1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,159 Hello, everyone. This is Jacob Emerson with the 2 00:00:02,159 --> 00:00:03,859 Becker's Payer Issues podcast. 3 00:00:04,240 --> 00:00:06,639 Thrilled today to be joined by Emily Porter, 4 00:00:06,639 --> 00:00:09,119 who is the vice president of external affairs 5 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:11,679 at Sidecar Health. Emily, thank you so much 6 00:00:11,679 --> 00:00:13,039 for taking the time to be with me 7 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:14,179 on the podcast today. 8 00:00:14,525 --> 00:00:15,904 Sure. Thank you for having me. 9 00:00:16,204 --> 00:00:17,804 So before we dive into everything we wanna 10 00:00:17,804 --> 00:00:19,484 talk with you about, Emily, and, a big 11 00:00:19,484 --> 00:00:21,644 policy change going on in Washington, can you 12 00:00:21,644 --> 00:00:23,644 talk to us a little bit about your 13 00:00:23,644 --> 00:00:25,804 career background and what it is that you're 14 00:00:25,804 --> 00:00:27,744 doing today at Sidecar Health? 15 00:00:28,660 --> 00:00:29,699 Sure. So I, 16 00:00:30,339 --> 00:00:32,260 I got my my career start at a 17 00:00:32,260 --> 00:00:34,359 think tank in Washington DC. 18 00:00:35,060 --> 00:00:37,380 I won't say how many decades ago, but 19 00:00:37,380 --> 00:00:38,280 many years ago. 20 00:00:39,060 --> 00:00:42,094 And then I worked on Capitol Hill for 21 00:00:42,094 --> 00:00:44,274 about a decade. So I spent most 22 00:00:44,814 --> 00:00:46,994 of that decade working for, 23 00:00:47,375 --> 00:00:48,994 former congressman John Boehner 24 00:00:49,614 --> 00:00:51,875 and worked for him in the majority leader's 25 00:00:51,934 --> 00:00:53,695 office and in his his role in the 26 00:00:53,695 --> 00:00:54,674 leadership generally 27 00:00:55,380 --> 00:00:58,020 as minority leader, and then I I ended 28 00:00:58,020 --> 00:00:59,940 my role with him in the speaker's office. 29 00:00:59,940 --> 00:01:02,659 So I left The Hill, about twelve years 30 00:01:02,659 --> 00:01:04,420 ago, and then I went to work at 31 00:01:04,420 --> 00:01:05,799 a small boutique lobbying 32 00:01:06,420 --> 00:01:07,400 firm in Downtown 33 00:01:07,780 --> 00:01:10,555 DC where many of our clients were all 34 00:01:10,555 --> 00:01:12,555 in the health care sector, so anything from 35 00:01:12,555 --> 00:01:14,894 insurance to hospitals to medical device. 36 00:01:15,194 --> 00:01:17,275 And then one of those clients that we 37 00:01:17,275 --> 00:01:19,295 had was, Sidecar Health. 38 00:01:19,674 --> 00:01:22,334 And I was very intrigued at the outset 39 00:01:22,709 --> 00:01:24,870 about what Sitecore Health has to offer. It 40 00:01:24,870 --> 00:01:27,609 was truly the only thing I had seen 41 00:01:27,670 --> 00:01:29,370 in my career that 42 00:01:29,909 --> 00:01:30,969 actually creates 43 00:01:31,349 --> 00:01:34,409 a market incentive for consumers to be engaged 44 00:01:34,469 --> 00:01:36,489 in probably the most meaningful way, 45 00:01:36,825 --> 00:01:39,224 that they've ever been engaged in health care. 46 00:01:39,224 --> 00:01:39,724 And 47 00:01:40,185 --> 00:01:41,944 that was that was really exciting for me, 48 00:01:41,944 --> 00:01:44,284 having been on Capitol Hill during 49 00:01:44,825 --> 00:01:47,004 the Medicare part d program consideration, 50 00:01:47,305 --> 00:01:48,204 during the 51 00:01:48,584 --> 00:01:51,879 Affordable Care Act consideration and multiple other pieces 52 00:01:51,879 --> 00:01:53,799 of of big legislation that I'm sure we're 53 00:01:53,799 --> 00:01:55,879 all familiar with. But this was really something 54 00:01:55,879 --> 00:01:56,379 that 55 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,759 I thought was the most interesting in terms 56 00:01:58,759 --> 00:01:59,659 of not requiring 57 00:02:00,119 --> 00:02:01,180 any sort of government 58 00:02:01,935 --> 00:02:03,854 subsidy or tax credit or some of the 59 00:02:03,854 --> 00:02:04,254 more, 60 00:02:04,814 --> 00:02:06,034 some of the more obvious 61 00:02:06,655 --> 00:02:08,574 carrots and sticks that we see in other 62 00:02:08,574 --> 00:02:09,074 legislation. 63 00:02:10,175 --> 00:02:12,334 Fantastic. So you've got a long career in 64 00:02:12,334 --> 00:02:14,735 in politics and in DC, Emily, and that's 65 00:02:14,735 --> 00:02:16,094 why we wanted to come to you to 66 00:02:16,094 --> 00:02:17,550 ask specifically about 67 00:02:17,870 --> 00:02:21,069 president Trump signing a new executive order in 68 00:02:21,069 --> 00:02:24,050 February aimed at cracking down on price transparency 69 00:02:24,189 --> 00:02:27,389 requirements for hospitals and insurers. And that, of 70 00:02:27,389 --> 00:02:30,110 course, follows his original executive order on health 71 00:02:30,110 --> 00:02:32,610 care price transparency back in 2019. 72 00:02:33,069 --> 00:02:35,384 So I think the natural question there is, 73 00:02:35,604 --> 00:02:37,864 what is the difference? What changes 74 00:02:38,164 --> 00:02:41,204 do insurers need to know about this new 75 00:02:41,204 --> 00:02:41,704 EO? 76 00:02:42,245 --> 00:02:43,704 What's what does it do differently? 77 00:02:44,485 --> 00:02:47,284 So as you as you articulated, Jacob, in 78 00:02:47,284 --> 00:02:50,030 the previous executive order, health plans and hospitals 79 00:02:50,030 --> 00:02:51,870 obviously were both swept up in that, but 80 00:02:51,870 --> 00:02:53,730 health plans were instructed to 81 00:02:54,270 --> 00:02:57,469 post their negotiated rates with providers and their 82 00:02:57,469 --> 00:02:58,210 out of network 83 00:02:58,510 --> 00:03:00,990 payments to providers and then the actual prices 84 00:03:00,990 --> 00:03:03,010 that they paid for prescription drugs. 85 00:03:03,414 --> 00:03:05,354 And then they had to maintain an online 86 00:03:05,974 --> 00:03:07,435 tool in order to permit 87 00:03:08,134 --> 00:03:11,834 customers to access that particular pricing information. 88 00:03:12,534 --> 00:03:13,995 This executive order, 89 00:03:14,534 --> 00:03:17,030 which we're very supportive of, obviously, at Sidecar 90 00:03:17,030 --> 00:03:19,030 Health because we we are a major medical 91 00:03:19,030 --> 00:03:20,569 product based on price transparency 92 00:03:21,030 --> 00:03:24,310 and giving consumer information. But this executive order 93 00:03:24,310 --> 00:03:24,810 requires 94 00:03:25,510 --> 00:03:25,909 the, 95 00:03:26,629 --> 00:03:28,490 requires the plans and hospitals 96 00:03:28,790 --> 00:03:31,050 to put up actual pricing. So 97 00:03:31,405 --> 00:03:33,084 previously, I think we've seen a lot of 98 00:03:33,084 --> 00:03:33,584 estimates. 99 00:03:33,965 --> 00:03:36,705 And so now there is a requirement that 100 00:03:36,924 --> 00:03:37,824 actual prices 101 00:03:38,364 --> 00:03:39,424 must be disclosed, 102 00:03:40,205 --> 00:03:43,164 and it requires that the department determine what 103 00:03:43,164 --> 00:03:44,705 kinds of enforcement policies 104 00:03:45,245 --> 00:03:46,384 they want to implement 105 00:03:46,770 --> 00:03:49,669 to ensure that the providers are compliant. 106 00:03:50,209 --> 00:03:52,209 So it will mean that not only will 107 00:03:52,209 --> 00:03:54,129 health care entities have to determine how they 108 00:03:54,129 --> 00:03:55,430 disclose a price in 109 00:03:56,530 --> 00:03:57,430 Toledo, Ohio 110 00:03:57,729 --> 00:03:58,229 or 111 00:03:58,849 --> 00:04:01,534 Jacksonville, Florida, but but that becomes, I think, 112 00:04:01,534 --> 00:04:03,694 a very meaningful and and different way that 113 00:04:03,775 --> 00:04:04,594 for the consumer 114 00:04:05,294 --> 00:04:07,134 and the plans to figure out how to 115 00:04:07,134 --> 00:04:09,775 share that pricing so that it's constructive and 116 00:04:09,775 --> 00:04:10,514 and useful. 117 00:04:11,534 --> 00:04:13,794 Absolutely. So more concrete information, 118 00:04:14,174 --> 00:04:17,629 actual prices, not estimates being required from insurers 119 00:04:17,629 --> 00:04:18,529 across the country. 120 00:04:19,629 --> 00:04:21,789 And so you mentioned insurers have been required 121 00:04:21,789 --> 00:04:23,969 to disclose a lot of this pricing information 122 00:04:24,269 --> 00:04:26,029 starting in 2022. 123 00:04:26,029 --> 00:04:27,969 It staggered from there over the years. 124 00:04:28,865 --> 00:04:31,745 So what's compliance been like, from your perspective, 125 00:04:31,745 --> 00:04:34,004 Emily, up until now across the industry? 126 00:04:34,545 --> 00:04:37,444 Are are insurers actually following these rules? 127 00:04:38,545 --> 00:04:40,725 So first, I'll say that, just 128 00:04:41,670 --> 00:04:43,189 go on with your question here in a 129 00:04:43,189 --> 00:04:44,709 second. But first, I I will say I 130 00:04:44,709 --> 00:04:45,449 do think 131 00:04:45,910 --> 00:04:48,949 that insurers are supportive of transparency. I think 132 00:04:48,949 --> 00:04:51,050 the crux of the issue has always been 133 00:04:51,269 --> 00:04:51,769 applicability 134 00:04:53,110 --> 00:04:56,055 and making sure that it's applicable in a 135 00:04:56,055 --> 00:04:58,535 uniform way and having the kind of data 136 00:04:58,535 --> 00:04:59,035 that 137 00:04:59,415 --> 00:05:01,275 that is displayed in a consistent 138 00:05:01,654 --> 00:05:04,134 consumer friendly format. I think that's where it 139 00:05:04,134 --> 00:05:05,654 can be a real game changer for the 140 00:05:05,654 --> 00:05:08,610 consumer, and we see this every day in 141 00:05:08,610 --> 00:05:11,189 what we do at Sycor Health. I think 142 00:05:11,410 --> 00:05:13,350 I think under these particular 143 00:05:14,050 --> 00:05:16,050 executive orders so first of all, the hospitals 144 00:05:16,050 --> 00:05:18,949 were required to disclose that information prior to 145 00:05:19,329 --> 00:05:19,829 insurers 146 00:05:20,129 --> 00:05:22,129 being required to in 2022. 147 00:05:22,129 --> 00:05:24,814 So I think you've seen some some delay, 148 00:05:25,834 --> 00:05:26,574 in enforcement 149 00:05:27,115 --> 00:05:28,954 really because I think in part, it was 150 00:05:28,954 --> 00:05:30,574 tied up in courts for a while. 151 00:05:30,954 --> 00:05:32,794 And but I think we all share the 152 00:05:32,794 --> 00:05:35,354 goals, obviously, of giving consumers the information to 153 00:05:35,354 --> 00:05:38,080 make good choices, but there has been a 154 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,660 bit of a lag in the Biden administration. 155 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:42,720 But I think there's always going to be 156 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:43,620 different priorities 157 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,400 depending on who is in the White House 158 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:47,379 and what the directives 159 00:05:48,080 --> 00:05:50,475 are from the senior folks at those 160 00:05:50,875 --> 00:05:52,334 departments. And I think 161 00:05:52,634 --> 00:05:54,175 in this particular instance, 162 00:05:55,275 --> 00:05:57,214 you know, there's maybe not been 163 00:05:59,115 --> 00:06:01,935 some of the processing of pricing data 164 00:06:02,555 --> 00:06:04,574 that has been a priority 165 00:06:04,955 --> 00:06:06,095 when you think about 166 00:06:06,599 --> 00:06:09,979 all of the other issues that both hospitals 167 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:11,819 and insurers are trying 168 00:06:12,519 --> 00:06:14,759 to work on every single day that really 169 00:06:14,759 --> 00:06:17,659 has nothing to do with price transparency, but 170 00:06:17,719 --> 00:06:19,479 is trying to is trying to work on 171 00:06:19,479 --> 00:06:21,875 just other issues related to Medicare or Medicaid 172 00:06:22,335 --> 00:06:24,735 and and different payments. So but I I 173 00:06:24,735 --> 00:06:25,395 do think, 174 00:06:25,855 --> 00:06:26,355 overall, 175 00:06:27,295 --> 00:06:29,535 hospitals and insurers, like, we very much value 176 00:06:29,535 --> 00:06:31,295 our hospital partners. And when it comes to 177 00:06:31,295 --> 00:06:32,035 giving consumers 178 00:06:32,495 --> 00:06:33,555 pricing information, 179 00:06:34,175 --> 00:06:35,714 we share those goals, 180 00:06:36,540 --> 00:06:38,480 but we really just wanna make the experience 181 00:06:38,540 --> 00:06:40,860 for the consumer smooth. And I think that's 182 00:06:40,860 --> 00:06:41,360 where 183 00:06:41,740 --> 00:06:43,199 sharing actual data 184 00:06:43,580 --> 00:06:45,980 is really gonna be a game changer in 185 00:06:45,980 --> 00:06:47,660 terms of, let's call this, 186 00:06:48,324 --> 00:06:50,165 executive order two point o, in terms of 187 00:06:50,165 --> 00:06:53,125 how this second executive order really sort of 188 00:06:53,125 --> 00:06:53,625 forces 189 00:06:54,245 --> 00:06:56,645 that positive direction, I think, forward for the 190 00:06:56,645 --> 00:06:59,464 next generation of of pricing in health care. 191 00:07:00,004 --> 00:07:02,060 Absolutely. Absolutely. And you mentioned some of the 192 00:07:02,060 --> 00:07:05,019 challenges and delays we've seen in enforcement. And 193 00:07:05,019 --> 00:07:06,779 and just so our audience is aware for 194 00:07:06,779 --> 00:07:09,339 context, we know that 18 hospitals have been 195 00:07:09,339 --> 00:07:12,220 fined for for noncompliance with these rules since 196 00:07:12,220 --> 00:07:14,435 they first came out. No insurers have been 197 00:07:14,435 --> 00:07:16,675 by CMS. So so that's where things currently 198 00:07:16,675 --> 00:07:17,175 stand. 199 00:07:17,475 --> 00:07:19,314 But but, Emily, you mentioned that this all 200 00:07:19,314 --> 00:07:21,314 comes back down to making things easier in 201 00:07:21,314 --> 00:07:23,095 health care for the consumer. So 202 00:07:23,954 --> 00:07:26,274 where do things stand in terms of, third 203 00:07:26,274 --> 00:07:28,774 party companies and consumers' ability 204 00:07:29,209 --> 00:07:31,770 to to use this data, and to know 205 00:07:31,770 --> 00:07:34,270 what their health care costs will be before 206 00:07:34,330 --> 00:07:36,029 they they go to the doctor's office? 207 00:07:36,810 --> 00:07:39,129 Sure. So I think it's always good for 208 00:07:39,129 --> 00:07:42,089 consumers and or for hospitals and insurers to 209 00:07:42,089 --> 00:07:43,689 provide this data, as you say, in a 210 00:07:43,689 --> 00:07:46,725 more actionable way. I think that helps move 211 00:07:46,725 --> 00:07:49,064 the ball forward and creates a more educated 212 00:07:49,125 --> 00:07:51,465 health care population. And this really is 213 00:07:52,085 --> 00:07:54,725 the next generation of evaluating what those next 214 00:07:54,725 --> 00:07:56,665 steps are. And in any sort of 215 00:07:56,965 --> 00:07:57,865 public policy, 216 00:07:59,250 --> 00:08:01,810 any sort of public policy development, there's always 217 00:08:01,810 --> 00:08:04,069 going to be room for progress. 218 00:08:04,529 --> 00:08:06,149 And I think this exercise 219 00:08:06,850 --> 00:08:07,990 from the Trump administration 220 00:08:08,529 --> 00:08:09,029 is 221 00:08:09,569 --> 00:08:11,910 a smart exercise in terms of 222 00:08:12,485 --> 00:08:15,384 how to make that public policy more effective 223 00:08:15,925 --> 00:08:17,764 for the consumer. I think we wanna make 224 00:08:17,764 --> 00:08:19,064 sure providers obviously, 225 00:08:20,324 --> 00:08:22,024 are providing that information 226 00:08:22,404 --> 00:08:25,125 in a way that is digestible. Consumers are 227 00:08:25,125 --> 00:08:28,000 savvy, and that's something that I've learned a 228 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:30,399 lot about at SacroHealth, but they like having 229 00:08:30,399 --> 00:08:33,360 additional information to the extent that they're able 230 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,679 and being able to share that information in 231 00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:36,820 a way that is 232 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:38,659 is digestible. 233 00:08:39,665 --> 00:08:41,745 And like I said earlier, in a uniform 234 00:08:41,745 --> 00:08:42,245 manner, 235 00:08:42,545 --> 00:08:44,384 in a way that they're buying anything else 236 00:08:44,384 --> 00:08:47,745 throughout their daily lives, that's a real that's 237 00:08:47,745 --> 00:08:48,404 a real, 238 00:08:49,425 --> 00:08:51,745 step forward. And we wanna make sure, obviously, 239 00:08:51,745 --> 00:08:52,245 providers 240 00:08:52,709 --> 00:08:54,389 that they don't need to go through prior 241 00:08:54,389 --> 00:08:57,129 authorization and they don't have to pay, 242 00:08:57,589 --> 00:08:58,949 or that we don't have to pay with 243 00:08:58,949 --> 00:09:01,110 a middleman. There should be immediate payment, and 244 00:09:01,110 --> 00:09:02,870 there is a privilege for the customer to 245 00:09:02,870 --> 00:09:04,949 be able to choose what they want. And 246 00:09:04,949 --> 00:09:05,449 sharing 247 00:09:05,829 --> 00:09:06,329 pricing 248 00:09:06,709 --> 00:09:09,665 is part of the process or a step 249 00:09:09,884 --> 00:09:11,884 in giving them that privilege to be able 250 00:09:11,884 --> 00:09:14,125 to go wherever they wanna go. I do 251 00:09:14,125 --> 00:09:16,445 think sharing this kind of data also opens 252 00:09:16,445 --> 00:09:18,465 the door for other innovation 253 00:09:19,004 --> 00:09:21,264 in the healthcare sector, which we think innovation 254 00:09:21,485 --> 00:09:23,264 is is always a good thing. 255 00:09:23,690 --> 00:09:26,509 And it will probably result in more opportunities 256 00:09:26,809 --> 00:09:27,309 for, 257 00:09:27,929 --> 00:09:30,250 you know, think about the the Google Healths 258 00:09:30,250 --> 00:09:32,509 and the Amazons of the world to create 259 00:09:32,889 --> 00:09:36,649 other innovative models that help give consumers the 260 00:09:36,649 --> 00:09:38,190 tools they need to be 261 00:09:38,845 --> 00:09:42,144 smarter and better consumers. And whether it's through 262 00:09:42,605 --> 00:09:43,664 artificial intelligence 263 00:09:44,205 --> 00:09:44,705 or 264 00:09:45,325 --> 00:09:45,825 website 265 00:09:46,205 --> 00:09:47,825 tools or just other, 266 00:09:48,445 --> 00:09:50,625 more intuitive ways to get information, 267 00:09:51,320 --> 00:09:53,240 I think that that that is always gonna 268 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:54,620 be a positive step forward. 269 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:57,320 Absolutely. Yeah. It is very exciting to think 270 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,200 about what could come from this new executive 271 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:03,080 order within the private sector. Yeah. But, Emily, 272 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:04,954 before we go, I think would you educate 273 00:10:04,954 --> 00:10:07,514 our audience on on the Sidecar Health model 274 00:10:07,514 --> 00:10:09,674 and how you all are using the price 275 00:10:09,674 --> 00:10:10,174 transparency 276 00:10:10,554 --> 00:10:11,454 data today? 277 00:10:12,074 --> 00:10:14,954 Sure thing. So Sidecar Health is a large 278 00:10:14,954 --> 00:10:17,695 group major medical insurance product. 279 00:10:18,100 --> 00:10:19,160 We give consumers 280 00:10:19,700 --> 00:10:22,419 pricing information so that they know what every 281 00:10:22,419 --> 00:10:24,440 single thing in the health care system 282 00:10:24,980 --> 00:10:27,220 can cost, and we give them that data 283 00:10:27,220 --> 00:10:29,460 on our website. And so they're able to 284 00:10:29,460 --> 00:10:29,960 compare, 285 00:10:30,274 --> 00:10:32,754 and we do this for all 170,000 286 00:10:32,754 --> 00:10:34,595 things you can do in the healthcare system, 287 00:10:34,595 --> 00:10:37,554 as well as for any FDA approved drug. 288 00:10:37,554 --> 00:10:39,414 So the consumers can compare 289 00:10:40,035 --> 00:10:42,514 and determine where they want to go because 290 00:10:42,514 --> 00:10:44,615 we don't have a lot of the more 291 00:10:45,069 --> 00:10:45,569 onerous 292 00:10:45,949 --> 00:10:49,089 or frustrating things that that more traditional insurers 293 00:10:49,149 --> 00:10:51,230 have. We don't have a network. We don't 294 00:10:51,230 --> 00:10:52,289 have prior authorization. 295 00:10:53,069 --> 00:10:55,709 We don't have set therapy or formularies. And 296 00:10:55,709 --> 00:10:57,069 again, we just don't have some of the 297 00:10:57,069 --> 00:10:58,129 more burdensome 298 00:10:58,835 --> 00:11:00,835 things. So we give the cons we give 299 00:11:00,835 --> 00:11:01,475 the consumer, 300 00:11:02,035 --> 00:11:03,795 a budget that they need to be able 301 00:11:03,795 --> 00:11:05,795 to shop, and then it's up to them. 302 00:11:05,795 --> 00:11:07,955 If they wanna go someplace that is over 303 00:11:07,955 --> 00:11:10,115 the budget that we're giving them, that's totally 304 00:11:10,115 --> 00:11:12,195 fine. That's their prerogative. But if they want 305 00:11:12,195 --> 00:11:15,440 to go someplace that that costs less, we're 306 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:18,000 gonna let them keep part of that savings. 307 00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:19,920 And so it really is a game changer 308 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:22,320 when you think about the consumer having more 309 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:23,379 skin in the game 310 00:11:23,759 --> 00:11:25,759 and and being able to consume health care, 311 00:11:25,759 --> 00:11:27,440 like I said earlier, in a meaningful way, 312 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,105 in a way they consume everything else in 313 00:11:29,105 --> 00:11:31,345 their lives. But we're really excited about what 314 00:11:31,345 --> 00:11:33,985 we've seen from consumers so far. Like I 315 00:11:33,985 --> 00:11:36,304 said, consumers are really smart and they like 316 00:11:36,304 --> 00:11:38,625 having the data. And we're seeing about 90% 317 00:11:38,625 --> 00:11:40,404 of our claims come back where consumers 318 00:11:41,889 --> 00:11:44,850 are getting their services either at the budget 319 00:11:44,850 --> 00:11:47,889 that we give them or slightly above with 320 00:11:47,889 --> 00:11:50,049 maybe what we consider like a co pay 321 00:11:50,049 --> 00:11:51,990 amount, like $15 or $20 322 00:11:52,129 --> 00:11:53,970 but they're choosing also to go to sites 323 00:11:53,970 --> 00:11:56,149 of care that are less costly and 324 00:11:56,544 --> 00:11:58,705 are finding a lot of success also at 325 00:11:58,705 --> 00:12:00,705 the pharmacy and saving a lot of money 326 00:12:00,705 --> 00:12:01,684 and being able 327 00:12:02,304 --> 00:12:05,024 to, you know, kind of almost compete a 328 00:12:05,024 --> 00:12:06,785 little bit sometimes with their coworkers. I know 329 00:12:06,785 --> 00:12:08,625 we certainly do that inside the company in 330 00:12:08,625 --> 00:12:11,044 terms of where we found good prices. And 331 00:12:11,129 --> 00:12:13,470 it really is an eye opening and exciting 332 00:12:13,690 --> 00:12:16,250 experience for both just us, but also the 333 00:12:16,250 --> 00:12:18,410 consumer. And we love hearing love hearing all 334 00:12:18,410 --> 00:12:18,990 the feedback. 335 00:12:19,529 --> 00:12:21,529 Well, appreciate that overview, Emily, and it'll be 336 00:12:21,529 --> 00:12:24,090 fascinating to watch as a sidecar continues to 337 00:12:24,090 --> 00:12:25,789 disrupt across the industry. 338 00:12:26,825 --> 00:12:28,264 Before we go, we've got a lot of 339 00:12:28,264 --> 00:12:31,384 health plan leaders listening in. Any final thoughts 340 00:12:31,384 --> 00:12:34,024 or final bits of advice you wanna offer 341 00:12:34,024 --> 00:12:36,745 them in terms of, this this new executive 342 00:12:36,745 --> 00:12:38,684 order and what that means for price transparency 343 00:12:39,225 --> 00:12:39,965 moving forward? 344 00:12:40,799 --> 00:12:43,120 Well, I think there's I do think sometimes 345 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:45,379 there's an impression that perhaps 346 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:47,779 there's, I think, a lot of opposition 347 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:51,540 to price transparency depending on what industry. And 348 00:12:51,759 --> 00:12:53,985 and I think I'd like to maybe just 349 00:12:53,985 --> 00:12:55,664 share. I don't think that's true. I think 350 00:12:55,664 --> 00:12:57,924 there is a lot of support for transparency. 351 00:12:58,304 --> 00:12:59,205 I think that 352 00:12:59,585 --> 00:13:01,044 there is a lot of 353 00:13:01,424 --> 00:13:03,024 there are a lot of federal and state 354 00:13:03,024 --> 00:13:05,664 programs that both hospitals and insurers are trying 355 00:13:05,664 --> 00:13:07,620 to comply with. And so there's a little 356 00:13:07,620 --> 00:13:09,960 bit of a a push pull between 357 00:13:10,340 --> 00:13:12,340 between where some of the attention can be 358 00:13:12,340 --> 00:13:14,040 focused. But I do think that 359 00:13:14,420 --> 00:13:17,139 insurers and, like I said earlier, our hospital 360 00:13:17,139 --> 00:13:17,639 partners, 361 00:13:18,019 --> 00:13:19,799 they're supportive of giving the consumers 362 00:13:20,495 --> 00:13:21,235 more information 363 00:13:21,934 --> 00:13:22,654 and more, 364 00:13:23,774 --> 00:13:27,054 more information that'll make them better consumers because 365 00:13:27,054 --> 00:13:29,054 we want the consumer to have a smooth 366 00:13:29,054 --> 00:13:31,534 experience. And so I think we do all 367 00:13:31,534 --> 00:13:32,434 truly have, 368 00:13:32,896 --> 00:13:34,945 you know, shared goals in that area. This 369 00:13:34,945 --> 00:13:37,251 probably I'm maybe giving you more of a 370 00:13:37,251 --> 00:13:39,300 a kumbaya answer than you wanted, but but 371 00:13:39,300 --> 00:13:41,350 I do think sometimes in the field, there's 372 00:13:41,350 --> 00:13:43,655 a little bit of a, the sense that 373 00:13:43,655 --> 00:13:45,705 there's consternation. And I think in this case, 374 00:13:46,105 --> 00:13:48,345 there isn't. I think because the prices have 375 00:13:48,345 --> 00:13:51,485 been somewhat hidden for quite some time that 376 00:13:51,705 --> 00:13:52,205 it's 377 00:13:52,585 --> 00:13:55,065 a different administrative role to make some of 378 00:13:55,065 --> 00:13:57,865 that pricing more public, but we're really excited 379 00:13:57,865 --> 00:13:59,785 to have allies in that effort. And we're 380 00:13:59,785 --> 00:14:00,524 very grateful 381 00:14:01,009 --> 00:14:03,089 to have all the providers that that we 382 00:14:03,089 --> 00:14:05,330 have that that do take Sitecore Health customers 383 00:14:05,330 --> 00:14:07,429 because we wanna make that experience really 384 00:14:07,809 --> 00:14:10,230 enlightening and smooth for the consumer. 385 00:14:11,009 --> 00:14:13,409 Fantastic. Well, Emily, thank you so much for 386 00:14:13,409 --> 00:14:14,850 taking the time to sit down with us 387 00:14:14,850 --> 00:14:16,955 and for sharing your insights with our listeners. 388 00:14:16,955 --> 00:14:19,375 We really appreciate it. Thank you so much. 389 00:14:19,675 --> 00:14:21,115 And if you'd like to listen to more 390 00:14:21,115 --> 00:14:25,215 podcasts from Becker's Healthcare, you can visit beckershospitalreview.com.