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This is Laura Dedo with the Becker's Healthcare Podcast.
I'm thrilled today to be joined by Dr. Mike Curran,
clinical assistant professor of medicine and eRecord medical director,
provider documentation, and E H R optimization.
And well as section chief of the division of cardiology at U P M C St. Margaret.
Dr. Kran, it's a pleasure to have you on the podcast today.
It's a pleasure to be here, and thank you for having me.
Now, I know we've got a lot to talk about.
There's so much happening in healthcare and really a lot changing with
technology and, um, how fast that is moving and evolving.
But before we dive into my questions,
can you tell us a little bit more about yourself and your background?
Sure. Um, well, first and foremost, I am a, a non-invasive cardiologist.
I practice on a daily basis seeing patients
across every venue of care. I do some minor procedures.
I spend time in the office and I see patients in the hospital.
So I do a little bit of everything. Um, at the same time,
I have a lot of responsibilities related to our electronic health record at U P
M C,
which has really evolved out of an interest in making processes better and has
developed into being involved in some of our strategic decision making and, um,
how we interact with both our end users and our patients at our organization.
Absolutely. I love that. And, you know, when you think about those two roles,
both on the technology side as well as the clinical side,
how have you been able to make them work together?
Has it really seemed pretty seamless to you? Or do you,
have you built over time strategies to really be effective at both?
Uh, that's a great question. Uh, I, I think for me, the,
the biggest value that I bring to, to what I do is that I'm,
that I'm doing both things simultaneously almost all of the time.
So when I'm delivering care to my patients,
I'm using the functionality and asking myself the question of, does this work?
Doesn't this work? What, what can be done better?
Or why does this work this way?
And I then take that back to technical teams and say, Hey, I noticed this today.
What's happening here? And we,
we discover things about something that we may have built a long time ago and we
can optimize,
or it leads us down a discovery path for doing something differently. Um, it it,
at the same time,
when I go to my colleagues and I'm talking to them about new functionality or
changes,
I have a lot of credibility with them because I'm delivering care every day with
them in some fashion. And so when I'm talking to them about,
this is why we're doing this, or I need you to do this, they,
they listen to me because they understand that I am there with them, um,
and part of the caregiving team. And it really, it really makes for a, a,
a successful partnership across our organization between me as an informatics
physician delivering care and working with our IT teams to,
to deliver a great experience for our patients and our, our physician staff.
Absolutely. I love that. I think, you know,
it's just so impactful to have both of those backgrounds and,
and that expertise front and center. So, you know, when you think about that,
um,
very unique place you're sitting at between the clinical care and the technology
teams that you work with,
what are some of the big opportunities that you have your eyes on right now as
well as the headwinds that are emerging?
Uh, I think the opportunities, I mean, it, it,
if possible not to talk about artificial intelligence is the opportunities. Um,
uh, it is very real. Um, and, and it is here. Um, and, and you know,
those are the things that I,
I'm certainly laser focused on to try to deliver some, uh,
opportunities for our providers to be more efficient in how they deliver care,
um, to have, uh, you know,
tools available to them to truly deliver care to their patients,
give themselves some time back. I,
I think that anyone who's asked that question is probably gonna give a very,
very similar answer based on the exciting times that we're living in right now
related to ai. Um, the headwinds, uh, I think are, are,
are an interesting question. It's with AI and with technology, it's,
it's the challenges of just the constant change that has occurred as we've come
out of the pandemic. It's been, it was a draining time. You know, I just, uh,
just thinking back on the, the,
the several years going through it and the impact that that had on, uh,
so many people, both, uh, caregivers, our IT staff, uh,
you know,
our patients and all the work that we had to do and the things we had to change
as a result of that. And then as we continue,
have continued to evolve from that as a, as a society and a,
and a healthcare organization, you know, and we talk about things like ai,
that's a headwind. Talking about the change that comes with that. Um, you know,
a lot of things have come out of that, uh,
the pandemic as well related to just our ability to staff our hospitals,
our clinics, um,
and some of the challenges that we've had with our patients accessing our care,
um, uh, to, to come back and, and,
and feel comfortable receiving care in an environment that many people are still
a little bit wary of because of the impact that the pandemic has had on them
personally. Um, I think all of those are, um,
things that will be overcome, but they're, they're, they're real headwinds.
It's, they've been real challenges to us.
Absolutely. I think that's such a great point.
And certainly looking at all the different changes that have happened over the
past two years during the pandemic and then, you know,
the continued aftermath of what we're seeing both economically on a large scale
and then in healthcare with, as you mentioned, the staffing challenges.
I can imagine there's, there's always a, a new, uh,
new thing you need to troubleshoot or a new issue that you're working on. So,
um, uh, and I love your your focus on AI too,
because I think certainly it's been around for a long time,
but really in the last few months here, um,
ha has emerged in the big way on the national stage as well as in healthcare.
Uh, from your vantage point, you know,
what are those conversations like when you're talking about ai,
when you're talking about where it can be most useful, uh,
for the hospital and the health system in general? What are you thinking about?
What factors are you thinking through in, in, where do you see it headed?
Um, so, so I, you know, my, my main focus is related to direct care delivery,
so that's, that's how I think about it. Um, uh,
so that's how my answer's gonna be phrased around that. I, I think that the,
some of the automation tools to do mundane tasks for physicians,
for nurses, um, leveraging AI to do that,
th there are very real opportunities. Um, I, you know, I,
I'm incredibly excited and just seeing some of the,
the things that are out there currently, um, and,
and that are still in their infancy,
but just the potential that they already and, and the, the,
the real outcomes that they already deliver are just incredible. Um, you know,
I, I just was talking to a colleague yesterday and, and,
and talking to them about some,
a pilot with an AI project that we're going to be doing with some folks and
using the, the term, you know, the kind of the,
the mind blowing moment when you see it in real use. And it's,
it's incredible to see and visualize and then think about the potential of what
that can do to my ability to care for a patient, to talk to a patient,
and then do all of the work that comes with that around me, have it, uh,
much more automated than it is currently. It's a time saver.
It gives me ability to see more patients, um, uh, in a more meaningful way.
It's a more meaningful interaction when it occurs,
and I feel better at the end of the day because I have a lot of those tasks that
have really caused the burden on physicians and nurses. Um, you know,
I'm sure you're familiar with the burnout conversation that is ongoing that,
that really assists to, to reduce those things. I, I, it's just,
it's incredibly, um, uh, exciting to me in terms of, uh,
the next steps related to ai.
That's great to hear. Now, overall,
how are you thinking about growth and adding value to the hospital?
What does that look like for you?
Especially as I know we've talked through some of the,
the current challenges and, and headwinds. I.
I think, um, growth is a, is a challenging question,
particularly for someone like me. Um, but I,
I do think that there are many opportunities to think about how to grow as an
organization for us. Um, I, I think one of the, the things that,
that we really can focus on is how to better deliver care outside of the
traditional walls of the hospital or the, the, the,
the office or the imaging center or wherever. Um, I, I, there's,
there's a ton of opportunity that,
particularly as technology has evolved to deliver care, um,
in non-traditional settings in asynchronous ways, um, you know, we've,
we've learned a lot of that through, through, as we've come out of the pandemic.
You apply that with some of the, the,
the technology that has been in being developed,
and we continue to connect all of those pieces. I think there's a,
a huge opportunity to partner with vendors who have done that to,
to get more into a bigger opportunity with patients to care for. Um,
I also think that there is a quite a bit of duplicative work that's completed
within some of the traditional healthcare environments that if you can reduce
that, you can free time and deliver potentially more care, more,
more diagnostics, more communication with patients, and that, that truly,
that's an opportunity for,
for organic growth within an organization if you can do that. Um,
I think if those two things are focused on,
there are many other opportunities for growth,
but that's the way that I view it as someone with the background that I've
mentioned, um, thinks through growth for our, for our healthcare organization.
Absolutely. I, I love that. And I think that makes so much sense,
just especially given, um,
your role in really where you can be most impactful for that direct patient
care. Um, and you know, I was wondering too,
obviously right now is a, a time of lots of different challenges,
both financially as well as resource-wise with staffing shortages, shortages,
as we've talked about. So every dollar and minute is precious in healthcare,
but you know,
if there's a space where you feel like it's still an important area to invest in
or a risk to take right now, um, to set yourself up for success in the future,
what would that be?
Um, again, a great question. Um, it it's, it's picking the right partner, um,
whether that be a clinical partner or a technology partner, speci,
I would say specifically related to artificial intelligence. I think that,
that the risks, um, are definitely worth taking with partnering with,
with AI vendors to, to better yourself as an organization. I, I,
I,
I think that not getting into that space is, uh,
will be a mistake for organizations if they are unwilling to think about, um,
the future of AI as a healthcare delivery partner for them. And I,
I think that people are, they are doing that as you, you know,
everything that you read about AI every day in healthcare, it's,
it's a scary concept, but, um, um, I think it, it,
it is absolutely worth the risk to take moving forward.
That makes a lot of sense. And you know, I know it was still very,
very early on in this, but when you think about, uh,
what an ideal partner would look like,
is it similar to the other vendor partnerships that you have or are there
certain aspects of, um, artificial intelligence and just the gravity of,
of what that brings to a,
to a hospital or health system that are really unique to think about?
Um,
I don't know that anybody can answer that question because of the infancy that
we are in with this. Um, uh, I, I think, um,
it's having a measured approach to partnership, uh, when,
when selecting a, a, a vendor, if you have existing relationships with,
with, um, companies that are getting into that, that, I mean,
like everyone is involved with the artificial intelligence, then you, uh,
trust that that organization and you have some of the infrastructure already in
place, it might be easier for you to go with,
with that partnership because of the relationship that's already there.
There's always the flip side of a, of a, you know,
a small developing company and working with them,
potentially even investing in them to develop,
making part of your healthcare organization.
I really think that's going to be a, a,
an organization by organization decision based upon their existing relationships
and where they are as an organization to, to, to
make those types of decisions.
Got it. That makes a lot of sense. Uh, before we wrap up our conversation today,
I'm wondering where do you see some of the best opportunities for growth and
development in the future,
both for yourself as well as the teams that you work with?
Oh, um, you know, it for, for, for me personally, for growth, um,
the opportunities,
it's really just continuing to think outside their traditional, um,
healthcare delivery system. Uh, you know, the, the, the walls of the hospital,
the walls of the office. I think, um,
we have to think differently in the world that we are now living in and
will be living in, in 10 years from now in the world that my kids will live in.
Uh, I, I think that the opportunity there is just is,
is still very much, uh, untapped. Um,
so I, I think personally that's a huge opportunity, um,
as well as for our organization and, and the folks that I work with. Um,
at the same time there, there's, there's,
there's also personal growth and just continuing to build those
relationships with, with team members. Um, you know, that's a,
that's a different type of growth. Um,
I think we lost a lot of personal relationships with the pandemic, uh,
because we all are now behind screens all of the time,
and it's been great personally for growth, uh,
to watch teams come back together and work together and be productive and real,
remember what it's like to do those things. There's clearly a space for, um,
doing remote work, but I think that the value of the,
of being part of a team in place, uh, is, is, uh,
being realized again because people are doing it more and more. And I,
I think there's, there's professional growth related to that, not necessarily,
um, uh, directedly translating into financial growth,
but I think that's a critical, uh, part of being part of a team and developing,
um, uh,
care models and technology and everything related to healthcare that we do.
I'm really glad you mentioned that because it is so important to have that
personal connection and,
and that ability to work with the teams and the teams to work well together in
order to, um,
have great patient care and then that ultimately fuels everything else about the
health system. So I think that's such an important point. And, you know,
given as we emerge from the pandemic and everything that went with that,
you know, are,
are you seeing anything that's different about forging those types of
relationships with your teams, with the other care providers? Um,
how do you go about really kind of personalizing that relationship
in this post pandemic era?
Um, it's, it's just, it's different than it used to be. Uh,
that's for certain. Um, but it still comes down to, um,
having good interpersonal skills and communicating and, um,
you know, holding people,
committing to people that you will be present and accountable and asking them to
do the same. Um, uh,
recognizing that you have to be a little bit more flexible probably than you,
we were five years ago because of what we've afforded people, um,
and how people have become more flexible and comfortable with working remotely.
You know, it, I love the turn your cameras on for meetings, uh, um,
mantra that a lot of people have put into place. If you're gonna be on the call,
you need to have your camera on.
I think that helps for those people that are remote to, to be more engaged, uh,
when they, when we need to be. But I still think, um, you know,
it just comes down to how you treat people and, uh, how you, um, uh,
want them to treat you.
There's just so much of interpersonal relationships that you just try
to lead by example, um,
and help other people to get there when they're struggling.
Dr. Curran, thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today.
This has been such an interesting and fantastic conversation and I look forward
to connecting with you again soon.
I really appreciate you having me today. It's been fun.
Absolutely.
And I'm looking forward to meeting you in person as well at our Health IT
Digital Health and Revenue Cycle event this fall in October.
I think a lot of these things that we talked about are really gonna be front and
center, um, as part of the discussions at the event.
And so I am really excited to meet you and learn from you.
Absolutely. Thank you. I'm looking forward to it as well.
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