I forget who
was in third.
Anyway, they were blurry, but Steve was in
focus. And I was like, I was still
kind of like, I didn't get that race
with sure. I need more. And Steve Pete,
I was gonna document him till he fell
asleep. And I wasn't
even working for Santa cruz then Gary Per
was.
So then they went to some back
where
Normally, we're not allowed to go, but because
it's will champs.
They don't really know what you're allowed to
do. And because Australia they not used to
so desire to wondered in and there I
was, and there was the medals and it
was probably between anti doping and some kind
of press interview, but there was this quiet
room and space.
And Steve had literally
just picked up the phone and he he's
having a conversation with Dell and he had
had
his son's name written on each of his
loves. And
yeah, I've got a photo of him chatting
on the phone, like in tears,
I was pretty much in tears taking the
photo, and then he gave me like, a
double n with these kids names and the
gloves. So, like, that...
Even again, it's a series of photos. So
you asked me a question I went spoke
for too long
of a single image. It's the storytelling of
the narrative of of those Say, 5 pitches,
and the action photos is the worst out
of all of them.
You know, then there's the
Samuel crashing at Val assault in 2008. You
know, I don't want that to be, but
it's time stamps of moments in the sport.
So my
best
photos that I remember are not actually photographic
the photo that would end up on a
cover of a magazine. They're not
The ones that I like the most are
definitely not like they're not even technically correct
They. They might even be slightly soft or
exposure wrong or frame wrong or So there's
a couple of those that are,
I guess I'm remembering events and sport, and
then I'm thinking would... Image I have that
going in. So I'm that's... I guess I'm
I'm there to document the sport. Yeah. So
it's not so much. I got this coolest
photo because I you get as a photographer,
and we're getting shooting a lot of photos.
With the best riders in the world that
some of the best venues in the world,
we're gonna have lots of nice pretty photos
all of us. If you're not, you know,
like, we wouldn't be doing this or they
shouldn't be doing it.
So
those images are easy to get. You know,
there's tons of rachel assets and images which
I like super special just because I sort
of started with that her whole
whole and rise and, you know, from the
late 2 thousands all the way through.
Yeah. There's a couple of athletes I could
just have a book on just just on
that 1 1 athlete, you know,
greg Rachel Steve, Sam Hill is, you know,
through through everything.
The and this
shawn palmer pictures that, like, I kinda missed
his whole era. So I always always wanted
to get a good short palmer pitcher and
the funniest thing
the very first chart time I saw Shawn
palmer person was at Mon. No. No Actually,
so I I've seen before entire with the
Santa Cruz camp.
But Steve saw me were going everything God
and he's like sv jump in the Gauntlet
live with us. So there was, like,
still I was ready about is Steve at
this point, but sort of like, I can't
even though I was like, Palmer age or
something.
And
and then I like start taking pictures, but
I just see there's no battery in my
camera.
And I was like, fuck. I admitting this
for sure.
And I kind of just stopped, and then
we're getting in the gauntlet again in the
go... And then Steve's like, And what's a
monk? Usually you'd be taking a million first
Like... You don't wanna get take it foot
of me,
I mean, like, Gun. I'm like,
yeah. We'll when Get to the top and
get a battery from someone in the next
gon because I don't even have a battery
in the car in the in the camera.
I guess, well, palmer was like,
he was bigger than the sport at the
time. Right? When he stepped in, I ikea
had such a background from other sports that...
Yeah. When and when I was sort of
not formative years Daniel 2003 older
videos we watch were from, you know, trans
continental and and handle, like,
the circus will then circus is a bit
later after Palmer, but, you know, there's...
You know, he was, yeah, bigger than the
sport and and got it to
some levels that it needed to get to
and,
him and Missy missy too. She she was
of part of that whole... That whole vibe
and uplifting the sport into a bigger, bigger
aid.
And personalities. It's it's personalities and we're so
lucky in the sport, especially Daniel. We we
you know, I'm just watching the Toyota France
stuff and yeah, These guys have big following,
and and, I guess they have personalities, but
not what we've got in the sport.
And to have
access
everyone fans, you know, you can be put
side and and,
you know, to have a chat with low
armor and
all these writers have have,
you know, are doing such a good job
for the sport. They're not like, they just
Yeah. They they personalities. So it's really what
it comes down to so and we've got
a lot in the sport right now. And
I think we need a few more rival,
but like that's just You know, like, and
it be nice to have, like,
a few more villains in the sport. We
don't really have enough villains in. We haven't
had any real so strong
like, Greg,
Sam Hill and g,
they and Fabian,
like, they all respected each other. But they
all were
less friendly than the current like top 5
guys are amongst each other. Yeah. These these
5 or or hug and kiss each other,
and and go for dinner that way... Yeah.
It wasn't happening,
you know, 10 and, 10:15 years. Yeah. But
it is good. We don't we don't even
know. It's a it's a new world
everybody's is happy. Alright. To be nice. Yeah.
It's alright to be nice.
Talk a bit about the technology? Because obviously,
that's changed quite a lot. Like, are you...
Are you able to use
technology to your advantage, both in the process
when you're out on the hill taking shots,
I've seen using remote cameras and stuff.
But also when you get back, like, in
the editing and that side things. So the
technology...
While, it has helped us
take more
consistently
better or more usable or sharp
photos. It's actually kind of shut us in
the foot. Because say we
shot all day on cameras that only shot
7, 8 frames a second.
And then the order focus is good, but
not that good. So you're getting
a few usable shots per sequence or per
rider.
Now you're shooting
15
frames as a second, if not more,
and nearly all those frames are shops, so
he's spending that much time to go through
milliseconds or moments to pick the ones.
You know, Say you would have shot
2000 images a day and now shooting 07/08/9000
images a day. And of those 2000 images
you shot a few years ago, you know,
you'd add 200 because that's you know, now
you shot 7000 new editing 700.
So technology, while it's helped us
be more reliable. It's it's definitely cost us
a lot of time.
There is a bit of Ai editing software
out there. In it's early days
I'm I'm not using any of that. I'm
sort of I'm going frame by frame. Yeah.
Shot by shot. You know, you're you... I'm
not using any presets. I'm mean, I'm literally
hitting each shot sing.
You might apply the same a little bits
of tweaks of of, black, some contrasts and
and kinda of temperature and stuff to the
same group of shots, but I'm
editing each shot
individually.
So
technology wise, yeah, the cameras are getting better.
Internet. The most places are getting better except
in Com. We we were struggling to get
stuff uploaded with phones and Wifi.
Remotes and stuff. There's there's a lot of
technology for people for press and agency photos
like 2 d France type stuff where you
literally
plugged into an Ftp into your camera through
through a little wireless modem. Okay. And you
you've... It's streaming as you're taking it to
an a picture editor.
I'm not...
I'm... I've do some jobs like that. Some
bigger road races in South Africa,
but I haven't actually shot for for a
while, but
where it's all about the agency and some
of the red bull stuff have done in
hard line where you're getting a shot,
this
Like, the Twitter France stuff talking to her
photographer that's that's the main photographer Toyota France,
he said, Like, if if they're getting the
shot
20 minutes late, it's it's old news. Like,
that
attack on the hill is already
in an edited by an editor that's sitting
off sites somewhere or in another country even
So,
you know, thankfully our sports, you know,
we don't need still images. You you get
a lot of
video and live feeds that cover that. So
we can,
you know, we can still, you know, doing
everything you can to deliver moments or hours
the same day. But
And some images if someone's winning world champs,
I can get it that image to my
phone, do a quick edit. While I'm waiting
for podium, they having an an image and
quickly send a podium image at the same
time, but so connectivity to mobile devices.
But in the end of the day,
you know, there's many forms of media,
and
a iphone clip of a moment or a
podium
and video or still whatever
that comes out immediately is is can be
more valuable than that still image, which can
come out later because there's
room can have all this other media
news events. Yeah. And then the good stuff
people can wait for or
come out later that day or wait up
later the month or get snagged for a
marketing campaign or something. So,
yeah. No technologies
help but not in the best of ways.
So basically get less sleep basically. Yeah. I
wanted to ask about video actually, because it
feels like for a long time
sort of photographers of being king of the
hill or at a mountain bike event, and
there's been there's such a demand now online
for video like, I mean, we're sat here
in front cameras and that wouldn't be my
first choice.
Do you...
How do you see that? Because it feels,
you know, people like sleeper occurrence and stuff
have been well placed to make the most
of that, and there's more and more and
more media content
of video content that coming off the hill.
Now do you see a a transition
to some extent away from photography? I feel
like hopefully if still photography always be a
part of it, But is it less so
feel now? I wouldn't say it's it's less,
so. It's
there's definitely more video because
that's consumed
and favor,
the algorithms favor that unreal and everything.
But,
like, for sure, they coexist. Mh.
If a team at only a video and
no still...
You know, and
it needs a actual third component, and it
needs that bridging component
where you have a a social media manager
that's managing
that content both
professional video, professional photo and on the ground,
like, some of the
2 most important people I see at these
races like N and Anna that they work
for common cell and syndicate,
and there's a there's
there's a couple of... There's more than just
them doing it. Yeah. But,
they almost have a more important role than
me the photographer or
the film because they managing immediate And sometimes
they're running the athletes accounts within the team
as well. They're they're running the brand account.
They're running the team account,
and they're putting the on the hill behind
and like Lorry pulls over to talk to
Steve and they there that that
kind of constant
demand for
what the fans have got used to seeing
what used to be kind of handled by
the magazines or by the videos or by
the websites like the power from
magazines videos and websites, Those have gone long
ago. Yeah. It's it's... And it's not even
the brand or the team feeds where people
are consuming the content athlete feeds, and and
those are and obviously, by the athletes themselves,
but then there's other people at events
that Are are doing that, Sir,
if I but to go back to the
original question, like, his photo or video,
these
hierarchy, I would say. But
if I was starting out now,
it would be hard to come in as
a someone just shooting photos. Yeah. So I
think a lot of the newcomers would be
able to either do both
or
or, like, if I was a a kid
greg them now, I would probably wanna come
in and do it from,
doing moving images, but the the problem with
that,
the...
It's such it's
A lot of my work is event based
and luckily I've called the knee out from
myself and always be a need for some
photos, and
so I never have to chase or keep
looking for photo or photo work. It's it's
sort of part of the package.
But
if you're doing video,
then it's also like, how many... It's no
longer just video because are you doing social
video are you forming vertically?
And are you forming that like that. And
are you also doing a Youtube or you
do key frame? Or you... Like, there's so
different ways and then is it gonna be
edited? It be long form short form is
a getting slower where you doing real time?
Are you doing audio or you're just doing
a jan and you're forming slower and releasing
in real time and are you using order
focus. Are you using focus filters.
Like
it would suck more for me as a
filmmaker
to be, like, on the hill, and then
all you your shit's getting ripped to... Excuse
me.
Getting ripped and it's been used in like
the most terrible way and not how you
shot it, but like, so the art of
the craft gets torn apart. But then the
at end of the day, you gotta do
a job and and how how is that
consumed? How is your media consumed
dictates how you should do it? And like
this,
people like see here that can do his
big death grip form with clay porter, but
then it can is equally hand of, like,
using a small evening phone and just forming
vertical for, you know, it just it's it
just goes back to what
is the story you're trying to get out?
Where is it being consumed and and just,
you know, so you have different deliverables and
different way of doing the same job just
like photography. Yeah. I'm shooting for Instagram sometimes,
and I'm shooting on my phone even and
or even, you know, some of my best
work that I'm happiest with at World cup,
like I did an interview with finale and
with Emery more recently.
Those are the 2 moments I almost
like both from those 2 world cups and
it wasn't even me taking photos. I'm I'm
like, a photographer yes, but I'm more of
a storyteller and
those conversations, the 1 of the fin he
came to to just hang out I in
a hotel room and and how it was
Zig y I didn't even know if he
was visiting me.
And us... He was on the podium so
I did the interview and you never know
if it's gonna be a 30 second 2
minute
and then we ended up chatting for 10
minutes. This was Leah getting posted and taking
a couple of day or a day was
the track. Yeah. Super interesting. Yeah. So... And
and you never And to me, that was
1 of my more interesting stories I captured
at Leah and it wasn't even a photograph.
I. I didn't even take a photo of
him in the room.
An Emery
I
did the similar thing of El soul when
you had... But then I was like,
I was like, shit. I didn't even get
a photo of fin. So I
filmed
alm on the iphone because thinking it back
ahead it could get cut to a to
1 of my slide shows, and then we
into space like a slideshow from his whole
week with the tat we had in his
truck and those kind of things are are
kind of cool. And Also, I'm lucky to
have
the miss bin summers guys
take that from me. I've
sent them the clip. They've got my dropbox
at all my images of Armor from the
whole week. And then I can carry on
with my normal work. And
since it's having a team behind and and
then so between Ben and James and Archie,
they
brought that to life through the the
the views. Yeah. Sort of thing that we're
doing on on miss Spin seventh. So... Yeah.
So again, it's... And then again, that's multimedia.
It's not video. It's not photos. It's not
it's it was it's Slideshow format with subtitles.
So it's You just kind of gotta go
with how the meter has been consumed really?
Definitely. Yeah. I've used as well Worth checking
out vehicle Haven't. You've got such a good
rapport with all the riders there that it's
always you get some great insight after the
racing.
Do do you think we're at a point
yet where we've... We're, like, reaching max
content from a work cup It feels pretty
saturated. There's a a lot of stuff coming
out. Yeah. The... I mean, and everyone's doing
this
similar thing in terms of the athletes are
also doing... They trying, like, stay relevant and
you know, a couple of them are good
Youtube
accounts as well.
But then again, like, you're the consumer, you
can pick or choose who you following who
you're consuming from what you're viewing and and
but then at the same time,
even though we have live feeds, and this
goes especially true for End,
without some of that athlete content or maybe
some of our content, the story wouldn't be
getting out there, you know? Yeah. And maybe
that's also why I'm looking for the stories
within the story or the story behind story
to to... Obviously, the... There's a live stream
everyone sees what happens in the race and
and or some people see what happens in
the race. But there's a lot of
stories are are untold or little bit... We...
Even now, even at the done you can
build a bit more personalities they can build
up you can
lot more depth with these athletes that offer
a lot more that could be exposed or
used a bit a bit better or bit
more.
And obviously, the whole side of things, any
additional storytelling
or insight you can give, you know, we'll
we'll go huge into getting that sort of...
Yeah. Story of the race that message or
where we are out. Yeah. I guess there's
a level for everyone right depends how into
the sport you are. If you if you're
a passing fan, you can watch a highlights
video if you're fairly into it, you can
watch the broadcast. And then if you want
more, you can delve into all sorts of
vlogs and podcasts an imagery and video and
yes there's a lot out there. You can
go deep and what what is worrying though
like, for some of the cool fans. Sometimes
it's quite hard to see the main product
and the replay and the live feeds or
there's quite a few countries where I've heard
the
the finals are suddenly last minute bumped and
then they have a darts or a sneaker
contest shown and then your life feeder was
a replay. And then if you're sitting in
the country, and you don't have an alternate,
you know,
it's a a tricky 1 out there. Yeah.
It's okay if you're at home and you
got your usual way of of,
of watching the racing. But if you're traveling
a bit, some friends
from the Uk and they got their package
but now then in Sweden it doesn't work
because they're as geo based and... Yeah.
There's no... There's no 1 place to go
get it to make it nice and simple,
like, last year. There was like Gcn
Least core consumer, you could find your replay
there you can find anything there. So it'd
be nice to see that again or even
the riders sometimes they struggle to find their
runs and show their race runs.
You know, it it can be done, but
even the rebel
website at times was quite hard to navigate
search. So it's
there's no
what's silver bullet and everything. Yeah. There isn't
for sure. Yeah. So we've seen a lot,
obviously changes in technology change in the media
landscape. And then, like you say changes in
in kind of the racing over the last
couple of years since the warner brothers takeover.
Yeah, I'm keen to hear your thoughts on
what's gone on so far, like, the last
couple of years and where things are heading.
So there's there's
things that or,
have continuously, like,
just when you thought the racing couldn't get
more intense the last time we spoke in
2019.
Was a 2019 here when when Emery won,
and that was the first huge.
Yeah. Yeah. That was. So,
like you just... With those sites we'd never
seen before, and the racing was as good
as it could possibly ever be
But every year we see those moments again
and again. And the racing is even tighter
and even faster even better. So so
And then with the switch to Warner brothers,
there's definitely a whole lot of
they've elevated the sport in a lot of
good ways.
The presentation, everything's a bit more professional and
slick. And I'm just talking about, like, the...
When you show up to in the event,
It does look like it's sort of
just step up in in terms of, like...
Yeah. The brand in the sign. Is just
connotation of Yeah. But then sometimes that's come
at a price. And and there's been a
tracks side as a spectator
there's a lot of... If you look at
a finnish bowl picture from 2019 Fort William.
From the visit Scotland Arch, which it's just
sadly no longer there, and that's a tradition
of the sport, it was been the Tis
arch. It's been the Gru arch. No. Maybe
4 all william them don't have had a
Gru arch, but it's been many different things
and Scotland for the last few years. And
to not have an arch.
Was just sec of my opinion. But the
worse than that,
I don't know what they smoothed out the
finish, but somehow
All spectators removed from both sides of the
track... Long time ago the... From the right
side of the track was kept free because
you've... Because they're crossing the track. But we
used to have this huge
sort of finish areas where the
fan spectators would line the course. But in
in a safe way in safe sections, they're
all still with B zone. And increasingly,
the fans are being kept away from the
track. And from the finished bowls
have got bigger,
but
they've got wider and there they've made it
less personal. There's less. I I wouldn't say
because you don't need intimacy, but
if you're not surrounded
by people, you'd lose that vibe and it
doesn't resonate through and it doesn't translate as
well to the lab as the last 3
4 events. We've had lower spectator numbers than
than at any world cup
previously at those at those venues.
A lot of it has been due to
quite bad weather the forecast. This this is...
As everyone knows has been the worst summer
in Europe. In in living memory. Yeah. This
is there's... We haven't and see in summer.
So that's part in parcel, but also,
Your show up Event is quite expensive to
go spec some events, some some are free.
But then you can't even access a lot
of the track or the B zones are
taped
la
far too wide
and you
at what point do you not come back
to an event to watch because you can't
even, you know, see the and be hanging
over the track and having wheels flying by
your head. We don't need that. But
you can definitely have a compromise and even
the finish area the the the hot seat,
the riders are so far removed.
And as the rider crosses the line, he's
whisk away. He doesn't even have
minute to celebrate or if especially if the
rider has already crossed a lot earlier and
he was 1 of the earlier finishes. We
don't ever seem again. He doesn't come back
to the finish bowl. The crowd doesn't seem
them. It's like a big massive anti climax.
The media doesn't see him. We can barely
see him in the hot seat because they're
elevated and they hidden behind these big screens
and then there's massive arch, which... So basically
effectively...
And you've got
12:15
feet, if not more,
just taken up sort of unnecessarily, and sometimes
placed in the only logical place to view
the finish line as as a media or
film or a photographer,
but that said, they are working increasingly with
us to help tweak those areas. That's good.
So that we care work. But Yeah. There's
a lot of
there's a lot of emphasis and, I guess
rightly so because then 1 of brothers in
discovery and business of putting on a good
Tv package. But
a lot of... Unfortunately, some of the time,
it's at the expense of the on... Live
viewing experience for spectators.
Poland had a big finish area and spectators
were kept out of unless they paid to
get the Vip stand, which set pretty much
empty.
We can even go up and take a
photo from that V stand, which was almost
empty. So there was no, like could vibe
at the finish area. Yeah. Yeah. And there
was a great racing in Poland amazing racing.
So
I think
there's...
But every year, they've been improving everything, and
they noticing when things can be done better.
And and even just this year now, we
have sort of 2 or 3 dedicated media
personnel
that Lia and interacts with us working press
be photographers of farmers,
helping us do our job better and making
things easier and getting feedback on those shooting
positions, but, you know, there's there's
there's always more that can be done. And,
obviously, this is not, you know, there's only
so much that can be done as well.
From a from an event organized standpoint. But
I just...
I I just
we see way things can be better, and
and
I also said it can't be a thorn
in the side whether the event organizer or
or a thing. I'd I just want the
sport to be good for both the fans,
the races,
and us media and people, especially on... You
know, you don't wanna alienate those those people.
Yeah. Like, fort william were used to getting
10, 15000. I don't even think we had
5000.
K. Leah gang, we didn't finish the finish
ball.
Then Joe this weekend in Come was, like,
quite quiet.
So there's obviously some things could be done
better from some standpoint, You know? How do
you feel about the lack of race tape
does that help from a perspective. When we
got an End endure now, and they type
of, you know, corners as as they... End
endure if you can just gave them polls,
these guys be out the polls. Give them
a half a chance. It there's no marshall
there'd be 3 poles.
So race tape sadly still needed in in
euro, not at like, cra like stone king
rally,
with bit more the spirit of endurance followed.
But
it's so hard
imagining how it is to shoot a world
cup with tape. Like,
it's only been like the 2 years with
these poles and and
And also when they suggested polls, I was
like, that'll will never work. Yeah, I think
we all when I know, a good luck
of that. Yeah. And it's it's working
fine Perfectly. Like, I think we have almost
less incidents than people cutting the course accidentally
than than we've had before. Also because we
have more of the track shown on the
live feeder, which is also good.
So the polls have been amazing. Yeah.
Now and then they and then worst possible
spot as a photographer, but literally, you, you
know, you you you you have quite a
few kilometers track issue
because as much as we'd like to move
the pole like
2 feet, so we get a better photo.
They they do need to be at certain
intervals to keep the flow of the track
and opposing poles and and
basically, the right stool or using it as
sighting and Yeah. Yeah. Track boundaries. So we
we avoid touching the poles that we definitely
used in old days like, move the tape
up and down, you know, and then forget
to move back up and down. It's Jorge
Who's now the marketing guy at Mon Ae
used to hate us for him rightly slow.
Exactly so.
But we can laugh about it now. But
so the polls of the Gods sent and,
and it it just looks good on on
the on the
just good lie feed and looks good in
the photos makes our job easier.
Some of the writers said it was hard
to get used to it at first, but
yeah.
Yeah. Looks cool. Because problem problem with tape,
if you have a problem spot, you got
a marshall that doesn't actually have enough reserve
tape, you just have knots and then they
put a double row tape and there's more
knots and more knots. So the nail is
part of the track where you tend to
shoot has got a bunch of tape with
the 20 knots in it, and they're just
hanging. The branding upside down. It just doesn't
look good on anybody. Yeah. Like, you always
want the event to look it is professional.
So you want, you know, everything to look
professional, So tape never did look professional. Yeah.
Good stuff. How about more rounds? We hear...
We hear rumors of quite a few more
rounds potentially. So I had 13
rounds were presented to the teams,
plus world champs 14.
But realistically,
also heard from the teams that while that
might be an ideal number to get to,
it's It's a hundred percent not feasible to
do it within a year. From a budget
perspective. Yeah. Because that's almost doubling your budget.
That's almost doubled. So you gotta pay the
riders double could pay staff double your flights
to w or everything available. And it's at
this time of the year,
we, you know, budgets are pretty much done
for next year I would... I for the
most part, You know? And it's also not
the best time in the industry to double.
So
I could realistically see a up to maybe
9 events later here and then double digits
a lady,
but sadly, I don't think I saw any...
At least not for next year. I didn't
see any
signed it. There's no
New Zealand Or Australia or South africa liquid.
This is Diet Dany I'm talking about. There's
no South America. So those, hopefully,
when we do get to double digit races.
Yeah. 10 plus.
And this doesn't seem and the calendar it
didn't look like it was like a whistler
option, and it didn't look like there was
another North America. It seem like it might
only still be months.
But
like nothing's official. Nothing's out. I was just
kind of filling in the dots with what
dates and what months events are usually. Yeah.
But for sure, without a doubt, we should
have, like, an Australia or New Zealand or
both or if you're flying all that way,
2 world cups,
you know, 2 in new Zealand or 2
in Australia or 1 in new zealand or
Australia, like they did with Aws and and
it's the same. I mean, chris ball did
do that with Aws. When went to Chile,
we didn't just go Tell you, We went
to Argentina as well. So... But the man
there's there's a lot of other countries that
have huge markets,
good Tv markets,
good bike markets,
Santiago. I can know Brainer obviously, where we
had the ed Ed...
Is there.
And then going back to Japan,
South Africa,
where they have the World cup and s
bushes. Yeah. Could definitely have a annual event,
it would be
a bit trickier because it would have to
be shuttle, but you know, if they're reducing
the numbers, then that wouldn't be as bigger
a problem.
So there's lots of,
yeah. I mean, I think there should be
more rounds,
10 rounds and make 1 of them a
throw because of the state of the
sport, you know,
to do the sport, with the amount of
injuries to have a seasonal what title decided
on a
broken finger risk collar bone or flat tire,
Yeah. The bikes are empty and you meant
to pick your right lines. But
the nature of the sport and how it
is to win a race, you are riding
over your head
or it seems like they should be wearing
over the head.
It'd be nice to have a a throw
away, you know, not and and not use
it just because you don't wanna spend the
money go the event you... Yeah. Yeah. A
reason to use it.
A doctor's note or something.
Are you into the idea of this Lc
queue last chance qualify thing? Well, yeah. I
think we'd
Andrew Andrew brought it up like more than
a year ago,
and we've talked about it a lot, but
No 1 likes a semi file. I was
quite surprised that the semi final stayed on,
to be honest because it's seemed like it
was a unanimous decision that noah 1 I
liked it. Yeah. So I thought, okay. Well,
they're keeping it because they still... They wanted
to do extra broadcast. U. So then they
to show it, and there was no broadcast.
Yeah. Which they also said nothing about, like,
didn't just never... Not to us not to
the teams. So the teams has asked to
pay this more in return we're getting all
this extra viewing, or that that didn't happen
this year.
My worry is that
that
this is my conspiracy theory. This is not
based on factor there are facts in it.
They wanna get the numbers down and inches
next year.
The way they allocate points,
you have to be basically making the final.
Yeah. So that semi final takes away the
points that people may just qualify, You know,
your top 60 riders.
Now there's less people making points. So you
have a semi final for 2 years. Suddenly,
you got at the end of that 2
year period, you suddenly got very few people
with the right amount of points, whatever they
decide you need
because you can't just have it elite trade
teams only because there's many riders we've seen
the Sierra that have been in the top
10 or on the podium that are not
on an elite trade team. Yeah. Or fastest
woman in the day.
Joe but joe Joe Bowman junior. Right? Yeah.
Early. Yeah. You know, and there's not a
trade team. Technically, there's quite a few people
that wouldn't be able to race a world
cup that have beat on podium Yeah. Or
in top 10, Lucky, Anna. Yeah. So there's...
There's there's a lot of people about that.
So So, obviously, there needs to be more
than just trade teams that are allowed and
you will have World cup ranking points. But
then is it world ranking that you can
get in Ocean or you can get your
continental or your or your the odd race
in your home country which aren't a lot
of races to get point.
So suddenly by keeping the semi final another
year, you've you've really cut a lot of
people's woke cup points that they would have
been able to use to enter a world
cup the following season, You know, while those
points about it. So that's a little bit
worry. But, yeah. Lc q, you know, have
your top 30 that that qualify.
And
you have your next 30 riders, and you
offer 10:15, 20 spots whatever to get
said the file has got 40 or 50
or to 45 or whatever it is. Yeah.
Of course, up the woman's
number to more equitable number.
Everyone's saying that so we don't even need
to, like, go on about. That just good...
To me as a brainer, and we shouldn't
have to be asking or or discussing it.
Yeah. So that Lc lgbtq,
again,
warner brothers are in the in the in
the business of giving entertainment. Viewing entertainment.
A El ones qualifier
is a lot more entertaining. It is a
lot more on the line. Yeah. Than another
race which just kinda like the final them
which is kinda like the qualifying.
This is giving
all the guys, and then there'll be maybe
some tweak in the protection rule, you know,
that should be in the final and extra
chances. Like I, what if they flattered in
the in their quality, but they were on
the podium last weekend? But they're not put
protected from the last year. Yeah. You wanna
watch them right variety. So
to him to have a Lc secured. It's
just it's an brainer. And it's it's just
you know, 30 riders 1 more run on
the hill. That's literally 30 more minutes in
the day. Yeah. It's 40 minutes,
if you're doing women or or 50 minute.
You know, so it's in all in all,
it's you'll be fighting an hour in it
a.
It it takes a lot longer to run...
It takes a lot longer to run
a whole semi final.
So
everything's easier, the day shortened the,
you know, and I wouldn't say there's an
unfair practice because these riders have had 1
more run on the course. Because those guys
that made the top 30. You could pretty
much awesome. Do you wanna do another run
or would you rather chill or go walk
to course? They'll be like, we'll chill thank
again much we've done enough riding and racing.
So
So I think it's... It be good for
everyone for fans, for spectators on side. Yeah.
Again, a good thing for them.
Because it's a bit grim you go into
Sunday if it's a Sunday race. If it's
a Daniel lonely, and there's only, like, at
the moment there's
the junior is, this is like 50 people
riding on the hill, and at some venues,
that's not a lot of writing. So you're
to your final day and you've paid this
money and you've made your holiday and your
camping in the woods and you're walk the
track. There's not a lot of writers you're
watching. There's not a lot of your favorite
writers because they got knocked out in the
semi, You know? So
yeah. It's a balance all of this say.
But I hope they show the Lc q
on broadcast because... Well, I mean, it's a...
It would be a no brainer not to,
and it would be
a perfect sort of
lead up a teaser
to to to get people to tune and
you know, to the 2 that I, it's
kind of what what the whole semi was
meant to do, but then people find out
because it was on the same day. Was
too much viewing was too much naughty too
towards the same.
And you can just show the highlights, you
know, You didn't have to show full runs
of there. So you still
showing kind of cool bits of the track
or certain camera angles,
or, left for the main show as as
they come should be.
Perhaps yeah. Yeah. Interesting. Let's talk a bit
about End then. It looks
like, looking from the outside. I've not been
on... Any this year, but the tracks looks
to have been good. The racing that's to
have been good. The coverage does seem to
have taken a step up. I think there's
more coming out. What's the what's the vibe
generally at the insurers this year. I'd say
last year they were
massively
overlooked and were just almost
kicked to the curb in terms of sort
of how they were
treated in amount of
amount of
coverage sort of the organizers or the 1
brothers discovery
were sort of dev voting
time resources, media output. Mh. It it just...
This year, there's a definite noticeable
improvement on on all fronts. It's also
it also has that
sort of pro presentation.
But a lot of it is down to
the the the local organizers that that if
they do a better job than that
event is also better. You know, Like, the
guys Tasmania last year, did amazing job And
it started off, I was like, oh, sweet,
this is End endurance is gonna be in
a good place.
But the the problem is
for me anyway, you've got
pro
best interior riders in the world riding on
Thursday and Friday.
People can't even take off work in their
hometown to watch the Friday race. Yeah.
You know.
And then you have the eb bikes
bizarre on the Saturday and the Sunday. We're
now...
This weekend, it was a Saturday practice a
half day practice and in the Sunday. So
Like Saturday and Sunday, on a standalone event,
and we have no... You know, it's a
stand. So we're I'm not competing with Daniel
and it's not a triple event.
With this Daniel Chris Country and everything else
going on.
Yet the guys are still racing on on
a Friday. So they're not getting the spectators
you know,
so, yeah, it's isn't really a spectator friendly
sport, but it isn't a lot of places.
You have these huge policies of people
and fans. There's a lot of cool fans.
And it's like, actually a good way to
watch a race because you're getting around the
network of trails in a bike. And says.
It's a very fun way to watch a
race some rounds. You know?
Not all a set up like that.
But so having said that definitely looks like
from on the ground at the end endurance,
they have their staff, their production there's a
much bigger crew,
and they're getting their highlights out quicker and
better, and there's more stories been told and
there's more content pushed up from End endure.
But then
And the racing is is is equally good
and and still being elevated.
Still some questionable venues like Leah gang,
is
you know?
You're pe 70 k's because there aren't good
tracks suited for in europe. Yeah. And then
you're traversing to ride 2 stage in another
towns. Like, maybe we should have had that
race in that town or,
you know, is are in the business of
cutting costs and piggyback events to save on
staff from production properly, but, you know,
the the whole
the whole way
this whole warner brothers discovery
thing was become what it is now was
based on sort of Chris balls
immense success of what he did with End
endure over 10 years. Yeah.
So it's kind of sad to see where
it is now compared to anything 10 years
ago. You know, for the first 10 years,
and it was a sort of the last
3 years was a bit a few things
creeping in, but,
yeah. So
you know, IIII,
like I said, I I still have a...
I'm still loving endure, the the riding and
the racing and and even, like, I'm not
a e bike hate tip saying, why are
we having Eb box in the weekend because
the Eb bikes yes yesterday was. What they
did in the mud,
gnarly conditions where were... They had harder weather
conditions and on heavier bikes.
But
the the riding of the athletic, the professionalism
you know, is is is still all time.
But,
you know, when the top writers Of of
feeling hadn't and feeling overlooked or, I wouldn't
say disrespect. But, yeah, disrespect, you know, and
they couple of them like, well, they don't
wanna become eb bike races They rather just
do Downhill, but, you know, why don't you
just not worry about that? Just put on
the best event possible.
And we got Ka having World champs and
those are event organizers are are already good.
Swiss guys put on a really good events.
So, like, the next couple events I'm I'm
very positive. They will be sweet and good
because
I think a lot more comes down to
the local organizers than them getting the the
tracks and stuff right. But, like,
this last weekend,
the ride most like all the tracks are
a little bit flat at times and and
part of it is condition wise...
But
everyone enjoyed every every in 0, there's gonna
be 1 track or 2 that's not enjoyable,
but 3 or 4 that Are are good.
But
for the first time, we're we as a
media arrived there and we've got 360 degree
view of Mont blanc and all this surrounding
both sides of the valley. Literally, you couldn't,
like,
you stood at the top of the mountain
where 3 stages started,
you couldn't, like,
there was a a view everywhere.
Except where those 3 stages started. They somehow
managed to go like, 2 meters below the
top of the hill where they could have
started on the top of the hill
every stage start could have had the first
turn
with a mountain background where the B mod
blanc or whatever,
a gui immediate and somehow they manage... It
must have been difficult to somehow take the
courses to not get a mountain of view.
I don't know how they managed it, but
they did.
And it's like, that's why we came to
your region. This is what you're selling us.
Like yeah. I've put on events and I've
literally taped courses. I've we did a 700
kilometer s king rally race, and we literally
take the course on the side of a
cliff so we can have a side of
a cliff on the course.
Not so the rider falls off and we
get clickbait, but
it's not hard.
You know, yes. I understand your access and
far as and things. But if you've got
a year to work an event, like,
there's so much need to get done often,
there's little things to get over list.
Right? Yeah. I mean, I I literally thought
of free taping a course, like, literally 2
meters moving
the the course tape. Because that 2 meters
would have put us with him blanc, and
that's entire little it took.
But, anyway,
that's just an example
because there's way more positives than negatives in
euro, and and
I just feel like the writers should be
maybe listened to more like the downhill
got listened to the slope style got listened
to, and and then got their ways in
the daniel of I'm getting their feedback. And
I know there is a working group with
Euro. Mh. Have a bit more of a
role and and Josh Calls thankfully is
He's been racer from both sides E bike
and normal and nice he's part of Warner
brothers discovery, and he's taken upon himself. He's
not it's not his role.
Better he's
giving in a huge amount of he's kind
of put the
a lot of energy his energy, which is
good energy
into
making
everybody happy, both the racing, the package, the
Tv, and he knows the stories he knows
riders. So
Thankfully, we have a Josh Coles there that,
like,
so that is really good and Yeah. And
there's like,
million bigger picture things where I'm sure, like,
if an organizers listening to me, they say,
yeah but yeah but it was sv, like,
complaining yet, but I'm hopefully being constructive and
not just been
not constructive. Yeah. Fair. Do you think that,
like, the scheduling at the weekend of e...
Of e bike being on the weekend and
normal bike being Thursday, Friday is reflect of,
like, the industry demand. If... But everything I
hear is that e bike sales are very,
very strong and
bike sales are so should result weaker, But...
So should we not raise daniel because they're
not selling the bags and they're selling eb
bikes? Very fair point. So should we raise
radial your finals on
Friday and have the bike race at the
Daniel event on Sunday and the Saturday. Yeah.
So, I mean, to come on. There's arguments
or are silly that they're giving us.
The
the sport.
Maybe just trying to think
the pro the problem is, yes. There's pressure
to
there's maybe some pressure from the industry
to have
more people entering E. They struggle to get
50 people to enter an bike race. Yeah.
The field was pretty small still. We Still
and it was bigger than normal this weekend.
Yeah. So so they've tried to do... Okay,
well, let's make the eb box on the
on the weekend and let's do the schedule
completely separately. So some writers can raise both,
which a couple of writers are are starting
to do now. But now actually what the
eb bike are doing, they're racing both. Not
because Wanna race both because they get more
practice. They get another race run on the
track, which makes them better in the eb
bike race.
So it's it's
it's like a... I wouldn't say a new
form of cheating because you'd be seated not
to, but it's another lap on the track.
Yeah. You're gonna have to pedal and you're
gonna lose lot energy. So It's a it's
quite a balance. But these guys are are
fit and they're racing bikes, so they can
probably fit in 1 more day of it's
actually half a day of riding. Yeah.
So the before we'd have the e bike
and the normal bike at the same day,
and then the eb bikes would do a
few extra stages, and it was quite hard
for the media cover both
equally or fairly.
So it kind of worked because we still
at least raced on weekends, but it also
didn't work because it was quite tough to
cover and and the eb bikes would be
marginalized to some degree.
But then
but then is the current form of
world cup bike racing. The best
way we should be racing world cup eb
box.
Essentially racing the exact same of endure with
a few extra
stages and a few power stages. And the
power stage are no longer climbing stages, they're
little trials, obstacle courses and circles.
A little bit of tech moves and some
climb... Obviously, climbing
climbing themed or base. But
it... So is that the best way to
race or or or
deliver the showcase e bike racing to the
world? Do bikes need to be raised at
World cup level?
Or is it a big festival race and
you race around Mont Blanc and you use
bloody a lot of batteries because that's what
you we use e bikes for?
When I run my e bike, I'm maxing
out my...
You know,
anyway, I I no. I'm with you. I
think I I just like I haven't thought
about evo bikes. And what's the solution for
them. I just know a festival based
participate like,
You know, there's eva graces
like to rome and then jerome payments and
put on that like, it sells out 304
hundred riders because because they're doing the right
kind of adventure right in a forest, where
you go hell afar, and then they have
your batteries up in a, in a
in a
refuge
and when you switch batteries or charge and
have a long land. Like, there's other ways
of doing Yeah. Doing stuff. But then, you
know, obviously, you're doing within the form of
a race where there's
village and media and
production and staff and timing. So
you know, I'll I need to think about,
you know, how to do E bike, but,
you know, and I'm not... And... But just
putting the
top athletes
on a Thursday and a Friday, that's just
not right. You know. Yeah.
Yeah. And then some of the track locations
have been chosen
because they had the budget to do a
race, you know, a lot of venues were
told unless he doing a Daniel
and
you know, but it at Daniel and a
e
end.
Do you have give to deb birth? You
can't do 1. Okay. So you... There's a
lot of... In the early days
the venues were chosen solely on, is that
the best trails we can ride when we
go to Chile,
Argentina, Australia, New Zealand, Yeah. And nearly all
the time, it was yes yes yes Yes.
And now those definitely...
Those incidents saying. We can go look at
the last 2 years of you know, there's
a couple of classic events, but, the answers
is that's... That is not the same. Yeah.
Yeah. Which is also a reality and the
world will live in and budgets. And
So, yeah. I'm not I'm not oblivious to
that fact. Yeah. A tough time to make
things work for sure. But let's tap into
the spirit of End endure an an event
that I think I've heard you say in
the past your favorite event of the year
stone king rally.
We had the third and final
s king rally, just a couple of weeks
back.
What is it about that event that that
kind of speaks to you?
Well, when I lived in the Us,
and I was
started by Daniel Mountain America I didn't really
start by cross Country biking because in those
days
2 very different sports. Now. We have trail
bikes and you're essentially daniel on a bike
that pedal up a hill, You know? But
then...
So when we rode bikes, it was Downhill
Labs down the labs and eventually when we
got, like, bikes that would capable of going
trail riding.
I would go for a 2 hour ride,
and I thought that was a man of
my ride. You know? You're either doing dino
labs shuttles for a day or or chair
lift And then when you went in my
my ride, it's like an hour loop or
2 hour loop whatever.
When we got to Europe,
and
the besides this the mountains and the length
of the trails and we... This is what
we discovered pre Aws with French interior season
series and super and Mega launch and all
things like that.
It's like, it changed my idea and vision
and concept
about what mountain biking was. It it was
no longer a little sport I fitted into
my work or my job or my my
off office stay or I worked in a
bike shop back then and that escape
distribution company.
But now it's like,
it's kind of
you can go on an old day adventures
on a bike. And and it's amazing what
bikes what terrain
you can cover on bikes is days. Normal
bikes and bikes.
So basically, it's the
and the way
from this the way the Ed has evolved
into the short they half day races. By
the time the pros start, they started after
12 and they so they were riding for
5 hours as well. On on the hill
for 5 hours riding for not not the
5 hours.
So the old 2 day full day
Aws has has sort of changed and got
more professional on and got, like, super fast
and
sports progressed in a long way where both
equipment wires athlete wise and also the way
you approach racing the estate.
So
I've always liked riding new trails in new
countries and and riding the best trails and,
you know, hook out with the local, you're
finding This is pre trail folks and and
heat maps and all the rest.
So to go to an event, like, Stone
king rally and Ash has done, you know,
10 years before that with trans He's basically
done all that thinking out of you. And
and
as a
as a result, he started a whole new
niche
race series.
There's Sierra nor. There's Trans
there's Trans New Zealand Trans Tasmania.
There's
a trans error.
He has 2 editions.
So it's it's birth the whole... It's almost
like a whole genre. There's almost different athlete.
You can take
Richard Root and Jesse... Actually, Jc I feel
could do good at these trans races because
he's pretty
I mean, not taking the away from Ritchie,
but
like, I don't think those guys can win
these 6 day blind
on side riding. It's a different style of
riding. So it's a very pure proper way
of riding your bike reacting and
and visualizing and pacing and and planning and
and keeping your equipment and your body and
your tires and it's a very
different type of riding, but it's it's a
very
I don't know, like, perhaps the purest or
the the the the best way of riding
a bicycle, which these days a bicycle is
a very capable
5 to 7 8 inch travel pebble bike.
So these events are just that. I'm working
them. I used to raise them in the
in the earlier additions.
I've won sum in
am or master's class and been hell lifted
in some others, and it was deter actually,
hill lifted in Chile and and,
andy specific and and Trans proven,
maybe somewhere else as well. But
So it's been basically I I Shoot them,
but I'm also
on my bike all day the lighter to
pack the normal 2 bodies 3, 4 lenses
and tools, space bags,
food and stuff. So we're doing the full
route
with the us. We are on e bikes
and they are on normal bikes. But we're
doing essentially the same the same route and
some he bikes, you know, they can just
carry their light bike and we're carrying our
heavy e bikes and
a lot of high bucks we can pay
most of it. But basically,
I'm leaving camp at 07:30,
starting to shoot photos from about 07:30
first stages or opening at 8 08:30 and
last stages are closing at like, 5 05:30.
You have all day. So you have all
sorts of riders from the fitness guys that
either get to the field pretty quick or
take their time and stop and have a
coffee, have a gelato have it be depending
on what time of the day it is
and some guys start on a beer and
end on a coffee. It just depends on
the crew you with, And it's just like,
it's the kind of riding holiday you would
have with your mates, whatever everything's taken care
of Yes, you're timed, but it's almost like...
To make you just dig a bit deeper
and and focus on the trail and
So, yeah. For me, it's it's a I
could ride a full week on the bike,
but I'm still using work as an excuse.
So I can't
the very little time of the year where
I can just take away a from family
or I can't go into riding holiday for
a week. But this is my riding holiday.
Just have to do 6 hours in computer
after my each days.
Are we leaving in hotel beds and and
the kept the races sleep in tents. So
we do get
we're not sleeping much, but we do get
that.
We have a real shower and they have,
like a cow at shower. Yeah. Some of
them were pretty bad.
How do you go about replacing that in
your calendar then? Because we're s rally if
we believe ash is now finished.
I mean, if there is a
Well, if they're having more daniel rounds next
year, then maybe, like, I don't have it
in my calendar anymore. Yeah. But we've... The
last 2 seasons we have had a a
break the mid season break, which, I guess
won't really exist if you have more rounds
next year.
It's it's a bit of a weird 1
having, like, it's so busy, and then there's
so many events doubled stacked on top of
each other I think they had, like,
like,
like, I think they had, like, cape Epic
crank works and Australia national champs on the
same weekend. You know, we have... We just
had 6 months of no racing whatsoever over,
and then you tripled stack 3 big events,
even if some are different
disciplines even like cape Epic. But from a
media standpoint or a industry standpoint or
fan standpoint, like,
know, stretch the racing out earlier and later,
which he could do with the southern Hemisphere
stops.
But so what... You know, I don't know
what I replace transfer runs. So s really.
I think 1 thing Ash has done different
to trans bonds. Where we kept the root
secret
is he's develop these routes to develop sort
of hubs in these
smaller towns in France and Italy are along
the kind of du on both sides of
the border
and he's developed, built,
opened existing trail and built new connected trail,
but he's also left each of these towns
that we visited over the last 3 years
with the sort of infrastructure and a hub
there's the hotel for people to base out
of they can ride that
over 3 different years, we've written kind of
all 3 sides at the hill and the
mountain and the and and in that area.
Instead of doing a 6 day point to
point race, you can go... You can still
do that with your friends and you can
use Ash for the shuttles. They do put
on trips.
But you can chop up to the town
and ride the first 2 or 3 days
of the stone king rally being based in
1 town, but you can ride all the
best trails that we've used over 3 years
because it uses different trails each 3 years.
So so essentially, you've got, you know,
1, you got a week or a weekend
trip in each little stop
offering a huge network of trail. So... And
that's what he's
kinda his vision for the future is self
sustainable creating.
Employment and lifeblood for these little towns. I
live in a little time And the bike
tourism is kept it's the lifeblood of the
town. It's kept people employed. To keep people
in town, get the young people in town,
has brought young people back to town, it's
brought real estate back. You know, it's the
same story all over the world.
So I think
it's great that he's doing that. And he
did leave some kind of hint in terms
of the stone king rally is over.
So maybe as a race, but maybe...
I don't know Maybe it's just e bike
weeks with your mates. If you don't need
shuttles. I don't know what it's gonna be.
Yeah. Be nice. So if you could pick
1 of the places for like a ride
in day or days with your mates that
wasn't Mile along the route, which 1 would
you pick?
I I would look today. Each 1
because there's the Vi, which has a huge,
more purposeful
because they've got a very strong mountain by
club and super passionate people. So they've got
trails.
The day we arrive in the day we
leave on either side, but then there's a,
which is the second day which is this
huge vertical, like every trails like, we only
erased, like half the vertical 1 2 them
this year because they literally
too long to do as a race stage
because would be...
They're so physical and gnarly,
if you had to do without stopping, you
would actually not enjoy the ride or yeah.
Breaks or bike. Arms or hands or fingers
could fall apart. Like,
even though 1 staring into me... It's trail
into mile millennials. I was like, as should
we start up top and we finished out
on the bar, He's like, dude
you think it's nice to do that because
you stopped 20 times when you do that
child you made. If you did that as
1 race that they would hate you and
that at a terrible horrible time and they'd
be crashing and importing in the river at
the end of the trial. So
there's tons of vertical and other trails and
to do the full link of trails. It's
almost, like sometimes better not to do it
as a race because you can session with
your mates or take race breaks. Unless your
foot race, like, you train for that race.
But pump is real and if you're descending
for 10 minutes
on gnarly fast trails like,
more technical and and gnarly than any darling
world cup track. You know, you're gonna get
tired. And and so
I don't know if there's the high Alpine
saf with Glen Macarthur lives
which is on the French side,
in the Q. Yeah. Yeah. I'd do a
weekend there. Some Paris do a weekend there
Do a weekend there.
Then what's in between, then you got, like,
Junior,
then the Royal Valley, a weekend there, and
then Mile
to San Rem area, a weekend there. I
mean, it's... Studio... You can a week in
each of the. Yes. Never mind a weekend.
And Ash
just as a day in each of those
places. It's there's a lot more to be
done,
you know, and it's just really...
Yeah. It's just we're lucky in Europe to
have
this history in of of trails basically, and
and that it does take a special soul
to put
to put together to open all trails because
the popular ones are often quite bon
or jan
and rough But Asha ashes opened up, literally
trails that were haven't been used for 50
years and and those are kind of lo
or smooth or that
better turns because they were built for pre
dating certain vehicles, so they needed to be
able to carry a coffin around a corner
or a ox or something. So, like,
certain
age of trails are are are better for
certain things. Yeah. Amazing Yeah other history in
that place is is insane for sure. Yeah.
And then there's, like,
mind like, luckily I a photographers, I could
stop. If I see this room and I'm
like, oh my god. I'm taking a photo
with this room
and the riders and then, like,
the writers don't don't see it. They don't
even see the room. And like I like,
and then those... They're quite happy to see
the photos because Like, I I had no
idea and some of them were like, I
had no idea I was on a cliff
band. And I was like, yeah, we knew,
and you were told in your notes and
it was safe enough that Ashley, you weren't
gonna fall off to the right, but
Yeah. It's,
yeah. It's it's nice to do as a
race, but I feel it could be better
to do as a weekend or weak trip
with your mates. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The touring
club by brexit the race. Yeah. Yeah nice.
You... You mentioned Mali, and obviously, you guys
have a place there. And then, I think
there's probably a lot of people that are
kind of
en of your
lifestyle that you've created.
I'm interested in whether that's like, evolved
almost organically because of what you do or
whether like you and anchor of put,
like, a lot of consideration and thought into
kinda how you
work out what your life's gonna look like
where you're gonna base yourself how you're gonna
operate.
Yeah. It's it started quite a bit before
that around 2008
when I started shooting full time. I basically
started seeing I was
working all summers
very little time to do our own thing
outside of the World cup seasons. Right? And
most of the interest in Daniel and then
prevailed is Daniel and End,
done in Crank works done in Crank ramp
based, hard line, you know, like...
So increasingly, there's less time In Europe used
to be something I would do because our
could do it, and I was working shooting
down your racing. So basically, it became very
apparent to us. We need to be somewhere
and the shoulder seasons or the off seasons
where we can enjoy riding our bike outside
of work for for both of us for
Uncle was training or, you know,
So we would originally move to Oregon from
California because we could afford and was kind
of better season. But then there was too
much snow in Oregon, so we're like, okay,
we need to be in the Southern Hemisphere,
but where
basically settled on New Zealand. So all these
choices were based on
we need to still be able to work,
but we also wanna maximize
our on bike time at the best times
of the year when we are free and
where it's also maybe peak seasons for those
areas.
And then when we would basically, you know,
be in New Zealand from October to
to April was that's the best time to
Mountain Mike New Zealand and and 1 of
the best countries
without a doubt, Nelson, 1 of the best
cities in New Zealand Towns in New Zealand
to 2 Mountain Bike. Most vertical, most natural
terrain, and I'm always more skewed to a
natural terrain versus a bike park. Yeah.
And then...
But then being based in Europe, we can't
come back and forth to New Zealand or
South Africa.
So we living out of bags for months
at a time, which in 2019 rented did
the lowest podcast,
we were looking for a place. Border placed
the end of 2019,
and we chose
Initially, we're looking in Mo and Finale like,
I don't where everything's going on on both
Daniel and euro, child bike and friends
and a vibe. Yeah. But then we quickly
realize
we are flat out in the season
at all these events with all these people
when we have the odd week
before the season after the season or during
the season, there's very few weeks actually open.
But when we do, it'd be nice to
actually be in a more told place.
But still, you know, early enough for shoulder
season, so basically that meant Southern Europe, which
meant italy lyon or Southern France.
And then the way of life in at
leaves sort of better,
we we resonate better with it than the
French way of life, the coffee is better.
That drinks are cheaper,
their property. And then we're so we're looking
for finale area, but then Med,
go put on the map think Steve Jones
and Dirt magazine did an article on it.
And we ended up there, and then we
realized, you know,
everything we need. We we just
need a base. Don't... And the fact that
it's quiet and more rural and and
it was actually perfect for us. It was
this out downtime and But then the bonus
was it had, like, to meet some of
the best trail riding on the doorstep from
the house or in a shuttle or on
pedals or or with the e bike
and it's hour from Airport, 30 minutes from
the beach if you wanna go to the
beach and got rivers swimming and
it's small enough we can never get over
overrun. Mh. But there's 2 solid operators,
millennium to be a a typical
and between the 2 of those and and
the 1 or 2 companies that
c... That join up with them from Finale
or from France.
It's just enough. We still need I'd say,
more trail builders in the valley for for
the amount of attention it's getting now, like,
there's definitely scope to develop that into more
permanent full time
sort of non partisan travel that works maybe
for the commune and and not for either,
you know,
because each trail, all the the shuttle companies
are also doing... Their own building own building
and and maintenance and opening and and the
problem is we have, like,
40 trails and they over, like, from 600
to
for 1600 meter drop,
And that's
probably kilometers wise in in the hundreds and
hundreds of kilometers. It's a lot of maintenance.
So know... And it's 1 thing maintenance, but
then, like, you know, it's streaming. There's is
a job that nobody wants to do. Yeah.
But when you're in a Sub Alpine, Alpine
or above tree like, you can't ride the
trails if they're overgrown. But nobody wants a
str a 10 kilometer track, but it needs
to get done, so it it does get
done. But then there's also, you know, your
be, you fixing your your rut and your
winter rising the tracks to shut them down
and get them prepped for the next season.
And so
there's always,
yeah. There's always room for more development
and trail building, but Then this and I
help a lot with that actually with with
initiatives to raise money so we can fully
employ
permanent travels, which we've done in the last
couple of years. Through different initiatives and, Santa
Cruz also
with their dirt fund
yeah. Granted
for some
Yeah. So that that goes a long way
in a small community when a lot of
people do many different jobs there. Like, sometimes
the plumber is also the trail build that
is also the shuttle guy.
And he's maybe growing your tomatoes as well.
So, like, it's it's pretty cool. And you
can get everything that we eat is pretty
much grown
the malt cheese tomatoes, whatever within 5 the
the other mo grown within 5 kilometers. The
malt... You know, so it's it's a very
healthy way of living and it's made me
a bit healthier in the last few years,
and
I get to ride my bike more and
And I I like to live in a
place where I need to have, like,
a zap that's 1 71 80, like, It's
it's like, because we spend some of the
year in Cape town, where I have, like,
a toll boy with a 01:50 or 01:44
and
that's kinda plenty. Yeah. Then I'm just serving
mostly, but
between Nelson and Mile, like, I like the
fact that I live in the place where
I need guitar or a no or a
bullet or something. You know Like,
I don't wanna live permanently in a place
that just requires a tall white because that
that's what Ben Oregon was and and we
left... It was a lovely community, but was
the trails went
weren't good enough to keep. I love it.
I love the way you choose your location
based on the Santa Creek product you wanna
ride there. Well, I guess let's... We won't
be brand specific.
If you need to double down or a
daniel rear tire, and you need at least
a 1 to 74, then you're living a
pretty good. And it good spot. Yeah. I
reckon. Although, like, I do get lazy, and
I... I I've heard your podcast. You do
the same because I, like, I... I'm not
racing so I had... I do go the
xl plus on the front because I go
and Max grip,
but, yeah, just to keep the weight down,
I'd rather fix my flat than have a
heavy bike.
Good on you. But we should start wrapping
up, but the Yeah. 1 thing I do
wanna ask. I mean, you spend a lot
of time on the hill throughout the season
at these races.
And it be cool to hear from you,
like, a couple of riders
who are exciting you at the moment. Like,
who are you enjoy watching? Who do you
think might be the next kinda
breakout riders.
You know, obviously, the
the the near future is is
is Jackson and and Ass, and and I
don't wanna just mention them because it's not
fair on anybody else, but
It's pretty apparent for our and his first
year junior, first time at a venue.
At least we've seen he's not superhuman and
he hasn't just had a clean sweep of
the series, which I think for him
might be a bit disappointing, but it's also
probably the best thing that could happen to
him. Yeah. Just like it was for Jackson
to have Jordan beat him, like, it only
raises the the game. And also he started
the season not actually
super with a lot of bike time and
and Yeah physically fit.
So just seeing how
good they already are at how seasoned they
really are
without ever having the experience like Jackson's 1
of the most experienced Daniel is
But where the hell does to get that
experience from? Isn't so. Like, it's pretty crazy
how the sport has become so professional that
they're arriving at first year junior kinda like
Valley almost it although. She learned a lot
through her
crashes in her race craft,
you know, seeing Elliott was 1 of the
1 of the junior girls set foster time
of the days and similar conditions is,
you know, pretty crazy. So, like, the future,
we don't have to worry about, like, you
know, just when you thought, like, the
the Jackson would be a a once in
a lifetime athlete then the next year you
have, like, acid coming or you or you
know, you think it was only like 1
luke B and Lori and
Alm, and there's just, you know, more more
in the wings. And then
everybody's is so good. Like I don't know...
Like,
there's very few people that don't shoot good.
When you're getting to that top 50,
and this is like, it's... And I'm not
saying top 10. When you get to that
top 50,
pro athlete, you're all
within that timeline, which means you're riding at
a certain thing, which means you're to ride
that good. Your technique has to be good.
And for techniques good, your style generally good.
There's some writers that give it a bit
more or or, like, know you there, and
they,
give it a bit extra for the camera.
But
there's very few people the top end of
the sport. So it's quite easy and lucky
for us that we are shooting that the...
We quite privileged to work with the best
athletes.
Because it makes our job as choosing the
the photos are all better for it. Yeah.
But, you know,
you know, obviously, you always want photos of
people that are doing well and and,
you know, and, like, Noise looks like he's
putting a hundred and 10 percent effort in
like, in a very different way where he's
just low the front of his bike, but
then also just seeing what each rider goes
into. When you think they've done as much
as they can do,
did having care go to an extra weekend
and s.
And if you never heard his thumb... Like,
he would've
I thought he would have won hands down
and lea again, like...
So, you know, you always wanted him to
have his day to get get his just
and and
Yeah. And
yeah. And and then, like I said,
yeah. III definitely can't name names because they
are all... They'll up there, and that's why
if you see on on the sort of
the miss some stuff and in the books,
Yeah. Obviously, the
a lot of people are appearing more than
once because they are, you know, at the
the top 5 of the sports so they're
gonna feature every weekend, but there's quite a
spread of writers in both the men's and
the women's, you know, like,
yeah. It's it's
everyone's
everyone's good at this level. Fiftieth place. You're
you're still 1 of the best 50 mountain
biker in the world and you're only, like,
a few seconds of
being on the podium. Yeah. It's insane that.
Yeah Yeah. It's it's pretty nuts. Yeah. How
have you found it shooting Dakota this year
on that high bar because that's the 1
person new style looks so different this year.
It's pretty cool because sometimes, like, when he
does... And and Dakota actually is... Thank you,
Dakota. He does
definitely pay attention where we are because there's
sometimes where he's
super doing a super like scrub turned down
and and he's
definitely doing it for us. It's not helping
him and go any faster. But like, it's
worth. Like, I've I've got a cut a
few shots to see where the bar is
actually like like a picture frame around his
head. Yeah. Yeah Like when he does his
target's it's like, oh, it's just the perfect
framing on his bar like it's weird to
definitely look weird.
At first, and now it doesn't. No. I
think it would look weird it was the
other way around. Like,
like, but then, like, how caused the sport
that you have to dakota right up there
And then you have fin that's that's always
like bent over. His back is nearly parallel
ground at all times of his riding, but
how both techniques could win race. You know,
I'll get you on the podium.
It's
this...
And such different riding styles on, yeah, similar
bikes but differences mentioned electronic non electronic. Yet
you all end up arriving at the finish
line within the same millisecond and and on
different tires and it's it's
it's quite bizarre really. Yeah. And whether it's
a short track or long track of weather
track, you know, unless it's O Val soul,
but
how they do manage to be that close,
like, it's it's... Yeah. It's quite interesting. And
and that that that perfect run
sort of stat where you... Who's winning each
sectors is is a quite interesting thing to
always look at and Yeah.
I think was it just
only once or twice is it the 1
rider that gets the perfect? Rare, especially in
the elite. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Nice, man. Well,
that's a good place for us to wrap
up. But if people wanna
have eyes on your work, where are the
places for them to be looking.
I wish I could... I, I mean, obviously,
I put stuff on my Instagram, but I
put increasingly less as
at the events, I have the least time,
I'm getting all the photos were should and
could be posting content, but I have the
least time to post content and
it's not as simple as just throwing up
10 quick shots. It's like everyone's doing carousel
ourselves and everything on sliders and everything.
So luckily, Miss spend some are doing some
of my photos each each day at event.
Obviously, miss spin summers. They do a lot
of other this stuff and gonna spend summers.
They they do a newsletter, which sounds old
school, but that's running good way. We do
things aspen some. We get a lot more
facts some tidbits behind the scenes and a
lot more photos and video content.
And also, like, that interviews thing, yeah, I
do I do the
the moments or the shoot time frame. What's
your time frames? I don't even know what
my is called. The views. Views shit.
But then we actually do a Youtuber with
that, like, the Thursday Tuesday, Wednesday art the
long views. That
includes all the riders that have interviewed not
just the 2 winners whatever, which you get
some surprisingly, like cool content, like, like this
girl
winnie he Gold.
Right? So you won't know this happened at
the last 2 she came out from New
Zealand.
She didn't do the first ones. She's junior,
junior girl. First year overseas. First year overseas
that parents. I arrived with her parents,
in in New Zealand. And they
the main state of the New Zealand scene.
They, like,
they do back country rides, technical wet routes.
They've, like, stay away from the bike parks,
and this is how this girl woody was
brought up. Anyway, she comes out here. 1...
The first 2 races she's ever done the
2 world cups
she would have been, like quite good times
in the elite woman.
But in both runs,
she's
at first stage of both races that she's
won the day. She's stopped
because
1 marshall stopped her because I was write
down in front of her.
And was red flagged and was told to
carefully proceed around the rider or get a
rerun, and it was the first ever insurer
in the first date of a first 7
endure woke cup, and she didn't know what
to do. She said, I'll, carry on. I'll
just crack on. And then a chain came
off 3 times because she's a first year
junior and she doesn't
know how about correct bikes set up properly.
The dad's not there, Richard's is not there
to make sure her bike stalled. Actually, his
here... Knows. Sorry. Her dad on your rides
of Gear box box is that. She has
no idea how to keep your paid on.
Alright.
So anyway, so she's just had to check
him with 3 times. She stopped twice to
put on once coast to the finish line
stopped and thinks she won that race.
Now this ran cold blue, her next second
woke up.
First run, her friend who got down 2
or 3 riders ahead of her, and she
came across and her friend was lying on
the floor knocked out.
Kind of unconscious kind of coming too, so
she stopped again.
Obviously, like you would
Sure if the other girls in front of
us stopped or if there were girls in
front,
I can't recall anyway.
She called a Marshal. Luckily there was 1
with Insider within hearing, and the marshal came
and her friend was coming to
Za who's my dentist daughter, another kiwi go
for Nelson. So small world
anyway. So she's on the floor knocked out
or coming to
winnie he's like, okay. You're good The marshall
are alright? Del get. I'm wanna carry on.
She carries on. So she has a terrible
stage 1. I'm not even that bad.
I'm and then she ends up winning the
rates coming by the last, you know, 6
stages later. She's, like, claude enough time back.
So
I don't know what the question was, but
like, there's
there's AS0
by the interviews. Yeah Well, well, yeah. We
Fine. That's not to this question. This is
just a fourth popped to my head. But
this is what I talk about.
Stories behind stories and talent and junior talent,
and junior woman talent. We've... Andrew and I've
spoken about the junior woman
more the last sort of race recap and
we have about the elite men, you know,
because we know the elite man's good, but
we're kind of not... I'm not... We're not
surprised they're due to them so good, but
we're like, proud and happy and, you know,
like, the future of it was good for.
Yeah.
Basically, we end off from the future and
End and Daniel and eb bikes too, not
snow racing.
Is all rosy and engaged
because it comes down to the riding and
the bikes are great and the the trails
are great and
the sports at its best point ever. You
know? Yep. A hundred percent month. So, yeah,
people should check that stuff out. So we
spent. So that's some. And then the books,
the year books, and then are you still
doing your Ep book No. Okay.
So there's there's that, and my Instagram and
Yeah. Sq on tour. Now. You get some
behind the scenes world cup. Yeah. Content on
there. There's a a couple of us the
post on there.
Yeah. Nice. I'll stick links to all that
in the show notes. But yeah, thanks, Matt.
I. Busy you are during a world cup
block. So, yeah, I appreciate you making some
time to sit down for a chat. You
might have to from that babies put that
baby talk at the end of the podcast
through the beginning as you might have massive
drop off.
Do you have the other the thing that
that
that shows where you're your... Do most people
that get a certain way to listen to
the whole podcast? How does it work on?
They get most of the way on average
like 70. So you're gonna click watch your
podcast, you you or listen or watch. You
you can see the length and you choose
and... Yeah. Some people now and then I
played in 1 and a half times, but
I can't... I actually can't get into that.
Because I know the people, I don't I
hear their voice at 1 and a half
times and like, you get used to a
while. Now I tried Tried it. And. Like,
if, I, if I'm on a flight and
a short flight, I don't know no in
Did, but if I'm driving as I I'd
like to hear people's voices. Effort and you
do a lot driving. Yeah. I'm doing a
lot of driving Yeah. They're almost like losing
air on status because we fly a little
these days. It's just like 2 big flights
a air and that's it. Better for the
world. I guess. Better for the world. Yeah.
As To price and told us taught us
all. There you go. Nice 1. Cheers. There's
an answer to 1 of your questions. I
was sick to see Yeah. She Josh Bryce
added, Event. Was that actually racing Eb bikes
this venue last year in Chant tell and
was just so cool
to see him, I missed him and hard
on, unfortunately, I wasn't there.
But it was, like, you had to seeing
the people and personalities and and, like, that
they still out there and and the sport
has room for everyone. Yeah definitely. It's a
cool place, man. Yep. Awesome. Thanks man. Thank
you.
Alright. That's it for this episode was Fun.
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until next time. Get out and ride.