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- This is Gracelyn Keller
with the Becker's Healthcare Podcast,
and we are live at the business and operations of a SC
and the Future of Dentistry Roundtable.
I'm joined right now by Harold Gobain, who is the head
of business development for Apex Reimbursement Specialists
and Genesis Dental Partners.
So, Harold, thanks so much for joining me this morning.
Um, and I would love to have us start off
by you introducing yourself
and telling us a little bit more about your background.
- I appreciate it, grace. Thanks so much for having me.
Um, you know, my journey goes,
goes back about 30 years in healthcare.
Um, I was on the dark side.
I worked for the insurance carriers,
uh, for many, many years.
About 25 years in total.
And, uh, so I understand that world really, really well.
Um, and then we kind of got into the world
of Apex reimbursement Specialist, uh, by accident.
Uh, I had a, I have a partner now whose cousin's,
a periodontist down in Miami, who called him one day
and said, Hey, I, I'm unhappy with the fees
that, that I'm being paid.
Can you help with that? And, um, he said, well,
you can either, you can complain or do something about it.
So he decided to do something about it,
and he knew that, uh, my partner, well at the time,
didn't know anything about dentistry, uh,
but he knew that I, I knew a lot about dental
and, um, we put our heads together, made some calls,
got him some nice increases for his,
his periodontist cousin down in, in Miami.
We said, maybe we have a business. So Apex was
born at that point.
That was back in 2012.
Um, since then, we've grown from fee negotiations
to credentialing management, to full dental billing,
insurance verification, really,
and also clinical due diligence on the acquisition side.
So anything that really from a back office payer relations,
uh, revenue cycle perspective, uh, apex can, can manage
and do, um, we do it well.
We've worked with about 4,500 practices across the country.
Um, and then over that period of time, based on having a,
a number of DSO clients
and dentists as clients were like, Hey,
maybe we could think about potentially, uh,
running our own practices as well.
And that's when Genesis Dental Partners was born.
That was back in 2019.
Um, today we've got, we've been managing one office
to kinda get our feet wet, get our experience, uh,
but we're should be closing on our second practice, uh,
shortly, probably within the next couple weeks.
And, um, that's how Genesis Dental Partners wanted
to utilizing that knowledge that we've gained over the years
of the Apex and apply it to practice ownership.
Um, so that's, uh, that's my background a little bit
and, um, little history. Yeah.
- Well, congratulations on that second practice.
Very exciting. Um,
and I'd love to start our conversation with
what the biggest issues you are
currently following in dental.
- Yeah, so I think really it, it, it applies
to, to both sides.
We're in the apex world
and the Genes dental partners world is really labor today.
Um, it's not hard to find a practice to operate.
Um, and for us in the Apex side, it's not hard
to find practices to help on the revenue side.
Um, but what we constantly hear within the world
of our clients at Apex and also our own practices is labor.
Um, hygienists cost have gone up probably 20,
30% in the last 12 months, which is really impacting, um,
the financial health of the practice.
Um, and also just finding dentists
to work in the practice has been a challenge.
Uh, and you add that that labor challenge
and labor cost increasing to the reimbursements
with the insurance companies really being flat or stagnant.
You know, at Apex, we, we, we,
we've got a nice little track history
of making some improvements there,
but still the labor costs are far outpacing
what the reimbursement levels are at insurance companies.
So you've got this labor
and financial stress right now that's, that's facing, um,
that's a big challenge in dental today.
- And I kind of have a, a two-prong question
for our next one.
So first, what are you most excited
about in the dental space?
And then second, what makes you most nervous?
- Good question. Uh, excellent question.
What are some like, excited about opportunities?
I think that it, what, what, right now, the buzzword,
I don't wanna just jump on anybody in the bandwagon,
but, um, AI capabilities within the world of dental,
I don't, I don't see AI replacing people, um, as far
as the late, the clinicians, uh,
and the clinical aspect of the business.
Um, but there's plenty of, of, of administrative
responsibilities and ways to communicate
with patients more effectively
and more timely that I think AI is,
is right now poised to help with that.
Uh, we see a lot of different platforms.
We review a lot of platforms in that space,
and, um, there's no one perfect platform yet.
But, um, as that constantly develop, develops,
it's gonna make practices more effective.
I think they'll be able to see more patients, uh, by doing
that and also, uh, create probably even a happier workforce
by enabling tools for them.
So AI, I think is, is really exciting today.
Um, I think that the, the concerns right now I think is,
is, is still, there's a, we're still in an,
an inflationary environment, um,
and with that inflationary environment
and the stagnant reimbursements
and what, what dentist prac dental practices are able
to charge, it's not a apples to apples environment.
It's really you as a business owner,
you really have to juggle.
Um, that's a fine balance between rising cost, uh,
and stagnant cost
or reimbursements at the insurance payer level.
So you have to get creative on
where your patients come from, uh,
what your sources of revenue are.
Um, so right now that's still a little bit of a concern.
Again, cost labor still just right now is still a
lingering aspect of it.
Um, I think that we need more dentists coming outta dental
school also and more dental schools being created, um,
because our population is growing tremendously and,
and there's a lot of people to serve.
Um, and I, I think a concern, additional concern could be,
are there enough, um, dentists coming outta school
to service that, and Hyn
and the hygienist programs also,
they need more schools for that.
And I think that's also contributing to the high labor cost,
uh, with hygienists when you have a very, I think,
constricted labor force, obviously that
increases increases rates.
So those, those factors are one that's exciting,
but also one that we just have to, um, have to,
it is a little troubling and concerning right now.
Um, but hopefully it'll get better in time.
- Absolutely. And my final question for you today here is
what will the most effective healthcare leaders need
to be successful in the next two to three years?
- A leader today, we'll say, you know,
in our world we're talking about the really the dentist,
at the end of the day, the dentist is
that leader in that practice.
Um, you could have some admin help, you could have, um,
you know, c-level folks in the background helping run the
business, but at the end of the day, the dentist is the one
that everybody in that practice is
looking to as their leader.
And so I think a, a dentist
or a leader in our field, in the world of dentistry has
to be much more well-rounded in
not just being a great clinician,
but understanding, um, the practice
and understanding the human component.
That hr, they're almost like an HR specialist.
They have to be a finance specialist, they have
to be a business specialist, they have
to be an HR specialist, um,
and one that can communicate really well with the staff
and also be able to communicate well with the patients.
It's really, I would say it starts,
leadership starts at the top
and in, in the practice dental practice, the business
that we're in, it starts with that dentist.
So I think they need to be a little bit more, well,
ra well-rounded in the, um, business side of, of dentistry.
Um, that I think if you went back, you know, th 20,
30 years, that wasn't always the case.
Dentists just wanted to practice.
It's our job as, as folks that are helping manage practice
and helping support them to help them be,
continue to be a great clinician.
But I think there's a benefit, um, if they're able to
be more well-rounded in the business of dentistry,
not just clinical dentistry.
And that'll, that'll help them.
- Absolutely. Well, thank you so much
for joining me today on the Becker's Healthcare Podcast.
Again, we're live at the business
and operations of ASCs in the future
of Dentistry Roundtable. Thanks so much.
- Thank you for having me. - It's so important
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