Hey there. I'm doctor Dave, and this is
Micro dose. Thanks so much for being with
me today. So many of you have issues
with some type of a job of
relationship, the work that you're doing that, you're
not really in line with, but you might
not even be recognizing this. And if you
continue this,
They are surely wreak havoc on your mental
health and a lot more.
So how do you recognize this? How do
you recognize a something going on in your
life is not really working for you. And
then if you find that out, what do
you really do about it? Well, today, I'm
gonna be having a great discussion with Jake
S. He's a local
Salt Lake City psychedelic
facilitator
We're doing this in a local tea shop.
So please,
bear with me if the sound quality is
not studio quality. The information you're gonna get
from this is really, really gonna be valuable.
So stick with it. Oh, and, also, I'm
gonna be putting Jake's contact
information and anything you need to know in
the show notes. So please be sure to
check that all out. Welcome Jake.
Enter the world of magic mushrooms
We're gonna help people today, because I wanna
kinda get into your story and your life
and find out what you're doing, how you
got to where you are now. So I
don't know if you wanna start with just
with just that, it's not really much of
a question, but
tell me kind of about what what Jake
is is up to these days and and
And how did you get there?? I think
it's probably best to start an abbreviated version
at the beginning?
I'm originally an East Coast kid Jersey boy.
Born raised out there and never quite
identified with the culture out there was
so a lot of people. There's a lot
of energies.
I'm grateful to be raised there. I think
it grounded me well.
And just kinda
fell into
the normal rhythm of things out there went
to school in Connecticut and then immediately after
graduating
Moved Manhattan
and entered the rat race if you will.
And love New York for a lot of
reasons, but also it was
quite taxing. So I was working sales jobs
and
at that point without really knowing it. Just
gonna chasing paychecks and more money, nicer apartment,
more things,
really kind of living it what to me
was a bit of an empty existence.
Around 25,
had quite severe depression and anxiety,
ended up kinda hidden
hitting the red button,
and
leaving my
my job,
which many would say was
you know, it was a very good job
based on the money I was making and
the perks of it, but I was very
unhappy there and ending a relationship that seemed
to be wilt.
Getting rid of my apartment. And at that
point, put a 1 way ticket get Australia,
that resulted in a year of
budget, solo travel,
which is probably 1 of the most pivotal
moments in my life, and that culminated
in an experience in Amsterdam, the very last
day before I be back to New York.
Where I was reintroduced to magic mushrooms in
the form of troubles as they call it
in Amsterdam.
I
was quite into Psychedelics early in life,
my first experience that was 14,
and really loved
the recreational side of them doing them with
friends.
Didn't use it much for therapeutics at that
point though.
And at the point that I did it
in Amsterdam, I had about a 5 year
break from them,
looking back. I realized it I was
I was quite afraid to face myself in
the mirror as they are the great amplifier.
But... Yeah. I'm making a a long story
not short. But ended up having experience there.
It was wonderful. I, I came back state
side, and
at that point, was truly following my heart.
That brought me to a job working wilderness
therapy out in Utah,
working with
troubled adolescence 13 to 17 down in the
desert,
which was my first
experience working a job that truly build my
soul.
Continue to work jobs in the mental health
industry,
to get where I am eventually working filled
full time as
a psychedelic
guide or a facilitator facilitating therapeutic experiences
for folks.
And that's where I am now. So I
I have a private practice under the name
soul passage.
And
I have been accepted into a network like
folks
under the named psychedelic passage. About 25.
Facilitator nationwide the network of facilitator, which
has been extremely
beneficial to me in my practice to
to open up into the the wider world
of
facilitation and have some
some people to bounce ideas off. So, yeah,
that's where I'm at these days.
You know, it's it's an interesting story because
I think we have a a lot of
a lot of parallels, A lot in... Common.
No, I've got... How how old are you
right now, Jake? I I know you said
you're were 25 when you... I think you
said 25 when you took off to Australia
or something. How old are you now?
Some 32,
a few moments months away from 33
at this point. Okay. Well, I wanna be...
May I be the first to wish you
a happy birthday early.
But
Thank okay.
But I think we've got a lot in
common as far as
east Coast people.
Holding jobs that seemed like they were... To
most people seem like very successful and and
really good jobs that most people were say,
oh, you've got a great job like that
Why why would you ever leave? But something
inside of both of us
felt like. Say it wasn't it wasn't really
right. It wasn't really resonating with with me
and it it sounds like it wasn't resonating
with you. So we... We we
realized that and said,
I've gotta do something different. Now this happened
to me much later in life. I would
look, I was a,
a dentist and,
a a dental speaker
and and
people would say that would, you know, quite
successful in the East Coast. But, like, you
said,
crowded,
I did I didn't love the landscape of
the East Coast like, I love out west
here now, and
My wife and I 1 day just said,
we're gonna we're gonna sell everything we we
own and just move out west. Now we
didn't go to Australia first. Didn't go to
Amsterdam first. We just moved out west,
but you you you had some other stuff
before you came with. I'm and I'm just
curious,
when you went to Amsterdam,
what
what made you
get into Psychedelics again? Was it was it
not recreation at this point? Were you were
you searching for
or a way to change your life and
get out of this depression and anxiety or
whatever whatever exactly it was you had. Why
did you why did you decide to get
into truffle out there?
I had avoided them for so long.
So about 20, I
I wasn't able to smoke marijuana anymore and
I've been smoking a lot for about 7
years at that point, and there was a
switch that was flipped.
Into where I was extremely paranoid
anxious when I would.
And now looking back, I realized that.
I had some traumas that were,
unspoken for at that point. And
marijuana obviously an traditional psychedelic, but
along with the the long list of hall
eugenics is an amplifier into emotions, and I
wasn't quite sure how to deal with my
emotions. I think you pair that with the
back that I was living a very misaligned
life.
A life that wasn't true to myself,
I
did not want to face myself and look
myself in the mirror
because I I think I would've have been
ashamed.
And I wasn't ready to own up to
that.
It was only after the year of travel,
a full year of working on myself, and
a lot of times spent alone and
a time having beautiful experiences with strangers and
yeah. Everything that comes with
the expansion there
that
I found myself able,
to look at myself in mirror again. And
it was
1 of the most profound experiences of my
life truly felt like, a rebirth.
Like, a a full fresh start on life
with the ethos being
follow your heart,
truly listen
to what it is, your your mind body
and soul needs.
And
from there, things have just fallen in place
in a way that
I've never questioned it
again.
It truly changed my my perspective in my
thinking and for that, I'm
forever, grateful.
And is that
the main reason that you have
dedicated your life to helping others now
that may be in a assembler.
Situation or experienced
trauma or or some other type of mental
health issue. You're
helping them
find themselves and and and and get out
of that, get out of that, with their
end with their call up with. Yeah. It's
absolutely 1 of the reasons if I
if I could find some realign, I would
hope that others can, and I just know
from a personal experience when I was misaligned.
I was crank.
I was
I wasn't living in my gifts, and I'm
a believer that if you're not living in
your gifts, you're not able to contribute
as much as you can
to the world,
if And, yeah, I'm I'm just a Bieber
if everyone is living in their Dicks and
everyone is contributing to their fullest extent the
world. Of course, it would make sense. Logically,
it would be a little bit of a
better place.
So, yeah, I would say that is 1
of my...
My hopes,
and the clients I I work with is
to uncover,
some gems that they already have and planting
the ground just kinda ex them and shine
them up and hopefully, yeah. Let them shine
bright, and
see where life takes them from there. But
a lot of people are are listening or
watching this episode on on video or or
audio, if they wanna see us, they can
watch the video. But...
And and many of them, I'm I'm sure
or are like you and I used to
be. Or if You know, they're going to
a job every day that
appears to be successful. They've got their family.
They've got their friends. They're doing their their
their stuff. How do how does somebody really
know
if they're aligned with what they're doing? I
mean, I knew... Okay. So I knew in
my heart. I I've gotta say it is
from the day I started dental school, I
knew in my heart from day 1
that this really wasn't for me. I was...
It wasn't a perfect alignment with me. However,
being, you know,
20 in your twenties,
it's very hard to say that your family
and to your friends into, you know, to
your spouse or whoever.
I'm
I'm in the wrong place. I I gotta
get out. It's it's very difficult. So we
just... We just go with the program And
then 1 thing leads to another and all
of a sudden,
I'm sitting at a dental office treating patients.
There are many other people, in that situation,
watching or listening, and, you know, they may
not be dentist, but they may be something
else
how does 1 truly know
if
they're doing what they're what they're meant to
do or what they're aligned with? Thanks it's
not. Easy. You live in a world
full of distractions,
and some would say a world
telling us the wrong messaging to
make money so that you could buy this
or
make money so that you could compare yourself
to the... This person,
and it's extremely difficult.
My... In my own story, I I didn't
know my... I to College were out 17.
And I had to choose a major and
I only knew 2 pass my mom was
a psychologist, and my dad was in sales.
My dad made more money.
I knew I had all these student debts
so and that probably sure what was psychology
looking at my path now.
But I went with business kind of business
sticker in, and and Fell into a a
path of working with sales. And at that
point, I wasn't
at all
I knowing to think I knew the word
alignment or being att or I wasn't listening
really to anything. It was just, like, what
I was living from a place of scarce.
Be. I knew that I needed money and
what was gonna make me money was working
sales, joe.
And
see
I could also speak to where I'm currently,
I think the path of
listening to your heart and
decipher what the right path is
continuous, and it takes
constant practice, and it will forever take practice
because I still have moments
where I...
You know, I'm I'm running my own business
facilitating, and I
so build up with the zest of life
doing so. And when I work with clients,
it feels so right. But I am running
my own business and sometimes I have great
moss, sometimes I have slower months. And when
I have those slower months and I have
bills. I'm like, wow I could go back
to a job and and make this much
money, but it is...
And that again is is
operating from that scarcity mindset
verse
sitting with myself and reminding myself of my
purpose and why I do what I do
and being open to the magic and and
letting it flow freely,
But, yeah, All to say, it's it's constant
work and it's,
a constant practice of...
Listening to what's around, but also really tuning
in with yourself and,
determining...
Why you're taking the actions that you're that
you're doing, or why you're able be thinking
the thoughts that you're thinking. You know, and
also to add to that,
what we do for a living is is
major, of course, but but also, there are
many people and including myself in my first
marriage,
that there are in relationships. And they...
On some level probably say, well, you know,
it's not perfect, and I'm gonna... You know,
it's it's not great, but there's nothing else...
There's, you know, there's nobody else out there
for me or there's nothing else I can
do. So
I'm finding that,
you
so many people that that are not aligned
with their with what they're doing for a
living or not aligned with their relationship.
Just tend to stay in the same thing
day after day because they're
afraid of the unknown. Look, I I could
get out of this relationship, but
I'm afraid of what might happen. The least
I know this might not be great, but
I know what it is. If it's I
I know exactly what it is. So I'm
okay. Continuing it. And same thing with work.
And many other things.
And and it sounds like that's where you
were, and that's where I was as well,
and both of us
both of his had that had the guts,
just say no. This is this is not
working. And I'm... I need to change. But
I but I still feel, Jake that most
people
don't have that don't have that courage to
say that I'm just gonna... I'm gonna change
my entire life because this isn't working for
me. I get it.
I think it is is... I mean, it's
it's scary and
courage may even be an understanding statement like
it.
I I only could... Because I was in
such a dark place. It was kinda rock
bottom, and I was at a pivotal moment
in my life for my him, I'm 25,
like, I can make some changes and see
how things play out. And if they don't
work, I can always go back and get
a job like this. And But it's scary.
I was extremely blessed to be in that
situation and be from a place of.
Opportunity enough to to give me the leeway
to say. Things will work out.
Not everyone has that. So I get that,
people are in different situations and have different
responsibilities.
What I will say is it seems that
when you're living,
in a
if 1 thing is misaligned to your job.
And then from there, also your relationship and
maybe the way you take care of your
body, there's this like, trickle down a effect
where everything just kind of forms into 1
or, like, well, what what's the point of
fixing 1 thing? If if I hate my
job or I'm in an unhappy relationship. And
the same is true to where if you
are listening to,
your soul and and living your purpose. If
you're working a job that you absolutely love
and feel very aligned to. Then
you're probably gonna want a partner that supports
you and appreciates that and loves up for
you and your standards are gonna be higher
because you're
self confidence is gonna be higher in the
respect have yourself is gonna be higher. And
if you respects higher, you probably don't take
care of your body. So it seems to
be that domino effect.
But it is about making
and finding the courage
to make that that first step. And I
think that comes from a confidence
of
knowing that things are going to work out.
And I think that
the confidence knowing that things are gonna work
out.
Comes from... You you need you need some
reps.
You need to hear that and see that
in the universe a few times.
So, yeah, I understand it not being easy.
But I think if you if you get
a little...
You take that step and you get a
little feedback,
it could help. But is there ever a
situation where... And, again, I'm getting back to
somebody that's somebody that's listening or watching to
us right now, and they're saying to themselves.
Yeah But
you know, I don't love my job, and
I'm not... Maybe my relationship, my marriage is
is not fantastic, but I've got a couple...
Kids and and I've gotta bring be bringing
in this money under or we're not gonna
be able to eat. So I can't make
any changes at all. Is there is there
ever a situation where kids somebody realizes they're
they're not living
in in a life they're aligned with, but
they just can't... They they know they can't
change. They can't do anything different. Is it
is that is that ever true or
can we always change no matter what? It
it's...
True on so many levels,
the last client I worked with. I with
last week.
And
won't share any specifics, but he's 34,
2 young girls about to have his third
in a relationship. He's not, and he he
appeals perhaps he gotten in a little too
early working at job the
kind of loads at this point. But he
has your responsibilities he's that have a son
that's actually due today.
I think they're inducing tomorrow.
So he has a job who responsibilities, and
I can't just mean.
Who has no kids, and
I can't just say, like man just quit
your job and do what you love. Like
he has
responsibility is still above too, and I I
understand that.
But at the same time, I think it's
important to take
a few steps because
he came to the realization that he is
so misaligned that he has been attaching his
identity so much to this relationship he's been
in, since he was 16,
that he kinda of forgot who he is,
and I think the first step for him
is not to make a drastic move.
I would agree that would probably,
be ill advise.
A first step maybe is to take some
time.
Maybe go down to the desert just him.
For 3 days and just sit. Just be
quiet.
Leave your phone, maybe take a couple books.
Just
realign with yourself and remind yourself who you
are and then take those necessary steps from
there, perhaps he gets insights that, you know,
I should probably to start running, just and
who knows from running,
then he starts to eat healthier and starts
to feel better and maybe a lot of
the the mental,
issues that he has. The depression anxiety start
to take care of themselves with physical fitness
and eating a healthy gut
So, yeah, I'm a firm believer in
taking just a small step, open up.
The window a little bit, let a little
light in.
And then I I think that a lot
of my clients are... They're at the point.
They're that coming to sit
with the medicine that I work with.
They're at the point where they... It's it's
drastic and they need a change that and
they need a little bit of a push.
Just to
to open up that window and let them
light in on some of my shows in
the past, I've said to people, and I'm
a firm believer in this also.
And even if you're in a great relationship,
and and you love your job.
Take some time
by yourself. And that doesn't mean just go
after dinner by yourself and then come home.
It means... I mean,
go somewhere
drive or fly or whatever you have to
do,
stay in a hotel or camp out or
backpack or whatever you whatever you do, But
b,
ins sol,
be with yourself and just think
and just
clear your mind and
think about life, think about yourself. And and
interesting that you just say that, I think
that's 1 of the most powerful things that
we can do. Again, even if you're even
if things are really good in your life.
I for example, I've... My marriage
is great. And, you know, I, look, but
I was in a bad marriage at first.
And so I know I know both ways.
But even though things are so good in
my life right now. I said to my
wife a few weeks ago.
I'm gonna I'm gonna go Las Vegas, and
I'm gonna just hang by myself, and I'm
gonna see some shows and and just spend
time by myself.
And you know, I saw a sold
good concert or 2. And and those are
the kind of things that like,
kind of almost rejuvenate my life, like, getting
me back to... Even though I'm I'm always
passionate. It just... It gets gets things even
better.
So
Jake, I think this... I think this great
advice that you gave your client. Just go
down to the desert for a little while.
Just just think.
Think.
Sit by yourself, sit with yourself. I think
it's an extremely powerful tool that people,
especially
in today's society don't take advantage of where...
I mean, if you look,
is threw throughout
civilization, think of a think of agriculture and
how many people were farmers. How many people
were out there
tending the fields in sal for the entire
day, just listening,
listening to the wind, the listening to their
own thoughts, and we are in a
in a place
in human
society where it's... We're always reaching for a
distraction, We don't even and Eye I fall
victim too where I don't even give myself
to full time to let a thought form
and I've reached for my phone because I'm
bored.
And
when I'm doing that, I know that I'm
not in a great place, and I need
to delete whatever apps are distracting me.
I
I think that being alone is a superpower
that we all have they could teach ourselves.
And
to do it right. It's gonna hurt. It's
going to suck for a little bit. It's
gonna be painful. And
you need to push past that pain to
get the benefits. Just like meditation. Right? Or,
like, meditation kinda of sucks at first. But
if you keep doing it, you start to
build the practice,
start to drill that muscle.
And it was something that I first learned
when I did do that solo trip, and
I was alone a lot. And I I
felt what loneliness this was. I was some
comfortable and it pushed me out of my
comfort zone and allowed me to go and
talk to people in hostel and develop these
interpersonal skills that I didn't ask for. But
also, let me just be alone and be
with my thoughts, and I became very okay
with myself
because ultimately,
that's all we have is is ourselves and
our our consciousness and our thoughts. So if
you could be okay with yourself, I think
there's a lot of power there.
1 last thing I'll say on that is
I've been...
So I got a lot of my own
personal healing down and the desert, and it
was also what I kind of, I've learned
to heal
working
with
teenagers and
you're down the San Rafael swell for a
wilderness therapy program called elements,
and it was a tremendous experience. And it
taught me the power
of quiet. And in that time, they were
stripped from all creature comforts, including their phone,
no music.
They were we were just out there in
the desert. They were out there for about
3 months at a time. Us as mentors
should do 8 day shifts.
It was it was pretty rugged.
And
the stillness
taught me that this is always at our
fingertips. It's just a matter of if we
want it.
And recently, I've been going on my own,
for lack better term vision quests.
Where
I go back down to the swell as
swell. Sin rafael swell here in Central Utah
very
healing
place for me.
So I go down there 3 days fasted
and
feeling very clean and very clear
and
sit with my own medicine and then
eventually break my ass and then what ends
up being a pretty spiritual practice for me.
Re my body and giving myself those nutrients,
but
talk about
Stein never never coming in quite so clear.
Than when I I go down fast it
with the intention showing up for myself saying,
you know what, I'm not gonna eat a
thing for 3 days. I'm gonna show my
devotion
to myself and to my spirit, and
to whatever God that I or anyone else
believes in.
That for me seems to be the quickest
way to realign and to remember.
Who I am.
I... It's... It's a bit extreme for sure.
So I wouldn't recommend it for everyone,
but it's something that I'm very passionate about,
and it's it's interesting. It's it's 3 days.
It's really only 1 day down in the
desert lake. I think we could most of
us could find that time.
Again, it's a tool that is at our
fingertips. It's just a matter of,
if you want it, and if you're willing.
I remember
several weeks after I got divorced actually, this
is this is back in 2001.
I think, yeah, 2001. So quite some time
ago.
I just I just talked to you about
Las Vegas, and nobody nobody would in the
right mind would say Las Vegas is a
peaceful place to go to to
meditate and and just be solid it. It's
not. However,
when I
ready Forgot the worst, I packed up my
backpack, and I went at on the Appalachian
trail by myself
for 3 days. And you a 3 days
is not a lot of time, but
I was in it was in the winter.
I remember, They... I was, like, the only
crazy person on this trail backpack packing,
a snowstorm was coming in, but I was
by myself, and I'll never forget this. I
was able to spend
3 full days just in sol
being by myself, and that that helped
incredibly,
no. Now, I didn't fast because when you're
backpack packing for 3 days, I don't think
you wanna fast. You need the energy.
But I do wanna know
it's interesting. So you say you go to
the to the desert and you spend 3
days
without without food or water. Tell me tell
me a little bit about your fast because
I don't I don't think you're... I don't
think you're not drinking anything either. Right?
No. So it's not a dry fast. I
do shrink water.
Okay.
And there are benefits to a dry fast
for sure, but for me being out there
alone. I
I wanna take care of my body now
can get myself enough
nutrients to at least sustain.
So I'm... I'm drinking water, but only only
water, no coffee, no tea.
Nothing that's gonna break that fast.
And
outside of
the physiological benefits of which there are many.
And I feel very much. It's
it's a
it's a practice and devotion
to myself and how much.
I'll show up for myself, and
it's also just a re examination of food,
and I think that, you know,
from food nourishment comes life in life force
and it's very important for us to read
examine what that relationship is because I've had
so many
instances where I'm not feeling great, and I've
just binge eating and just so quickly
eating food. And I'll
a slight example, I grew up in a
non religious household I.
My family is I'm a a of italian
descent. My family's room Catholic now Is baptized,
but that was it.
Parents never found the church it really spoke
to him.
Their their God was the golden rule treat
others the way you'd like to be treated
and always is abide by that, but no
real spirituality. No. No. Church. No organized religion.
And it we'd we never prayed over meals,
and it wasn't until I'm met
my partner, a 4 years now M michele.
That we...
Our life has felt bit like a fairy
tale, and we're extremely grateful in
every moment in K is so good at
slowing down and listening and
practicing gratitude.
That we try for every meal every time
we can ingest say a prayer, and it's
different than the the prayers of Regents says
hey, Christmas or Easter the 2 times that
we would just kinda felt like you're reading
a script where we do a, a grateful
practice. And say what we're grateful for that
day. And it's just taking a pause taking
a moment.
Before we ingest the the food the 1
of the greatest gifts of all.
That... Yeah. It's a practice that I think
we will continue fourth with the with our
family. Could you share an example of maybe
something that you would say before a meal?
I'm very curious?
Absolutely. So it actually started.
Going back to elements
program before
bed every night. So it it'd be about
4 field mentors.
And about 10 to 12 kids have crew.
And we'd stand around the fire because we
we'd always have fire of good camping. And
before we put it out,
under a
desert moon with stars. You'd go around and
we do a great group that was called,
and you could you could ramble for as
as long as you want And I brought
that practice to Mc mckay. That's that's what
started, and it could be anything as large
as, you know, I'm grateful for
for God and for the fact that he
showed me my purpose and now how it
I could help everything,
or it could be as
small as
you know, lay a grass or this lady
bug or the the fact that snails might
my girlfriends in insect. She she texted me
this back today, and this is a great
example.
Snails
have
they have the ability
to reproduce with themselves.
And
they could do that and reproduce and make
babies, but they choose not to.
Maybe they're something they they have some love
in their system, and they choose to come
together in commune and reproduce that way. So
something as silly as that seemingly silly is
that.
I'm grateful for that fact because that...
That's a little bit of magic. And a
little bit of magic in life keeps me
going and I love it.
So... Yeah. It's... Sometimes they're they ramble. Sometimes
they're they're a little quicker because I'm hungry.
But we try to do it every night.
I'll tell you something. I'm gonna start that.
I... Sometimes my wife and I do that,
and, she she's
Japanese
She lived most life in Japan. So we
always will say something before we will say
like It,
which
loosely loosely
translated to needs,
thank you for the food. I'm about to
ingest or thank you for the life that
you gave so we can eat this food
some... You know, again, there's no... It's not
an exact translation. So that's
something that
almost all Japanese and these people will say
before eating anything.
But your idea,
just to, like,
talk a little bit more about something that's
you're thankful for or, I I love it.
I'm gonna I'm gonna start it. I promise.
I
I'm curious also getting back to your getting
back to your client and, of course, keeping
complete confidentiality. We have no idea who this
person is so that's okay.
What's the next step though? You say you...
You... I think you said you suggested that
he go
spend some time by himself. But let's say
he does that comes back.
And maybe he feels a little bit better,
but still he's in a job in a
relationship that's that's that are not really working,
but has to support kids.
What's your what's your next step with him?
How how do you how are you gonna
help him
more... You know, get get to work he
needs to be? So with all my clients,
I lead a 3 step process, and it
starts with
preparation.
Then obviously the ceremony. And then perhaps perhaps
the most important pillars
integration and taking the lessons
from the ceremony, what we learn and putting
them into practice.
And
at that point, it turns into
my role a little bit more of coaching.
I don't like that term, like coach with
me as all another stigma, but it is
a little more of
identifying
identifying the lessons the insights and Got. What
I like to do... I like I like
things and threes.
So the the the order of 3 for
that 1 would be first
identify
the insight that you have. And then second
step,
is come up with the absolutely best case
scenario, Let your mind expand
and the firm be believer in
the practice of manifestation, I think to to
truly manifest whether it is that we want
we need to see the best case scenario
we need to be shooting for something.
And then the third step is, okay. Let's
break you down. What's
what's the first thing that we need to
do?
And let's build the path. So for example,
if he gets the insight? Okay. I need
to work out more.
Great. What's the absolute best case scenario?
I am learning
10 miles every day. I I'm am extremely
fit from that. I get so much energy.
I get so much dopamine me, and I'm
not depressed anymore.
I live a long healthy life
95. I'm able to
pick up my my great grandchild. Great. Right?
What's the first step
and how to accomplish that?
Go to the gym. Created get a Gym
membership. Right get a pair of running shoes,
make a plan,
tell people about, tell your wife that you're
gonna do. When you tell people about things
you're you're less likely to to not accomplish
them.
So... Yeah, taking those next steps. So that's
integration in a
nutshell,
it's
it's constant
communication.
I have multiple calls with my clients
to check ins. So that first call is
kinda about. Diving into those and
determining what steps we're gonna take. And then
it is a matter of
accountability,
and
checking it with the clients. But
in this work, it is...
I'm a I'm a guide. I'm a facilitator,
But I can't do the work. Right? They
they need to show up for themselves,
and that starts in preparation. They need to
prepare for ceremony.
Because it's
it's very true that more fair for this
ceremony it's more effective it's gonna be. If
you come in have a Mcdonald's breakfast,
and not doing any meditation or journal before,
your intention. It's not gonna be as effective
as a ceremony as if
you were to do the work beforehand.
So, yeah, That that leads into integration and
shown after your yourself and
goes back to that devotion that we were
talking about how devoted argue
to the change that you desired.
Where do you normally do the ceremony? Do
you do this
your house? Or do you do with it?
Their house or you do it out in
nature? Where... Where's... Where do you find as
the best place for you to do a
ceremony with your with your client?
Totally dependent. So that my practice. I
I've I'm in Salt Lake as was mentioned,
and there are a lot of Salt Lake
clients or Utah, local clients. I,
being part of the psychedelic passage network. I
do get a lot of clients from out
of state.
Sometimes they like to to fly in and
have a little bit of a getaway,
get away from their normalized. Sometimes that they
like me to fly out. So I've loaned
to Alaska, I'm trying to boise
in a few weeks,
going down to Arizona. So it it depends
on the client where they're most comfortable.
If they have a space that's it's conducive
to a healing
ceremony. Fantastic.
If they need a break from it,
I always offer,
my house I have a
cute little bun here in sugar house that
has a sound system and a nice day
bed. And it's it's a been tried and
tested many times in for ceremony.
And that is kinda nice offering a neutral
setting for
for the work to be done.
So I would say about 80 percent of
time. I I do end up doing,
ceremony in my own space, my own house.
So
At what point do you
understand whether your work is is actually
successful with a client And and do you
have any clients that are just... That just
don't work out. That are just... No matter
what you try to do with them, they're
stuck in the same space and they just
can't get out.
This work
is filled with nuance add something.
It's filled with variables
each ceremonies is so different and each experience
from each client coming in is each is
so different.
I have
many
clients that will come in and
have a
completely life altering experience
right in
that day. And for we'll forever be changed,
and we'll have this glow about them. I've
have other ones that will have extremely challenging
experiences, and that's that's a problem it's just
part of the work.
Means that there were some real stuff that
had to come up. But that day they
may not be super bright
and and bubbly.
It may be a week after an integration
that they start to have these insights and
start to be grounded it again that they
can start making those changes. It may be
5 weeks from now.
It's so dependent. And
I would say it's...
I'm not
personally, too worried about,
determining if it's successful from from my standpoint.
I'm I'm more so focused on that. And
how they how they see it to be
successful.
I would say that I I do believe
that most of my clients do get some
form of change,
and from that subset, most of them, It's
it's the change that they're looking for.
With my intention setting, I'm I'm always quick
to say,
you know, let's let's set some intentions.
Let's come in looking to work on on
something.
But the the nuance of it,
hold that intention loosely.
The medicine will give you,
not necessarily exactly what you want.
It'll often give you what you need. And
it may be a little unclear in the
moment, but sit on it for a little
bit. Let's give it some time and space.
And see how that works out in more
times than not. It does tend to to
work out and all for the insights that
were needed.
I've got 1 more question for you, and
then I think we're gonna we're gonna wrap
it for today. However, Jake, I've got so
many more questions. I wanna ask you. So
it's okay, can we do this again sometime
soon. Oh, I would not take.
Excellent. Let's let's plan to do that, But
that wasn't my that wasn't my question. Actually,
That was 1 of my question, but that
wasn't my real. But so my real question
is, to to end this today,
I still feel a lot of people or
are listening or watching, And they're they're just
in that
bad space, whether it's a relationship or a
job or or or something like that.
And they're saying they're saying to themselves.
Yeah. But I just can't... I just I
just can't do anything now.
There plenty of people like that. And and
and
you and I were probably in that in
that situation before, and I know I was.
And and
and and like you said, like...
I had to go through a really tough
time after after my divorce to get to
where I am now. And I can honestly
say, and I I have a feeling, you
can say the same thing, like...
Every day is a blessing for me now
because I love what I do. I love
where right am. I'm looking up at Mountains
here. I and I'm exactly where I wanna
be in my life exactly. And I I
feel that you are as well.
However, there are people that are...
Following this, and they're not.
And... But they're afraid to take that first
step. They're just afraid to rock the boat
because fear the unknown.
So my final question on today's episode is
is what do you say to those people
that just say, I
I know something's wrong I just can't do
anything about it now.
The first step
would be find some stillness
and listen.
And listen listen for the next steps because
they usually do comps, but first shows some
devotion to your process.
However, that looks.
Again, for me, it's it's fasting the physical
fitness tends to get me their,
meditation as well.
But,
everyone's
first up like that crack of the window
that we chatted about letting some light in
looks different
and acknowledging that.
And,
you know, obviously,
this podcast is kinda centered around sole set
mushrooms and work I do is
centered around Psychedelics, but
I wanna say very, very plainly that Psychedelic
aren't the answer for everyone. And that's very
very to admit. And
for a lot of folks, they could find
that same place through meditation or Yoga.
Or a journal practice. Or community.
Ecstatic dance there are so many avenues. So
many things to try.
It's it's a matter of
Again, listening to yourself on listening, what's what
feels right to try?
Now I think it's safe to say that...
And again, yeah. Yeah. This show is is
absolutely based on
psilocybin. And what you do in your daily
life helping other people. That's based on psilocybin.
But I think it's safe to say and...
Let's see if you agree with me that
if you're in...
If got some just shitty thing going on
in your life
just taking some psilocybin
and hoping for the best is is not
gonna is not gonna do the trick. When
would you agree with that?
Going hundred percent. I I think that's
it is a common perception around
the world of psychedelics right now. There's so
much energy energy. And it's great. And, I'm
glad that there's been this, re revolution.
This awakening thing. But they're along with that
comes some headlines and
16 minutes zoom stories in New York comes
out articles of 20 years of therapy and
in 1 session. And while that's great. That's
very rarely the case
especially for someone who's not doing the work
for beforehand.
You need to tilt the soil.
You need to first tilt this because if
you're if you're trying to sow a seed
in some... Some of this Utah clip that
we have here without filling it and amending
it and putting compost thin mix, the rows
isn't gonna grow out.
So in the preparation, and that's, you know,
why it's in eat fully important part to
the ceremony and the integration, the preparation is
till the soil. And and till the soil
is doing the work and
dev boating yourself to the cause of the
heat or whatever it is to the expansion,
whatever is working on.
But it's not on that or... It's not
a magic pill.
And we live it... We live in a
western
culture where for so long you've been
prescribe magic pills
that
affect our brains in such way ways that
they end basically just not us to emotions.
This is be complete opposite. This will make
you feel emotions.
But that could be really scary sometimes. So
it's about doing the prep work beforehand.
Be to create that space where you can
feel the emotions.
Through ceremony,
feeling them and then through integration,
taking the necessary steps to have lasting change
in your life.
Yeah. Like I say to people all the
time, you've got to do this work. It's
not This is not like popping a pharmaceutical,
like taking an Ss and then going about
your normal business just hoping for the best.
You've got to put the work into this.
So so if you're
with us here,
please, if you find yourself in a in
a very rough situation in your life, don't
just think that by dosing some psilocybin and
it's gonna change it change everything. It's it's
not... That's not the way it works. So
I just wanna leave you with it. Please.
You've gotta do what we've talked about. At
least start this way. We'll talk about in
this show.
Jake,
thank you so much for your time today
as a matter of fact, if you can,
I wanna to share something with our, especially
with our viewers right now? If you're listening,
you might appreciate this. But if you're if
you're watching,
Jake,
come over here for a second and be
with... Because I I gotta share this is
really funny. We we met at a call
at a tea shop in Salt Lake City,
but we couldn't sit at the same table
as we're getting bleed over from the microphone
it... So. But with me,
it's just...
So
to take those out
because that's good. Good Yeah.
Anyway, listen,
thank you so much for being here. May.
You are pleasure such great energy, and I
real really appreciate, and we're gonna do this
again. Right? I can't wait. That's incredible pleasure.
Say I feel the same way. So
so guys,
hang... Hang tight be with us. Because gonna
have this guy back. He's awesome, and I'm
glad. I'm glad I met him. So thanks
again. And remember, I put out a brand
new episode every
Wednesday and Friday,
Micro You, both on Youtube
and
Apple podcasts, spotify,
check the show notes, got some very important
links that you can, get some resources. And
also my website,
micro u dot com, and that's micro dose
just with the letter u tacked on the
end of it. Micro u dot com, fairly
new website, It's got some really good stuff
for you there. Just hang with us, and
we're here to help. I'm here to help.
And, as I say, Jake, I say at
the end of every single episode and this
is no exception. I look at my listeners
and my followers and my friends, I called
them na come which is a word that
means kinda, like our whole... Our tribe, our
family, our group of like minded people and
I say, I love you, and I really
do. Thanks so much for being here. Thanks.
Thanks again, Jake. I really appreciate it
See you guys later.