1 00:00:01,000 --> 00:00:06,139 ♪ Opening theme music ♪ 2 00:00:13,747 --> 00:00:18,752 Hello, and welcome to this episode of ArtsAbly in Conversation. 3 00:00:18,752 --> 00:00:21,221 My name is Diane Kolin. 4 00:00:21,254 --> 00:00:26,826 This series presents artists, academics, and project leaders who dedicate their 5 00:00:26,860 --> 00:00:32,999 time and energy to a better accessibility for people with disabilities in the arts. 6 00:00:32,999 --> 00:00:38,271 You can find more of these conversations on our website, artsably.com 7 00:00:38,271 --> 00:00:43,476 which is spelled A-R-T-S-A-B-L-Y dot com. 8 00:00:44,878 --> 00:00:50,016 ♪ Theme music ♪ 9 00:00:57,624 --> 00:01:02,629 Today, ArtsAbly is in conversation with Alex Bulmer, a Canadian playwright 10 00:01:02,662 --> 00:01:08,968 and theatre artist working in theatre, film, radio, and education. 11 00:01:09,102 --> 00:01:13,406 You can find the resources mentioned by Alex Bulmer during this episode 12 00:01:13,406 --> 00:01:17,577 on ArtsAbly's website in the blog section. 13 00:01:18,411 --> 00:01:19,846 Hello, everybody. 14 00:01:19,879 --> 00:01:23,349 Welcome to this new episode of ArtsAbly in Conversation. 15 00:01:23,383 --> 00:01:29,756 Today, I'm with Alex Bulmer, who is a Canadian playwright and theatre artist, 16 00:01:29,789 --> 00:01:35,628 she works in theatre, she works in film, radio, she works also in education. 17 00:01:35,662 --> 00:01:39,399 She does thousands of things that we will discover today. 18 00:01:39,432 --> 00:01:42,102 Alex, welcome. Thank you for being here. 19 00:01:42,102 --> 00:01:44,871 Thank you so much. It's great to be with you. 20 00:01:45,305 --> 00:01:48,041 I would like to know a little bit more about yourself. 21 00:01:48,074 --> 00:01:54,481 Can you tell us about your background, how you started in theatre, everything that 22 00:01:55,148 --> 00:01:59,285 is part of your history as an artist? 23 00:01:59,619 --> 00:02:01,287 Sure thing. 24 00:02:01,454 --> 00:02:10,597 Well, I had all intention of being in the theatre or being an actor, I guess, 25 00:02:10,630 --> 00:02:13,333 from a very, very, very young age. 26 00:02:13,333 --> 00:02:15,368 I grew up sighted. 27 00:02:15,401 --> 00:02:21,674 I did not know I was going to be diagnosed with an eye condition. 28 00:02:21,708 --> 00:02:24,310 I had no idea. 29 00:02:24,310 --> 00:02:29,782 My ambitions were all coming from a sighted childhood. 30 00:02:30,683 --> 00:02:39,692 And I think that's significant because I think that I do believe that those of us 31 00:02:39,692 --> 00:02:45,031 who had the privilege of being not disabled for 32 00:02:45,031 --> 00:02:49,102 the early part of our life, 33 00:02:49,102 --> 00:02:52,572 carried a certain level of ambition 34 00:02:52,572 --> 00:02:58,578 and a sense of entitlement into our 20s and 30s, et cetera. 35 00:02:58,611 --> 00:03:05,018 And so I definitely had a sense that everything was possible. 36 00:03:05,451 --> 00:03:14,494 I was in second year of university when I was diagnosed with retinitis pigmentosa. 37 00:03:14,727 --> 00:03:19,732 And initially, the doctor said, nobody wants to see a blind woman 38 00:03:19,732 --> 00:03:21,601 tripping across the stage. 39 00:03:21,634 --> 00:03:25,305 So that's a nice start. 40 00:03:25,972 --> 00:03:29,576 I decided to ignore them. 41 00:03:29,909 --> 00:03:37,417 And my drama teacher at university introduced me to this amazing 42 00:03:37,417 --> 00:03:41,321 woman named Jo Jo Rideout, who is a voice teacher and is still 43 00:03:41,354 --> 00:03:45,058 teaching voice to this day in Canada. 44 00:03:45,091 --> 00:03:50,964 And I started to work with her studying voice for actors. 45 00:03:50,997 --> 00:03:59,305 And I loved it, but I wasn't ready 46 00:03:59,339 --> 00:04:04,611 to dedicate myself to being a teacher. 47 00:04:04,644 --> 00:04:08,081 At least I didn't think I was ready. 48 00:04:08,114 --> 00:04:12,652 So I returned to my first ambition, which was to become an actor, 49 00:04:12,652 --> 00:04:15,488 even though I knew I was going to lose my sight. 50 00:04:15,521 --> 00:04:22,729 And I was in second year of acting school at what is now TMU here in Toronto, 51 00:04:22,762 --> 00:04:30,603 when my sight started to reveal the difficulties I was going to have. 52 00:04:30,603 --> 00:04:38,244 And so I decided to leave my training after two years and go to England. 53 00:04:38,278 --> 00:04:44,317 I was accepted into the top training school, the top theatre school. 54 00:04:44,350 --> 00:04:49,789 Actually, it's considered - it was then considered the top in the world to study voice 55 00:04:49,822 --> 00:04:51,424 for acting and for theater. 56 00:04:51,424 --> 00:04:52,759 So that's what I did. 57 00:04:52,792 --> 00:04:58,564 And while I was there, while I was studying voice, I was invited to 58 00:04:58,598 --> 00:05:07,507 be a voice teacher on a theatre workshop run by Graeae Theatre Company. 59 00:05:07,540 --> 00:05:13,880 And Graeae Theatre Company was the UK's, and still is, I guess, arguably - 60 00:05:13,913 --> 00:05:18,785 it's considered the UK's leading disabled-led theatre company. 61 00:05:18,818 --> 00:05:20,853 I hesitated at first. 62 00:05:20,887 --> 00:05:28,127 I thought, oh, no, I don't think I want to be identified as "those people." 63 00:05:28,961 --> 00:05:33,266 But I then changed my mind and thought, no, Alex, be open-minded. 64 00:05:33,299 --> 00:05:40,373 And honestly, I think it took about, I don't know, 15 minutes being in a room 65 00:05:40,406 --> 00:05:46,879 with all these incredible people where I thought, no, I don't not 66 00:05:46,913 --> 00:05:49,849 want to be associated with these people. 67 00:05:49,882 --> 00:05:53,052 I need to be with these people. Like, it just - 68 00:05:53,052 --> 00:05:58,858 My entire sense of self and of 69 00:05:58,891 --> 00:06:02,161 what is possible and the potential 70 00:06:02,195 --> 00:06:07,066 of theatre and performance and creative thinking and imagination 71 00:06:07,100 --> 00:06:11,204 just erupted over that week for me. 72 00:06:11,237 --> 00:06:14,140 And I have never turned back. 73 00:06:14,173 --> 00:06:19,846 I have worked in disability arts since. I returned to Canada and started 74 00:06:19,846 --> 00:06:25,118 disability arts programming here in Toronto. 75 00:06:25,151 --> 00:06:31,557 And I then went on to do a lot of 76 00:06:31,557 --> 00:06:35,428 performance art, a lot of drag work, a lot of queer theatre. 77 00:06:35,428 --> 00:06:41,100 That was my step inside, step towards political theatre, 78 00:06:41,100 --> 00:06:45,605 I guess, was through the lens of queer theatre and queer performance. 79 00:06:45,605 --> 00:06:50,443 Then I wrote a play called Smudge, which was an exploration 80 00:06:50,476 --> 00:06:54,380 of my journey towards blindness. 81 00:06:54,413 --> 00:07:02,188 That play was picked up by a UK theatre company and produced in the UK in 2003. 82 00:07:02,221 --> 00:07:09,729 When I got myself back into that country and saw what was happening 83 00:07:09,762 --> 00:07:15,968 with disability theatre, 13 years after I had first been there, 84 00:07:16,002 --> 00:07:21,541 I just so wanted to learn more. 85 00:07:21,574 --> 00:07:26,913 I applied to the government, and I was very lucky. 86 00:07:26,913 --> 00:07:31,617 The UK government awarded me a highly skilled migrant visa based on 87 00:07:31,651 --> 00:07:37,323 my skill set, which was - I had trained as an actor, I had trained as a voice teacher, 88 00:07:37,323 --> 00:07:43,062 I was part of the disability community, I'd written a produced play. 89 00:07:43,095 --> 00:07:49,202 So I had an unusual set of skills, and the government felt that I would be 90 00:07:49,235 --> 00:07:56,742 a really valuable contributor to disability and performance across the UK. 91 00:07:56,776 --> 00:07:58,478 So that's what I did. 92 00:07:58,511 --> 00:08:02,882 I went and worked in the UK for 15 years, and then I returned back 93 00:08:02,915 --> 00:08:07,086 to Canada, and I've been here for eight years, basically doing all of 94 00:08:07,086 --> 00:08:09,188 the things I've just mentioned. 95 00:08:09,889 --> 00:08:16,062 When you were at Graeae, what was the mood, the ambiance over there? 96 00:08:16,095 --> 00:08:20,900 I wonder if you can tell us a bit about these years as you spent there. 97 00:08:22,368 --> 00:08:29,976 Ok, so, my first encounter with Graeae was, as I say, it was in 1990. 98 00:08:30,109 --> 00:08:37,450 And it was - The room was full of joy 99 00:08:37,617 --> 00:08:41,220 and sassy assness. 100 00:08:41,654 --> 00:08:45,391 There was no precious, precious. 101 00:08:45,391 --> 00:08:52,999 It was just super funny people, really adventurous, wild imagination, 102 00:08:53,032 --> 00:08:59,071 like a real avant-garde feel, 103 00:08:59,105 --> 00:09:03,609 energy in the room and a fierceness. 104 00:09:03,609 --> 00:09:08,748 And definitely - Now, how do I explain this? 105 00:09:08,781 --> 00:09:13,519 Definitely a political - a really strong 106 00:09:13,552 --> 00:09:19,292 political passion behind the work. 107 00:09:19,292 --> 00:09:23,863 But it never felt like the politics were leading the work. 108 00:09:23,896 --> 00:09:31,604 It felt like the art was leading the work and it had 109 00:09:31,637 --> 00:09:36,075 this deep political foundation. 110 00:09:36,108 --> 00:09:44,050 Its roots were coming from a real political belief and movement 111 00:09:44,050 --> 00:09:49,288 in that country that started to really pick up momentum in the '80s, 112 00:09:49,288 --> 00:09:59,932 that disabled people must have equal opportunity across all sectors of society. 113 00:09:59,966 --> 00:10:06,839 But the art and the creativity just seemed to be the lead in the space. 114 00:10:06,872 --> 00:10:09,141 And that was so joyful. 115 00:10:09,175 --> 00:10:13,045 And that was the same as I worked there for 15 years. 116 00:10:13,079 --> 00:10:16,916 And I worked with Graeae for a number of those years. 117 00:10:16,949 --> 00:10:25,725 We were all very political, but it was art that was driving the work, 118 00:10:26,292 --> 00:10:35,368 which I'm not always sure - Well, I don't always feel that, 119 00:10:35,601 --> 00:10:39,372 but I definitely felt that with Graeae. 120 00:10:40,339 --> 00:10:47,647 You also led a quantity of other projects during these years in the UK, because 121 00:10:47,680 --> 00:10:53,252 if I'm not mistaken, the particularity of the UK is that they give some money 122 00:10:53,285 --> 00:10:56,422 to the arts for disabled artists. 123 00:10:56,455 --> 00:11:00,192 Yeah, I think what you're talking about is something called Access to Work. 124 00:11:00,226 --> 00:11:06,532 I truly believe that Access to Work is the game changer. 125 00:11:06,532 --> 00:11:08,901 We don't have it in Canada. 126 00:11:08,934 --> 00:11:11,871 When I talk about it, I talked about it a lot when I first came back, 127 00:11:11,871 --> 00:11:14,940 and then I started not talking about it because I thought, 128 00:11:14,974 --> 00:11:20,846 I'm just probably making people pissed off because I don't want to come across 129 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:23,349 as if I'm saying, It's hopeless here. 130 00:11:23,382 --> 00:11:31,223 But I wish that we could galvanize as an arts community. 131 00:11:31,257 --> 00:11:34,026 I don't mean just the disabled arts community. 132 00:11:34,060 --> 00:11:36,028 I mean the entire arts community. 133 00:11:36,062 --> 00:11:42,902 Because what Access to Work does that's truly significant is that 134 00:11:42,935 --> 00:11:46,772 it enables people to be self-employed. 135 00:11:46,772 --> 00:11:52,144 So yeah, you can work for a company in Canada, and that company can... 136 00:11:52,178 --> 00:11:55,047 When I say company, I don't mean necessarily an arts company, 137 00:11:55,081 --> 00:11:57,149 but just any organization. 138 00:11:57,183 --> 00:11:59,785 Go and have a full-time job with an organization. 139 00:11:59,819 --> 00:12:02,421 Go work for TD Bank. Well, yeah, sure. 140 00:12:02,455 --> 00:12:09,428 The organization, the business, can apply for funds to cover 141 00:12:09,462 --> 00:12:11,831 the access needs of their staff. 142 00:12:11,864 --> 00:12:14,300 But that funding stays with the company. 143 00:12:14,333 --> 00:12:18,137 It doesn't go with the staff member, when the staff member decides it's time 144 00:12:18,170 --> 00:12:20,840 to leave or go freelance or whatever. 145 00:12:20,873 --> 00:12:22,541 So it's always attached. 146 00:12:22,575 --> 00:12:24,710 That access funding here in this country is always 147 00:12:24,710 --> 00:12:28,647 attached to businesses or employers. 148 00:12:28,681 --> 00:12:34,820 And in the UK, it's directly attached to the disabled person. 149 00:12:34,854 --> 00:12:39,592 So if you want to be a freelancer, if you want to be self-employed 150 00:12:39,625 --> 00:12:45,798 and be an artist or an actor or a director and work for all sorts of different 151 00:12:45,831 --> 00:12:51,303 companies, which is what most self-employed artists do, 152 00:12:51,337 --> 00:12:54,206 or get project grants to do their own work, 153 00:12:54,206 --> 00:12:58,144 you have Access to Work funding all year round. 154 00:12:58,177 --> 00:13:00,746 As long as you make a - It's a threshold. 155 00:13:00,779 --> 00:13:03,382 I think you have to make £6,000 a year. 156 00:13:03,415 --> 00:13:07,820 If that's what you're making, you can get Access to Work. 157 00:13:07,853 --> 00:13:09,455 I can just give you an example. 158 00:13:09,488 --> 00:13:14,226 I just had mine reapproved because I'm moving back to the UK. 159 00:13:14,226 --> 00:13:16,362 I'm going to spend more of my time back in the UK. 160 00:13:16,395 --> 00:13:22,701 I'm going to have £100,000 to support me over three years. 161 00:13:22,735 --> 00:13:25,471 So it's something like, I think it's something like 38. 162 00:13:25,504 --> 00:13:29,842 So it's more than that, more than £100,000, which is, I think, 163 00:13:29,842 --> 00:13:33,379 I don't know what that is in Canadian dollars, but it works out to be something like 164 00:13:33,379 --> 00:13:39,852 $68,000 per year, guaranteed for three years. 165 00:13:39,852 --> 00:13:43,789 So that's a game changer because that means I have somebody 166 00:13:43,822 --> 00:13:49,962 who can support me even if I just want to go to the library and read a play. 167 00:13:50,496 --> 00:13:52,131 It's amazing. 168 00:13:53,666 --> 00:13:56,669 I should say it's not amazing. 169 00:13:56,702 --> 00:14:00,706 It just makes sense because it enables people to work and thrive. 170 00:14:00,739 --> 00:14:03,108 And it gives someone else a job. 171 00:14:03,142 --> 00:14:05,511 So two people are working. 172 00:14:05,544 --> 00:14:10,983 And economically, if people are interested in the ching-ching of it all, 173 00:14:10,983 --> 00:14:17,289 the dollar signs, it actually - Every pound invested in this program returns 174 00:14:17,323 --> 00:14:22,261 a pound and a half to the treasury, so it easily pays for itself. 175 00:14:22,761 --> 00:14:25,764 Plus it really supports the initiatives. 176 00:14:25,798 --> 00:14:29,068 Okay, let's build a project together with this and that company 177 00:14:29,101 --> 00:14:36,242 and there is this kind of freedom of creation that comes with it. 178 00:14:36,242 --> 00:14:40,679 Absolutely, because you're so right. 179 00:14:40,713 --> 00:14:50,155 It liberates a disabled artist to move widely across the arts sector, 180 00:14:50,422 --> 00:14:57,196 as opposed to only being able to work for organizations 181 00:14:57,229 --> 00:14:58,898 that are eligible for access money. 182 00:14:58,931 --> 00:15:07,039 So here in Canada, the Arts Council gives access funding to disabled led companies, 183 00:15:07,072 --> 00:15:11,577 arts companies, because they have a limited pot of access funding, 184 00:15:11,610 --> 00:15:16,382 and so they prioritize those companies that are identified as disabled led. 185 00:15:16,415 --> 00:15:20,386 Well, that's great that they're prioritized, 186 00:15:20,419 --> 00:15:25,424 but it's not great because it means that a disabled person really is only guaranteed 187 00:15:25,457 --> 00:15:30,362 to have their access funds met working for only those companies. 188 00:15:30,396 --> 00:15:36,302 I just think all artists need the - Well, 189 00:15:36,302 --> 00:15:39,471 all artists deserve the opportunity to work with 190 00:15:39,471 --> 00:15:44,109 whatever organization is interested in collaborating with them and vice versa. 191 00:15:44,143 --> 00:15:50,816 I find that really problematic. 192 00:15:50,883 --> 00:15:55,120 I think it also is preventing disabled leadership from flourishing 193 00:15:55,154 --> 00:16:01,794 in this country because, and I can speak from experience, 194 00:16:01,827 --> 00:16:08,634 if you're disabled and you're the leader of an organization, an arts organization, 195 00:16:08,667 --> 00:16:15,207 whose board doesn't want to transition into the potential of being 196 00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:19,945 disabled led, then your organization isn't eligible for access funds. 197 00:16:19,979 --> 00:16:26,185 So how in the world can you take on a leadership role if the organization 198 00:16:26,218 --> 00:16:27,720 isn't eligible for access funding? 199 00:16:27,753 --> 00:16:32,591 I had to leave an artistic director leadership because of that. 200 00:16:32,591 --> 00:16:35,894 So there's a lot of... 201 00:16:35,961 --> 00:16:40,199 Yeah, the funding structures definitely make a difference, I think. 202 00:16:40,232 --> 00:16:47,039 All that said, I am really 203 00:16:47,072 --> 00:16:51,910 encouraged by the state of play 204 00:16:51,910 --> 00:16:57,750 in Canada now versus what it was, let's say, when I left in 2003. 205 00:16:58,017 --> 00:17:08,827 We've come a long way, and I think our potential as artists is just so strong. 206 00:17:09,228 --> 00:17:16,769 I really believe disabled artists bring so much to culture 207 00:17:16,802 --> 00:17:19,571 and creativity and sustainability. 208 00:17:19,605 --> 00:17:26,078 I mean, we, I think more than most people, 209 00:17:26,111 --> 00:17:31,984 we understand how to negotiate 210 00:17:31,984 --> 00:17:36,188 barriers and how to pivot 211 00:17:36,221 --> 00:17:43,362 and how to be flexible, which are all... 212 00:17:43,362 --> 00:17:47,433 These are all words that are associated with creativity. 213 00:17:47,466 --> 00:17:54,940 I think we're inherently great leaders because we're constantly having to find 214 00:17:54,973 --> 00:18:01,814 solutions to lack of access. 215 00:18:01,980 --> 00:18:05,184 Basically, we rock. 216 00:18:06,251 --> 00:18:08,554 That's a good definition of us. We rock. 217 00:18:08,587 --> 00:18:12,858 We rock. 218 00:18:13,625 --> 00:18:15,394 Okay. 219 00:18:15,427 --> 00:18:20,098 Just before arriving, before coming back to Canada, you had the time 220 00:18:20,132 --> 00:18:29,575 to do the 2012 Olympic Games, the London Olympic Games Overture. 221 00:18:30,108 --> 00:18:33,345 That was a big, big thing, right? 222 00:18:33,345 --> 00:18:34,980 Yeah. Yeah. 223 00:18:34,980 --> 00:18:40,352 I don't think that could be done in Canada the way it was done in London, right? 224 00:18:40,786 --> 00:18:43,489 I don't know. 225 00:18:43,522 --> 00:18:46,792 I really don't know the answer to that. 226 00:18:46,825 --> 00:18:55,801 I know that having all of that access funding enabled so many of us 227 00:18:55,801 --> 00:19:05,677 to participate in the Cultural Olympiad, I was - I was writer and co... 228 00:19:05,711 --> 00:19:09,248 I guess I was writer and dramaturge or assistant director 229 00:19:09,248 --> 00:19:17,155 of the opening ceremonies of the Olympics, the sailing, all the water sports. 230 00:19:17,189 --> 00:19:21,426 So the Olympics had two centers. 231 00:19:21,460 --> 00:19:25,797 One center was in London and one center was in Weymouth. 232 00:19:25,831 --> 00:19:31,670 And little me from Canada ended up writing 233 00:19:31,670 --> 00:19:35,707 the opening ceremony of the Weymouth Olympics, 234 00:19:35,707 --> 00:19:39,011 the Weymouth-centered Olympics. 235 00:19:39,044 --> 00:19:43,315 That just still blows my mind that I did that. 236 00:19:43,348 --> 00:19:45,884 But I would not have been able to do that. 237 00:19:45,918 --> 00:19:50,956 And also the participants, there were a lot of disabled participants 238 00:19:50,956 --> 00:19:56,628 in the opening ceremonies of the Olympics, not just the Paralympics, but the Olympics. 239 00:19:56,662 --> 00:20:03,468 And yeah, that required a lot of accessibility support, 240 00:20:03,468 --> 00:20:06,672 and the infrastructure for that is already there. 241 00:20:06,672 --> 00:20:08,941 And then, of course, the Paralympics. 242 00:20:08,974 --> 00:20:12,544 I mean, what Jenny Sealey did with the... 243 00:20:12,578 --> 00:20:15,080 And she's the director of Graeae. 244 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:19,618 So basically, the director of Graeae directed the Paralympic opening ceremonies. 245 00:20:19,618 --> 00:20:24,590 And I suppose, just again, 246 00:20:24,590 --> 00:20:30,562 because they have the funding to support 247 00:20:30,596 --> 00:20:35,701 all their access needs, so they're really able to do big, big, big things. 248 00:20:35,734 --> 00:20:38,003 For sure. I mean, everybody - 249 00:20:38,003 --> 00:20:42,641 It's a dream to put all these artists in these ceremonies, 250 00:20:42,674 --> 00:20:50,716 the opening and closing, and also to have no barrier between 251 00:20:50,749 --> 00:20:58,090 the people with disabilities attending or supporting or volunteering, 252 00:20:58,223 --> 00:21:00,993 neither in the Olympics or the Paralympics. 253 00:21:00,993 --> 00:21:05,063 It was an amazing event with some flaws, right? 254 00:21:05,097 --> 00:21:08,967 You always have flaws in that kind of big event. 255 00:21:09,001 --> 00:21:11,203 Oh my God, yeah. 256 00:21:12,537 --> 00:21:14,106 For sure. 257 00:21:14,139 --> 00:21:16,208 Also, I also... 258 00:21:16,241 --> 00:21:22,748 I'm aware that the Paralympics is controversial. 259 00:21:22,781 --> 00:21:29,821 Not all disabled people are keen on the Paralympics, and I do understand that. 260 00:21:29,855 --> 00:21:33,692 Maybe that's a whole other podcast. 261 00:21:33,725 --> 00:21:43,635 But I think the investment in the cultural Olympiad, all the money that went into 262 00:21:43,669 --> 00:21:49,741 creating large scale 263 00:21:49,741 --> 00:21:52,277 arts and cultural events 264 00:21:52,277 --> 00:21:56,114 that surrounded the Olympic Games, 265 00:21:56,114 --> 00:21:58,216 that was a huge investment. 266 00:21:58,250 --> 00:22:05,157 And Disability Arts was identified as a priority. 267 00:22:05,190 --> 00:22:07,326 So that helped. 268 00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:15,734 Actually, out of that came the Unlimited Festival, which is the UK's 269 00:22:15,734 --> 00:22:22,841 big disability arts festival that happens every two years at the Southbank Centre. 270 00:22:22,841 --> 00:22:29,448 They have a huge million-pound budget to commission. 271 00:22:29,481 --> 00:22:34,820 I love it because the structure is basically unlimited commissions, 272 00:22:34,853 --> 00:22:40,392 artists, disabled artists, to create new work that will then 273 00:22:40,392 --> 00:22:44,930 be shown at the festival at the Southbank Centre. 274 00:22:44,963 --> 00:22:51,503 So basically, it's a commissioning scheme, and it's been a huge success, 275 00:22:51,536 --> 00:22:56,308 and that grew out of the 2012 Olympics. 276 00:22:56,341 --> 00:22:58,110 Are you participating? 277 00:22:58,577 --> 00:23:01,012 I have participated. Yes. 278 00:23:01,012 --> 00:23:07,753 I was part of the very first Unlimited Festival. 279 00:23:07,753 --> 00:23:14,493 I had a piece of the very first Unlimited Festival, and I had a film shown there. 280 00:23:14,493 --> 00:23:18,497 I a couple of festivals ago. 281 00:23:19,331 --> 00:23:26,304 And I was initially part of Assisted Suicide: The Musical by Liz Carr, 282 00:23:26,505 --> 00:23:29,007 that was there also a few years ago. 283 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:30,942 I haven't done anything for a while. 284 00:23:30,976 --> 00:23:37,516 I might pitch my recent show, Perceptual Archeology or How to Travel Blind 285 00:23:37,682 --> 00:23:40,352 for the Festival, because in addition to the commissions, 286 00:23:40,352 --> 00:23:45,423 they do curate a few shows, but largely it's new commissions. 287 00:23:45,423 --> 00:23:49,861 Well, good segue. Can we know more about Perceptual Archeology? 288 00:23:49,895 --> 00:23:52,063 Hi hi hi hi. Yeah, that was good. 289 00:23:52,097 --> 00:23:54,399 That was so smooth. 290 00:23:54,432 --> 00:23:55,634 Amazing. 291 00:23:55,667 --> 00:24:00,872 Yes, Perceptual Archeology or How to Travel Blind is a show 292 00:24:00,872 --> 00:24:08,480 that I created with Leah Cherniak and 293 00:24:08,513 --> 00:24:16,788 a number of incredible Toronto artists. 294 00:24:16,888 --> 00:24:23,061 So Perceptual Archeology or How to Travel Blind came out of 295 00:24:23,094 --> 00:24:29,968 a project I did in 2014, '15 and '16. 296 00:24:30,435 --> 00:24:34,573 Which was a travel project. 297 00:24:34,606 --> 00:24:43,348 I wanted to follow in the footsteps of James Holman, who was this 19th century 298 00:24:43,348 --> 00:24:50,822 traveler, who I guess he was the first known blind traveler 299 00:24:50,822 --> 00:24:54,793 who had his travel documented in journals. 300 00:24:54,793 --> 00:24:56,761 He was a traveler and a travel writer. 301 00:24:56,795 --> 00:25:00,565 And I wanted to be a travel writer, 302 00:25:00,565 --> 00:25:05,003 which was something I had discovered while swimming in a pool in Los Angeles. 303 00:25:05,003 --> 00:25:07,506 And I'll just tell you a little bit more about that in a second. 304 00:25:07,539 --> 00:25:12,744 But basically, the play started off as me trying to travel where he traveled, 305 00:25:12,777 --> 00:25:15,280 and it was a disaster. 306 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:16,915 (Laughs.) 307 00:25:16,915 --> 00:25:19,351 It went really badly. 308 00:25:19,384 --> 00:25:25,523 And so I just gave up on the idea of following in the footsteps of 309 00:25:25,523 --> 00:25:32,564 some 19th century guy and reimagined 310 00:25:32,564 --> 00:25:39,404 a travel journey that was connected to my 311 00:25:39,404 --> 00:25:44,876 way of being in the world, my sensory strengths. 312 00:25:44,876 --> 00:25:48,113 So I went to the Music Belt of America. 313 00:25:48,113 --> 00:25:52,350 Basically, I followed my ears, and then I walked. 314 00:25:52,350 --> 00:25:59,891 I followed my feet, and I walked in the outdoors for 128 kilometers 315 00:25:59,925 --> 00:26:02,761 across Portugal and Spain. 316 00:26:02,794 --> 00:26:04,996 I did the Camino. 317 00:26:05,030 --> 00:26:11,670 And both of those things were just incredible and really 318 00:26:12,103 --> 00:26:17,676 taught me a lot about letting go of... 319 00:26:17,709 --> 00:26:22,480 Well, yes, letting go of sight, but even more specifically, 320 00:26:22,514 --> 00:26:29,587 learning how to have a blind imagination, because I learned from that experience 321 00:26:29,621 --> 00:26:34,059 that what I was imagining before traveling, in a sense, was 322 00:26:34,092 --> 00:26:39,364 I was always imagining things in pictures, which is so strange because 323 00:26:39,364 --> 00:26:45,570 I have been functionally blind for a number of years, but my imagination 324 00:26:45,604 --> 00:26:49,040 was very much stuck in my sighted past. 325 00:26:49,074 --> 00:26:56,982 So I really learned how to imagine with my ears and with my feet. 326 00:26:57,682 --> 00:27:07,625 And I had two incredible journeys. 327 00:27:07,659 --> 00:27:10,295 So I wrote a play about it. 328 00:27:10,328 --> 00:27:11,896 That's basically what the play is about. 329 00:27:11,930 --> 00:27:15,934 It's my whole journey from initially wanting to be a traveler 330 00:27:15,967 --> 00:27:22,540 and a travel writer to the completion of the Camino walk and 331 00:27:22,574 --> 00:27:25,543 two and a half years of traveling. 332 00:27:25,577 --> 00:27:29,981 But the reason I'm just going back to where I first had this idea 333 00:27:30,015 --> 00:27:38,690 of becoming a traveler was in 1996, I was struggling so much with my sight loss. 334 00:27:38,690 --> 00:27:44,029 I was living in Toronto at the time, and I just felt like my world was shrinking. 335 00:27:44,062 --> 00:27:47,665 So I basically just did the opposite. 336 00:27:47,699 --> 00:27:52,237 I got on a plane and I went to Los Angeles by myself. 337 00:27:52,270 --> 00:27:56,341 And the reason I went to Los Angeles is because I had a friend who lived there. 338 00:27:56,374 --> 00:28:00,879 So I thought, well, if I get into trouble, I can always call my friend. 339 00:28:00,912 --> 00:28:04,649 But I wanted to go somewhere I'd never been before by myself 340 00:28:04,682 --> 00:28:07,819 and just see what that would be like. 341 00:28:07,852 --> 00:28:17,462 And I found myself in a swimming pool at a hotel, having no idea what the size 342 00:28:17,495 --> 00:28:23,601 or shape of the swimming pool was and thinking, Gosh, when I could see, 343 00:28:23,635 --> 00:28:25,203 everything was immediate. 344 00:28:25,236 --> 00:28:27,806 Everything, concepts came to me immediately. 345 00:28:27,839 --> 00:28:31,009 I just had to look and, Oh, look There's a pool. 346 00:28:31,042 --> 00:28:35,313 It's round, it's square, it's kidney-shaped, whatever. 347 00:28:35,346 --> 00:28:39,017 It's big, it's small, and I couldn't do that. 348 00:28:39,050 --> 00:28:44,222 So I swam around and around this pool, tracing its edges and listening 349 00:28:44,255 --> 00:28:48,560 to the way that the water, it slapped against the ladder and 350 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:50,061 how it sounded under the diving board. 351 00:28:50,095 --> 00:28:58,069 And I came to discover the pool through my other senses, but as if I was 352 00:28:58,103 --> 00:29:03,808 a discoverer or an explorer, as opposed to what I refer to as 353 00:29:03,842 --> 00:29:06,678 this immediate way of knowing. 354 00:29:06,711 --> 00:29:11,750 It took time, an exploration to understand the pool. 355 00:29:11,750 --> 00:29:18,556 But once I got it, once I figured it out, I understood that pool 356 00:29:18,590 --> 00:29:23,661 in a way I never would have had I just witnessed it with my eyes. 357 00:29:23,695 --> 00:29:27,499 And that's when I thought, oh, my God, I want to be a blind travel writer. 358 00:29:27,499 --> 00:29:29,267 This is so interesting. 359 00:29:29,300 --> 00:29:34,472 So I eventually did become a blind travel writer and wrote a play. 360 00:29:34,506 --> 00:29:40,712 I think it's not your first experience of writing about your travels 361 00:29:41,112 --> 00:29:43,481 because you traveled a lot. 362 00:29:43,481 --> 00:29:47,752 I traveled a lot. Yes, I have traveled. I have traveled a lot. 363 00:29:47,786 --> 00:29:50,555 I think it might be... 364 00:29:50,588 --> 00:29:57,195 I'm now thinking, Oh, I think this is permanent. 365 00:29:57,228 --> 00:30:01,933 I have some kind of travel gene or something. 366 00:30:01,933 --> 00:30:04,769 It's in my soul somehow. 367 00:30:04,803 --> 00:30:09,374 That's a challenge for someone who's blind because, 368 00:30:09,374 --> 00:30:12,343 blindness is such a familiarity-sensitive disability. 369 00:30:12,377 --> 00:30:16,681 Once you're familiar with an environment, you're not really disabled anymore. 370 00:30:16,714 --> 00:30:19,517 I mean, I'm always blind, but I'm not always disabled. 371 00:30:19,551 --> 00:30:25,223 So it unfortunately does throw me into very disabling or potentially disabling 372 00:30:25,256 --> 00:30:26,758 environments and circumstances. 373 00:30:26,791 --> 00:30:34,833 But I think now that I've I found a way of travel that really works for me, 374 00:30:34,866 --> 00:30:40,071 it's not so - it's not so dramatic. 375 00:30:40,104 --> 00:30:41,606 But yeah, I travel. 376 00:30:41,639 --> 00:30:42,807 I love traveling. 377 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:48,680 Yeah, I think part of it is it keeps me in the moment. 378 00:30:49,013 --> 00:30:56,521 Traveling really, really keeps me present in the way that acting does. 379 00:30:56,554 --> 00:31:01,626 I think that's what I love the most about acting is that you 380 00:31:01,659 --> 00:31:06,464 have to be so present and grounded. 381 00:31:06,497 --> 00:31:12,303 You have got to be fully in your body in order to be an actor. 382 00:31:12,470 --> 00:31:15,473 It doesn't matter what your body is. That's a great thing about it. 383 00:31:15,473 --> 00:31:23,481 That's why disabled people are great actors because they inhabit their bodies 384 00:31:23,514 --> 00:31:28,686 like any other actor does, and their bodies are so unique and interesting. 385 00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:33,024 But that's I love that about acting, and I think that's part 386 00:31:33,057 --> 00:31:34,726 of why I love traveling. 387 00:31:34,759 --> 00:31:37,362 Does the play start in the pool? 388 00:31:37,362 --> 00:31:38,429 Yes, it does. 389 00:31:38,463 --> 00:31:40,765 Pretty much. 390 00:31:40,765 --> 00:31:43,001 How did you bring the pool on stage? 391 00:31:43,001 --> 00:31:45,003 Ah! 392 00:31:45,637 --> 00:31:48,640 Through the magic of sound! 393 00:31:48,673 --> 00:31:52,944 Yes. We had an amazing sound designer. 394 00:31:52,977 --> 00:32:00,351 We had two sound designers, and they created this beautiful water sound. 395 00:32:00,385 --> 00:32:01,586 Yeah. 396 00:32:01,619 --> 00:32:06,958 The pool is very, very early on in the play, for sure. 397 00:32:06,991 --> 00:32:10,028 Yeah, I can imagine. Okay. 398 00:32:10,061 --> 00:32:13,564 I know you have a great website that goes with that play, so I'm going 399 00:32:13,598 --> 00:32:17,835 to publish that on ArtsAbly's website. 400 00:32:17,869 --> 00:32:19,203 That would be great. 401 00:32:19,237 --> 00:32:21,239 I'm really pleased with that website. 402 00:32:21,272 --> 00:32:23,474 My personal website sucks. 403 00:32:23,508 --> 00:32:24,776 I'm just going to say it. 404 00:32:24,809 --> 00:32:31,783 I have been terrible at social media 405 00:32:31,816 --> 00:32:35,586 and self-promotion, which I need to do 406 00:32:35,586 --> 00:32:37,155 something about that because it's dumb. 407 00:32:37,188 --> 00:32:42,393 I mean, we live in a very digital world. 408 00:32:42,427 --> 00:32:49,867 I think because I'm blind, I just partly ignore it, but I think to a fault. 409 00:32:49,901 --> 00:32:55,473 If anybody goes to my personal website, it's so out of date. 410 00:32:55,506 --> 00:32:59,877 But Perceptual Archeology, on the other hand, is still fresh. 411 00:32:59,911 --> 00:33:01,012 Very good. 412 00:33:01,012 --> 00:33:06,584 We know each other through a group that is called Creative Connector. 413 00:33:06,617 --> 00:33:10,221 I love this group because 414 00:33:10,722 --> 00:33:17,261 it shows the great number of artists 415 00:33:17,295 --> 00:33:21,566 who are working in disability arts. 416 00:33:21,599 --> 00:33:26,771 I wanted to ask you what it is for you to work in the field 417 00:33:26,804 --> 00:33:28,906 of disabilities in arts. 418 00:33:28,940 --> 00:33:38,349 Well, it means an opportunity to reshape a theater and re-imagine process 419 00:33:38,383 --> 00:33:44,589 because disabled people bring 420 00:33:44,622 --> 00:33:49,160 a particular unique set of opportunities 421 00:33:49,193 --> 00:33:55,066 to impact creative practice. 422 00:33:55,099 --> 00:34:04,909 And a lot of that is because of our differing ways of contributing. 423 00:34:04,942 --> 00:34:10,448 I need someone to line feed my lines to me when I'm in rehearsal. 424 00:34:10,481 --> 00:34:15,887 So I wear this little earbud in my ear, and I have someone on a little device 425 00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:18,222 that's reading my lines into my ear. 426 00:34:18,256 --> 00:34:27,365 And that process actually ended up being performed in my play. 427 00:34:27,398 --> 00:34:32,437 I did the whole play with an earpiece in my ear and somebody line feeding. 428 00:34:32,470 --> 00:34:38,476 And it was so much fun because I ended up playing with that line feeder. 429 00:34:38,509 --> 00:34:45,450 As the play went on, we became playmates on stage. 430 00:34:45,483 --> 00:34:54,358 And the line feeder had some funny moments where he just suddenly was taking over. 431 00:34:54,392 --> 00:34:59,530 Basically, my access allowed for a whole set of creative possibilities. 432 00:34:59,530 --> 00:35:10,007 And so anyone who brings that into a room, their unique way of participating, 433 00:35:10,041 --> 00:35:15,012 is going to change the shape of the play, and it's going to change 434 00:35:15,046 --> 00:35:18,583 the way the play is created. 435 00:35:18,616 --> 00:35:20,585 That is magic. 436 00:35:20,618 --> 00:35:28,292 So what working with disabled people means to me is the potential 437 00:35:28,292 --> 00:35:32,130 for something unexpected and brilliant. 438 00:35:32,130 --> 00:35:38,369 And it also means I feel safe. 439 00:35:38,402 --> 00:35:43,641 I feel safest when I am working with other disabled people. 440 00:35:43,674 --> 00:35:48,846 If I'm the only disabled person in a room, I don't feel very safe. 441 00:35:50,148 --> 00:35:52,083 But be it an integrated group or not. 442 00:35:52,116 --> 00:35:56,721 But when there are other disabled people in a creative room with me, 443 00:35:56,721 --> 00:36:03,127 it definitely changes my sense of safety and vulnerability. 444 00:36:03,161 --> 00:36:06,164 I guess it means safety. 445 00:36:06,164 --> 00:36:09,166 Nice. I like that. 446 00:36:09,934 --> 00:36:15,806 I like the notion of safety defined like that because it's also true. 447 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:21,879 We have this feeling of a community of people working together and 448 00:36:21,879 --> 00:36:31,822 working better together when we understand what it means to be in that - in a group or 449 00:36:31,856 --> 00:36:36,294 in a creative group, even more, I think. 450 00:36:36,294 --> 00:36:38,195 If it make sense. 451 00:36:38,195 --> 00:36:40,665 Yeah. No, it does. 452 00:36:40,698 --> 00:36:50,575 The creative part of it is so powerful and empowering because 453 00:36:51,108 --> 00:36:56,948 a lot of the times, being with a whole bunch of other disabled people, 454 00:36:56,981 --> 00:36:59,317 it doesn't happen very often. 455 00:36:59,350 --> 00:37:06,424 It's not like - It's different than ethnic communities that often 456 00:37:06,457 --> 00:37:09,727 move to the same neighborhoods. 457 00:37:09,727 --> 00:37:12,129 That's why we have in Toronto, Little Italy and Little Portugal. 458 00:37:12,163 --> 00:37:17,501 We don't have Little Disability, but I wish we did. 459 00:37:17,535 --> 00:37:19,837 That's a great idea. 460 00:37:19,870 --> 00:37:23,641 I'm going to start Little Disability. 461 00:37:23,674 --> 00:37:26,077 I said it here. Yeah, okay. 462 00:37:26,110 --> 00:37:29,013 I think we would collaborate on that. 463 00:37:29,046 --> 00:37:34,819 Not I mean, not only the two of us, we would be a lot to collaborate on that. 464 00:37:34,852 --> 00:37:36,220 That's great. 465 00:37:36,253 --> 00:37:38,022 I love it. We have to do it. 466 00:37:38,055 --> 00:37:41,525 Everyone listening, we're going to start a Little Disability. 467 00:37:42,126 --> 00:37:44,695 Okay, I see the time going. 468 00:37:44,729 --> 00:37:49,266 I have one last question for you, and it's about meeting people. 469 00:37:49,300 --> 00:37:57,642 It's about someone who might have in your career inspired or encouraged you 470 00:37:57,675 --> 00:38:03,981 or motivated you, and If there was one person you would think of 471 00:38:03,981 --> 00:38:13,658 in that, these people who had some influence in your career, who would it be and why? 472 00:38:13,691 --> 00:38:15,926 Wow. Okay. 473 00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:17,295 Big question. I know. 474 00:38:17,328 --> 00:38:19,330 I know. 475 00:38:19,330 --> 00:38:22,767 Okay, I'm going to answer that. 476 00:38:23,934 --> 00:38:24,802 Yeah. Okay. 477 00:38:24,802 --> 00:38:26,637 I'm not just going to give a single answer. 478 00:38:26,637 --> 00:38:32,943 I mentioned Jo Jo Rideout, the voice teacher. 479 00:38:33,377 --> 00:38:41,018 Jo Jo has been a huge inspiration for me, even though we haven't really 480 00:38:41,052 --> 00:38:45,723 worked together very much since long ago. 481 00:38:45,923 --> 00:38:54,131 She created some foundation in me that I think really 482 00:38:54,165 --> 00:38:59,470 created the soil for the roots for a lot of the other things to grow. 483 00:38:59,503 --> 00:39:01,138 So I take Jo Jo. 484 00:39:01,172 --> 00:39:08,045 Lina Chartrand, who sadly died way too young in her 40s. 485 00:39:08,079 --> 00:39:11,048 She was a disabled playwright in Canada. 486 00:39:11,082 --> 00:39:17,755 Her play, Little Miss Easter Seals, which was actually first done in French. 487 00:39:17,788 --> 00:39:19,590 Do you know what Easter Seals is? 488 00:39:19,623 --> 00:39:20,791 No. 489 00:39:20,825 --> 00:39:30,101 I think Easter Seals was a stamp that you would buy at Easter time, in April. 490 00:39:30,134 --> 00:39:32,436 Or March, whenever Easter was. 491 00:39:32,470 --> 00:39:40,077 And I think it was a fundraiser for disabled children or children with polio. 492 00:39:40,111 --> 00:39:43,147 And it's still existing today, Easter Seals. 493 00:39:43,180 --> 00:39:44,382 I think it is. 494 00:39:44,415 --> 00:39:46,550 I think it is. I think it is. 495 00:39:46,584 --> 00:39:50,020 And so she - It's the Access2 Card, I think, in Canada. 496 00:39:50,020 --> 00:39:51,922 Yeah. It is. 497 00:39:51,956 --> 00:39:54,225 Okay, that's exactly what it is. 498 00:39:54,258 --> 00:40:00,197 So Lina Chartrand, as a child, was the poster child 499 00:40:00,231 --> 00:40:02,700 for Little Miss Easter Seals. 500 00:40:02,867 --> 00:40:12,409 Lina had polio, and she wrote a play about that experience, and it was 501 00:40:12,409 --> 00:40:16,647 produced in 1988 at Harbourfront Centre. 502 00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:26,624 And I met Lena, gosh, maybe 1993, something like that, '92, maybe. 503 00:40:27,124 --> 00:40:30,895 And I was working for a television program called Disability Network. 504 00:40:30,928 --> 00:40:33,931 It was a CBC television show. 505 00:40:33,931 --> 00:40:41,205 And so I produced a documentary on Lina and interviewed her 506 00:40:41,238 --> 00:40:48,445 while she was the first disabled person to be at the Canadian Film Centre, 507 00:40:48,479 --> 00:40:51,782 the Norm Jewison Film Center. 508 00:40:51,816 --> 00:41:01,959 She was just such a groundbreaker, and she was Oh, full of joy. 509 00:41:01,992 --> 00:41:08,566 And that's my memory of her, was color and joy and creativity. 510 00:41:08,599 --> 00:41:10,301 And she was a lesbian. 511 00:41:10,334 --> 00:41:15,072 And so I just was like, I so wanted to be her. 512 00:41:15,105 --> 00:41:22,012 So I have to say Lina is one of my champions. 513 00:41:22,012 --> 00:41:24,648 And then I'm just going to say that whole group of people 514 00:41:24,682 --> 00:41:31,589 I met at Graeae in 1990, everyone in that workshop, changed my life. 515 00:41:31,622 --> 00:41:35,693 That's my answer, three. 516 00:41:35,726 --> 00:41:40,264 That's only three, but I'm sure there are so many more. 517 00:41:40,297 --> 00:41:43,601 So many more. So many more. 518 00:41:43,868 --> 00:41:44,869 Okay. 519 00:41:44,902 --> 00:41:47,304 Well, thank you so much. 520 00:41:47,471 --> 00:41:52,643 I know we will see each other again in some projects that we 521 00:41:52,676 --> 00:41:58,115 will figure out how to build Little Disability in Toronto first. 522 00:41:58,148 --> 00:42:01,051 Yes. 523 00:42:01,051 --> 00:42:02,086 Absolutely. 524 00:42:02,086 --> 00:42:04,588 We're going to build Little Disability, and I want to do something 525 00:42:04,622 --> 00:42:08,392 with music with you because music has been another part of my life that I 526 00:42:08,392 --> 00:42:11,762 haven't really done a lot with recently. 527 00:42:11,795 --> 00:42:15,199 I love to do something musical with you. 528 00:42:15,232 --> 00:42:19,770 I heard so many great things about you from my UK friends, 529 00:42:19,770 --> 00:42:21,772 John Kelly and Pickles. 530 00:42:21,805 --> 00:42:22,907 They loved you. 531 00:42:22,940 --> 00:42:24,408 Yeah, he's amazing. 532 00:42:24,441 --> 00:42:26,010 I love him, too. 533 00:42:26,010 --> 00:42:28,746 It's a big love-in. 534 00:42:28,779 --> 00:42:31,215 Loving community. 535 00:42:31,882 --> 00:42:32,917 Yeah. 536 00:42:32,950 --> 00:42:38,822 Okay, well, I'll see you soon and have a fantastic day and lots 537 00:42:38,856 --> 00:42:45,896 of great projects and lots of great positive energy in this artistic world 538 00:42:45,930 --> 00:42:49,066 that we are building together. 539 00:42:50,301 --> 00:42:51,001 Amazing. 540 00:42:51,035 --> 00:42:53,904 Thank you so much for talking with me today. 541 00:42:53,938 --> 00:42:55,039 That was fun. Yeah. 542 00:42:55,072 --> 00:42:57,174 Thank you. Have a great day. 543 00:42:57,308 --> 00:42:58,676 See you. 544 00:42:59,944 --> 00:43:05,082 ♪ Closing theme music ♪