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Welcome to Press Play, the StreetCred podcast with

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Elena Krasnow, yours truly, and Jimmy Moke from

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StreetCred PR.

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In this podcast, Jimmy and I will welcome

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industry leaders, journalists,

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influencers,

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and friends of the firm to shed some

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light on who they are and the various

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twists and turns that led them to where

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they are today. We're grateful to have you

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listening in, and we hope you enjoy the

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show.

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My name is Elena Krasnow. Welcome to Press

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Play, The Street Credit Podcast. I'm so grateful

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you're here. I'm the marketing manager at Street

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Credit PR and your host for today's show

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along with co host and managing partner, Jimmy

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Mok. We will break down the show into

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two segments,

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press where we dive into all the hard

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news about our guest life and their professional

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goals, and then play where we have a

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little extra fun with it. Today, Jimmy and

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I are delighted to welcome Ryan Van Gorder

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to the show. To give our listeners a

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little more background on Ryan, he is the

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chief executive officer of Opto Investments, a technology

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enabled solution expanding private markets across

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access, sorry, for independent investment advisors.

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Under his leadership, Opto has distinguished itself from

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competitors by creating a unique alignment of interest

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with advisors.

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Prior to joining Opto, Ryan was a managing

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director at BlackRock where he led finance in

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the Asia Pacific region, And throughout his time

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there played a role in growing the asset

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management platform up to 10 up to 10,000,000,000,000

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from a little over 1,000,000,000,000 when he joined.

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Ryan has more than twenty years of financial

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services experience and began his career in 2001

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at Queloz, a Seattle based hedge fund of

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funds.

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When he's not focused on building Opto into

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a world class business,

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Ryan can be found running, biking,

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or adventure racing, which we will talk about

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more in just a bit. Ryan, welcome to

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the show.

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Alright. Couldn't be more pumped to be here.

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Good to see you, Elena and Jimmy. Good

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to see you. So great to have you

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on the pod. Thanks for joining us.

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Yeah. I think the last time we saw

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you was, Future Proof in the sun.

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That's right.

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It's it's, the sun's coming back. Super excited

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about summer.

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Excited to spend more time with you guys.

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Likewise.

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And, Ryan, one thing that Elena didn't mention

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in her,

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opening intro is that you are also

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sometimes able to be found on the river

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in a kayak. Is that right? There you

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go.

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This is true. Spend a lot of time

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on the water as much as I can,

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paddling with friends whether we're in rivers or

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in the ocean. It's one of one of

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my one of my faves. What about surfing?

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Is so fun. Do you surf too?

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I do. I'm

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a horrible surfer, but I love it. It's

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one of those things that you need some

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some reps to,

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be very good at. And as soon as

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it falls off, then I just enjoy bobbing

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in the water with my friends and catching

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one out of every 10 waves that I

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try to catch.

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There you go. Well, I am a I'm

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a body surfer. That's it. I can't stand

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on a board. I would embarrass myself. So

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there's that.

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Love it.

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I am not a surfer, but I enjoy

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observing the surfers, and I'm very impressed.

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Cool. Thanks again for joining us. It's so

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fun to have you on the show.

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And as we like to start all of

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our podcasts, my first question for you, Ryan,

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is what did you have for lunch today,

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or what do you plan to have?

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Well, today's a big day. I was really

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hungry, so I went down to the

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taco truck down the street

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at First And Howard in SoMa in San

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Francisco at El Vaco

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Loco

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and got the pork torta.

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Yum.

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It's so good.

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Grease was dripping down my elbow. The one

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that it's gonna have me do is definitely

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ride my bike home and do a workout.

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I might even start here with some jumping

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jacks.

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That is a that is a press play

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first right there. Exercising on the pod.

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That's right. That's right. Well, if we had

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some of our team members here, we might

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have Emma on the bike desk, Meg on

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the walking pad. You know? That does happen

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from time to time.

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And if I were with Ryan right now

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in San Francisco, you would have me with

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him at the taco

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truck. True. We would have to do more

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like man on the street podcast style

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reviewing tacos or something like that. Indeed.

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Awesome. Well, let's get into it. We have

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so much we wanna talk talk about with

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you today, Ryan.

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But just to start us off, tell us

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and our listeners a little bit about your

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background and what led you to becoming CEO

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of Opto, and, you know, how your team

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is doing things differently when it comes to

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private markets investing.

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Yeah. So I'll start with background and

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I think I Start as far back as

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you want. Like, one years old, 10 years

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old, whatever you want.

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Okay. Let's see. I'll take you back to

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the late nineties in college.

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So I went to school in Durango, Colorado,

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and I graduated with an accounting degree.

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My first declared major was field biology.

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My second declared major was

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ski resort tourism management.

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Amazing. I convinced my parents that that was

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actually a real thing.

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And then what I found out was I

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love the rules and framework of accounting.

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I'm pretty good with math,

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and I was able to really understand that

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framework and extrapolate that into business. So I

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graduated with an accounting degree, and I loved

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it.

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Shout out to Fort Lewis College Skyhawks out

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there. There's not many of us, but, big

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shout out. And then,

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from there, I went to,

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one piece of my career. I don't actually

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bring up often, but I did a little

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over a year at the resort at Squaw

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Creek, which is

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a a large resort next to Squaw Valley,

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which is now called Palisades.

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And my job was the income audit manager,

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and I managed the night auditors there. It

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took me about four months to fully automate

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everything that was happening there

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and,

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sort of reconstruct that, which is

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why I ended up leaving and moving up

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to Seattle to join a a start up.

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And it was a start up that we

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joined I joined in

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late ninety nine two thousand.

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It's called Avenue a.

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We brought the company public

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on 02/29/2001.

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We'll have to fact check the, the IPO

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day, but I certainly remember it being a

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leap year. And

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it was a wild ride. It was the.com

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boom and bust,

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sleeping under my desk, working twenty hour days.

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I lived at my aunt's house on Bainbridge

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Island. I missed the 01:40AM

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ferry often,

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slept under my desk, went to the vault,

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which was the gym I belonged at, took

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a shower, and came back to work. Wow.

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It's one of the experiences that,

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is so memorable and character building. And I

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met a lot of really good people and

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worked with a lot of really good people

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that are now out in the wild doing

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awesome things.

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And it was a digital media company, which

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at the time was very new.

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So, the company is still alive today in

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the form of a ray, Razorfish, which is

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an agency out of New York.

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And, Microsoft

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did a full stock purchase of

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the equity

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in 2005 and then took the tech in

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house and spun out the agency as Razorfish.

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But,

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anyways, I did that for,

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I'll just round up and call it a

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couple years. And then after the dot com

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bust,

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I got wooed into financial services with

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company called Qualos, which is,

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gets billed as a hedge fund to fund,

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private equity fund to fund.

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It also had a wealth management boutique,

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attached to it, and that's what we call

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it then. I think today we'd call it

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a multifamily office.

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And, we grew the business to about 23,000,000,000

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in assets under management.

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We had a a large list of clients.

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We We had a broker dealer. We had

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all these businesses, and then BlackRock came along

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and bought

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Qualos.

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They did not do a company acquisition. They

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did an asset purchase agreement. So they lifted

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all the funds out of Qualos and brought

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them into BlackRock to build out their Alts

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platform. And it was our first Alts acquisition.

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It came off the heels of buying,

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Milim, which is Merrill Lynch Investment Management.

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So,

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that was sort of my entry view to

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to BlackRock. And when I joined,

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about 1,600

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people.

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Fast forward when I left, I think it

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was 14,000 people. And I think today it

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might be 20,000.

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And,

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it was their first foray into alts.

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I came in and sort of sat on

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the the acquisition for both BlackRock and Qualos,

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and then, basically got to help them build

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out their alts platform from a finance perspective,

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and then partner with a lot of people

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running businesses and learn how to build businesses,

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the BlackRock way, which is

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really, based on scale and process, and it

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was a a fabulous experience. I did sixteen

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years at BlackRock.

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I don't think I ever held a role

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longer than three years.

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Part of their ethos is to move people

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around,

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reward you with new opportunities, exposure, experience.

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I like that. I very much appreciate it

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because

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I do think variety is the spice of

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life.

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From an operator perspective, it also is nice

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for controls to make sure that you're sort

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of moving people and building process that anybody

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can plug into.

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And then,

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I would say from those last three experiences

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and particularly from growing up in financial services

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at Quellos, I had seen

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some form of the power law exhibited in

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terms of high alpha and returns, and I

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was wondering why this was happening in ultra

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high net worth portfolios and, at the time,

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not my portfolio

271
00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:37,820
per se or

272
00:09:38,225 --> 00:09:40,065
people who are in their late twenties or

273
00:09:40,065 --> 00:09:41,365
early thirties and wondering,

274
00:09:43,504 --> 00:09:44,004
why

275
00:09:44,625 --> 00:09:46,485
an illiquid long term

276
00:09:47,345 --> 00:09:48,404
high alpha opportunity

277
00:09:48,865 --> 00:09:50,884
exposure wouldn't be in people who have

278
00:09:51,259 --> 00:09:53,339
time on their side and are building for

279
00:09:53,339 --> 00:09:55,279
multi decade retirement down the road.

280
00:09:55,899 --> 00:09:58,940
I had seen software deliver scale and efficiency

281
00:09:58,940 --> 00:10:00,539
in the form of Avenue a in my

282
00:10:00,539 --> 00:10:02,799
experience there. I'd seen the alpha piece.

283
00:10:03,339 --> 00:10:05,100
And then at BlackRock, what I saw were

284
00:10:05,100 --> 00:10:06,240
all the different channels

285
00:10:07,465 --> 00:10:09,784
of wealth that come into the investment management

286
00:10:09,784 --> 00:10:11,004
space from the institutional

287
00:10:11,384 --> 00:10:13,304
space to the retail space and everything in

288
00:10:13,304 --> 00:10:13,804
between

289
00:10:14,745 --> 00:10:16,205
and saw that the wealth

290
00:10:17,144 --> 00:10:18,825
what would be referred to as a wealth

291
00:10:18,825 --> 00:10:20,985
channel, but really the wealth space in America,

292
00:10:20,985 --> 00:10:22,445
the independent wealth space

293
00:10:23,279 --> 00:10:25,759
had been somewhat underserved in terms of their

294
00:10:25,759 --> 00:10:26,740
access to privates.

295
00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:30,320
We had perhaps accomplished this zero to one

296
00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:31,779
type experience where

297
00:10:32,159 --> 00:10:34,179
we went from no access to access.

298
00:10:35,414 --> 00:10:37,574
And that was sort of felt a little

299
00:10:37,574 --> 00:10:39,434
good, but not a lot good,

300
00:10:40,134 --> 00:10:40,634
because

301
00:10:40,934 --> 00:10:42,534
I had the ability to put on my

302
00:10:42,534 --> 00:10:44,714
X-ray glasses and look at what the retail

303
00:10:45,014 --> 00:10:46,855
and wealth market was being served, and it

304
00:10:46,855 --> 00:10:47,834
didn't feel awesome.

305
00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:50,420
Nobody

306
00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:53,940
really would put their friends into a mega

307
00:10:54,160 --> 00:10:56,179
cap fund 47

308
00:10:56,399 --> 00:10:58,660
that's serving up beta like returns

309
00:10:59,920 --> 00:11:00,420
for

310
00:11:01,054 --> 00:11:03,294
400 basis points of fees when you know

311
00:11:03,294 --> 00:11:04,574
they could just go get an S and

312
00:11:04,574 --> 00:11:06,975
P 500 ETF for three basis points and

313
00:11:06,975 --> 00:11:07,954
get the same return.

314
00:11:08,414 --> 00:11:08,914
Mhmm.

315
00:11:09,694 --> 00:11:10,194
So,

316
00:11:11,375 --> 00:11:14,370
the industry the private market industry and investment

317
00:11:14,370 --> 00:11:16,209
management industry in that sense took some steps,

318
00:11:16,209 --> 00:11:17,889
but it didn't feel like the real solution.

319
00:11:17,889 --> 00:11:19,429
So the combination of

320
00:11:21,009 --> 00:11:23,190
trying to deliver quality product

321
00:11:23,569 --> 00:11:24,789
in search of alpha

322
00:11:25,730 --> 00:11:26,949
Mhmm. Trying to,

323
00:11:29,134 --> 00:11:31,455
use technology to deliver it in a seamless

324
00:11:31,455 --> 00:11:31,955
fashion

325
00:11:35,535 --> 00:11:37,934
and really having a sort of bold and

326
00:11:37,934 --> 00:11:39,615
principled approach that allows you to have a

327
00:11:39,615 --> 00:11:42,480
different and aligned model versus a distribution model

328
00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:44,480
was something that I was looking for. And

329
00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:47,039
I got introduced to Joe Lonsdale and his

330
00:11:47,039 --> 00:11:49,440
formation of the company, and he had his

331
00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:50,500
circle of founders.

332
00:11:51,839 --> 00:11:52,339
And,

333
00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:54,480
when I talked to him, I knew that

334
00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:55,839
this was it. This was the problem I've

335
00:11:55,839 --> 00:11:57,714
been staring at, and it's a a problem

336
00:11:57,714 --> 00:11:58,934
that I really wanted to

337
00:11:59,314 --> 00:12:01,475
have a part of trying to solve or

338
00:12:01,475 --> 00:12:02,855
at least be part of the solution.

339
00:12:03,714 --> 00:12:06,115
And, couldn't be happier with the introduction and

340
00:12:06,115 --> 00:12:07,954
the group of founders that I met and

341
00:12:07,954 --> 00:12:09,954
now all of my employees. So,

342
00:12:10,595 --> 00:12:12,570
we have arrived. We're here. We're excited about

343
00:12:12,570 --> 00:12:13,789
it. Let's go.

344
00:12:14,090 --> 00:12:16,490
What a wild journey. Let's Yeah.

345
00:12:16,970 --> 00:12:19,529
Let's hit the rewind button real quickly, if

346
00:12:19,529 --> 00:12:21,309
you don't mind, Ryan. Yeah.

347
00:12:21,769 --> 00:12:24,649
One of my best friends, and I'm sure

348
00:12:24,649 --> 00:12:27,049
I'm gonna get, some gruff for this, and

349
00:12:27,049 --> 00:12:28,264
even a fraternity

350
00:12:28,805 --> 00:12:30,585
brother was actually at Razorfish.

351
00:12:31,285 --> 00:12:32,965
And I didn't know that,

352
00:12:33,524 --> 00:12:35,524
that you you might have crossed paths with

353
00:12:35,524 --> 00:12:37,945
him. He was, one of their top developers.

354
00:12:38,165 --> 00:12:38,665
But

355
00:12:39,860 --> 00:12:42,899
what's what's really interesting about your journey from

356
00:12:42,899 --> 00:12:44,120
Avenue Way to Razorfish,

357
00:12:44,500 --> 00:12:45,959
you you were dealing with

358
00:12:46,500 --> 00:12:47,480
the volatility

359
00:12:48,179 --> 00:12:49,159
of the markets

360
00:12:49,620 --> 00:12:52,360
during this during the .com

361
00:12:52,500 --> 00:12:53,639
boom and,

362
00:12:54,764 --> 00:12:56,545
subsequent crash. Right?

363
00:12:57,245 --> 00:12:59,325
And being early on in your career, I'd

364
00:12:59,325 --> 00:13:00,384
imagine that,

365
00:13:01,965 --> 00:13:02,625
you were,

366
00:13:03,085 --> 00:13:04,945
you know, pressure makes diamonds.

367
00:13:05,325 --> 00:13:07,805
Right? Like, those were some tough times. I

368
00:13:07,805 --> 00:13:08,305
remember

369
00:13:08,899 --> 00:13:09,399
young

370
00:13:09,940 --> 00:13:11,540
Jimmy who and I did a lot of

371
00:13:11,540 --> 00:13:13,639
dot com PR back in the day.

372
00:13:14,500 --> 00:13:15,000
Poof.

373
00:13:15,379 --> 00:13:18,679
So many of these companies just literally disappeared

374
00:13:19,379 --> 00:13:22,924
almost after their hundred thousand dollar launch party

375
00:13:22,924 --> 00:13:25,504
somewhere in Manhattan or San Francisco.

376
00:13:26,044 --> 00:13:27,804
I'm sure you remember those days, and I

377
00:13:27,804 --> 00:13:30,764
know that at least recently couple, Jimmy. Yeah.

378
00:13:30,764 --> 00:13:32,524
Same here. They were a lot of fun,

379
00:13:32,524 --> 00:13:34,924
especially for 25 year old Jimmy living in

380
00:13:34,924 --> 00:13:36,360
New York City at the time.

381
00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:39,980
And then you

382
00:13:40,439 --> 00:13:40,939
you

383
00:13:41,399 --> 00:13:43,959
you went through that market volatility, and then

384
00:13:43,959 --> 00:13:46,440
you got into the fund to fund space

385
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:47,579
at Queloz,

386
00:13:48,714 --> 00:13:49,455
And then

387
00:13:49,835 --> 00:13:52,894
with BlackRock, you're you're watching the the

388
00:13:53,995 --> 00:13:55,774
the beginning, the foray,

389
00:13:56,075 --> 00:13:56,575
the

390
00:13:57,595 --> 00:14:00,254
the BlackRock itself walking into the

391
00:14:00,714 --> 00:14:04,174
alt space with full intention. Is that right?

392
00:14:04,610 --> 00:14:05,269
That's right.

393
00:14:05,970 --> 00:14:06,950
Building this.

394
00:14:07,570 --> 00:14:10,870
Roller coaster ride. Here we go. Yeah. Yeah.

395
00:14:11,090 --> 00:14:12,710
And and there's siren.

396
00:14:13,250 --> 00:14:15,649
Yeah. Well well, there's also this this,

397
00:14:16,210 --> 00:14:17,730
I don't know if it's if the economy

398
00:14:17,730 --> 00:14:19,350
is the right word, but you went from

399
00:14:20,184 --> 00:14:21,804
start up to

400
00:14:22,904 --> 00:14:25,884
a sound what sounds like a more, obviously,

401
00:14:26,024 --> 00:14:26,524
established

402
00:14:27,144 --> 00:14:28,044
fund to funds,

403
00:14:28,664 --> 00:14:30,924
and then you went to the behemoth.

404
00:14:31,304 --> 00:14:32,985
Mhmm. What what was that like as a

405
00:14:32,985 --> 00:14:35,225
as a professional? No matter what you might

406
00:14:35,225 --> 00:14:37,360
have been doing or what your job function

407
00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:39,519
was like, talk a little bit about what

408
00:14:39,519 --> 00:14:40,340
that was like

409
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:43,220
as you were were finding your way

410
00:14:43,759 --> 00:14:45,940
as a leader in financial services.

411
00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:49,460
Yeah. I think that maybe the most

412
00:14:49,845 --> 00:14:51,924
profound thing for me was the structure and

413
00:14:51,924 --> 00:14:52,664
the process.

414
00:14:54,485 --> 00:14:57,284
And what I mean was the .com startup

415
00:14:57,284 --> 00:14:57,784
was

416
00:14:59,204 --> 00:14:59,704
chaos,

417
00:15:00,964 --> 00:15:02,644
and we spent a lot of time trying

418
00:15:02,644 --> 00:15:04,230
to organize. So we did bring it together

419
00:15:04,230 --> 00:15:05,669
when you file with the SEC to go

420
00:15:05,669 --> 00:15:07,029
public. There's a lot of work that needs

421
00:15:07,029 --> 00:15:09,029
to be done in organization admin, but it

422
00:15:09,029 --> 00:15:11,830
still was off spread. Things are on fire.

423
00:15:11,830 --> 00:15:12,309
You're going

424
00:15:13,909 --> 00:15:15,750
the Quello story for me was sort of,

425
00:15:15,750 --> 00:15:17,625
like, growth, but we weren't a lot of

426
00:15:17,625 --> 00:15:20,125
people. We were, I think, 200 ish people

427
00:15:20,985 --> 00:15:22,345
at the time of the acquisition. And then

428
00:15:22,345 --> 00:15:24,184
we we got into this space. It was

429
00:15:24,184 --> 00:15:26,924
1,600 people. And it was just

430
00:15:27,464 --> 00:15:29,144
a year before maybe a year and a

431
00:15:29,144 --> 00:15:32,110
half before they doubled by buying Barclays Global

432
00:15:32,110 --> 00:15:32,610
International,

433
00:15:32,990 --> 00:15:35,009
BGI, which was the iShares franchise

434
00:15:35,550 --> 00:15:37,809
amongst other businesses coming on board.

435
00:15:38,190 --> 00:15:38,690
And,

436
00:15:41,950 --> 00:15:42,769
the process

437
00:15:43,149 --> 00:15:44,370
that was in place

438
00:15:45,725 --> 00:15:47,264
and the way that BlackRock

439
00:15:47,804 --> 00:15:50,865
achieved scale from that process, which is sort

440
00:15:51,245 --> 00:15:53,964
of the centers of excellence and having scale

441
00:15:53,964 --> 00:15:56,044
and leverage from a back office that's totally

442
00:15:56,044 --> 00:15:57,644
repeatable. And when you add on a business,

443
00:15:57,644 --> 00:15:59,004
it's just the front end of the business,

444
00:15:59,004 --> 00:15:59,669
and they

445
00:16:00,149 --> 00:16:02,970
use all the the, infrastructure to support that,

446
00:16:04,070 --> 00:16:04,809
was legitimate

447
00:16:05,269 --> 00:16:07,350
and was built by real business builders. They

448
00:16:07,350 --> 00:16:09,829
had hired and were thinking about this, and

449
00:16:09,829 --> 00:16:11,269
they were getting ready to go on a

450
00:16:11,269 --> 00:16:13,610
real acquisitive run. It hasn't stopped.

451
00:16:15,585 --> 00:16:17,024
Hasn't stopped at all in the sense of

452
00:16:17,024 --> 00:16:19,105
the fact that in 2024,

453
00:16:19,105 --> 00:16:21,904
I believe, they bought Prequin and Mhmm. For

454
00:16:21,904 --> 00:16:22,785
$3,000,000,000

455
00:16:22,785 --> 00:16:23,684
private market

456
00:16:24,144 --> 00:16:24,644
data

457
00:16:25,024 --> 00:16:26,245
driven company.

458
00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:28,660
They are very good at

459
00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:30,740
process achieving scale.

460
00:16:32,639 --> 00:16:35,040
Maybe the less fun part is synergies and

461
00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:36,720
saving money as a result of it and

462
00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:39,759
then also integrations. But, sir, that that's one

463
00:16:39,759 --> 00:16:41,200
of the things that really stood out to

464
00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:41,679
me. And,

465
00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:44,455
from a business building perspective to put that

466
00:16:44,455 --> 00:16:46,075
lens on and see like, oh, okay.

467
00:16:47,174 --> 00:16:48,615
We're about ready to go on this tear.

468
00:16:48,615 --> 00:16:49,654
How are we gonna do it in an

469
00:16:49,654 --> 00:16:50,475
effective way?

470
00:16:51,014 --> 00:16:53,254
There it was profound, and a lot of

471
00:16:53,254 --> 00:16:55,029
people don't geek out on that stuff. But

472
00:16:55,029 --> 00:16:56,389
because I've been a part of a lot

473
00:16:56,389 --> 00:16:58,309
of different businesses and built a lot of

474
00:16:58,309 --> 00:17:00,789
businesses within the walls of other companies as

475
00:17:00,789 --> 00:17:02,470
well as being part of building one now,

476
00:17:02,470 --> 00:17:04,150
I think about that that stuff quite a

477
00:17:04,150 --> 00:17:04,650
bit.

478
00:17:05,109 --> 00:17:06,250
I bet. Fascinating.

479
00:17:06,549 --> 00:17:09,589
Must have been a wild journey and Yeah.

480
00:17:09,914 --> 00:17:11,535
Such a ton of great experiences

481
00:17:11,914 --> 00:17:12,654
that you've

482
00:17:12,955 --> 00:17:13,855
were able to

483
00:17:14,154 --> 00:17:14,654
accumulate,

484
00:17:15,275 --> 00:17:16,734
refine, and and sharpen.

485
00:17:17,355 --> 00:17:17,855
Totally.

486
00:17:18,875 --> 00:17:22,015
Not that markets right now are under such

487
00:17:22,234 --> 00:17:24,335
duress as they were during the

488
00:17:25,380 --> 00:17:28,660
the .com days, but volatility is back. You

489
00:17:28,660 --> 00:17:29,400
can blame

490
00:17:29,700 --> 00:17:30,759
tariffs or

491
00:17:31,539 --> 00:17:32,039
inflation,

492
00:17:32,500 --> 00:17:34,519
both, whatever you'd like, DC.

493
00:17:34,860 --> 00:17:35,360
Mhmm.

494
00:17:35,700 --> 00:17:36,600
What Weather.

495
00:17:36,980 --> 00:17:37,220
What

496
00:17:39,085 --> 00:17:40,625
talk a little bit about that.

497
00:17:40,924 --> 00:17:42,384
You know, here we are again,

498
00:17:42,845 --> 00:17:45,565
and now you are in this seat at

499
00:17:45,565 --> 00:17:46,305
at Opto

500
00:17:47,565 --> 00:17:49,805
and what that means to the clients that

501
00:17:49,805 --> 00:17:51,745
you serve and and their end investors.

502
00:17:53,565 --> 00:17:54,384
Yeah. I think,

503
00:17:55,450 --> 00:17:57,130
well, maybe I'll just sort of go back

504
00:17:57,130 --> 00:17:58,750
and say the GFC experience

505
00:17:59,130 --> 00:18:01,369
also. Okay. I mean, yeah, that was my

506
00:18:01,369 --> 00:18:03,529
next question too because you started at BlackRock.

507
00:18:03,769 --> 00:18:06,009
Really fascinating things there. And one is the

508
00:18:06,009 --> 00:18:07,609
company that we're part of sold at the

509
00:18:07,609 --> 00:18:08,589
peak of the market.

510
00:18:09,674 --> 00:18:11,674
Wow. And it's questionable as to whether or

511
00:18:11,674 --> 00:18:13,115
not they would have survived it. It was

512
00:18:13,115 --> 00:18:14,954
a hedge fund of funds in a time

513
00:18:14,954 --> 00:18:16,095
that Bernie Madoff's

514
00:18:16,714 --> 00:18:19,134
experience came out and a series of other

515
00:18:19,674 --> 00:18:22,174
funds, large institutional funds went down.

516
00:18:22,630 --> 00:18:24,869
Hedge fund to funds lost their steam. They

517
00:18:24,869 --> 00:18:26,549
sold at the peak of that market. So

518
00:18:26,549 --> 00:18:28,250
just there could have been an existential

519
00:18:28,630 --> 00:18:30,869
crisis that they averted, and then we got

520
00:18:30,869 --> 00:18:33,029
put into a large machine that used the

521
00:18:33,029 --> 00:18:35,269
real value of of their purchase in that

522
00:18:35,269 --> 00:18:35,769
regards.

523
00:18:36,150 --> 00:18:37,589
And so it acted kind of as a

524
00:18:37,589 --> 00:18:40,365
buffer, but, I believe that we were part

525
00:18:40,365 --> 00:18:43,325
of, shortly thereafter, the first layoff that that,

526
00:18:43,884 --> 00:18:44,865
they had experienced

527
00:18:45,484 --> 00:18:47,024
Mhmm. Or that they had executed.

528
00:18:47,404 --> 00:18:47,884
And,

529
00:18:48,444 --> 00:18:49,105
that was

530
00:18:49,565 --> 00:18:51,724
some shock and awe within that organization to

531
00:18:51,724 --> 00:18:52,384
go through

532
00:18:52,710 --> 00:18:55,109
the the volatility and roller coaster and reaction.

533
00:18:55,109 --> 00:18:57,429
But now it's, like, from a market perspective,

534
00:18:57,429 --> 00:18:59,190
people will look and see in large asset

535
00:18:59,190 --> 00:19:00,409
managers. That's just,

536
00:19:01,429 --> 00:19:02,329
part of the

537
00:19:02,789 --> 00:19:05,109
the course. It's it's just gonna happen over

538
00:19:05,109 --> 00:19:06,730
and over again, and large

539
00:19:07,035 --> 00:19:09,355
money managers will follow that. Now what I

540
00:19:09,355 --> 00:19:11,275
would say is, and bring it back to

541
00:19:11,275 --> 00:19:11,775
today,

542
00:19:12,795 --> 00:19:15,275
is we exist in a very special part

543
00:19:15,275 --> 00:19:17,855
of a whole portfolio perspective, and that's in

544
00:19:18,075 --> 00:19:19,215
the private markets.

545
00:19:19,869 --> 00:19:22,269
And the private markets have longer duration, and

546
00:19:22,269 --> 00:19:23,089
there's reasons,

547
00:19:24,269 --> 00:19:26,450
there are regulatory reasons and

548
00:19:26,750 --> 00:19:28,509
business reasons and a lot of different reasons

549
00:19:28,509 --> 00:19:29,569
why that's the case.

550
00:19:30,269 --> 00:19:30,750
It also

551
00:19:32,265 --> 00:19:33,484
because it's not

552
00:19:33,865 --> 00:19:36,744
a sentiment driven or day to day mark

553
00:19:36,744 --> 00:19:38,125
to mark on the value,

554
00:19:39,305 --> 00:19:40,445
investors in the space

555
00:19:40,825 --> 00:19:42,744
can be very emotional about the things that

556
00:19:42,744 --> 00:19:44,825
matter, which are what are the jobs I'm

557
00:19:44,825 --> 00:19:47,144
creating? What's the problem I'm solving? Where's my

558
00:19:47,144 --> 00:19:48,960
money going to work? And how are the

559
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:51,200
operators of those companies gonna react to that

560
00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:51,700
environment?

561
00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:54,019
It's a very

562
00:19:55,599 --> 00:19:57,279
awesome space to be as well as sort

563
00:19:57,279 --> 00:19:58,900
of outside of the volatility,

564
00:20:00,079 --> 00:20:01,299
just in terms of

565
00:20:02,884 --> 00:20:04,424
the volume of investors

566
00:20:05,605 --> 00:20:08,664
in efficient markets that are now realizing that

567
00:20:09,125 --> 00:20:10,105
there's a

568
00:20:10,565 --> 00:20:11,464
high multiple

569
00:20:12,644 --> 00:20:15,304
of businesses and opportunities in the private markets

570
00:20:15,605 --> 00:20:16,585
to create value

571
00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:19,559
than than there are in the public markets

572
00:20:19,559 --> 00:20:20,539
to invest in.

573
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:23,080
Mhmm. And I feel like that multiple is

574
00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:24,920
changing every day. You know, we used to

575
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:26,779
talk about, like, there are six

576
00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:29,320
times the amount of investable opportunities in the

577
00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,234
private markets than there are in the public

578
00:20:31,234 --> 00:20:33,954
markets. It change it's changing rapidly as as

579
00:20:33,954 --> 00:20:37,014
things are getting more accessible, as there's more,

580
00:20:38,115 --> 00:20:39,815
efficient ways to get into

581
00:20:40,595 --> 00:20:43,494
stock ownership in the private markets, into managers

582
00:20:43,554 --> 00:20:45,494
that sort of invest in that space. And,

583
00:20:46,049 --> 00:20:48,370
as you apply a modern portfolio theory and

584
00:20:48,370 --> 00:20:50,610
build more efficient portfolios that do have a

585
00:20:50,610 --> 00:20:52,549
risk allocation to the private markets,

586
00:20:53,090 --> 00:20:55,269
and we make it easier to do that,

587
00:20:55,570 --> 00:20:56,950
we're in a very special place

588
00:20:57,970 --> 00:20:58,710
to aid

589
00:20:59,090 --> 00:20:59,590
people

590
00:21:00,514 --> 00:21:02,835
investing in better ways for their future, and

591
00:21:02,835 --> 00:21:04,134
we're excited about that,

592
00:21:05,234 --> 00:21:07,394
especially in terms of volatility. It's a good,

593
00:21:07,714 --> 00:21:10,054
there's a good story there. I mean yeah.

594
00:21:10,115 --> 00:21:11,875
And I I have to go back because

595
00:21:11,875 --> 00:21:14,900
BlackRock is such a prolific organization, and you

596
00:21:14,900 --> 00:21:16,420
started there in 02/2007.

597
00:21:16,420 --> 00:21:16,920
Right?

598
00:21:17,380 --> 00:21:19,619
Yeah. So you're, like, in the middle, in

599
00:21:19,619 --> 00:21:21,240
the thick of it with the GFC.

600
00:21:22,019 --> 00:21:24,180
Do you have, like, some big takeaways or,

601
00:21:24,180 --> 00:21:26,259
you know, specific memories from that time at

602
00:21:26,259 --> 00:21:26,920
the organization?

603
00:21:28,835 --> 00:21:29,954
Oh, yeah. It was,

604
00:21:30,674 --> 00:21:32,855
chaos. I mean I can only imagine.

605
00:21:33,714 --> 00:21:35,234
I saw that on your LinkedIn as I

606
00:21:35,234 --> 00:21:36,835
was, like, researching for this show, and I

607
00:21:36,835 --> 00:21:38,994
was like, oh, that is a year to

608
00:21:38,994 --> 00:21:39,494
start.

609
00:21:40,275 --> 00:21:42,295
Yeah. I mean, I follow this general

610
00:21:43,759 --> 00:21:44,259
rule

611
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:45,140
philosophy,

612
00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:47,220
and

613
00:21:47,679 --> 00:21:49,039
people who are around me get to hear

614
00:21:49,039 --> 00:21:50,500
this a lot. But I think that

615
00:21:51,279 --> 00:21:52,579
this idea of uncertainty

616
00:21:54,319 --> 00:21:55,299
equals anxiety.

617
00:21:56,705 --> 00:21:58,625
So the more uncertain you are about stuff,

618
00:21:58,625 --> 00:22:00,085
the more anxiety you have.

619
00:22:00,465 --> 00:22:00,965
Yeah.

620
00:22:01,345 --> 00:22:03,525
And what I would say is to

621
00:22:04,224 --> 00:22:04,965
to BlackRock's,

622
00:22:07,184 --> 00:22:08,724
I I would give them kudos

623
00:22:09,025 --> 00:22:10,980
to the way that they had navigated that,

624
00:22:10,980 --> 00:22:12,200
which was to overcommunicate

625
00:22:12,580 --> 00:22:13,720
and do a good job

626
00:22:14,019 --> 00:22:15,000
of letting the

627
00:22:15,380 --> 00:22:16,359
the crew know

628
00:22:16,660 --> 00:22:18,440
that, yeah, this is horrible.

629
00:22:19,059 --> 00:22:21,059
We're there's a path to peace, and it

630
00:22:21,059 --> 00:22:22,340
it might hurt for some people, but we're

631
00:22:22,340 --> 00:22:24,180
gonna do what's best for our shareholders and

632
00:22:24,180 --> 00:22:25,214
our employees. And

633
00:22:25,694 --> 00:22:26,894
they they sort of built some path, and

634
00:22:26,894 --> 00:22:29,054
I learned a lot from that. Yeah. And

635
00:22:29,054 --> 00:22:29,954
I think that,

636
00:22:31,294 --> 00:22:31,794
my

637
00:22:32,335 --> 00:22:34,815
colleagues will hear this often from me is

638
00:22:34,815 --> 00:22:36,815
just turn the communication dial up. A lot

639
00:22:36,815 --> 00:22:37,294
of times,

640
00:22:38,575 --> 00:22:39,954
you know, dealing with uncertainty,

641
00:22:40,759 --> 00:22:41,420
If you're

642
00:22:41,799 --> 00:22:43,640
dealing with human beings, they tend to think

643
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:45,340
about, like, the worst case scenario.

644
00:22:46,279 --> 00:22:48,519
That's me. Yeah. So every time you go

645
00:22:48,519 --> 00:22:49,960
to the doctor, you know, every time I

646
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:51,320
have a back pain, I, like, go to

647
00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:52,840
the Internet and I turn into a doctor,

648
00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:54,039
and then I roll in and I go,

649
00:22:54,039 --> 00:22:56,005
doctor, I have, you know, spina bifida. I

650
00:22:56,005 --> 00:22:56,825
found a doctor.

651
00:22:57,684 --> 00:22:58,904
What are you talking about?

652
00:23:00,644 --> 00:23:02,325
The the real fact of the matter is

653
00:23:02,325 --> 00:23:03,765
they'll go, oh, maybe you just slept on

654
00:23:04,644 --> 00:23:07,125
Right. Right. Yeah. Someone wants to be more

655
00:23:07,125 --> 00:23:09,700
cognizant about how you're sleeping. Oh, okay. It's

656
00:23:09,700 --> 00:23:11,619
amazing how quickly you can become a doctor,

657
00:23:11,619 --> 00:23:13,460
though, by looking at the Internet for about

658
00:23:13,460 --> 00:23:14,360
five to ten minutes.

659
00:23:15,619 --> 00:23:17,700
That's very true. So I've stopped doing that.

660
00:23:17,700 --> 00:23:19,860
But, what I have started doing internally and,

661
00:23:21,815 --> 00:23:23,335
just about everywhere I go, I just try

662
00:23:23,335 --> 00:23:24,934
to turn the communication dial up and make

663
00:23:24,934 --> 00:23:26,375
sure people are aware of sort of what's

664
00:23:26,375 --> 00:23:28,454
happening, where we're going, how we're gonna get

665
00:23:28,454 --> 00:23:31,515
there. Yeah. It's to drive down that uncertainty

666
00:23:32,615 --> 00:23:33,994
and drives down anxiety.

667
00:23:34,890 --> 00:23:35,390
Yeah.

668
00:23:36,170 --> 00:23:39,789
So Absolutely. There's something to connect there also.

669
00:23:39,849 --> 00:23:42,890
Right? Your your back hurts. You hop on

670
00:23:42,890 --> 00:23:45,950
to WebMD, and you're trying to self diagnose.

671
00:23:46,009 --> 00:23:48,734
And you call your your primary, and you

672
00:23:48,815 --> 00:23:49,474
tell them

673
00:23:49,855 --> 00:23:51,214
all the reasons why you have to come

674
00:23:51,214 --> 00:23:53,234
in. Let them know the bad news.

675
00:23:53,775 --> 00:23:54,275
Right.

676
00:23:54,815 --> 00:23:55,634
For investors

677
00:23:56,654 --> 00:23:58,595
that might not be able to

678
00:24:00,575 --> 00:24:01,075
follow

679
00:24:02,330 --> 00:24:02,830
the

680
00:24:03,369 --> 00:24:04,910
value of their investments

681
00:24:05,369 --> 00:24:06,750
on in privates

682
00:24:07,130 --> 00:24:09,789
just because they are not marked daily.

683
00:24:10,890 --> 00:24:11,869
They can watch

684
00:24:12,330 --> 00:24:13,390
financial television

685
00:24:13,849 --> 00:24:15,470
and see a sea of red

686
00:24:16,115 --> 00:24:18,755
and land in that spot of anxiety that

687
00:24:18,755 --> 00:24:20,295
you were just talking about.

688
00:24:20,674 --> 00:24:23,795
Mhmm. So let's hear a little bit about

689
00:24:23,795 --> 00:24:24,295
how

690
00:24:25,475 --> 00:24:27,734
private markets can't just be a

691
00:24:28,370 --> 00:24:30,850
a ballast or a source of even alpha

692
00:24:30,850 --> 00:24:31,830
to a portfolio,

693
00:24:32,850 --> 00:24:35,590
but they might also help investors,

694
00:24:37,890 --> 00:24:41,350
calm themselves when they're looking at their overall

695
00:24:41,490 --> 00:24:41,990
portfolio.

696
00:24:42,370 --> 00:24:42,610
Do you

697
00:24:43,545 --> 00:24:45,545
I'm I'm tracking with you. Right? Yeah. I

698
00:24:45,545 --> 00:24:47,005
know. I gotcha. I think

699
00:24:47,625 --> 00:24:48,285
it does

700
00:24:48,585 --> 00:24:49,805
boil down to some

701
00:24:51,065 --> 00:24:52,825
sort of easy to follow in a linear

702
00:24:52,825 --> 00:24:54,045
path here. And and

703
00:24:54,585 --> 00:24:57,485
so while you're not seeing marks on portfolios

704
00:24:57,945 --> 00:24:58,755
wildly swing

705
00:24:59,490 --> 00:24:59,990
Mhmm.

706
00:25:00,690 --> 00:25:02,450
That's a byproduct of the fact that,

707
00:25:03,490 --> 00:25:06,769
there are less frequent requirements to do that.

708
00:25:06,769 --> 00:25:07,269
However,

709
00:25:07,650 --> 00:25:09,190
the way you stay in tune

710
00:25:10,369 --> 00:25:13,509
with your strategic portfolio manager or GP,

711
00:25:15,005 --> 00:25:16,625
historically, has been very difficult.

712
00:25:17,005 --> 00:25:18,684
And what we try to do and what

713
00:25:18,684 --> 00:25:19,664
we're doing with,

714
00:25:20,285 --> 00:25:21,985
our data information connectivity

715
00:25:22,365 --> 00:25:23,105
and software

716
00:25:23,884 --> 00:25:25,965
is connect advisors we work with with what's

717
00:25:25,965 --> 00:25:27,725
going on in their portfolio so they can

718
00:25:27,725 --> 00:25:30,029
talk intelligently about a little, you know, about

719
00:25:30,029 --> 00:25:32,049
a couple of things I mentioned previously, which

720
00:25:32,350 --> 00:25:34,130
are what are the jobs you're creating,

721
00:25:34,509 --> 00:25:36,750
where is your money being spent, how are,

722
00:25:37,309 --> 00:25:37,809
portfolio

723
00:25:38,509 --> 00:25:39,970
managers as well as,

724
00:25:40,830 --> 00:25:42,450
operators within those portfolios

725
00:25:42,934 --> 00:25:45,174
putting money to work or allocating money or

726
00:25:45,174 --> 00:25:46,794
reallocating what's the approach.

727
00:25:47,174 --> 00:25:47,674
Mhmm.

728
00:25:48,054 --> 00:25:50,875
And we've found that arming our

729
00:25:51,414 --> 00:25:54,394
partners and clients with that information allows them

730
00:25:54,454 --> 00:25:56,775
to talk more intelligently and clearly about how

731
00:25:56,775 --> 00:25:58,214
money is being put to work and why

732
00:25:58,214 --> 00:26:00,740
it's not swinging wildly and put put people,

733
00:26:01,759 --> 00:26:03,759
not necessarily at ease in times of volatility,

734
00:26:03,759 --> 00:26:05,860
but give them some clarity and and transparency

735
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:07,779
into what's going on with their money.

736
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:08,980
I think that

737
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:11,680
we've got a lot of opportunity in front

738
00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:12,340
of us

739
00:26:13,174 --> 00:26:14,775
to take it to the next level, and

740
00:26:14,775 --> 00:26:15,914
we're certainly

741
00:26:16,214 --> 00:26:18,394
adding to our product road map a path

742
00:26:18,615 --> 00:26:19,674
to try to

743
00:26:19,974 --> 00:26:21,894
go as far down the transparency road as

744
00:26:21,894 --> 00:26:23,734
possible and get people connected in a way

745
00:26:23,734 --> 00:26:25,194
that can make them feel,

746
00:26:25,974 --> 00:26:27,894
on top of how their money is getting

747
00:26:27,894 --> 00:26:28,714
put to work

748
00:26:29,380 --> 00:26:30,740
and have a little bit more of a

749
00:26:30,740 --> 00:26:33,460
keel in terms of, the fact that there's

750
00:26:33,460 --> 00:26:35,140
a long duration bet going on, and you're

751
00:26:35,140 --> 00:26:37,299
betting on a company that can survive downturns

752
00:26:37,299 --> 00:26:37,960
and upturns.

753
00:26:38,419 --> 00:26:41,059
Yeah. Mhmm. It it becomes more tangible in

754
00:26:41,059 --> 00:26:42,279
that regards, I believe.

755
00:26:42,955 --> 00:26:44,975
Mhmm. Actually, just came from

756
00:26:45,434 --> 00:26:47,615
one of our underlying GP's

757
00:26:48,075 --> 00:26:50,734
AGMs, which is a annual general meeting,

758
00:26:51,115 --> 00:26:51,615
where

759
00:26:51,914 --> 00:26:52,575
this is

760
00:26:52,995 --> 00:26:53,495
a,

761
00:26:54,234 --> 00:26:56,690
not an early stage or emerging manager. They're

762
00:26:56,690 --> 00:26:58,789
on their fifth fund, but they showcased,

763
00:26:59,250 --> 00:27:01,570
you know, three sectors that they invest in

764
00:27:01,570 --> 00:27:04,630
heavily, enterprise AI, health care, and,

765
00:27:05,250 --> 00:27:07,090
industrials. And they brought up their port co

766
00:27:07,090 --> 00:27:08,470
managers, and they all addressed

767
00:27:08,865 --> 00:27:11,184
how we're getting built. We're new companies, but

768
00:27:11,184 --> 00:27:12,384
how do we get through the trough of

769
00:27:12,384 --> 00:27:12,884
volatility?

770
00:27:13,664 --> 00:27:16,005
Mhmm. And they're very focused on solving problems,

771
00:27:16,065 --> 00:27:18,865
which feels very good. You hear people say

772
00:27:18,865 --> 00:27:20,005
there's a real problem

773
00:27:20,384 --> 00:27:22,244
in this space, whether it's mRNA,

774
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:26,940
coding and development, whether it's robotics or infrastructure

775
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,480
for companies on the path to Saturn.

776
00:27:29,799 --> 00:27:31,960
Pretty exciting to hear people talk about that

777
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,140
stuff rather than how the public is

778
00:27:34,759 --> 00:27:35,259
viewing

779
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:38,200
the price of their stock on a daily

780
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:38,700
basis.

781
00:27:40,894 --> 00:27:42,994
Makes total sense. That's awesome.

782
00:27:46,414 --> 00:27:48,654
Personal question. When it comes to your own

783
00:27:48,654 --> 00:27:49,154
portfolio,

784
00:27:49,934 --> 00:27:50,434
how

785
00:27:51,470 --> 00:27:54,369
how is it divvied up between equities,

786
00:27:54,990 --> 00:27:55,490
bonds,

787
00:27:56,269 --> 00:27:58,049
and then private markets?

788
00:27:59,549 --> 00:28:02,029
Yeah. Maybe because of my proximity to private

789
00:28:02,029 --> 00:28:03,009
markets, I'm

790
00:28:03,789 --> 00:28:05,630
have an excessive allocation. But if we just

791
00:28:05,630 --> 00:28:06,450
think allocations,

792
00:28:06,805 --> 00:28:09,045
historically, I've had a very boring portfolio. I'm

793
00:28:09,045 --> 00:28:10,744
not out looking for grand slams.

794
00:28:11,125 --> 00:28:13,605
Mhmm. But I, certainly am looking for an

795
00:28:13,605 --> 00:28:14,744
opportunity to

796
00:28:15,845 --> 00:28:17,924
invest in private markets. And right now, I

797
00:28:17,924 --> 00:28:20,105
am north of 20% in private markets.

798
00:28:20,650 --> 00:28:22,750
Okay. I think that that's in line with

799
00:28:23,930 --> 00:28:26,089
the modern portfolio theory and me having an

800
00:28:26,089 --> 00:28:28,809
efficient portfolio. But, I do historically, I've I've

801
00:28:28,809 --> 00:28:31,049
been very boring. Run something that looks like

802
00:28:31,049 --> 00:28:32,029
a sixty forty

803
00:28:32,625 --> 00:28:34,085
in equities and fixed income,

804
00:28:34,464 --> 00:28:35,904
and then I have inner circle of that

805
00:28:35,904 --> 00:28:37,825
which is private market exposure to the same

806
00:28:37,825 --> 00:28:40,005
thing, some equity, some income opportunities.

807
00:28:40,545 --> 00:28:42,545
Yeah. And I think that's a nice extension

808
00:28:42,545 --> 00:28:44,964
of, a sixty forty approach.

809
00:28:45,929 --> 00:28:47,149
Boring is not bad.

810
00:28:47,450 --> 00:28:49,450
It's not been bad for me. I guess

811
00:28:49,450 --> 00:28:51,450
I'm trying to fill my time with other

812
00:28:51,450 --> 00:28:51,950
activities

813
00:28:52,730 --> 00:28:53,230
to

814
00:28:53,609 --> 00:28:54,909
take my mind off of

815
00:28:55,289 --> 00:28:57,609
the roller coaster ride. I'll serve that up

816
00:28:57,609 --> 00:28:59,585
for you. I was gonna say, speaking of

817
00:28:59,585 --> 00:29:01,365
that, what a perfect segue.

818
00:29:02,304 --> 00:29:04,804
That's twice, Ryan. Ryan's running the show. I

819
00:29:05,424 --> 00:29:07,264
mean, do I just give the host keys

820
00:29:07,264 --> 00:29:08,804
over to Ryan at this point?

821
00:29:09,424 --> 00:29:10,884
More jumping jacks, please.

822
00:29:11,184 --> 00:29:13,309
But, yeah, we've heard so much from the

823
00:29:13,309 --> 00:29:13,809
team.

824
00:29:15,470 --> 00:29:17,070
I hope y'all are watching on YouTube so

825
00:29:17,070 --> 00:29:18,830
you can see the magic that's happening right

826
00:29:18,830 --> 00:29:19,330
now.

827
00:29:19,789 --> 00:29:21,470
I've heard a lot about your passion for

828
00:29:21,470 --> 00:29:23,869
adventure racing, and I read your article that

829
00:29:23,869 --> 00:29:25,250
you wrote about it as well.

830
00:29:26,144 --> 00:29:27,664
Can you tell us more about that and

831
00:29:27,664 --> 00:29:30,325
your experiences and kind of how it's influenced

832
00:29:30,384 --> 00:29:32,485
your approach to life as a fintech CEO?

833
00:29:33,664 --> 00:29:34,164
And

834
00:29:34,465 --> 00:29:36,884
and don't forget to bring in the connection

835
00:29:36,945 --> 00:29:39,000
to Mark Wahlberg, if you could.

836
00:29:40,519 --> 00:29:41,960
You have to you have to tease that

837
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:43,980
out a little bit later. Okay. Well,

838
00:29:44,759 --> 00:29:46,519
so maybe I should just say what adventure

839
00:29:46,519 --> 00:29:48,039
racing is. That would be a good starting

840
00:29:48,039 --> 00:29:50,539
point. Because it's a it is a nuanced

841
00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:52,460
eccentric sport that

842
00:29:53,164 --> 00:29:54,525
there are not a ton of people that

843
00:29:54,525 --> 00:29:55,424
follow it.

844
00:29:55,884 --> 00:29:57,644
I've never heard of it until you take

845
00:29:57,644 --> 00:29:58,924
a bite of it. It's hard to let

846
00:29:58,924 --> 00:30:00,684
it go because it's super exciting, and it's

847
00:30:00,684 --> 00:30:03,164
a fun way to spend your spare time

848
00:30:03,164 --> 00:30:04,525
whether you're trying to get ready for it

849
00:30:04,525 --> 00:30:06,845
or actually participating in it. So adventure racing

850
00:30:06,845 --> 00:30:07,345
is

851
00:30:07,849 --> 00:30:09,230
a point to point race

852
00:30:10,009 --> 00:30:12,650
with no set course that's timed. So when

853
00:30:12,650 --> 00:30:14,029
you go through the start line,

854
00:30:14,970 --> 00:30:16,650
the gun has gone off, and not until

855
00:30:16,650 --> 00:30:18,170
you go through the finish line does the

856
00:30:18,170 --> 00:30:20,970
clock stop. So that means if you eat,

857
00:30:20,970 --> 00:30:21,470
sleep,

858
00:30:21,930 --> 00:30:22,650
go to the bathroom

859
00:30:23,615 --> 00:30:24,974
All on the clock. Look at your map,

860
00:30:24,974 --> 00:30:26,414
you're on the clock. So what you try

861
00:30:26,414 --> 00:30:27,775
to do is be the most efficient you

862
00:30:27,775 --> 00:30:29,695
possibly can to get through a course, which

863
00:30:29,695 --> 00:30:32,414
is a multi sport course with transition areas.

864
00:30:32,414 --> 00:30:34,515
So most people go to oh, like triathlon.

865
00:30:35,055 --> 00:30:35,875
You can have

866
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,960
up to infinity transition points. Well, maybe not

867
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:40,400
infinity because it wouldn't end, but you get

868
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:42,960
the point that you transition from the core

869
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:44,900
sports that are involved in this are running,

870
00:30:45,839 --> 00:30:46,339
biking,

871
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:48,480
and some type of a water sport like

872
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,595
canoeing, kayaking, something like that.

873
00:30:51,075 --> 00:30:53,075
And if any if you've ever orientated, that's

874
00:30:53,075 --> 00:30:53,974
a map and compass,

875
00:30:54,914 --> 00:30:57,394
race around getting some checkpoints. Adventure racing is

876
00:30:57,394 --> 00:30:58,934
just that. So you're given

877
00:30:59,234 --> 00:31:00,835
the points, but you're not given how to

878
00:31:00,835 --> 00:31:02,515
get there. You have to navigate with map

879
00:31:02,515 --> 00:31:04,075
and compass, and then you do it Fascinating.

880
00:31:04,434 --> 00:31:04,994
Human powered

881
00:31:05,700 --> 00:31:07,460
And the longest race I did I've done

882
00:31:07,460 --> 00:31:08,759
is 800 miles.

883
00:31:09,859 --> 00:31:12,500
So the the shortest race I've done shortest

884
00:31:12,500 --> 00:31:13,639
race I've done is

885
00:31:14,019 --> 00:31:16,500
12 miles, and they have races everywhere in

886
00:31:16,500 --> 00:31:18,419
between that. So they have sprint races that

887
00:31:18,419 --> 00:31:20,234
are usually three to six hours or two

888
00:31:20,234 --> 00:31:21,835
to four hours. Some of them are Wednesday

889
00:31:21,835 --> 00:31:23,855
nights after work, and everyone has a potluck.

890
00:31:24,394 --> 00:31:26,234
Seattle has Oh my gosh. That does that.

891
00:31:26,234 --> 00:31:27,914
Wait. Wait. Where was the 801?

892
00:31:27,914 --> 00:31:29,615
Like, where did you go to and from?

893
00:31:30,234 --> 00:31:31,455
So the 800

894
00:31:31,779 --> 00:31:34,519
mile race was around Moab, Utah.

895
00:31:34,900 --> 00:31:37,539
Oh, beautiful. It was called Subaru Primal Quest.

896
00:31:37,539 --> 00:31:38,920
Subaru is a title sponsor

897
00:31:39,539 --> 00:31:41,460
shown on CBS. It was like a week

898
00:31:41,460 --> 00:31:42,279
long show.

899
00:31:43,859 --> 00:31:46,359
The the genesis of this stuff comes from

900
00:31:47,095 --> 00:31:49,595
a French produced race called the Raid Galois,

901
00:31:49,735 --> 00:31:52,154
which is a tough to say race name.

902
00:31:52,215 --> 00:31:54,535
And then Mark Burnett, who produced a whole

903
00:31:54,535 --> 00:31:55,995
bunch of TV shows including,

904
00:31:56,455 --> 00:31:56,955
Survivor,

905
00:31:57,575 --> 00:31:59,335
went and tried it a couple times and

906
00:31:59,335 --> 00:32:00,855
failed and then came back to The US

907
00:32:00,855 --> 00:32:02,394
and produced the Eco Challenge.

908
00:32:02,950 --> 00:32:04,390
And the Eco Challenge was alive in the

909
00:32:04,390 --> 00:32:06,710
nineties and early two thousands on CBS. They

910
00:32:06,710 --> 00:32:08,549
would show this show for a week, do

911
00:32:08,549 --> 00:32:10,309
about two to three hours a night, and

912
00:32:10,309 --> 00:32:12,070
I saw it and thought, I could do

913
00:32:12,070 --> 00:32:12,570
that.

914
00:32:13,190 --> 00:32:14,890
Of course, there's no way I could do

915
00:32:15,750 --> 00:32:16,250
it

916
00:32:16,549 --> 00:32:17,590
in affairs. But,

917
00:32:18,295 --> 00:32:19,815
I went to a barbecue at a friend's

918
00:32:19,815 --> 00:32:20,315
house.

919
00:32:20,775 --> 00:32:22,615
We all watched the eco challenge while we

920
00:32:22,615 --> 00:32:24,454
were barbecuing. We all said it. I could

921
00:32:24,454 --> 00:32:25,734
do that. And it turns out one of

922
00:32:25,734 --> 00:32:27,015
the guys that I was hanging out with

923
00:32:27,015 --> 00:32:28,775
was a a man of action, and he

924
00:32:28,775 --> 00:32:30,394
signed us up to go to a race.

925
00:32:31,255 --> 00:32:31,914
We went

926
00:32:32,549 --> 00:32:35,110
maybe two months later to Deep Cove, British

927
00:32:35,110 --> 00:32:37,029
Columbia and did what was called a three

928
00:32:37,029 --> 00:32:39,269
to six hour race. Three hours shortest time,

929
00:32:39,269 --> 00:32:40,730
six hours longest time.

930
00:32:41,430 --> 00:32:43,269
Took us eight hours to complete. We tipped

931
00:32:43,269 --> 00:32:43,930
our canoe.

932
00:32:44,470 --> 00:32:45,990
We missed a checkpoint and had to go

933
00:32:45,990 --> 00:32:47,845
back. One of my best friends, Frenchie, went

934
00:32:47,845 --> 00:32:49,684
over his handlebars on his mountain bike four

935
00:32:49,684 --> 00:32:51,224
times. Oh, no.

936
00:32:51,525 --> 00:32:52,164
It was,

937
00:32:52,644 --> 00:32:54,744
everything that could have gone wrong went wrong.

938
00:32:55,125 --> 00:32:56,804
When we were done, we high fived, and

939
00:32:56,804 --> 00:32:58,724
we were like, that was awesome. Let's go

940
00:32:58,724 --> 00:32:59,545
do it again.

941
00:32:59,980 --> 00:33:01,980
So we fucked us. We forgot about all

942
00:33:01,980 --> 00:33:02,700
the pain, and,

943
00:33:03,099 --> 00:33:04,319
we just jumped in

944
00:33:04,619 --> 00:33:07,039
and started racing more. And then the elite

945
00:33:07,339 --> 00:33:09,579
category within adventure racing is coed. So then

946
00:33:09,579 --> 00:33:10,950
we started racing with our our,

947
00:33:11,835 --> 00:33:14,554
women friends, joined the team. Turns out they

948
00:33:14,554 --> 00:33:16,575
were the strongest ones on the team. And,

949
00:33:17,115 --> 00:33:18,794
we built a team of about 10 to

950
00:33:18,794 --> 00:33:21,134
12 people, and we rotated based on time,

951
00:33:21,755 --> 00:33:22,255
efficiency,

952
00:33:23,674 --> 00:33:24,174
money,

953
00:33:24,730 --> 00:33:26,889
the time piece being the schedule, who could

954
00:33:26,889 --> 00:33:28,809
actually make it. And we started doing these

955
00:33:28,809 --> 00:33:31,450
expedition length races, which are defined as expedition

956
00:33:31,450 --> 00:33:33,069
if they're over forty eight hours.

957
00:33:34,250 --> 00:33:36,490
So we did three hour races across the

958
00:33:36,490 --> 00:33:37,309
Baja Peninsula.

959
00:33:37,609 --> 00:33:39,634
We went to The United Arab Emirates and

960
00:33:39,634 --> 00:33:40,855
raced a seven day

961
00:33:42,115 --> 00:33:43,734
race in the kayaking in the ocean.

962
00:33:45,315 --> 00:33:47,575
We raced in Tasmania and Australia.

963
00:33:48,275 --> 00:33:49,875
Oh my gosh. This is so cool. We

964
00:33:49,875 --> 00:33:52,608
raced in Switzerland and all I mean, basically,

965
00:33:52,608 --> 00:33:54,654
you name it, and we've raced there as

966
00:33:54,654 --> 00:33:57,211
a team. And, it was I should've told

967
00:33:57,211 --> 00:33:59,257
you to come prepared with, like, slides so

968
00:33:59,257 --> 00:34:01,303
we could see some photos. This sounds so

969
00:34:01,303 --> 00:34:03,604
amazing. On version two. So maybe it's not

970
00:34:03,860 --> 00:34:06,162
I can't even you can tell I get

971
00:34:06,162 --> 00:34:08,065
fired up about it. I think the the

972
00:34:08,065 --> 00:34:10,164
main question was how did adventure racing play

973
00:34:10,305 --> 00:34:11,445
into what I bring

974
00:34:12,065 --> 00:34:14,385
Yeah. The tattoos. And and, I think it

975
00:34:14,385 --> 00:34:15,925
plays out in a lot of

976
00:34:16,465 --> 00:34:18,545
it's a metaphor for life, adventure racing. It's

977
00:34:18,545 --> 00:34:20,385
easy to find that. Also, when you're out

978
00:34:20,385 --> 00:34:22,859
running, biking, and kayaking for seven days straight,

979
00:34:22,859 --> 00:34:25,179
there's a lot to think about. So you

980
00:34:25,179 --> 00:34:26,319
find a lot of metaphor.

981
00:34:27,260 --> 00:34:29,500
But the thing about adventure racing, and this

982
00:34:29,500 --> 00:34:31,500
is the probably the most important piece in

983
00:34:31,500 --> 00:34:33,420
terms of why the team that, I was

984
00:34:33,420 --> 00:34:35,519
on and we helped build was successful.

985
00:34:35,994 --> 00:34:37,355
We were ranked in the top 10 in

986
00:34:37,355 --> 00:34:38,635
the world for a number of years. It

987
00:34:38,635 --> 00:34:39,994
was fun to race internationally

988
00:34:40,394 --> 00:34:42,574
Wow. Was because we had very aligned

989
00:34:43,434 --> 00:34:46,074
goals and incentives. It was mostly about aligned

990
00:34:46,074 --> 00:34:46,574
goals.

991
00:34:47,755 --> 00:34:49,675
We checked our egos at the door before

992
00:34:49,675 --> 00:34:51,214
we hit the start line.

993
00:34:53,039 --> 00:34:54,880
And you you just go through so many

994
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:57,039
ebbs and flows like life. You have highs

995
00:34:57,039 --> 00:34:57,700
and lows.

996
00:34:58,960 --> 00:34:59,460
And

997
00:34:59,920 --> 00:35:02,340
everyone kinda has some roles on the team.

998
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:05,175
Mine was everyone joked about me being the

999
00:35:05,175 --> 00:35:08,235
Sherpa or carrying other people's gear. I'm bigger,

1000
00:35:08,454 --> 00:35:09,974
have more weight. It was easier for me

1001
00:35:09,974 --> 00:35:11,414
to take more weight on. I would tow

1002
00:35:11,414 --> 00:35:11,914
people.

1003
00:35:12,375 --> 00:35:14,135
But without a doubt, on a long race,

1004
00:35:14,135 --> 00:35:15,835
somebody was gonna carry my backpack,

1005
00:35:16,615 --> 00:35:18,295
and somebody was gonna tow me on a

1006
00:35:18,295 --> 00:35:18,795
bike.

1007
00:35:19,949 --> 00:35:22,909
It didn't never mattered who. I would say,

1008
00:35:22,909 --> 00:35:23,969
give me the tow,

1009
00:35:24,829 --> 00:35:26,829
and the goal is to move as fast

1010
00:35:26,829 --> 00:35:28,670
as you can as a team. Yeah. You

1011
00:35:28,670 --> 00:35:30,349
can only move as fast as your slowest

1012
00:35:30,349 --> 00:35:30,849
teammate.

1013
00:35:31,309 --> 00:35:33,070
So once you can all check your ego

1014
00:35:33,070 --> 00:35:34,670
at the door and say, I need help,

1015
00:35:34,670 --> 00:35:36,094
it's it's kinda hard to seem to do.

1016
00:35:36,094 --> 00:35:37,295
Put your hand up and just say, I

1017
00:35:37,295 --> 00:35:38,594
don't feel good. I need help.

1018
00:35:40,414 --> 00:35:42,335
I think that perhaps you guys are thinking

1019
00:35:42,335 --> 00:35:44,094
about this right now. It's easy to metaphor

1020
00:35:44,094 --> 00:35:46,014
out of that and say, hey. That happens

1021
00:35:46,014 --> 00:35:47,714
at work a lot. Yeah.

1022
00:35:48,179 --> 00:35:50,179
Yep. We we literally just came here from

1023
00:35:50,179 --> 00:35:52,760
our all hands virtual meeting

1024
00:35:53,380 --> 00:35:54,839
where we were talking about

1025
00:35:55,300 --> 00:35:58,420
new roles that management is going to be

1026
00:35:58,420 --> 00:35:59,400
taking on.

1027
00:35:59,940 --> 00:36:00,440
And,

1028
00:36:01,780 --> 00:36:02,679
to get there,

1029
00:36:03,005 --> 00:36:03,664
I think

1030
00:36:04,765 --> 00:36:06,785
that all of us on the management team

1031
00:36:07,405 --> 00:36:10,204
do have to check portions or all of

1032
00:36:10,204 --> 00:36:12,144
our ego at the door

1033
00:36:12,445 --> 00:36:15,485
in order to accomplish what we're putting forth

1034
00:36:15,485 --> 00:36:16,545
in front of us

1035
00:36:17,079 --> 00:36:19,719
in terms of a firm street cred and

1036
00:36:19,719 --> 00:36:20,539
our own

1037
00:36:21,079 --> 00:36:22,219
growth trajectory.

1038
00:36:22,519 --> 00:36:23,500
And I'd imagine,

1039
00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:25,420
whether

1040
00:36:26,359 --> 00:36:27,819
you're whether you're help towing

1041
00:36:28,119 --> 00:36:30,940
or you're admitting that you need that help,

1042
00:36:33,054 --> 00:36:36,094
it's probably really tough to admit the need

1043
00:36:36,094 --> 00:36:38,755
that those first couple of times.

1044
00:36:39,695 --> 00:36:41,954
Any any truth to that, or

1045
00:36:42,655 --> 00:36:44,175
give us a little bit in terms of,

1046
00:36:44,175 --> 00:36:46,034
like, what that experience was like?

1047
00:36:46,420 --> 00:36:46,920
Yeah.

1048
00:36:47,219 --> 00:36:48,579
It's hard to check your ego at the

1049
00:36:48,579 --> 00:36:51,400
door and make yourself vulnerable and Mhmm.

1050
00:36:52,099 --> 00:36:53,079
Let let

1051
00:36:53,460 --> 00:36:54,679
in front of other people

1052
00:36:56,340 --> 00:36:57,079
show that

1053
00:36:57,699 --> 00:37:00,099
you're not the strongest or the fittest or

1054
00:37:00,099 --> 00:37:01,724
the best at any given time. And in

1055
00:37:01,724 --> 00:37:02,784
a work environment,

1056
00:37:04,045 --> 00:37:06,924
if we're capable of making ourselves vulnerable, we'd

1057
00:37:06,924 --> 00:37:09,005
like we we try to preach that to

1058
00:37:09,005 --> 00:37:10,605
people, and it means different things to different

1059
00:37:10,605 --> 00:37:11,424
people, but

1060
00:37:12,525 --> 00:37:14,364
we spend a lot of time validating our

1061
00:37:14,364 --> 00:37:14,864
existence

1062
00:37:15,244 --> 00:37:17,300
or within a firm. Here's why I'm here.

1063
00:37:17,300 --> 00:37:18,840
I'm the subject matter expert.

1064
00:37:19,539 --> 00:37:21,139
It's tough to say, oh, but I do

1065
00:37:21,139 --> 00:37:21,880
need help.

1066
00:37:22,179 --> 00:37:23,699
And it's tough to say that when you

1067
00:37:23,699 --> 00:37:24,760
have, like, a hierarchy.

1068
00:37:25,219 --> 00:37:26,440
Mhmm. And I think what

1069
00:37:27,059 --> 00:37:29,619
we're doing our best at sort of bringing

1070
00:37:29,619 --> 00:37:30,280
to life,

1071
00:37:30,764 --> 00:37:31,664
particularly at Opto,

1072
00:37:32,764 --> 00:37:35,824
is that we're creating an environment that's,

1073
00:37:37,324 --> 00:37:39,244
got ownership across the board. It's one of

1074
00:37:39,244 --> 00:37:39,904
our values.

1075
00:37:40,364 --> 00:37:42,924
It's got courage across the board. It's also

1076
00:37:42,924 --> 00:37:44,385
another one of our values.

1077
00:37:45,030 --> 00:37:47,210
We have three values. The third is partnership,

1078
00:37:47,429 --> 00:37:49,829
and that's us celebrating the success of our

1079
00:37:49,829 --> 00:37:51,449
partners as our success.

1080
00:37:52,469 --> 00:37:54,309
And all of those go together and and

1081
00:37:54,309 --> 00:37:55,610
at times being

1082
00:37:56,550 --> 00:37:58,469
or being required to put your hand up

1083
00:37:58,469 --> 00:38:00,844
amongst our teammates and say, hey. Has Has

1084
00:38:00,844 --> 00:38:02,605
somebody thought about this in a different perspective?

1085
00:38:02,605 --> 00:38:04,224
And we we do our

1086
00:38:04,525 --> 00:38:05,904
we bring that into our

1087
00:38:06,605 --> 00:38:08,444
our build effort on our platform. We do

1088
00:38:08,444 --> 00:38:10,224
that on our investment processes.

1089
00:38:10,525 --> 00:38:13,000
We do that, in our partnership with our

1090
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:15,400
clients, and it's a special thing. And, I

1091
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:17,079
talk about adventure racing a lot to bring

1092
00:38:17,079 --> 00:38:18,519
this back to the question, and I do

1093
00:38:18,519 --> 00:38:20,840
bring it into work quite a bit because

1094
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:21,340
there's,

1095
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:24,200
a lot of that metaphor that plays out

1096
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:25,019
in real life.

1097
00:38:25,704 --> 00:38:27,704
I mean, there is an abundance of metaphors

1098
00:38:27,704 --> 00:38:28,204
there,

1099
00:38:28,824 --> 00:38:30,344
and kind of a thread too from what

1100
00:38:30,344 --> 00:38:32,764
you were saying about your experience at BlackRock

1101
00:38:32,824 --> 00:38:34,984
and how they sort of reposition people every

1102
00:38:34,984 --> 00:38:37,164
couple years to give people different exposure.

1103
00:38:37,980 --> 00:38:40,139
That also leads into this value you hold

1104
00:38:40,139 --> 00:38:42,780
so dearly now of shared ownership across all

1105
00:38:42,780 --> 00:38:44,719
the different things that need to be done,

1106
00:38:45,420 --> 00:38:47,599
and certainly as part of Opto's success.

1107
00:38:50,155 --> 00:38:52,474
You literally stole words out of my mouth,

1108
00:38:52,474 --> 00:38:54,474
Elena. That was amazing. Getting too good for

1109
00:38:54,474 --> 00:38:56,394
you, Jimmy. What are you gonna do? I

1110
00:38:56,555 --> 00:38:58,875
I've I wanted to hit on those three

1111
00:38:58,875 --> 00:39:01,934
pillars and just share with you that

1112
00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:03,380
as

1113
00:39:03,679 --> 00:39:04,819
a business owner

1114
00:39:05,119 --> 00:39:07,519
and someone who is working on his own

1115
00:39:07,519 --> 00:39:08,659
leadership skills,

1116
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:10,260
courage,

1117
00:39:10,639 --> 00:39:11,139
partnership,

1118
00:39:12,319 --> 00:39:12,819
ownership,

1119
00:39:13,519 --> 00:39:15,380
like, those are three

1120
00:39:16,364 --> 00:39:17,264
heavy topics

1121
00:39:17,965 --> 00:39:18,465
to,

1122
00:39:19,164 --> 00:39:20,864
to always lean into.

1123
00:39:21,324 --> 00:39:23,244
But for the benefit of the team and

1124
00:39:23,244 --> 00:39:26,125
watching how Opto has grown since we've partnered

1125
00:39:26,125 --> 00:39:26,625
together,

1126
00:39:28,445 --> 00:39:29,184
you're obviously

1127
00:39:29,679 --> 00:39:30,719
onto something and and,

1128
00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:35,119
kudos on that. And being able to lean

1129
00:39:35,119 --> 00:39:36,739
into your past

1130
00:39:37,199 --> 00:39:39,840
and extrapolate some of the things that you've

1131
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:40,579
gone through

1132
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:43,460
as an athlete and as a human

1133
00:39:44,195 --> 00:39:46,135
to the benefit of

1134
00:39:46,434 --> 00:39:48,434
the team that you work with now at

1135
00:39:48,434 --> 00:39:49,175
the firm.

1136
00:39:50,195 --> 00:39:51,735
Yeah. I think, thank you,

1137
00:39:52,594 --> 00:39:55,494
by the way. And I think that we

1138
00:39:55,635 --> 00:39:56,775
all have a

1139
00:39:58,119 --> 00:39:58,619
circuitous

1140
00:39:59,639 --> 00:40:02,139
path in our history, you guys included,

1141
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:03,500
and

1142
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:05,320
I think it feels good to be able

1143
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:06,679
to lean into those and bring them to

1144
00:40:06,679 --> 00:40:08,619
life. Yeah. We learn. We're always learning.

1145
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:09,900
Absolutely.

1146
00:40:10,359 --> 00:40:11,000
That's why,

1147
00:40:12,324 --> 00:40:14,005
I don't hide my gray hair. I've gotta

1148
00:40:14,005 --> 00:40:15,445
turn my head a little bit here. But,

1149
00:40:16,485 --> 00:40:19,204
with that comes all these kick ass experiences,

1150
00:40:19,204 --> 00:40:21,045
and we love to bring those along. We

1151
00:40:21,045 --> 00:40:23,125
should be so lucky to grow old enough

1152
00:40:23,125 --> 00:40:25,045
to have gray hair and wrinkles. Like, that's

1153
00:40:25,045 --> 00:40:26,804
how I always think about it. I hope

1154
00:40:26,804 --> 00:40:28,550
that I look like that someday. I hope

1155
00:40:28,550 --> 00:40:29,530
I have that chance.

1156
00:40:30,469 --> 00:40:32,389
I'm hide I'm hiding my gray hair and

1157
00:40:32,389 --> 00:40:34,469
my bald spot with That's okay, Jimmy. With

1158
00:40:34,469 --> 00:40:35,769
with the Octo hat.

1159
00:40:37,349 --> 00:40:39,829
Awesome. Okay. Well, I'm gonna take us into

1160
00:40:39,829 --> 00:40:41,050
our play segment,

1161
00:40:41,534 --> 00:40:43,614
which is pseudo rapid fire, but, you know,

1162
00:40:43,614 --> 00:40:45,534
me and Jimmy like to yap. So rapid

1163
00:40:45,534 --> 00:40:47,155
fire is very relative.

1164
00:40:49,054 --> 00:40:51,775
But if it weren't wealth management, Ryan, what

1165
00:40:51,775 --> 00:40:53,214
would you be doing? Like, did you have

1166
00:40:53,214 --> 00:40:54,974
any dream jobs as a kid or alternate

1167
00:40:54,974 --> 00:40:56,994
paths that you considered? I know you mentioned

1168
00:40:57,510 --> 00:40:59,590
biology and some other majors that you explored.

1169
00:40:59,590 --> 00:41:00,630
Like, what do you think you'd be doing

1170
00:41:00,630 --> 00:41:01,769
today, if not this?

1171
00:41:02,550 --> 00:41:03,130
I think

1172
00:41:03,670 --> 00:41:05,510
if I go back to dream jobs and

1173
00:41:05,510 --> 00:41:08,309
I think about what fires me up, if

1174
00:41:08,309 --> 00:41:10,684
there was an alternative path, it would have

1175
00:41:10,684 --> 00:41:12,844
been around some form of hospitality. I do

1176
00:41:13,164 --> 00:41:14,304
Oh, yeah. Like

1177
00:41:15,085 --> 00:41:16,945
to build the stoke in people.

1178
00:41:17,885 --> 00:41:18,945
And I think,

1179
00:41:19,724 --> 00:41:22,364
as you've might have recognized through my passion

1180
00:41:22,364 --> 00:41:24,864
for adventure racing and just recreating in general,

1181
00:41:25,650 --> 00:41:27,889
that alternative path probably would have been some

1182
00:41:27,889 --> 00:41:28,369
sort of,

1183
00:41:28,929 --> 00:41:30,949
mountain guide, ski guide combo.

1184
00:41:32,609 --> 00:41:35,010
I could totally say that. And and I

1185
00:41:35,010 --> 00:41:37,109
I flushed a little bit of this out

1186
00:41:37,170 --> 00:41:38,710
during college. And

1187
00:41:39,244 --> 00:41:41,405
what I found was there were people in

1188
00:41:41,405 --> 00:41:43,105
that industry that were telling me,

1189
00:41:43,405 --> 00:41:44,144
don't mix

1190
00:41:44,844 --> 00:41:47,164
your extreme passion with the business because you

1191
00:41:47,164 --> 00:41:48,785
get burnout. You don't wanna ski

1192
00:41:49,405 --> 00:41:50,704
powder in remote mountains.

1193
00:41:51,565 --> 00:41:53,244
I didn't that wasn't enough to, like, steer

1194
00:41:53,244 --> 00:41:54,750
me off of it. I just found that

1195
00:41:55,389 --> 00:41:57,710
accounting could be applied everywhere, and I like

1196
00:41:57,710 --> 00:41:59,070
to work with my business. And so I

1197
00:41:59,070 --> 00:42:01,090
followed that path. However, I could see

1198
00:42:01,710 --> 00:42:03,630
in a bizarro universe that that would have

1199
00:42:03,630 --> 00:42:04,769
been a path I followed.

1200
00:42:05,150 --> 00:42:05,650
Totally.

1201
00:42:06,030 --> 00:42:08,269
I mean, somewhere in a parallel universe, that

1202
00:42:08,269 --> 00:42:09,329
is what you're doing.

1203
00:42:11,454 --> 00:42:13,074
What's your favorite thing to do for fun?

1204
00:42:14,255 --> 00:42:15,775
I mean, sorry to be kicked a dead

1205
00:42:15,775 --> 00:42:17,474
horse, but I love riding a bike.

1206
00:42:18,175 --> 00:42:20,574
And I love riding bikes on trails, and

1207
00:42:20,574 --> 00:42:22,494
I love riding bikes on trails with my

1208
00:42:22,494 --> 00:42:24,034
family and my friends.

1209
00:42:24,940 --> 00:42:25,440
Probably

1210
00:42:25,739 --> 00:42:28,380
top of my list right there. Yeah. I'm

1211
00:42:28,380 --> 00:42:30,619
out in Hood River, Oregon, and we are

1212
00:42:30,619 --> 00:42:33,420
famous for our mountain biking trails. So if

1213
00:42:33,420 --> 00:42:34,940
this part of the world ever calls to

1214
00:42:34,940 --> 00:42:36,079
you. Well

1215
00:42:36,699 --> 00:42:37,199
well,

1216
00:42:37,885 --> 00:42:38,385
you

1217
00:42:39,085 --> 00:42:41,005
know that I mountain bike in Hood River

1218
00:42:41,005 --> 00:42:41,505
often.

1219
00:42:41,805 --> 00:42:44,925
Really? Wow. Yeah. In Awesome. The the river

1220
00:42:44,925 --> 00:42:45,825
in White Salmon.

1221
00:42:46,285 --> 00:42:47,184
Yeah. Little

1222
00:42:47,724 --> 00:42:50,045
Moab. There's a couple of Syncline. Have you

1223
00:42:50,045 --> 00:42:52,125
done that? I've done syn that is Syncline

1224
00:42:52,125 --> 00:42:54,519
is that, basically. I can see that trail

1225
00:42:54,519 --> 00:42:56,199
from where from my house right now. Okay.

1226
00:42:56,199 --> 00:42:57,980
Like, literally looking out on my porch.

1227
00:42:58,599 --> 00:43:00,699
And, for what it's worth, I used to

1228
00:43:00,760 --> 00:43:02,280
live in a house across the street from

1229
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:03,339
the Philly Cheesesteak,

1230
00:43:04,644 --> 00:43:07,144
the restaurant on Waskow Drive in Hood River.

1231
00:43:07,285 --> 00:43:08,885
There we go. I don't know if that's

1232
00:43:08,885 --> 00:43:10,485
still there. I have made it through the

1233
00:43:10,485 --> 00:43:12,885
pandemic. But, Yeah. Oh, definitely a lot of

1234
00:43:12,885 --> 00:43:16,405
restaurant changes. Up there, and pun intended, after

1235
00:43:16,405 --> 00:43:17,224
Post Canyon.

1236
00:43:18,970 --> 00:43:21,369
That's where my boyfriend rides, like, every weekend.

1237
00:43:21,369 --> 00:43:23,210
There you go. Funny. There's some trail up

1238
00:43:23,210 --> 00:43:25,309
there called, like, Dad Camp or, like,

1239
00:43:26,329 --> 00:43:28,170
Dad Trail. It's for all the the dads

1240
00:43:28,170 --> 00:43:30,490
to, like, be mellow and not act like

1241
00:43:30,490 --> 00:43:31,710
a kid who's catching

1242
00:43:32,664 --> 00:43:35,065
25 feet of air on full send mode.

1243
00:43:35,625 --> 00:43:37,144
That was Somehow, I feel like you're with

1244
00:43:37,144 --> 00:43:39,625
the kids catching 25 feet of air. I

1245
00:43:39,625 --> 00:43:40,125
know.

1246
00:43:40,984 --> 00:43:42,364
Very cool. Awesome.

1247
00:43:42,824 --> 00:43:44,344
Well, we like to close out the show,

1248
00:43:44,344 --> 00:43:46,480
Ryan, with a moment of gratitude and and

1249
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:48,640
just give you the opportunity to shout out

1250
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:50,640
someone in the industry, on your team, in

1251
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,199
your life who you admire and, yeah, say

1252
00:43:53,199 --> 00:43:55,519
something nice about someone who may or may

1253
00:43:55,519 --> 00:43:56,340
not be listening.

1254
00:43:57,680 --> 00:43:59,599
Well, I appreciate that. That's a it's a

1255
00:43:59,599 --> 00:44:00,559
nice opportunity. And,

1256
00:44:01,614 --> 00:44:03,375
I would say I've invested I'm a people

1257
00:44:03,375 --> 00:44:04,894
person. I've invested a lot of time in

1258
00:44:04,894 --> 00:44:06,655
building a big network, and there's probably at

1259
00:44:06,655 --> 00:44:08,335
least a thousand people I could say thank

1260
00:44:08,335 --> 00:44:10,195
you to. I feel like I do build

1261
00:44:10,494 --> 00:44:12,755
a bit of a personal advisory board, but,

1262
00:44:13,454 --> 00:44:14,815
I get asked a lot of times, like,

1263
00:44:14,815 --> 00:44:16,900
hey. How did you manage this finance career

1264
00:44:16,900 --> 00:44:19,780
and then also go race competitively internationally on

1265
00:44:19,780 --> 00:44:21,059
this thing that, like, took a lot of

1266
00:44:21,059 --> 00:44:21,719
time? And,

1267
00:44:22,179 --> 00:44:24,099
again, I do get caught up telling a

1268
00:44:24,099 --> 00:44:25,320
story at times about

1269
00:44:26,179 --> 00:44:27,400
my boss at the time

1270
00:44:28,614 --> 00:44:30,934
at Quellos. His name is Dan. I'll leave

1271
00:44:30,934 --> 00:44:33,035
it at that. He'll know who he is.

1272
00:44:33,735 --> 00:44:33,974
And,

1273
00:44:35,494 --> 00:44:36,235
I tried

1274
00:44:36,695 --> 00:44:38,614
I had this thought that perhaps I should

1275
00:44:38,614 --> 00:44:39,434
not work

1276
00:44:39,815 --> 00:44:42,855
in in towards developing my career as much

1277
00:44:42,855 --> 00:44:43,755
as I was,

1278
00:44:45,389 --> 00:44:47,789
based on my age and the fitness I

1279
00:44:47,789 --> 00:44:49,550
wanna do accrue. And the fact that I

1280
00:44:49,550 --> 00:44:51,469
was having kids at the time, I was

1281
00:44:51,469 --> 00:44:52,589
like, maybe I should do this when my

1282
00:44:52,589 --> 00:44:53,789
kids are younger. And, like, I have all

1283
00:44:53,789 --> 00:44:54,769
these thoughts. And

1284
00:44:55,150 --> 00:44:56,670
so I I told him, hey. I'm thinking

1285
00:44:56,670 --> 00:44:59,614
about taking a large sabbatical, basically, quitting for

1286
00:44:59,614 --> 00:45:01,695
a couple years and just focusing on on

1287
00:45:01,695 --> 00:45:03,855
racing. And he said, well, why would you

1288
00:45:03,855 --> 00:45:04,514
do that?

1289
00:45:05,215 --> 00:45:06,195
And I said, well,

1290
00:45:06,494 --> 00:45:08,815
super fit. We're competitive. We're beating these teams

1291
00:45:08,815 --> 00:45:09,315
internationally.

1292
00:45:10,430 --> 00:45:12,430
Some of my teammates have, like, quit their

1293
00:45:12,430 --> 00:45:14,910
jobs and become professional athletes. And, you know,

1294
00:45:14,910 --> 00:45:16,430
that doesn't mean a lot. It means you

1295
00:45:16,430 --> 00:45:16,930
struggle

1296
00:45:17,710 --> 00:45:19,410
financially, but you get to

1297
00:45:19,789 --> 00:45:21,950
fulfill yourself fill your cup on all your

1298
00:45:21,950 --> 00:45:23,170
recreational endeavors.

1299
00:45:24,355 --> 00:45:25,875
And he said, well, I think you're racing

1300
00:45:25,875 --> 00:45:27,394
a lot right now. Right? And I said,

1301
00:45:27,394 --> 00:45:29,715
yeah. He said, do you wanna race more

1302
00:45:29,715 --> 00:45:30,994
than you are now? I said, yeah. There

1303
00:45:31,074 --> 00:45:32,755
you know, I do wanna race more. He

1304
00:45:32,755 --> 00:45:34,114
said, well, how much more can you race?

1305
00:45:34,114 --> 00:45:35,815
These things are, like, killing you almost.

1306
00:45:37,670 --> 00:45:38,789
So I explained to him and he said,

1307
00:45:38,789 --> 00:45:39,610
how about this?

1308
00:45:40,789 --> 00:45:42,410
Don't ask me for more money.

1309
00:45:43,670 --> 00:45:45,289
Don't ask me for a new title.

1310
00:45:45,750 --> 00:45:47,349
Keep doing what you're doing because we love

1311
00:45:47,349 --> 00:45:49,670
your output, and you're dedicated and emotionally attached

1312
00:45:49,670 --> 00:45:51,610
to growing our business and us succeeding.

1313
00:45:52,125 --> 00:45:54,684
And I'll support you having a life outside

1314
00:45:54,684 --> 00:45:56,045
of work. It just means that you're not

1315
00:45:56,045 --> 00:45:57,724
gonna get some fancy title and do this

1316
00:45:57,724 --> 00:45:58,224
thing.

1317
00:45:58,925 --> 00:45:59,425
And

1318
00:45:59,724 --> 00:46:01,885
that was the kick start to me basically

1319
00:46:01,885 --> 00:46:03,184
having a career and,

1320
00:46:03,565 --> 00:46:04,704
being able to flex

1321
00:46:05,159 --> 00:46:05,659
recreationally

1322
00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:06,679
as well as,

1323
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:08,460
with my brain

1324
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:11,019
and on a career path with some experience.

1325
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:13,739
I very much appreciate,

1326
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:15,960
that person who's,

1327
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:17,420
become

1328
00:46:17,799 --> 00:46:19,639
certainly a a very good friend of mine,

1329
00:46:19,639 --> 00:46:21,325
but, you know, acted as a mentor and

1330
00:46:21,325 --> 00:46:22,704
at the time, a manager and,

1331
00:46:23,485 --> 00:46:26,285
leader in finance at at Quellos. And, yeah,

1332
00:46:26,285 --> 00:46:28,525
big shout out to Dan for, helping me

1333
00:46:28,525 --> 00:46:29,344
on my way.

1334
00:46:29,885 --> 00:46:30,785
Dan, man.

1335
00:46:31,164 --> 00:46:31,664
Yeah.

1336
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:35,599
Fantastic insight and story in terms of how

1337
00:46:35,599 --> 00:46:36,099
he,

1338
00:46:37,359 --> 00:46:38,420
he met you halfway

1339
00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:39,539
more or less.

1340
00:46:40,319 --> 00:46:42,079
Yeah. I mean, I think it helped that,

1341
00:46:42,239 --> 00:46:44,000
I had had some a good output for

1342
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:45,119
him, but he knew I was,

1343
00:46:45,519 --> 00:46:47,199
on board and he wanted me to be

1344
00:46:47,199 --> 00:46:47,780
a human.

1345
00:46:49,765 --> 00:46:50,965
I think I said it at the beginning

1346
00:46:50,965 --> 00:46:52,405
of this, but variety is the spice of

1347
00:46:52,405 --> 00:46:54,005
life. So it's something that helped me to,

1348
00:46:54,005 --> 00:46:55,864
you know, proverbly proverbially

1349
00:46:57,285 --> 00:46:57,785
run

1350
00:46:58,244 --> 00:46:58,744
career

1351
00:46:59,364 --> 00:47:00,985
marathon rather than a sprint

1352
00:47:01,445 --> 00:47:03,204
Yeah. And just figure out what I like

1353
00:47:03,204 --> 00:47:03,704
about

1354
00:47:04,299 --> 00:47:05,039
working and

1355
00:47:05,339 --> 00:47:06,799
building teams and,

1356
00:47:08,139 --> 00:47:08,639
winning.

1357
00:47:09,179 --> 00:47:11,339
Well, to steal another phrase that you just

1358
00:47:11,339 --> 00:47:12,960
mentioned, you're able

1359
00:47:13,900 --> 00:47:14,559
to fill

1360
00:47:15,819 --> 00:47:18,755
two different cups at the same time. Your

1361
00:47:18,775 --> 00:47:20,434
your professional career

1362
00:47:20,815 --> 00:47:22,114
and then your recreational

1363
00:47:22,494 --> 00:47:24,514
racing career. That's awesome.

1364
00:47:25,135 --> 00:47:26,194
Shout out to Dan.

1365
00:47:26,574 --> 00:47:28,594
Shout out to Dan. Let's go.

1366
00:47:30,190 --> 00:47:32,989
Awesome. What a beautiful full circle way to

1367
00:47:32,989 --> 00:47:33,890
close the show.

1368
00:47:34,989 --> 00:47:37,309
Thank you so much for joining us, Ryan.

1369
00:47:37,309 --> 00:47:39,469
To our listeners, we know that you learned

1370
00:47:39,469 --> 00:47:41,969
something new. Hope you enjoyed hearing Ryan's story.

1371
00:47:42,405 --> 00:47:44,244
And be sure to write us via email

1372
00:47:44,244 --> 00:47:46,405
at pressplay@streetcredpr.com

1373
00:47:46,405 --> 00:47:48,244
to tell us what you think, ask us

1374
00:47:48,244 --> 00:47:49,065
any questions,

1375
00:47:49,844 --> 00:47:52,164
suggest any guests, or even just to tell

1376
00:47:52,164 --> 00:47:53,785
us what you had for lunch today.

1377
00:47:54,260 --> 00:47:55,780
Thanks again for tuning in, and we can't

1378
00:47:55,780 --> 00:47:57,719
wait to introduce you to our next guest.

1379
00:47:57,780 --> 00:47:59,780
Thanks again, Ryan. See you later. Thanks, guys.

1380
00:47:59,780 --> 00:48:01,000
Have fun to take. Thanks, Ryan.