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Hello,

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and welcome to the Adventures and earning pod.

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Cast where we analyze, explore and celebrate the

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creative journey.

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My name is Julie Fe ann Ba, and

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I'm a working artist living outside of Boston.

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And if you wanna develop a strong and

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thriving art practice, I hope you'll check out

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my art practice dot com. You can get

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on the waitlist list, and be the first

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to know when the doors open in August.

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And for cycle 2, where we're gonna be

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talking about iteration or working in a series.

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So I'm excited about that. So mom is

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in here today, but we do have a...

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For fabulous guest, Angela.

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There.

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You know what? I just had it in

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your head. This is the fear fair

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thing, which is me talked about it. Now

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it's in my head, and it's so sore

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on around. No worries.

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So, Angela, so excited that you could do

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this. I wanna read a quick bio about

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you, and then we'll chat a little bit.

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From her home in Northern British Columbia, Canada

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through her video lessons on her website and

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Youtube for Created a community of watercolor lovers

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that spans the globe. And in fact, this

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isn't in your bio but I happened to

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know. You just came back from Greece. Right?

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Drake? Yep.

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She wants every painter to know the freedom

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of fearless self expression, and she has made

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it her mission to share this empowering message

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through lessons and heart prioritizing

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watercolor

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technique and loose intuitive painting.

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And I believe your membership is called something

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like heart or heart,

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Yeah. Bartlett

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Yeah. Part is Smart com. Yeah. There you

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go. And more than anything, she demonstrates that

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the most important thing you need to bring

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to your r... Is you. So welcome, Angela.

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Thank you.

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So I quite love why you were saying

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about iteration,

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as your is your upcoming theme because that's

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a lot of what we do as well.

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Yeah.

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Well, you know, let's just talk about iterations

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were there anyway and just talk about it

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Like, what what do you as an artist

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and a teacher find useful

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about that whole idea. Of working in a

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series of trying something sort of multiple times

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multiple ways.

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I think

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I think I'm not that you... I'm not

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that unique and I'm not that original instinctively.

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Right? So if I'm going to start painting

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something,

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I generally rely heavily on my reference photo.

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It's very literal to what I see.

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It's just, like you ask somebody, you know,

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how do you just... Love, and they were

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gonna start talking about the most common symbols

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that we might use are most common ideas.

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But when you spend a little more time,

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you get to get a little deeper, you

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get to edit out the cliche or the

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non essential,

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and maybe dig into,

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what does this really mean to me? You

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know, if I get beyond the the key

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phrase or the... Yeah, the keywords or whatever

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that people tend to commonly expect to hear?

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Let's have a, you know, I I get

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to have a deeper conversation. And

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I love that. I love seeing what

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when comes when you start scratching at an

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idea and see what emerges.

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Okay. Yeah. I think, like, your first idea

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is not the best idea. And I'm actually

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taking a piece of favor and writing down

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what you just said about a deeper

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Conversation because I just think that's such a

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beautiful way of just describing what happens. It's

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like,

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that sort of,

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quick 2 minute chat. You have with somebody

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at the post office

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conversation. Which is what you get to do

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when you're spending, like, 6 hours in the

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car with somebody, and that's all you're doing

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is stocking.

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Exactly. I was gonna say grocery store. So,

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yeah, We're on the see same area go.

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Yeah. Let's get deeper. I mean, here in

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canada. We talk about the weather. It's the

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first thing you... And I just... I don't

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even wanna go there.

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You know, let's...

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Obviously, you can't have a heart to hurt

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with everybody you meet, but it's really interesting

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what happens when you take that little bit

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of extra time

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and and see what's there. And in art,

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we get to do that with ourselves, and

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then maybe share it with the world is

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Yeah. Mh. Mh. I think that's so true

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now. So you and I actually have a

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kind of similar

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similar, but different.

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If that can be a thing sort of

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trajectory background sort of in how we came

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to what we're doing, Do you want to

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tell people a little bit about your story.

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Yeah. I love the fact that you and

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I, like, I first heard of you because

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I was involved in paper crafting when my

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kids were little, And so I I think

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your name popped up and... Some of the

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paper crafting magazines that I was subscribed to.

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And and for a while, I started painting

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in watercolor when I was 18. And so

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it making art

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has always been something I kind of wanted

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to do as a business,

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but I never believe that I could really,

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every artist that I know in Northern British

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Columbia in my in my

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circle,

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at the time anyhow, not a single 1

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was actually making a living as a full

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time artist. It was a hobby. And so,

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you know, to have a nice little side

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income, maybe make a couple hundred dollars a

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month, you know, that would that would be

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a nice little pipe dream for me. And

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so I pursued watercolor,

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off and on.

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And

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then when my kids were a little, I

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started doing paper crafting. And I did that

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as a little side business for a while

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and had people over and and started teaching

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little groups of of friends

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and then I... When I had... When I

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wanted to decide, what industry do I kinda

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throw myself at?

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I realized,

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I actually... Watercolors is something that I do

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kind of in my own unique way? Why

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would I not wanna niche down to that?

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So that's kinda of when I... About 20

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12, I think, was when I kinda started

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to really drill down on watercolor and and

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made that commitment to pursue

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to identify myself, I think as a watercolor

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artist and instructor and and pursue that that

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kind of angle. So it's been... I haven't

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looked back, been really

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amazing how how I've been able to create

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relationships and community,

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and it's and find my voices and artist

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and just continue to move in that direction.

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Well, I love what you said,

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about you have a unique way of doing

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watercolor

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and why wouldn't you, like, niche damage that

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go after it because I I think it,

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like,

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I am always

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screening for the roof rooftops that people that,

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like, whatever makes you weird is also what

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makes you awesome.

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Whatever makes you different is, like, the key

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to your success, and that people are always

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trying to sort of homo homo.

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Constantly, which I which I never understand because

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any work you make that looks like someone

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else is just a pale limitation

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of someone else. Right? You always wanna make

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work that looks like you And I know,

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like, that you very specifically say that it's

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important for you to help people sort of

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bring themselves

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to their art. And I'm wondering,

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is that something that you just sort of

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intrinsically

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new. Is this something that you came to

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after a while of teaching? Is this something

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that was a path of self discovery? Like,

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how did that become an important tenant for

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you?

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Yeah. Yeah. It is a really important tenant

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for me, and I I was just, like,

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patti myself on the back yesterday for the

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fact that... I get to applaud myself for

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committing to something even in the face of

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rejection, even in the face of not knowing

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where it's taking me.

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You know, and you just keep committing to

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that authenticity of your process, and that is

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huge, but I didn't start there.

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I started with the idea that if I

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could just make a perfect painting, I would

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feel fulfill as an artist, I would consider

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myself successful.

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I even remember bringing a painting very controlled,

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giant orc painting

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to a local gallery, And I'm showing the

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the gallery owner my work.

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And

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and even in, like, in Northern Bc, you

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don't just get to have an art gallery,

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you if you're a private art at gallery,

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you also are wearing other their hats, like,

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framing and all the things.

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We... You know, it's it's it's so hard

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to make living as an artist here or

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in an art field,

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And, but I remember showing him my painting

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and going. It's perfect, and he's like, well,

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but that was my my thought is that

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I don't see... You know, I what I've

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done here is I... I've created something that

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I don't have visible mistakes in. And so

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I don't have to be embarrassed by

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you know, my... I I get to hide

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behind this painting and it's

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controlled aspect.

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And

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and what I realized was Yeah. That's all

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subjective.

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I'm still gonna feel like I'm hiding because

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paintings never go the way you think they're

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going to go.

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And so you're always in a problem solving

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kind of cycle. And if perfection is well,

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you know, I'm never gonna get there. And

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so it took some rejection. It took apa

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empathy

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to help me to start to realize that,

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oh, maybe I'm not needing to win approval.

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By making that perfect painting.

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And I took the model of other artists

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who are courageous enough to trust their audience,

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to just pour their love into what they

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were doing and then leave it up to

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others as to whether or not, you know,

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it was

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accepted or or not

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And so brave artist than me have led

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the way, And and I'm so thankful fly

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stumbled across some of these artists. And and

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saw in their work, the kind of freedom

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that I wanted to have and didn't know

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it. So last 1 of their favorite artists.

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The 1 first 1 I think of is

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Linda Camp. She's a Canadian watercolor artist, and

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actually, she's doing more with, with acrylics now.

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But she,

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has a negative painting process.

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So she's generally

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painting around the object rather than... You know,

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you're working light to dark, you're creating... Carving

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00:09:42,392 --> 00:09:43,822
out those shapes in the painting.

271
00:09:44,616 --> 00:09:46,285
But what I saw in her work was

272
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a willingness to kind of leave a lot

273
00:09:48,668 --> 00:09:48,826
said.

274
00:09:50,118 --> 00:09:51,956
And it it made me wanna paint with

275
00:09:51,956 --> 00:09:53,474
that kind of freedom.

276
00:09:54,832 --> 00:09:56,750
And then the other was Jean Haynes,

277
00:09:57,324 --> 00:09:59,158
And I remember... I was just looking at

278
00:09:59,158 --> 00:10:00,194
a painting on the wall, and it was

279
00:10:00,194 --> 00:10:02,267
the first painting that I did after reading

280
00:10:02,427 --> 00:10:04,819
Jean book atmospheric watercolors, and she...

281
00:10:06,429 --> 00:10:07,866
That it was the text of the work

282
00:10:07,866 --> 00:10:09,542
of the book as much as the images

283
00:10:09,542 --> 00:10:12,038
that drew me because she was talking to

284
00:10:12,656 --> 00:10:13,555
newer painters

285
00:10:14,092 --> 00:10:16,340
about the fact that you get decide what

286
00:10:16,340 --> 00:10:18,410
kind of painting you're gonna create. And you

287
00:10:18,410 --> 00:10:20,321
get to be in control regardless of whether

288
00:10:20,321 --> 00:10:22,311
or not you feel like you are, and

289
00:10:22,311 --> 00:10:24,156
you get to pour your love to for

290
00:10:24,156 --> 00:10:26,537
watercolor out into the paper. And she she

291
00:10:26,537 --> 00:10:28,284
articulated that over and over again that she

292
00:10:28,284 --> 00:10:29,101
just really,

293
00:10:29,950 --> 00:10:32,173
approached her work with this deep compassion and

294
00:10:32,173 --> 00:10:34,417
love. For her subject for her medium,

295
00:10:35,054 --> 00:10:35,453
and

296
00:10:36,249 --> 00:10:38,162
I want... I wanted to be able to

297
00:10:38,162 --> 00:10:39,139
express that freely

298
00:10:39,596 --> 00:10:41,587
instead of trying to hide behind all this

299
00:10:41,587 --> 00:10:41,747
control.

300
00:10:43,197 --> 00:10:45,750
Well, so I get your newsletter, which is

301
00:10:45,750 --> 00:10:47,266
excellent. And you're a fantastic writer.

302
00:10:48,622 --> 00:10:49,122
And

303
00:10:49,674 --> 00:10:51,827
you actually recently wrote a newsletter that was

304
00:10:52,146 --> 00:10:53,821
I thought very much about control.

305
00:10:55,496 --> 00:10:55,895
And

306
00:10:56,374 --> 00:10:58,607
I actually wrote down also something that you

307
00:10:58,607 --> 00:11:00,615
had sent me where you were talking about

308
00:11:00,615 --> 00:11:03,005
using watercolor and having to let go of

309
00:11:03,005 --> 00:11:05,794
control or you said any original intention must

310
00:11:05,794 --> 00:11:06,590
be released.

311
00:11:07,243 --> 00:11:09,237
If the painting turns in a new direction,

312
00:11:09,397 --> 00:11:12,109
and this brings me into a relationship and

313
00:11:12,109 --> 00:11:14,443
intimacy with my chosen medium that is dangerously

314
00:11:14,501 --> 00:11:16,575
vulnerable and continually new.

315
00:11:17,385 --> 00:11:18,258
Yeah. Yeah.

316
00:11:18,892 --> 00:11:20,400
I think I pulled that from the... I

317
00:11:20,797 --> 00:11:22,067
I was working on a landscape book, and

318
00:11:22,146 --> 00:11:23,495
I think that was actually part of that.

319
00:11:24,447 --> 00:11:25,265
That script

320
00:11:25,574 --> 00:11:27,240
which I have to rewrite the landscape because

321
00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:29,938
my landscape process is changing again. But.

322
00:11:30,652 --> 00:11:33,209
So it's still in manuscript stage, but That

323
00:11:33,209 --> 00:11:34,646
is, I think for me,

324
00:11:35,364 --> 00:11:37,440
actually, a huge part of my process is

325
00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:38,957
that while I am painting,

326
00:11:40,074 --> 00:11:42,070
I have to remind myself that I don't

327
00:11:42,070 --> 00:11:44,242
get to be in control,

328
00:11:45,121 --> 00:11:47,039
you know, Jean Han in her book talking

329
00:11:47,039 --> 00:11:48,956
about you are in control. It is You

330
00:11:48,956 --> 00:11:51,526
are the 1 making decisions. And so that

331
00:11:51,526 --> 00:11:52,961
means you have to be the 1 to

332
00:11:52,961 --> 00:11:54,476
make the decision. Am I gonna fight what's

333
00:11:54,476 --> 00:11:56,788
happening on the painting? Or am I going

334
00:11:56,788 --> 00:11:59,433
to somehow kind of align into it? And

335
00:11:59,513 --> 00:12:01,267
I think that to me is that idea

336
00:12:01,267 --> 00:12:03,659
of letting go of control and saying, okay,

337
00:12:03,818 --> 00:12:05,173
I had this initial idea.

338
00:12:05,971 --> 00:12:08,776
But what I'm seeing here is more important

339
00:12:08,776 --> 00:12:11,647
to me than committing to whatever's locked to

340
00:12:11,647 --> 00:12:14,438
my brain, which probably wasn't very well formed

341
00:12:14,438 --> 00:12:15,156
to begin with.

342
00:12:17,404 --> 00:12:19,884
And and I'm going to to I'd react

343
00:12:19,884 --> 00:12:21,644
and respond to what's happening on the paper,

344
00:12:21,884 --> 00:12:23,904
and that's the control my choosing

345
00:12:24,365 --> 00:12:26,445
to let go of whatever I intended.

346
00:12:27,019 --> 00:12:28,860
Because I see something else going on here.

347
00:12:29,179 --> 00:12:30,940
And I actually will,

348
00:12:31,500 --> 00:12:33,500
signal to myself that I'm not,

349
00:12:34,953 --> 00:12:37,661
I don't have to dominate the painting,

350
00:12:38,776 --> 00:12:40,926
often all have placed a bunch of, you

351
00:12:40,926 --> 00:12:43,888
know, beautiful brush marks on my paper. And

352
00:12:43,888 --> 00:12:46,039
they're really special to me because they look

353
00:12:46,039 --> 00:12:47,951
so promising at the beginning of the painting.

354
00:12:48,190 --> 00:12:50,124
And then I start trying to protect them

355
00:12:50,182 --> 00:12:52,253
and work away from them, so I don't

356
00:12:52,253 --> 00:12:54,813
mess them up And whenever I noticed myself

357
00:12:54,813 --> 00:12:57,038
doing that, generally, I get my spray bottle

358
00:12:57,038 --> 00:12:58,786
out, and I release those marks, and I

359
00:12:58,786 --> 00:13:00,534
spritz them with some water and and let

360
00:13:00,534 --> 00:13:01,646
go of them a little bit.

361
00:13:02,299 --> 00:13:04,779
Because suddenly, you know, they are starting to

362
00:13:04,779 --> 00:13:07,259
control the painting or starting to dominate. And

363
00:13:07,259 --> 00:13:09,659
so there's a whole process there for me

364
00:13:09,659 --> 00:13:12,389
of reminding myself. That it's not, you know...

365
00:13:13,344 --> 00:13:13,741
I don't know.

366
00:13:14,458 --> 00:13:16,368
The language we use around painting is so

367
00:13:16,368 --> 00:13:16,845
difficult.

368
00:13:17,323 --> 00:13:18,517
It's not me needing to...

369
00:13:19,407 --> 00:13:19,907
Master

370
00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:22,985
the painting so much as, you know, be

371
00:13:22,985 --> 00:13:24,735
relational with it. And

372
00:13:25,450 --> 00:13:27,597
I'm always trying to tune myself to. What's

373
00:13:27,597 --> 00:13:31,770
my body language saying about my my control

374
00:13:31,986 --> 00:13:32,225
issues.

375
00:13:33,099 --> 00:13:34,849
You know, what... What's the language I'm using

376
00:13:34,849 --> 00:13:36,439
as I talk to myself about the painting?

377
00:13:36,757 --> 00:13:38,879
How do I kind of just

378
00:13:39,873 --> 00:13:40,589
stay present.

379
00:13:41,225 --> 00:13:41,622
And

380
00:13:42,178 --> 00:13:44,881
yeah, stop trying to parent this painting, I

381
00:13:44,881 --> 00:13:45,120
guess.

382
00:13:46,312 --> 00:13:49,346
Yeah. It's really hard. I mean, I think

383
00:13:49,346 --> 00:13:49,846
that

384
00:13:50,219 --> 00:13:50,719
it's

385
00:13:51,887 --> 00:13:52,387
having

386
00:13:53,317 --> 00:13:53,817
freedom

387
00:13:54,191 --> 00:13:57,888
when you're... Painting is something that strikes me

388
00:13:58,741 --> 00:14:00,993
is quite often found in

389
00:14:01,448 --> 00:14:02,267
complete amateur,

390
00:14:03,453 --> 00:14:04,011
or children?

391
00:14:04,966 --> 00:14:05,864
Yeah. Or

392
00:14:06,319 --> 00:14:09,503
very experienced painters, but hard to find when

393
00:14:09,503 --> 00:14:10,879
you're somewhere in the middle

394
00:14:11,428 --> 00:14:13,652
you know, And I and I feel like

395
00:14:13,652 --> 00:14:15,241
it's because when you sort of don't know

396
00:14:15,241 --> 00:14:15,741
anything,

397
00:14:16,274 --> 00:14:18,101
then there's is seen enormous freedom because you're

398
00:14:18,101 --> 00:14:20,904
just... It's not playing. You're just, you're experimenting,

399
00:14:20,985 --> 00:14:23,404
you're seeing what's gonna happen. And when you,

400
00:14:24,024 --> 00:14:26,184
you know, know a lot, then you know

401
00:14:26,184 --> 00:14:27,625
all the tricks like you were saying that

402
00:14:27,625 --> 00:14:28,504
you have to like go, I have just

403
00:14:28,504 --> 00:14:30,919
tell myself all the time, walk away, stop

404
00:14:30,919 --> 00:14:33,080
controlling it, stop doing that, Like, you know

405
00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:33,480
I mean?

406
00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,559
And then I think when you're in the

407
00:14:37,559 --> 00:14:39,572
middle somewhere where you're, like, trying to keep

408
00:14:39,572 --> 00:14:41,967
your design principles in mind. To remember your

409
00:14:41,967 --> 00:14:44,202
color wheel and figure out if you're doing

410
00:14:44,202 --> 00:14:46,597
this the right way that, like, your brain

411
00:14:46,597 --> 00:14:48,762
gets so into it. It's to so much

412
00:14:48,762 --> 00:14:49,262
harder

413
00:14:49,634 --> 00:14:51,932
at that point to, let, not possible, but

414
00:14:51,932 --> 00:14:53,993
it's, like, you just have to push yourself

415
00:14:53,993 --> 00:14:54,864
harder to do it.

416
00:14:55,594 --> 00:14:58,064
Yeah. I agree. I think... I'm... I almost

417
00:14:58,064 --> 00:15:00,296
think we need to schedule in time for

418
00:15:00,296 --> 00:15:00,455
it.

419
00:15:01,252 --> 00:15:04,533
Mh. If it because we do tend to

420
00:15:04,533 --> 00:15:06,602
schedule a lot of time for skill development

421
00:15:06,602 --> 00:15:07,239
as artists.

422
00:15:08,114 --> 00:15:09,945
It's very, very easy to fix your mind

423
00:15:09,945 --> 00:15:12,508
on, you know, I'm improving my brush handling.

424
00:15:12,747 --> 00:15:15,218
I'm studying color theory. I'm studying design,

425
00:15:15,855 --> 00:15:16,174
but,

426
00:15:16,971 --> 00:15:18,246
I'm making time for play.

427
00:15:19,454 --> 00:15:21,841
For experiments that don't seem to take me

428
00:15:21,841 --> 00:15:24,863
anywhere. That's a lot harder to feel productive

429
00:15:24,863 --> 00:15:25,363
with

430
00:15:25,753 --> 00:15:26,969
but I think

431
00:15:27,424 --> 00:15:29,492
I like to try to to warm up

432
00:15:29,492 --> 00:15:31,322
when I come into the studio, and I

433
00:15:31,481 --> 00:15:31,958
I do that,

434
00:15:32,928 --> 00:15:34,124
1 way I do it is just by

435
00:15:34,124 --> 00:15:36,117
really pacing myself before I ever pick up

436
00:15:36,117 --> 00:15:37,950
a brush, and I ramble through the room,

437
00:15:38,110 --> 00:15:40,581
and I move paintings around, and I kind

438
00:15:40,581 --> 00:15:43,148
of... Observe past work, and I I get

439
00:15:43,148 --> 00:15:44,743
really inefficient with starting,

440
00:15:45,780 --> 00:15:47,295
try to tidy up a little bit and

441
00:15:47,295 --> 00:15:49,050
see where that takes to me. And so

442
00:15:49,050 --> 00:15:50,007
there's that beginning.

443
00:15:51,698 --> 00:15:53,536
And it's kind of, like you're getting your

444
00:15:53,536 --> 00:15:55,454
feet wet or, you know, getting used to

445
00:15:55,454 --> 00:15:57,531
that cold water of, k. Now I have

446
00:15:57,531 --> 00:15:58,250
to be creative.

447
00:15:59,144 --> 00:16:01,299
And and then I also try to make

448
00:16:01,299 --> 00:16:04,013
time to just mess around with something. So

449
00:16:04,013 --> 00:16:05,610
maybe it's a painting that I know isn't

450
00:16:05,610 --> 00:16:07,765
going anywhere, and I can poke at it.

451
00:16:07,845 --> 00:16:09,316
And do something crazy

452
00:16:10,092 --> 00:16:12,403
because it's it's not a it's not a

453
00:16:12,403 --> 00:16:14,157
successful painting. Let's just take a risk.

454
00:16:15,273 --> 00:16:18,313
Sometimes it's just let's watch color move on

455
00:16:18,313 --> 00:16:19,666
a wet wash for a while,

456
00:16:20,302 --> 00:16:22,530
and see if I can't trigger that part

457
00:16:22,530 --> 00:16:24,599
of my brain that starts to get excited.

458
00:16:24,837 --> 00:16:25,337
And

459
00:16:26,125 --> 00:16:28,432
find that little that little hint of flow.

460
00:16:28,830 --> 00:16:30,421
And if I can't find out then I

461
00:16:30,421 --> 00:16:31,614
just pretend for a while.

462
00:16:33,062 --> 00:16:34,897
Well, I think the fake till you make

463
00:16:34,897 --> 00:16:37,370
it thing works for me all the time,

464
00:16:37,688 --> 00:16:39,762
which is, like, you just sort of start

465
00:16:39,762 --> 00:16:42,097
our moving and eventually you find yourself

466
00:16:42,730 --> 00:16:45,129
dropping into it. You know? It's like,

467
00:16:45,769 --> 00:16:46,269
your

468
00:16:47,049 --> 00:16:48,490
your body picks up. I don't know if

469
00:16:48,490 --> 00:16:50,669
it's an automatic or it's like, a learned

470
00:16:51,384 --> 00:16:54,496
a learned behavior based on, like, past experience

471
00:16:54,496 --> 00:16:57,209
or something like that. Yeah. Yeah. I don't

472
00:16:57,209 --> 00:16:58,326
know what it is either,

473
00:16:59,059 --> 00:17:00,415
it's been interesting because I was just in

474
00:17:00,495 --> 00:17:02,090
Greece, and I was teaching and art and

475
00:17:02,090 --> 00:17:04,881
travel workshops. So we... As a group, we're

476
00:17:04,881 --> 00:17:07,136
traveling in different locations in Greece

477
00:17:07,513 --> 00:17:09,921
and doing Plan air. And so you just...

478
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:11,517
I I didn't know where we were gonna

479
00:17:11,517 --> 00:17:13,431
show up on a given day. And then

480
00:17:13,590 --> 00:17:15,425
I just get to do a demo for

481
00:17:15,425 --> 00:17:18,296
everyone. And, a lot of times, it starts

482
00:17:18,296 --> 00:17:21,833
with that feeling of tension and stiffness and

483
00:17:22,048 --> 00:17:23,797
the awareness that, you know, when we were

484
00:17:23,797 --> 00:17:25,625
in Santa, we had a hundred people walk

485
00:17:25,625 --> 00:17:26,659
past design demoing.

486
00:17:27,135 --> 00:17:27,374
And,

487
00:17:28,264 --> 00:17:29,244
So there's

488
00:17:29,625 --> 00:17:31,224
learning how to tune all that out,

489
00:17:31,784 --> 00:17:34,524
and then also seeing the painting kind of

490
00:17:34,744 --> 00:17:36,585
often to start out with a little struggle.

491
00:17:37,475 --> 00:17:39,143
All of that tension. And

492
00:17:40,175 --> 00:17:42,161
as, you know, the the 1 thing that

493
00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:44,544
I'm forced to do as a as an

494
00:17:44,544 --> 00:17:46,132
instructor is keep going.

495
00:17:46,704 --> 00:17:48,539
And it's amazing to me. I learned as

496
00:17:48,539 --> 00:17:49,678
much through that

497
00:17:50,215 --> 00:17:52,370
idea, just keep going and then all of

498
00:17:52,370 --> 00:17:52,928
a sudden,

499
00:17:53,806 --> 00:17:54,045
oh,

500
00:17:54,618 --> 00:17:56,528
Wait a minute. Some... This little thing is

501
00:17:56,528 --> 00:17:58,118
working, and maybe I can use more of

502
00:17:58,118 --> 00:17:58,755
that over here.

503
00:17:59,948 --> 00:18:02,830
That's just been power. Full. But in the

504
00:18:02,830 --> 00:18:04,824
meantime, and my students don't know that I'm

505
00:18:04,824 --> 00:18:07,456
dealing with all of these thoughts of, oh,

506
00:18:07,536 --> 00:18:09,290
man, this isn't going well and how do

507
00:18:09,450 --> 00:18:10,827
I salvage this somehow

508
00:18:11,378 --> 00:18:13,521
And, I mean, sometimes I try to articulate

509
00:18:13,521 --> 00:18:15,029
that because I think it's Right. It's an

510
00:18:15,029 --> 00:18:15,529
important

511
00:18:15,981 --> 00:18:18,124
conversation to have. But I think...

512
00:18:19,013 --> 00:18:20,686
Even when the painting is going well, there's

513
00:18:20,686 --> 00:18:22,858
a lot of that little voice kind of

514
00:18:23,075 --> 00:18:23,575
cycling

515
00:18:24,031 --> 00:18:25,624
and trying to shove it out of the

516
00:18:25,624 --> 00:18:27,478
way. So the painting can continue

517
00:18:28,106 --> 00:18:30,807
Yeah. It's... I think art as a performance

518
00:18:30,807 --> 00:18:31,919
is so hard,

519
00:18:32,555 --> 00:18:34,938
and it's... And I know that many times

520
00:18:34,938 --> 00:18:36,447
that I'm doing a demo. I feel like

521
00:18:36,606 --> 00:18:37,106
I

522
00:18:38,528 --> 00:18:40,595
do something too early because I'm trying to

523
00:18:40,595 --> 00:18:42,662
just get this thing finished make it look

524
00:18:42,662 --> 00:18:44,570
good or I'm, you know, pulling out checks.

525
00:18:44,729 --> 00:18:47,288
And so then it's it's not really alive

526
00:18:47,288 --> 00:18:48,639
at that point. It's actually 1 of the

527
00:18:48,639 --> 00:18:49,934
reasons that I love

528
00:18:50,547 --> 00:18:51,047
online

529
00:18:51,819 --> 00:18:54,894
teaching because that means that, like, I can

530
00:18:55,014 --> 00:18:56,713
spend 3 hours in the studio

531
00:18:57,171 --> 00:18:59,807
in a very natural version of my practice.

532
00:19:00,287 --> 00:19:03,195
Shorten it to a fit 15 minute video

533
00:19:03,252 --> 00:19:05,479
or pick the section that actually is helpful

534
00:19:05,479 --> 00:19:06,911
to somebody instead of the part where I

535
00:19:06,911 --> 00:19:10,014
d around. This fear this this this, you

536
00:19:10,014 --> 00:19:10,173
know,

537
00:19:11,065 --> 00:19:12,505
and I think that, like,

538
00:19:13,305 --> 00:19:16,025
pardon me. For me, like, that has been

539
00:19:16,025 --> 00:19:18,618
a great way to feel like I'm being

540
00:19:18,835 --> 00:19:20,130
authentic in my process

541
00:19:20,506 --> 00:19:22,813
and with everything else and yet give people

542
00:19:22,813 --> 00:19:25,852
something that I'm also, like, proud of whereas

543
00:19:25,852 --> 00:19:27,763
when you catch the line show, it's always

544
00:19:27,763 --> 00:19:28,480
50 50,

545
00:19:29,116 --> 00:19:31,744
whether I'm gonna be. Excited I did about

546
00:19:31,744 --> 00:19:32,619
how that turns out.

547
00:19:33,829 --> 00:19:36,142
Yep. Oh, yeah. I mean, half the time

548
00:19:36,142 --> 00:19:38,615
when I'm doing a demo with a class,

549
00:19:38,934 --> 00:19:41,007
you know, they'll walk away after the first

550
00:19:41,007 --> 00:19:42,762
demo done, and all the second painting I'll

551
00:19:42,762 --> 00:19:44,930
day was just like, Oh, man. That was

552
00:19:44,930 --> 00:19:46,924
even better. It's like, come back for the

553
00:19:46,924 --> 00:19:47,721
second 1.

554
00:19:48,519 --> 00:19:49,396
Okay. But,

555
00:19:50,513 --> 00:19:52,267
at the same time, I think,

556
00:19:53,798 --> 00:19:57,009
that being forced as an instructor during a

557
00:19:57,227 --> 00:19:57,727
demonstration

558
00:19:58,663 --> 00:20:01,773
to keep persisting through a, I think we

559
00:20:01,773 --> 00:20:04,258
do have the opportunity to teach so well.

560
00:20:05,531 --> 00:20:08,555
This idea of iterating, even through 1 painting,

561
00:20:09,033 --> 00:20:11,355
we can iterate a series, but we also

562
00:20:11,355 --> 00:20:13,661
iterate in the moment on that single painting.

563
00:20:14,138 --> 00:20:15,807
You know, okay. This is working.

564
00:20:16,682 --> 00:20:19,147
Let's do it somewhere else. Or sometimes, this

565
00:20:19,147 --> 00:20:20,101
is not working,

566
00:20:20,434 --> 00:20:21,952
But if I do it again over here,

567
00:20:22,112 --> 00:20:24,290
it's gonna look like I planned it. So

568
00:20:24,430 --> 00:20:27,067
that's that's actually 1 of my favorite ways

569
00:20:27,067 --> 00:20:29,318
to to solve the painting is. Take that

570
00:20:29,318 --> 00:20:31,152
thing you kinda thought was ugly and make

571
00:20:31,152 --> 00:20:32,109
it look intentional.

572
00:20:33,624 --> 00:20:35,777
You know, I think there is, like,

573
00:20:36,574 --> 00:20:37,951
there's an art in

574
00:20:38,582 --> 00:20:40,570
I don't know how to say, hiding stuff

575
00:20:40,570 --> 00:20:43,594
or, like, figuring out mistakes or there's just...

576
00:20:43,753 --> 00:20:44,867
There's an art in...

577
00:20:45,519 --> 00:20:47,694
In in learning about the process,

578
00:20:48,151 --> 00:20:49,826
you know? It's like, we were talking about

579
00:20:49,826 --> 00:20:51,820
skill building and how people are worried about

580
00:20:51,820 --> 00:20:54,292
loading their brush and, you know, blah app.

581
00:20:54,532 --> 00:20:56,775
But it's, like, there's a skill and play.

582
00:20:57,411 --> 00:21:00,512
There's a skill in, you know, on, like,

583
00:21:00,750 --> 00:21:03,214
letting yourself go in the process. There's a

584
00:21:03,214 --> 00:21:04,486
skill in pushing through.

585
00:21:04,979 --> 00:21:06,574
There's a skill in so many things that

586
00:21:06,734 --> 00:21:08,829
I think people don't think of as

587
00:21:09,206 --> 00:21:11,838
traditional, like, I'm working on an art skill,

588
00:21:12,078 --> 00:21:14,470
but they really are important important skills.

589
00:21:15,123 --> 00:21:16,634
I remember... So I have I have a

590
00:21:16,634 --> 00:21:19,339
4 year old, and I remember reading this

591
00:21:19,339 --> 00:21:19,839
article

592
00:21:20,532 --> 00:21:22,918
about Blue, which we're very into at the

593
00:21:22,918 --> 00:21:23,237
moment.

594
00:21:24,128 --> 00:21:25,885
In which they were saying, like, 1 of

595
00:21:25,885 --> 00:21:27,960
the things about Blue as a cartoon is

596
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:28,859
that it's helping

597
00:21:29,397 --> 00:21:29,897
adults

598
00:21:30,275 --> 00:21:32,271
understand how to play with their children.

599
00:21:33,244 --> 00:21:33,744
And

600
00:21:34,122 --> 00:21:35,558
I had a moment where I was, like,

601
00:21:36,037 --> 00:21:36,835
adults need help,

602
00:21:37,633 --> 00:21:39,229
understanding how to play with a child.

603
00:21:40,027 --> 00:21:42,037
And then I would And then I realized

604
00:21:42,037 --> 00:21:45,390
how many of my friends ask me, you

605
00:21:45,390 --> 00:21:47,785
know, weird play questions that I always sort

606
00:21:47,785 --> 00:21:49,302
of, like, didn't think a lot about. And

607
00:21:49,302 --> 00:21:51,472
then I was like, oh, I'm the weirdo.

608
00:21:52,111 --> 00:21:54,586
I... This is part of, like, Artist brain,

609
00:21:54,985 --> 00:21:56,821
where because I don't to play with art

610
00:21:56,821 --> 00:21:58,418
supplies. It's like, I also just understand how

611
00:21:58,418 --> 00:22:01,066
to play with Legos or play man things

612
00:22:01,066 --> 00:22:03,396
because I do it. It's a muscle

613
00:22:03,772 --> 00:22:06,160
that I have developed and or haven't let

614
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:07,433
go of, childhood.

615
00:22:07,831 --> 00:22:09,605
And that was such a

616
00:22:10,394 --> 00:22:13,666
that was a big realization for me about

617
00:22:13,666 --> 00:22:16,380
the fact that we often walked through the

618
00:22:16,380 --> 00:22:18,716
world, like, not understanding that our

619
00:22:19,028 --> 00:22:20,379
view of it is not the same as

620
00:22:20,379 --> 00:22:22,684
other people's. Yep. You know? And that's is

621
00:22:22,684 --> 00:22:24,774
that thing, which is how exciting for you

622
00:22:24,831 --> 00:22:26,523
that you were able to figure out

623
00:22:26,834 --> 00:22:29,469
that the... Your approach to watercolors is still

624
00:22:29,469 --> 00:22:32,741
unique that that's your, you know, thing.

625
00:22:33,699 --> 00:22:36,905
That not that. Yeah. Well, it's not even

626
00:22:36,905 --> 00:22:39,133
that my approach to watercolor was unique. I

627
00:22:39,133 --> 00:22:40,883
didn't have that much confidence, but it's just...

628
00:22:41,599 --> 00:22:42,873
I didn't know anybody else who was a

629
00:22:42,873 --> 00:22:43,373
watercolor

630
00:22:43,684 --> 00:22:44,642
I have a whole bunch of friends who

631
00:22:44,642 --> 00:22:46,638
are paper crafting. You know? I... Mh. And

632
00:22:46,638 --> 00:22:49,272
we're working with things products other people had

633
00:22:49,272 --> 00:22:52,066
designed. So here's something, I get to take

634
00:22:52,066 --> 00:22:54,311
ownership of the entire kit in Cabo. Well,

635
00:22:54,390 --> 00:22:54,549
that...

636
00:22:55,425 --> 00:22:57,414
That's kind of freeing, kind of scary,

637
00:22:58,210 --> 00:22:59,961
but also, there's a freedom in that.

638
00:23:00,773 --> 00:23:02,528
You know, I think the thing that brings

639
00:23:02,528 --> 00:23:04,602
that play out and... Because I had a

640
00:23:04,602 --> 00:23:06,277
lot of fun with my kids,

641
00:23:06,915 --> 00:23:09,387
they're... My my youngest just turned 18 last

642
00:23:09,387 --> 00:23:10,206
week. So

643
00:23:10,679 --> 00:23:11,878
I think I need to grieve of some

644
00:23:11,878 --> 00:23:12,378
childhood

645
00:23:13,236 --> 00:23:14,375
memories, but

646
00:23:14,994 --> 00:23:16,613
this is... You know, this is his last

647
00:23:17,471 --> 00:23:18,750
last last week of school.

648
00:23:19,243 --> 00:23:21,387
And I remember I was just thinking about

649
00:23:21,387 --> 00:23:23,609
how 1 year for their last week of

650
00:23:23,609 --> 00:23:25,039
school. The last day of school, I took

651
00:23:25,039 --> 00:23:26,944
them to 07:11, and we all bought our

652
00:23:26,944 --> 00:23:27,738
height in licorice.

653
00:23:28,389 --> 00:23:30,723
And, you know, it's, like the crazy mom

654
00:23:31,180 --> 00:23:33,892
playful thing that maybe that's an Arts thing

655
00:23:33,892 --> 00:23:35,089
to do. I don't know, but,

656
00:23:35,807 --> 00:23:36,843
we had those kind of fun.

657
00:23:37,641 --> 00:23:38,141
But

658
00:23:38,452 --> 00:23:40,064
I think it's the what if factor

659
00:23:40,516 --> 00:23:43,135
because as artists were continually asking what if,

660
00:23:43,929 --> 00:23:46,787
that's imaginative, and that does translate into play.

661
00:23:47,438 --> 00:23:49,353
So I think... Yeah. And what you're saying

662
00:23:49,353 --> 00:23:50,549
makes a lot of sense. I think that's

663
00:23:50,549 --> 00:23:50,788
fine.

664
00:23:51,666 --> 00:23:53,341
Yeah. Yeah. I think, you know,

665
00:23:53,979 --> 00:23:57,031
now you obviously are coming at

666
00:23:57,342 --> 00:23:59,640
you know, teaching people and coaching people and

667
00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,335
all that kind of stuff through this, your

668
00:24:02,335 --> 00:24:02,835
heart,

669
00:24:03,761 --> 00:24:04,158
you know,

670
00:24:04,728 --> 00:24:07,508
point of view, which I think is very...

671
00:24:07,985 --> 00:24:09,097
Well, I mean, I don't wanna put words

672
00:24:09,097 --> 00:24:10,789
your mouth. Why don't you tell me

673
00:24:11,321 --> 00:24:13,307
a little bit about your sort of the

674
00:24:13,307 --> 00:24:13,943
that approach?

675
00:24:15,631 --> 00:24:15,870
Yeah.

676
00:24:16,747 --> 00:24:19,858
I I like calling it heart or heart

677
00:24:19,858 --> 00:24:20,358
prioritizing

678
00:24:21,294 --> 00:24:24,380
because that was not something that I

679
00:24:24,896 --> 00:24:26,430
did or that I

680
00:24:26,964 --> 00:24:28,793
thought about as being important when I was

681
00:24:28,793 --> 00:24:30,542
learning to paint. It was, like I said,

682
00:24:30,940 --> 00:24:32,689
figuring out my standard of excellence,

683
00:24:33,405 --> 00:24:33,905
and

684
00:24:34,533 --> 00:24:35,747
I think in

685
00:24:36,753 --> 00:24:37,546
the art world,

686
00:24:38,736 --> 00:24:40,480
it's very... That's a... Oh, it's also something

687
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:41,932
that's very difficult to quantify.

688
00:24:42,479 --> 00:24:43,835
And so when you are,

689
00:24:44,792 --> 00:24:46,090
submitting your art to

690
00:24:46,706 --> 00:24:48,222
exhibitions or Jury shows,

691
00:24:49,498 --> 00:24:52,050
the criteria they're using is not did the

692
00:24:52,050 --> 00:24:53,972
artist prioritize their heart in this painting,

693
00:24:54,688 --> 00:24:56,515
or mean, are their self expression, How does

694
00:24:56,515 --> 00:24:58,104
the art is showing who they are.

695
00:24:59,375 --> 00:25:01,786
Prioritize it's that's very rare to find.

696
00:25:02,905 --> 00:25:04,502
And, yet, I think it's so...

697
00:25:05,381 --> 00:25:06,100
I needed that.

698
00:25:07,231 --> 00:25:08,898
I need... I needed that for myself.

699
00:25:10,645 --> 00:25:13,424
It's very, very easy to find ourselves falling

700
00:25:13,424 --> 00:25:15,171
into a... Fitting into a system in some

701
00:25:15,171 --> 00:25:15,807
way. So,

702
00:25:16,779 --> 00:25:19,099
you know, it's do what your boss needs

703
00:25:19,099 --> 00:25:20,859
you to do at work, so you can

704
00:25:20,859 --> 00:25:22,779
be an excellent employee and get that raise

705
00:25:22,779 --> 00:25:23,419
or whatever.

706
00:25:24,714 --> 00:25:25,613
Win approval

707
00:25:25,991 --> 00:25:26,491
in

708
00:25:26,869 --> 00:25:27,369
your

709
00:25:27,827 --> 00:25:28,146
relationships,

710
00:25:29,184 --> 00:25:32,217
you know, be the satisfactory partner and spouse,

711
00:25:32,456 --> 00:25:32,956
and

712
00:25:33,426 --> 00:25:35,907
you know, when I lose sight of my

713
00:25:36,041 --> 00:25:38,815
relationship, and I focus on my role, the

714
00:25:38,815 --> 00:25:40,004
relationship actually suffers.

715
00:25:40,734 --> 00:25:43,547
And somehow I get trapped in that sometimes.

716
00:25:44,243 --> 00:25:44,642
And

717
00:25:45,360 --> 00:25:46,955
raising 3 kids for a very close in

718
00:25:46,955 --> 00:25:48,471
age. It was very easy to get lost

719
00:25:48,471 --> 00:25:50,519
in mom and lose sight of the the

720
00:25:50,639 --> 00:25:51,139
play

721
00:25:51,517 --> 00:25:51,916
and

722
00:25:52,474 --> 00:25:54,788
trying to get the job done. And so

723
00:25:54,948 --> 00:25:56,464
I had all of these things in my

724
00:25:56,464 --> 00:25:58,161
life that that

725
00:25:58,714 --> 00:26:01,750
demanded a level of excellence or performance for

726
00:26:01,750 --> 00:26:04,467
me. And by doing that in my art,

727
00:26:06,319 --> 00:26:07,674
you know, it wasn't good for me. It

728
00:26:07,674 --> 00:26:09,028
wasn't what I actually needed.

729
00:26:09,905 --> 00:26:12,296
I needed a place where I could create

730
00:26:12,296 --> 00:26:13,651
at that safe space to just...

731
00:26:14,305 --> 00:26:15,984
Who am I? How do I show up

732
00:26:15,984 --> 00:26:18,464
in in this space in my art? And

733
00:26:18,464 --> 00:26:20,305
when I learned how to do that and

734
00:26:20,305 --> 00:26:21,505
began to learn how to do that?

735
00:26:22,478 --> 00:26:24,153
I was able to show up as myself

736
00:26:24,153 --> 00:26:27,263
in other spaces and suddenly realized, oh, this

737
00:26:27,263 --> 00:26:28,858
is what I was missing?

738
00:26:29,895 --> 00:26:32,143
And why would I want... Why would I

739
00:26:32,143 --> 00:26:34,294
want others to miss out on on knowing

740
00:26:34,294 --> 00:26:36,547
me because I was so busy trying to

741
00:26:37,003 --> 00:26:38,596
be a good way, mother.

742
00:26:39,488 --> 00:26:39,887
Partner,

743
00:26:41,083 --> 00:26:42,120
you know, all of the things.

744
00:26:42,918 --> 00:26:43,556
Community member.

745
00:26:44,752 --> 00:26:45,252
So

746
00:26:45,789 --> 00:26:47,703
I needed that safe space. And so Art

747
00:26:47,703 --> 00:26:50,111
has been that for me. And I've actually

748
00:26:50,111 --> 00:26:52,026
come to the place where I think in

749
00:26:52,026 --> 00:26:52,585
my art,

750
00:26:54,819 --> 00:26:56,175
what I like to do when I come

751
00:26:56,175 --> 00:26:58,180
into studio is ask myself, What do I

752
00:26:58,180 --> 00:26:59,931
need? What do I need to hear today?

753
00:27:00,169 --> 00:27:01,283
How do I need to feel?

754
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:02,420
And

755
00:27:03,114 --> 00:27:03,852
when I

756
00:27:04,243 --> 00:27:06,397
really think about that, and I become that

757
00:27:06,397 --> 00:27:08,869
person who listens to me because I think

758
00:27:08,869 --> 00:27:10,305
we all want someone to do that for

759
00:27:10,305 --> 00:27:12,459
us. You know, it's a really normal how

760
00:27:12,459 --> 00:27:13,597
really are you

761
00:27:13,989 --> 00:27:15,821
But yet, we don't do that to ourselves.

762
00:27:16,140 --> 00:27:17,574
And so this is a place where I

763
00:27:17,574 --> 00:27:19,486
get to teach myself. How I wanna be

764
00:27:19,486 --> 00:27:19,804
treated.

765
00:27:21,253 --> 00:27:23,903
And so it's it's a really important

766
00:27:24,279 --> 00:27:24,518
relationship,

767
00:27:25,553 --> 00:27:25,951
and

768
00:27:26,747 --> 00:27:27,486
I come

769
00:27:28,180 --> 00:27:30,819
out of a a student community, like I

770
00:27:30,819 --> 00:27:34,020
grew up in in the church. And

771
00:27:34,393 --> 00:27:35,108
and I think...

772
00:27:36,061 --> 00:27:38,285
And I'm still I'm still involved in that

773
00:27:38,285 --> 00:27:38,785
community

774
00:27:39,174 --> 00:27:41,004
But I also see how we can very

775
00:27:41,004 --> 00:27:43,631
quickly twist something into a system and then

776
00:27:43,631 --> 00:27:46,177
lose sight up relationship and start to figure

777
00:27:46,177 --> 00:27:48,247
out how do I fit into this system

778
00:27:48,247 --> 00:27:50,408
and how do perform well in it. And

779
00:27:50,408 --> 00:27:53,906
then the individual gets lost. And you know,

780
00:27:54,224 --> 00:27:56,211
we don't do church well when we're doing

781
00:27:56,211 --> 00:27:57,741
that and we don't do our... Well, we're...

782
00:27:57,900 --> 00:27:59,815
When we're... When we're thinking that way out.

783
00:28:00,612 --> 00:28:02,447
You know, we just... We we miss so

784
00:28:02,447 --> 00:28:04,520
much. And so I get to create that

785
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:06,355
space in my heart, and that's really valuable.

786
00:28:06,609 --> 00:28:06,847
For me.

787
00:28:07,882 --> 00:28:09,553
I hope that. I can share that with

788
00:28:09,553 --> 00:28:10,507
others too. Yeah.

789
00:28:11,701 --> 00:28:14,008
Well, I think, you know, it always seems

790
00:28:14,008 --> 00:28:15,542
to me at least from the outside

791
00:28:15,854 --> 00:28:20,269
that you are definitely, like, encouraging people constantly

792
00:28:21,207 --> 00:28:21,707
to

793
00:28:22,326 --> 00:28:22,826
not

794
00:28:23,617 --> 00:28:25,388
have that kind of tension

795
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,325
that art should be like a safe

796
00:28:29,016 --> 00:28:30,683
space. Mh. You. Know.

797
00:28:31,253 --> 00:28:33,657
And I think, like, I know that,

798
00:28:34,981 --> 00:28:36,195
art has

799
00:28:37,123 --> 00:28:39,051
done, you know, a lot of

800
00:28:39,997 --> 00:28:42,945
stuff for me as well where, like, and

801
00:28:42,945 --> 00:28:45,336
a lot of people where it definitely is

802
00:28:45,336 --> 00:28:46,904
a safe place. It's a place you can

803
00:28:47,104 --> 00:28:48,778
explore ideas as a place you can be

804
00:28:48,778 --> 00:28:50,714
brave. It's definitely a place where

805
00:28:51,091 --> 00:28:53,723
I was brave in arch before I was

806
00:28:53,723 --> 00:28:55,557
able to be brave in my life and

807
00:28:55,557 --> 00:28:58,040
yet. Yep. 1 follow of the other. As

808
00:28:58,040 --> 00:28:59,233
soon as I started to be able to

809
00:28:59,233 --> 00:29:00,745
break rules in art, I started to feel

810
00:29:00,745 --> 00:29:02,279
like I could break some rules,

811
00:29:02,654 --> 00:29:03,052
you know,

812
00:29:04,260 --> 00:29:06,568
outside of that. I think, I definitely suffer

813
00:29:06,568 --> 00:29:09,036
from kind of a good girl good syndrome

814
00:29:09,036 --> 00:29:10,946
zoom. I'm gonna be good. And if I'm

815
00:29:10,946 --> 00:29:13,508
just good, do all my good things, know,

816
00:29:13,667 --> 00:29:16,212
then I'll be rewarded and you know, that,

817
00:29:16,372 --> 00:29:18,281
of course, you want to be...

818
00:29:19,315 --> 00:29:21,481
And I think if you been a good,

819
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:22,938
like, student

820
00:29:23,315 --> 00:29:23,815
academically,

821
00:29:24,272 --> 00:29:26,506
then you come at art from almost like

822
00:29:26,506 --> 00:29:28,659
an academic point of view where you're trying

823
00:29:28,659 --> 00:29:29,319
to d.

824
00:29:29,776 --> 00:29:32,267
Okay. I can memorize the color wheel, and

825
00:29:32,267 --> 00:29:34,105
then I can memorize the names of all

826
00:29:34,105 --> 00:29:36,422
the tools, and then I can memorize, but

827
00:29:36,422 --> 00:29:38,121
it's like, it doesn't quite

828
00:29:38,834 --> 00:29:41,148
translate, like, your orc painting that you were

829
00:29:41,148 --> 00:29:42,126
talking about

830
00:29:42,983 --> 00:29:43,462
into,

831
00:29:44,260 --> 00:29:44,760
something

832
00:29:45,138 --> 00:29:47,150
exciting. I mean, I 1 of the things

833
00:29:47,150 --> 00:29:49,470
that we're dealing with right now or dealing

834
00:29:49,470 --> 00:29:50,750
with, like, it's a problem with of the

835
00:29:50,750 --> 00:29:52,769
things that we're talking about right now

836
00:29:53,070 --> 00:29:55,879
over in my art practice which is my

837
00:29:55,879 --> 00:29:56,675
membership is that,

838
00:29:57,470 --> 00:29:59,482
is the idea of like, Ka,

839
00:30:00,016 --> 00:30:02,402
and which is the Japanese art of mend,

840
00:30:02,482 --> 00:30:03,436
you know, with gold,

841
00:30:03,930 --> 00:30:04,730
And I think that,

842
00:30:05,610 --> 00:30:07,150
of, just like it's embracing

843
00:30:07,450 --> 00:30:09,289
mistakes of sort of, you know,

844
00:30:09,930 --> 00:30:11,470
not feeling the need

845
00:30:11,864 --> 00:30:12,603
to constantly,

846
00:30:13,378 --> 00:30:15,689
post something and point out to everybody like,

847
00:30:16,326 --> 00:30:18,239
oh, I don't really like this, and this

848
00:30:18,239 --> 00:30:19,448
is a problem. It's like, you would attack

849
00:30:19,448 --> 00:30:21,596
it before anybody else could because you're so

850
00:30:21,596 --> 00:30:21,914
scared,

851
00:30:22,471 --> 00:30:24,142
that somebody's gonna attack it, but then you

852
00:30:24,142 --> 00:30:25,437
basically do their job

853
00:30:26,464 --> 00:30:28,702
for them. You know? I think it's I

854
00:30:28,702 --> 00:30:31,099
think it's a really hard thing to get

855
00:30:31,099 --> 00:30:31,818
over. So...

856
00:30:32,617 --> 00:30:34,935
Yeah. I'm sure you see of about that.

857
00:30:35,987 --> 00:30:38,001
Yeah. And I think 1 thing I

858
00:30:38,378 --> 00:30:39,812
I need to come down even harder on,

859
00:30:40,051 --> 00:30:41,906
I think is the way we use language

860
00:30:42,123 --> 00:30:43,892
because I think that's a... Big part of

861
00:30:43,892 --> 00:30:46,683
it. You know, We talk about mistakes. We

862
00:30:46,683 --> 00:30:48,837
talk about... I'm just a... You know, our

863
00:30:48,837 --> 00:30:50,432
people will post their work in the. I'm

864
00:30:50,432 --> 00:30:52,367
just a beginner. I'm just

865
00:30:53,157 --> 00:30:53,555
whatever.

866
00:30:54,032 --> 00:30:56,180
And I... The other day... Not that long

867
00:30:56,180 --> 00:30:57,930
ago, a few months ago, I realized I

868
00:30:57,930 --> 00:31:00,434
was still saying I'm unjust. I'm just from

869
00:31:00,490 --> 00:31:03,295
the north where we don't have these resources

870
00:31:03,351 --> 00:31:04,646
that, you know, you have

871
00:31:05,020 --> 00:31:07,428
in these communities with big networks of art

872
00:31:07,579 --> 00:31:09,010
and so suddenly, I'm like, wait a sit.

873
00:31:09,328 --> 00:31:10,759
I'm still dismissing myself.

874
00:31:11,474 --> 00:31:11,872
And

875
00:31:12,666 --> 00:31:15,051
and so it's it's being, kind of a

876
00:31:15,051 --> 00:31:17,850
att to when that language kind of triggers

877
00:31:17,850 --> 00:31:18,646
those kinds of things.

878
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:21,194
That's been a big part of it for

879
00:31:21,194 --> 00:31:22,331
me and and hopefully,

880
00:31:22,946 --> 00:31:24,959
when I talk about how we use language

881
00:31:25,335 --> 00:31:27,569
kind how I how I talk about my

882
00:31:27,569 --> 00:31:29,947
paintings as I'm painting them, how I describe

883
00:31:29,947 --> 00:31:30,660
them to others,

884
00:31:32,086 --> 00:31:32,586
maybe

885
00:31:32,974 --> 00:31:34,721
you know, others can can start to go,

886
00:31:34,801 --> 00:31:37,264
oh, yeah. I use that word, and and

887
00:31:37,264 --> 00:31:39,647
maybe it's impacting how I approach my work.

888
00:31:40,138 --> 00:31:42,281
And, you know, band perfect band, this is

889
00:31:42,281 --> 00:31:43,233
a bad painting.

890
00:31:44,264 --> 00:31:44,764
Because

891
00:31:45,216 --> 00:31:47,755
generally the failed paintings, the ones I consider

892
00:31:47,755 --> 00:31:48,255
failed

893
00:31:48,643 --> 00:31:51,032
are teaching me more than all my successes

894
00:31:51,032 --> 00:31:53,102
do where my successes are often they keep

895
00:31:53,102 --> 00:31:55,012
me safe because I'm just gonna do the

896
00:31:55,012 --> 00:31:57,336
same thing I've always done, and Mh. End

897
00:31:57,336 --> 00:31:59,404
up with this nice safe results. So, yeah.

898
00:31:59,723 --> 00:32:02,450
Let's let's think about how we use language,

899
00:32:02,825 --> 00:32:05,334
to describe our way yeah. I just read

900
00:32:06,112 --> 00:32:08,030
to creative act by Rick Rubin. I don't

901
00:32:08,030 --> 00:32:10,028
know if you've read it yet. Just sitting

902
00:32:10,028 --> 00:32:11,786
of myself that I need to just open

903
00:32:11,786 --> 00:32:13,065
it up and actually read it know.

904
00:32:13,878 --> 00:32:15,550
Well, it's 1 of those books that's good

905
00:32:15,550 --> 00:32:17,540
to kinda, like, dip in and dip out

906
00:32:17,540 --> 00:32:18,495
of. You know what I mean?

907
00:32:19,291 --> 00:32:21,122
And you could honestly open it to any

908
00:32:21,122 --> 00:32:23,045
page. And, like, read a page or 2

909
00:32:23,045 --> 00:32:24,636
and then have something to think about for

910
00:32:24,636 --> 00:32:27,100
a couple days. But he does talk sort

911
00:32:27,100 --> 00:32:29,350
of exactly about that, which is if you

912
00:32:29,979 --> 00:32:32,855
are still doing the same thing, you know,

913
00:32:33,015 --> 00:32:34,054
kind of over and over,

914
00:32:35,012 --> 00:32:36,610
to get to mediocre, like,

915
00:32:37,424 --> 00:32:40,380
that's not great. You know, nobody is dreaming

916
00:32:40,380 --> 00:32:41,119
of mediocre

917
00:32:41,498 --> 00:32:42,957
like, you want to

918
00:32:43,415 --> 00:32:43,915
try

919
00:32:44,228 --> 00:32:47,272
new things and to get uncomfortable and to

920
00:32:47,488 --> 00:32:48,919
do things in a way that you haven't

921
00:32:48,919 --> 00:32:51,883
done them before. And, you know, I think

922
00:32:52,194 --> 00:32:54,985
I think that's exciting, and that's interesting and,

923
00:32:55,065 --> 00:32:57,617
you know, but it's also... And I... I

924
00:32:57,617 --> 00:32:59,133
know you've used this word before, so I

925
00:32:59,133 --> 00:33:00,648
know it's something that you think about, which

926
00:33:00,648 --> 00:33:01,467
is it's vulnerable.

927
00:33:02,339 --> 00:33:02,738
Mh.

928
00:33:03,298 --> 00:33:04,736
Yeah. Yeah. And I have a and and

929
00:33:04,816 --> 00:33:05,955
I struggle with the vulnerability.

930
00:33:06,733 --> 00:33:08,890
It's very easy actually as an instructor.

931
00:33:10,020 --> 00:33:11,771
I can come across with a lot of

932
00:33:11,771 --> 00:33:14,476
on authenticity, but I'm still managing what I

933
00:33:14,476 --> 00:33:14,635
share.

934
00:33:15,351 --> 00:33:17,420
And, my husband and I last year, we

935
00:33:17,420 --> 00:33:17,898
joined

936
00:33:18,708 --> 00:33:21,248
a community group. And and we go to

937
00:33:21,248 --> 00:33:21,748
these

938
00:33:22,835 --> 00:33:24,819
get together, and I would... And on the

939
00:33:24,819 --> 00:33:26,582
way home might be like, don't know if

940
00:33:26,661 --> 00:33:28,332
I can go back. Like, I'm so embarrassed

941
00:33:28,332 --> 00:33:30,718
what's the... That's something I said in conversation.

942
00:33:31,116 --> 00:33:32,468
And my husband looked at me and he's

943
00:33:32,468 --> 00:33:32,627
like,

944
00:33:33,598 --> 00:33:35,591
when you say stupid things, it's you being

945
00:33:35,591 --> 00:33:38,062
vulnerable. Like, you're... The real you is showing

946
00:33:38,062 --> 00:33:40,135
up. You're not managing every word that comes

947
00:33:40,135 --> 00:33:41,570
out of your mouth, and that's a good

948
00:33:41,570 --> 00:33:43,904
thing. And he was kinda there to coach

949
00:33:43,904 --> 00:33:46,785
me that, yeah, you're gonna feel uncomfortable because

950
00:33:46,785 --> 00:33:48,704
you're being vulnerable in the way you haven't

951
00:33:48,704 --> 00:33:50,384
before. You're building these relationships.

952
00:33:51,119 --> 00:33:53,751
And you know, new people and get to

953
00:33:53,751 --> 00:33:55,745
say the stupid things and hope they still,

954
00:33:55,825 --> 00:33:57,500
you know, are interested in hanging out with

955
00:33:57,500 --> 00:33:59,675
me. And we've built some really wonderful

956
00:34:00,132 --> 00:34:02,545
relationships, but it's often driving home. I'm like,

957
00:34:02,705 --> 00:34:03,184
oh, man.

958
00:34:03,825 --> 00:34:04,785
I don't know if I can go back.

959
00:34:05,345 --> 00:34:07,664
So learning how to be vulnerable, Yeah, It's

960
00:34:07,664 --> 00:34:10,304
gonna be uncomfortable and probably continue to be.

961
00:34:11,276 --> 00:34:13,105
It is and it's hard because, like, when

962
00:34:13,105 --> 00:34:16,047
you're vulnerable and someone doesn't like you,

963
00:34:16,684 --> 00:34:19,803
then they really don't like you, Right? And

964
00:34:19,803 --> 00:34:22,197
that's hard to take. Whereas when you're not

965
00:34:22,197 --> 00:34:23,634
really yourself, and they don't like you, You

966
00:34:23,634 --> 00:34:25,150
can be, like, whatever, you know what I

967
00:34:25,150 --> 00:34:27,066
mean, They don't... They're even really know me.

968
00:34:27,305 --> 00:34:27,465
Right?

969
00:34:28,197 --> 00:34:30,268
And so... And I think that's 1 of

970
00:34:30,268 --> 00:34:32,520
the things that's so hard because our art

971
00:34:33,613 --> 00:34:36,241
is it shouldn't be us, but it is

972
00:34:36,241 --> 00:34:38,089
us. You know what I mean? What you

973
00:34:38,089 --> 00:34:40,082
make is such a representation of who you

974
00:34:40,082 --> 00:34:42,315
are, your perspective on the world your point

975
00:34:42,315 --> 00:34:44,148
of view, like, what you're thinking about, your

976
00:34:44,148 --> 00:34:46,555
hopes, your dreams, like, it just is. And

977
00:34:46,555 --> 00:34:47,454
so when someone

978
00:34:48,390 --> 00:34:50,326
rejects that, it can feel

979
00:34:50,862 --> 00:34:53,414
very much like a rejection of you, especially

980
00:34:53,414 --> 00:34:55,425
if you're being all the way open. On

981
00:34:55,425 --> 00:34:56,784
the other hand, I have to say, like,

982
00:34:57,105 --> 00:34:57,585
I think,

983
00:34:58,625 --> 00:34:59,824
I kinda say great.

984
00:35:00,625 --> 00:35:02,085
Like mean by that

985
00:35:02,465 --> 00:35:02,965
is,

986
00:35:03,265 --> 00:35:03,960
like, but

987
00:35:05,677 --> 00:35:06,817
I don't think

988
00:35:07,196 --> 00:35:09,514
that, for instance, you should have to chase

989
00:35:09,514 --> 00:35:12,231
somebody to tell them why dating you is

990
00:35:12,231 --> 00:35:13,030
a good idea.

991
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:16,704
Yep. Right? Like, either if they're like, oh,

992
00:35:16,943 --> 00:35:18,614
yeah. And the same with the friendship. Like,

993
00:35:18,852 --> 00:35:20,617
I don't think you have to list off

994
00:35:20,617 --> 00:35:22,447
for somebody. These are my good qualities and

995
00:35:22,447 --> 00:35:23,799
why I should be my friend. Like, either

996
00:35:23,799 --> 00:35:25,390
they like you and they vibe with you

997
00:35:25,390 --> 00:35:27,713
or they don't. And that's, like that's fine.

998
00:35:27,953 --> 00:35:30,347
That's their choice. Yeah. Do it. And so

999
00:35:30,347 --> 00:35:31,783
the same thing is true I think with

1000
00:35:31,783 --> 00:35:33,938
your art, which is, like, it's okay for

1001
00:35:33,938 --> 00:35:35,868
people not to like your art. Like, that's

1002
00:35:35,868 --> 00:35:38,183
normal. Yeah. If everybody likes your art is

1003
00:35:38,183 --> 00:35:40,099
probably very middle of the road.

1004
00:35:40,737 --> 00:35:43,052
You know? Don't... Yeah. Don't you think that,

1005
00:35:43,212 --> 00:35:45,064
like, when we're trying... So hard to make

1006
00:35:45,064 --> 00:35:47,461
art that kind of is approved by everyone.

1007
00:35:48,420 --> 00:35:51,217
Then it's more the rejection stings more because

1008
00:35:51,217 --> 00:35:52,495
you're like, I tried it's so hard to

1009
00:35:52,495 --> 00:35:54,739
please you. But for me, I'm learning that

1010
00:35:54,898 --> 00:35:57,679
I'm making art now to please myself.

1011
00:35:58,394 --> 00:35:59,903
I was teaching in Santa Fe this spring,

1012
00:36:00,062 --> 00:36:01,175
and III

1013
00:36:01,175 --> 00:36:03,649
don't paint people, and I don't paint urban

1014
00:36:03,649 --> 00:36:05,710
scenes, and I've been pushing myself a little

1015
00:36:05,710 --> 00:36:07,217
bit in that way. And so we're in

1016
00:36:07,217 --> 00:36:08,327
the San fe Plaza,

1017
00:36:08,802 --> 00:36:09,540
and I'm

1018
00:36:10,168 --> 00:36:11,045
drawing painting,

1019
00:36:11,603 --> 00:36:13,677
1 of the buildings there. And I had

1020
00:36:13,677 --> 00:36:15,273
a little line in the corner by the

1021
00:36:15,273 --> 00:36:16,628
building, and I'm like, that kinda it looks

1022
00:36:16,628 --> 00:36:17,506
like a pair of legs.

1023
00:36:18,144 --> 00:36:19,122
And so I

1024
00:36:19,833 --> 00:36:21,658
drew a person. I'm like, let's put a

1025
00:36:21,658 --> 00:36:23,722
person in there, and I drew... Like, it

1026
00:36:23,722 --> 00:36:26,126
was a stick figure with the potato body

1027
00:36:26,182 --> 00:36:29,140
and it made me so happy. I because

1028
00:36:29,140 --> 00:36:30,579
it was exactly the same way I would

1029
00:36:30,579 --> 00:36:32,340
have drawn children I was 2 years old.

1030
00:36:32,980 --> 00:36:33,380
And

1031
00:36:34,179 --> 00:36:36,260
so it just felt like a little joke

1032
00:36:36,260 --> 00:36:38,511
to myself that here. I put a person

1033
00:36:38,511 --> 00:36:40,186
in and it's a little stick figure with

1034
00:36:40,186 --> 00:36:41,702
the potato body, and I like him so

1035
00:36:41,702 --> 00:36:43,695
much. I'm gonna give him a friend, and

1036
00:36:43,855 --> 00:36:45,211
I'm gonna make them hold hands and now

1037
00:36:45,291 --> 00:36:47,699
I have a love story. And that was

1038
00:36:47,699 --> 00:36:50,170
the... I was so happy with that because

1039
00:36:50,170 --> 00:36:52,243
it was just so silly. It was my

1040
00:36:52,243 --> 00:36:52,562
story.

1041
00:36:53,439 --> 00:36:55,751
It was personal to me, and whether anybody

1042
00:36:55,751 --> 00:36:57,202
are... Liked it or not.

1043
00:36:58,319 --> 00:37:00,155
There was such a... You know, is such

1044
00:37:00,155 --> 00:37:02,331
a full circle moment and

1045
00:37:02,949 --> 00:37:05,672
and that permission to just have that little

1046
00:37:05,672 --> 00:37:07,499
bit of fun with the painting. I ended

1047
00:37:07,499 --> 00:37:09,166
up selling it at the workshop. So other

1048
00:37:09,166 --> 00:37:10,993
people did like it too, but I think

1049
00:37:10,993 --> 00:37:13,710
that's what came alive was that this is

1050
00:37:13,710 --> 00:37:16,259
relational. It's me talking to myself, and, oh,

1051
00:37:16,418 --> 00:37:18,750
this is just silly enough to work. And,

1052
00:37:19,046 --> 00:37:20,958
you know, that was just really special. And,

1053
00:37:21,117 --> 00:37:21,276
yeah,

1054
00:37:22,403 --> 00:37:22,562
it's...

1055
00:37:23,355 --> 00:37:25,099
And it it was so personal.

1056
00:37:26,367 --> 00:37:28,983
And yet somehow, that was what made the

1057
00:37:28,983 --> 00:37:31,150
connection happen. In between me and and, yeah,

1058
00:37:31,230 --> 00:37:33,625
other people kind of watching that demo and

1059
00:37:33,704 --> 00:37:35,780
Yeah. I don't know. It's pretty close to

1060
00:37:35,780 --> 00:37:37,535
like, the other side of white people. Right?

1061
00:37:38,188 --> 00:37:40,102
Right. I was gonna say speaking the fact

1062
00:37:40,102 --> 00:37:41,538
that you don't... Use and you don't do

1063
00:37:41,538 --> 00:37:43,292
urban and you don't do people. I know

1064
00:37:43,292 --> 00:37:44,409
that you said that,

1065
00:37:44,967 --> 00:37:48,172
in your bile that nature informs both your

1066
00:37:48,172 --> 00:37:49,550
subject in your process.

1067
00:37:50,166 --> 00:37:52,023
So are you a

1068
00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:54,968
Hike? Are you a, like, walk out, are

1069
00:37:54,968 --> 00:37:56,643
you a look her through the window? Like,

1070
00:37:56,882 --> 00:37:58,955
you know, what kind of what kind of

1071
00:37:58,955 --> 00:37:59,455
nature

1072
00:37:59,832 --> 00:38:01,028
fan are you? Yeah.

1073
00:38:01,985 --> 00:38:04,073
When I was 2 months old, I was

1074
00:38:04,073 --> 00:38:06,147
born in this area. My mom put me

1075
00:38:06,147 --> 00:38:08,061
in a backpack and they hike down to

1076
00:38:08,061 --> 00:38:08,779
the Peace River,

1077
00:38:09,417 --> 00:38:10,693
and I slept the whole way there and

1078
00:38:10,693 --> 00:38:13,539
back apparently. But my earliest memories are

1079
00:38:13,977 --> 00:38:15,568
being in the forest with family,

1080
00:38:16,045 --> 00:38:18,352
my grandma picked wild strawberries, we had a

1081
00:38:18,352 --> 00:38:19,943
little path that would go to their house.

1082
00:38:21,074 --> 00:38:22,675
And there was violence in the woods in

1083
00:38:22,675 --> 00:38:24,755
the spring. And so there was always that

1084
00:38:24,755 --> 00:38:25,494
sense of

1085
00:38:25,795 --> 00:38:28,114
walking in the forest and trying to find

1086
00:38:28,114 --> 00:38:30,849
stuff. Trying to find the wild strawberries or

1087
00:38:30,849 --> 00:38:34,369
whatever was bloom at the time. And now

1088
00:38:34,369 --> 00:38:36,289
we live on an acreage in Northern Bc,

1089
00:38:36,624 --> 00:38:39,253
and I have miles of trails that actually

1090
00:38:39,253 --> 00:38:41,643
connect to my backyard. So I do try

1091
00:38:41,643 --> 00:38:43,396
to hike, walk in the forest.

1092
00:38:44,048 --> 00:38:46,113
Couple times a week at least. And

1093
00:38:47,066 --> 00:38:48,893
yesterday, you know, we were wandering and out

1094
00:38:48,893 --> 00:38:50,481
of the corner on my eye. Saw something

1095
00:38:50,481 --> 00:38:52,546
white, and we went off the trail, my

1096
00:38:52,546 --> 00:38:53,102
dog and I.

1097
00:38:53,753 --> 00:38:56,935
And found some oyster mushrooms and the squirrels

1098
00:38:56,935 --> 00:38:58,446
had already been eating them, so I left

1099
00:38:58,446 --> 00:39:00,378
them for for the squirrels, but

1100
00:39:00,847 --> 00:39:03,629
there is that sense of, let's go ramble

1101
00:39:03,629 --> 00:39:06,172
around and keep our eyes peeled and see

1102
00:39:06,172 --> 00:39:06,729
what we see.

1103
00:39:07,365 --> 00:39:09,034
And, you know, every day is a little

1104
00:39:09,034 --> 00:39:09,431
different.

1105
00:39:09,923 --> 00:39:12,071
And you can kind of start to predict

1106
00:39:12,071 --> 00:39:14,458
the seasons based on, you know, the the

1107
00:39:14,458 --> 00:39:16,287
small bits of knowledge that accumulate.

1108
00:39:17,097 --> 00:39:19,562
And I like that. There's something very open

1109
00:39:19,562 --> 00:39:21,868
ended about it. And I think it is

1110
00:39:21,868 --> 00:39:24,730
mirrored in my art practice because I'll start

1111
00:39:24,730 --> 00:39:26,105
a painting and

1112
00:39:26,655 --> 00:39:28,974
kinda see where it goes and hope to

1113
00:39:28,974 --> 00:39:31,454
discover or notice something special or beautiful.

1114
00:39:32,094 --> 00:39:33,934
And, you know, maybe bring that to light,

1115
00:39:34,094 --> 00:39:35,375
maybe uncover it a little bit.

1116
00:39:36,028 --> 00:39:37,545
And so I think there is an ethic

1117
00:39:37,545 --> 00:39:40,280
there that it's very much mirrored in my

1118
00:39:40,578 --> 00:39:41,695
in my painting practice.

1119
00:39:42,254 --> 00:39:44,743
And I hope that regardless of subject because

1120
00:39:44,743 --> 00:39:46,499
when I travel, you know, I, I don't

1121
00:39:46,499 --> 00:39:48,734
always get to choose what what I'm looking

1122
00:39:48,734 --> 00:39:49,373
at and painting.

1123
00:39:50,012 --> 00:39:52,566
But I think always there's that idea of

1124
00:39:52,566 --> 00:39:53,066
what's

1125
00:39:53,459 --> 00:39:54,976
what's small enough to notice?

1126
00:39:55,694 --> 00:39:58,168
And and how do we linger there? Yeah.

1127
00:39:58,967 --> 00:40:01,063
I love that. I'm reading this step. What's

1128
00:40:01,441 --> 00:40:02,135
small enough

1129
00:40:02,815 --> 00:40:04,894
to notice. Oh like that down too.

1130
00:40:07,215 --> 00:40:09,054
Yeah. Well the reason I like that so

1131
00:40:09,054 --> 00:40:11,863
much is because I think that so often,

1132
00:40:12,022 --> 00:40:14,083
we think about more along the lines of

1133
00:40:14,083 --> 00:40:16,541
what's big enough to attract Know. Yeah. You

1134
00:40:16,541 --> 00:40:18,626
know what Mean. And it's like you're

1135
00:40:19,094 --> 00:40:21,083
And but what's small enough to attract my

1136
00:40:21,083 --> 00:40:23,414
nose is a wonderful way to think about

1137
00:40:23,869 --> 00:40:24,347
looking.

1138
00:40:24,825 --> 00:40:27,861
I... With my son, I... We go outside

1139
00:40:27,861 --> 00:40:29,051
a lot. I mean, I live in an

1140
00:40:29,051 --> 00:40:32,145
urban area. So Yeah. Our version of outdoors

1141
00:40:32,145 --> 00:40:34,543
to, like, houses sidewalk, whatever. But we've spend

1142
00:40:34,543 --> 00:40:36,218
a lot of times talking about, like, what

1143
00:40:36,218 --> 00:40:39,329
are you observe it? What are you seeing?

1144
00:40:39,489 --> 00:40:43,747
And like, you know, I'm always delighted when

1145
00:40:44,121 --> 00:40:47,700
he, you know, find some little thing that

1146
00:40:47,939 --> 00:40:50,023
you know, I didn't see or find some

1147
00:40:50,023 --> 00:40:52,256
little animal whatever it is. It it's it's

1148
00:40:52,256 --> 00:40:54,090
an exciting game, And I think it's a

1149
00:40:54,090 --> 00:40:56,324
wonderful way to walk through life, and it

1150
00:40:56,324 --> 00:40:57,760
goes back to that idea. I think we

1151
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:59,296
were talking about earlier about

1152
00:40:59,689 --> 00:41:01,687
what is sort of an artist's mindset? Like,

1153
00:41:01,847 --> 00:41:03,865
what does that mean? And I think maybe

1154
00:41:04,883 --> 00:41:08,092
being really observe and looking for things. To

1155
00:41:08,092 --> 00:41:09,602
notice is part of that.

1156
00:41:10,635 --> 00:41:12,621
Yeah. I think there's a sense of,

1157
00:41:14,210 --> 00:41:15,958
get your head up, I had...

1158
00:41:17,006 --> 00:41:19,073
Someone I cared about who was struggling with

1159
00:41:19,073 --> 00:41:21,298
depression, and it was a very inward, like,

1160
00:41:21,378 --> 00:41:23,285
the head was down, and it was like,

1161
00:41:23,524 --> 00:41:25,431
maybe if you lifted your gaze a little

1162
00:41:25,431 --> 00:41:27,431
bit. There would be a little more freedom

1163
00:41:27,431 --> 00:41:29,097
there. And you know,

1164
00:41:29,811 --> 00:41:32,510
there's there's... That's a long conversation, but there

1165
00:41:32,510 --> 00:41:34,985
was that sense of how do I... Encourage

1166
00:41:34,985 --> 00:41:36,042
you to look

1167
00:41:36,576 --> 00:41:37,076
beyond

1168
00:41:37,530 --> 00:41:39,620
just the current situation. And

1169
00:41:39,994 --> 00:41:41,824
and I try to do that for myself

1170
00:41:41,824 --> 00:41:42,721
too. But

1171
00:41:44,303 --> 00:41:46,687
being looking for something small enough to notice

1172
00:41:46,687 --> 00:41:48,833
also is a way of if... I think

1173
00:41:48,833 --> 00:41:51,398
it's app of a life affirming because

1174
00:41:51,947 --> 00:41:55,047
we often feel pretty small and insignificant and,

1175
00:41:56,081 --> 00:41:58,012
you know, my little art practice,

1176
00:41:58,625 --> 00:41:58,942
of,

1177
00:41:59,817 --> 00:42:00,794
maybe isn't

1178
00:42:01,104 --> 00:42:04,525
you know, making a splash worldwide or maybe

1179
00:42:04,604 --> 00:42:06,513
I'm not getting in the shows I wanna

1180
00:42:06,513 --> 00:42:08,674
get into or selling the painting, paintings I

1181
00:42:08,674 --> 00:42:11,214
wanna sell, but maybe in this small place,

1182
00:42:12,484 --> 00:42:15,286
it's doing something really significant. And

1183
00:42:15,977 --> 00:42:18,458
I believe that, Well, I I think that

1184
00:42:18,458 --> 00:42:18,958
always,

1185
00:42:19,574 --> 00:42:22,043
your our practice is doing something very significant

1186
00:42:22,043 --> 00:42:25,150
for you. You know? And, like, that's enough.

1187
00:42:25,867 --> 00:42:26,106
Yep.

1188
00:42:26,998 --> 00:42:27,897
Exactly and

1189
00:42:28,275 --> 00:42:29,391
be enough. Yeah.

1190
00:42:30,428 --> 00:42:32,502
And I think that's that's the other thing

1191
00:42:32,581 --> 00:42:33,858
I think we have a tendency to do.

1192
00:42:34,017 --> 00:42:35,213
And I don't know if it's the social

1193
00:42:35,213 --> 00:42:36,511
media era, but

1194
00:42:37,062 --> 00:42:39,931
we all want to make our our struggle

1195
00:42:39,931 --> 00:42:42,242
whatever we're dealing with right now. We kinda

1196
00:42:42,242 --> 00:42:44,791
wanna make it productive. We wanna see it

1197
00:42:44,791 --> 00:42:46,168
produce something we wanna

1198
00:42:46,639 --> 00:42:48,891
have, you know, turn it into

1199
00:42:49,984 --> 00:42:51,041
a way to,

1200
00:42:51,657 --> 00:42:53,250
I don't know, get our wisdom devoted into

1201
00:42:53,250 --> 00:42:54,843
the world or whatever it is.

1202
00:42:55,893 --> 00:42:56,293
And

1203
00:42:56,851 --> 00:42:59,005
and we'd rather do that than actually kind

1204
00:42:59,005 --> 00:43:00,121
of sit with it,

1205
00:43:00,839 --> 00:43:01,237
and

1206
00:43:02,195 --> 00:43:04,428
there needs to be that place where. I'm

1207
00:43:04,428 --> 00:43:05,599
gonna sit with this

1208
00:43:06,116 --> 00:43:07,569
situation. I'm gonna

1209
00:43:08,102 --> 00:43:10,564
get quiet in my studio and and just

1210
00:43:10,564 --> 00:43:13,503
be in my situation. Rather than thinking that

1211
00:43:13,583 --> 00:43:15,251
I would immediately need to make this productive.

1212
00:43:15,505 --> 00:43:15,982
In some way.

1213
00:43:16,936 --> 00:43:19,164
It's so interesting because I think, like, this

1214
00:43:19,164 --> 00:43:22,130
to me is related out to, like, fast

1215
00:43:22,186 --> 00:43:24,035
fast in or, like, the way that we

1216
00:43:24,035 --> 00:43:27,146
can communicate so quickly. So it's like, you...

1217
00:43:27,465 --> 00:43:29,458
People know that you can text them, email

1218
00:43:29,458 --> 00:43:31,134
them call them, like, whatever. And it's, like,

1219
00:43:31,612 --> 00:43:32,112
it's

1220
00:43:33,061 --> 00:43:35,130
it doesn't give you the time to sort

1221
00:43:35,130 --> 00:43:37,518
of process to think about it, you know,

1222
00:43:37,677 --> 00:43:39,348
in the old in the olden days,

1223
00:43:40,237 --> 00:43:42,008
when I was a little girl, you were

1224
00:43:42,381 --> 00:43:44,843
to, like, you know, take the time. Write

1225
00:43:44,843 --> 00:43:46,510
the letter find the address walks in the

1226
00:43:46,510 --> 00:43:47,994
mailbox, like, you know what I mean? And

1227
00:43:48,194 --> 00:43:49,313
wanna give you some times you'd be like,

1228
00:43:49,553 --> 00:43:52,349
okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Let's relax. Yeah. I

1229
00:43:52,349 --> 00:43:55,065
really wanna, you know, do this. And and

1230
00:43:55,225 --> 00:43:57,236
I think that there so many things that

1231
00:43:57,396 --> 00:43:58,614
I love about modern

1232
00:43:59,311 --> 00:44:01,227
society, but are there so many times when

1233
00:44:01,307 --> 00:44:03,462
I'm like, I do think we have lost

1234
00:44:03,462 --> 00:44:05,795
the ability to sit in things. I mean,

1235
00:44:05,875 --> 00:44:07,574
this is also an iteration

1236
00:44:07,875 --> 00:44:09,414
thing too, which is

1237
00:44:10,675 --> 00:44:12,924
as an artist you sometimes need to sit

1238
00:44:12,924 --> 00:44:15,391
it to have that deeper conversation. You sometimes

1239
00:44:15,391 --> 00:44:16,608
need to just like

1240
00:44:17,302 --> 00:44:17,802
dwell

1241
00:44:18,336 --> 00:44:21,952
with an idea, tang through something that complicated,

1242
00:44:22,404 --> 00:44:23,674
know what I mean to try to get

1243
00:44:23,674 --> 00:44:25,262
to something good. And you you probably have

1244
00:44:25,262 --> 00:44:27,009
to generate a lot of crap,

1245
00:44:27,739 --> 00:44:29,672
you know, Know, to get to something

1246
00:44:30,047 --> 00:44:32,118
that again is really good, But there's a

1247
00:44:32,118 --> 00:44:32,436
very,

1248
00:44:32,994 --> 00:44:35,564
1 of the performative things about social media

1249
00:44:35,780 --> 00:44:37,781
or, and having a newsletter and doing this

1250
00:44:37,860 --> 00:44:39,313
And all that kind of stuff is that

1251
00:44:39,687 --> 00:44:42,887
you kind of have to be continually producing

1252
00:44:43,181 --> 00:44:43,681
something

1253
00:44:44,307 --> 00:44:45,523
that is at least mediocre

1254
00:44:46,612 --> 00:44:48,360
because as much as people say they want

1255
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:49,790
to see the failures and they wanna see

1256
00:44:49,790 --> 00:44:51,697
the bad things, They don't really wanna see

1257
00:44:51,697 --> 00:44:52,412
it a lot.

1258
00:44:52,984 --> 00:44:54,898
They want... In order for them to trust

1259
00:44:54,898 --> 00:44:56,972
you and to feel. They wanna see a

1260
00:44:56,972 --> 00:45:00,003
lot of success. Yeah. They wanna see that

1261
00:45:00,003 --> 00:45:00,503
you've

1262
00:45:01,039 --> 00:45:03,605
overcome all the things. Yeah. Yes. So that's

1263
00:45:03,605 --> 00:45:04,003
interesting.

1264
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:06,469
I have noticed that, you know, I get

1265
00:45:06,469 --> 00:45:08,219
emails. I get a lot of emails, and

1266
00:45:08,695 --> 00:45:11,097
that's 1 thing I've... Encourage. I have I

1267
00:45:11,097 --> 00:45:12,529
have an assistant to kind of filter through

1268
00:45:12,529 --> 00:45:14,518
it because I I will get sucked into

1269
00:45:14,518 --> 00:45:16,347
trying to reply to everything, But that was

1270
00:45:16,347 --> 00:45:18,279
1 thing we talked about is that sometimes

1271
00:45:18,828 --> 00:45:20,340
the easiest thing in the world is to

1272
00:45:20,340 --> 00:45:22,408
send that email and say, So how do

1273
00:45:22,408 --> 00:45:24,396
you do such and such? How what, you

1274
00:45:24,396 --> 00:45:26,482
know, I wanna get started with doing this

1275
00:45:26,482 --> 00:45:28,236
thing that I see you doing? And so

1276
00:45:28,236 --> 00:45:30,070
can you get me started? And a lot

1277
00:45:30,070 --> 00:45:32,383
of times it's like, actually, a Google search

1278
00:45:32,383 --> 00:45:33,760
would advance through that question?

1279
00:45:35,349 --> 00:45:37,582
A little bit of research, and that's not

1280
00:45:37,582 --> 00:45:39,177
my job to do that for you, so

1281
00:45:39,257 --> 00:45:42,048
I've actually really pulled back from... I've... Because

1282
00:45:42,208 --> 00:45:43,564
I want people to do the work. I

1283
00:45:43,564 --> 00:45:46,310
want them to know how it's feels to

1284
00:45:46,764 --> 00:45:48,989
to have that light bulb moment to see

1285
00:45:48,989 --> 00:45:51,158
what it produces for them. That's

1286
00:45:51,691 --> 00:45:53,836
been such a rewarding thing for me. I

1287
00:45:53,836 --> 00:45:56,312
wouldn't want to rob somebody of that because,

1288
00:45:56,471 --> 00:45:57,423
you know, they're gonna...

1289
00:45:58,375 --> 00:45:59,883
You know, I I love sharing what I

1290
00:45:59,883 --> 00:46:01,970
know. But at the same time, there's that

1291
00:46:02,025 --> 00:46:03,153
idea of you...

1292
00:46:03,951 --> 00:46:06,025
Where is your... How are you committing to

1293
00:46:06,025 --> 00:46:07,380
the to the path you're choosing?

1294
00:46:08,338 --> 00:46:10,651
Right. Well, it's also the old. I am

1295
00:46:10,651 --> 00:46:11,927
a great believer, and this is part of

1296
00:46:11,927 --> 00:46:13,933
my teaching philosophy v too in that old

1297
00:46:13,933 --> 00:46:16,081
adage, if you give a man sheets for

1298
00:46:16,081 --> 00:46:18,228
a day. If you teach them man sheets,

1299
00:46:18,467 --> 00:46:21,026
for a lifetime. Right? And so I am

1300
00:46:21,026 --> 00:46:24,600
very guilty of when students ask me or

1301
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:26,745
even when my child asked me, frankly, a

1302
00:46:26,745 --> 00:46:29,048
question of parenting right back. Well, what do

1303
00:46:29,048 --> 00:46:29,367
you think?

1304
00:46:30,098 --> 00:46:32,012
What happened when you tried it. Like, you

1305
00:46:32,012 --> 00:46:33,927
know, all those kinds of things because I

1306
00:46:33,927 --> 00:46:36,022
do think that as frustrating

1307
00:46:36,399 --> 00:46:38,313
as it can be because we want answers,

1308
00:46:38,473 --> 00:46:40,239
and I get guilty of less too, you

1309
00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:42,302
know, I've screamed at my computer more than

1310
00:46:42,302 --> 00:46:43,492
once? Well, I long don't you just tell

1311
00:46:43,492 --> 00:46:44,445
me the answer of this.

1312
00:46:45,714 --> 00:46:47,483
But it's like you

1313
00:46:48,015 --> 00:46:51,296
too the discovery, the path of discovery helps

1314
00:46:51,296 --> 00:46:52,514
you so much

1315
00:46:52,969 --> 00:46:57,362
in really understanding concepts, in really understanding ideas

1316
00:46:57,362 --> 00:46:59,508
and also in finding your own way into

1317
00:46:59,508 --> 00:46:59,746
it.

1318
00:47:00,461 --> 00:47:01,415
Exactly. Yeah.

1319
00:47:02,289 --> 00:47:02,449
Yeah.

1320
00:47:03,258 --> 00:47:06,036
And I've I've experienced that. For years, I

1321
00:47:06,036 --> 00:47:06,774
would read

1322
00:47:07,226 --> 00:47:09,130
artist interviews, and they would say in order

1323
00:47:09,130 --> 00:47:10,559
to be a great artist, you need to

1324
00:47:10,559 --> 00:47:12,881
do section such. And to me it felt

1325
00:47:12,881 --> 00:47:14,556
like gate keeping because I'm like well, I

1326
00:47:14,556 --> 00:47:15,274
don't know how to do that.

1327
00:47:16,311 --> 00:47:18,704
But I kept painting, and in the process,

1328
00:47:18,863 --> 00:47:21,197
I realized, oh, what they were articulating,

1329
00:47:22,146 --> 00:47:25,004
is actually something that's inevitably gonna happen when

1330
00:47:25,004 --> 00:47:27,386
you make that commitment to make your art.

1331
00:47:27,783 --> 00:47:30,664
It's... You inevitably learn how to

1332
00:47:31,215 --> 00:47:32,894
draw, but you learn how to do it

1333
00:47:32,894 --> 00:47:33,454
your way.

1334
00:47:34,175 --> 00:47:35,855
And I learned to draw, like a painter

1335
00:47:35,855 --> 00:47:37,775
would draw, not like a pencil artist, which

1336
00:47:37,775 --> 00:47:39,630
is what I would here when they would

1337
00:47:39,630 --> 00:47:40,750
say you need to know how to draw.

1338
00:47:41,150 --> 00:47:42,849
And so, you know, learning

1339
00:47:43,230 --> 00:47:43,889
kind of

1340
00:47:44,269 --> 00:47:45,889
kind of ignoring the advice

1341
00:47:47,396 --> 00:47:50,173
and yet still continuing to do the art,

1342
00:47:50,729 --> 00:47:52,395
was was a way of learning that for

1343
00:47:52,395 --> 00:47:53,586
me. And

1344
00:47:54,062 --> 00:47:56,545
so that was So it's interesting because that

1345
00:47:56,545 --> 00:47:57,603
piece of advice

1346
00:47:57,981 --> 00:47:58,778
sounds helpful,

1347
00:47:59,336 --> 00:48:01,410
and yet, I had to learn it for

1348
00:48:01,410 --> 00:48:01,650
myself,

1349
00:48:02,447 --> 00:48:04,122
and I would... And I heard it wrong

1350
00:48:04,122 --> 00:48:06,454
for all those years. So... Yeah. It's kinda

1351
00:48:06,454 --> 00:48:06,775
interesting.

1352
00:48:07,575 --> 00:48:08,635
That is interesting.

1353
00:48:09,335 --> 00:48:12,135
I think there's probably advice all the time

1354
00:48:12,135 --> 00:48:14,548
that I get that I'm mis hearing And

1355
00:48:14,548 --> 00:48:16,934
that later I'm, like, 000,

1356
00:48:17,094 --> 00:48:18,525
okay. Yeah. I guess I feel like I

1357
00:48:18,525 --> 00:48:20,195
was here back words. Yeah.

1358
00:48:20,832 --> 00:48:22,437
Yeah. Yeah. Get. I need to get out

1359
00:48:22,437 --> 00:48:23,869
of my own way. That's my... I I'd...

1360
00:48:24,027 --> 00:48:25,697
Should get a t shirt that just says

1361
00:48:25,697 --> 00:48:27,526
that. I need to have of my own

1362
00:48:27,526 --> 00:48:27,685
way.

1363
00:48:29,690 --> 00:48:31,530
So before we wrap up, I just wanted

1364
00:48:31,530 --> 00:48:33,130
to say, 1 of the things I like

1365
00:48:33,130 --> 00:48:34,510
that you said

1366
00:48:35,449 --> 00:48:37,769
in... I... I, when I was asking you

1367
00:48:37,769 --> 00:48:40,099
some, you know, pre interview questions here. As

1368
00:48:40,099 --> 00:48:42,331
you said, art offers me a space to

1369
00:48:42,331 --> 00:48:44,744
create a world that is only limited

1370
00:48:45,121 --> 00:48:45,860
by my

1371
00:48:46,237 --> 00:48:46,476
imagination.

1372
00:48:47,128 --> 00:48:49,757
And since you do create work so closely

1373
00:48:49,757 --> 00:48:51,271
tied to nature and you are, so interested

1374
00:48:51,271 --> 00:48:52,227
understood in nature, I'm,

1375
00:48:53,103 --> 00:48:55,431
interested in just hearing a little bit about,

1376
00:48:55,511 --> 00:48:57,825
you know, how closely do you try to

1377
00:48:57,825 --> 00:49:00,219
huge to what you see versus what you're

1378
00:49:00,219 --> 00:49:01,256
sort of dreaming of?

1379
00:49:02,390 --> 00:49:04,250
Yeah. Yeah. I think

1380
00:49:04,710 --> 00:49:06,390
I think I think of it like,

1381
00:49:07,269 --> 00:49:08,489
like, when you're dreaming

1382
00:49:08,789 --> 00:49:11,363
because when we're dreaming nothing's flushed out. You

1383
00:49:11,363 --> 00:49:13,215
know, we know that we were in a

1384
00:49:13,271 --> 00:49:15,657
in this place, so these people were there

1385
00:49:15,657 --> 00:49:18,360
and yet, somehow they had someone else's face

1386
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:20,667
or, you know, everything's kind of mashed together.

1387
00:49:21,318 --> 00:49:23,549
And so there's not that a bill. It's

1388
00:49:23,549 --> 00:49:25,462
it's kind of a ep, and it's kind

1389
00:49:25,462 --> 00:49:26,440
of poetic.

1390
00:49:27,055 --> 00:49:29,706
And so I like to think about

1391
00:49:31,293 --> 00:49:32,724
I tend to be very literal in my

1392
00:49:32,724 --> 00:49:34,155
first iterations. And so...

1393
00:49:35,188 --> 00:49:36,619
And there's a place for that, You know,

1394
00:49:36,938 --> 00:49:38,687
my plan air practice is pretty literal.

1395
00:49:39,260 --> 00:49:39,760
And

1396
00:49:40,300 --> 00:49:42,940
and yet, there comes up a time when

1397
00:49:42,940 --> 00:49:43,500
it's, like,

1398
00:49:44,380 --> 00:49:45,519
in this process

1399
00:49:45,900 --> 00:49:48,547
of painting the same subject over and over

1400
00:49:48,547 --> 00:49:50,142
again and yet letting go of it a

1401
00:49:50,142 --> 00:49:52,454
little bit each time. There's a part where

1402
00:49:52,454 --> 00:49:53,890
you kind of get to the poetry of

1403
00:49:53,890 --> 00:49:55,460
the subject. And I'd like to think the

1404
00:49:55,659 --> 00:49:58,522
that's what I'm attempting to do is find

1405
00:49:58,522 --> 00:50:00,295
a way of capturing

1406
00:50:02,754 --> 00:50:04,507
share... Or not even capturing because I don't

1407
00:50:04,507 --> 00:50:06,500
like that word capturing. But sharing,

1408
00:50:07,137 --> 00:50:08,572
expressing my love for,

1409
00:50:09,369 --> 00:50:10,108
my subject,

1410
00:50:10,977 --> 00:50:13,763
that moment of fascination where time fell away,

1411
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:15,378
I think when you're

1412
00:50:15,753 --> 00:50:17,026
when your president and beauty,

1413
00:50:17,504 --> 00:50:19,096
you kind of lose... It it kind of

1414
00:50:19,096 --> 00:50:20,051
lives outside of time.

1415
00:50:20,864 --> 00:50:21,343
And

1416
00:50:21,743 --> 00:50:24,161
so I... But I get to try to

1417
00:50:25,419 --> 00:50:27,097
talk about those things without words,

1418
00:50:27,976 --> 00:50:28,375
and

1419
00:50:29,989 --> 00:50:31,670
And I and I never know how well

1420
00:50:31,829 --> 00:50:33,510
I'm doing it. You know, that's... I I

1421
00:50:33,510 --> 00:50:35,510
hopefully I'd hit something that resonates for me.

1422
00:50:36,563 --> 00:50:38,398
And what other c, you know, if that's

1423
00:50:38,398 --> 00:50:40,312
kind of on them. And so,

1424
00:50:41,030 --> 00:50:43,104
in fact, there's kind of a 3 phase

1425
00:50:43,104 --> 00:50:45,337
process behind my head right now here in

1426
00:50:45,337 --> 00:50:45,816
the studio,

1427
00:50:46,546 --> 00:50:48,530
on this side, we've got something from a

1428
00:50:48,530 --> 00:50:50,592
few years ago, and it's letting go of

1429
00:50:50,592 --> 00:50:52,734
a lot of detail to Paint Mountain forest

1430
00:50:52,734 --> 00:50:54,495
team. And then in the middle,

1431
00:50:55,766 --> 00:50:58,172
there's another mountain, and the forest is kinda

1432
00:50:58,228 --> 00:51:00,532
disappeared, and they're on the far side, it's,

1433
00:51:00,611 --> 00:51:01,905
you know, it's it's monochromatic.

1434
00:51:02,517 --> 00:51:04,841
It's it's definitely a landscape? But we don't

1435
00:51:04,841 --> 00:51:07,868
know where it is? And and just did

1436
00:51:07,947 --> 00:51:09,961
I capture a remove? Did I share

1437
00:51:10,974 --> 00:51:12,824
a little bit of a little bit of

1438
00:51:12,824 --> 00:51:15,081
my love, and and really, that's

1439
00:51:15,859 --> 00:51:17,457
all I can really say.

1440
00:51:19,389 --> 00:51:21,384
Yeah. And and there's letting go of the

1441
00:51:21,384 --> 00:51:22,820
need for it to match anything,

1442
00:51:23,538 --> 00:51:25,772
to match my idea, to match my reference

1443
00:51:25,772 --> 00:51:26,171
photo,

1444
00:51:27,382 --> 00:51:29,936
or even to call the same story to

1445
00:51:29,936 --> 00:51:30,974
someone else's mind.

1446
00:51:32,012 --> 00:51:33,847
And so there's a lot of unknowns. And

1447
00:51:34,007 --> 00:51:35,780
I think we end up as as artists,

1448
00:51:35,940 --> 00:51:37,059
the deeper we get into this,

1449
00:51:37,619 --> 00:51:38,900
giant massive making art,

1450
00:51:39,699 --> 00:51:41,460
the more we just are living with the

1451
00:51:41,460 --> 00:51:42,579
whole bunch of questions.

1452
00:51:43,219 --> 00:51:43,719
And

1453
00:51:44,273 --> 00:51:46,504
and realizing just how how wonderful it is

1454
00:51:46,504 --> 00:51:48,257
to be able to ask them and kind

1455
00:51:48,257 --> 00:51:51,523
of play with different ideas and just see

1456
00:51:51,523 --> 00:51:52,956
see what what ends up happening.

1457
00:51:53,609 --> 00:51:54,009
I don't know.

1458
00:51:55,128 --> 00:51:57,066
Well, Angela, this has been such a wonderful

1459
00:51:57,684 --> 00:52:01,041
conversation. You're so intelligent and well spoken, and

1460
00:52:01,201 --> 00:52:03,052
I know you're a great teacher as well.

1461
00:52:03,291 --> 00:52:05,524
If people are interested in taking in class

1462
00:52:05,524 --> 00:52:07,996
with you or phone you online or signing

1463
00:52:07,996 --> 00:52:10,787
up for your fantastic newsletter, where can they

1464
00:52:10,787 --> 00:52:11,186
do that?

1465
00:52:12,318 --> 00:52:14,152
Fastest easiest way it's just to head over

1466
00:52:14,152 --> 00:52:16,705
to Angela fair dot com. I do have

1467
00:52:16,705 --> 00:52:17,365
a monthly

1468
00:52:17,902 --> 00:52:20,149
membership, which is kind of a, look over

1469
00:52:20,149 --> 00:52:21,923
my shoulder into my studio practice

1470
00:52:22,299 --> 00:52:24,927
and my process. So, it's it's kind of

1471
00:52:24,927 --> 00:52:26,759
a mentorship as as much as we can

1472
00:52:26,759 --> 00:52:29,409
do that online. In just opening up my

1473
00:52:29,409 --> 00:52:29,909
practices

1474
00:52:30,369 --> 00:52:32,789
as much as I can to kind of

1475
00:52:33,329 --> 00:52:35,570
dig into how how this all works, And

1476
00:52:35,570 --> 00:52:37,524
let's see if we can figure it So

1477
00:52:37,820 --> 00:52:40,052
that's all yeah, try it down at angela

1478
00:52:40,052 --> 00:52:40,530
fair dot com.

1479
00:52:41,724 --> 00:52:42,123
Awesome.

1480
00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:44,753
Well, if you wanna connect with me, you

1481
00:52:44,753 --> 00:52:47,159
can find me at julie vol dot com

1482
00:52:47,159 --> 00:52:49,813
or all over social media as at or

1483
00:52:49,872 --> 00:52:51,469
designs. And I hope you'll sign up for

1484
00:52:51,469 --> 00:52:53,224
my weekly newsletter at that's the best way

1485
00:52:53,224 --> 00:52:54,581
to keep make sure you keep up on

1486
00:52:54,581 --> 00:52:57,065
latest news. There's a big button on the

1487
00:52:57,065 --> 00:52:58,576
homepage of julie balls dot com where you

1488
00:52:58,576 --> 00:52:59,530
can do that or you can go to

1489
00:52:59,530 --> 00:53:01,440
the show page or for this podcast to

1490
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:04,010
find the link. As always, if you'd like

1491
00:53:04,010 --> 00:53:05,690
to help the show, you can leave a

1492
00:53:05,690 --> 00:53:07,930
review, mention us on social media or tell

1493
00:53:07,930 --> 00:53:08,410
a friend.

1494
00:53:09,050 --> 00:53:10,730
All of those things help other people find

1495
00:53:10,730 --> 00:53:12,998
the show. So thanks so much for listening

1496
00:53:13,055 --> 00:53:15,363
and subscribing, and thank you, Angela for your

1497
00:53:15,363 --> 00:53:17,989
time and your wisdom. I appreciate it. Well,

1498
00:53:18,148 --> 00:53:20,399
thank you, Julie. This was such a fun

1499
00:53:20,536 --> 00:53:21,267
conversation. Thank you.

1500
00:53:22,540 --> 00:53:24,052
And we'll see you the next time on

1501
00:53:24,052 --> 00:53:26,462
the Adventures art podcast.