WEBVTT 00:00:00.249 --> 00:00:00.929 and we'll do it. 00:00:08.852 --> 00:00:10.234 Welcome to Orthostatic, 00:00:10.333 --> 00:00:11.454 a podcast brought to you by 00:00:11.493 --> 00:00:12.775 the Academy of Orthopedic 00:00:12.814 --> 00:00:13.615 Physical Therapy. 00:00:14.134 --> 00:00:15.535 I'm physical therapist, Jimmy McKay. 00:00:15.855 --> 00:00:16.076 Today, 00:00:16.135 --> 00:00:18.216 our guest has extensive experience 00:00:18.297 --> 00:00:19.937 in ergonomics, human factors, 00:00:19.978 --> 00:00:20.797 and body mechanics. 00:00:21.399 --> 00:00:22.539 He focuses primarily on 00:00:22.579 --> 00:00:23.859 preventing and managing 00:00:24.079 --> 00:00:26.100 musculoskeletal injuries in 00:00:26.120 --> 00:00:26.800 the workforce. 00:00:27.100 --> 00:00:28.722 Dr. Gordon Riddle, welcome to Orthostatic. 00:00:30.219 --> 00:00:30.579 Hi, Jimmy. 00:00:30.599 --> 00:00:31.278 Thanks for having me. 00:00:31.859 --> 00:00:32.140 All right. 00:00:32.159 --> 00:00:34.060 So we have to go big picture 00:00:34.140 --> 00:00:35.420 first because I don't want 00:00:35.441 --> 00:00:36.561 to assume that everybody 00:00:36.600 --> 00:00:37.781 listening or watching on 00:00:37.822 --> 00:00:38.962 YouTube actually 00:00:39.142 --> 00:00:43.183 understands what workplace help is. 00:00:43.204 --> 00:00:44.905 I understand what workplace 00:00:44.984 --> 00:00:46.164 is and I understand what health is. 00:00:46.185 --> 00:00:47.566 But when you put those things together, 00:00:48.026 --> 00:00:50.746 what does workplace health mean to you? 00:00:50.786 --> 00:00:51.466 How do you describe it? 00:00:52.829 --> 00:00:54.890 Yeah, I think it's a good point. 00:00:55.011 --> 00:00:57.271 And I don't think I knew 00:00:57.292 --> 00:00:58.472 that whenever I first kind 00:00:58.512 --> 00:01:00.914 of started out in clinical practice. 00:01:01.454 --> 00:01:02.253 But as I reflect, 00:01:02.334 --> 00:01:03.375 I think there's maybe like 00:01:03.395 --> 00:01:03.935 a couple of different 00:01:03.975 --> 00:01:04.935 pillars as a physical 00:01:04.974 --> 00:01:06.075 therapist that we would look at. 00:01:06.835 --> 00:01:07.516 And one of those would be 00:01:07.796 --> 00:01:08.736 ergonomic assessments, 00:01:09.496 --> 00:01:10.257 which that kind of gives us 00:01:10.298 --> 00:01:11.397 the ability to make 00:01:11.438 --> 00:01:13.239 recommendations or 00:01:13.599 --> 00:01:15.000 adaptations to the workplace. 00:01:15.760 --> 00:01:16.781 workplace design. 00:01:16.820 --> 00:01:17.841 So even work with like 00:01:17.921 --> 00:01:20.102 engineering on trying to design, um, 00:01:20.864 --> 00:01:22.305 like if it's a new build or 00:01:22.444 --> 00:01:24.746 a new building or a new, I guess, 00:01:24.787 --> 00:01:26.168 a change in process, 00:01:26.308 --> 00:01:27.447 like being on the front end 00:01:27.487 --> 00:01:28.489 of that to try to really 00:01:28.528 --> 00:01:31.871 design and have the workers, um, um, 00:01:32.772 --> 00:01:33.593 physical health and 00:01:33.632 --> 00:01:35.513 musculoskeletal system in mind on that. 00:01:35.873 --> 00:01:36.034 Um, 00:01:36.495 --> 00:01:37.796 a lot of it also is training and 00:01:37.835 --> 00:01:38.355 education. 00:01:38.996 --> 00:01:39.156 So, 00:01:39.177 --> 00:01:40.617 which can be like movement training or 00:01:40.658 --> 00:01:42.019 safe lift training, um, 00:01:43.031 --> 00:01:44.653 And then maybe what more PTs 00:01:44.692 --> 00:01:45.373 are a little bit more 00:01:45.754 --> 00:01:46.495 comfortable with is 00:01:47.135 --> 00:01:48.275 mobility and stretching 00:01:48.376 --> 00:01:49.557 flexibility programs, 00:01:49.656 --> 00:01:51.759 strengthening and fitness programs. 00:01:51.858 --> 00:01:53.781 And then even on like the pre-hire side, 00:01:54.561 --> 00:01:57.563 like fit for duty type of evaluations, 00:01:57.644 --> 00:01:59.344 or even helping to kind of come up with, 00:02:00.486 --> 00:02:05.489 I guess, a process or a test, so to speak, 00:02:06.710 --> 00:02:08.051 for a worker to maybe take 00:02:08.132 --> 00:02:10.014 before they actually 00:02:10.582 --> 00:02:12.705 or put into the job. 00:02:12.724 --> 00:02:13.945 So try to help the worker to 00:02:13.985 --> 00:02:15.807 be successful in whatever 00:02:15.867 --> 00:02:16.709 job that they're in. 00:02:18.540 --> 00:02:19.441 That's a good overview. 00:02:19.461 --> 00:02:19.700 All right. 00:02:19.721 --> 00:02:20.401 So I think you might've 00:02:20.420 --> 00:02:21.061 touched on a couple of 00:02:21.080 --> 00:02:22.122 those things in those pillars, 00:02:22.181 --> 00:02:23.921 but how can orthopedic 00:02:23.981 --> 00:02:24.861 physical therapists 00:02:24.961 --> 00:02:27.402 contribute to workplace health programs? 00:02:27.443 --> 00:02:28.242 You mentioned a couple of 00:02:28.263 --> 00:02:30.543 different big areas, but you know, 00:02:30.582 --> 00:02:31.502 when your work with 00:02:31.562 --> 00:02:33.084 students or educating other 00:02:33.123 --> 00:02:34.824 physical therapists on this, this, 00:02:34.963 --> 00:02:37.063 this location or the way 00:02:37.123 --> 00:02:38.084 physical therapists get to 00:02:38.163 --> 00:02:39.205 interface with humans, 00:02:40.185 --> 00:02:41.485 how can orthopedic PTs 00:02:41.504 --> 00:02:42.865 contribute to workplace health programs? 00:02:44.786 --> 00:02:45.086 Yeah. 00:02:45.105 --> 00:02:46.786 So really kind of, 00:02:48.573 --> 00:02:49.893 How do we how do we tailor 00:02:50.074 --> 00:02:51.354 workplace health programs 00:02:51.454 --> 00:02:52.493 to to the worker? 00:02:52.593 --> 00:02:54.354 So like kind of performing 00:02:54.395 --> 00:02:56.716 an ergonomic assessment and 00:02:57.816 --> 00:02:58.895 really kind of integrating 00:02:58.915 --> 00:03:00.796 that into the workforce? 00:03:01.236 --> 00:03:01.497 You know, 00:03:01.616 --> 00:03:03.198 so I guess kind of thinking about. 00:03:09.150 --> 00:03:10.971 assessing or going into to 00:03:10.991 --> 00:03:12.752 the to the to the workplace, 00:03:13.032 --> 00:03:14.133 looking at the observation 00:03:14.173 --> 00:03:15.074 or observing the worker, 00:03:15.093 --> 00:03:16.655 kind of do their job and 00:03:16.694 --> 00:03:17.735 then trying to use our 00:03:17.795 --> 00:03:18.836 analytical brain to 00:03:18.876 --> 00:03:21.997 identify what it is that 00:03:22.438 --> 00:03:23.840 that we see that could be improved. 00:03:23.939 --> 00:03:26.700 So is the person and is 00:03:26.741 --> 00:03:28.102 their posture less than 00:03:28.201 --> 00:03:29.383 optimal or do they lack 00:03:29.462 --> 00:03:30.563 range of motion to do a 00:03:30.604 --> 00:03:31.525 certain part of the job? 00:03:32.711 --> 00:03:33.953 And then from there kind of 00:03:33.973 --> 00:03:34.973 coming up with either 00:03:35.014 --> 00:03:36.096 individualized or job 00:03:36.116 --> 00:03:38.299 specific kind of programs 00:03:38.359 --> 00:03:41.062 to help improve the worker themselves, 00:03:41.304 --> 00:03:41.503 right? 00:03:41.544 --> 00:03:43.387 Like to allow them to kind 00:03:43.426 --> 00:03:43.947 of live a little bit 00:03:45.426 --> 00:03:46.647 maybe with less risk of 00:03:46.867 --> 00:03:47.867 developing an injury or 00:03:47.888 --> 00:03:49.609 also maybe less pain, um, 00:03:49.769 --> 00:03:50.929 in their job or even at home. 00:03:51.189 --> 00:03:51.650 So, yeah. 00:03:52.250 --> 00:03:52.389 Yeah. 00:03:52.409 --> 00:03:53.310 It seems like wherever a 00:03:53.350 --> 00:03:54.010 worker is going to 00:03:54.070 --> 00:03:55.390 interface with their job, 00:03:55.411 --> 00:03:56.211 whether that be a piece of 00:03:56.271 --> 00:03:57.372 equipment or whatever, 00:03:57.831 --> 00:03:59.193 whatever motion they're going to be, uh, 00:04:00.133 --> 00:04:00.193 uh, 00:04:00.274 --> 00:04:02.253 performing a lot or all day and what 00:04:02.294 --> 00:04:03.354 position those bodies and 00:04:03.435 --> 00:04:05.256 feels like PT really is, 00:04:05.556 --> 00:04:06.616 is pretty poised to be at 00:04:06.635 --> 00:04:07.257 that intersection. 00:04:08.016 --> 00:04:08.276 Yeah. 00:04:08.296 --> 00:04:08.997 I mean, absolutely. 00:04:09.016 --> 00:04:10.557 I think we are kind of movement experts. 00:04:10.598 --> 00:04:12.459 We have the ability to, um, 00:04:12.967 --> 00:04:13.206 you know, 00:04:13.247 --> 00:04:14.608 help people to move better and 00:04:15.028 --> 00:04:16.569 minimize maybe some of 00:04:16.589 --> 00:04:17.449 their inefficiencies, 00:04:17.571 --> 00:04:18.932 which ultimately kind of 00:04:18.971 --> 00:04:21.733 like companies and employers like as well, 00:04:21.834 --> 00:04:23.194 like they like efficiencies 00:04:23.274 --> 00:04:24.675 and they also want to 00:04:24.696 --> 00:04:26.516 minimize worker time off. 00:04:26.617 --> 00:04:28.439 So I think if we have kind of a healthier, 00:04:28.519 --> 00:04:31.060 more well workforce, then we would, 00:04:31.434 --> 00:04:32.153 tend to have a little bit 00:04:32.173 --> 00:04:35.875 better productivity and, um, also, um, 00:04:36.375 --> 00:04:39.115 you know, maybe just a little bit less, 00:04:39.415 --> 00:04:39.555 uh, 00:04:39.716 --> 00:04:41.375 people missing work less for various 00:04:41.475 --> 00:04:42.377 reasons as well. 00:04:42.576 --> 00:04:43.057 So, yeah. 00:04:43.096 --> 00:04:45.757 Uh, I'm sure there are a lot, 00:04:45.797 --> 00:04:46.598 but maybe let's just stick 00:04:46.617 --> 00:04:47.617 to a couple of the common 00:04:47.757 --> 00:04:48.978 workplace injuries that 00:04:49.038 --> 00:04:51.459 physical therapists can help, you know, 00:04:51.499 --> 00:04:53.358 prevent or, or manage. 00:04:53.418 --> 00:04:54.420 What are some of the ones 00:04:54.439 --> 00:04:55.339 that come to mind when I, 00:04:55.459 --> 00:04:56.079 when I mentioned that? 00:04:57.435 --> 00:04:57.735 Yeah, 00:04:57.875 --> 00:05:00.696 I think back pain is such a common 00:05:00.735 --> 00:05:02.096 thing among non-workers. 00:05:02.576 --> 00:05:03.636 So I think it's still back 00:05:03.675 --> 00:05:04.516 and neck pain is a really 00:05:04.557 --> 00:05:07.177 common workplace injury, 00:05:07.997 --> 00:05:11.577 but also overuse type of conditions. 00:05:11.677 --> 00:05:15.139 So when you think about tendinopathy, 00:05:15.178 --> 00:05:18.538 tendinitis, plantar foot pain, 00:05:19.139 --> 00:05:19.899 things like that. 00:05:21.564 --> 00:05:23.444 But really when we get to prevention, 00:05:23.685 --> 00:05:24.786 like I work a lot in 00:05:25.946 --> 00:05:27.706 industry and in the 00:05:27.747 --> 00:05:28.346 environment where the 00:05:28.387 --> 00:05:30.567 worker is on the clock and working. 00:05:30.769 --> 00:05:32.629 And I tell people that I 00:05:32.670 --> 00:05:33.589 don't treat the injured 00:05:33.629 --> 00:05:35.091 worker because if they have an injury, 00:05:35.151 --> 00:05:37.492 then they need to actually 00:05:37.672 --> 00:05:38.512 go through the appropriate 00:05:38.552 --> 00:05:40.252 processes by OSHA and 00:05:40.312 --> 00:05:44.154 submit some type of report. 00:05:44.595 --> 00:05:46.375 And that kind of changes the 00:05:46.396 --> 00:05:47.137 whole dynamics. 00:05:47.237 --> 00:05:49.177 So on my end, it's a little bit, 00:05:50.093 --> 00:05:50.774 kind of maybe a little bit 00:05:50.814 --> 00:05:51.795 more on the preventative side. 00:05:51.855 --> 00:05:53.797 And I look for people who 00:05:54.016 --> 00:05:55.439 maybe complain of soreness 00:05:55.598 --> 00:05:57.920 or stiffness or mention 00:05:58.560 --> 00:05:59.541 that there's something that 00:05:59.562 --> 00:06:01.283 they find challenging in their job. 00:06:01.343 --> 00:06:02.285 And then I try to kind of 00:06:02.404 --> 00:06:04.666 intervene on the front end 00:06:05.708 --> 00:06:06.869 to try to make improvements 00:06:07.389 --> 00:06:08.529 for them so they don't 00:06:08.589 --> 00:06:10.050 actually have a point of 00:06:10.110 --> 00:06:10.891 where they have maybe 00:06:11.833 --> 00:06:12.733 symptoms that would cause 00:06:12.774 --> 00:06:15.196 them to report an injury, so. 00:06:17.670 --> 00:06:17.870 Good. 00:06:18.831 --> 00:06:18.971 Now, 00:06:19.232 --> 00:06:21.293 how do you tailor wellness programs 00:06:21.452 --> 00:06:22.314 for different work 00:06:22.353 --> 00:06:24.495 environments when work can 00:06:24.514 --> 00:06:25.535 mean a lot of things to a 00:06:25.574 --> 00:06:26.396 lot of different people? 00:06:27.076 --> 00:06:28.076 So what's your approach? 00:06:28.117 --> 00:06:28.956 How can you tailor those 00:06:29.016 --> 00:06:29.958 programs for those 00:06:30.437 --> 00:06:33.000 multifaceted different work environments? 00:06:33.740 --> 00:06:34.019 Yeah. 00:06:34.040 --> 00:06:35.500 I mean, 00:06:35.600 --> 00:06:37.982 usually whenever I work in specific 00:06:38.021 --> 00:06:38.423 industries, 00:06:38.463 --> 00:06:40.283 I like to go and spend time 00:06:40.324 --> 00:06:42.564 with the employees and kind of 00:06:43.654 --> 00:06:44.435 If they're on the road, 00:06:44.454 --> 00:06:45.456 I like to ride along. 00:06:45.475 --> 00:06:46.576 If they're in a warehouse, 00:06:46.675 --> 00:06:47.596 I like to kind of stand 00:06:47.637 --> 00:06:48.697 next to them and see what 00:06:48.737 --> 00:06:50.398 they're doing and really 00:06:50.418 --> 00:06:51.617 get to know them and talk 00:06:51.658 --> 00:06:52.598 to them and talk to the 00:06:52.658 --> 00:06:54.259 safety team and talk to the 00:06:55.220 --> 00:06:56.660 executive leadership team 00:06:56.839 --> 00:06:58.901 and gather information first. 00:06:59.000 --> 00:07:00.382 And then once I kind of see 00:07:00.442 --> 00:07:01.942 and understand the job 00:07:01.961 --> 00:07:03.122 demands and the tasks 00:07:03.182 --> 00:07:04.963 themselves and the environment, 00:07:05.004 --> 00:07:05.783 I think the environment's 00:07:05.824 --> 00:07:06.624 really important and that's 00:07:06.663 --> 00:07:07.745 where ergonomics comes in. 00:07:10.312 --> 00:07:11.333 Then I'll try to develop or 00:07:11.353 --> 00:07:12.495 see what the priorities are 00:07:12.574 --> 00:07:14.096 and see what's realistic to 00:07:14.136 --> 00:07:15.757 implement some type of a program. 00:07:15.858 --> 00:07:16.858 So for instance, 00:07:17.038 --> 00:07:18.339 a union versus a non-union 00:07:18.379 --> 00:07:19.261 environment might have a 00:07:19.300 --> 00:07:19.841 little bit different 00:07:19.862 --> 00:07:23.105 implications on where 00:07:23.144 --> 00:07:24.086 they're able to kind of 00:07:24.125 --> 00:07:26.247 implement some type of a 00:07:26.288 --> 00:07:27.149 wellness program. 00:07:28.230 --> 00:07:29.771 And that being said, 00:07:32.028 --> 00:07:32.790 know I'm always trying to 00:07:32.850 --> 00:07:34.791 balance optimal with like 00:07:34.831 --> 00:07:36.213 realistic or doable right 00:07:36.273 --> 00:07:37.574 like optimal would be no 00:07:37.613 --> 00:07:38.755 restrictions I can do what 00:07:38.776 --> 00:07:39.976 I want everybody kind of 00:07:40.576 --> 00:07:41.879 they they do aerobic 00:07:41.939 --> 00:07:43.019 conditioning at work they 00:07:43.040 --> 00:07:43.819 do strength training 00:07:43.860 --> 00:07:44.901 several days a week they're 00:07:44.920 --> 00:07:46.083 working on balance training 00:07:46.122 --> 00:07:46.963 right but that's not 00:07:47.023 --> 00:07:48.204 necessarily that's not 00:07:48.245 --> 00:07:49.526 necessarily realistic so 00:07:49.565 --> 00:07:50.646 it's what how much time do 00:07:50.687 --> 00:07:51.588 I have and what is the 00:07:52.048 --> 00:07:54.009 highest priority and then I 00:07:54.050 --> 00:07:55.190 try to kind of fit that to 00:07:55.250 --> 00:07:56.632 it's um the specific 00:07:57.509 --> 00:07:59.048 worker and or company that 00:07:59.069 --> 00:08:00.149 I'm working with at that time. 00:08:00.550 --> 00:08:00.810 Yeah. 00:08:01.449 --> 00:08:02.629 Any work environments that 00:08:02.649 --> 00:08:03.370 you'd want to mention? 00:08:03.410 --> 00:08:06.271 I mean, I think when I picture, you know, 00:08:06.350 --> 00:08:07.091 workplace health, 00:08:07.630 --> 00:08:09.151 I picture a lot of factories. 00:08:09.411 --> 00:08:11.552 I picture a lot of loading facilities. 00:08:11.612 --> 00:08:13.012 But what are some, you know, 00:08:13.052 --> 00:08:13.951 work and workplace 00:08:14.492 --> 00:08:15.353 environments that maybe 00:08:15.372 --> 00:08:16.533 people wouldn't necessarily 00:08:16.612 --> 00:08:18.132 picture that a PT, you know, 00:08:18.192 --> 00:08:18.913 a PT has been in? 00:08:19.533 --> 00:08:20.454 Yeah, for sure. 00:08:20.514 --> 00:08:23.213 So, I mean, I've worked in warehousing. 00:08:23.374 --> 00:08:23.954 So, like, 00:08:24.074 --> 00:08:25.214 that's probably kind of more what 00:08:25.254 --> 00:08:26.834 you were kind of imagining or thinking. 00:08:26.855 --> 00:08:26.894 So, 00:08:27.894 --> 00:08:28.095 you know, 00:08:28.134 --> 00:08:30.115 essentially people kind of making 00:08:30.235 --> 00:08:31.315 orders and it's really in 00:08:31.336 --> 00:08:32.236 the grocery industry is 00:08:32.256 --> 00:08:34.418 where I do a lot of my, uh, consultation. 00:08:34.778 --> 00:08:36.999 Um, so they're kind of building pallets of, 00:08:37.599 --> 00:08:39.480 of cases of product that go 00:08:39.519 --> 00:08:40.759 to stores and then they're 00:08:40.779 --> 00:08:41.600 loading it on trucks. 00:08:42.441 --> 00:08:43.140 And then actually, um, 00:08:44.481 --> 00:08:45.522 I've done a fair amount in 00:08:45.562 --> 00:08:46.361 the retail side, 00:08:46.422 --> 00:08:48.623 actually on the grocery store side, uh, 00:08:48.682 --> 00:08:51.024 which is, I think maybe a little bit, um, 00:08:51.104 --> 00:08:53.044 interesting or surprising, um, 00:08:53.735 --> 00:08:54.394 to some degree. 00:08:54.495 --> 00:08:55.134 So like really, 00:08:55.195 --> 00:08:57.716 I'm in the other side of the environment. 00:08:57.755 --> 00:08:58.775 So where they have to unload 00:08:58.796 --> 00:08:59.917 the truck and break down 00:08:59.937 --> 00:09:01.017 the pallet and take things 00:09:01.057 --> 00:09:02.418 to their designated area. 00:09:02.457 --> 00:09:03.957 And then they have to essentially, 00:09:03.977 --> 00:09:05.278 you know, 00:09:05.298 --> 00:09:07.198 a grocery store has a produce department, 00:09:07.438 --> 00:09:09.480 a deli, a prepared foods, 00:09:09.799 --> 00:09:10.820 a meat department, 00:09:11.899 --> 00:09:13.821 obviously their grocery goods, a bakery. 00:09:14.730 --> 00:09:14.929 Right. 00:09:14.970 --> 00:09:16.671 So like in each department, 00:09:16.691 --> 00:09:17.370 there's several different 00:09:17.390 --> 00:09:20.613 jobs and some have, you know, 00:09:21.013 --> 00:09:21.633 in our opinion, 00:09:21.653 --> 00:09:22.533 like greater risk than 00:09:22.594 --> 00:09:23.533 others when it comes to 00:09:23.573 --> 00:09:25.215 kind of movement type disorders. 00:09:26.216 --> 00:09:28.557 So that's probably one area 00:09:28.576 --> 00:09:29.557 where I've spent the most time. 00:09:29.576 --> 00:09:32.798 I've also worked in like a 00:09:33.578 --> 00:09:35.460 medical tech company on 00:09:35.480 --> 00:09:36.681 their production side. 00:09:36.780 --> 00:09:38.942 So like they have an 00:09:38.981 --> 00:09:40.461 assembly line and they also 00:09:40.501 --> 00:09:41.802 have a receiving area. 00:09:42.631 --> 00:09:46.835 Um, as well as, um, um, kind of a, 00:09:47.134 --> 00:09:50.157 a team that helps to quality control. 00:09:50.256 --> 00:09:51.798 So like it's a, and an office, 00:09:51.837 --> 00:09:52.217 like there was a 00:09:52.258 --> 00:09:52.697 significant amount of 00:09:52.758 --> 00:09:54.119 office employees there as well. 00:09:54.278 --> 00:09:55.360 So, um, 00:09:55.820 --> 00:09:57.301 and then the last one I actually 00:09:57.341 --> 00:09:58.701 did was I worked with a, uh, 00:09:58.822 --> 00:09:59.721 that I can think of anyway, 00:09:59.761 --> 00:10:00.582 off the top of my head is I 00:10:00.602 --> 00:10:03.063 worked with a nonprofit that, um, 00:10:03.524 --> 00:10:04.205 they actually. 00:10:05.386 --> 00:10:07.687 they quote rescue food. 00:10:07.768 --> 00:10:08.967 So they rescue food that's 00:10:08.988 --> 00:10:09.888 going to spoil and then 00:10:09.908 --> 00:10:10.628 they give it to those that 00:10:10.648 --> 00:10:11.408 are less fortunate. 00:10:11.469 --> 00:10:12.469 So like one of the, 00:10:13.168 --> 00:10:14.208 and so they go all around 00:10:14.229 --> 00:10:16.830 the city and pick up 00:10:16.870 --> 00:10:17.929 different items and then 00:10:17.950 --> 00:10:18.730 they have to try to 00:10:18.770 --> 00:10:19.691 distribute them to like 00:10:19.730 --> 00:10:21.551 local food pantries or 00:10:21.671 --> 00:10:25.993 churches or co-ops and things like that. 00:10:26.033 --> 00:10:26.613 And that was kind of 00:10:26.653 --> 00:10:27.493 interesting because I was 00:10:27.673 --> 00:10:28.452 like literally spent the 00:10:28.493 --> 00:10:29.634 day on the road with these people. 00:10:29.754 --> 00:10:30.734 And, you know, 00:10:30.813 --> 00:10:32.854 not only are they driving hours and hours, 00:10:32.933 --> 00:10:33.894 they have to climb up in 00:10:33.914 --> 00:10:34.815 and out of a box truck 00:10:35.475 --> 00:10:36.676 in and out of the basement of a church. 00:10:37.735 --> 00:10:38.716 And they're handling every 00:10:38.755 --> 00:10:41.018 single package by hand at 00:10:41.057 --> 00:10:41.857 least four times. 00:10:41.878 --> 00:10:43.958 So there's lots of repetition. 00:10:44.379 --> 00:10:44.558 Yeah. 00:10:44.619 --> 00:10:45.919 And you've touched on this a few times, 00:10:46.019 --> 00:10:48.421 but talk about what role 00:10:48.520 --> 00:10:49.981 ergonomic assessment plays 00:10:50.062 --> 00:10:51.522 in workplace health. 00:10:51.701 --> 00:10:53.682 It feels like that's your 00:10:53.743 --> 00:10:55.303 chance to get your eyes or 00:10:55.364 --> 00:10:56.303 some measurements on the 00:10:56.364 --> 00:10:57.345 human involved in this. 00:10:58.791 --> 00:10:59.432 Yeah, for sure. 00:10:59.491 --> 00:11:00.874 So ergonomics is really kind 00:11:00.913 --> 00:11:02.797 of fitting the workplace to the worker, 00:11:02.977 --> 00:11:03.177 right? 00:11:03.217 --> 00:11:04.639 So it's actually not fitting 00:11:04.659 --> 00:11:05.682 the worker to the workplace, 00:11:05.741 --> 00:11:06.604 it's fitting the 00:11:06.644 --> 00:11:08.365 environment and to the 00:11:08.407 --> 00:11:09.408 working population or the 00:11:09.447 --> 00:11:10.409 worker and that interface. 00:11:12.594 --> 00:11:13.934 You know, so if we can really, like, 00:11:14.034 --> 00:11:15.034 we have to, like you said, 00:11:15.054 --> 00:11:15.894 we have two ability, 00:11:16.115 --> 00:11:17.936 two components where we can influence. 00:11:17.975 --> 00:11:19.116 And one of those is the worker. 00:11:19.136 --> 00:11:19.697 And that's kind of our 00:11:19.736 --> 00:11:21.116 traditional stuff that we can think about, 00:11:21.177 --> 00:11:22.457 such as like range of 00:11:22.498 --> 00:11:23.538 motion and strength and 00:11:23.557 --> 00:11:26.178 flexibility and endurance, 00:11:26.259 --> 00:11:26.799 things like that, 00:11:26.860 --> 00:11:28.000 that physical therapists, 00:11:28.259 --> 00:11:28.841 it's kind of in our 00:11:28.860 --> 00:11:30.600 wheelhouse versus like the 00:11:30.660 --> 00:11:32.221 environment is kind of like, you know, 00:11:32.282 --> 00:11:33.461 it's our investigative eye. 00:11:33.522 --> 00:11:34.503 Like we want to make sure, 00:11:34.523 --> 00:11:37.203 and people have different statures, 00:11:37.264 --> 00:11:37.443 right? 00:11:37.464 --> 00:11:39.044 So the more adjustability 00:11:39.105 --> 00:11:41.865 there is in a workplace, the better. 00:11:43.357 --> 00:11:44.558 So I mentioned the bakery 00:11:44.599 --> 00:11:46.360 before and a cake decorator, 00:11:46.380 --> 00:11:47.181 somebody who's decorating 00:11:47.221 --> 00:11:49.363 cookies or cupcakes or something, right? 00:11:49.503 --> 00:11:50.604 Somebody might be five feet 00:11:50.624 --> 00:11:51.904 and somebody might be six, four. 00:11:51.965 --> 00:11:53.225 So we have to be able to 00:11:53.265 --> 00:11:56.969 kind of change the level for that person. 00:11:57.450 --> 00:11:58.389 But the principles of how 00:11:58.409 --> 00:11:59.871 they move shouldn't really change. 00:11:59.912 --> 00:12:00.812 Like that's what we do from 00:12:00.851 --> 00:12:02.153 a PT standpoint is how we 00:12:02.193 --> 00:12:03.615 move those principles stay the same, 00:12:03.634 --> 00:12:05.615 but any type of adjustment 00:12:05.655 --> 00:12:06.817 we can have is really kind 00:12:06.836 --> 00:12:08.938 of what we're looking at in ergonomics. 00:12:09.259 --> 00:12:11.160 And I've also worked on a 00:12:11.280 --> 00:12:12.642 little bit on the engineering side where 00:12:13.136 --> 00:12:14.057 trying to determine like 00:12:14.096 --> 00:12:15.018 what is an appropriate 00:12:15.038 --> 00:12:16.258 height for a certain amount of weight, 00:12:16.538 --> 00:12:18.840 according to like the gross population, 00:12:18.899 --> 00:12:19.100 right? 00:12:19.120 --> 00:12:19.580 How much, 00:12:20.059 --> 00:12:23.240 if 75 to 90 percentile of the population, 00:12:23.360 --> 00:12:24.522 like how can we get to 00:12:24.581 --> 00:12:25.962 where they can succeed in 00:12:26.543 --> 00:12:27.962 whatever environment they're working in? 00:12:28.183 --> 00:12:28.864 So those are, 00:12:29.203 --> 00:12:30.183 that's probably where I spend 00:12:30.244 --> 00:12:30.965 most time kind of 00:12:31.004 --> 00:12:32.024 ergonomically is trying to 00:12:32.065 --> 00:12:33.046 balance and improve 00:12:34.645 --> 00:12:36.366 patient's posture or not 00:12:36.386 --> 00:12:36.927 the patient really, 00:12:36.947 --> 00:12:37.788 I guess it's the worker, right? 00:12:37.827 --> 00:12:39.388 The worker's posture and 00:12:40.009 --> 00:12:41.089 their interface to reduce 00:12:41.109 --> 00:12:42.669 stress on joints, ligaments, and muscles. 00:12:44.431 --> 00:12:45.471 Let's go big picture now. 00:12:45.672 --> 00:12:46.912 How can physical therapists 00:12:47.072 --> 00:12:49.653 advocate for health and wellness at work? 00:12:49.734 --> 00:12:51.614 Is this physical therapist 00:12:51.653 --> 00:12:52.754 approaching an organization? 00:12:52.794 --> 00:12:53.434 It could be physical 00:12:53.475 --> 00:12:54.916 therapists educating 00:12:55.096 --> 00:12:56.777 someone who is now downstream, a worker. 00:12:57.756 --> 00:12:58.357 How would you answer that? 00:12:58.378 --> 00:12:59.538 How can PTs advocate for 00:12:59.557 --> 00:13:01.239 health and wellness at the workplace? 00:13:01.839 --> 00:13:02.899 Yeah, I think at the workplace, 00:13:02.919 --> 00:13:03.600 I mentioned this maybe a 00:13:03.620 --> 00:13:04.880 little bit earlier, is like a healthy, 00:13:04.921 --> 00:13:07.841 well worker is best for 00:13:07.961 --> 00:13:11.644 kind of our whole workforce dynamic. 00:13:11.764 --> 00:13:13.725 So like to a company or a corporation, 00:13:15.183 --> 00:13:15.464 you know, 00:13:15.965 --> 00:13:17.666 like typically a PT that's gonna 00:13:17.725 --> 00:13:18.746 consult or work in industry, 00:13:18.767 --> 00:13:19.106 they're gonna be 00:13:19.147 --> 00:13:21.089 compensated by the company 00:13:21.149 --> 00:13:22.190 that they're working with, right? 00:13:23.735 --> 00:13:26.456 And ultimately if we can 00:13:26.476 --> 00:13:28.697 kind of help to influence 00:13:28.738 --> 00:13:30.219 that culture up top is 00:13:30.298 --> 00:13:31.860 really what helps to drive 00:13:32.360 --> 00:13:33.941 kind of benefits downstream. 00:13:34.140 --> 00:13:35.621 So ultimately like the 00:13:35.682 --> 00:13:37.663 worker is who I feel that I work for, 00:13:37.722 --> 00:13:38.562 even though like the 00:13:38.623 --> 00:13:40.224 company is who compensates 00:13:40.283 --> 00:13:41.345 me for my time. 00:13:41.365 --> 00:13:43.785 And it's really that biopsychosocial model, 00:13:43.885 --> 00:13:44.066 right? 00:13:44.105 --> 00:13:46.607 So we try to kind of with 00:13:46.628 --> 00:13:48.428 statistics and data, try to help to 00:13:49.857 --> 00:13:51.259 influence a company to have 00:13:51.960 --> 00:13:53.241 a safety first culture. 00:13:53.361 --> 00:13:55.524 And then that in that safety first culture, 00:13:55.565 --> 00:13:56.907 maybe we should really think about, 00:13:57.226 --> 00:13:57.427 you know, 00:13:57.447 --> 00:13:58.489 because part of safety is 00:13:58.548 --> 00:14:00.230 environment and health and wellness, 00:14:00.331 --> 00:14:02.374 and how can we have an optimal 00:14:03.481 --> 00:14:04.782 uh optimally healthy and 00:14:04.861 --> 00:14:06.562 well employee that's going 00:14:06.582 --> 00:14:08.202 to really help to drive um 00:14:10.023 --> 00:14:10.703 you know kind of the 00:14:10.764 --> 00:14:12.004 culture and the buy-in so a 00:14:12.163 --> 00:14:14.364 lot of times people feel if 00:14:14.443 --> 00:14:16.125 a company is invested in 00:14:16.184 --> 00:14:17.705 them that they're gonna you 00:14:17.745 --> 00:14:19.784 know maybe work um work 00:14:19.845 --> 00:14:20.905 good work hard for that 00:14:20.966 --> 00:14:22.826 company um versus if they 00:14:22.926 --> 00:14:23.765 say one thing and do 00:14:23.806 --> 00:14:24.826 another then that creates 00:14:24.866 --> 00:14:25.866 kind of a bad culture um 00:14:27.873 --> 00:14:28.232 as well. 00:14:28.373 --> 00:14:29.634 So like big picture, 00:14:29.693 --> 00:14:30.594 I think there's a lot of 00:14:30.653 --> 00:14:33.235 opportunity in the, in the profession, um, 00:14:33.495 --> 00:14:35.195 in kind of health and 00:14:35.215 --> 00:14:36.816 wellness at work and ergonomics. 00:14:37.696 --> 00:14:37.875 Um, 00:14:38.275 --> 00:14:40.197 but also it's getting in front of the 00:14:40.236 --> 00:14:40.756 right people. 00:14:40.856 --> 00:14:41.616 Like I don't, you know, 00:14:41.657 --> 00:14:43.498 workers sometimes have limited, um, 00:14:44.018 --> 00:14:45.519 limited ability to influence, 00:14:45.619 --> 00:14:46.359 but it's just kind of 00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:49.840 continuing to network and, um, really 00:14:50.788 --> 00:14:52.089 You know, I think HR, 00:14:52.288 --> 00:14:53.690 people in the HR side of 00:14:53.750 --> 00:14:55.091 things are interested 00:14:55.150 --> 00:14:56.251 because they wanna make 00:14:56.272 --> 00:14:57.773 sure that they maintain the 00:14:57.812 --> 00:14:58.754 high quality employee 00:14:58.774 --> 00:14:59.695 that's right for the job. 00:14:59.774 --> 00:15:01.475 And then also, you know, 00:15:01.495 --> 00:15:02.716 a lot of my contacts have 00:15:02.756 --> 00:15:03.538 been really in the health 00:15:03.577 --> 00:15:04.758 and safety profession. 00:15:04.879 --> 00:15:06.940 So people that are really 00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:09.162 interested in the safety of the worker. 00:15:09.809 --> 00:15:11.610 not just kind of from an OSHA standpoint, 00:15:11.630 --> 00:15:12.471 but even OSHA's 00:15:13.373 --> 00:15:14.312 Occupational Safety and 00:15:14.332 --> 00:15:15.693 Health Administration, right? 00:15:15.714 --> 00:15:16.695 So they really do care about 00:15:16.735 --> 00:15:17.615 the health of the worker. 00:15:17.875 --> 00:15:19.197 And that's kind of under 00:15:19.256 --> 00:15:21.357 musculoskeletal injuries or 00:15:21.398 --> 00:15:21.899 work-related 00:15:21.918 --> 00:15:23.158 musculoskeletal injuries is 00:15:23.239 --> 00:15:25.181 really where we kind of spend our time. 00:15:26.153 --> 00:15:26.833 In your experience, 00:15:26.894 --> 00:15:29.674 what are the big KPIs that 00:15:29.754 --> 00:15:32.037 either HR organizations pay attention to? 00:15:32.456 --> 00:15:35.158 I'm sure, you know, lost productivity, 00:15:36.038 --> 00:15:36.580 you know, 00:15:37.340 --> 00:15:38.740 reducing the number of days 00:15:39.380 --> 00:15:40.101 workers are out. 00:15:40.142 --> 00:15:41.482 Are there other metrics that 00:15:41.702 --> 00:15:42.923 really make their eyebrows 00:15:43.004 --> 00:15:44.644 go up when someone like 00:15:44.664 --> 00:15:45.605 yourself starts talking to 00:15:45.644 --> 00:15:46.586 about what a PT can do? 00:15:48.167 --> 00:15:48.726 Yeah, I mean, 00:15:48.767 --> 00:15:50.408 I think you hit it with 00:15:50.868 --> 00:15:52.188 productivity is a key one. 00:15:52.208 --> 00:15:53.049 And then also, like, 00:15:54.072 --> 00:15:55.173 dart rate is days away 00:15:55.234 --> 00:15:56.514 restricted time is really 00:15:56.595 --> 00:15:58.817 something so dart d-a-r-t 00:15:58.976 --> 00:16:00.438 is days away restricted 00:16:00.499 --> 00:16:01.239 time and that's what a 00:16:01.278 --> 00:16:02.120 worker that's kind of an 00:16:02.240 --> 00:16:03.480 osha metric that's driven 00:16:04.241 --> 00:16:05.982 um so you know that's 00:16:06.123 --> 00:16:06.783 that's who they really 00:16:06.864 --> 00:16:08.504 answer to is osha so like I 00:16:08.586 --> 00:16:09.625 think that those are the 00:16:09.666 --> 00:16:10.967 metrics that they that they 00:16:11.008 --> 00:16:12.288 care about and the life 00:16:12.349 --> 00:16:13.169 cycle of a worker's 00:16:13.210 --> 00:16:15.091 compensation claim like um 00:16:15.150 --> 00:16:15.851 if you know the 00:16:16.917 --> 00:16:17.897 if you have data and 00:16:17.937 --> 00:16:20.818 statistics on the cost for 00:16:20.938 --> 00:16:22.038 an employee to be in the 00:16:22.078 --> 00:16:25.660 workers' compensation kind of system, 00:16:26.541 --> 00:16:28.581 then there's a little bit more 00:16:31.626 --> 00:16:33.708 money lost not just in costs 00:16:33.769 --> 00:16:34.749 for workers compensation 00:16:34.769 --> 00:16:35.789 but as you mentioned kind 00:16:35.809 --> 00:16:37.110 of lost productivity so 00:16:37.130 --> 00:16:38.672 like you know prevention is 00:16:38.692 --> 00:16:39.753 hard to measure like it's 00:16:39.793 --> 00:16:41.573 not an easy metric to to 00:16:41.634 --> 00:16:42.715 try to to measure and 00:16:42.754 --> 00:16:44.676 justify but I think I even 00:16:44.696 --> 00:16:45.616 think the profession as a 00:16:45.657 --> 00:16:46.638 whole it's kind of where 00:16:46.658 --> 00:16:47.639 we're where we're headed 00:16:47.719 --> 00:16:49.200 hopefully even in our 00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:50.039 medical system and 00:16:50.059 --> 00:16:51.421 reimbursement would be to 00:16:51.461 --> 00:16:53.202 that prevention side but um 00:16:54.192 --> 00:16:55.932 you know, if we can put it, unfortunately, 00:16:56.234 --> 00:16:56.754 or fortunately, 00:16:56.793 --> 00:16:57.654 I think if we put a dollar 00:16:57.695 --> 00:17:01.857 sign to how if we reduce injuries by 10%, 00:17:01.857 --> 00:17:02.438 like this is your 00:17:02.914 --> 00:17:04.497 your savings and ultimately 00:17:04.576 --> 00:17:05.637 like when I talk like 00:17:05.678 --> 00:17:06.618 that's the kind of the 00:17:06.638 --> 00:17:07.759 pitch to the executive 00:17:07.779 --> 00:17:08.980 leadership team and or 00:17:09.040 --> 00:17:09.862 those that are making those 00:17:09.922 --> 00:17:11.042 decisions but to the worker 00:17:11.083 --> 00:17:12.743 themselves you know I just 00:17:12.884 --> 00:17:13.904 I just tell them like we 00:17:13.944 --> 00:17:15.006 want we want you to go home 00:17:15.086 --> 00:17:16.186 and enjoy life outside of 00:17:16.208 --> 00:17:17.368 work right like work work 00:17:17.388 --> 00:17:18.390 can be fun and enjoyable 00:17:18.410 --> 00:17:19.210 and it should be but 00:17:19.250 --> 00:17:20.431 ultimately like we all work 00:17:20.551 --> 00:17:22.393 to have a some type of a 00:17:22.532 --> 00:17:23.473 enjoyment outside of 00:17:23.934 --> 00:17:25.016 outside of work so whatever 00:17:25.036 --> 00:17:25.977 it is that you like to do um 00:17:27.611 --> 00:17:28.832 With your friends, with your family, 00:17:28.932 --> 00:17:30.054 for yourself is really 00:17:30.074 --> 00:17:31.095 where we want you to succeed. 00:17:31.134 --> 00:17:32.096 So we want you to feel just 00:17:32.175 --> 00:17:33.737 as good at home as you do at work. 00:17:33.797 --> 00:17:35.078 So leave in the same way you came in. 00:17:35.739 --> 00:17:38.061 If a physical therapist is listening, 00:17:38.082 --> 00:17:39.123 what are some resources 00:17:39.163 --> 00:17:43.287 you'd suggest that people can get, 00:17:43.326 --> 00:17:43.707 can use, 00:17:43.727 --> 00:17:45.008 can learn from that will help 00:17:45.068 --> 00:17:46.490 them in this particular setting? 00:17:48.362 --> 00:17:50.482 Yeah, I think, you know, 00:17:50.522 --> 00:17:52.084 as far as kind of the 00:17:52.724 --> 00:17:55.046 occupational health special 00:17:55.086 --> 00:17:56.166 interest group here with 00:17:56.247 --> 00:17:57.807 the Academy of Orthopedics 00:17:58.248 --> 00:18:00.829 is a really great resource. 00:18:00.910 --> 00:18:02.790 They have newsletters, they have podcasts, 00:18:02.830 --> 00:18:04.251 they have webinars. 00:18:04.751 --> 00:18:06.373 They have a kind of a home 00:18:06.432 --> 00:18:07.614 study course to current 00:18:07.653 --> 00:18:09.575 concepts of occupational 00:18:09.595 --> 00:18:12.016 health and archive and 00:18:12.056 --> 00:18:13.876 guidelines that are all archived as well. 00:18:15.634 --> 00:18:17.017 They have a recently kind of 00:18:17.096 --> 00:18:17.696 come out with a 00:18:17.817 --> 00:18:18.498 occupational health 00:18:18.577 --> 00:18:20.840 practitioner certification as well. 00:18:20.980 --> 00:18:21.942 So like, that's another. 00:18:22.881 --> 00:18:23.821 kind of component that give 00:18:23.862 --> 00:18:24.382 you a little bit of a 00:18:24.422 --> 00:18:26.364 deeper dive and become 00:18:26.683 --> 00:18:27.905 certified professionally. 00:18:27.925 --> 00:18:30.847 I think that's another component, 00:18:31.528 --> 00:18:32.630 maybe even like bigger 00:18:32.690 --> 00:18:36.373 picture outside of the PT world. 00:18:37.013 --> 00:18:38.515 I think the health and safety industry, 00:18:38.595 --> 00:18:39.715 as I mentioned before, 00:18:41.617 --> 00:18:42.959 several different states. 00:18:43.298 --> 00:18:43.680 So like, 00:18:43.700 --> 00:18:45.361 I think the state of Ohio and 00:18:45.421 --> 00:18:46.342 Washington state, 00:18:47.776 --> 00:18:50.657 Bureau of Labor, like they have, 00:18:50.877 --> 00:18:51.618 they have some pretty good 00:18:51.659 --> 00:18:53.539 resources on worker health 00:18:53.599 --> 00:18:55.461 and safety and ergonomics. 00:18:56.382 --> 00:18:57.083 And even ergonomic, 00:18:57.163 --> 00:18:58.324 like ergonomics themselves, 00:18:58.344 --> 00:18:59.124 there are specific 00:18:59.223 --> 00:19:00.605 ergonomic certifications 00:19:00.786 --> 00:19:03.326 through kind of a certified 00:19:04.067 --> 00:19:05.348 professional ergonomist is 00:19:05.368 --> 00:19:06.869 a certification that would 00:19:06.910 --> 00:19:08.651 be worth maybe kind of exploring, 00:19:08.871 --> 00:19:10.152 depending on what level you 00:19:10.192 --> 00:19:11.953 wanted to invest or spend 00:19:11.993 --> 00:19:13.434 time in this part of the practice. 00:19:14.653 --> 00:19:15.573 And we'll put the link to 00:19:15.613 --> 00:19:16.953 those Academy of Orthopedic 00:19:16.973 --> 00:19:18.394 Physical Therapy resources. 00:19:18.474 --> 00:19:19.154 And you mentioned that's a 00:19:19.194 --> 00:19:21.115 three-step program on your 00:19:21.155 --> 00:19:21.736 way of earning a 00:19:21.776 --> 00:19:23.836 certificate in this particular area. 00:19:24.576 --> 00:19:25.897 Last thing we do on the show, Gordon, 00:19:25.938 --> 00:19:27.057 is called words of wisdom. 00:19:27.198 --> 00:19:28.058 Try to wow people. 00:19:28.098 --> 00:19:28.858 Words of wisdom. 00:19:28.919 --> 00:19:30.098 What would you want to leave 00:19:30.200 --> 00:19:32.240 people with who've been listening so far? 00:19:34.000 --> 00:19:34.280 Yeah. 00:19:34.500 --> 00:19:37.061 I mean, I guess words of wisdom. 00:19:37.182 --> 00:19:38.742 So when we think about 00:19:39.943 --> 00:19:41.723 physical therapy and in the 00:19:41.804 --> 00:19:43.105 outpatient world, like you, 00:19:43.472 --> 00:19:43.692 I mean, 00:19:43.873 --> 00:19:45.213 generally you're seeing one or two 00:19:45.273 --> 00:19:46.515 patients at a time in 00:19:46.555 --> 00:19:47.875 outpatient physical therapy. 00:19:48.957 --> 00:19:50.198 And as I've reflected over 00:19:50.238 --> 00:19:50.999 some of the work that I've 00:19:51.019 --> 00:19:51.858 done in developing 00:19:51.939 --> 00:19:53.441 trainings and being a part of, 00:19:54.320 --> 00:19:56.682 integrated part of a health 00:19:56.702 --> 00:19:57.903 and wellness program with a 00:19:58.044 --> 00:20:00.365 company for almost a decade, like, 00:20:01.310 --> 00:20:02.872 had the ability to kind of 00:20:03.211 --> 00:20:05.574 influence tens of thousands 00:20:05.614 --> 00:20:07.115 of people that I've never even met. 00:20:07.955 --> 00:20:09.215 So I really think like the 00:20:09.336 --> 00:20:10.978 reach or scalability and 00:20:11.097 --> 00:20:13.098 reach in the occupational 00:20:13.138 --> 00:20:15.079 health and wellness and 00:20:15.099 --> 00:20:18.343 ergonomics realm is really 00:20:18.403 --> 00:20:19.383 great and fantastic. 00:20:19.442 --> 00:20:20.723 So I think, you know, 00:20:20.763 --> 00:20:21.744 we have that ability. 00:20:22.728 --> 00:20:24.248 if you kind of get in with 00:20:24.327 --> 00:20:25.509 the company that has the 00:20:25.548 --> 00:20:26.568 right culture and is really 00:20:26.608 --> 00:20:28.088 invested in their worker 00:20:28.169 --> 00:20:30.349 and kind of just global 00:20:30.369 --> 00:20:33.050 health and wellness, like I think that's, 00:20:34.030 --> 00:20:35.351 I think there's a ton of opportunities, 00:20:35.391 --> 00:20:35.990 something that you can be 00:20:36.030 --> 00:20:39.031 excited about and really 00:20:39.051 --> 00:20:40.332 gives us the ability to 00:20:40.372 --> 00:20:42.492 have potentially a huge impact and 00:20:44.336 --> 00:20:46.136 don't even know the scale of your impact, 00:20:46.196 --> 00:20:48.098 but you could change 00:20:48.138 --> 00:20:49.740 somebody's life for the better. 00:20:49.881 --> 00:20:50.320 So yeah, 00:20:50.361 --> 00:20:52.222 I think that's something that I 00:20:52.282 --> 00:20:52.923 reflect upon. 00:20:53.765 --> 00:20:54.285 Very much so. 00:20:54.925 --> 00:20:55.125 Gordon, 00:20:55.145 --> 00:20:56.846 thanks so much for helping us 00:20:56.886 --> 00:20:57.928 understand better the role 00:20:57.968 --> 00:20:58.949 of orthopedic physical 00:20:58.969 --> 00:21:00.530 therapy in workplace health. 00:21:00.570 --> 00:21:01.172 Appreciate your time. 00:21:02.132 --> 00:21:02.692 Thank you, Jimmy. 00:21:02.712 --> 00:21:03.614 I appreciate you having me on.