Happen to have your aboard here for the
really big barbecue show.
We cook because we have to and we
grill because we want to.
Hit me. Fine. How as wrong.
You have a great show big can.
But going. So what what what seems to
be the problem You know, this man looks
like dead and he's in the in the
crackle.
Succulent finished what?
For wheeler.
So is Liberty chicken beef.
Now shipping like dog, shit pink seeds.
We have all been working on it right
now.
And just like that, we are into the
second hour. It is the Barbecue Central show.
Where we cover the most important items of
the barbecue and grilling world,
happening every Tuesday night live, 9 to 11,
Recording audibly for podcast,
released Wednesday, first hour, Thursday, Second hour.
Video, auto archiving as soon as we stop
the feet. So if you're just rolling across
the second hour right now. Where were you
in the first hour? But again, recorded. So
no worse. Get it tomorrow.
The show originating from... I'm city
Usa
Cleveland. Still they come on the show tonight,
James Howe from Winners products.
We say good evening to those of you
watching tonight through 1 of our video streaming
platform.
You can go to facebook dot com
or twitter dot com slash bbq central show.
You can also watch show over on Youtube.
Which is Youtube dot com slash at bbq
b central show. We're asking everybody this Youtube
poll question of the week, including All guests
this evening,
Did you watch either of the hotdog dog
eating contest on July fourth? It is claw
back, but still 88 percent of you are
saying no.
You did not watch any of the hotdog
dog eating contest.
And that's a shame. I said I wouldn't
watch it under protest because jaws was not
in Brooklyn.
In half the amount of time, Joey Chestnut
ate only 1 shy of what took the
10 minute event.
At Nathan famous, Pat Bert, eating 58 hot
dogs and buns, Joey Chestnut eating 57,
hot dogs and bun. But Pat did it
in 10 minutes and Joey did it in
5 minutes.
So we know
world record breaking pace,
and it didn't happen because pet
somehow rear its head in something called major
league eating,
which is a shame.
Coming up on the best moments of the
barbecue Central show in 10 minutes or less
this coming Friday, episode 341,
taking you back to July ninth of 20
13, and this week we feature, the first
Tuesday of the month regular guest in the
second hour saying the cooking guy,
John, who puts these shows together from
Michigan,
not typically
into doing many best moments shows.
That revolve around the monthly recurring guests for
fear of overload
for you, the listener. I don't know if
I necessarily agree with that up or not.
Nevertheless,
the subject we head on back in 20
13 was former
food network
icon. Paula Dean. Anybody remember her,
You might recall back then. Paula had some
issues,
with P r stemming from an account from
a former employee that she had made some
racial comments. Also, there was an issue of
her
keeping back some information about her health.
Most pointed
having diabetes
while creating recipes that certainly
didn't shy away from certain unhealthy ingredients,
probably causing diabetes
over a certain number of years if you
ate like that all the time. Snowball,
causing quite a bit of media back then,
and saying the cooking guy shared his thoughts
on both topics.
And if he felt that Paula was being
sincere in her words,
or if she was just doing it to
try and keep the sponsorship money
that she was getting. Great segment from back
of the day. So that's what you'll will
be hearing this coming Friday, don't forget you
can subscribe to the podcast feed, which you
need to be subscribed too to hear the
best moment show. If you like it. The
bbq b q central show dot com slash
subscribe is the way you wanna do that.
And you can see all the options
to subscribe and the platforms. And so on,
you can use... Even subscribe through email if
you don't wanna use a podcast platform. Don't
forget if you wanna hear a guest or
segment again, that's been loss in the archive,
email John,
and let them know what you would like
to hear that is J0N
john J0N at the Bbq b central show
dot com,
and he'll do his best to meet your
needs.
Look at crashes in the chat.
It's got an email from crash,
He's in Hawaii. So is Lance.
Crash, are you in Kona?
I can make an introduction between you and
Lance?
I feel like it could be instant man
love just like that, but I don't know
exactly where in Hawaii you are. And I'll
reply back to your email that I got
a little bit earlier today as well. So
thank you for doing that. As famous Days,
All star Barbecue series was, and off again
this past weekend.
We knew that.
No winners to tell you about for the
second week in row
However, what do we know?
When play resumes, which I'll tell you about
here in a second.
The grand champion in reserve grand champion in
for the location events, we'll earn spots into
the 20 24 World Food championship in the
barbecue
division
in So we'll see who's next in line
to qualify and the next famous the Dave's
All star Barbecue series event
is this coming Saturday,
July thirteenth and hermit Tennessee.
The event is full,
so don't try and register for it.
The El paso, Texas,
Event on August third, and the Columbia Maryland
event, August 20 fourth, still still showing as
having 1 spot left open. So if you
are interested in taking part in the famous
Dave's, All star Barbecue Series events,
El paso, Texas, which is the... Second trip
through El Paso on August third still has
1 spot
and Columbia, Maryland, which is the last event
for the series.
It all culminate at the end of August.
There is 1 open event or 1 open
spot there as well. I believe the deposit
is a hundred bucks to hold your spot.
So you can find out all the past
results and the remaining schedule of future events
by visiting
world food championships dot com's. Slash all stars
and remember
the world food championships
will take place in Indianapolis, Indiana in November,
so we look forward to that.
Before we get to James,
I am asking
you you know what? I'm not even gonna
ask. We'll save it for another day.
I do wanna thank
show
fan, podcast listener mostly.
Raj Sc.
Or
giving me this book.
This is the ladies,
ladies
home
Journal Cookbook.
Let me get a date on this.
Ladies Home Journal Cookbook.
Double play and company, a Carol is it
tracks T.
Here we go.
Wow. No way.
This book coming out.
19
63.
11 years before I was debuted into the
world.
So quite a
timely peace.
He stopped over today to give this to
me for my,
impending birthday, which is tomorrow,
Oh, as we turn 50 years old tomorrow,
if you can believe it.
So, Rod, thank you for the book. We're
gonna be comb through that through the rest
of the weekend on the weekend and start
ear marking,
recipes that we would like to try from
back in the sixties and see how we
might bring them into current day with different
types of ingredients or different cooking styles because
I'm sure there wasn't a lot of options
back then. I'm just making an assumption.
But 50 years old.
We are now officially tomorrow or 12:01.
As the day turns Tuesday into Wednesdays. We
are officially at E0D
watch. You know what I mean?
Not gonna get into that.
So,
I wanna thank Rob for that. Also I
wanna thank
embedded correspondence
doug shining from Texas
and Rusty Mon from the Great City of
Utah,
and Matt Os from Tennessee for the birthday
gifting of cigars, which I certainly appreciate. Well,
mister Jay was consult it as well because
I said, as I'm going through these cigars.
I'm not... Like, Doug was in the cigars
at 1 point. I don't think the other
guys know anything about cigars. Both certainly not
to this level, and I'm looking at these
going wow.
These are some elite levels cigars that I
can believe,
Doug Rusty or Matt have any clue about.
And the low and behold,
Doug tells me, yeah. You know, we consult
to mister Jay, and he's the 1 that
kinda hooked it up and made the final
call at the end, but it was a
lot of
communication back and forth between them. So as
a
semi recurring guest to mister Jay, and then,
of course, the embedded correspondence
working together to get me such a great
gift. I say thank you very much.
By the way, we thank, our pal and
first Tuesday of the month regular guest 14
past the first hour.
Malcolm Reed from killer hogs and how to
barbecue write for outfit fitting your humble host
here with the take pride in your q
t shirt,
with the American flag pig.
Believe it or not.
This symbol,
is what a lot of countries think about
it. American pig.
Right? Of course.
That's alright.
Hey, James Howe is ready to go o,
and the grain room will get to him
here in just 1 second.
Before we do that, our friends at o
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And Franklin Pits can be found in Barbecue
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If you of the listener
Arnold odor of such a store and you
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fill out the dealer for. Odor If you
the listener of the show, Want to own
a Franklin pit and live in a part
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So you either have a store
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either.
Let's learn about how
manufacturers,
same and brands
find each other, fall and love and make
great product.
Let's do it Stick around I'll be right
back. You're listening to that Barbecue hughes Central
show.
Howard stern, Jim Rome, dan Patrick and Greg
Rem.
The mountain Rushmore more of talk show entertainment.
No. Let's get back to the Barbecue
Central show.
This portion of the show being brought to
you by
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Barbecue Central She'll sent you terrible news that
I just learned that coffee mug that I
used to pi all the time that no
longer avail oh, the heartache can paint. However,
great accessories nonetheless.
Let them know the Barbecue Central Show sent
you. My guest in the second hour made
his debut on the show to rave reviews
back in June where we talked about as
company, winners products.
And how they came to be the largest
barbecue and grilling manufacturer in the world. We
also talked a bit about the new grill
that Sam's club is selling, you know, the
1 with the thermostat
control that everyone wanted for decades.
Back on the show tonight. We have another
topic to tackle that I'm sure you will
enjoy. So we welcome back friend of the
show, James How.
James before we talk about
brands
and manufacturers
and matching these 2 together to to bring
products to market, we have a most important
Youtube poll question of the week that we're
asking everybody, which is this. Did you watch
either?
Of the hotdog dog eating
competitions on July fourth.
Unfortunately, I did not.
86
percent of the
Youtube voting public is with you, and me,
we did not watch either hot eating kat.
5 minutes.
How many hot dogs is a in his
prime James Howell pudding down.
Obviously, I think probably...
Maybe 2 or 3. That's about it.
That's about it. I'm with 3, 2 is
like, so, as I mentioned last week, 1
is the best. I mean, any kind of
hot dog ballpark,
worse than ballpark, the snap, but first 1
always great. And then I immediately need to
have the second 1 wasn't nearly as good
as the first 1. So what do I
do? I have the third 1, which was
tremendously bad. And it's nowhere near the second
1 and really far away from the first
1. And I said, I just should've have
stopped at 1. So 3 for me, at
no doubt about it and frees questionable.
I don't know if
you get them regularly,
but since we are now on the teeth
of grilling season.
Any feedback from a Sam's club, the members
mark Pro series Grill, and how they're pulling
through at location.
Yeah.
The units are doing well, and I think
customers are like the control some of them
admittedly or having
to learn a bit about how to use
the grill or learn the grill can be
used as an oven. Getting
but that's gonna happen. I think with any
new technology. But for the most part, I
think 1 of the great things about it
is that you can use the grill as
a normal grill. Right? And I I mentioned
that last time,
and it works great like that. And then
now people are kinda discovering how to use
the oven mode and different things to cook
with it. So
you know, up in Canada, we sold that
a version of that technology for,
already for 4 years.
And it took some time for people to
kinda of really understand the value of that
technology.
Did they
realize?
It was on there. In other words, were
they buying a grill because they needed a
new grill. They saw either the 4 burner
or the 5 burner, members market Sam's and
just bought it. Because they were their shopping.
And then all of a sudden, they're like,
oh, what's this dial in the middle of
all the normal looking dials? And then they
start to dive in a little bit and
see, Oh, I can make it enough? How
would I do that? Or do they buy
it knowing the technology and they just aren't
employing.
I think it's I think it's a little
bit different for Sam's versus Canadian Tire. I
think Canadian Tire you have
a regular assortment like you what you would
see it like a Lowe's or Home Depot
where you have multiple brands and different choices
for every price point.
So I think at Canadian Tire,
the feature of temperature control is much more
of a thing that you might choose to
purchase
because you have... Other choices at that price
point other brands.
I think at a channel like Sam's Club
where there are
more limited selection of product,
You know, I think you do have the
customer that's in there that just wants to
spend 500 dollars on the grill and he
buys it or her.
Goes home and then discover that they have
this feature. I think there are some other
people that have seen the feature, and
you know,
that's what made them decide to buy it.
So I'm an una
fan of the grill. I was a little
skeptical at first when we talk about building
for price point, and
private labels. Maybe there is
a
a subconscious
unconscious
stigma attached to
the term private label when you hear it
in certain instances. So I wasn't ready for
it to really rock my world, but I've
had it for a good couple months now.
And as I was telling,
Robert Moss, a little bit earlier in the
first hour I find myself
trying to figure out ways
to use it. I'm not looking... I don't
feel like I have to use it. Like,
it's, like a contract thing or pressure in
any way I'm trying to use it more
and more, and it's 50 50, whether I'm
using it as a traditional grill all the
way through. Or as an oven all the
way through, and then there's
the other half of the half of that
time where I'm starting it
let's say or reverse here. So I'm dialing
it all the way down in the oven
mode at 02:25.
Once I get to my target temperature, I
pull them off, and then I turn it
into regular grill mode.
And go as how as it again? Or
I use the infrared side burner and finish
it that way for a a really nice
sear on the steaks
It's just
in my heart, I feel like in 10
years,
this grill is still gonna be around. Like,
the 1 that's in my backyard right now,
it's still gonna be around.
Well, yeah. I mean, I think that was
the intention from the beginning. Right? I think
any new
application of technology on con of a traditional
product,
has the potential to be confusing to people.
So that's... What we what we wanted to
avoid was, of you know, people avoiding the
grill because they thought it was too complicated
and so forth. We...
Our our intention was much more
buy the grill because you need a girl
or you like the way it looks and
its features, and then you can, you know,
go on the process of discovery on how
to use it for a lot of and
things. Once you get to know how to
use it, the the temperature control. So so,
yeah, happy that you're that you're liking it
from And at a sub 700
price points. As I was saying you put
another badge on that from a brand standpoint,
you're probably easily. Into 1800 bucks or more,
for the same grill because there's a lot
of a great value
items that are in there, specifically the
real grace that we talked about the last
time, you know, I'd beginning to appreciate those
even more and more every time I use
it. So
big fan here. I mean, some people might
say, you know, well, what else you're gonna
say. I mean, I probably wouldn't be h
up nearly as much if I wasn't as
hyped up on the grill. Be a lot
more of a very business type,
tone for me.
But I'm a fan and I'm recommending it
out, no doubt about it. So,
the topic that I wanted to talk with
you about tonight because you're a guy that
can really shed a lot of light on
this. Probably nobody else has access to. And
this kind of a show setting is building
a
relationship
with a trusted brand. So here's James
you own the factory. You're making it. And
then here's
Greg.
Barbecue Central has a a brand of grill,
or I wanna I wanna make g,
but I don't have any manufacturing. So somehow,
I find James.
Let's start there. How do I find James?
If I have a great idea for a
grill, and I don't have the manufacturing behind
me. How do I find you?
Good question. I think our our our our
our customers have been more along, Like I
said, like you said, the brands and retailers.
So in the industry, people know, I think
they pretty much know how to find me.
But, you know, I think just if you
were to go online, you could you could
look it up. The challenge is,
you know, we get a lot of requests
from people to build product and grill,
the nature of our footprint doesn't lend itself
well to con small inventors or manufacturers.
And and not because not because they're not
important, but just, you know, we're more of
a large scale manufacturer. Now, if a brand
or manufacturer retailer did wanna con... Tech me,
how would they go about it? Well,
there's a lot of information
just available in the industry. So we'd be
able to validate each other and say, well,
who's who's asking and what type of product
do they sell and who do they sell
to? And then we'd begin the dialogue there?
So there's the opportunity where a brand
reaches out to winners, but
there's also another side of business, which would
be
making active calls manufacturer onto the brand. So
How do you identify
a brand to call on to see if
there might be a good relationship to start.
Well, to be honest, there know, the industry
is not that big, I think, you know,
in terms of
people doing,
did the different types of products, I think
everyone pretty much knows who everyone is with.
And mh, you know, to a certain extent,
you also know who is building what where.
I
so there's that kind of circle of information,
but certainly,
you know, people do reach out and you
do do,
new projects or tenders for business.
And so that also happens all the time.
And then it happens from retailers as well,
retailers typically work in
1 or 2 year cycles.
Where they'll be reviewing their line in private
labels and so forth. So you can choose
to participate in those
reviews as well,
when you first started was the manufacturer,
the brand by and large, so both components
together,
and if so, when did that start to
separate?
So you have just a brand, but they
didn't have manufacturing behind it?
I think I think the start of this
would have been, you know, early 2 thousands.
Right? So back before 2000,
most manufacturers and brands that they were 1
company. So back then, you would have had
sun beam,
you would have had,
you know, Char, obviously, Weber
you would had,
even coleman back then. Mh.
Cha. Charm glow.
Charm will, I think was gone by then.
But these were all manufacturers located in North
America.
And then I think in the early 2
thousands when you kinda had this.
Kinda outsourcing to to China.
Some brands,
kind of change their business model, to become
more product development marketing,
R and D and after sales, and then
they would outsource their manufacturing
to
they would do a hybrid of both, you
know, much like Weber, and I think Napoleon
would do today be a hybrid of that
approach.
And then you'd have other brands that have
come up purely from a R and D
marketing
design point of view
that into the manufacturing space.
You know, so that would be
you know, more people in the recent years,
I guess, in the industry,
you know, I think T is a good
example of that, you know, they don't have
any
manufacturing that that I'm aware of themselves.
So so again, it... It... It's changed over
the years.
Is that the same for, like, a a
master build I remember having John Mack
at 1 point. Mh And he was...
Very open almost bringing it up themselves saying,
you know, the biggest
benefit to us is we're coming up with
all these great ideas or things that we
wanna implement but then we're going offshore to
actually get it manufactured. It... To us... To
a point it almost sounded like, if he
had to keep it in country,
The company wouldn't have made. It was
almost a necessity for them to take everything
offshore from a manufacturing standpoint to remain competitive
and grow.
Yeah. A master built is a good example.
And you know, they...
They're close to the market. They had their
own, you know, call it approach to
smokers, electric smokers, that type of product.
And so they were able to give that
information to factories in China
And, you know, China
had the supply chain. They had the engineering.
They had the manufacturing capacity to deliver that
product to market at a reasonable cost.
And so that was I think the secret
of their success for sure.
When you are
aligning with a brand. You're coming up with
1 02:10 grill, whatever you're gonna do.
Is there also talking in the beginning about
how long the relationship is gonna last.
Is it assumed that it will go on
in perpetuity unless somebody screws somebody else how
does that work?
No. I don't think anything is assumed. I
think there's a lot of capacity everywhere. Right?
And
I think you have to you, you know,
as a manufacturer. I think you have to
do what it takes to try to maintain
in that relationship
because you know that there's
another 05:10 factories out there that would love
that business is well. Mh So it's in
your... It's in your interest to have a
good relationship to maintain quality to be
transparent
around...
Whether it's costing or quality challenges or how
you're building the product.
So for sure, it's
I don't think you really see long term
written supply agreements very often.
No names please,
but do
customers
of, I'm saying yours, but customers 2 manufacturers,
try and overs step a little bit and
and try and get better deals, by threatening
to take away business to go to another
manufacturer or is that
dirty pool?
No. I think it's I think it's part
of the business. You know, I think a
any procurement or sourcing person within these organizations
part of their job is to ensure that
they are getting the best value or deal
that they can.
And
sometimes that involves, you know, double checking outside,
you know, outside of your current relationships. Or
what's going on, not necessarily revealing anything proprietary.
But I think that's a healthy kind of
friction for both sides to keep both sides.
Both sides honest because sometimes the... Sometimes the
customer will go outside,
Or the... They have to go outside to
realize what a good value they're getting with
their current supply chain.
Right? So it works both ways.
So where does it matter
to the consumer?
For instance,
as I'd mentioned, I'm Barbecue Central show, grill
brand.
I decide
that partnering with
XYZ
manufacturing isn't working out for me.
James from winners comes in, blows my minds
and
makes a great pitch to take over manufacturing.
How can that move
affect the consumer that has bought a grill
for me prior to, you know, you guys
taking over manufacture.
I think
I think for brands, you know, so I'll
say 1 thing first. I think whether it's
cost or quality,
it all ends up in the... It all
ends up in the equation at some point.
Right? So if if the
manufacturer of the brand or the cusp... Has
been
unreasonable as it relates to expectations around cost
or
you know, things like that. You know, that
d typically manifest in the product somehow. Meaning,
you know, there's no magic formula there. If
if there's a
artificially low cost target,
then the product is not going to come
out well.
You know, by the same token, if the
manufacturer is a bit too hungry for business
and artificial quotes very low to get the
business.
There's obviously a risk that that manifests in
the product as well. And at the end
of the day, that all ends up in
the consumer's hands, and that's never a good
story.
The second order effect of course is if
you constantly change manufacturers, then access to replacement
parts or spare parts sometimes gets gets limited.
So in the case of private labels,
sometimes with retailers,
if they're constantly churning their vendor base,
to the customer even though the brand is
the same, you know, for example, a private
label at 1 of the big retailers.
If the fact... If you've gone through 3
or 4 manufacturers in the last 10 years.
I would say good luck trying to get
a replacement part for that specific grill or
even getting any help.
So that's that's been a challenge, I think
for last a lot of retailers worldwide.
Do you know of any brand saying, hey,
if you're gonna take over our manufacturing, we
also...
Want you to look at making a slew
of replacement parts
for the stuff authority in the market or
is that unreasonable?
But it it sometimes it it... It would
be a request.
A lot of brands if they manage it
properly.
They probably get an inventory of parts before
they leave their previous manufacturer. Oh, that'd be
the way to do it.
But short of that, you know, of course,
you could reverse engineer almost anything so if
that was part of the business then you
would do it.
How many grill brands out there right now
are not owners of their own manufacturer?
Did you say... I'm not looking for a
specific number, but, would you say the majority?
Of things that we see available for sale
or just the brand and they're not the
manufacturer as well.
Yeah. I would say the majority, but, you
know, that that is that
I, you know, I'd say that that... There's
a lot of nuance there because I think
some brands
just choose not to focus on factoring, put
a lot of investment in R and d,
quality standards, you know, customer support and marketing.
And that's just where they choose to to
to spend their resources, and I think that's
a that's a very good thing to do.
Other brands
would be more
just, I would say
putting labels on existing product that has been
ear, you know, at the manufacturing level,
and that would be more of a trading
model, I'd say,
If you're the brand
of the
the former, not the ladder that you were
just describing.
You're doing all this great work and
innovation and marketing and all this other stuff.
To me, you you're obviously missing,
the biggest component. It's the manufacturing and now
you're having to go out and try and...
Figure out or or navigate
the different manufacturers to see.
Are you trying to see who best of
lines.
Oh
That was supposed to be.
Are you
are you able to navigate to see, like,
which manufacturer best of aligns with you. How
do you... If you... If I'm the brand
and I'm doing all this work upfront. I
mean, I wanna have the manufacturer, that's also
gonna make it very seamless for me and
provide a great product. But if there is
a number of
manufacturers to choose from her how am I
making the right decision?
Good question. I think it comes down to,
obviously first. You know, who do you who
do you feel you can have a good
relationship with? Because
there will always be good and bad things
that come out of a project Right? And
how do you manage and navigate those good
and bad things?
1. I think second, you also have to
look at capabilities, of course. So does that
factor that you worked with, Do they have
the...
You know, do they have the manufacturing capabilities
that are specific to your product, You know,
a...
A commodity cooker,
you know, manufacturer is not necessarily gonna be
good at manufacturing
pellet grill or or a gas grill and
so forth. Right? So you'd have to look
at that.
And I think third, you'd look at also
things like who are their existing customers and
how
what kind of relationships does that factory have
with their existing customers. So
if if that factory has a has a
history of churning through different customers and, you
know, having a bunch of issues, well that
that might tell you something as well.
I wanna ask you a question, but I'm
gonna be
very vague and,
you know, not trying and put you on
any any weird spot on this.
Let's talk about manufacturers
and brands
running promotions,
you know, whatever that means.
As a consumer, if you are
signing up for promotion,
Is it in the end caveat
door?
You're taking the the risk at, you know,
let's say,
hypothetically,
there's a manufacturer or a brand says, you
know, buy this grill, and then for the
next so many years, you're gonna get some
grill in replaced. Whatever that means.
Are you buying it knowing, hey, I think
I'm just getting a good deal on 1?
And if I get 2
or 5,
or
they fulfill the whole thing that's just cream
on the coffee? Or as a consumer should
I believe that if I'm signing up for
this, they're gonna be able to support it
all the way through.
Well, I think you'd... Like, like any kind
of consumer proposition, you do have to look
at the brand. Right? And see the reputation
in the market? How long have they been
around?
Do you think they'll still be around for
the length of whatever contract it is?
I think that would apply to anybody not
just a fact. Sure. Right? Any brand promise
or or even warranty. Right? If you're getting
a 10 year warranty on something. Mh
again, this applies to sure
brands that applies to retailers as well. For
retailer in in our space, You know, if
you have a 10 year warranty on something,
the worst case that happens is you bring
the product back and you scream and they
could probably give you your money back. Right?
You know,
but for a brand,
you know, you have to ask yourself who
do you go to to scream in in
10 years. If there's, you know, to to
get that money back or to get your
promise fulfilled on that warranty or whatever it
is.
So I'd say I'd say it really depends
on the brand and their kind of
reputation and how long they've been around.
Where do you see the live market
over the next...
Well, I guess through the second half of
the year now that we're
into the teeth of July? You see anything
crazy coming up or do you see a
continued flatness because
from my end of it, it's kind of
shockingly quiet, but you're on a different side
of this.
Yeah. I think I think everybody,
and this would be around the world, not
just not just, you know, the Us. I
think everybody was hoping for
you know, a stronger bounce back from some
of the supply chain.
Challenges and kind of inventory challenges post Covid.
A lot of people bought
bought in this category during Covid. Mh. And
so and so I think they pulled forward
demand,
and everyone was hoping that they would have
burned through that demand already.
But I I think it hasn't quite happened.
There's there's certainly signs of life. Okay? In
certain pockets and segments.
I know that on the fuel side,
on the fuel side, things are strong,
which is good because it indicates people are
still grilling. Mh. And still using the products.
It's just more on the hardware side that
the replacement cycle hasn't really hit, So I
think people haven't haven't
burn through what they bought during Covid.
And
or people that were gonna buy now
maybe bought during Covid,
so,
we just haven't had the the bounce back
that the whole industry had hoped yet. So
I think it's both. I think you have
people that were gonna buy now bought 2
years ago and people
that maybe didn't think they were gonna be
buying 2 years ago decided to buy. 1,
2 or 3 coke. I think that's the
other portion of this.
When people were on the buy, they weren't
just buying 1. They were buying multiple,
well they never had multiple. Right? So now
you have 3 times the amount of cooker
to get through, and you're not using them
all at the same time, every single time
you're firing and up to cook.
You have longevity that you didn't plan for.
It's built in. So you you wanna... And
now, you know, money's tied and
world's gonna end and all this other stuff.
So you're not racing out to buy the
next luxury ticket item when you didn't give
a shit 2 years ago She just thought
you're never gonna be able to leave your
house again. So I think, you know, that
part of it is... Is... And then you
just have...
I mean, if you're buying something that's, let's
say, middle of the road or better.
I mean, they just last...
I'm sorry that it's gonna last 5 years.
So if you were a Ceo
banking on...
Whatever that
non
buy was, and you're like, you know what
this is going to be
how it's going to be going forward. You
should have been fired. I mean, nobody was.
But that was that was some really bad
game planning by what are supposed to be
really smart people, and I'm looking at it
going, throw all these years away. Like, you
can't even begin to
forecast office.
This is just
more This is what's happening in real time
and then completely discard it. Like, a pitcher
getting a home run head off you. Think
out... You gotta immediately forget about it.
And then when things start to flatten out,
then we can start going back to normal
forecasting. But it was crazy to me,
The smartest people in the industry were saying,
the way people are buying now is how
it's going to be caring for.
Unbelievable. Well, I think I think they have
different pressures, you know, that they have to
say that,
you know, on them, But I will say
that,
I think different segments are behaving differently as
well. Right? I think you're seeing continued growth
in grid. You know, obviously, it's it's it's...
It's coming off a smaller base, so, you
know, it it continues to grow as people
kinda discover that product.
And I think Blacks stones has done a
great job in kind of getting that message
out there. I think that the... As I
said, I think Pellets continue to be used,
you know, you see the sales on the...
Fuel side doing very well. So I think
that space is certainly here to stay if
not, you know, we'll continue to grow as
people, you know, use it and kind of
the Covid hangover, you know, finishes.
And I think the last part is, I
think gas grill
you know,
people are looking for more innovation and new
stories, including retailers. Right? So
manufacturers and brands,
have to work hard to bring more exciting
stories and innovation and utility to the market.
And I... And I certainly know that that's
happening Whether it's our thermostat grill
or whether it's some of our customers and
some of the thinking they're doing there, including,
you know, hybrid product that includes
grid,
you know, AAA grid pan, so you could
use a gas grill as a grid land
as a gas grill, things like that.
So I think, you know,
everyone's working hard to bring excitement in. And,
of course, the last biggest trend trend which
you and I have talked to is electric.
Right? Yep. I think
the entire world is focused on
bringing some sort of electric solution to the
market
that cooks
that cooks well.
At the moment, nothing really cooks as well
as gas, I don't think or or charcoal.
But certainly from a trend point of view,
it's something that Cap be denied. I,
tons of people are working on it. You
were at the sp event, which is
Okay. I mean, no offense sp, but just
for the Americans. This would be something akin
to, like, the Hp expo. But this is
actually, like, a real live event. Huge displays,
like, it's a week long or whatever it
is. What did you see aside? I know
you said electric was was a pretty big
push out there, But what else did you
see that was interesting?
Yes. Sp is the European equivalent of, I
guess, the Hp and hardware show rolled into
1. So I think most major brands even
American brands are there as well.
The style of cooking in Europe is a
bit different than it is here in North
America.
So you see a lot of different brands
that you don't see here that are that
are quite big.
Because there's so many markets in Europe, you
see a lot of regional brands as well,
So German or French or or, you know,
niche Spanish brands and so forth.
So you get a lot of neat product
id, that all of them translate, you know,
to to North America.
You know, as an example,
is I think grid cooking has always been
part of
the landscape over there. In fact, a lot
of gas grill.
Have always come 50 50
greats and grid.
So that's been something that's been normal
in Europe and and Australia. For for years
and years.
So so it's interesting to see now full
grid there are also gaining traction, but it's
something that they've had
there's also a lot of neat kind of
social
live fire type product where you have
people standing around maybe like a
a giant plant, and then there's a giant
log fire in the middle. You know, the...
These... It's a lot of those products. I
don't... I've never actually seen 1 being used
I had 1 for a years.
Did you use it?
Yes. I used it twice a year. Memorial
Day and a labor day.
Right. Right. And so I think they're beautiful
product.
They are beautiful product. If you have a
lot of space. I think they can be
great.
I just don't know how often people use
use that type of product, but there's certainly
lots of them. And then... And then, of
course, you have your your your,
you know, your global trends right now such
as pizza,
you know, that's still very big. Is it?
I
judging by the number of product you see,
yes, I'd say.
Are but are we on the downside of
popular?
Or no. We're still we're still launching up
or are we flattening?
Alright.
You know, I... I'd say I'd say what
people are doing, you know, whether it's uni
or whether it's ga,
I think they're trying to
take it beyond pizza.
You know? So I think didn't Uni launch
a very big 1 recently and and they're
showing
they're showing you can cook with all your
kinda cast iron pans and it and so
forth. Yeah. So so I think I think
what they're trying to do is they're trying
to say, well, you should buy this not
just for the pizza it makes, but you
can do all this other stuff in into
too. And certainly, I think that's the approach.
Ga is taking as well. Because
because... Yeah. I mean it's a different style
of cooking. Right? It is almost closer to
a, you know, I guess, a Hu style
or oven style of cooking.
Would you like to see air fryer off
of grill?
Or do you not care? You'll put it
on if the customer is gonna ask?
Well, I I think, you know, it depends
on which customer is asking and depends. You
know, I and I don't know I don't
know how many people use it,
to be honest with you.
But but certainly, there's a lot out there.
And I... And I think the the...
Is it the ninja that is out there
right now. The
the Ninja smoker. It's almost like a half
indoor plants half out year. Yeah. Yeah.
Did you would find you know? That that
is done.
That's right. That's right. But that 1 is
doing tremendous numbers from what I understand. Yeah.
So there certainly is an appetite for it.
And that uses a bit of kind of
air frying. Technology to deliver kind of,
it's cooking.
Anything else? We can
technology debunk
myth or po authenticate on tonight before I
let you go, James?
I have no idea what else Did you
wanna
debunk.
You think grid are still
growing in the market? Or are they starting?
To flatten out. Because let... It's it's a
loaded question because...
Sure.
Blacks stone still has
the Lion's share.
But if we're gonna be talking about what's
a jumping the shark and and what isn't,
I was shocked
to see them deviate
and go high line
for a 2000 dollar grid. You know, stainless
this or built in that. I was never
surprised that they went into a pallet cooker
thing. I thought that was, you know, pretty
easy thought to to make the jump to,
but
I was shocked to see them go into
luxury
g when it seemed...
The everyday Ham and Egg was their main
base. They were catering to what they were
giving accessories.
They were building an empire around it and
to make that big of a departure seemed
like a jump to shark moment for grid.
You know, I think that they are still
doing a great job with their core audience,
which is kind of like you said more
of the core price points and
mass product.
I think the installed kind of built in
island
2000 dollar fully stainless,
you know, grid
you know, a little bit of behind the
scenes, I think from a development point of
view, it would have caused nothing to develop
that product.
You know? So from an R and D
development,
even a tooling point of view, it wouldn't
have been a very big investment to build
the product.
So maybe from their perspective, they thought, you
know, let's throw some
high end stainless steel. Let's make it look
premium and see if we can sell some.
So is it a bigger maybe Is it
a bigger Gp item for that?
Oh, I would imagine something. Yeah. I mean
I would imagine so. So...
And and, you know what? Maybe people are
so maybe they're just trying to push the
narrative that, you know, the girls can replace
grill in every way. Right? So even in
your installed island, you should be thinking about
putting a grip as opposed to a grill.
Mh right? And, you know, that's... Their they're
there may be the brand to push that.
You know? But I think you'll see you
see big grid from
you know, big grid from commercial guys have
existed forever. Right? You know,
so so we'll see what happens. But but,
yeah, It's
they're very expensive.
James Howe is the Vp
managing director North America
for winners products, winners products dot com is
the website.
And
James sounds like a million dollars.
Of course, because he has also been... Told
you've gotta get a Usb microphone in order
to be a guest on the show. However,
James is not in Arkansas or in Illinois
Tell us James.
Where are you joining us from tonight doing
this interview.
Oh, currently, I am in Taipei 8 Taiwan.
I think you're almost the farthest away guest
I have ever had.
I had a, a guy from,
was he
He live in Australian was originally from New
Zealand or the other way around,
but he might have been the far of
this guest. But you definitely gotta be, like
second farthest, and you sound like a million
bucks. So this is why we have this
technology
because James sounds like he's sitting just to
the left of me, but in the Barbecue
Central Show Studios, but instead he's in Taipei
Taiwan.
Are you you doing a lot of travel
out there or What do you want to?
Yeah. Actually, the last show we did I
was... I did it from Singapore.
So Wow,
yeah. So I do a lot of travel
all around.
How many days out of the year do
you think you're out of pocket?
I'd say at least a third? Wow, I'd
say at least... A third. So it's quite
a bit.
That includes trips, you know, to Europe and
North America and and, obviously, the facilities is
in China, so all around.
James always appreciate the
conversation. You lend great insight to the show
that a lot of people would never have
access to. So the fact that you... You're
willing to reveal all this stuff and talk
about. I certainly appreciate, and
we're gonna line you up again. We're gonna
talk about you're
what did I have ready? Oh, growing a
private label from start to acceptance. Now I
think that's gonna have
a allowed of value for the folks when
we get to that conversation, but we'll get
it set up, and then we'll have you
back on in the meantime, stay safe and
continue success.
Happy birthday. Thanks, James. 50.
Alright. Yeah.
You give this guy.
That's James Howe. Winners products.
Winners products dot com.
I will
tell you that if you are
heading to winners products dot com and you're
looking for
a whole bunch of information. That is more
of a, a general information website.
And I gotta find a lot of
detailed stuff there, but
you can get some contact information if you're
ready to start a brand with James.
He's willing to have that conversation.
Maybe he can point you in the right
direction of the smaller footprint folks.
Grow you up, put you through the bush
leagues and then transition to the major leagues
over with winners. Who knows.
But the next conversation we have building a,
with the trusted brand.
Alright. Look.
My clock is all jacked up.
Let's do this.
And me get right there.
And me get right here.
We'll get ready to close it up.
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For all the amazing recipes.
We'll be back to wrap the show right
after this stick around will be right back.
Get
Let's get back to a guy who was
more experience giving you his opinion,
then he actually has cooking.
Once again, here's your host.
Greg ramsey.
And we thank James How for joining us
last segment from Winners products this portion of
the show being brought to you by a
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And there are growing through the country. So
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El or Jr tobacco retailer near you.
Great info from
James howe, For the extended segment there in
the second hour, a lot of great stuff,
a lot of great answers, a lot of
great insight.
So you're not finding this type of information
on any other barbecue podcast because they don't
have the access to a guy like James
that I was lucky enough to meet during
the
whole Covid debacle.
So
a great
positive that came out of that, many positive.
But James certainly a shining beacon and of
positivity
for the Covid
situation.
And I think that's gonna do it.
Appreciate everybody wishing me a happy birthday on
Instant chat, of course,
and the emails that I've gotten earlier today.
Again, thanks to Rod Sc for the Cook
book that he brought by earlier today, Doug
and Matt and Rusty for the cigars.
And unfortunately, now that everybody knows my birthday
tomorrow gifts will be expected hot and heavy
from here pork.
You got always to get it to me.
Express shipping only.
It
All the way back in the first hour,
it was meat head from amazing ribs dot
com, and then it was robert moss, robert
moss dot com.
Second hour all j all the time winners
products dot com.
He actually has a car
detailing
pressure washer
website.
See if I can find.
Real quick.
Active products
dot com
is the web website at like the way
it's sound active product.
If you're into
like, washing your car your detail guy.
This is like the most elite pressure washers
serving that niche to the industry premium,
car bundle.
You can believe.
Active products dot com.
We'll plug for James side business there, but
winners products otherwise.
Big show playing for you next week and
you can believe it we're always gonna be
through the third Tuesday of the month West
right is coming in. We have a quarterly
guest.
Tuesday probably going to be a
just trial.
That who we got.
Let's look
Yes. Just p Oh.
That's gonna be tough, I. She's on like
the 6 week travel journey.
We're gonna have to iron that out directly
after the show, so we can re refocus
the messenger necessary.
Anyway, how do I always lead you to
09/11/2001,
I will never forget.
Till next Tuesday at 9PM Eastern. This is
your program host and proud Us American, Greg
Rem, Good night now.
This off the park since Pit master with
Sm Mountain Dew in Nashville Tennessee and you
are listening to the Barbecue Central show.
Since