Hi, Welcome to Bc Cat On Brad White
happy to have you with us today, and
I'm happy to have a full crew here.
Good morning, Bob. Good morning, guys. Dustin. Good
morning. Philip. Good morning, guys. And we have
Doctor. Fred Gin from the American Association of
Bo Practitioners. He's their executive director. Good morning,
Fred. Hi, everybody. So we're happy to have
him on because he's got his own podcast
that he does through the Bo
practitioners called Have you heard. And he is
really good at identifying lots of new scientific
topics,
great podcast if you're a veterinarian and wanna
listen to something else while you're in the
truck good chance to catch up on what's
latest and we're gonna quiz for Adam, Fred
adam, what's latest today, including
talking a little bit about the high path
Av influenza, how it's influence the cattle industry,
what are some of the upcoming things that
we see.
As well as talk about some advances in
Bo Medicine. And then at the end, I've
got some questions for you guys that we'll
do kind of a rapid fire questions as
we go through our final topic there. Before
we get into those, I wanted to remind
you if you wanna listen to 1 of
our other podcast podcasts, we have a Bo
Science with Bc,
which a lot of times what we'll do
is we'll talk about different
manuscripts or scientific topics in a little bit
more detail. So that one's a little bit
different than this 1 and that we dive
into some of the specifics that you may
wanna listen to. Guys is as we were
putting this together, we were talking about advances
in Bo Medicine through our career,
many have had kind of a in this
room, I've had a career that has spanned
decades now. So what it made me think
of being summer was
I wanted to see if you guys could
identify
summer
blockbuster movies from the eighties. I have a
list of the top. 10 summer blockbuster from
the eighties,
and I wanna see how many you guys
can name. If you don't name 1 on
the list, you're out we'll see who's the
last man standing. Oh. Fred you're our guest,
you get go first.
About the terminator.
No.
Alright. Fred Fred didn't want to play it.
I mean, you could've just said I don't
wanna play, Fred.
I like that 1, Fred.
Mom, Alright. I'm gonna go with I wanna,
the Harrison ford. Oh, what are they called
the? It's not an actor.
Use I thing. Oh, I'm b on the
names of the you know, the, temple of
Doom and, you know, so the... Yeah, how
what very difficult last name. Simple of doom.
I will accept that. Okay. Fill. There you
go. Ghost.
That 1 is
not in the top.
That's gonna guess that too.
Dustin.
Dirty dancing.
Oh, not in the top 10.
Alright. I'm gonna go back...
How about?
How about the original
top gun.
The original top gun Yeah. Is on the
list. Alright Alright.
We're out. We lost Bob. He's The only
1. So Bob, Bob could have named all
3 of the Indiana Jones movies. Yeah. Batman.
Oh.
Back to the future. Okay. Don't forget don't
forget about Star Wars,
and
number 1, and I don't know why you
guys didn't have it right off tip of
the tongue, e t.
Yeah I finally. I forgot the phone home.
So now now that we've done that part,
Fred, we wanted to talk a little bit
about, so the high path Avian influenza,
and we briefly discussed this a few weeks
ago. I know
the Ab has been very involved in trying
to generate and dis assimilate scientific
information for investigations on this.
Maybe give us a broad overview from your
perspective of of where we are today.
Where we are today is there's been about
a hundred and 30 hertz
impacted. I think they're supposed to a dozen
states.
Kansas is 1 of the states that has
had herd affected. It's only been identified in
dairy.
So has not affected the Fed cattle industry
or Cal calf ranches,
and
it's it's
been spreading. And right now, the the the
the theory is is that there was 1
jump from birds to cows, and now it's
spreading from cow out either through introduction of
lac dating dairy animals and nerds
or via mechanical transfer.
And then probably
1 of the most
important things for listeners to understand is pasteur
milk is safe, Fda, Friday released, you know,
a very comprehensive study.
On commercial
hospitalization. They've looked at multiple different dairy products,
and it ina the virus. So drink pasteur
milk or consuming pasteur dairy products is safe.
And then also,
on the beef side, the Usda has confirmed
that
eating beef is safe that this virus does
not pose a public health risk from, you
know, consuming the products that we
that we eat. They even in
ground beef patties with virus and then cook
those hamburger patties to media
and
inactivated the virus. So
think that's pretty important for everyone to understand
and it's important and for the veterinary industry
to demonstrate that the products that our clients
produce are are safe and tasty. Yeah. Absolutely.
And I think that's the the human health
side of it is is a part that's
important to kind of iron out And we
go back to the cal side when you
say those herd are affected, The main thing
that... What what some of the symptoms that
cows show when they're impacted with this virus.
Well, it... It's it's a bit strange because,
you know, when we think about flu in
humans or birds or other species, we think
about a arrest
virus that, you know, causes respiratory symptoms.
With this virus, influenza AH5N1,
in cows, it based quickly goes right to
the m gland.
They've even done some aerosol commercialization studies, and
it's pretty much transferred in the male
And
what it does is it makes cows stop
eating, stop rum eating and stop making now.
And they do recover
95 to 98 percent of them. And so
that's that's you know, we're thankful that those
animals do recover. But, you know, pretty much,
it's
significant economic hit to these da,
when they, have 10 percent of their animal
quit making milk. That probably if you look
at know, our napkin math thus far is
it probably costs about anywhere from a hundred
50 to 250 bucks per cow.
You is what the economic hit is on
these da,
in people.
There's been 3 people affected. There there all
dairy farm employees and the primary symptom of
people is pink eye,
because we have influenza receptors in our con
of or in and There's been great research
out that cows have those receptors in their
ut. Mh. Interesting. Yeah. That's interesting that there
would be that big a difference between species.
We we often
don't think about how different species respond, and
I think a good point that you're making
there that most times we think about influences
as respiratory, but here, we're seeing memory you.
Yeah. 1 of the things that... Yeah. I
I think and and I really tip my
hat to Fred and what he's done on
a leadership side because we live in a
world, you know, with the Internet and lots
of information going around. 1 of the things
that, I think when you have something new,
like, we've really not seen this
ad influenza jumped to cattle.
There's a lot of questions from a lot
of different people and Fred is has organized
kind of weekly meetings to have the veterinarians
that are on the ground.
Producers that are affected or producers that are
interested
well as some of the regulatory people all
get together and without that effort
to have some miscommunication, I think
miscommunication could happen really easily.
What have you kinda... So, first of all,
thank you for kinda making sure that that
those groups are talking to each other because
you would think, oh, well, for don't talk
to each other without Fred stepping in, but
I'm not sure that would have happened. Well,
thanks, Bob. I appreciate that. You know, it's
it's really, I'm just the organizer. It's all
the smart people that are figuring this out.
You know, when we initially met, it was
before we knew what this disease was. It
was was just very veterinarians and the Texas
panhandle handle saying something weird going on here.
We don't know what it is. And
and so initially, when we met it was
to try to collaborate and in figure that
out. And then once the diagnosis was done,
we'd primarily focused on, you know, collaboration, sharing,
case histories,
research and laboratory reports and whatnot. So, you
know, it's been a good effort. Thank I'm
thankful for the Aa members that have participated
and really are driving the ship. So what
are what are the next steps in the
process for Edward or do you have kind
of the next parts outlined? Well, I think
the the next parts are. We really have
to get a really good handle on how
exactly the virus is being transmitted, and I
think we're learning more and more about that
every day. You know, goodness. It's only been
3 months, just a little over 3 months,
and they've already figured out a lot.
And then we need to encourage dairy farms
to report.
That's the major barrier right now.
They don't wanna be identified as being a
positive heard.
They're concerned about their, you know, the workers
on their farm. They're not concerned about their
milk market and whatnot. So we we need
to get a really good grasp on where
this virus is. And then I think we
need to focus efforts on prevention and that
may or may not include of
vaccinations so there's some discussions going on with
that right now and what some of the
opportunities and challenges.
So appreciate your leadership on that and keeping
everybody up to date. I would say 1
of the things about their reporting. Those requirements
vary state. State based on movement and how
that's set up. So if you're if you
have questions about that, contact your local veterinarian
and or your state veterinarian and they will
help you figure out what is the right
thing to do in each situation and when
you might need to test? So thanks, Fred
for your leadership? So I'm gonna shift gears
and I'd like to talk about advances in
in Medicine, but I'm gonna I'm gonna change
it a little bit on you guys, and
we've talked about to things that maybe you've
seen over your career, but I want you
to project forward and Fred and Bob, I'm
gonna start with you guys as veterinarians and
then bob, or Dustin and Philip up, I'm
gonna turn to you guys and say, what
do you guys see as
what's next in veterinary medicines. So what are
the next things that are coming that you
think either
are used a small amount now and we'll
be used much more. So or maybe something
that's not even used yet. Bob, I'm gonna
start with you first.
So
I think 1 of... And I'm gonna go
back too. I I like to read some
of these older,
books that I Might I go to garage
sales whatever room,
old veterinary books too And it is interesting
to see 2 things that are really interesting.
Some things, you know, you can read a
book from the late 18 hundreds or early
19 hundreds, and and they they were spot
on. Those guys understood,
the disease process and the best treatments just
as well as we do today. And other
things they were way off on. So you
know, looking into the future. It's, like, well,
I bet that trend continues.
I'll bet there's some things that we're just
nailing and some things that we don't we
don't quite figure out. And
what I see us moving towards in the
future is,
I I think, like, ef Fred said, you
know, disease control is... So It's either. Well,
maybe it's either easy or it isn't. And
first so I'll go back to the, you
know, things they got right in the 18
eighties.
They were pretty straightforward, and we figured them
out and we understood it. Things that were
complicated then are still complicated. Now things with
a lot of different modes of transmission. You
know, how does how does the bacteria virus
move from 1 angle to the next? Things
that have a lot of other factors, you
know, the nutritional aspect or something. So anything
that makes a disease process complicated.
We may still be struggling with this 20
years, 40 years from now.
And so it... So working with clients. It's
helping them understand that. Yeah. There's there's some
things in animal health that we understand we
know what to do, we can make a
big impact. And there's other things that we
still don't and So when I look into
the future, I still... I see those 2
aspects you're gonna lean on your veterinarian
for
clear answers on some things. And just guidance
on back to the basics of animal husband
or Nutrition and those kinds of things because
we we don't have the details figured out
again. Fred, what do you see coming? What's
net?
Well, follow up on Bob, 1 of my
most cherished books is from my grandfather. It's
from the early 19 hundreds at Usda book
on cattle care. It is really interesting to
read how they used to treat cattle, you
know, pre antibiotic. You need, you know, pre
calcium and all that stuff. So pretty cool.
But you know, I think we're on the
cusp of
some major advances in both beef and dairy
production with using genomics and genetics. You you
know, the University of Nebraska had some researchers
that
just produced the first B resistant calf using
genomics.
And you think about, you know, in the
beef industry if we can produce disease resistant
animals naturally, the impact that would have on
productivity on welfare on health on antimicrobial stewardship.
I think it's just huge.
And I also think that there's just big
opportunities, you know, look at some of the
differences between beef and dairy with 97 percent
of the beef breed animals born cold and
very few of the dairy breeds born cold,
Huge if we could fix that with the
genetic
manipulation, I think that that is huge. And,
you know, even some of the other things,
can we produce a... If of male calf
that doesn't grow test.
Boy. That'd be neat. I think all of
those things are really gonna impact
how we
prevent disease as well as,
manage cattle in in the future. I think
1 of the unfortunate things I was talking
to a student. I said, you know, 1
of the unfortunate things about our own mortality
is we're not gonna live long enough to
see the really cool things that our grandchildren
are gonna get a c. And they're they're
some cool things coming in that space. Yeah.
I think you're right. Those are those are
all great ideas. And and we may see
more expansion in that area. Philip? What? So
being nutrition. I'm gonna take it from a
nutrition angle. Know, we're learning more and more
about how
the gut microbiome is related to different
disease, processes or syndromes and things like that.
And we do in humans, we do this
a little bit, but I think Right now
in livestock,
our nutrition is based on performance. We're we're...
We are formulating diets to get certain level
of performance. But I think as we move
forward, we're gonna start doing more and more
with nutrition
to
combat or prevent disease. So we're gonna be
learning more and more about how we can
formulate a diet to keep animals
healthier.
And I think a great point there on
the microbiome. So for a long time, we've
focused on individual,
primarily pathogens.
But now we're saying they're actually part of
it their own environment, which I think is
is great to think about both dietary
and for other health aspects. Dustin.
Kinda following up, I think with what Fred
was saying,
technologies, just
technologies that allow us to collect. More data,
and we can do more, you know, analyses
and whether it's real time or not, but
coming from a, data coming from an economist
is, you know, we like study data. Just
the new technologies that are coming online that
allows collect more data that we can maybe
do some more real time, diagnosis or stuff
like that. Think of all the graphs you'll
be able to make. I know honestly
That's what you're excited about. Real Alright. Great
great ideas for the future there, guys. And
I think it's... It'll be fun to watch
those develop. Now I'm gonna I'm gonna ask
you guys some questions, and these are all
short answer questions and anybody else can can
jump in. But Fred, I'm gonna start with
you. So X is a sedative that is
used in cattle.
And there has been some some questions about
it recently. Maybe first outline the problem and
then tell us whether... What is the solution?
Well, the the problem is is that X
is being illegally imported and mixed into illicit
drugs and people are, dying. From it.
And so
the
approach from the Dea
has been to schedule it, to increase penalties
and enforcement
And the concern is is that
it's the only sedative that's effective in cattle.
Many producers are probably familiar with their veterinarians
using it to at 8 cattle,
and it it's used extensively. It's cheap, and
it's effective.
And,
the concern is is that if it's if
it's
identified as a controlled substance,
veterinarians may not have access to it anymore.
Fat, it may put burden on manufacturers. There's
only 2 companies make it. 1 said they'd
quit making if it was scheduled. So, you
know, our main concern is, number 1, protect
the public health. We don't want you know,
what to be diverted into or or illegally
imported into the human, you know, drug crisis.
So is rampant it in this country. But
number 2, we wanna make sure that veterinarians
still have access to it, so they can,
you know, safely work around cattle when needed.
Yeah. And I think an important point there,
that relative to... So si
sedative for cattle, not for people, and the
only time that it's being used there is
in illicit drugs. And so that's the that's
the problem.
So certainly Appreciate that that you keep up
on that part.
Bob,
I wanted to ask you. So
when we think about
identifying a new person that I've gotta work
with on the farm, be they
maybe I need a new accountant, a new
insurance agent, a new risk management person or
somebody to work on my farm
How do I
identify the right person
to work with?
You know, this is obviously, every individual is
different, but I think
finding new talent
is is an issue across all of our
air agriculture. And so I'm looking at it
from, So if I'm a cattle producer.
When you think of all the people that
you rely on, you rely on, you know,
your nutrition your veterinarian,
the, you know, your life... It the market
analyst or market a adviser. You know, So
you've got a lot of people and sooner
her later, some of those people are gonna
turn over. You know. Somebody's gonna retire. You're
gonna need a new 1.
And and I personally...
I I like what I'm comfortable with, and
I like the person that we've developed a
relationship with So I guess 1 of the
things that I guess I would say is
we're gonna have the the work of developing
a new relationship. And so you gotta find
somebody that you can work with, somebody that
has 2 things. The skill, and then the
communication that that works 2 ways with you.
And then be willing to be a good
second partner.
I mean, it it should be a win
win relationship. I'm I'm paying for their advice,
and and they are supplying something to me.
But I'm looking for... So I don't necessarily
enjoy, but I should always be on the
lookout for good talent for
information
and skills that I'm gonna need k. Excellent.
And I think you're right. You developed that,
kinda develop that
relationship. Philip,
time to put away round bales in many
areas. And so let's specifically as we think
about putting away round bales, and I want
to
minimize was itch any tips?
Yeah. So a couple of things
related to... That'll help minimize the amount of
stored hey that that is wasted or or
not gonna be consumed by cattle once you
put it out there. Is number 1, get
it up off the ground.
Put it on top... I've seen people put
it on top of old pallet on top
of both tires.
Some people will lay down a bed of
3 inch bigger 4 inch big rock
that will let the water leach away, but
get it off the ground so that moisture
from the ground doesn't get
pulled up into the bail.
And then,
spread your... The rows out and don't put
them under
shade trees or on the edge of the
field, you want them in an open area
and with space between the rows. So that
the sun can get down between there. And
dry things out after rain or
snow melt to snow after snow and things
like that. So that
we are again where we're getting moisture. So
whatever you're you're just from the general principle
perspective, whatever you can do to minimize the
amount of moisture
on that bail or
was gonna help reduce the amount of hay
was. Yeah. Absolutely. And I think you're you're
key there's
getting them off the ground and spreading them
out, which a lot of times we don't
wanna burn any more ground than we have
to to have hay storage. Because basically, I
can't do anything else there. But leaving those
gaps between, and you can easily tell do
I have enough gap if I've got sunlight
going back and forth. Right? And a lot
of times you may want that row
north south. Mh. The length wise so that
you've got the sun going east west across
every day. Yeah. That's true.
Dustin, I'm gonna ask you and your your
question a little bit different you
since you work here at the University, you
get interact with that lot of students.
And we often talk about
generational differences.
But if
we want to hire somebody who's in a
younger generation than what are some of the
things that you say that I should be
aware of or I should think about or
maybe there's a generational difference that I should
try to address?
So, a couple years ago, I mean, the
last few years, I was a director of
grad studies. And so, you know, I tried
to recruit students to come to K state
grad program.
And what I noticed is when we would
make offers or when I would wanna talk
to students send an email, and I get
response. Right? And we just go back and
forth. The email, set up time to
be a phone call then. But now it's
Zoom.
You know, probably 20 20, a little after
20 20, it just changed, and I couldn't
get students, like, I would make them an
offer, you know, assistant ship. We pay their
salaries and tuition. And I they just ghost
to me. You would not hear from them.
And was, like, that's odd. So finally, I
had... And it's just... I think it was
a generational thing. Finally, I had all their
cell phone numbers because other applications.
I started texting them, and they would reply
right away. So I just started texting every
single person.
And then that go away outcome.
Otherwise, I might not You just sent an
email, no response. No response. Yeah. And so
it just took a little while to figure
that out. I just happened to
start texting.
It's... And there are differences.
And even that more effective than phone calls
in in some situations. Yeah. And so for
example, when people call me, and I only
have a cell phone, I don't recognize the
number. I don't pick it up. I will
let them leave voice mail, and I'll call
back, but if they don't leave
a voice mail that I'm not gonna... Yep.
And I've had some of those were working
with students or you call, and it'll say,
voice mail not set up. Right? They're they're
not even gonna get that call if it
doesn't come through, but you text him and...
Amp, Yep. They're right there. So I think
I'll go back to your question, it
probably a little different in every situation.
But the newer or a different generation, it
it
they respond differently. They... And you just
maybe you list talk to other people see
what their experiences are on how to reach
out. To a different generation, how they how
the communicates different
and try to adapt, course... I mean, if
you wanna survive, you gotta adapt, There's the
key. You gotta adapt. Because
otherwise, I mean, I could send them emails
all day and get frustrated about it. But
if that doesn't work, it doesn't make any
sense to continue to do that. You had
that experience recently too with some of our
Missy grads where you said, hey, hey, this
guy, I know was gonna respond to email,
the rest of my head to text. Yeah.
It was an interesting. And and it was
just a few years get a little bit
older, young veterinarian
responded immediately the email. All my younger, young
veterinarians,
they responded to tech. And so I did
both. Yeah. And I think that's... A great
point is adapting and on the figuring out
what that communication is, and just ask Right?
What... How do you how do you want
me to communicate with you? Because I think
that could easily lead to misunderstandings that
it might be perceived as rude or upsetting
that somebody had done something, but they may
not be checking their email. So
Excellent. Appreciate those answers, guys. And Fred, I
really appreciate you joining us, and he's with
the American Association of Bo
practitioner and has a podcast. Have you heard
that I think is a great listen if
you have a chance to get on and
find that on itunes or Google Play?
Thanks, Fred for joining us, and thank you
guys. You have further questions, things you'd like
us talk about, You can send us an
email at Bc at k u idiot.