1 00:00:00,235 --> 00:00:02,205 - Prepare to dive into the forefront 2 00:00:02,225 --> 00:00:05,525 of healthcare innovation at our 14th annual meeting coming 3 00:00:05,545 --> 00:00:06,645 up on April 8th 4 00:00:06,645 --> 00:00:10,765 through 11th at the Hyatt Regency in Chicago, with thousands 5 00:00:10,765 --> 00:00:13,965 of industry leaders converging over four dynamic days 6 00:00:13,985 --> 00:00:16,805 of discussions on crucial topics from health IT 7 00:00:17,185 --> 00:00:18,685 to executive leadership. 8 00:00:18,995 --> 00:00:21,325 It's where the future of healthcare takes shape. 9 00:00:21,865 --> 00:00:24,085 We can't wait to connect with you in person 10 00:00:24,305 --> 00:00:26,725 and engage in these important conversations. 11 00:00:27,715 --> 00:00:30,045 - This is Laura Zido with the Becker's Healthcare Podcast. 12 00:00:30,625 --> 00:00:32,085 I'm thrilled today to be joined by Dr. 13 00:00:32,185 --> 00:00:34,525 Pam Oliver, chief Medical Officer at Novant Health. 14 00:00:34,785 --> 00:00:35,885 Dr. Oliver, it's a pleasure 15 00:00:35,885 --> 00:00:37,045 to have you on the podcast today. 16 00:00:38,335 --> 00:00:39,705 - Well, thank you for having me, Laura. 17 00:00:41,095 --> 00:00:42,555 - Now I know we have a lot to talk about, 18 00:00:42,555 --> 00:00:46,515 and I'm excited to really discuss further Novans News Center 19 00:00:46,575 --> 00:00:48,035 for Public Policy Solutions. 20 00:00:48,055 --> 00:00:49,835 But before we dive into that discussion, 21 00:00:49,835 --> 00:00:50,835 can you tell me a little bit more 22 00:00:50,835 --> 00:00:51,995 about yourself and your background? 23 00:00:53,765 --> 00:00:55,655 - Sure. Um, I am Pam Oliver. 24 00:00:55,755 --> 00:00:57,215 I'm Executive Vice President 25 00:00:57,355 --> 00:01:00,055 and Chief Medical Officer at Novant Health. 26 00:01:00,595 --> 00:01:03,695 I'm an OB GYN physician, um, by training at heart. 27 00:01:03,815 --> 00:01:05,015 I should probably leave with that. 28 00:01:05,515 --> 00:01:09,895 Um, we are a not-for-profit integrated health system in 29 00:01:09,895 --> 00:01:12,855 North Carolina and South Carolina with 19 medical centers, 30 00:01:13,555 --> 00:01:17,015 um, more than 850 locations across our network. 31 00:01:17,645 --> 00:01:19,735 Over 2000 physicians, um, 32 00:01:20,115 --> 00:01:23,255 and about as many as match practice, um, providers 33 00:01:23,255 --> 00:01:25,775 who are caring for our communities in the Southeast. 34 00:01:26,195 --> 00:01:29,495 Um, as Chief Medical Officer, I now have the, uh, 35 00:01:29,495 --> 00:01:31,775 responsibility and take great pride and our safety 36 00:01:31,795 --> 00:01:35,855 and quality, um, health equity across our organization, 37 00:01:36,245 --> 00:01:39,335 medical education, including our graduate medical, um, 38 00:01:39,485 --> 00:01:42,575 education programs, clinical research, um, 39 00:01:42,875 --> 00:01:46,815 and that drives me as a woman of color, a physician driving 40 00:01:47,375 --> 00:01:49,855 outcomes for our communities, uh, in a holistic 41 00:01:49,875 --> 00:01:53,655 and a comprehensive approach is, um, really what my team do. 42 00:01:54,275 --> 00:01:57,415 Um, and so, you know, I have a platform that I don't take 43 00:01:57,435 --> 00:01:58,815 for granted, you know, in my role. 44 00:01:59,275 --> 00:02:02,335 Um, and try to make sure I think that, that I leverage that 45 00:02:02,335 --> 00:02:04,735 for good, which is why I really appreciate you, um, 46 00:02:04,735 --> 00:02:05,855 having me here today. 47 00:02:07,595 --> 00:02:08,895 - Uh, the pleasure is all ours. 48 00:02:08,995 --> 00:02:10,895 Now, uh, from your perspective, 49 00:02:10,985 --> 00:02:13,135 could you tell us about novo's New Center 50 00:02:13,275 --> 00:02:14,815 for Public Policy Solutions? 51 00:02:15,475 --> 00:02:18,335 Why did you launch it and what are your you focused on? 52 00:02:19,135 --> 00:02:23,635 - So, Novan Health has been on a journey for many years to, 53 00:02:23,935 --> 00:02:25,835 um, address several things related 54 00:02:25,935 --> 00:02:28,195 to the care our teams provide. 55 00:02:28,655 --> 00:02:32,195 One of those was, um, addressing burnout, 56 00:02:32,575 --> 00:02:37,355 and another was tackling, being real tactical in 57 00:02:37,375 --> 00:02:39,795 how we think about what is getting in the way 58 00:02:39,795 --> 00:02:41,755 of our teams doing the good care 59 00:02:41,755 --> 00:02:43,435 that we already know that they do. 60 00:02:43,935 --> 00:02:45,675 So we've been on a journey of listening 61 00:02:45,735 --> 00:02:49,395 and engaging, um, our physicians, our nurses 62 00:02:49,495 --> 00:02:52,195 and advanced practice providers, to really appreciate 63 00:02:52,945 --> 00:02:56,635 what it is that gets in the way of us delivering, 64 00:02:56,635 --> 00:02:58,355 of having the best impact we can have 65 00:02:58,375 --> 00:03:00,645 for the great care we already know that we deliver. 66 00:03:01,265 --> 00:03:03,925 So we put together the Navan Health Center 67 00:03:04,145 --> 00:03:08,245 for Public Policy Solutions in 2023 as an extension 68 00:03:08,245 --> 00:03:10,885 of some work that we had already undertaken, um, 69 00:03:11,225 --> 00:03:14,125 and wanted this to really be about developing actionable 70 00:03:14,545 --> 00:03:18,125 policy with patients and clinicians at the center. 71 00:03:18,985 --> 00:03:21,885 So right now, across our organization 72 00:03:22,025 --> 00:03:25,885 and almost every organization, we are facing burnout related 73 00:03:26,065 --> 00:03:29,885 to just the load of what gets in the way of, 74 00:03:30,265 --> 00:03:32,805 of physician being able to take care 75 00:03:32,805 --> 00:03:34,045 of the patient in front of them. 76 00:03:34,785 --> 00:03:37,925 And so our goal with this was we'd done a lot 77 00:03:37,925 --> 00:03:40,365 of work already to remove barriers 78 00:03:41,145 --> 00:03:43,045 and to do what we feel like we could do. 79 00:03:43,145 --> 00:03:45,205 We saw a lot of work that was being done. 80 00:03:45,305 --> 00:03:47,165 We were listening to our clinicians, 81 00:03:47,825 --> 00:03:52,005 and this was our way to really think about how 82 00:03:52,065 --> 00:03:55,125 to bring together those thought partners, 83 00:03:55,125 --> 00:03:58,365 those really smart people who are experts and understand 84 00:03:58,365 --> 00:03:59,805 and appreciate every aspect 85 00:03:59,825 --> 00:04:01,525 of the challenges that they're facing. 86 00:04:02,265 --> 00:04:04,525 Put those smart minds together, help us 87 00:04:04,625 --> 00:04:07,925 to identify the highest priority areas 88 00:04:07,975 --> 00:04:09,485 where we can have real impact. 89 00:04:09,545 --> 00:04:12,205 And when we have impact, it will not just affect 90 00:04:12,265 --> 00:04:13,645 and benefit Novan Health, 91 00:04:13,985 --> 00:04:16,485 but it will benefit all those across the country. 92 00:04:17,065 --> 00:04:18,885 And so pulling together the Center 93 00:04:18,905 --> 00:04:22,845 for Public Policy Solutions was a way for us to get 94 00:04:22,845 --> 00:04:25,485 beyond some of the macroeconomic challenges 95 00:04:25,665 --> 00:04:28,205 and weeping reforms that get caught up 96 00:04:28,225 --> 00:04:31,245 and have maybe less of a chance of, of success, 97 00:04:31,945 --> 00:04:35,605 and to get into the weeds, identify very specific solutions, 98 00:04:36,295 --> 00:04:37,365 drive real change, 99 00:04:37,625 --> 00:04:41,325 and see an impact during the careers of the physicians 100 00:04:41,435 --> 00:04:43,165 that are facing these challenges today. 101 00:04:46,055 --> 00:04:47,075 - That's amazing to hear. 102 00:04:47,095 --> 00:04:49,195 And you know, what a, a really cool philosophy 103 00:04:49,195 --> 00:04:53,115 to have in terms of being able to affect real change, um, 104 00:04:53,215 --> 00:04:56,435 in the moment in being able to tackle those things 105 00:04:56,465 --> 00:04:59,875 that can be dealt with, um, over, as you mentioned, 106 00:04:59,875 --> 00:05:02,995 that kind of timeframe, um, within a physician's career, 107 00:05:03,055 --> 00:05:05,675 or the time that there was no one to be able to, um, 108 00:05:05,675 --> 00:05:06,795 really see the results. 109 00:05:06,815 --> 00:05:09,195 That's so cool. Um, what are some 110 00:05:09,195 --> 00:05:10,435 of the big healthcare policy 111 00:05:10,795 --> 00:05:11,995 challenges that you're seeing right now? 112 00:05:13,885 --> 00:05:16,305 - Oh, the, the, the one that we're targeting right now, 113 00:05:16,325 --> 00:05:19,705 and one that is core to the challenges that we have 114 00:05:19,705 --> 00:05:22,145 as physicians is overregulation. 115 00:05:22,725 --> 00:05:26,185 Um, we go to school, we learn all the best medicines. 116 00:05:26,185 --> 00:05:27,625 We believe in best practices. 117 00:05:27,685 --> 00:05:28,705 We see patients, 118 00:05:29,205 --> 00:05:31,465 and there are so many things that get in the way 119 00:05:31,465 --> 00:05:33,665 of us being able to just take care of that patient. 120 00:05:34,285 --> 00:05:36,865 And when, when we look at the studies nationwide 121 00:05:36,965 --> 00:05:39,185 and they say two and three scary, that two 122 00:05:39,185 --> 00:05:41,465 and three physicians and one in two nurses 123 00:05:41,805 --> 00:05:43,105 report experience and burnout. 124 00:05:43,765 --> 00:05:48,265 And it's not because of the, the care we're delivering, the, 125 00:05:48,265 --> 00:05:50,585 the actual practice of medicine, it is 126 00:05:50,585 --> 00:05:52,865 because of all the other stuff that's getting in the way. 127 00:05:53,285 --> 00:05:57,365 And a lot of that is driven by policies, regulations, rules 128 00:05:57,955 --> 00:06:01,965 that physicians have to jump through hoops to be able to do 129 00:06:01,965 --> 00:06:03,645 what we know our patients need 130 00:06:03,705 --> 00:06:06,005 and what is best practice for our patients. 131 00:06:06,505 --> 00:06:09,565 So when we started, we've been on a journey for many, 132 00:06:09,565 --> 00:06:11,525 many years to, as we looked at burnout 133 00:06:12,105 --> 00:06:15,925 and we put together programs to address burnout affecting, 134 00:06:15,955 --> 00:06:18,725 like looking at the both internal, what can I do 135 00:06:18,725 --> 00:06:23,165 as a physician myself being present, working on, you know, 136 00:06:23,425 --> 00:06:25,165 my my own, what I can control. 137 00:06:25,625 --> 00:06:28,245 And what we really started getting into these external 138 00:06:28,635 --> 00:06:30,485 factors that affect burnout. 139 00:06:31,065 --> 00:06:34,645 And this falls into that external, as an organization, 140 00:06:35,225 --> 00:06:38,445 we identified, we had a project called Getting Rid 141 00:06:38,445 --> 00:06:39,645 of Stupid Stuff that some 142 00:06:39,645 --> 00:06:41,165 organizations have done across the country. 143 00:06:41,305 --> 00:06:43,365 And we, we looked at, we asked our doctors, 144 00:06:43,555 --> 00:06:45,605 what are the things that you feel are just stupid 145 00:06:45,635 --> 00:06:47,525 that are getting in the way that, um, 146 00:06:47,635 --> 00:06:49,845 that block bog you down in a day, 147 00:06:49,845 --> 00:06:51,285 take you away from patient care? 148 00:06:52,105 --> 00:06:55,285 And we addressed hundreds of those over the course 149 00:06:55,345 --> 00:06:56,365 of the first year even. 150 00:06:56,385 --> 00:06:59,885 And we continue it year over year, removing clicks, 151 00:07:00,565 --> 00:07:04,485 removing popups that don't drive value, um, 152 00:07:05,165 --> 00:07:07,405 simplifying, um, workflows and, 153 00:07:07,585 --> 00:07:10,485 and optimizing our, um, electronic health record. 154 00:07:11,065 --> 00:07:12,565 And we did that. And that was 155 00:07:12,585 --> 00:07:16,565 to take our doctors from the norm of spending two hours 156 00:07:16,945 --> 00:07:19,365 for every one hour, two hours, documenting 157 00:07:19,365 --> 00:07:21,805 and charting for every one hour patient care, 158 00:07:21,805 --> 00:07:25,165 which is insane that that's the balance now that nationally 159 00:07:25,625 --> 00:07:27,005 to reducing that time. 160 00:07:27,585 --> 00:07:29,005 So we drove as much as we could. 161 00:07:29,005 --> 00:07:31,445 And what we realized is sometimes we would send out a, 162 00:07:31,785 --> 00:07:34,965 you a, a notification that to our teams 163 00:07:34,995 --> 00:07:38,485 that now this is a new requirement or you need to do X or Y 164 00:07:39,105 --> 00:07:41,965 and we started putting a y behind it. 165 00:07:42,345 --> 00:07:43,765 Why are you being asked to do this? 166 00:07:44,505 --> 00:07:46,445 And we need, need it to be clear. 167 00:07:46,545 --> 00:07:49,365 Is this something that we as a system have chosen to, 168 00:07:49,545 --> 00:07:50,565 to ask you to do? 169 00:07:51,145 --> 00:07:54,245 Or is it something that someone else, a payer, 170 00:07:54,545 --> 00:07:57,805 the government, um, the state is saying 171 00:07:57,805 --> 00:07:59,085 that we now have to do? 172 00:07:59,705 --> 00:08:01,005 And it was eye-opening 173 00:08:01,155 --> 00:08:05,485 because it really helped us to see the amount of 174 00:08:06,325 --> 00:08:10,085 external influence on the workload of our clinicians. 175 00:08:10,865 --> 00:08:15,125 And so we set up a clinician, um, uh, 176 00:08:15,485 --> 00:08:19,805 clinical partner engagement team, educating our doctors on 177 00:08:20,435 --> 00:08:23,245 what are the, what is happening in the policy world. 178 00:08:23,745 --> 00:08:26,445 We started engaging them more writing letters 179 00:08:26,625 --> 00:08:30,285 to get feedback to CMS to the state, inviting them 180 00:08:30,385 --> 00:08:31,965 to be active advocates. 181 00:08:32,545 --> 00:08:35,565 And so as we pull those poly solutions together, 182 00:08:35,625 --> 00:08:38,645 and we started talking about the biggest cha one of the, one 183 00:08:38,645 --> 00:08:40,365 of the biggest challenges right now, 184 00:08:40,365 --> 00:08:42,885 what they see in taking care of patients in front of them, 185 00:08:43,505 --> 00:08:47,685 the overregulation topic that rose to the top was the idea 186 00:08:47,795 --> 00:08:52,245 that when we see patients for a specific type of visit, 187 00:08:52,725 --> 00:08:55,725 specifically a preventative visit, that um, 188 00:08:55,945 --> 00:08:58,285 we are limited in what we can provide to 189 00:08:58,285 --> 00:09:02,085 that patient without that patient having, um, to pay more. 190 00:09:02,225 --> 00:09:03,485 And it then becomes a, 191 00:09:03,625 --> 00:09:06,245 almost like the physicians in the middle is a 192 00:09:06,485 --> 00:09:09,165 confrontational, um, situation that develops. 193 00:09:09,545 --> 00:09:12,805 So the Affordable Care Act requires that insurers 194 00:09:13,535 --> 00:09:17,045 cover annual checkups, annual preventative exams, 195 00:09:17,355 --> 00:09:20,805 that those are visits in our world that are in the, in the, 196 00:09:20,905 --> 00:09:24,965 um, insurers world that are designed to be, um, coming in 197 00:09:24,985 --> 00:09:26,485 to get checked out, um, 198 00:09:26,585 --> 00:09:28,485 and just do the routine preventative things 199 00:09:28,835 --> 00:09:31,365 that is different than a po a problem visit 200 00:09:32,075 --> 00:09:33,125 when we see patients. 201 00:09:33,265 --> 00:09:35,205 And a lot of patients don't speak that language. 202 00:09:35,205 --> 00:09:37,725 They don't understand, and I don't think the payers do a 203 00:09:37,725 --> 00:09:39,165 great job of informing them 204 00:09:39,345 --> 00:09:41,725 of the nuances of their coverage. 205 00:09:41,995 --> 00:09:44,485 They see this as a free visit regardless. 206 00:09:44,945 --> 00:09:47,165 So when the physician and when they have problems 207 00:09:47,185 --> 00:09:48,805 and our teams do the right thing 208 00:09:49,385 --> 00:09:51,965 and we address those problems at the time, 209 00:09:52,585 --> 00:09:55,605 the patient then incurs a separate bill 210 00:09:55,855 --> 00:09:57,645 where they actually have to pay something 211 00:09:58,425 --> 00:10:01,445 and it leads to lots of anger. 212 00:10:01,865 --> 00:10:05,365 And, um, the patients are, are, are upset 213 00:10:05,365 --> 00:10:06,405 with their physicians and, 214 00:10:06,425 --> 00:10:09,405 and their, their anger is directed to the wrong people. 215 00:10:09,645 --> 00:10:11,325 'cause this contract is with their payer 216 00:10:11,345 --> 00:10:12,765 and this is driven by the payers 217 00:10:12,765 --> 00:10:14,405 or the government in some ways. 218 00:10:15,105 --> 00:10:17,125 And we just, we need that to change. 219 00:10:17,345 --> 00:10:20,965 We need to be able to take care of our patients 220 00:10:21,145 --> 00:10:22,325 and do what we need to do. 221 00:10:22,745 --> 00:10:25,485 And we would do the same thing for them if they came back 222 00:10:25,545 --> 00:10:27,405 for a problem visit, it would be the same. 223 00:10:27,835 --> 00:10:29,925 It's just that the pa we are not, 224 00:10:29,945 --> 00:10:32,085 we are either prohibited from doing it without 225 00:10:32,605 --> 00:10:35,085 applying the charge or we're asked to do it 226 00:10:35,345 --> 00:10:37,685 and not charge so that we don't upset the patient. 227 00:10:37,945 --> 00:10:40,965 And that's not fair to our physicians either to not be that, 228 00:10:40,965 --> 00:10:43,085 to not value the time, the energy they're doing it, 229 00:10:43,305 --> 00:10:46,605 or to be put in a situation where we ignore something 230 00:10:46,685 --> 00:10:49,925 for a patient or, or have to have them come back knowing 231 00:10:49,925 --> 00:10:51,765 that that might impact the outcome. 232 00:10:52,345 --> 00:10:56,245 So overregulation the multiple rules that vary 233 00:10:56,425 --> 00:11:00,325 by insurer, but this specific topic of, for our, uh, 234 00:11:00,325 --> 00:11:02,525 especially our primary care physicians rose to the top 235 00:11:02,865 --> 00:11:05,725 as something that if we can move the needle on, 236 00:11:06,035 --> 00:11:08,725 they really felt would benefit them from an, um, 237 00:11:09,035 --> 00:11:11,445 from a career burnout perspective. 238 00:11:13,415 --> 00:11:14,665 - Well, that's fascinating to hear 239 00:11:14,725 --> 00:11:15,865 and certainly, you know, 240 00:11:16,085 --> 00:11:18,985 as you were describing this whole situation, um, I, 241 00:11:19,065 --> 00:11:21,705 I can imagine extremely frustrating for the physicians 242 00:11:21,725 --> 00:11:25,185 as well as patients and trying to figure out how to manage, 243 00:11:25,365 --> 00:11:27,025 um, all of the, the different rules 244 00:11:27,045 --> 00:11:29,505 and regulations from different payers, I'm sure as well. 245 00:11:30,085 --> 00:11:33,145 Um, obviously you outlined a few 246 00:11:33,145 --> 00:11:34,185 of the steps you've been taking, 247 00:11:34,325 --> 00:11:37,825 but, um, how have you seen any of the response 248 00:11:37,825 --> 00:11:40,305 or have you been able to move the needle at all, um, 249 00:11:40,305 --> 00:11:42,145 within some of your conversations 250 00:11:42,255 --> 00:11:44,145 with payers in, in that regard? 251 00:11:44,245 --> 00:11:46,225 Or, um, is it still a work in progress? 252 00:11:47,735 --> 00:11:49,545 - It's definitely still a work in progress. 253 00:11:49,605 --> 00:11:52,505 Uh, we expect that some of this will take, you know, time 254 00:11:52,505 --> 00:11:55,405 because there are so many parties that are involved, right? 255 00:11:55,405 --> 00:11:59,325 There's, there are levers that the government obviously can, 256 00:11:59,545 --> 00:12:03,365 um, pull to influence payers in this space. 257 00:12:03,585 --> 00:12:07,645 Uh, individual payers may be willing to partner, um, and, 258 00:12:07,745 --> 00:12:09,205 and, and make these changes. 259 00:12:09,515 --> 00:12:13,005 There's not a, there may not necessarily be a single 260 00:12:13,485 --> 00:12:15,085 solution that, or, you know, swipe 261 00:12:15,085 --> 00:12:16,925 of a pen solves it for us. 262 00:12:17,265 --> 00:12:20,485 Day one. Um, we put together, we did a white paper, um, 263 00:12:20,585 --> 00:12:23,485 on this subject and released that, um, in the fall 264 00:12:23,555 --> 00:12:25,805 with the input of our physicians 265 00:12:25,905 --> 00:12:27,485 and our, um, leadership teams. 266 00:12:28,105 --> 00:12:31,205 Um, and so we still are very much early in this, 267 00:12:31,265 --> 00:12:35,245 but continuing the advocacy for, um, pulling in those, 268 00:12:35,555 --> 00:12:37,405 like continuing to engage our physicians 269 00:12:37,465 --> 00:12:41,245 and more, I will tell you that has had an impact that, um, 270 00:12:41,645 --> 00:12:45,725 I don't want to understate is physicians feeling seen 271 00:12:45,825 --> 00:12:47,445 and heard and knowing 272 00:12:47,445 --> 00:12:50,525 that we are advocating on their part is priceless. 273 00:12:53,685 --> 00:12:55,205 - Absolutely. That makes a lot of sense. 274 00:12:55,225 --> 00:12:58,205 You know, and it's great that you've been able to, uh, fill 275 00:12:58,205 --> 00:12:59,765 that space and fill that voice 276 00:12:59,785 --> 00:13:02,805 and give them a platform in order to really, um, 277 00:13:02,835 --> 00:13:05,165 make a difference, um, within the patients 278 00:13:05,165 --> 00:13:06,365 that they're working with as well 279 00:13:06,365 --> 00:13:08,085 as just the healthcare system overall. 280 00:13:08,585 --> 00:13:10,525 And I'm curious too, when you look at, you know, 281 00:13:10,525 --> 00:13:12,445 what you've been able to do at Novant Health 282 00:13:12,585 --> 00:13:15,725 and, um, how health systems across the board are, 283 00:13:15,725 --> 00:13:17,845 are really dealing with many of the same challenges. 284 00:13:18,115 --> 00:13:20,765 What opportunities are there for those health systems 285 00:13:20,865 --> 00:13:22,325 to really influence legislation 286 00:13:22,325 --> 00:13:23,525 and public policy in the future? 287 00:13:25,575 --> 00:13:28,055 - I think we have, um, there's, there's, 288 00:13:28,055 --> 00:13:29,815 there's huge potential there. 289 00:13:30,195 --> 00:13:34,975 And, um, it's really about starting with just listening 290 00:13:35,195 --> 00:13:37,975 to all of all health systems, while we have similar 291 00:13:38,765 --> 00:13:42,615 overarching challenges, um, have a unique opportunity to 292 00:13:43,235 --> 00:13:46,335 use those experts that we work with 293 00:13:46,515 --> 00:13:50,015 and partner with every day to inform us on 294 00:13:50,085 --> 00:13:52,255 what the challenges are and to truly listen. 295 00:13:52,795 --> 00:13:55,855 We bandaid and we, we fix things 296 00:13:56,075 --> 00:13:59,295 and try to make it work within this complex kind of, 297 00:13:59,395 --> 00:14:00,775 you know, I don't wanna say it's broken, 298 00:14:00,875 --> 00:14:04,935 but really challenging system that we all, um, work with 299 00:14:05,715 --> 00:14:10,135 and listening and, and, and, right, um, raising those voices 300 00:14:10,635 --> 00:14:12,095 and pushing that forward so 301 00:14:12,095 --> 00:14:16,495 that it becomes not just Novant Health who is identifying 302 00:14:16,715 --> 00:14:19,935 and challenging and seeking solutions, 303 00:14:20,315 --> 00:14:24,855 but there is a sea of, there are c it's a sea of voices that 304 00:14:25,435 --> 00:14:29,255 all can sing and inform about these challenges. 305 00:14:29,535 --> 00:14:32,655 I think that that is, that could be incredibly powerful. 306 00:14:33,075 --> 00:14:35,655 Um, I do think that the more like our, our, 307 00:14:35,675 --> 00:14:38,295 the more our clinical teams have an opportunity to engage 308 00:14:38,445 --> 00:14:40,175 with lawmakers, um, 309 00:14:40,195 --> 00:14:42,855 and that's across any health system, the better. 310 00:14:43,275 --> 00:14:47,295 Um, that I've often found myself when, when 311 00:14:48,335 --> 00:14:51,765 advising or speaking with, um, members of Congress 312 00:14:51,945 --> 00:14:55,605 or state legislators, um, they're open and willing to listen 313 00:14:55,665 --> 00:14:57,805 and don't always appreciate 314 00:14:57,825 --> 00:15:00,125 or know some of these nuances and challenges. 315 00:15:00,185 --> 00:15:04,005 So as, as health systems, we have both the ability to 316 00:15:04,265 --> 00:15:09,205 and the duty to pull in our teams to do the best we can 317 00:15:09,265 --> 00:15:12,805 to inform those who are setting these policies, having an, 318 00:15:12,945 --> 00:15:15,805 um, have an opportunity to change these policies over time. 319 00:15:16,305 --> 00:15:19,005 And we truly believe that our organization 320 00:15:19,555 --> 00:15:23,005 will be a great resource, um, as timely policy, 321 00:15:23,425 --> 00:15:26,485 timely policy changes, um, are on the horizon 322 00:15:26,745 --> 00:15:28,725 and other health systems will follow suit. 323 00:15:30,285 --> 00:15:31,735 - Well, Dr. Oliver, thank you so much 324 00:15:31,735 --> 00:15:33,255 for joining us on the podcast today. 325 00:15:33,255 --> 00:15:35,975 This has been such a fun and informative conversation 326 00:15:36,315 --> 00:15:38,095 and I look forward to connecting with you again soon. 327 00:15:39,485 --> 00:15:40,975 - Well, I look forward to updating you 328 00:15:40,975 --> 00:15:42,935 as we can see progress from the great work we're doing 329 00:15:42,935 --> 00:15:44,095 and I appreciate you having me, Laura.